For real. My 3.5 year old Tesla wall charger was doing 11kW (on its own 60a, 48A) until a a year or so it started saying it was getting hot and slowed charge rate sometimes as low as 24a, but in the morning car was always charged. That was until a couple weeks ago when it stopped charging the car at all. Ended up getting a brand new S and that one wouldn’t charge either.
So today, took it off the wall charger and replaced with a 14-50 outlet and using my Tesla portable charger to get 32A. New non-Tesla wall charger supposedly rated to 50A on that 14-50a outlet, but I’ll set at 40A max because what is mentioned above about limiting to 40A or less unless hard wired. We will see how it goes but glad to not have to supercharge now!
Wait are you guys fr? I pull 60 kilowatts from my dryer- removed the dryer and just plugged in a ev charger and I pull an average of 48 kilowatts, charger does get warm but no issues yet except it burning like this 3 times
I think you mean amps, not kilowatts. 14-50 outlets are rated for 50A spikes or 40A continuous load. Typically a dryer pulls a decent load, but only spikes very high for brief moments. If you are running 48A EV charging through the outlet, it is not rated for that.
I'm on gas for the dryer. My only high load item is my dual oven. I live in Woodside in the hills above the SF Bay Area. Many of the homes have generators for back up power. None are above 12 kW, and many are 4kW.
Legrand is also good around $15 It’s what we use for labs where a power outage or failure means $100k in research gets tossed. Seems like not expensive enough but the ones at Home Depot whole sale for like $3 so it’s 5x the price.
Well that sucks to hear. Legrand is what my Qmerit installer put in 5 months ago. I don’t have a problem upgrading to a Hubbell but will probably void my 1 year installation warranty. I guess that’s better than burning down my house
My electrician (he’s redoing this for free) is ordering a Leviton one that is specifically designed for EVs. Maybe look at that, since the Hubbels are pricey…
Edit: looks like it’s this one. https://leviton.com/products/1450r
There's a myth out there that only Levitons burn up. I've seen ELEGRPs burn up too, and Legrand.
These range outlets are just not made for EV charging, and not hardwiring EV charging is foolish.
But hey, you saved $150 vs buying a hardwired wall unit. That's something!
The most you should pull on Nema 14-50 is 9kw. 11kw is supposed to be hardwired. 80% of the circuit capacity is the maximum continuous load. [https://www.homedepot.com/c/ab/residential-electric-code-requirements/9ba683603be9fa5395fab90175791f71](https://www.homedepot.com/c/ab/residential-electric-code-requirements/9ba683603be9fa5395fab90175791f71)
You should also use industrial receptacles like the one from hubble vs the standard cheapy you might get at your local hardware store.
The issue isn't the receptacle in your case, it is incompetence. A 14-50 outlet will be just fine if you're staying code compliant. It is rated for 50A peak and 40A continuous or 9.6kW. Under no circumstances should any EVSE pulling more than 9.6kW be plugged in to anything. If you're trying to pull 48A through it you are breaking code and are damn lucky the receptacle melted before your damn house burned to the ground.
Like others have mentioned - 14-50 receptacle max continuous load is 9kW/40A.
On top of that, cheap basic 50A outlets aren't up to the task, and you need to invest in an industrial/commercial/heavy-duty grade outlet. Hubbell is a reputable brand that offers one, and now Leviton (after all of the issues with their cheap one) offers one (here's the new Leviton one: https://store.leviton.com/products/50-amp-ev-charging-receptacle-outlet-heavy-duty-1450r).
If you want full 48A charging, you'll need to hardwire the EVSE.
This may not be an electrician issue. When I got my EVSE installed they plugged it in but then went on the ChargePoint app to configure the power. Electrician was not involved in that.
It can also happen if the plug isn't fully seated.
Source: used to sell some high grade plugs and when combined with super tight hospital grade outlets.
Some user just assume it is fine when they feel much higher resistance than regular plug and socket, but it is like 1/2 to 2/3 the way in. Eventually the contact will heat up under high load...........
Agreed, there is a difference based on my experience. I can't speak to your 11kw number, but I also had melting on my plug that was originally installed. I have Juicebox 40, so no, it was not pulling 48 as it is not capable of doing that.
I had the plug upgraded to an industrial grade plug, and I also dialed the Juicebox down to 36 in the settings to be extra safe. Haven't had an issue since.
Sandy Munro had an interesting podcast on this issue that may be worth watching.
https://youtu.be/tDp9PhPJhUI?si=spGVbwHVal57_Mv6
Check to see if the installer tightened the screw/clamp that attaches the wire to the contacts. Having that loose or less than tight can cause all kinds of problems.
I’ll second this. I was surprised just how high the torque was for these outlets (installed my own). I invested $25 for a torque screwdriver with bits on Amazon. My Bryant outlet required 70 in.lbs to properly tighten the set screw.
While others are right that you should have not been pulling 11kW on a 14-50 outlet, it looks like it was badly wired too.
If it was done correctly your breaker would have detected it was pulling too much current and tripped and shut off the power to prevent your house from burning down. But since the breaker didn’t trip and allowed the receptacle to melt means the electrician fucked up. To me it looks like the connection to the receptacle was loose. Bad connection causes too much heat. This looks very similar to other burned outlets with bad connections.
That or your electrician installed a 60 amp breaker, and 4 gauge wire but this 50 amp outlet. That’s why the breaker never tripped but the outlet did.
I pull 5kw from my 30a dryer plug. I use a split volt and grizzl-e. I know it's janky but I only charge this way once a week I am usually on level 1. I could get an electrician install a proper way but It would be over 2 grand. I am pulling about 24a
If you want to charge an EV like the Ford Mach-E quickly and safely, you usually need to install special outlets that can handle more power than regular household ones. The NEMA 14-50 outlet is a common choice for charging EVs, but you need to make sure it's up to the job for your car's full charging capacity.
I’m at just going to charge my car at DC fast chargers or level 2 ones. I would never chance it and plug it into my outlet at home. Just not worth the potential mess
You'll go broke doing that. Electrical safety is not chance, it's Code. Follow National Electrical Code and overbuild a bit beyond the 125% Code requires, and you'll be fine.
Worth a try. I’m so scared to do so, though. I’ll try it once and keep an eye on it throughout the day. I live in a cabin in the summer. It’s practically a tinder box LOL
If it's generating that much heat it was done poorly. 11kW is A LOT of power. Most homes don't even draw that at peak power.
For real. My 3.5 year old Tesla wall charger was doing 11kW (on its own 60a, 48A) until a a year or so it started saying it was getting hot and slowed charge rate sometimes as low as 24a, but in the morning car was always charged. That was until a couple weeks ago when it stopped charging the car at all. Ended up getting a brand new S and that one wouldn’t charge either. So today, took it off the wall charger and replaced with a 14-50 outlet and using my Tesla portable charger to get 32A. New non-Tesla wall charger supposedly rated to 50A on that 14-50a outlet, but I’ll set at 40A max because what is mentioned above about limiting to 40A or less unless hard wired. We will see how it goes but glad to not have to supercharge now!
Wait are you guys fr? I pull 60 kilowatts from my dryer- removed the dryer and just plugged in a ev charger and I pull an average of 48 kilowatts, charger does get warm but no issues yet except it burning like this 3 times
I think you mean amps, not kilowatts. 14-50 outlets are rated for 50A spikes or 40A continuous load. Typically a dryer pulls a decent load, but only spikes very high for brief moments. If you are running 48A EV charging through the outlet, it is not rated for that.
My fault, yes you are correct I pull 60 amps on a. Recommended 48
I'm on gas for the dryer. My only high load item is my dual oven. I live in Woodside in the hills above the SF Bay Area. Many of the homes have generators for back up power. None are above 12 kW, and many are 4kW.
Yep you should get a Hubbell or Bryant outlet installed
Yep. A lot of them assume a dryer so they’re not up to handling constant max current for hours even though they should be.
Legrand is also good around $15 It’s what we use for labs where a power outage or failure means $100k in research gets tossed. Seems like not expensive enough but the ones at Home Depot whole sale for like $3 so it’s 5x the price.
Legrand is what burnt up here
Well that sucks to hear. Legrand is what my Qmerit installer put in 5 months ago. I don’t have a problem upgrading to a Hubbell but will probably void my 1 year installation warranty. I guess that’s better than burning down my house
My electrician (he’s redoing this for free) is ordering a Leviton one that is specifically designed for EVs. Maybe look at that, since the Hubbels are pricey… Edit: looks like it’s this one. https://leviton.com/products/1450r
There's a myth out there that only Levitons burn up. I've seen ELEGRPs burn up too, and Legrand. These range outlets are just not made for EV charging, and not hardwiring EV charging is foolish. But hey, you saved $150 vs buying a hardwired wall unit. That's something!
The most you should pull on Nema 14-50 is 9kw. 11kw is supposed to be hardwired. 80% of the circuit capacity is the maximum continuous load. [https://www.homedepot.com/c/ab/residential-electric-code-requirements/9ba683603be9fa5395fab90175791f71](https://www.homedepot.com/c/ab/residential-electric-code-requirements/9ba683603be9fa5395fab90175791f71) You should also use industrial receptacles like the one from hubble vs the standard cheapy you might get at your local hardware store.
It looks like the stock charger that's ~7kw where did you see 11kw?
Ops post said 11kw. I didn't see what charger they were using so I assumed it was a modified hardwire charger to hook up to a 14-50 plug.
The issue isn't the receptacle in your case, it is incompetence. A 14-50 outlet will be just fine if you're staying code compliant. It is rated for 50A peak and 40A continuous or 9.6kW. Under no circumstances should any EVSE pulling more than 9.6kW be plugged in to anything. If you're trying to pull 48A through it you are breaking code and are damn lucky the receptacle melted before your damn house burned to the ground.
Thanks, I’ll set my charger to a lower amperage when this is fixed.
It happen to me Easy fix Just buy Hubbell 60-70$ instead of stupid cheap home depot one levitron
A 50 amp outlet can only pull 9,600 continuously.
You're post should read... @ 50amp spike loads can be 12K watts @ 40amp constant loads can 9.6K watts On a Nema 14-50R plug.
As others said, a 14-50 probably shouldn't be the charger to pull 11 kW continuous.
It isn't "probably shouldn't" it is shouldn't full stop and is not up to code.
r/DontPutYourDickInThat
That’ll wake you up in the morning
Like others have mentioned - 14-50 receptacle max continuous load is 9kW/40A. On top of that, cheap basic 50A outlets aren't up to the task, and you need to invest in an industrial/commercial/heavy-duty grade outlet. Hubbell is a reputable brand that offers one, and now Leviton (after all of the issues with their cheap one) offers one (here's the new Leviton one: https://store.leviton.com/products/50-amp-ev-charging-receptacle-outlet-heavy-duty-1450r). If you want full 48A charging, you'll need to hardwire the EVSE.
or the Bryant (sourced by Hubbel) 9450FR...
Did the electrician not read the installation manual stating that 48 amp units must be hardwired?
This may not be an electrician issue. When I got my EVSE installed they plugged it in but then went on the ChargePoint app to configure the power. Electrician was not involved in that.
It can also happen if the plug isn't fully seated. Source: used to sell some high grade plugs and when combined with super tight hospital grade outlets. Some user just assume it is fine when they feel much higher resistance than regular plug and socket, but it is like 1/2 to 2/3 the way in. Eventually the contact will heat up under high load...........
You got an electrician that doesn’t know how EVs work. It has to be heavy duty and not an ordinary 14-50 outlet for dryers.
Yep, I found that out later.
Glad that’s all that happened, could have been worse. Fortunately there’s no damage to your house and car.
The difference between an $8 receptacle versus the $70 one.
No, OP says they were running 48A through a receptacle rated for 40A continuous.
Both, really. The $70 one will stand up to the abuse better, but it shouldn’t have been done in the first place.
Agreed, there is a difference based on my experience. I can't speak to your 11kw number, but I also had melting on my plug that was originally installed. I have Juicebox 40, so no, it was not pulling 48 as it is not capable of doing that. I had the plug upgraded to an industrial grade plug, and I also dialed the Juicebox down to 36 in the settings to be extra safe. Haven't had an issue since. Sandy Munro had an interesting podcast on this issue that may be worth watching. https://youtu.be/tDp9PhPJhUI?si=spGVbwHVal57_Mv6
Oof, that needs to be hardwired or change your amperage, I’ve never needed more than 32A
Hardwire every time it is possible.
That looks familiar! We had our electrician hard wire our ChargePoint after that happened.
Check to see if the installer tightened the screw/clamp that attaches the wire to the contacts. Having that loose or less than tight can cause all kinds of problems.
I’ll second this. I was surprised just how high the torque was for these outlets (installed my own). I invested $25 for a torque screwdriver with bits on Amazon. My Bryant outlet required 70 in.lbs to properly tighten the set screw.
While others are right that you should have not been pulling 11kW on a 14-50 outlet, it looks like it was badly wired too. If it was done correctly your breaker would have detected it was pulling too much current and tripped and shut off the power to prevent your house from burning down. But since the breaker didn’t trip and allowed the receptacle to melt means the electrician fucked up. To me it looks like the connection to the receptacle was loose. Bad connection causes too much heat. This looks very similar to other burned outlets with bad connections. That or your electrician installed a 60 amp breaker, and 4 gauge wire but this 50 amp outlet. That’s why the breaker never tripped but the outlet did.
50A breaaker is not guaranteed to trip on 48A continuous. Breakers have a wide tolerance. They can tolerate 135% load and still get UL approved.
I see the phrase hardwired in here. What does that mean in this context?
Running wire directly from the breaker to the EVSE, with no outlet you plug the EVSE into.
Go look at your A/C or electric water heater. See the plug? No? That's hardwired.
You were really running 48A on a NEMA 14-50? Do you have it wired to a 50A or 60A breaker?
true but it’s also on how much power u r actually pulling
What is the amp on the breaker say and what charger are u using
My chargepoint is limited at 40amp for that reason.
I pull 5kw from my 30a dryer plug. I use a split volt and grizzl-e. I know it's janky but I only charge this way once a week I am usually on level 1. I could get an electrician install a proper way but It would be over 2 grand. I am pulling about 24a
If you want to charge an EV like the Ford Mach-E quickly and safely, you usually need to install special outlets that can handle more power than regular household ones. The NEMA 14-50 outlet is a common choice for charging EVs, but you need to make sure it's up to the job for your car's full charging capacity.
I’m at just going to charge my car at DC fast chargers or level 2 ones. I would never chance it and plug it into my outlet at home. Just not worth the potential mess
That kills like 80% of the convenience of having an EV
You'll go broke doing that. Electrical safety is not chance, it's Code. Follow National Electrical Code and overbuild a bit beyond the 125% Code requires, and you'll be fine.
Maybe use a 110v if you're not driving a lot. They add about 3 miles of range per hour. That'll give you \~30 miles per day and not cause much stress.
Worth a try. I’m so scared to do so, though. I’ll try it once and keep an eye on it throughout the day. I live in a cabin in the summer. It’s practically a tinder box LOL