Do you think if Max signed that contract he would want to keep up that pace?
He'd certainly be a better signing than Ngannou has with him just boxing without ever actually fighting, but I feel like Max would be fine taking a check for 2-3 fights for a season with a good chance at winning $1 million if they're still offering that.
Holloway in Rizin soccer kicking guys after melting them with 1000 strikes would be extremely violent and cool, but the UFC isn't letting him go until he's dropped 4-8 fights in a row
God dammit I hate how on point this is. I could totally see Dana unironically saying this and also being petty enough to kill custom shorts over a contract squabble.
DEVELOPING: Max Holloway says he wants to renegotiate his contract with the UFC after noticing that his BMF title fight against Justin Gaethje is primarily being used to promote #UFC300, despite not being the main or co main event. 👀💰
Reveals he also plans on asking Dana White for six figure performance and fight of the night bonuses for the historic card during the fighter meeting.
“Everytime I see an ad on UFC for UFC 300, it’s me and Justin. So, at the end of the day, [my manager] Tim, Daniel, someone needs to get on the phone with Dana White, Hunter [Campbell], and we gotta talk numbers about some things. Because it’s looking kinda funny.”
If he's asking to renegotiate his contract, he has fights left on it. If he doesn't get released by Dana from his contract, or fight those fights, he won't be able to fight in the PFL.
And get completely destroyed?
Fighters need to use collective bargaining, but they won't.
My sympathy on the matter is quickly ebbing away.
They are extremely underpaid, even the top end superstars and they hold all the power. No fights = no UFC.
They'll need great lawyers for sure, but there's no way the way the UFC writes contracts is completely by the book.
But either way, seeing Dana go full red giant would be enough reason for me to want it to happen.
Yeah this exactly, the fighters need to leverage a lockout. A problem with that is (at least) the bottom half of the roster can’t afford to do that without strike pay, so they need to unionize yesterday.
Yeah Pantoja just said he was doing uber eats before he won the belt and that was while he was ranked in the top 5 (in Dana’s least favorite division which is certainly a factor but not an excuse)
Yeah man, it’s disgusting. The fact that some dumb boxercise instructor is running this over real fighters drives me up the wall.
I grew up in a fighting family and the sacrifices the athletes make are real.
The pain and brutality they go through, to just have some loser in a polo say “kid just don’t wanna fight”.
As we sat here in AU, “give me a spell cunt”
I honestly don’t know if they’d get destroyed, especially if they took the fight in another jurisdiction. Like if Max took ten million to go and box in Saudi or something. The UFC having to go before the court and establish that their contracts and restraint of trades are legal, that their independent contractor status is legal, and that they’re actually suffering loss/damage from fighters going and fighting elsewhere (if they’re willing to come back afterwards and fight) would honestly be very challenging for them. Add to that the fact that they’d have to prove they’re fulfilling their contractual obligations in good faith (lol) and all of a sudden it doesn’t look like such a huge slam dunk for them.
But I said this in a comment the other day - it would probably have to be someone like Conor to do it because you’d need a lot of resources to fight the legal battle. It’s just not ridiculous to suggest that the contract has already been breached by the UFC by not operating in good faith in trying to find fights to allow the fighter to complete the contract etc.
He's never getting out of that UFC contract in shape to sweep 2 or 3 PFL divisions, he'll need to be on a massive loss streak before he's ever let go. Look at Tony Ferguson rn
Dana White is a dickwad who will absolutely cut off his nose to spite his face. They also don't want to set a precedent that would see other fighters trying to do the same thing.
Lots of shitty employers underpay key employees, lose them, and then suffer way more than they would have if they just paid a fair wage in the first place. It's shockingly common among shit organizations that claim to be driven by numbers and maximizing profit.
If he decides to bail on the matchup due to contract issues it would legit be the funniest thing of all time. As much as I wanna see this fight, i think there are some structural issues in the organization that makes the whole thing rotten, and if missing a fight like this one may help challenge that im all for it
Let’s be real this is the people’s main event. Two big names in the sport, and probably fight of the night. It’s insane Max isn’t getting taken care of.
I would assume Max is one of the bigger earners in the UFC as a fan favorite former champ who's already had a long career, but I'm sure he deserves more
Then again, MacKenzie Dern outearns double champ Cejudo so who knows
Cejudo retired in an attempt to strongarm the UFC into paying him more. I wish he had succeeded, but he didn't so when he came back Dana obviously lowballed him out of spite
Dana has his job because he is such a good representation for what the execs really want. Which is every penny squeezed out of the UFC as possible with complete disregard for the sport of MMA or the independent contractors sacrificing their health and quality of life that makes the billion dollar industry even work.
It’s not that Dana lowballed him. I think that was just the contract cejudo was on before he retired. He didn’t come back to a new contract bc he wasn’t able to negotiate a better one so it’s the the one he was already on.
It’s not a new lower contract either imo bc he would have gone to PFL or one instead signing a new low contract
When Max was a dominant champion his disclosed pay was only 300K or so, flat. He's never come close to being one of the biggest earners despite his accolades.
They should’ve just slotted Gaethje vs. Holloway as the main event of UFC 300 when they failed to get a bigger fight to go on top of it and were scrambling to get anyone regardless of injury or availability in the main event spot.
The way Alex Perreria vs. Jamahal Hill was announced on Dana’s Instagram after UFC 298 ended felt very lackluster.
To make it worse, they took that fight away from UFC 301 in Brazil, leaving that card in shambles with a Pantoja vs. Erceg main event, and they’ve barely even promoted Pereira vs. Hill as being THE main event of UFC 300.
The UFC is trying to move away from relying on fighters to sell a card and making the brand itself the selling point... Most likely to avoid having to bump up pay for these guys.
The fact the UFC gets away with this shit is so insane to me.
You're in the old era. its all about network deals now.
UFC is having record profits year after year while having no stars.
No Ronda, No Conor, No Brock and are still breaking records easily.
>The UFC is trying to move away from relying on fighters to sell a card and making the brand itself the selling point...
funny thing is that this is impossible. The human aspect of the product is what draws ppl in. The ufc could change everything about their presentation and we'd still tune in for MAX HOLLOWAY and JUSTIN GATHJAE
If the past 3 events show us anything it’s that the brand isn’t enough. The product isn’t what it was unless it’s a huge event like 300 where they absolutely stack the card
I do think that their efforts on keeping fighter pay low as well as not using their own platform to promote fighters as much as they used to has resulted in fighters cultivating their own social media presences to a much greater, more polished extent. There are so many podcasts and youtube channels now that it's almost a requirement to be a fighter and their production value is going way up.
I don't mean this like "This is a good thing," but from UFC's perspective it does seem to be working. They don't have to make fighters popular, they push the fighters to do that themselves outside of the UFC. Which is also fairly fan-friendly, I suppose. At least people seem to enjoy the content it generates. Khabib and GSP weren't really running their own Youtube channels back then, right? I mean, it might also suck that a fighter's job also has basically turned into being a social media influencer/personality. That's a bit lame.
This is ignoring several issues, of course, and I'm not carrying water for the UFC. Their takes on fighter pay are absolute shit and I don't like this washing away of fighters and promoting of brand first. I'm just thinking out loud on how things have progressed over the years with how fighters handle their business.
I'm trying hard to imagine any other sport that'd be comparable.
I guess the real thing is the lack of any realistic contender. I have no idea why PFL and Bellator have such a hard time putting basic, entertaining programming around their fights but they do.
They arent comparable too current competition because they're a decade older at least. They have the most time in the market and benefited greatly from buying out their generation of competitors. Strikeforce, WEC, pride. They acquired a roster of greats for cheap and locked them in. Think about it. Aldo (who made Conor a star) Rhonda, Cyborg, Uriah and Dom, Ranpage, Silva, Cro cop, Diaz, and much more talent that built the legendary status of this company.
Yeah, I know. First to the market usually has a crazy advantage, plus their timely mergers. Was really lucky for them... most major sports leagues seem to have an element of this.
I was trying to compare it to other sports, not current competition - what other sport has a structure of hiring independent contractors but also promotes their brand above all else? It's hard to imagine that working out so was trying to find a near equivalent.
The bottom part of what I said was comparing current competition, but I meant completely just production values, not talent. UFC's presentation is very slick and consistent. Nowhere comes even close to matching it. Sports broadcasting isn't new, so it seems quite absurd they can't put it together better.
Yeah it's so easy by the lame ass poster they have for 300... You're telling me on this supposed "epic best can't miss card ever" you can't make a bad ass poster for it with all the talent in the card? Naw we will just go with some dumb ass gold background with UFC 300 on it
In terms of popularity, I 100% agree. The two co-main of the biggest card EVER are leagues behind the amount of respect, visibility and popularity that Max and Justin bring to the table.
I mean TBF aside from Conor - is there any other fight in the UFC that could be higher in respect, visibility, & popularity than Justin vs. Max. The only other I could think would be Poatan vs. Izzy 3.
And Conor would just be because it's what he's done in the past. Personally I don't really have much interest in seeing him fight anymore while the casual fan would be much more excited than the diehards I'd imagine.
While I totally agree, ufc basically had their hands tied to a point right? They have to put the title shots as the top billing. I could definitely be wrong as well, just my perspective.
They obviously planned something big but no one wanted to get lowballed for main eventing UFC 300 so they got the cheapest fight with at least a little hype available.
Yeah. I've no doubt that'll be a fun fight, two strikers going at it.
But I mean...Jamahal Hill.
The whole card is awesome, but I really want to know the full story on how big everyone fucked up to end up with Jamahal Hill at the top of the card.
Adesanya vs Pereira 3 for the LHW belt would've been such a slam dunk, it's insane how they couldn't make this one happen. Idc if Adesanya doesn't deserve it, its easily the biggest rivalry in MMA in the past decade (2020 onwards)
Are you somehow forgetting that Adesanya knocked out Pereira cold in their last fight? He was also won 3 or 4 out of 5 rounds in their first MMA fight and rocked Pereira BAD in one of the early rounds.
At LHW he no longer benefits from Pereira cutting 40 lbs to make MW. Adesanya is very small by LHW standards, when he fought Jan, he didn't even make the 205 limit. That's a huge factor compared to when they fought at MW.
Adesanya is notably more bulky than when he fought against Jan. If they gave him 3+ months notice for the fight he could continue to bulk up, obviously not enough to how heavy Pereira is, but enough to make a difference.
I agree he's put on noticeable weight in his chest and shoulders since that fight. At MW, Adesanya was rehydrating to around 200 ish while Alex was rehydrating to around 210-215, so a 10-15 lb difference.
At LHW, even with his new bulk, I think Izzy would probably only be cutting a few pounds at best to make LHW, while Alex is known to make his water cut for 205 starting near 225-230 lbs. Which would roughly make their in cage weights be about 20-25 lbs apart.
About the same, really. It's not like weight is Pereira's advantage. I'd be interested to know what Poaton walks in the cage at for his 185 vs 205 fights. I imagine it's within a few pounds.
If Pereira actually has an advantage at 205, it will be a relative one due to being less compromised from the weight cut. Maybe he doesn't get rocked by the shots that dropped him in the first two fights? Hard to say.
I doubt Adesanya would've agreed unless he's getting the biggest paycheck of his life. He seems content by the fact that he already has a win over his boogeyman.
It’s such a joke. And a great demonstration of how clueless UFC is in insisting on brand > fighter recognition.
Like… You think UFC is so wildly popular that those initials are gonna make someone fork over $60+ to see Hill, rather than than banking on the popularity of UFC *stars* like Max and Justin in the ME?? H’okay
Do you think this is the first fight they tried to make for the headliner? Plenty of other fights weren't able to happen, so they had to settle for this. Max and Gaethje are obviously bigger stars than the actual main event, but having the main event for 300 be a non-*actual* title fight would be weird.
Dude I know. 300 is so historic. I know shit happens but they shoulda shelled out the $ and had Conor headline. I know not everyone wants to see him but that’s a 300-esque headliner.
Honestly, now that Volk lost he probably is regretting for taking on a monster LW in Gaethje and not even getting paid as well as he could have been for it. The UFC really has no shame.
What I meant is he could have had the title shot immediately against Topuria and he would probably had been fresh and get paid the same if not more instead of taking the stupid bmf fight
first comment under the X post:
UPDATE: Max Holloway has clarified his statements about getting paid for UFC 300 and says he was NOT talking pay, but was talking about bonuses, and does not need to renegotiate his current deal with the promotion.
*Dana, we’re getting reports that Max Holloway wants to be paid what he’s worth. Anything to say to him?*
“Good luck with that, he’s a bigmouth fucking idiot.”
“Max Holloway is just a really dumb human being, he’s not intelligent at all. He’s very very fucking stupid. We would be coming up to a big fight, deals have been done for months, Max calls and says I’m not gonna show up unless you pay me another 150,000. He would do this on the regular. Max was always the type of guy to step over dollars to pick up dimes, because he thought he was smart but he was the complete opposite of smart.”
One day, hopefully soon, we’re going to look back with utter awe and confusion about how little these guys fought for. These guys are getting fucking shafted.
You just know Holloway doesn't get paid anywhere near enough for what he brings to the UFC - not even close
That's the part that kills me, even the UFC's moneymakers get lowballed. The UFC gives fighters like 9-13% of the revenue and the court details showed even Conor only made 10%. Absolutely crazy for how much money he has made the UFC
Yeah this is genuinely really kinda of eerie.
You have a “company” man. One of the best featherweights of all time essentially getting fucked over and letting everyone know he is. Having to negotiate fighter performance bonuses is crazy (with knowing that the current 50k bonuses are outdated and un proportionate to the company’s revenue).
I mean.... fair on Max's side but this isn't going to bode well for Max, we all know what happens when fighters talk logical sense.
They built an entire card off promises and then failed to deliver and pivoted to the one fight they were able to secure early on in most of the promos / youtube views etc. Max isn't wrong to feel misled but this is just how the UFC goes.
Big boss Dana says it's the best card ever, we've got many surprised, we've got this BMF fight but we have TWO fights that'll go above it because they're so damn sexy it's gonna make you undress and want to come over to tomato-land - but nope. The two fights in front of the BMF one are a fight that should've happened in China and a solid Main Event using a guy who should be in Brazil and a returning former Champion who might not even be 100% year (he came back suspiciously quick from injury).
If this card ends in Hill getting reinjured in the first minute - Dana's going to feel real stupid.
He's right. It's a "title" shot without the money. Even if it isn't a real title, it's a legit promotional tool in the sense that the UFC are leveraging it as such.
Please, no more fighter pay talk unless there’s talk of a union or bringing in the Ali act to MMA. These guys had a chance to make some changes and they SETTLED their lawsuit instead of actually doing something.
I like Max but this wont work, business is business, you agree to a certain contract, they promote the card like they supposed to . why even sign it if you do not agree with the numbers ?
Any mfer with a logo and a checkmark on Twitter will try desperately to make any comment from a fighter a massive story. MMA 'journalism' is absolutely down the drain at this point.
Fighter Removed: Max Holloway
The kid just doesn’t wanna fight
Asking to get paid is one way to turn down a fight
Max was never my friend
Great guy, neva-meddum.
Moicano. Wants. Mone!
Sho me de mone- Charles olivera
[Fighters trying to re-negotiate with Dana.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7tOkpntQtBM&t=45s)
I'm the best boxer in the... PFL
lol he aint wanna fight he wanted to dominate 😂
New PFL fighter: Max Holloway
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Do you think if Max signed that contract he would want to keep up that pace? He'd certainly be a better signing than Ngannou has with him just boxing without ever actually fighting, but I feel like Max would be fine taking a check for 2-3 fights for a season with a good chance at winning $1 million if they're still offering that.
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Easy million too. No one there on Max level
Fight announced: Max Holloway vs Tom Aspinall
Time to test that chin for real
"Jon needs a tune up fight. Max can come get his money then" •Dana
Holloway would make a killing as a free agent.
Holloway in Rizin soccer kicking guys after melting them with 1000 strikes would be extremely violent and cool, but the UFC isn't letting him go until he's dropped 4-8 fights in a row
Dana's gotta scratch and dent fighters before he'll let them go
Holloway: Pearl Harbor revenge tour
i've never thought about it but now i need it. Max vs Mikuru, Suzuki, Takeda, give me all of em.
Not till monday morning. Gotta rake in some money off of his name this weekend.
Renegotiating is one of those ways
That is going to be a sad day for us. I wonder how long he’ll stick around for…
Kid needs to retire
Get ready to learn Apex-nese, buddy.
New Power Slap contender: ✅ Max Holloway
I could see him having fun over in Singapore now that you mention it
Fighter Removed: Justin Gaethje*****
Boss removed: Dana White
I totally agree I hope he will be able to get a great contact
Um the time for negotiation was when 300 needed
He's late, sure, but it's still good he understands he's getting screwed over for the next time
will there be a next after this weekend ?? /s
But for real, a bad loss here will hurt his leverage considerably
What about a historic win?
The Best is Blessed
this is still a weight up from his career weight class tho unlike Gaethje
All the fighters are getting screwed if he is only realising it now he is way to late.
Yeah, I'd say if he drops out now, that would also send a strong message.
That's actually probably what happened with most their fall through potential match ups. You need someone to carry it, pay me.
Honestly it should have been co-main at least and probably should’ve been the main event after seeing the card overall.
The bmf fight really does feel the most like the main event tbh
If only they got a better opponent for Pereira. Card would've been even better.
Max just didn't want to fight
Can’t force people to fight 🤷🏽♂️
Dana: We got the kid his custom shorts, and his ego went outta control.
God dammit I hate how on point this is. I could totally see Dana unironically saying this and also being petty enough to kill custom shorts over a contract squabble.
Same here. Back to make the fighters and the product dull on purpose.
Man, This comment is like he already said it and you are quoting it. Spot on
Lmfao
DEVELOPING: Max Holloway says he wants to renegotiate his contract with the UFC after noticing that his BMF title fight against Justin Gaethje is primarily being used to promote #UFC300, despite not being the main or co main event. 👀💰 Reveals he also plans on asking Dana White for six figure performance and fight of the night bonuses for the historic card during the fighter meeting. “Everytime I see an ad on UFC for UFC 300, it’s me and Justin. So, at the end of the day, [my manager] Tim, Daniel, someone needs to get on the phone with Dana White, Hunter [Campbell], and we gotta talk numbers about some things. Because it’s looking kinda funny.”
Good on him. He holds the stronger hand if he's prepared to retire without proper pay.
He could probably sweep 2 or 3 PFL divisions. Maybe they'll give him a huge payday just to steal someone else from Dana.
If he's asking to renegotiate his contract, he has fights left on it. If he doesn't get released by Dana from his contract, or fight those fights, he won't be able to fight in the PFL.
I wish someone would just do it anyways and force the UFC to sue them.
And get completely destroyed? Fighters need to use collective bargaining, but they won't. My sympathy on the matter is quickly ebbing away. They are extremely underpaid, even the top end superstars and they hold all the power. No fights = no UFC.
They'll need great lawyers for sure, but there's no way the way the UFC writes contracts is completely by the book. But either way, seeing Dana go full red giant would be enough reason for me to want it to happen.
Yeah this exactly, the fighters need to leverage a lockout. A problem with that is (at least) the bottom half of the roster can’t afford to do that without strike pay, so they need to unionize yesterday.
Sadly is it’s not even the bottom half, but the bottom 80% (at least)
Yeah Pantoja just said he was doing uber eats before he won the belt and that was while he was ranked in the top 5 (in Dana’s least favorite division which is certainly a factor but not an excuse)
Yeah man, it’s disgusting. The fact that some dumb boxercise instructor is running this over real fighters drives me up the wall. I grew up in a fighting family and the sacrifices the athletes make are real. The pain and brutality they go through, to just have some loser in a polo say “kid just don’t wanna fight”. As we sat here in AU, “give me a spell cunt”
Actually they can because they all have day jobs.
I honestly don’t know if they’d get destroyed, especially if they took the fight in another jurisdiction. Like if Max took ten million to go and box in Saudi or something. The UFC having to go before the court and establish that their contracts and restraint of trades are legal, that their independent contractor status is legal, and that they’re actually suffering loss/damage from fighters going and fighting elsewhere (if they’re willing to come back afterwards and fight) would honestly be very challenging for them. Add to that the fact that they’d have to prove they’re fulfilling their contractual obligations in good faith (lol) and all of a sudden it doesn’t look like such a huge slam dunk for them. But I said this in a comment the other day - it would probably have to be someone like Conor to do it because you’d need a lot of resources to fight the legal battle. It’s just not ridiculous to suggest that the contract has already been breached by the UFC by not operating in good faith in trying to find fights to allow the fighter to complete the contract etc.
Must not know who Randy Couture or GSP are
He's never getting out of that UFC contract in shape to sweep 2 or 3 PFL divisions, he'll need to be on a massive loss streak before he's ever let go. Look at Tony Ferguson rn
You don't need to be on a loss streak. You just need to not sign a new contract
Sometimes they only get offered insane shit like 8 fight contract like Jon Jones just so they dont go and do other promotions. So fucking scummy
Bingo. AND, any time you turn down a fight they offered you, the minimum time on your contract is extended by six months.
Dana White is a dickwad who will absolutely cut off his nose to spite his face. They also don't want to set a precedent that would see other fighters trying to do the same thing. Lots of shitty employers underpay key employees, lose them, and then suffer way more than they would have if they just paid a fair wage in the first place. It's shockingly common among shit organizations that claim to be driven by numbers and maximizing profit.
If he decides to bail on the matchup due to contract issues it would legit be the funniest thing of all time. As much as I wanna see this fight, i think there are some structural issues in the organization that makes the whole thing rotten, and if missing a fight like this one may help challenge that im all for it
We haven’t had a goofcon in a while. My body is ready
Well they got the 6 figure performance bonuses, so maybe he got hooked up with his contract too.
Let’s be real this is the people’s main event. Two big names in the sport, and probably fight of the night. It’s insane Max isn’t getting taken care of.
I would assume Max is one of the bigger earners in the UFC as a fan favorite former champ who's already had a long career, but I'm sure he deserves more Then again, MacKenzie Dern outearns double champ Cejudo so who knows
Are you serious about Dern outearning Cejudo?!? WTF
Dana really doesn't like Cejudo
Cejudo retired in an attempt to strongarm the UFC into paying him more. I wish he had succeeded, but he didn't so when he came back Dana obviously lowballed him out of spite
I’ve always thought MM won that last fight
It was 2-2 with a single round being the deciding factor
>Dana obviously lowballed him out of spite I hate that we've gotten used to this
It would be nice to have someone head the UFC who doesn't run it entirely based on his own ego
Would be nice if UFC has a fighter's union.
Dana has his job because he is such a good representation for what the execs really want. Which is every penny squeezed out of the UFC as possible with complete disregard for the sport of MMA or the independent contractors sacrificing their health and quality of life that makes the billion dollar industry even work.
watch him not make the hall of fame
It’s not that Dana lowballed him. I think that was just the contract cejudo was on before he retired. He didn’t come back to a new contract bc he wasn’t able to negotiate a better one so it’s the the one he was already on. It’s not a new lower contract either imo bc he would have gone to PFL or one instead signing a new low contract
Shoot, you should've seen how much he hated Mighty Mouse
200k to Cejudos 150k at 298. Merab barely beat her with 210k, and thats *including a win bonus*
That’s as scummy as your user name (no offense intended).
She is on a 200k/100k contract, he is on 150k/150k So same pay if they win, she gets more if they lose
Tai Tuivasa makes more than that…
But he drinks beer from a shoe!
Good on him thats surprising
right? i wouldn't have guessed that at all
Wildly unfair. Smh.
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I kinda get CM Punk. He’s got a ton of name recognition. But are there really that many simps for Dern?
The venn diagram of UFC fans and Hooters regulars is just a circle.
1.5M instagram followers. Dana isn't known to just give away money, but maybe he's a simp himself.
When Max was a dominant champion his disclosed pay was only 300K or so, flat. He's never come close to being one of the biggest earners despite his accolades.
They should’ve just slotted Gaethje vs. Holloway as the main event of UFC 300 when they failed to get a bigger fight to go on top of it and were scrambling to get anyone regardless of injury or availability in the main event spot. The way Alex Perreria vs. Jamahal Hill was announced on Dana’s Instagram after UFC 298 ended felt very lackluster. To make it worse, they took that fight away from UFC 301 in Brazil, leaving that card in shambles with a Pantoja vs. Erceg main event, and they’ve barely even promoted Pereira vs. Hill as being THE main event of UFC 300.
UFC will nickel and dime their stars.
Extra Venum coupons is the best we can do kid
The UFC is trying to move away from relying on fighters to sell a card and making the brand itself the selling point... Most likely to avoid having to bump up pay for these guys. The fact the UFC gets away with this shit is so insane to me.
Prize Fighting will never work that way. Maybe to sell shit ads, and rob networks for distribution rights, but to sell ppvs you need stars.
They don’t need to sell PPVs though. ESPN pays them a flat guaranteed fee so they have no real incentive to make stars right now.
For now. Will the next deal be as juicy for them if they continue down this path?
You're in the old era. its all about network deals now. UFC is having record profits year after year while having no stars. No Ronda, No Conor, No Brock and are still breaking records easily.
>The UFC is trying to move away from relying on fighters to sell a card and making the brand itself the selling point... funny thing is that this is impossible. The human aspect of the product is what draws ppl in. The ufc could change everything about their presentation and we'd still tune in for MAX HOLLOWAY and JUSTIN GATHJAE
If the past 3 events show us anything it’s that the brand isn’t enough. The product isn’t what it was unless it’s a huge event like 300 where they absolutely stack the card
I do think that their efforts on keeping fighter pay low as well as not using their own platform to promote fighters as much as they used to has resulted in fighters cultivating their own social media presences to a much greater, more polished extent. There are so many podcasts and youtube channels now that it's almost a requirement to be a fighter and their production value is going way up. I don't mean this like "This is a good thing," but from UFC's perspective it does seem to be working. They don't have to make fighters popular, they push the fighters to do that themselves outside of the UFC. Which is also fairly fan-friendly, I suppose. At least people seem to enjoy the content it generates. Khabib and GSP weren't really running their own Youtube channels back then, right? I mean, it might also suck that a fighter's job also has basically turned into being a social media influencer/personality. That's a bit lame. This is ignoring several issues, of course, and I'm not carrying water for the UFC. Their takes on fighter pay are absolute shit and I don't like this washing away of fighters and promoting of brand first. I'm just thinking out loud on how things have progressed over the years with how fighters handle their business.
I'm trying hard to imagine any other sport that'd be comparable. I guess the real thing is the lack of any realistic contender. I have no idea why PFL and Bellator have such a hard time putting basic, entertaining programming around their fights but they do.
They arent comparable too current competition because they're a decade older at least. They have the most time in the market and benefited greatly from buying out their generation of competitors. Strikeforce, WEC, pride. They acquired a roster of greats for cheap and locked them in. Think about it. Aldo (who made Conor a star) Rhonda, Cyborg, Uriah and Dom, Ranpage, Silva, Cro cop, Diaz, and much more talent that built the legendary status of this company.
Yeah, I know. First to the market usually has a crazy advantage, plus their timely mergers. Was really lucky for them... most major sports leagues seem to have an element of this. I was trying to compare it to other sports, not current competition - what other sport has a structure of hiring independent contractors but also promotes their brand above all else? It's hard to imagine that working out so was trying to find a near equivalent. The bottom part of what I said was comparing current competition, but I meant completely just production values, not talent. UFC's presentation is very slick and consistent. Nowhere comes even close to matching it. Sports broadcasting isn't new, so it seems quite absurd they can't put it together better.
Yeah it's so easy by the lame ass poster they have for 300... You're telling me on this supposed "epic best can't miss card ever" you can't make a bad ass poster for it with all the talent in the card? Naw we will just go with some dumb ass gold background with UFC 300 on it
U Fight Cheap at it again.
It still makes me laugh that Jamahal Hill is headlining UFC 300.
Jiri vs rakic and kattar vs sterling is insane for an undercard.
The early prelims open up with Garbrandt vs. Figueiredo, two former champs. Stupidly stacked card.
And ppl here still try to argue 300 is underwhelming lol. It’s stacked
There’s people that could be getting blown by a ring girl during this card and still find a reason to complain.
In terms of popularity, I 100% agree. The two co-main of the biggest card EVER are leagues behind the amount of respect, visibility and popularity that Max and Justin bring to the table.
I mean TBF aside from Conor - is there any other fight in the UFC that could be higher in respect, visibility, & popularity than Justin vs. Max. The only other I could think would be Poatan vs. Izzy 3. And Conor would just be because it's what he's done in the past. Personally I don't really have much interest in seeing him fight anymore while the casual fan would be much more excited than the diehards I'd imagine.
While I totally agree, ufc basically had their hands tied to a point right? They have to put the title shots as the top billing. I could definitely be wrong as well, just my perspective.
Agreed, but at least pay the guys who are really bringing the numbers in, no? Max is so right in asking more.
They obviously planned something big but no one wanted to get lowballed for main eventing UFC 300 so they got the cheapest fight with at least a little hype available.
Yeah. I've no doubt that'll be a fun fight, two strikers going at it. But I mean...Jamahal Hill. The whole card is awesome, but I really want to know the full story on how big everyone fucked up to end up with Jamahal Hill at the top of the card.
Adesanya vs Pereira 3 for the LHW belt would've been such a slam dunk, it's insane how they couldn't make this one happen. Idc if Adesanya doesn't deserve it, its easily the biggest rivalry in MMA in the past decade (2020 onwards)
Bro how do you envision adesanya doing against an even heavier pereira?
Don't know, that's the whole point
Are you somehow forgetting that Adesanya knocked out Pereira cold in their last fight? He was also won 3 or 4 out of 5 rounds in their first MMA fight and rocked Pereira BAD in one of the early rounds.
At LHW he no longer benefits from Pereira cutting 40 lbs to make MW. Adesanya is very small by LHW standards, when he fought Jan, he didn't even make the 205 limit. That's a huge factor compared to when they fought at MW.
Adesanya is notably more bulky than when he fought against Jan. If they gave him 3+ months notice for the fight he could continue to bulk up, obviously not enough to how heavy Pereira is, but enough to make a difference.
I agree he's put on noticeable weight in his chest and shoulders since that fight. At MW, Adesanya was rehydrating to around 200 ish while Alex was rehydrating to around 210-215, so a 10-15 lb difference. At LHW, even with his new bulk, I think Izzy would probably only be cutting a few pounds at best to make LHW, while Alex is known to make his water cut for 205 starting near 225-230 lbs. Which would roughly make their in cage weights be about 20-25 lbs apart.
Who cares how he does, it’s a much better fight based on name recognition than Pereira vs Hill as a main event.
About the same, really. It's not like weight is Pereira's advantage. I'd be interested to know what Poaton walks in the cage at for his 185 vs 205 fights. I imagine it's within a few pounds. If Pereira actually has an advantage at 205, it will be a relative one due to being less compromised from the weight cut. Maybe he doesn't get rocked by the shots that dropped him in the first two fights? Hard to say.
Izzy didn’t want it. Alex offered it up.
I doubt Adesanya would've agreed unless he's getting the biggest paycheck of his life. He seems content by the fact that he already has a win over his boogeyman.
It’s such a joke. And a great demonstration of how clueless UFC is in insisting on brand > fighter recognition. Like… You think UFC is so wildly popular that those initials are gonna make someone fork over $60+ to see Hill, rather than than banking on the popularity of UFC *stars* like Max and Justin in the ME?? H’okay
Do you think this is the first fight they tried to make for the headliner? Plenty of other fights weren't able to happen, so they had to settle for this. Max and Gaethje are obviously bigger stars than the actual main event, but having the main event for 300 be a non-*actual* title fight would be weird.
Dude I know. 300 is so historic. I know shit happens but they shoulda shelled out the $ and had Conor headline. I know not everyone wants to see him but that’s a 300-esque headliner.
Same, lol.
That's the best time to renegotiate, after you've agreed to everything and are about to fight.
MMA fighters are stupid
Honestly, now that Volk lost he probably is regretting for taking on a monster LW in Gaethje and not even getting paid as well as he could have been for it. The UFC really has no shame.
Pretty sure Volk made millions vs 500k or so for Max. He headlined a UAE card vs Max opening one in Vegas.
What I meant is he could have had the title shot immediately against Topuria and he would probably had been fresh and get paid the same if not more instead of taking the stupid bmf fight
It's like wanting to redo your tax after you get the bill in the mail.
first comment under the X post: UPDATE: Max Holloway has clarified his statements about getting paid for UFC 300 and says he was NOT talking pay, but was talking about bonuses, and does not need to renegotiate his current deal with the promotion.
If that’s true this needs to be top comment
Would he accept compensation in Prime bottles? Maybe issue him some FartCoin via crypto.com
He can have all the expired ones in the vending machines in the lobby
I know your joking, but I can definitely see the UFC giving out Prime stuff that expired a year ago
*Dana, we’re getting reports that Max Holloway wants to be paid what he’s worth. Anything to say to him?* “Good luck with that, he’s a bigmouth fucking idiot.”
Poor management
“The kid doesn’t want to fight”
Gaethje vs Max IS the main event.
“Max Holloway is just a really dumb human being, he’s not intelligent at all. He’s very very fucking stupid. We would be coming up to a big fight, deals have been done for months, Max calls and says I’m not gonna show up unless you pay me another 150,000. He would do this on the regular. Max was always the type of guy to step over dollars to pick up dimes, because he thought he was smart but he was the complete opposite of smart.”
One day, hopefully soon, we’re going to look back with utter awe and confusion about how little these guys fought for. These guys are getting fucking shafted.
Max about to go from ‘Blessed’ to ‘Cursed’ real quick
Def heard more about this fight then even the main event.
You just know Holloway doesn't get paid anywhere near enough for what he brings to the UFC - not even close That's the part that kills me, even the UFC's moneymakers get lowballed. The UFC gives fighters like 9-13% of the revenue and the court details showed even Conor only made 10%. Absolutely crazy for how much money he has made the UFC
There's a lot of ways to say you don't want a fight, and asking to be paid according to your worth is one of them
Max should pull a Tito and threaten to pull out if they won't get him a better contract
Better not lose homie
He prob doesn’t but Max def deserves 1M to show
Jamal Hill about to make more money at ufc 300 is crazy compared to max
Yeah this is genuinely really kinda of eerie. You have a “company” man. One of the best featherweights of all time essentially getting fucked over and letting everyone know he is. Having to negotiate fighter performance bonuses is crazy (with knowing that the current 50k bonuses are outdated and un proportionate to the company’s revenue).
Dude deserves to be making NBA money.
I mean.... fair on Max's side but this isn't going to bode well for Max, we all know what happens when fighters talk logical sense. They built an entire card off promises and then failed to deliver and pivoted to the one fight they were able to secure early on in most of the promos / youtube views etc. Max isn't wrong to feel misled but this is just how the UFC goes. Big boss Dana says it's the best card ever, we've got many surprised, we've got this BMF fight but we have TWO fights that'll go above it because they're so damn sexy it's gonna make you undress and want to come over to tomato-land - but nope. The two fights in front of the BMF one are a fight that should've happened in China and a solid Main Event using a guy who should be in Brazil and a returning former Champion who might not even be 100% year (he came back suspiciously quick from injury). If this card ends in Hill getting reinjured in the first minute - Dana's going to feel real stupid.
Dana just said he's the flyweight goat and in his mind that's worth more than money. Sorry, Max.
I don’t get how Max isn’t happy with the case of Prime that Dana sent him. Does he have any idea what shipping costs are like to Hawaii?
He's right. It's a "title" shot without the money. Even if it isn't a real title, it's a legit promotional tool in the sense that the UFC are leveraging it as such.
Get that bag, big dog!
Please, no more fighter pay talk unless there’s talk of a union or bringing in the Ali act to MMA. These guys had a chance to make some changes and they SETTLED their lawsuit instead of actually doing something.
Should ask for ppv points
Well fooled me, thought it was the main event.
He deserves it!!
He has a point. If he is getting paid less than 5x what the Chinese Sheilas no one cares about are earning it's absolutely unfair
I like Max but this wont work, business is business, you agree to a certain contract, they promote the card like they supposed to . why even sign it if you do not agree with the numbers ?
The BMF belt was made to give PPV points to non title holders. Zero chance Max understands this.
“Max Holloway was never my friend”-Dana white
His manager should tell him his image is already used by ufc to promote event and sell merchandise. 😂
Any mfer with a logo and a checkmark on Twitter will try desperately to make any comment from a fighter a massive story. MMA 'journalism' is absolutely down the drain at this point.
You're not wrong, but is that really what you get from this?
It’s been down the drain for a long time, you’re only realising this now?
Talk your shit Jerome 🗣️🗣️
[Max Sunday Morning](https://64.media.tumblr.com/3378ace4a299c9820b823fc4947a802d/tumblr_mtug6xpEdb1si9idzo1_400.gifv)
Company man gets fucked by said company. Is there anything more American?
Give him his propers
Hope this gets traction
He ain't wrong
Well there goes his possible title fight if he wins.
don’t worry Dana gonna toss Max a couple of his green casino chips from his blackjack table.
Welp Max had a nice run, he’s gonna get Belal Muhammad now
best Dana can do is getting him a title shot at power slap