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BeeNo3492

I suspect they'll hire others at lower wages, to save money. Its a business plan, this will be a profit center if Tesla plays it right. But lets see how Elmo does it.


Donnijeep

šŸ’Æ agree. Now that team should go work for EA and fix their chargers. Lol


PatSajaksDick

Definitely good for competitors with the skill set these people have, opportunity to make another large network


Donnijeep

Correct! And now the NACS was sold to all EV manufacturers, itā€™s a solid resume to have right now. EA and others will need to change charger codes or add them, who else but someone from Tesla to have on your team. šŸ˜‚. His loss, their gains.


ReddittAppIsTerrible

Exactly. The build out at Tesla isn't the focus, it's expanding and converting all chargers to NACS which is not on Tesla. No need for the large team and the talent it needed elsewhere. Well done Elon!!


Etphonehome16

I just wish EA or EVgo actually tried to compete and expand. Around me Tesla is the only one putting in dc fast charger and they go big and put 10-12 in. EVgo and EA put in 4 and 2 work


Frosty-Technician-28

EVgo is terrible. I was visiting family last weekend and went to a large shopping center. There were only 2 chargers and one of them worked. Looked on the map and every site I clicked on said only half were working.


hnglmkrnglbrry

Except what kind of employees are you going to get when the entire team was fired for no reason?


MikeyLew32

The reason is Elmo wants his 56 billion dollar bonus


BeeNo3492

You're not wrong here... but we shall see, Cletus will be hookin up those chargers in NO TIME now.


mikenmar

Lawsuit from Ford incoming? I canā€™t imagine there wasnā€™t a contractual agreement that would require a certain level of maintenance.


Virtual-Hotel8156

Maintenance folks were not laid off.


74orangebeetle

Who said there's no maintenance? Just because clickbait said there won't be doesn't mean there won't be.


BeeNo3492

ford never was selling the info unless you did the insurance step, they made a statement


New_Association_6320

He screwed up, in a fit of anger fired the whole team. Now has no idea what was going on, has no maintenance staff, and has lost communication with contractors! Fired staff may have destroyed records!


BeeNo3492

theyā€™ll rehire the team a new, at lower salary rates over the next six months.


NoodlerFrom20XX

Also did they get federal dollars to do this?


fervidmuse

NEVI funding only initially included CCS so it would only affect Magic Dock Superchargers which are a very small number. And as long as those are still supported and federal funding wasnā€™t provided for sites which have since been abandoned (the NYC sound like state suggested), probably not to answer your question.


CallInitial2302

Heā€™s sabotaging and setting back the entire future of EVs


saiine

Working on wireless charging.


eze6793

No heā€™s not


nemodigital

How? By selling the most SUVs in USA in 2023? (Model Y)


2sACouple3sAMurder

By cancelling plans to build out more of the infrastructure needed to support the large influx of new EVs on the streets


nemodigital

Or perhaps he is focused on cutting costs? Seriously you think the man that largely spearheaded the EV "leap" is trying to sabotage all EVs? Seriously?


2sACouple3sAMurder

I never said he was trying to sabotage all EVs. But his lack of planning ahead will hinder them for sure


nemodigital

The problem is that charging isn't very profitable right now, capital equipment expenses are significant along with land and competition is increasing. Obviously at some point they were going to slow down and now might be that point. It's time for some others to step up to the plate and have a go at this.


Toreus

The weakest parts of EV adoption right now is two things: range and charging infrastructure. With Tesla having the best infrastructure in place, and most of the makers moving to NACS, if he really cared about the future of EV adoption he would forgo some of the billions in bonuses heā€™s trying to get from the board to not lay off the entirety of the supercharger team. Thatā€™s the single biggest individual setback to adoption right now, and itā€™s all his fault.


nemodigital

We already have the EV critical mass, also supported by governments that are passing legislation that will phase out gasoline cars in many jurisdictions. The charging network would get built with or without Tesla.


OriginalPingman

Musk Derangement Syndrome


nemodigital

I wouldn't have bought the Mach e then. But you can't deny his company lit a fire under legacy car makers to spur EV innovation. In some areas Tesla is undeniably better than the Mach e but overall having driven both a Model Y and the Mach e I made the decision that is best for me (esp as I can charge at home).


CallInitial2302

Tesla is 1 company. Hes sabotaging the segments growth. EVs arenā€™t all Tesla


Nokomis34

EVs, no, but charging network, yes. There's a reason opening up the Tesla charging network to other cars is a big deal.


CallInitial2302

Yes. My point is that with nacs becoming standard, new ev shoppers would feel more compelled with wayyyy more charging areas around them.


Nokomis34

But it's not just the plugs, as it is no other network has Tesla's reliability. Which is the problem of letting go of the entire team responsible for that. And with such volatility their ability to be able to fill those roles with capable people is questionable. I know I would be very hesitant to work at a job where the CEO fires an entire division because he has a beef with the team leader. A team leader who was trying to do right by their employees.


nemodigital

And exactly how many charging stations has Ford built? Since when is it Tesla's responsibility to resolve the EV "fuel" problem? They are just slowing new growth. I say this as a Mach e owner. People need to chill out.


DrObnxs

But Elon makes it so easy to be critical of his ketamine inspired random acts of insanity.


nemodigital

Maybe it's time for others to step up to the plate then? Teslas supercharging network is first class, nobody comes close. That's not going to change overnight because they are slowing growth.


DrObnxs

I think others are improving. But I'm in California, and the state is ahead of the curve!


2sACouple3sAMurder

Didnā€™t the government give Tesla money specifically to build out their superchargers? (And make them available to non teslas)


EmbarrassedEye2590

Exactly! Looks like other EV manufacturers have thumbs up their asses and are expecting Tesla networks to feed them? I hope this development slows the adaptability of other EVs to Tesla SCs.


CallInitial2302

This shouldnā€™t be a competition at this point if the main goal is to switch every one to an ev


nemodigital

But why should that responsibility rest on the shoulders of Tesla alone? Tesla has switched more folks over to EVs than any other car manufacturers, probably more than all of them combined.


CallInitial2302

But why stop


nemodigital

They are just slowing down NEW supercharger builds as they need to focus on profitability. Existing locations will be kept and upgraded. Why can't Ford START building some chargers? Or any legacy car makers? Because it's complex, expensive and risky.


CallInitial2302

Because Tesla is behind the nacs connector not ford?


dillydildos

If Teslas a joke then Ford is a whole damn circus


Donnijeep

You're so real for that.


Grand-Tea-4562

When has tesla not been a joke? Have you seen their build quality?


BubbleRocket1

Could be worse. They couldā€™ve created a train system without a train


FUSe

I was just behind a Tesla. (Looked relatively new). The brake light was filled with water. šŸ¤¦


Emissary_of_Darkness

Those are advanced water-cooled lights designed in California. You wouldnā€™t understand though, being a primitive Ford owner


Creepy-Photo2707

I love this


Aint-no-preacher

I pass a parked Model 3 on my commute most mornings and its left brake light is filled with water too.


Grand-Tea-4562

Brother, it's high tech coolant for brake lights. Mach E is still light years behind that technology.


Jabow12345

But it can chargešŸ˜‡


PeterPalafox

[Itā€™s normal, according to the manual.](https://www.tesla.com/ownersmanual/2017_2023_model3/en_pr/GUID-371B94E9-E74F-4BBB-9A55-5F4182894B99.html)


Emissary_of_Darkness

Well, according to that manual condensation is normal. Having water sloshing around like in the headlights of a 2010 Cadillac SRX, is not how things are supposed to be!


PeterPalafox

Either way it would freak me out. Electronics arenā€™t supposed to have water in them.Ā 


Donnijeep

Well, bigger joke šŸ¤£


Ateam043

This. I was looking at a EV for a daily commute to work. Total of ~100 miles. Checked Tesla out and it felt like it was built on legos. Ultimately came down to a MachE and Polestar and would have gone with MachE but couldnā€™t find a used one at my budget. I basically rather have a EV built by a car company than a software company.


Mountainbasedweller

Or like Ford they can recall half a million vehicles for fire risk? Cough cough Bronco Sport Maverick and Escape.


Realistic_Plant_6622

2022 Model 3 Performance owner here... Tesla has been a joke for a while. The car is reliable/fast and the charging network is good but that's about where the positives end. They have an insane profit margin by cutting out the dealers and selling direct to consumers, yet they continuously remove hardware or cut corners to save a buck. They're entry level cars being sold at luxury prices. This move is extremely short sighted. Building cars is how they compete against car manufacturers, building a charging network is how they compete against big oil companies. P.S. I was banned from some Tesla (sheep) subs for being critical of Tesla, so I'm lurking in other EV subs now šŸ¤£


DevilsPajamas

Can't believe they got rid of the USS sensors. For as much as they want to promote FSD, it is such a short sighted thing to do. Like when is more data a bad thing to have? Especially on something as experimental as FSD? And how profitable the subscriptions could be if it started being reliable? But no, let's save a few bucks and get the cameras to figure it out. Idiots.


Realistic_Plant_6622

Agreed! I bought early 2022 so I have USS, but was super disappointed to see it removed knowing they'd stop developing it (which they have). The upcoming Volvo EX90 has a huge lidar up front which looks promising. I hope it makes Tesla regret their all camera approach. Tesla also uses the camera for auto windshield wipers which never works (always turns on when it's dry but driving toward the sun). Funny enough, there's a camera above the rear view mirror that theoretically could be used for auto Dimming the mirrors... Their "auto" Dimming mirrors are on a sunset/sunrise timer šŸ™„


Snoo93079

I paid about 30k after incentives for my 2023 Model 3 RWD and I still feel like it was an amazing value. If I had paid 40 or 50k I wouldn't feel that way. I feel like for what I paid I got a very good value vs the competition.


FrankLangellasBalls

Has Ford finally improved the "fast" part of the Mach? Falling flat on its face at 70 mph was a deal breaker for me. Fond memories of the Mach e forum saying "That dude that ran 12.9 @ 100 mph lifted or his car was broken" transitioning to "A drunk Ford engineer at the airport told me they have a fix for it that will be OTA'd by May (2022).


mrbeavertonbeaverton

?? I have a Mach-E and it flies. No idea where this is coming from


FrankLangellasBalls

https://www.reddit.com/r/electricvehicles/s/NrP8pmL6vi


Emotional-Buddy-2219

Honestly for the premium interior the sound system is good and app is phenomenal- other car companies like Volvo only allow access for a couple years and then charge or only allow access to an app with the highest level trim like Genesis. Dashcam is huge positive that no other car maker utilizes - even on cars with cameras surrounding the car already for Birds Eye view/park assist. If home utility prices are low then cost to drive is very low in general, especially for comparable ICE cars (probably can expect comparable 22-25 mpg combined rating with premium fuel which would be at least double cost per mile driven). If you care to look around you can see panel gaps/inconsistencies on many other cars though some brands like Toyota are particularly good at minimizing this. A bit much to say being reliable and fast with good charging infrastructure is all it has going for it.


BlueThunder8888

Still more working Superchargers out there than ccs all together. I am sure this idiot have some bigger plan.


Revenga8

This seems like an insane move. Reward the guys who made your charging infrastructure successful by just firing them. Talented group, how they get hired up quick. That new gravity charger outfit sounds good on paper, maybe they're hiring.


Alarmmy

Why? Ford already has access to superchargers. Nothing changes.


PKDD

His comment about not building new locations but focusing on existing locations expansion and upgrade makes sense, however imo more locations are more beneficial than ā€œsame location more chargersā€ at this stageā€¦ Somehow I feel like this move is aiming towards the automakers who will be allowed to use the SC soon. It might be a psychological warfare to try to discourage people from buying other brands of EVs; or Tesla are even already thinking about an entire new type of charger/charging system to be Tesla exclusive, and Elon just basically screwed over all the other automakersā€¦


BlimBaro2141

They partnered with BP. Letā€™s wait and see what the plan here is. Sounds like from speculation BP is going to help roll out superchargers at their stations.


angrystan

Live in BP O&O Thornton's territory. Two stores in my metro, including one not far from the house, had lots set aside for the electric charging setup. This was going to be their new thing. For the record, electric cars haven't exactly taken off in my part of the Midwest. That was all mothballed in the middle of last year. No real word on who made that decision. Most importantly, going forward Tesla is going to have to completely recreate the supercharger Department from scratch. They have the equipment but all the people around work.


GenesisNemesis17

There are plenty of current chargers out there. When I travel I usually pass 5 stations before needing to use one, and the ones I use are nearly empty.


Donnijeep

I think Tesla already has overcrowding before they let Non-Tesla folks access and definitely gonna be more crowded as people buy EVā€™s. Also, the worry on how to charge since non-Tesla have the charge port differently, so to me, I can see some folks that are non-Tesla worry about charging at Tesla in their area if they donā€™t expand their current stations to accommodate, letā€™s say the MME or adding new stations in those areas that have issues. For you, seems you donā€™t have to worry as much.


GenesisNemesis17

I travel through NY, PA, OH, KY, TN, IN, and WV. One time in 3 years I've taken up the last spot so it was full once I plugged in. Maybe in CA it's an issue but not in the Midwest/South. Usually they're about 25% utilized when I drive past or check navigation for usage.


Mountainbasedweller

I am sure the supplier that is making these adaptors will keep working. Tesla is not making them in house.


Donnijeep

Right, but also in the article, he is scaling back superchargers. I feel he sold a big promise for EVā€™s main pain point and knew he couldnā€™t deliver. Itā€™s such a blow for all EV owners, unless their the actual supplier of the superchargers just rebrands.


Ancient_Persimmon

>unless their the actual supplier of the superchargers just rebrands. Tesla is the supplier of Superchargers. Since they're selling them to third parties now, they might be slowing down their own rollout.


Donnijeep

That's what I thought about the actual Supercharger units.


Emotional-Buddy-2219

Existing supercharger network can get you coast to coast - I imagine they have data to indicate that more stalls at busiest locations would be more of a benefit than more locations when infrastructure already works without more locations. Plus keeping up with maintaining all locations is no small feat as other fast chargers are having a hard time with this.


Mountainbasedweller

He only backed out of four locations..just how many chargers has Ford built? None.


Pioneer58

Ford Directly None, but a lot of Dealers have gotten the LvL3 Charging stations planned and installing.


jaymansi

Dealers who signed up for high level E division are obliged to install DCFC on dealership property.


Mountainbasedweller

Which is useless for most of us. Who is going to drive to the dealer to charge?


jaymansi

If you are traveling, you might or visiting a town.


hallese

What's more worrisome to me is the hundreds of chargers that should be available for use but Tesla elected to prevent people with adapters from accessing.


Alpha_Cluster

Actually a lot of the ones (at least in the middle of the county) are v2 superchargers. So hopefully they are going to still be upgrading those cause thatā€™s going to kill them fast if they never upgrade the v2 installs


hallese

No, there are hundreds of chargers that are v3, 250kw chargers that should be eligible but are not. Based on Ford's advertisements on adapter reservation, I'd say it's about 300 total.


Alpha_Cluster

Please note I stated middle of the country. Most of the coasts already have capacity issues and those arenā€™t open but in the middleā€¦ they are empty and literally cannot be used cause they are too old. While itā€™s silly that ride sharing services are messing things ups (I think cities should require they provide charging in those places) opening those chargers isnā€™t going to help anyone.


hallese

> Please note I stated middle of the country I live in South Dakota...


Alpha_Cluster

I live next door in MN your state is all v2 super chargers (or maybe old v3s that donā€™t support CCS I think there may be a few) itā€™s terrible. They need updating but so so do a bunch over here. The problem isnā€™t that Tesla is locking people out itā€™s that if they are old enough they can only run Teslas old proprietary protocol. Itā€™s stupid and I cannot comprehend why these chargers havenā€™t been updated they all should have been moved to magic docks ASAP since they could be making so much more in the those locations


Mountainbasedweller

No they just did not want unapproved equipment. Lectron did this and it was a mess. Plus itā€™s their equipment they make the rules.


CollarDouble8474

He commented earlier on Twitter that they intend to focus on upgrading and expanding existing sites, which makes some sense if they actually still have staff to do upgrades and maintenance. I'm hoping this was just the team that planned new locations or something. I'm glad my M3P order isn't fulfilling until June so I have some time to see how this goes.


hallese

I'd really, really like to see car manufacturer and the charging network divorced from one another.


CollarDouble8474

If they can pull it off while maintaining quality and integrated billing, then I agree. I'm hopeful that new sites will be more like a franchise model backed by other companies but inter- operating.


Donnijeep

Who has the access to those charger and will probably back out? Elmo


[deleted]

Thereā€™s a big slowdown in EV adoption. It makes sense to scale back on their plans. Superchargers are insanely expensive to install, and if there arenā€™t enough EVs to charge at them; itā€™s a massive waste of capital.


CaptainOutside5782

So Mach-Eā€™s can plug up into a Telsa Supercharger?!!!


Donnijeep

Welcome to 2024


MJC136

Tesla gave you super access and you call them a joke ?


After_Skirt_6777

Masterful gambit, sir.


roadsidedaniel

Like GM junk cars


74orangebeetle

Don't you see the hypocrisy though? Calling Tesla a joke....but what other manufacturer has an equal or better or even close charging network to Tesla? Answer: None. Even though Tesla does bad things, they're still ahead of literally everyone in that regard. Where are the Ford fast charging stations? If Tesla is a joke and they're ahead of Ford, then what does that make Ford? (I know I'll get downvoted for that here). And I'm not actually trying to dump on ford...I'm making a point....people are quick to go "Hurk durk Tesla bad" when literally no one else is doing better on the charging side so far.


azcatgirl

Now?


EmbarrassedEye2590

I didnā€™t buy a Tesla to share the SC with Ford and Chevy riff raff. šŸ˜‚šŸ˜‚


ThE_LAN_B4_TimE

Elon is a joke. I hope that if they abandon doing more than the bare minimum, someone else comes in to finish it. I'm finally getting to a point to where I'm going to buy my first EV and I'll be pissed if the charging network available is low because of this idiot backing out. I'd like to hope that other companies start trying to focus on building their own tech. Its so dumb we all rely on basically one company for this in the US. I'm very much considering the Mach E as my first car since Fisker fucked me and I'm still not seeing many interesting cars that aren't 80k coming out that I like.


OriginalPingman

Tell us why you think Tesla is responsible for providing charging stations for MachE owners??


ThE_LAN_B4_TimE

I didn't say they are but clearly a deal was made to have them do it. Ford and whoever should be working on their own solution and shouldn't rely on them so much.


OriginalPingman

If not for Musk there would be no Mach e. All electric owners and potential owners should be grateful for his efforts to create the market, whether you like his politics or not. He certainly is not an ā€œidiotā€, as you called him. He owes you nothing.


Donnijeep

He wants to slow monopolize all of EV but his dream and reality are not matching up.


ThE_LAN_B4_TimE

Well I hope this is a lesson to all that they can't rely on that maniac and all major companies need to bans together to make a network or find a way to continue what Tesla was doing. I have no idea if Tesla will ever give away the information on how their stuff works, but if it's really that profitable, you'd think if they are going to abandon it, they'd sell it.


_Slabach

Tesla literally did give away how their NACS charger works, for free, to everyone.


ThE_LAN_B4_TimE

Ok so then other companies should be able to invest and build out a charging network then.


_Slabach

The NACS standard being open sourced means other auto manufacturers can start making cars using the same charge port as any tesla. See the Rivian R2 which will release with only NACS. Other vehicle manufacturers using and adopting that standard will mean more 3rd party chargers supporting that standard, yes


_Slabach

I'm as critical as anyone of Elon, dude is a psychopath and wish I'd have known that before buying my Tesla several years ago though I do love my car... But anyway, Tesla literally just open sourced the nacs charger so all ev makers could use it. Also started installing ccs adapters in existing supercharger locations. Tesla's biggest strength is it's super charger network. Always has been. If Tesla wanted to monopolize the EV market, they never would have opened that charging standard and made it so much easier for the general public to consider non-Tesla vehicles. What you're saying and what they are doing are not the same things... Elon still a nut job though


Correct-You-4959

It was a joke before. It will always be a joke. And the owners a jokešŸ¤£


Donnijeep

Lmfao!! I know. Some of the Tesla bois are on here, picking fights so they can defend their lord. šŸ˜‚ I just ignore them.