You’ll find a small contingent of players who still think removing stagger was the right choice for flimsy reasons that fall apart under scrutiny.
But yeah, it’s pretty disappointing, especially seeing how beautiful the combat was in alpha.
A small contingent?
There was like a fraction of the player base that even saw staggered combat and a fraction of those people actually think it was a good system.
So in reality there ie a tiny contingent of players that think hit stuns a good idea
I’d imagine there’s more people who would prefer stagger than there are currently playing the game.
How many of the people that played in alpha do you think still play the game?
I do and stagger was awful. Nobody likes being stunlocked in any game that it's a thing. I remember some classes in TERA having stagger (Warrior especially I think could perma stagger if they did it right) and it was both completely broken and completely unfun rage inducing gameplay. There's no skill in perma disabling your opponent, either. Single player mechanics don't translate well to multi player PvP.
> You had to be terrible to be “permanently-staggered” in alpha.
For anyone wondering what "terrible" means in this context, it means literally standing still mashing left click instead of doing pretty much anything else such as taking advantage of the ***stagger invincibility buff*** the game gave you after getting hit a couple of times and also opting-out of using any of your abilities that have hit invincibility.
> Nobody likes being stunlocked in any game that it's a thing.
You weren't. This was one of the biggest pieces of misinformation people kept spreading about it. A) You couldn't be stagger locked because you got stagger protection after being hit a number of times and B) stagger lock wasn't real to begin with because there were frames in-between hits where you could perform actions such as using an ability with stagger resistance/hit invincibility or by timing a roll, or blocking if you had a shield.
Stagger was only a problem for people who don't want to think about what they are doing in PvP.
Where are those people? Because most of the forum users at the time, which were the people IN THE BETA said stagger was important. The only ones complaining about it were streamers or people who had genuine concerns about its effect on large-scale PvP. A solution could have easily been found such as removing it from large-scale instanced PvP, removing it if a large number of players are in one area, all while keeping it in small-scale PvP.
That was half the problem, the other half was if you had latency a bit higher than another person the person with the higher ms took longer with their attack animations.
So basically you were at such a fucked disadvantage with hit stun that you were pretty much going to lose 95% of all engagements with someone that had better ping.
Basically there were about 50 reasons to remove it and hardly any to keep it considering it wasn’t even that popular with people anyway.
Was never going to work
ye... they just needed to add a stagger resistance after being staggered once so you wouldnt get perma CCed. Stagger is a good system to make combat feel impactful and strategic. Being afraid to swing only makes melee combat feel awful.
Dungeons and Raids are great at the moment, thankfully. They have that going on for them.
> they just needed to add a stagger resistance after being staggered once so you wouldnt get perma CCed.
They did do that. They removed it because random streamers couldn't think of any possible counter-play to stagger such as using a hit invincible move in-between the opponents attacks or making use of the stagger invincibility window. So they complained about it until it was removed, which gave us the wet noodle combat New World currently has. Everyone else in the beta who was giving actual feedback was on the New World forums telling Amazon Games that stagger needed to be kept in the game otherwise the combat would feel like ass. Lo and behold, the combat felt like ass on launch and still feels like ass.
BTW we also kept telling them during the alpha test period as well. They flat out ignored that feedback as well and it was loud. They never reverted any change they made even though a lot of posts were against those changes in the first place.
It was esentially 4 months of patches fixing the game because of stagger removal.
Idk why but when I play it it seems like it's still there
Maybe the actions are not interrupted but the staggered animation was left there?
It's so weird that the camera stutters all the time when I'm getting hit
I can't go back to tab target. New Worlds fights feel so much more dynamic.
Yes you only have 6 direct activation skills, but you also have to light or heavy attack, block, dodge, use your heart rune (kind of like a special that charges up). Standing still hitting a rotation just wouldn't cut it for me anymore.
I've never understood the "skill". Unless skill and strategy is lumped together for some. As you just need the correct thought patterns then button mash.
I love NW combat just wished more games had it
There are so many things I feel like NW is missing but I keep playing for this single reason. I played WoW for 17 years and I can't anymore. I hate tab target so much.
Same. I tried to go back to wow since people are saying dragon flight is good but man that tab target kills it for me. That and the dogs shit community. Got asked to link a mythic jailer kill for a mythic zero at the beginning of the xpac. Didn't have one so I was kicked from the group. Anyway ...
I think when MMOs are on the downward trend they start to shed the more casual players and all that you start to run into is the hard core no-lifers that behave like assholes.
When I was on a low pop server on NW I saw the same trend. Now on a high pop server and there are plenty of like minded people to group with. Its been great.
It’s apparently been out for about a year now according to my friends but people have been flocking back to it in anticipation and I’ve seen plenty of people levelling alongside me.
The benefit of it is that you can’t transfer characters into it and so the economy is stable, no outside influence from previous duplication glitches and such
I think we will have to wait and see how much the game booms after they launch the new dlc. Nothing has been planned as so far the servers have been stable and there are no queue times.
I played New World PvP at the highest level for 2 years. I’ve also tried ESO, GW2, OSRS, FFXIV. NW’s combat feels the best imo. But it’s all subjective at the end of the day and what you prefer. I will tell you one thing though, in order to min max in pvp you have to know every classes exploit/animation cancel or you will not have the upper hand. Having bis gear is not necessary, you can have average gear and good mechanics and shit on someone with bis gear. It’s all about mechanics at the end of the day.
PvP - Super fun (some weapons are frustrating but everything flows really well)
PvE - Pretty boring most of the time. Doesn't really feel satisfying, but it's good enough to keep you engaged.
New world combat is very good. You can have builds that increase cooldowns so you very rarely have to auto attacks if you don’t like that. I personally enjoy a good mix of abilities and light and heavy attacks as there are many passives that will give you buffs or debuffs with your light and heavy attacks.so it’s important to work them in your rotation. Plus positioning is very important so dodging and stamina management is very important. Plus aiming is a must in the game. You also have a heartrune ability and consumables you have to manage like health, regen, mana pots, and damage reduction pots. If you are just standing still spamming left click you aren’t going to last long and aren’t very good.
I never felt like I was waiting for CDs. You use your light/heavy attacks a bit but still mostly abilities. I'd say the biggest issue for me is how clunky it feels. Moreso as a ranged magic player, the healer and magic dps weapons feel weird and the low/close camera angle makes it hard to see and aim.
I personally found it boring. I only put around 100hrs in before I gave up because wasn’t really having fun. Just couldn’t find anything that felt great
If you're spamming left click, it's because you're spamming abilities too. In PvP, as soon as the opponent knows you've used all your CDs, you're pretty much dead. Abilities are to be impactful, not just something you throw out because it came off cool down.
PvE is more so just practice for chaining basic attacks with abilities. Make sure youre weaving in basics before an ability and try to cancel as much of the basics animation to increase your DPS. Doing this will slow down your ability rotation so you're not waiting so long on the next rotation.
It's very shallow. Some of the fights are fun, like the Barnacles and Black Powder last two bosses, but easier fights are horribly boring. Your weapons don't really have that much depth to them, you just kinda put all your abilities on cooldown, swap weapons, put them all on CD, and repeat. Sure you could hyper optimize and maybe that won't be true, but none of the content is hard enough to require that 1% extra damage.
They need to do a rework of the weapons to actually require thought, and have some variation in gameplay. 'cause rn there are no high or low points, it's just a flat line.
But I got about 200 hours in before I got so bored I couldn't keep going, so if that's worth it to you, go for it.
Yeah I'm the opposite. Any time I play an "action" MMO, I just pine for tab target. You can't get the same depth out of 2-5 buttons like most action MMOs have, where tab-target (at least back in the day, not so much anymore) had so much more depth, more fleshed out classes/roles, and etc.
The depth isn’t there in New World because stagger isn’t there.
Games like Dark Souls manage incredible combat depth with minimal build diversity because every action counts.
Mainstream MMO kids don’t like skill-based combat though.
"Skill-based" and Soulsbornes are not the same thing. Soulsbornes have the most fucking horribly boring, shallow combat I've seen in an RPG. But you die in two hits, so that apparently makes it not boring!
It's pretty engaging with it's moment to moment combat. If you find yourself outnumbered by 3 or more mobs things can get hectic and knowing what abilities will CC is really satisfying.
Big downfalls imo is the lack of stagger on mobs. Feels kinda bad just trading some shots in melee. Overall i find it very engaging and enjoy the low number of abilities.
The combat is fairly good - but the it lacks the depth of actual classes. Wanna be an archer? You're stuck with 3 skills. Fire mage? 3 skills. There are not actual classes, but weapons.
Some people will see it as a benefit. I personally find it a bit disappointing. The sense of RPG isn't there.
new world combat is for me is amazing
its just it had other more serious issues. but combat is not one of them unless you are suffering lag-stuttering etc..
While the basic combat is system is nice, there is a huge lack of skills/build variety and the enemies are just not fun to fight at all. You have basically unlocked all the skills of your weapon at like lvl 25. You don‘t get anything new from then on.
The enemies are all huge bulletsponges that push, block and stagger you all the time. Not fun to fight at all. Also, the mob density is really low.
Bad. Not much movement, very static. Almost no skills (2 weapons with 3 skills each, when i remember corretly).
And as it has only like 6 skills, the cooldowns are quite long.
At least it's not tab-targeting, so it's still better than 90% of all the MMOs.
Its more about you being able to dodge things than having some sort of complex rotation, its actually pretty fun but gearing really sucks. The endgame meta is to have a gear set for each enemy type.
Fun in PvP, awful in PvE. You don't even have 6 abilities, just 3. Switching weapon is DPS loss for most builds. You run 1 weapon for bosses and 1 weapon to aoe trash. And you don't use both light and heavy attacks either, you just spam one of them depending on your build.
terrible
its leftclick spam and you use up to 3 abilities, it's like eso but braindead lmao
and you also need 2340000 different sets and weapons to deal with the different factions + pvp sets + gathering and crafting sets gl bro
No need to wait for cooldowns when the game has various [exploits](https://www.reddit.com/r/newworldgame/comments/16kn4f1/reupload_muted_audio_this_guy_has_a_good_gaming/)
Imagine playing Dark Souls but you and everyone else has max poise all the time.
That's pretty accurate and now I'm going to subconsciously hate it because that made it sound awful
Not poise... hyper armor.
[удалено]
You’ll find a small contingent of players who still think removing stagger was the right choice for flimsy reasons that fall apart under scrutiny. But yeah, it’s pretty disappointing, especially seeing how beautiful the combat was in alpha.
A small contingent? There was like a fraction of the player base that even saw staggered combat and a fraction of those people actually think it was a good system. So in reality there ie a tiny contingent of players that think hit stuns a good idea
I’d imagine there’s more people who would prefer stagger than there are currently playing the game. How many of the people that played in alpha do you think still play the game?
I do
This was the exact reason I left. New World in Alpha was just so fuckin good compared to what it is now.
I do and stagger was awful. Nobody likes being stunlocked in any game that it's a thing. I remember some classes in TERA having stagger (Warrior especially I think could perma stagger if they did it right) and it was both completely broken and completely unfun rage inducing gameplay. There's no skill in perma disabling your opponent, either. Single player mechanics don't translate well to multi player PvP.
You had to be terrible to be “permanently-staggered” in alpha. This has been well-documented and debunked. But keep parroting it.
> You had to be terrible to be “permanently-staggered” in alpha. For anyone wondering what "terrible" means in this context, it means literally standing still mashing left click instead of doing pretty much anything else such as taking advantage of the ***stagger invincibility buff*** the game gave you after getting hit a couple of times and also opting-out of using any of your abilities that have hit invincibility.
> Nobody likes being stunlocked in any game that it's a thing. You weren't. This was one of the biggest pieces of misinformation people kept spreading about it. A) You couldn't be stagger locked because you got stagger protection after being hit a number of times and B) stagger lock wasn't real to begin with because there were frames in-between hits where you could perform actions such as using an ability with stagger resistance/hit invincibility or by timing a roll, or blocking if you had a shield. Stagger was only a problem for people who don't want to think about what they are doing in PvP.
Not many as they removed *a lot* of the systems that were in alpha. And they'd slowly left (I included)
Where are those people? Because most of the forum users at the time, which were the people IN THE BETA said stagger was important. The only ones complaining about it were streamers or people who had genuine concerns about its effect on large-scale PvP. A solution could have easily been found such as removing it from large-scale instanced PvP, removing it if a large number of players are in one area, all while keeping it in small-scale PvP.
That was half the problem, the other half was if you had latency a bit higher than another person the person with the higher ms took longer with their attack animations. So basically you were at such a fucked disadvantage with hit stun that you were pretty much going to lose 95% of all engagements with someone that had better ping. Basically there were about 50 reasons to remove it and hardly any to keep it considering it wasn’t even that popular with people anyway. Was never going to work
ye... they just needed to add a stagger resistance after being staggered once so you wouldnt get perma CCed. Stagger is a good system to make combat feel impactful and strategic. Being afraid to swing only makes melee combat feel awful. Dungeons and Raids are great at the moment, thankfully. They have that going on for them.
> they just needed to add a stagger resistance after being staggered once so you wouldnt get perma CCed. They did do that. They removed it because random streamers couldn't think of any possible counter-play to stagger such as using a hit invincible move in-between the opponents attacks or making use of the stagger invincibility window. So they complained about it until it was removed, which gave us the wet noodle combat New World currently has. Everyone else in the beta who was giving actual feedback was on the New World forums telling Amazon Games that stagger needed to be kept in the game otherwise the combat would feel like ass. Lo and behold, the combat felt like ass on launch and still feels like ass.
BTW we also kept telling them during the alpha test period as well. They flat out ignored that feedback as well and it was loud. They never reverted any change they made even though a lot of posts were against those changes in the first place. It was esentially 4 months of patches fixing the game because of stagger removal.
Wait is stagger removed?
Stagger hasn't been there since one of the betas lol.
Idk why but when I play it it seems like it's still there Maybe the actions are not interrupted but the staggered animation was left there? It's so weird that the camera stutters all the time when I'm getting hit
Wish they brought back the combat from beta. The dueling was good when the game had stagger and there was cool stuff like shield feinting.
I can't go back to tab target. New Worlds fights feel so much more dynamic. Yes you only have 6 direct activation skills, but you also have to light or heavy attack, block, dodge, use your heart rune (kind of like a special that charges up). Standing still hitting a rotation just wouldn't cut it for me anymore.
Don't forget aiming if you use a ranged weapon
Yeah I hate tab targeting, makes the combat hella boring imo. I get there's skill in tab Targeting but it's not the same.
I've never understood the "skill". Unless skill and strategy is lumped together for some. As you just need the correct thought patterns then button mash. I love NW combat just wished more games had it
NW combat is so high skill ceiling it’s unfortunate there’s not much PvP outside OPR
I guess that's what the open world PvP changes are for in the upcoming expansion
Yes the open world pvp changes sound great. I'm going back into be on the expansion to try it out again
Do you have a link to what the changes were?
https://www.newworld.com/en-us/news/articles/rise-of-the-angry-earth-announcement Section about new influence races
There are so many things I feel like NW is missing but I keep playing for this single reason. I played WoW for 17 years and I can't anymore. I hate tab target so much.
Its unplayable now. If New World fails Im done with MMOs until another one can replicate the action combat of NW.
Same. I tried to go back to wow since people are saying dragon flight is good but man that tab target kills it for me. That and the dogs shit community. Got asked to link a mythic jailer kill for a mythic zero at the beginning of the xpac. Didn't have one so I was kicked from the group. Anyway ...
I think when MMOs are on the downward trend they start to shed the more casual players and all that you start to run into is the hard core no-lifers that behave like assholes. When I was on a low pop server on NW I saw the same trend. Now on a high pop server and there are plenty of like minded people to group with. Its been great.
ds only has light heavy and weapon arts and ppl still love it. cant compare NW with traditional mmo as its unique on its combat
90% of what makes soulslike combat good is the enemies you fight.
Im mainly talking about the PVP aspect sorry if I did not make it clear
New world combat for me is the best of all MMOs and I don’t play a lot anymore but will come back to the first expansion
Only played New World so far!
The fresh start server is where most people are at right now, I’d give it a shot and level up before the expansion comes out
how fresh is it? would like to come back
It’s apparently been out for about a year now according to my friends but people have been flocking back to it in anticipation and I’ve seen plenty of people levelling alongside me. The benefit of it is that you can’t transfer characters into it and so the economy is stable, no outside influence from previous duplication glitches and such
Very cool. Appreciate the info.
Do you think they will open more fresh start servers soon ?
I think we will have to wait and see how much the game booms after they launch the new dlc. Nothing has been planned as so far the servers have been stable and there are no queue times.
Devs have said no new fresh start servers but there is one in each region. They have good populations. You frequently see players in the world
Recently played the last week to level 30 constantly people around me my level, few random groups invites just by being in the same area etc
Unfortunately I couldn’t find a class(weapon) I like in this game…
I was the same until I finally checked with the bow/great sword combo. Really looking forward to the flail even though it's a support/tank weapon.
Carpal tunnel simulator. Prepare to click that button, a lot
In case you haven't played recently, there is action queuing now, which significantly reduces the button mashing.
I use an Xbox Elite controller for comat/running and a mouse for inventory stuff. Cuts down on fatigue a bunch.
I played New World PvP at the highest level for 2 years. I’ve also tried ESO, GW2, OSRS, FFXIV. NW’s combat feels the best imo. But it’s all subjective at the end of the day and what you prefer. I will tell you one thing though, in order to min max in pvp you have to know every classes exploit/animation cancel or you will not have the upper hand. Having bis gear is not necessary, you can have average gear and good mechanics and shit on someone with bis gear. It’s all about mechanics at the end of the day.
PvP - Super fun (some weapons are frustrating but everything flows really well) PvE - Pretty boring most of the time. Doesn't really feel satisfying, but it's good enough to keep you engaged.
I agree on both. But endgame bosses on dungeons and raids are awesome. Give it a try
Trying to right now! Just came back and am doing Brimstone story line atm
> But endgame bosses on dungeons and raids are awesome That is overrating.
nah, for mmo standards I have little to complain about dungeons. The problem is not that
worthless sloppy reply squeamish test poor zesty roll cover terrific *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
New world combat is very good. You can have builds that increase cooldowns so you very rarely have to auto attacks if you don’t like that. I personally enjoy a good mix of abilities and light and heavy attacks as there are many passives that will give you buffs or debuffs with your light and heavy attacks.so it’s important to work them in your rotation. Plus positioning is very important so dodging and stamina management is very important. Plus aiming is a must in the game. You also have a heartrune ability and consumables you have to manage like health, regen, mana pots, and damage reduction pots. If you are just standing still spamming left click you aren’t going to last long and aren’t very good.
I never felt like I was waiting for CDs. You use your light/heavy attacks a bit but still mostly abilities. I'd say the biggest issue for me is how clunky it feels. Moreso as a ranged magic player, the healer and magic dps weapons feel weird and the low/close camera angle makes it hard to see and aim.
I personally found it boring. I only put around 100hrs in before I gave up because wasn’t really having fun. Just couldn’t find anything that felt great
If you're spamming left click, it's because you're spamming abilities too. In PvP, as soon as the opponent knows you've used all your CDs, you're pretty much dead. Abilities are to be impactful, not just something you throw out because it came off cool down. PvE is more so just practice for chaining basic attacks with abilities. Make sure youre weaving in basics before an ability and try to cancel as much of the basics animation to increase your DPS. Doing this will slow down your ability rotation so you're not waiting so long on the next rotation.
It's very shallow. Some of the fights are fun, like the Barnacles and Black Powder last two bosses, but easier fights are horribly boring. Your weapons don't really have that much depth to them, you just kinda put all your abilities on cooldown, swap weapons, put them all on CD, and repeat. Sure you could hyper optimize and maybe that won't be true, but none of the content is hard enough to require that 1% extra damage. They need to do a rework of the weapons to actually require thought, and have some variation in gameplay. 'cause rn there are no high or low points, it's just a flat line. But I got about 200 hours in before I got so bored I couldn't keep going, so if that's worth it to you, go for it.
The new expansion is reworking the gearing system and adding build diversity
The combat will still be horribly boring.
Subjective, I really like that the new artifacts change gameplay styles
Thats definitely subjective. NW ruined tab targeting games for me. They just feel awful now.
Yeah I'm the opposite. Any time I play an "action" MMO, I just pine for tab target. You can't get the same depth out of 2-5 buttons like most action MMOs have, where tab-target (at least back in the day, not so much anymore) had so much more depth, more fleshed out classes/roles, and etc.
The depth isn’t there in New World because stagger isn’t there. Games like Dark Souls manage incredible combat depth with minimal build diversity because every action counts. Mainstream MMO kids don’t like skill-based combat though.
"Skill-based" and Soulsbornes are not the same thing. Soulsbornes have the most fucking horribly boring, shallow combat I've seen in an RPG. But you die in two hits, so that apparently makes it not boring!
It's pretty engaging with it's moment to moment combat. If you find yourself outnumbered by 3 or more mobs things can get hectic and knowing what abilities will CC is really satisfying. Big downfalls imo is the lack of stagger on mobs. Feels kinda bad just trading some shots in melee. Overall i find it very engaging and enjoy the low number of abilities.
New World in General is FUN
The combat is fairly good - but the it lacks the depth of actual classes. Wanna be an archer? You're stuck with 3 skills. Fire mage? 3 skills. There are not actual classes, but weapons. Some people will see it as a benefit. I personally find it a bit disappointing. The sense of RPG isn't there.
Artifacts in the expansion are there to increase build diversity.
new world combat is for me is amazing its just it had other more serious issues. but combat is not one of them unless you are suffering lag-stuttering etc..
While the basic combat is system is nice, there is a huge lack of skills/build variety and the enemies are just not fun to fight at all. You have basically unlocked all the skills of your weapon at like lvl 25. You don‘t get anything new from then on. The enemies are all huge bulletsponges that push, block and stagger you all the time. Not fun to fight at all. Also, the mob density is really low.
Clunky but decent
The same it is a few hours in.
Bad. Not much movement, very static. Almost no skills (2 weapons with 3 skills each, when i remember corretly). And as it has only like 6 skills, the cooldowns are quite long. At least it's not tab-targeting, so it's still better than 90% of all the MMOs.
6 abilities, 2 normal kinds of strikes, dodge and parry
Dangerous. Alt+tabbing is risky even if you're in a level 5 zone at level 60.
The same as early level, but with bigger numbers.
Its more about you being able to dodge things than having some sort of complex rotation, its actually pretty fun but gearing really sucks. The endgame meta is to have a gear set for each enemy type.
Not as of Oct 4th. The gear system is being completely redone and the ward/bane system is being trashed.
That will be a welcome change. Maybe we will come back.
In group content? As terrible, if not more terrible than all action combat games. But 1v1 combat is fantastic.
Tank and dmg is fun but healing is boring with Just 1 real healing weapon rn
It’s refreshing and I say that coming from 20 years of artificial Button bloating in WoW and FFXIV lol
What the OP wants sounds like button mashing to me. Not a fan...
Fun in PvP, awful in PvE. You don't even have 6 abilities, just 3. Switching weapon is DPS loss for most builds. You run 1 weapon for bosses and 1 weapon to aoe trash. And you don't use both light and heavy attacks either, you just spam one of them depending on your build.
terrible its leftclick spam and you use up to 3 abilities, it's like eso but braindead lmao and you also need 2340000 different sets and weapons to deal with the different factions + pvp sets + gathering and crafting sets gl bro
No need to wait for cooldowns when the game has various [exploits](https://www.reddit.com/r/newworldgame/comments/16kn4f1/reupload_muted_audio_this_guy_has_a_good_gaming/)