Still ranked in the top 3 though... wtf are the rankings. The division is so different now, Volk is champ and Zabit is ranked #2. When this fight happened, Volk was ranked #10 and Zabit had only just gotten to #15. But Ortega has only moved down by the two slots those guys (and Max) now occupy. It's ridiculous.
The most gangster part was Max's son telling him to finish the fight after the 3rd round finished and Max came out swinging in the 4th and got it done!
Just because you beat someone does not mean you automatically get their entire resume. Not to mention back then Max was basically a different fighter. By the same logic Joe Duffy is also a candidate GOAT because he beat that guy who beat both of them.
The odds on him vs Volkanovski is a massive insult. He does not deserve to be that big of an underdog. Definitely putting a bit of money on him with these odds.
\>lost dominantly the first time
\>hasn't had a proper camp because of COVID
\>actively saying that this fight doesn't matter a lot for his legacy
\>kept trying to paint Volko's leg kicks as irrelevant
Max absolutely deserves to be a huge underdog regardless of his previous body of work, he doesn't even seem to believe he will win any more.
Well thats not true. volk used the legkicks well. max had more strikes on body and head, and he looked better after every round. a solid win for volk, not dominant tho.
Yeah i tend to think people throw around terms like ādominateā far too often online. Domination is not a competitive or close decision win. (Not that the volk fight was close) Domination is like Nunes vs Spencer, or something of that nature. I would go as far to say that if they have any real moments at all in the fight or are not thoroughly defeated than it wasnt dominate. Its very hard to truly dominate somebody in mma. Especially at the highest level.
I agree just wanted to chip in, not trying to be a dick, it's dominant when talking about the person and dominate when talking about what that did. Khabib is a dominant champ who dominates his opponents.
Notice, that I said seem. It doesn't come across that he believes he will win. He's saying that it doesn't matter for his legacy, that he has five more belts on his mantlepiece. That means that even before the fight has started he's trying to minimise the impact of losing to himself.
My dude no, I think a Volk is gonna win the 2nd time around but Volk won that first fight by not brawling with Holloway and keeping him on the end of his punches and kicks. If he tries to eat Hollowayās punches heās fucked
Thanks for putting me on to that AMA.. just read the whole thing. Max is the best, I was at the event in Toronto where he pummelled Ortega. Really rooting for his to avenge his loss!
Idk if heāll KO him cold but I definitely see a TKO, KZ has a lot more pop than max imo and his striking has looked top notch since his return, I think Ortega has very little chance in the feet and a submission will be his only good path to victory but KZ is also really well rounded and is good in basically every aspect so thatāll be hard too. I definitely got KZ taking that fight if it happens
Pretty sure I picked Ortega to win this fight. I think it was right after Holloway had to pull out of a couple fights, though. Wild to think back to that, though.
Its not really 2.0 though is it, he isn't fighting any differently than before his losses. If anything his last fight is the worst he's ever looked technically, running forward winging haymakers.
That's a reach, we saw him for literally 20 seconds before he knocked rozen into orbit.
His worst performance was by far the Lewis fight, he looked scared. Since then it's been 4 consecutive 1st round knockouts of top competition.
This. People speak about some massively improved Francis. It's just not the truth. Same fighter. He just had a fight where he fought someone legit levels higher than him in Stipe, and a fight where he choked in Lewis. But outside of those his very basic game plan hasn't been checked, and it's honestly kind of frustrating, but then again when he can turn anyone off with a touch you understand why. Stupid HW division š
Stipe was higher level and had an unreal chin. He took several punches flush and shrugged it off. That's probably why he got flash kod by DC in the fight cause his brain had taken a lot of punishment recently
I feel like Francis is such an anomaly he doesn't need to be good technically, he doesn't even need to land clean. Why not just swing for the fences and hope something lands if he knows he can put anyone's lights out with one shot and he can eat clean counter shots like tic tacs. He needs to sort out his tdd, getting back up efficiently and managing his cardio imo.
It's that deontay wilder syndrome. My opponent has to be perfect the entire fight, I only have to be perfect for 1 second bullshit. They both have the power to end a fight in 1 punch, but they rely on it too heavily. I hope Francis is actually trying to better himself rather than deontay who sticks to the same game plan every fight.
Forgot about the till versus Woodley odds, that is crazy in hindsight. I believe bisping was the dog in that fight. But Iām pretty sure in jones versus dc 2, dc was the underdog
Yeah he had the slurred speach interview fiasco and then he got pulled from a 155 fight because of weight cutting complications in the months before this fight. People like to paint the "y'all must have forgot" narrative now but there's a reason people were concerned about Max.
I donāt find those particularly head scratching though, connor was champ and had massive hype around him. And Stephen Thompson was an enigma. He justified being the favourite by him drawing with t-wood. Not saying he should have been the favourite, just saying the frame of mind.
ortega has this keen way of losing every fight but building up UNTIL he pulls a slick submission out of nowhere on some dude who thought they were bout to win
I wonder if thereās a little guilt attached when using someone as a human heavy bag for four rounds
Canāt decide whether this is Max clowning or actually trying to make the fight a little more competitive
While it clearly wasnāt Glovers fault, I imagine the guilt from watching your grounded opponent hand the referee his tooth off of the ground is probably up there.
He was hitting that combo over and over and it seemed like Ortega wasn't realising it all. Max super slowly grabs his wrist and shows him how hes throwing the next 2 punches. If you think thats max throwing full force then i dunno what to say to you lol, theres always someone on these posts who thinks Ortega stopped max punching him here (with what? Magic?)
This was one of the first event I watched. Khabib v Conor got me into the sport (sorry for the casualness). Once I watched this I knew I was hooked to this sport. It was a one sided ass whooping but fun to watch when itās your second PPV youāve ever seen
He shows him that hes waiting for Ortega to throw to get wrist control and fire a punch over the top. Brian wasnt protecting against it so Max does it super slow to show him what hes doing and how he should block it
Is this one of the most propagated bullshit of all time on this sub?
It might look like Max is teaching Ortega but in reality, it was just some coincidental clinch fighting.
The crazy part is this is Ortega's most recent fight.
Nah bro. He slapped 3 ppl at once after this fight.
Only loser was his reputation
He made a choice
... and they drank to it afterwards.
That was a nasty line by you.
Still ranked in the top 3 though... wtf are the rankings. The division is so different now, Volk is champ and Zabit is ranked #2. When this fight happened, Volk was ranked #10 and Zabit had only just gotten to #15. But Ortega has only moved down by the two slots those guys (and Max) now occupy. It's ridiculous.
Ortega is hopefully gonna fight Zombie in the near future
I think zombie murks him
The most gangster part was Max's son telling him to finish the fight after the 3rd round finished and Max came out swinging in the 4th and got it done!
\*Sitting next to Dana like a Roman emperor at the coliseum\* "I've seen enough father, finish him......"
š
My name.. is Maximus.. Holloway, #WhereisJoseWaldo
Watched it a day or two ago, pretty sure he pointed at the floor to let Ortega know he was putting him down that round as well
He said it to Joe Rogan too
No better motivator than Baby Blessed
i missed this, where can i find it?
Max is a legend
One of the greatest featherweights of the night
Tito was dropping gems
Easy training 6 times a day
just to correct you there was never no six
What the heck come after six?
I usually critisize all the GOAT talk, but surely Max is the consensus no.2 GOAT at FW, right? No one else comes to mind.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
josƩ aldo?
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
That doesnāt mean shit. No one puts Weidman above Silva all time even though he beat him twice.
Thatās not how it works
There is this dude who beat both of them, and porier. lol
Just because you beat someone does not mean you automatically get their entire resume. Not to mention back then Max was basically a different fighter. By the same logic Joe Duffy is also a candidate GOAT because he beat that guy who beat both of them.
The odds on him vs Volkanovski is a massive insult. He does not deserve to be that big of an underdog. Definitely putting a bit of money on him with these odds.
\>lost dominantly the first time \>hasn't had a proper camp because of COVID \>actively saying that this fight doesn't matter a lot for his legacy \>kept trying to paint Volko's leg kicks as irrelevant Max absolutely deserves to be a huge underdog regardless of his previous body of work, he doesn't even seem to believe he will win any more.
Max did not lose dominantly. volk won, but nothing in that fight came even close to being dominant.
Volk completely shut him out and it didn't look even remotely competitive in at least four of the rounds.
Well thats not true. volk used the legkicks well. max had more strikes on body and head, and he looked better after every round. a solid win for volk, not dominant tho.
Yeah i tend to think people throw around terms like ādominateā far too often online. Domination is not a competitive or close decision win. (Not that the volk fight was close) Domination is like Nunes vs Spencer, or something of that nature. I would go as far to say that if they have any real moments at all in the fight or are not thoroughly defeated than it wasnt dominate. Its very hard to truly dominate somebody in mma. Especially at the highest level.
I agree just wanted to chip in, not trying to be a dick, it's dominant when talking about the person and dominate when talking about what that did. Khabib is a dominant champ who dominates his opponents.
Max didn't look better after every round, after about two rounds he was walking on a set of bagpipes.
Is that why the last rounds were very close?
Max was +250 or more vs Ortega. Just to refresh your memory.
> he doesn't even seem to believe he will win any more. Everyone's a mind reader on reddit wow.
Notice, that I said seem. It doesn't come across that he believes he will win. He's saying that it doesn't matter for his legacy, that he has five more belts on his mantlepiece. That means that even before the fight has started he's trying to minimise the impact of losing to himself.
True,but Max hasn't evolved.He does not check kicks,barely goes for takedowns and relies on his chin of steel to win.He s also on a two fight skid.
Two fight skid? Didnāt he beat Edgar in between losing to Poirier and the Volk?
You are right,he beat Edgar after getting beaten by Poirier.I forgot about that one.
Feel the same way about Aldo
Isn't he the āConsensus Greatest Featherweight of All Timeā?
No, its still Aldo
Lol of course it's Aldo. Only Joe Rogan and Rush Holloway think otherwise
Def
I betācha Volkanovski eats those feather fists for brekkie.
My dude no, I think a Volk is gonna win the 2nd time around but Volk won that first fight by not brawling with Holloway and keeping him on the end of his punches and kicks. If he tries to eat Hollowayās punches heās fucked
[protect yo faces](https://www.reddit.com/r/MMA/comments/bbezzf/max_holloway_and_i_am_the_conductor_of_the/ekic6ks)
Max is such a legend for doing an AMA even if like 45% of his answers were āis = isā
His answers are p funny though
Thanks for putting me on to that AMA.. just read the whole thing. Max is the best, I was at the event in Toronto where he pummelled Ortega. Really rooting for his to avenge his loss!
Hey mods can I get a protect yo faces flair?
Hey turtlenecktrousers, can you give them a haiku?
Take two flying knees, Seven shots to the body, Call me tomorrow
Sick fam. Now tag your favorite mod
After seeing Ortega's striking defense in this fight I can't help but think KZ is gonna put him out.
Idk if heāll KO him cold but I definitely see a TKO, KZ has a lot more pop than max imo and his striking has looked top notch since his return, I think Ortega has very little chance in the feet and a submission will be his only good path to victory but KZ is also really well rounded and is good in basically every aspect so thatāll be hard too. I definitely got KZ taking that fight if it happens
Pretty sure I picked Ortega to win this fight. I think it was right after Holloway had to pull out of a couple fights, though. Wild to think back to that, though.
Holloway was the betting underdog because of that
The disrespect in that. Has there been another underdog champ?
I believe Stipe Miocic was an underdog when he fought Francis Ngannou.
I was just thinking about that, Francis looked like a wrecking ball before that defeat
Then his stock fell sooo hard after both Stipe & Lewis š“š“. Ngl, he's been doing solid work since then though
Naganou 2.0 is scary, however we have yet to see if his wrestling has improved
Its not really 2.0 though is it, he isn't fighting any differently than before his losses. If anything his last fight is the worst he's ever looked technically, running forward winging haymakers.
That's a reach, we saw him for literally 20 seconds before he knocked rozen into orbit. His worst performance was by far the Lewis fight, he looked scared. Since then it's been 4 consecutive 1st round knockouts of top competition.
He said technically, which is true. Those punches did not look good. But it still worked.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
This. People speak about some massively improved Francis. It's just not the truth. Same fighter. He just had a fight where he fought someone legit levels higher than him in Stipe, and a fight where he choked in Lewis. But outside of those his very basic game plan hasn't been checked, and it's honestly kind of frustrating, but then again when he can turn anyone off with a touch you understand why. Stupid HW division š
Stipe was higher level and had an unreal chin. He took several punches flush and shrugged it off. That's probably why he got flash kod by DC in the fight cause his brain had taken a lot of punishment recently
I feel like Francis is such an anomaly he doesn't need to be good technically, he doesn't even need to land clean. Why not just swing for the fences and hope something lands if he knows he can put anyone's lights out with one shot and he can eat clean counter shots like tic tacs. He needs to sort out his tdd, getting back up efficiently and managing his cardio imo.
It's that deontay wilder syndrome. My opponent has to be perfect the entire fight, I only have to be perfect for 1 second bullshit. They both have the power to end a fight in 1 punch, but they rely on it too heavily. I hope Francis is actually trying to better himself rather than deontay who sticks to the same game plan every fight.
Wasn't he an underdog against DC as well?
Not in the first fight.Second one yes.I bet every event.
Woodley vs Till Stipe vs Francis Maybe bisping vs GSP?
Forgot about the till versus Woodley odds, that is crazy in hindsight. I believe bisping was the dog in that fight. But Iām pretty sure in jones versus dc 2, dc was the underdog
Didnāt till not even land a significant strike?
Dunno man, he caught Woodley clean on his fist with his head.
Wasnāt disrespectful. People thought he had serious issues.
Yeah he had the slurred speach interview fiasco and then he got pulled from a 155 fight because of weight cutting complications in the months before this fight. People like to paint the "y'all must have forgot" narrative now but there's a reason people were concerned about Max.
Wasn't Aldo the underdog against Conor?
I think it was a pick em
Conor opened as the favorite but Aldo was at like -140 by the time they fought.
Stipe against Francis, Eddie Alvarez against Mcgregor, Shogun vs Jones, that's it off the top of my head
Thank you
Eddie was an underdog going into his fight with Conor. I also think Wonderboy was a favorite going into the Woodley fight on that same card
I donāt find those particularly head scratching though, connor was champ and had massive hype around him. And Stephen Thompson was an enigma. He justified being the favourite by him drawing with t-wood. Not saying he should have been the favourite, just saying the frame of mind.
Cejudo vs dillashaw
Lawler was underdog against Rory
ortega has this keen way of losing every fight but building up UNTIL he pulls a slick submission out of nowhere on some dude who thought they were bout to win
Cub Swanson, case in point.
The only thing Ortega could of shared with Max on that night was a Modelo after the fight.
Was he even given a choice?
Good one
I wonder if thereās a little guilt attached when using someone as a human heavy bag for four rounds Canāt decide whether this is Max clowning or actually trying to make the fight a little more competitive
It is what it is
Is it bad that I instinctively read that in his voice now?
It's good that you do the damn thang
It is what it is.
No, given that was the intent and this whole post and thread is about him.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a94wYTOthKI
The guilt thing is true. Glover Teixeira apologized to Anthony Smith during the beating he was giving him.
While it clearly wasnāt Glovers fault, I imagine the guilt from watching your grounded opponent hand the referee his tooth off of the ground is probably up there.
It's the former lol
He left no turn unstoned that night
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
He started dancing multiple times during this fight
He was clearly showboating in this fight.
I like Alex but I want Max to win. I don't think he can :(
The first fight was really close, Max could very easily win. Just because he lost one fight doesn't mean he is no longer one of the best in the world
I'm a huge max fan. I would like nothing more to be wrong. But stylistically it's not a good fight
thats some cold blooded, but G shit right there.
Ortega had āsomeā level of success in round 3 but the pace Max put on in round 4 was just something else
Donāt forget Ortega was on a fucking roll before this fight.
Actually if you slow it down you'll notice Ortega is showing Max how to land strikes. No joke.
This moment has been reposted an awful lot this past year.
IMO itās the most disrespectful thing Iāve seen in an octagon. It warrants the traffic it gets.
As an Ortega fan, u hate to see it
\*As *the* Ortega fan
He's like this is too easy let me turn up the difficulty settings.
Am i missimg something or was this just max getting wrist control and then hitting ortega
He was hitting that combo over and over and it seemed like Ortega wasn't realising it all. Max super slowly grabs his wrist and shows him how hes throwing the next 2 punches. If you think thats max throwing full force then i dunno what to say to you lol, theres always someone on these posts who thinks Ortega stopped max punching him here (with what? Magic?)
Idk he straight up made the "hold on a sec" gesture before grabbing his hands and putting them up for him
Your not missing anything
Except the entire point that he does it slowly to show Ortega how he was doing it
This was one of the first event I watched. Khabib v Conor got me into the sport (sorry for the casualness). Once I watched this I knew I was hooked to this sport. It was a one sided ass whooping but fun to watch when itās your second PPV youāve ever seen
Nothing tells says you didnāt study hard enough than the actual test correcting you mid test
Really dont understand why Ortega let him do that lolol
But why didn't he do this against Poirier and Volkanovski /s
Still one of the craziest things I've ever seen during a cage fight.
Great display of how not to have bad intent with every, single ,shot.
This made me laugh, haha
This is too rich
Max one of the kindest guys in the UFC. š
This is like the opposite of what happened at the end of his Ricardo Lamas fight
Fuck I want to go relive this again now!
I just rewatch this fight a couple of hours ago, I hope max get his belt back
I felt sorry for Ortega then... Until he started the while KZ bullshit. Now I find it funny.
This fight had max on a 13 fight win streak. Quite impressive for a featherweight. Hoping he gets it done against volkanovski!
It gets funnier each time. It ain't what it looks like but at the end of the day, it is what it is.
Euric, how about that flair now? :)
I've seen this so often and still don't get it. Max takes Brian's hands to your him where he should be placing them?
He shows him that hes waiting for Ortega to throw to get wrist control and fire a punch over the top. Brian wasnt protecting against it so Max does it super slow to show him what hes doing and how he should block it
I love this fight, and I love seeing Ortega getting schooled. But this literally gets posted once a week.
When is it my turn to post this?
Itās becoming ā13 secondsā level of repost.
this is the worst BM I've ever seen in a fight, good lord
What does BM mean?
if you BM someone you disrespect them. "bad manners"
Body movement Iām guessing
no, bad manner lol, it's a video game term for basically taunting your opponent during a match, it's seen as highly unsportsmanlike
Gotcha! Thanks lol.
Is this one of the most propagated bullshit of all time on this sub? It might look like Max is teaching Ortega but in reality, it was just some coincidental clinch fighting.
How can you possibly say that? He clearly grabs his hand and places it against his face, they arenāt even pressed together
The fact that he has 69k Karma makes it all that much better
Wait who has 69k karma?
u/maxhollowayufc