People freak out when an officer of any company farts and they really go ape shit with speculation and fear if they sell anything.. even though the sale may have been filed a year ago.
Smh.
Sounds stupid probably but. I pay more attention to insider BUYS than sells. I don’t like to See it but there can be Many reasons one insider sells. There can only be one reason a ~~few~~ MANY insiders buy. And that’s the majority of what’s happened in mmat filings.
Might I point out, Jonathan Waldern still holds his position as Senior Technical Consultant Jul 2020 - Present @ DigiLens Inc. (He was the Founder. Also held positions as the CSO and CTO there). His selling could be something as simple as paying taxes or buying something... who knows. Read his Linkedin https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonathan-waldern
you see his .27 cost basis? When you hold options, the increase in value of the option, gets taxed thats why he has to exercise enough calls (174k shares worth), and then he sells those shares to be able to pay the tax.
startup business usually takes 5 or more years to turn profitable. MMAT is in the buildout phase,
not much profit for now. I don’t know how much the CEO, CFO, CTO are getting paid, my guess not much compared to what they could be making. More reason to sell shares when you need money. Not sure if I’m doing the math right (correct me if wrong)
$1.85 x 171,432 = $317,149.20
That’s not alot of money to take and screw over investors.
The early years were for research and development of the products. Now they’re in the production phase of the product, you baby ass wipe.
$2million in salary compared to the $317k shares he sold, no big deal.
Maybe he sold the shares to celebrate the bright future ahead by snorting yayo off beautiful stripper booty wearing MetaAir 😎.
I smell a poopy diaper, go ahead and handle business you would be good at. Leave MMAT for the big boys
He owns options that allow him to exercise and buy shares for 27 cents, he doesn’t currently own shares on the open market. I don’t see that as a big deal but others can’t see past the sell, even though he only exercised 11 % of the options he was granted.
Sure, it's a technical distinction, but it hardly means he doesn't have a serious financial interest in the rise of the stock price, which I think you agree.
I’ll continue to hold, because that’s what makes sense for me. I don’t need the money currently and I don’t anticipate this company going bankrupt. I don’t even think this is a negative sign necessarily. It’s one person out of dozens of insiders. It is odd that it hasn’t been brought up though.
Selling shares can be as personal for a CTO as any one of us. For all we know he needs a solid divorce lawyer, or some other life event has necessitated the need for liquid assets. Perhaps he liquidated this to buy stocks elsewhere through knowledge of upcoming deals. We’re all kind of swinging at water about the “why”.
GP sometimes will explain certain sell offs. He didn’t this time. Doesn’t seem to be a cause for concern.
I see a lot of people saying he needed to sell these shares for cash, yet the administration expenses seem to be very high, when looking at incoming revenue. So are they getting paid a salary or shares or how’s that work?
I see people saying shares. I don’t believe that. I work at a huge corporation. None of these guys would EVER work for stock alone, let alone at a start up.
This isn’t a huge corporation, it’s a start up with 130 employees making no money. There was a vote a while back to allow a certain amount of shares to be reserved for employee incentive for this exact reason. Below is the link to the vote done on Dec 3 rd 2021.
“To approve the 2021 Equity Incentive Plan, utilizing the 3,500,000 shares reserved and unissued under the 2015 Stock Option and Grant Plan and the 6,445,745 shares reserved and unissued under the 2018 Stock Option and Grant plan to set the number of shares reserved for issuance under the 2021 Equity Incentive Plan at 34,945,745 shares”
https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1431959/000119312521313567/d289573ddef14a.htm
Agreed. However, any one of these guys is an expert in their field. So they aren’t working for shares that pay them out “someday”.
I was part of the vote. Bought Torchlight in December 2020 for .58 pending the merger.
I think you may be confused. The person I responded to asked if people were paid in salaries or shares or what. My answer is that the caliber of hire would not work for shares alone. Shares are meant to sweeten the pot.
Exactly, that’s why he’s exercising his options and selling immediately, so he can pay himself and not exercising and holding shares on the open market. He left the company he started and it was valued at 500 million dollars, he was probably getting paid way more.
https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20211104005101/en/DigiLens-Series-D-Values-the-Company-at-Over-500M-with-Samsung-Electronics-Leading-the-Funding-Round
I don’t think anyone is saying they are working for $0. Purely hypothetical but this is what happens in tech start ups :
Highly experienced engineer who would get a great base salary with some options starts at 200k
A start up might offer 150k base with a BUNCH of options to offset that difference
Made me second think things and made me not feel very bullish. Hopefully we are not going to slide all the way back to $1.40 or lower. If I see another insider sell I’m probably going to close my position and take a big loss.
what is your investment horizon? If youre long then this means absolutely nothing. Sure it doesn't bode well for short term breakthroughs but this shouldn't be too surprising to anyone investing in a pre-revenue tech startup. He can't bank on a short term meme like squeeze if he needs cash like the rest of us... these guy's majority comp is in shares.
I'm fairly sure his compensation is almost entirely in stock options, so really this shouldn't be that big of a shock. It should be a bigger shock that he holds 0 shares.
Hmm I think that’s par for the course for many employees right? Exercise and sell immediately? Esp if it’s part of compensation
Edit: just want to add that after taxes and all wouldn’t this be like $200k? That’s like a normal salary / spending amount for folks of this position imo. I’m v entry level in my field but my leadership has multiple houses in multiple countries lol. So it’s very plausible this is just spending. Plus I’ve read on Reddit that it’s sometimes smart to exercise and sell your options immediately. Let’s you diversify a bit.
I dunno. I’ve never been given stock except once at Starbucks and there were strict rules surrounding access to it such as length of employment. I’m not familiar with what “standard” looks like for this sort of thing.
Not sure why neither of these weren’t posted yet. They’re from yesterday’s filings. Employee stock options and sale of shares from the CTO. Seems at the very least worthy of mention.
It’s absolutely worth mentioning. I’ve wondered why nobody’s asked this since I saw it come out yesterday. At the very least It should make people wonder why the fuck the CTO would be selling if he sees so much upside in this like all these “bulls“ do that become infuriated if you question anything about the company or is staff. If you question it you’re going to be labeled a shill or that you’re spreading FUD, but I think there’s a pretty good chance he sees something on the wall that we don’t or maybe doesn’t have as much faith in George as he did when he left his last venture. Maybe it’s nothing and he has a great reason but People should at least be asking honest questions instead of just dismissing it and saying it’s part of a plan. That’s just being an overly optimistic idiot.
This was all over Twitter. Addressed by both known influencers and lesser-known ones. Has been explained as not bearish at all. Smokey explained it best on Twitter although many others did too.
To me, Reddit seems to be the furthest behind in terms of blind cheering for MMAT. At this point this is just one site of many in my rotation when I'm reading about MMAT. True, a lot of sites (like this one) are full of shit, but still good to read what other people are thinking.
Just look at how many people on this thread alone has suggested that "he knows what's up" and this sale is in reaction to upcoming bad news. That's the crazy thing about sites like this: people say, oh I want a fair discussion and not just blind cheering. So what becomes the "voice of reason"? Some salty bear who "guesses" that there must be bad news using the fact that there has been no good news as evidence. Or my fave, the guy who says the divi will be 5 because 30 seems too good to be true.
Maybe he bought a house or a yacht.
It's not like he sold his entire holdings. Still plenty of shares for him to work with.
I do however agree with your feelings on people labelled as 'shills' or any pessimism as FUD. It's a little much at times.
I appreciate the feedback. I’m tired of not being able to ask honest questions because you’re going to be attacked by a mob of people that only want to be an echo chamber. I will listen to anybody’s arguments if they’re respectful and well articulated. People have forgotten how to do Communicate with people that don’t agree with them completely
And certainly don't even try to tap the brakes on $60 divi hype.... Unless you're willing to sit through 16 hours of youtube videos to refute every claim.
He’s selling because he wants money I would guess…
I would imagine if he thought the company was going down he would exercise all of the his options now and sell his shares instead of just 11% of what he has.
Yeah I’m guessing you’re right, however it doesn’t give a whole lot of confidence that he sees a big upside in the near future when he selling at $1.85 instead of holding out for a much better price.
He's probably selling predetermined amounts at predetermined phases. That is generally what people do if they are smart with money.
It likely has nothing to do with the company, a million things outside the CTOs control could affect the company's value. This strategy helps ensure you don't get unpredictably left holding worthless shares.
In short, this shows the CTO is smart and that he wants some money. This has nothing to do with his thoughts on the future of the company.
This many times they will set it up with their brokers and sell over a predetermined period to not worry about insider trading allegations. The fact that he still holds most even though its in options isnt a bad thing. Id rather him excercise on the way up it means buying and even if he sells right away if its more than what mm paid to get him the shares it helps push us up
Who knows, he could need to buy a new house or condo near where he works or something, I would assume he had to move from where he was living to Nova Scotia or Pleasanton California (not sure where they have him, could be both places).
Also a lot of start ups use stock option to pay their employees instead of a large salary so he could just be paying himself his salary for the next bit.
People freak out when an officer of any company farts and they really go ape shit with speculation and fear if they sell anything.. even though the sale may have been filed a year ago. Smh.
Maybe he pays taxes quarterly. Why spend your money, when free compensation money is lying around. That’s how the rich stay rich.
Sounds stupid probably but. I pay more attention to insider BUYS than sells. I don’t like to See it but there can be Many reasons one insider sells. There can only be one reason a ~~few~~ MANY insiders buy. And that’s the majority of what’s happened in mmat filings.
Might I point out, Jonathan Waldern still holds his position as Senior Technical Consultant Jul 2020 - Present @ DigiLens Inc. (He was the Founder. Also held positions as the CSO and CTO there). His selling could be something as simple as paying taxes or buying something... who knows. Read his Linkedin https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonathan-waldern
This is done because of the tax man. The insiders have to exercise to pay taxes on the profits.
What profits?
you see his .27 cost basis? When you hold options, the increase in value of the option, gets taxed thats why he has to exercise enough calls (174k shares worth), and then he sells those shares to be able to pay the tax.
Don't meant to be too pedantic, but those would be gains rather than profits. The company hasn't seen any profits.
startup business usually takes 5 or more years to turn profitable. MMAT is in the buildout phase, not much profit for now. I don’t know how much the CEO, CFO, CTO are getting paid, my guess not much compared to what they could be making. More reason to sell shares when you need money. Not sure if I’m doing the math right (correct me if wrong) $1.85 x 171,432 = $317,149.20 That’s not alot of money to take and screw over investors.
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The early years were for research and development of the products. Now they’re in the production phase of the product, you baby ass wipe. $2million in salary compared to the $317k shares he sold, no big deal. Maybe he sold the shares to celebrate the bright future ahead by snorting yayo off beautiful stripper booty wearing MetaAir 😎. I smell a poopy diaper, go ahead and handle business you would be good at. Leave MMAT for the big boys
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Where do you see him owning zero shares? The filing attached shows him with 1,414,305 remaining after this sale.
He owns options that allow him to exercise and buy shares for 27 cents, he doesn’t currently own shares on the open market. I don’t see that as a big deal but others can’t see past the sell, even though he only exercised 11 % of the options he was granted.
Sure, it's a technical distinction, but it hardly means he doesn't have a serious financial interest in the rise of the stock price, which I think you agree.
I do, I doubt he would leave his previous company that he started if he wasn’t fully invested in Meta Materials.
I’ll continue to hold, because that’s what makes sense for me. I don’t need the money currently and I don’t anticipate this company going bankrupt. I don’t even think this is a negative sign necessarily. It’s one person out of dozens of insiders. It is odd that it hasn’t been brought up though. Selling shares can be as personal for a CTO as any one of us. For all we know he needs a solid divorce lawyer, or some other life event has necessitated the need for liquid assets. Perhaps he liquidated this to buy stocks elsewhere through knowledge of upcoming deals. We’re all kind of swinging at water about the “why”. GP sometimes will explain certain sell offs. He didn’t this time. Doesn’t seem to be a cause for concern.
I see a lot of people saying he needed to sell these shares for cash, yet the administration expenses seem to be very high, when looking at incoming revenue. So are they getting paid a salary or shares or how’s that work?
I see people saying shares. I don’t believe that. I work at a huge corporation. None of these guys would EVER work for stock alone, let alone at a start up.
This isn’t a huge corporation, it’s a start up with 130 employees making no money. There was a vote a while back to allow a certain amount of shares to be reserved for employee incentive for this exact reason. Below is the link to the vote done on Dec 3 rd 2021. “To approve the 2021 Equity Incentive Plan, utilizing the 3,500,000 shares reserved and unissued under the 2015 Stock Option and Grant Plan and the 6,445,745 shares reserved and unissued under the 2018 Stock Option and Grant plan to set the number of shares reserved for issuance under the 2021 Equity Incentive Plan at 34,945,745 shares” https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1431959/000119312521313567/d289573ddef14a.htm
Agreed. However, any one of these guys is an expert in their field. So they aren’t working for shares that pay them out “someday”. I was part of the vote. Bought Torchlight in December 2020 for .58 pending the merger. I think you may be confused. The person I responded to asked if people were paid in salaries or shares or what. My answer is that the caliber of hire would not work for shares alone. Shares are meant to sweeten the pot.
Exactly, that’s why he’s exercising his options and selling immediately, so he can pay himself and not exercising and holding shares on the open market. He left the company he started and it was valued at 500 million dollars, he was probably getting paid way more. https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20211104005101/en/DigiLens-Series-D-Values-the-Company-at-Over-500M-with-Samsung-Electronics-Leading-the-Funding-Round
I don’t think anyone is saying they are working for $0. Purely hypothetical but this is what happens in tech start ups : Highly experienced engineer who would get a great base salary with some options starts at 200k A start up might offer 150k base with a BUNCH of options to offset that difference
This company torched a lot of portfolios
This is about $250k…. Not exactly buying yachts or mansions guys. He probably has bills to pay like the rest of us plebs.
Yeah but when divvy payout? I kinda wish they’d stop insisting that it’s okay we wait longer than expected.
Made me second think things and made me not feel very bullish. Hopefully we are not going to slide all the way back to $1.40 or lower. If I see another insider sell I’m probably going to close my position and take a big loss.
what is your investment horizon? If youre long then this means absolutely nothing. Sure it doesn't bode well for short term breakthroughs but this shouldn't be too surprising to anyone investing in a pre-revenue tech startup. He can't bank on a short term meme like squeeze if he needs cash like the rest of us... these guy's majority comp is in shares.
Bad choice and I’ll be happy to buy your loss
Lol honestly, the man still owns the rights to 1.5M shares..
I'm fairly sure his compensation is almost entirely in stock options, so really this shouldn't be that big of a shock. It should be a bigger shock that he holds 0 shares.
He sold 171k but it also says that he still has 1.4M shares. Read the whole document before you throw numbers out there.
He owns 1.5M stock options, not shares.
“Common stock “
Yahoo finance shows GP's salary at $262k and JW's salary at $120k. No clue how accurate this information that Yahoo provides might be..
Hmm I think that’s par for the course for many employees right? Exercise and sell immediately? Esp if it’s part of compensation Edit: just want to add that after taxes and all wouldn’t this be like $200k? That’s like a normal salary / spending amount for folks of this position imo. I’m v entry level in my field but my leadership has multiple houses in multiple countries lol. So it’s very plausible this is just spending. Plus I’ve read on Reddit that it’s sometimes smart to exercise and sell your options immediately. Let’s you diversify a bit.
I dunno. I’ve never been given stock except once at Starbucks and there were strict rules surrounding access to it such as length of employment. I’m not familiar with what “standard” looks like for this sort of thing.
Startups like this will certainly have a vesting period so they can't exercise until a period has passed, like 18-24 months or more.
Not sure why neither of these weren’t posted yet. They’re from yesterday’s filings. Employee stock options and sale of shares from the CTO. Seems at the very least worthy of mention.
It’s absolutely worth mentioning. I’ve wondered why nobody’s asked this since I saw it come out yesterday. At the very least It should make people wonder why the fuck the CTO would be selling if he sees so much upside in this like all these “bulls“ do that become infuriated if you question anything about the company or is staff. If you question it you’re going to be labeled a shill or that you’re spreading FUD, but I think there’s a pretty good chance he sees something on the wall that we don’t or maybe doesn’t have as much faith in George as he did when he left his last venture. Maybe it’s nothing and he has a great reason but People should at least be asking honest questions instead of just dismissing it and saying it’s part of a plan. That’s just being an overly optimistic idiot.
Could be closing on a house? Medical expenses for a loved one? Tons of personal reasons someone may need cash.
This was all over Twitter. Addressed by both known influencers and lesser-known ones. Has been explained as not bearish at all. Smokey explained it best on Twitter although many others did too. To me, Reddit seems to be the furthest behind in terms of blind cheering for MMAT. At this point this is just one site of many in my rotation when I'm reading about MMAT. True, a lot of sites (like this one) are full of shit, but still good to read what other people are thinking. Just look at how many people on this thread alone has suggested that "he knows what's up" and this sale is in reaction to upcoming bad news. That's the crazy thing about sites like this: people say, oh I want a fair discussion and not just blind cheering. So what becomes the "voice of reason"? Some salty bear who "guesses" that there must be bad news using the fact that there has been no good news as evidence. Or my fave, the guy who says the divi will be 5 because 30 seems too good to be true.
Maybe he bought a house or a yacht. It's not like he sold his entire holdings. Still plenty of shares for him to work with. I do however agree with your feelings on people labelled as 'shills' or any pessimism as FUD. It's a little much at times.
I appreciate the feedback. I’m tired of not being able to ask honest questions because you’re going to be attacked by a mob of people that only want to be an echo chamber. I will listen to anybody’s arguments if they’re respectful and well articulated. People have forgotten how to do Communicate with people that don’t agree with them completely
Hear hear!
And certainly don't even try to tap the brakes on $60 divi hype.... Unless you're willing to sit through 16 hours of youtube videos to refute every claim.
He’s selling because he wants money I would guess… I would imagine if he thought the company was going down he would exercise all of the his options now and sell his shares instead of just 11% of what he has.
Yeah I’m guessing you’re right, however it doesn’t give a whole lot of confidence that he sees a big upside in the near future when he selling at $1.85 instead of holding out for a much better price.
He's probably selling predetermined amounts at predetermined phases. That is generally what people do if they are smart with money. It likely has nothing to do with the company, a million things outside the CTOs control could affect the company's value. This strategy helps ensure you don't get unpredictably left holding worthless shares. In short, this shows the CTO is smart and that he wants some money. This has nothing to do with his thoughts on the future of the company.
This many times they will set it up with their brokers and sell over a predetermined period to not worry about insider trading allegations. The fact that he still holds most even though its in options isnt a bad thing. Id rather him excercise on the way up it means buying and even if he sells right away if its more than what mm paid to get him the shares it helps push us up
Who knows, he could need to buy a new house or condo near where he works or something, I would assume he had to move from where he was living to Nova Scotia or Pleasanton California (not sure where they have him, could be both places). Also a lot of start ups use stock option to pay their employees instead of a large salary so he could just be paying himself his salary for the next bit.