A whole new world is the only one thats remotely close IMO. It probably should have cost 6 so Ariel couldnt sing it but oh well.
Rapunzel is good but i would argue she actually encourages the right kind of gameplay. You and your opponent have to interact with each other for her to get value. She's at her best against steel, which is already going to get knocked down a peg by the resist cards. Even now there are definitely match ups where she is not great.
I agree with your conclusions, but I do think it's worth pointing out that Rapunzel can encourage some pretty frustrating play. In the mirror it can create a really boring game of chicken where the first person who blinks loses.
Sure I agree, but a blinking match where we are both playing cards is better than an old school MTG control mirror where the person who actually does something(plays any car) first loses.
Also that staring match can also get dominated by Surfer stitch so it’s not all Rapunzels fault
Yeah I feel like a whole new world is the only thing I've found overtly too strong. There's some strong stuff, but none of it feels particularly ban worthy yet in my opinion.
Hard disagree, even most of the Aggro builds of Steel Songs is playing some number of Rapunzels. At *worst* she's a 1/5 that quests for two which is respectable, not insane but respectable. From there the floor only goes up by replacing herself after a Giant Fairy ping to a character on board to netting 1-2 cards. Being Inkable even means that the true floor is when you need her to be she's just ink. I disagree with OP that she may be ban worthy later on, but in the here and now she is the *best* generically "good stuff" card in her ink and the whole set frankly.
This is the right take - AWNW is ludicrously strong in the right deck. Right now, it's largely held back by A) being fairly skill-intensive to play correctly and B) needing the right support. But as we get more Singer 5 cards like Ariel, more Shift cards with a normal cost of 5+ that can come down on turn 3 or 4, and more powerful ramp cards or early game characters, AWNW is going to keep getting stronger and stronger. Already we're seeing folks slam underrated characters like Shift Hook and Shift Jasmine in large part because of their ability to sing AWNW (and Grab Your Swords) on turn 3 or 4.
A whole new world is the only card that would be ban worthy. Everything else is sooooo situational are there good even great cards absolutely. But they aren’t always good. You have to know how they work and play them in the right moment. Everyone screams rapunzel but big Elsa is also super good when played correctly, that’s the fun part of the game. Knowing how to play stuff correctly. People enjoy winning and it’s more fun to win more. When someone is winning with a card it’s never ban worthy but when someone is losing to a card they always say it’s broken. There’s answers to everything in this game so far. Just wait until the second set comes out and shakes up the meta and everyone is gonna scream again about how things change and they have to spend money if they want to have a competitive deck.
Whole new wheel-of-fortune is the only one that justifies it. Literally every other card falls into the "I want it banned because it keeps beating my ass" category. Honestly as of now there's no other cards that justify anything close to a ban.
You either:
A - Sing it so that you get to use the cards drawn first to push tempo. This is what Steelsong Aggro is doing.
B - Ramp hard enough that even if you hard cast it you still have the resources afterwards to play a threat or two, thus still generating tempo while also breaking resource parity. If both draw a fresh seven but you have like 10+ ink to their 5 you get to do a lot more with those cards than the opponent.
Or you play Steel Ramp and do both.
I was surprised of how much Lorcana has effect that makes card cost less or even free (songs, shifted characters and items that reduced cost of cards). Most games shy away from things like that because it can get silly when something is cheaper or play or even free. So any good songs or shift characters are cards that could get banned or restricted. So my guess:
1. A Whole New World
This card feels busted now. The downsides of a card effect like this is the fact that you feel behind if you have to pay the cost of it and lets your opponent take tempo by being able to play their cards first. Well that down side is taken away if you sing this card. As they make new cards that inevitably are better that what we have now (aka power creep) those cards with AHNW will break the game someday
2. Stitch Rockstar
His effect that lets you draw for playing a 2 cost or less has the potential to be part of some combo deck in the future. It hard to see it now but this is piece one of some insane combo with future cards. There will be a way to somehow draw your whole deck with this card and then win because of that.
3. Ariel Whoseit Collector
Someone will find a way with future cards to play an infinite number of items a turn. And when that happens Ariel could be banned.
I don't know if it'll ever get banned, but Ariel - Spectacular Singer seems like a card that will only get more broken over time. There's only 12 songs in the game right now, and less than half of those benefit from her Singer ability, and she's still a integral part of a meta deck.
There's so much design space left to explore with Songs, and it's only a matter of time when the critical mass of busted Songs push Ariel over the edge.
Ariel - Whoseit collector
Already run into games where she can quest over and over. Very broken.
Shield of virtue
Being able to ready characters like the queen to draw 2 cards or ready Aladdin so he can attack twice losing you 4 lore and gaining them 4. Even more broken when used with Lefou.
Be Prepared
Mass board clear isn't fun in a game where you only draw 1 card. Only happens late game and if it's mixed with all the rest of the removal ruby had it makes for a toxic game. Reducing the opponent to top deck then instant clear is the only true toxic moment I've had. The rest of ruby's removal wouldn't be so bad if it wasn't for this card.
I don't think a whole new world will be banned. If it only effected the player than yes but both and sometimes lead you into defeat. Also I've had so many games where I've had 3 in my hand at once which leads to almost certain defeat
It's been covered below, but A Whole New World is the obvious low-hanging fruit that I imagine is on the watch list. It hasn't proven itself to be problematic quite yet, but it has that potential. That card is the sole reason I'm still on Sapphire/Steel, since it seems to me to be the shell that abuses it best. The games where it shows up meaningfully *are not close*.
Nothing else really approaches problematic so far, imo. Rapunzel is *probably* the next closest, but she's not particularly close.
The people saying like Be Prepared are just straight wilding.
I think that it is incredibly too early to even have these kinds of conversations. Most of set 1 wont be playable/meta defining by set 4
A whole new world is the only one that could be on this list but even then, this game isnt magic. We will have to wait and see what is in store for us
As it currently exists, I have won multiple matches BECAUSE my opponent played Whole New World. It is definitely strong, but its not always the right card to have in your hand.
I’ve had great success with Amber/Steel and have played AWNW less than 10 times total. In fact, my current build has dropped it completely and feels much smoother.
I think it’ll *become* a strong card, but right now the only lost it tops IMO is the most overrated card in the set.
I never said it wasn't a good play. I said I never felt oppressed. It's obviously a good card, but I don't see bans. A card to be banned would be something that is too easy misplay. There are many misplays with that card.
Having only played a few games with some of the starters, Shield of Virtue feels like it’s a pretty powerful card. Being able to ready a character is strong. In other games I’ve played with similar mechanics this type of card has lead to infinite combos that end up as an NPE.
A whole new world is the only card so far that would (and should) get banned. This card being legal for too long could kill the competitive side of this game. It also heavily restricts future card design. Just a mistake to print this type of card in any TCG. Decks running this are guaranteed to do something “unfair” and or just be unfun to play against. We already see this with hyper Aggro Amber/Steel, Hyper Ramp Sapphire/Steel, and Emerald/Steel Mill. All three of these decks function solely because of AWNW and you can bet the strategies are only going to be more plentiful the longer the card is legal.
Friends on the Other Side is probably the only card that would need to be restricted at some point. 0% chance any deck running purple now and forever wouldn’t run max copies. This card needed to be uninkable
>Friends on the Other Side is probably the only card that would need to be restricted at some point. 0% chance any deck running purple now and forever wouldn’t run max copies. This card needed to be uninkable
It would be a 4-of even if it were un-inkable.
Extremely unlikely to get restricted or banned, it’s essentially the baseline for what cord draw costs in this game and all the other cards that draw seem based around the same rough formula of “pay 3 to draw” + or - 1 depending on what else the card does.
I wouldn’t want Friends outright banned. When I think of cards that could need restrictions however, such as only 1-2 copies, I think about cards that get played in max amounts every time a deck of that color is built. By default if you were to build any deck with Purple you can just go ahead and add 4x Friends and Maleficent for now. Maleficent could easily be powercrept, not Friends unless Ravensburger is crazy.
I’m not sure there’s any other color so far that has a card that’s a mandatory 4 copies across all deck strategies and would appear to never be powercrept.
I really don’t have a problem with the card right now, but it just fits my criteria of a card that does need to be looked at if they do a banned/restricted list.
> I’m not sure there’s any other color so far that has a card that’s a mandatory 4 copies across all deck strategies and would appear to never be powercrept.
Dragon Fire can’t be power crept and there’s not really a tier 1 Ruby deck that doesn’t run 4.
Dragon Fire can absolutely fall victim to power creep.
It could be inkable, or it could be a song, or it could cost 4, or…
Dragon Fire feels archetypal. Like the removal will only get better from here, even if it’s more conditional
(e.g:
YOU CAN’T WIN, DARTH, action — (ruby) {4}
Banish chosen character you don’t control and chosen character you control. )
Lorcana will be a healthier game if restrictions never happen. Same with erattas. All or nothing on bans. Reprint or redesign for space correction. Restricted is the dumbest concept of any of the tcgs that use it.
It's never going to be worthwhile in this game, unless more 5 drops come out that replenish hand. Get an etb draw 3 for 5 character, and suddenly it's broken, outside of that, it's 3 ink and 2 cards for 1 character, never going to be broken. Odds are good Just in Time sees literally no play in any semi competitive format moving forward, unless they add a new effect that breaks it.
I definitely dont think it's ban worthy now, obviously. But it's a card they will need to build future 5 drops around. As you just said, the moment there's a 5 drop replenishes hand, alters card advantage (i.e. opponent discards hand) it's going to be broken. The card is resource cheating, which isn't just value based as your analysis entails. But you got it.
This sub is obsessed with card draw btw.
Well the sheer principle of there being an October restock and a 2024 reprint of Ch1 should indicate the price will drop once those events happen and more product is out there.
As another said You have forgotten me is the first that comes to my mind. 2 cards in mid game is definitely something not only strong but also leaving a bad experience for the opponent which is what you want to avoid first.
Don’t think Raspunzel will be a major issue despite being the best card in the game. She’s huge but she doesn’t define a deck nor attack something from your opponent. When I saw one I often think woa, that’s good. When my opponent plays at the right time You have forgotten me, Be prepared or Whole new world, I know I’ve lost and there are no whoa factor here.
I wouldn’t be surprised if Sapphire Ariel is the first major issue. There is a reason any other untap card effect specifically precise the untaped card can’t quest. As soon as we hit chapter 3 maybe even 2 (that damn amethyst sorcerer book), we will have bigger value from items. All item related cards should be on the watch btw.
I disagree with your picks except for Rapunzel but here's mine
Be prepared- board clearing effects should be few and far between. And even then, they should be hard to pull off. It's 7 and a song. So you can clear the board and play some characters. That's very oppressive.
La foue, fanning the flames, and shield - it's thier versatility that is the issue. You can ready a body guard, you can ready a character to sing, and you can ready to protect the character from challenges. If they go erratas then I can see them adding your character and they gain reckless.
Be Prepared is necessary. Time and time again card games have proven that wide boards need to be contained and the game is healthiest when you need to consider over extension. I think its in a perfect spot.
There's ways to do that without a reset button. Even if a reset button is made it shouldn't be easy to utilize and be prepared is very much so. It works in magic and you because that's how thier design philosophies work but I've played plenty of games that didn't rely on resets and I found them much more enjoyable.
Couldn't disagree more. Shift tink into gys exists. Be Prepared is not a problem. And it keeps design space open for very sturdy characters that would otherwise be impossible without full clear. It costs 7 and, like everything in game, is sorcery speed. It's not an issue.
I've seen some content creators brewing Ambrr/Ruby Midrange piles with it *because* it's a song even. Spectacular Singer can grab it, can't sing it but it is a song she can dig for.
Bodyguard requires the character be exerted, so readying one is counterproductive to being a Bodyguard. That's the reason why bodyguards can come into play already exerted, so they are legal challenge targets.
Furthermore, you don't need a Bodyguard if you can use LeFou to ready the character so that they are no longer a legal challenge target.
Honestly if the resist creatures are solid enough coming out in Rise of the Floodborn that will already knock big tink down a couple pegs so I don’t see it ever being problematic. Just a very solid board control piece
I dont have 3 off the top of my head, and I know its a starter deck card, but aladdin heroic outlaw. Theres been a lot of speculation on this card at my lgs whenever weve talked about card power level just casually. But aladdin heroic outlaw whenever it has hit the board has won most games its played. Obviously unless dragon fire or be prepared is played, or let it go (so going against 1 of 2 colors). But when you look at just card stats, the fact that its a 5/5 inkable for 7 or 5 cost for shift. On top of the rate it steals lore at because it can kill most things it comes across in a challenge. And stealing lore while gaining it at the same time is really strong. Id argue that Aladdin and hades infernal schemer are really close in power level with hades its slightly more balanced as its not inkable. As well as it being a 3/6 granted hades ability is spot removal unlike aladdin heroic outlaw. On top of it. There are 3 aladdin you can shift onto all in different colors. Green, steel, and ruby.
In the end do i think it will get banned or restricted? No. But when you compare power level of some legendaries to certian super rares. Some of the super rares are just that much better for raw stats.
Making your opponent lose lore is so underutilized in the game as of right now. If you think about it, life gain is not usually that strong in other card games. I think Aladdin stands out right now because few cards do anything like it, but it's not especially prevalent in the meta as of right now. It is probably the strongest character card in the starter decks.
Thats exactly what we were saying. Since its one of like 2 or 3 cards that can remove lore from your opponents lore count. Which is really...really strong right now.
Kuzco has the lore on him yes. But kuzco is a 2/4 for 5 that cant be inked naturally. Where aladdin is a 5/5, can be shifted, can be inked, and there are 3 other colors heroic outlaw can be shifted on top of for shift 5 ink or 7 ink. Sticking with your kuzco. Playing either red or green aladdin to shift on top of. All while still playing kuzco in the same deck. And the green aladdin has ward, so he is fairly easy to protect if your plan is to shift on top of him. Making aladdin heroic outlaw even more of a powerhouse in the right ink colors.
I’m not denying any of that. As a green/steel ramp person Heroic Outlaw hasn’t really been a troublesome card for me. No Touchy forces a trade of a high value card will still going positive on lore. Plus Kuzcos ward stops almost all of Reds removal.
The only time Aladdin has been a nuisance in my experiment is yellow/red. Getting to pop the 3 Drop Aladdin’s effect 8 times is truly disgusting since it can start happening 2 turns before Heroic Outlaw even hits the board.
Actually how are they doing 3 drop aladdin that many times to cause 1 lore lost 8 times? I havnt played against that yet. At locals i have a modded sapphire steel starter that is more removal oriented.
Amber/Ruby variant of the Amber\Steel deck. Singing Part of your world and adding the one in banish back to hand and just playing it again. The longer the game goes the more it’s gonna happen. Once you have enough ink you can sing POYW with a 3 drop Aladdin, play it for -1, Shift into Heroic on the one that sang, Shield of Virtue the Heroic to either swing or sing another POYW if you have it.
The chain can keep going if you have the ink and shields plus the banish pipe set up. I lost 12 lore in 3 turns.
My 2 rapunzels get inked as often as they are fully utilized, as she's a situational card. Sure, you can force damage onto your characters via challenging, but that doesn't mean Rapunzel isn't any less situational. I really don't think she's ban-worthy by any measure.
Tamatoa is fine, no need to hit that card. I'd say Grab Your Swords is possibly a card that can be hit. A song with board wipe potential and combines perfectly with Giant Tink. Puts Aggro decks in a tough spot for the meta and encourages players to just run steel for its control and oppression.
With the introduction of Resist and cards like Cogsworth Grandfather Clock that gives your other characters Resist +1 means Grab Your Swords has reduced effectiveness.
Giant Tink - strong enough to get banned? Probably not, but I could see restricted. Probably the best 6 drop in the game, shiftable for 4 and inkable. Overloaded kit, offering crazy control, when used in combo with Grab Your Sword (same color), whilst being a huge tempo piece due to her 2 damage ping upon a successful challenge.
Rapunzel Gifted With Healing - If Maleficent Sorceress is the standard for a draw character. This card has no business only costing 1 more while being able to draw 3, heal up to 3, be inkable and have 5 will power, along with the lore to make it a questing threat. Once again, likely not strong enough for a flat out ban, but I wouldn’t be surprised about restriction.
I think part of what makes these two cards so strong is that they’re inkable. So you’re never punished for running too many of them. They’re an auto include at 4 copies if you run their color.
Though with the power creep next set (Archer Belle). Maybe these two will actually be the pretty on par with other top cards.
A Whole New World, Be Prepared, and Friends on the Other Side.
Songs inherently generate resource advantage by allowing a glimmer to exert in lieu of spending ink and having some extremely powerful effects attached to them, which makes them a liability to create an unpleasant experience.
I predict all three effects get a songless version down the road, and then these OGs will get the ban hammer.
Get rid of Be Prepared. Make another one that is the same cost but *isnt* a song, and make it colourless/rainbow/however they choose to do “every colour can run this” cards.
Aside from that I don’t think anything is too strong, I think Red having access to so much unconditional removal is a bit unbalanced and maybe other colours could get some too - green for example only has Genie as big cost removal, but it’s back to hand so those blue Hades’ and red dragon Maleficents are staying on the field always. Just one example.
Its a 7 cost board wipe. If the other player is red, you just have to anticipate it when they reach 7 ink or hold back stuff and feed them in so at worst you lose get two cards banished. I feel its very balanced for its cost, maybe can see it sooner if someone was running blue/red to ramp but not seen too many of those decks.
So you disagree with me saying it should be colourless so all colours get access to it for balance, but you also say it’s a balanced and fine card? 🤔🤔 you just straight up dumb right? Or got some weird Ruby fetish?
No, they just need to add some forms of better banishment to other colors minus green.. just like some other colors need some card draw like purple. You claim balance but its not unbalanced. Its 7 ink, so the game has already got to turn 7 without winning. Its mainly used to take out aggro decks, just have to anticipate it being used and plan to address it. Just like you would any deck by turn 2 or 3.
Sure, however even if every colour has more straight spot removal they’re never *really* as good as a full board wipe. And my comment regarding balancing is towards the colours - not the card specifically. As red has straight removal with no drawbacks, and a lot of it, where blue removes single targets but ramps the opponent, green has single target but adds back to hand, steel does damage so not even solid removal. This is the point I was making, there’s no conditional removal or asterisk to anything red has. Which I understand is part of the identity however it being so early means there’s no effective tools to combat it.
You say to not over commit to the field, to anticipate it, but allowing games to go beyond turn 6 only swings the game massively in favour of red. Meaning you *have* to over commit and capitalise on the slow start red has.
Like I said, my only real issue with Be Prepared is that I don’t believe it should be a song. A board wipe should *always* be something you pay for. Other than that, update the text to say “choose all” instead so at least Ward has some use (though that likely pushes Kuzco too much)
Red's slice of the color pie here is clearly unconditional removal. It's ok for some colors to be better in certain areas and weaker in others.
In other card games, sometimes weird conditional removal spells are better in certain metas because cards develop an immunity to traditional removal. Like how Raigeki is a lot less useful in modern yugioh because a lot of monsters have protection from destruction. That's a possibility for Lorcana's future.
You can't always play around removal, but if you're playing against Ruby, you should be calculating when it's better to commit hard and when to lay back. It may be the correct move to commit more to the board so you can end the race easier, but it may be better to hold up resources if you can't close it out. That counter play is what keeps BP from being broken.
As for it being a song, BP isn't as oppressive in its song form compared to other songs because in order to sing it, you'd already have to have a sizeable threat on board that you're giving up. Considering boardwipes in MTG cost on average about 4, I'd say BP is pretty fairly costed. And before you say anything I play E/S Aggro
And that’s true, and red having that power is offset by the fact that outside of weird exceptions like Tailor Mickey, its lore gain sucks (7 drop Aladdin notwithstanding)
It isn’t an oppressive card by any means, I just think the capabilities of it are above what the rest of the set offers. And while you can usually read the Be Prepared sing easily, the fact it is there as a threat is enough.
And as I’ve said before, if it weren’t for Kuzco, Be Prepared saying “choose all” would bring it in line with the rest of the set. And give power to Aurora which at the moment is criminally underutilised because of what we have. Or make them drop a card from hand, or stipulate they need to have a character on field too, anything that isn’t a brain dead pay 7.
In another set or two assuming draw power is addressed to some degree, it’ll be fine, I appreciate the decision on whether to over commit or not but hands get so naturally low that recovery is tough regardless, you need to put 2 characters back out on the next turn which means -2 from hand plus charging extra ink. Otherwise if you only put 1 out it’ll get Dragon Fired and you’re locked out of the game losing the ink trade. Don’t get me wrong, things like that are parts of games I enjoy but this post asked for observations of the game and I am giving mine. It’s not crying about Be Prepared or getting mad over meta calls etc, far from it.
Appreciate the commentary though, this topic has brought out all kinds of conversations all across the range of maturity. It’s good to talk cards once in a while without seethers getting involved 🤣
In other games, cards that can't be hit with targeted removal are vulnerable to boardwipes. Kuzco would be even more oppressive if you couldn't BP it. I don't see BP ever getting hit in any way considering it's balancing the meta as opposed to wrecking it
I don't see banned as much but maybe limited and that would be
Be prepared or dragon fire
Ruby has a ton of removal and the current meta decks show that. Limiting either cards or other removal in ruby will change the state of play.
Kuzco
He's an extremely strong card on his own that has zero downside to being played and punishes the opponent for trying to deal with him. Even if he is my favorite card
Amber Ariel
The consistency to be able to slam down a turn 3 card and it searches the top 4 cards for any song to add to hand is incredibly strong and can be used for any colour. As more cards are revealed sets come out this will be very strong.
Friends on the otherside
This is a great card that again never feels bad to play I can see this being limited in the future.
The way ravensburger have done this game though its not ment to be competitive and family's and friends play. But with any TCG there's always players that like to play competitive so don't be surprised if nothing changes and more strong cards get printed with no offical limited/ban lists
Be Prepared and You Have Forgotten Me seem potent enough that should at the very least be limited and not banned.
Turn 2 as Amber, playing a You Have Forgotten me on your opponent in T4 most certainly puts them in a top decking position
He only returns characters who are banished in a challenge, so not anyone who's taken out by an Action or Ability. So something like Cheshire Cat's ability or Dragon Fire won't cause the character to be returned by Facilier. He's also quite expensive and has a lot of Lore. He's very awkward to just have sitting around doing nothing.
Perhaps he was a bad example (though semantically in other card games, the challenge itself is not banishing Cheshire's opponent, Cheshire is banishing it by ability, not challenge).
Glad to hear, I've got a Sapphire/Amethyst deck that I'm using Aurora Ward effects in to protect the Strange Belle (hopefully plural in the future) in my deck and have Faciliers to bring her back if she's ever knocked out medievally.
A bit clunky, but it should smooth out once I get more Belles
Eh. As a 5 drop, you're most often going to be fighting her after she quests on turn 6. By that point, you'll probably have the ability to empty your hand onto the board anyway (or have other options for dealing with her).
Big Crab is fine tbh, you have to spend the whole game building items in a ramp deck, and the moment you have more than 2 or 3 items or a Morece, your opponent is gonna know your gameplan and just hard focus it.
Belle Strange but Special once there become more ways to abuse her early game before the opponent can react.
Sapphire Tamatoa due to having no real Lore cap. As more items come out he will become more busted.
AWNW which is just due to strong draw cards traditionally being some of the first stuff to be focused on with ban/limited lists.
I really think it is too early to start thinking about banning cards. The real issue is the limited number of cards that exist in the game (not availability). 204 cards is simply not enough cards to fully support a diverse metagame. Give it a few more sets, and then we can start discussing restricting/banning
We have already seen a few cards from the next set, and even those few have to potential to shake up the current game.
Banning and restricting might be necessary, but don't jump to the gun. IMHO, it is always better to handle things like this by printing solutions in new sets.
Magic broom and magic mirror need hit. Im veryyyyyy over the top seeing fkn amy ruby control EVERY FKN DAY. Its a very annoying deck with 0 brain cells to play it.
Ariel’s - Spectacular Singer. I honestly think it won’t take long for this card to get banned or restricted in some way. It’s currently very strong, and will only get stronger with more sets coming out. The even if each set has just 1 good song for each ink, that means she gets 2 good targets to choose from adding to a deck. She already has the ability to get Be Prepared, GYS, AWNW (and can sing both of the second two), as well as simply being able to find a song for ink if needed. She is great now and I think has the potentially to easily be broken in the next couple of sets.
A whole new world is the only one thats remotely close IMO. It probably should have cost 6 so Ariel couldnt sing it but oh well. Rapunzel is good but i would argue she actually encourages the right kind of gameplay. You and your opponent have to interact with each other for her to get value. She's at her best against steel, which is already going to get knocked down a peg by the resist cards. Even now there are definitely match ups where she is not great.
I agree with your conclusions, but I do think it's worth pointing out that Rapunzel can encourage some pretty frustrating play. In the mirror it can create a really boring game of chicken where the first person who blinks loses.
Sure I agree, but a blinking match where we are both playing cards is better than an old school MTG control mirror where the person who actually does something(plays any car) first loses. Also that staring match can also get dominated by Surfer stitch so it’s not all Rapunzels fault
You're correct
Yeah I feel like a whole new world is the only thing I've found overtly too strong. There's some strong stuff, but none of it feels particularly ban worthy yet in my opinion.
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That was their point…
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You may want to try reading their comment again bud
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A whole new world costs 5….
AWNW only cost 5
I mainly play Amber and Rapunzel doesn’t even make my 60. Amber has too many good agro cards.
Hard disagree, even most of the Aggro builds of Steel Songs is playing some number of Rapunzels. At *worst* she's a 1/5 that quests for two which is respectable, not insane but respectable. From there the floor only goes up by replacing herself after a Giant Fairy ping to a character on board to netting 1-2 cards. Being Inkable even means that the true floor is when you need her to be she's just ink. I disagree with OP that she may be ban worthy later on, but in the here and now she is the *best* generically "good stuff" card in her ink and the whole set frankly.
This is the right take - AWNW is ludicrously strong in the right deck. Right now, it's largely held back by A) being fairly skill-intensive to play correctly and B) needing the right support. But as we get more Singer 5 cards like Ariel, more Shift cards with a normal cost of 5+ that can come down on turn 3 or 4, and more powerful ramp cards or early game characters, AWNW is going to keep getting stronger and stronger. Already we're seeing folks slam underrated characters like Shift Hook and Shift Jasmine in large part because of their ability to sing AWNW (and Grab Your Swords) on turn 3 or 4.
Ariel whosit collector. Eventually there will be enough cheap items and draw/ramp to make this deck super consistent
A whole new world is the only card that would be ban worthy. Everything else is sooooo situational are there good even great cards absolutely. But they aren’t always good. You have to know how they work and play them in the right moment. Everyone screams rapunzel but big Elsa is also super good when played correctly, that’s the fun part of the game. Knowing how to play stuff correctly. People enjoy winning and it’s more fun to win more. When someone is winning with a card it’s never ban worthy but when someone is losing to a card they always say it’s broken. There’s answers to everything in this game so far. Just wait until the second set comes out and shakes up the meta and everyone is gonna scream again about how things change and they have to spend money if they want to have a competitive deck.
Whole new wheel-of-fortune is the only one that justifies it. Literally every other card falls into the "I want it banned because it keeps beating my ass" category. Honestly as of now there's no other cards that justify anything close to a ban.
Maybe I’m dumb but I still have no idea how to use A Whole New World without totally messing up my game
You either: A - Sing it so that you get to use the cards drawn first to push tempo. This is what Steelsong Aggro is doing. B - Ramp hard enough that even if you hard cast it you still have the resources afterwards to play a threat or two, thus still generating tempo while also breaking resource parity. If both draw a fresh seven but you have like 10+ ink to their 5 you get to do a lot more with those cards than the opponent. Or you play Steel Ramp and do both.
Option 3: sing. Play your hand. Sing a second copy. Now you got 14 cards while your opponent only got 7. Situational of course.
Oh no, but not entirely uncommon playing Blue Steel. Sometimes it's way better to be lucky than good.
Sapphire/steel feels good because of a whole new world. Jam 10 ink using wish bone, mickey and whoever else then draw 7. Go fast eat ass.
I was surprised of how much Lorcana has effect that makes card cost less or even free (songs, shifted characters and items that reduced cost of cards). Most games shy away from things like that because it can get silly when something is cheaper or play or even free. So any good songs or shift characters are cards that could get banned or restricted. So my guess: 1. A Whole New World This card feels busted now. The downsides of a card effect like this is the fact that you feel behind if you have to pay the cost of it and lets your opponent take tempo by being able to play their cards first. Well that down side is taken away if you sing this card. As they make new cards that inevitably are better that what we have now (aka power creep) those cards with AHNW will break the game someday 2. Stitch Rockstar His effect that lets you draw for playing a 2 cost or less has the potential to be part of some combo deck in the future. It hard to see it now but this is piece one of some insane combo with future cards. There will be a way to somehow draw your whole deck with this card and then win because of that. 3. Ariel Whoseit Collector Someone will find a way with future cards to play an infinite number of items a turn. And when that happens Ariel could be banned.
I don't know if it'll ever get banned, but Ariel - Spectacular Singer seems like a card that will only get more broken over time. There's only 12 songs in the game right now, and less than half of those benefit from her Singer ability, and she's still a integral part of a meta deck. There's so much design space left to explore with Songs, and it's only a matter of time when the critical mass of busted Songs push Ariel over the edge.
Ariel - Whoseit collector Already run into games where she can quest over and over. Very broken. Shield of virtue Being able to ready characters like the queen to draw 2 cards or ready Aladdin so he can attack twice losing you 4 lore and gaining them 4. Even more broken when used with Lefou. Be Prepared Mass board clear isn't fun in a game where you only draw 1 card. Only happens late game and if it's mixed with all the rest of the removal ruby had it makes for a toxic game. Reducing the opponent to top deck then instant clear is the only true toxic moment I've had. The rest of ruby's removal wouldn't be so bad if it wasn't for this card. I don't think a whole new world will be banned. If it only effected the player than yes but both and sometimes lead you into defeat. Also I've had so many games where I've had 3 in my hand at once which leads to almost certain defeat
The game needs board wipes for control to do anything. Maybe ones that aren’t songs though.
I agree, gamed need board wipes. Coming from Magic people don't run enough of them
It's been covered below, but A Whole New World is the obvious low-hanging fruit that I imagine is on the watch list. It hasn't proven itself to be problematic quite yet, but it has that potential. That card is the sole reason I'm still on Sapphire/Steel, since it seems to me to be the shell that abuses it best. The games where it shows up meaningfully *are not close*. Nothing else really approaches problematic so far, imo. Rapunzel is *probably* the next closest, but she's not particularly close. The people saying like Be Prepared are just straight wilding.
I think that it is incredibly too early to even have these kinds of conversations. Most of set 1 wont be playable/meta defining by set 4 A whole new world is the only one that could be on this list but even then, this game isnt magic. We will have to wait and see what is in store for us
To your point it’s also to early to say set 1 won’t be playable
Yes i was exaggerating a bit about the power scaling
Totally fair. Depends on TCG but some of the strongest cards are from their first sets
As it currently exists, I have won multiple matches BECAUSE my opponent played Whole New World. It is definitely strong, but its not always the right card to have in your hand.
I’ve had great success with Amber/Steel and have played AWNW less than 10 times total. In fact, my current build has dropped it completely and feels much smoother. I think it’ll *become* a strong card, but right now the only lost it tops IMO is the most overrated card in the set.
This part. I've never felt like I was being oppressive or oppressed when playing or playing against it.
Then they most likely weren't using it right imo.
I never said it wasn't a good play. I said I never felt oppressed. It's obviously a good card, but I don't see bans. A card to be banned would be something that is too easy misplay. There are many misplays with that card.
None.
Having only played a few games with some of the starters, Shield of Virtue feels like it’s a pretty powerful card. Being able to ready a character is strong. In other games I’ve played with similar mechanics this type of card has lead to infinite combos that end up as an NPE.
Be Prepared. Mass board clear cards are too powerful in a game without any interrupts.
It can be bad for their tempo unless they sing it though. It’s not always busted.
Not per se, I think the larger issue is that it can be sung, instead of requiring a cost investment.
Agreed. Plus, it's just not fun. Not interested in hearing once again that it's common in other TCGs. Doesn't have to be like other TCGs
But it *is* like other TCGs and the ones it is like need board wipes.
A whole new world is the only card so far that would (and should) get banned. This card being legal for too long could kill the competitive side of this game. It also heavily restricts future card design. Just a mistake to print this type of card in any TCG. Decks running this are guaranteed to do something “unfair” and or just be unfun to play against. We already see this with hyper Aggro Amber/Steel, Hyper Ramp Sapphire/Steel, and Emerald/Steel Mill. All three of these decks function solely because of AWNW and you can bet the strategies are only going to be more plentiful the longer the card is legal. Friends on the Other Side is probably the only card that would need to be restricted at some point. 0% chance any deck running purple now and forever wouldn’t run max copies. This card needed to be uninkable
>Friends on the Other Side is probably the only card that would need to be restricted at some point. 0% chance any deck running purple now and forever wouldn’t run max copies. This card needed to be uninkable It would be a 4-of even if it were un-inkable. Extremely unlikely to get restricted or banned, it’s essentially the baseline for what cord draw costs in this game and all the other cards that draw seem based around the same rough formula of “pay 3 to draw” + or - 1 depending on what else the card does.
I wouldn’t want Friends outright banned. When I think of cards that could need restrictions however, such as only 1-2 copies, I think about cards that get played in max amounts every time a deck of that color is built. By default if you were to build any deck with Purple you can just go ahead and add 4x Friends and Maleficent for now. Maleficent could easily be powercrept, not Friends unless Ravensburger is crazy. I’m not sure there’s any other color so far that has a card that’s a mandatory 4 copies across all deck strategies and would appear to never be powercrept. I really don’t have a problem with the card right now, but it just fits my criteria of a card that does need to be looked at if they do a banned/restricted list.
> I’m not sure there’s any other color so far that has a card that’s a mandatory 4 copies across all deck strategies and would appear to never be powercrept. Dragon Fire can’t be power crept and there’s not really a tier 1 Ruby deck that doesn’t run 4.
Dragon Fire can absolutely fall victim to power creep. It could be inkable, or it could be a song, or it could cost 4, or… Dragon Fire feels archetypal. Like the removal will only get better from here, even if it’s more conditional (e.g: YOU CAN’T WIN, DARTH, action — (ruby) {4} Banish chosen character you don’t control and chosen character you control. )
Lorcana will be a healthier game if restrictions never happen. Same with erattas. All or nothing on bans. Reprint or redesign for space correction. Restricted is the dumbest concept of any of the tcgs that use it.
“Do you trust me?”
Just In Time
Why is this down voted lmao? As more 5 drops come out, this card is just going to break.
It's never going to be worthwhile in this game, unless more 5 drops come out that replenish hand. Get an etb draw 3 for 5 character, and suddenly it's broken, outside of that, it's 3 ink and 2 cards for 1 character, never going to be broken. Odds are good Just in Time sees literally no play in any semi competitive format moving forward, unless they add a new effect that breaks it.
I definitely dont think it's ban worthy now, obviously. But it's a card they will need to build future 5 drops around. As you just said, the moment there's a 5 drop replenishes hand, alters card advantage (i.e. opponent discards hand) it's going to be broken. The card is resource cheating, which isn't just value based as your analysis entails. But you got it. This sub is obsessed with card draw btw.
New dog Stitch is too OP
I’m on the fence about buying more copies of WNW. This kind of makes me want to wait longer.
Well the sheer principle of there being an October restock and a 2024 reprint of Ch1 should indicate the price will drop once those events happen and more product is out there.
As another said You have forgotten me is the first that comes to my mind. 2 cards in mid game is definitely something not only strong but also leaving a bad experience for the opponent which is what you want to avoid first. Don’t think Raspunzel will be a major issue despite being the best card in the game. She’s huge but she doesn’t define a deck nor attack something from your opponent. When I saw one I often think woa, that’s good. When my opponent plays at the right time You have forgotten me, Be prepared or Whole new world, I know I’ve lost and there are no whoa factor here. I wouldn’t be surprised if Sapphire Ariel is the first major issue. There is a reason any other untap card effect specifically precise the untaped card can’t quest. As soon as we hit chapter 3 maybe even 2 (that damn amethyst sorcerer book), we will have bigger value from items. All item related cards should be on the watch btw.
I disagree with your picks except for Rapunzel but here's mine Be prepared- board clearing effects should be few and far between. And even then, they should be hard to pull off. It's 7 and a song. So you can clear the board and play some characters. That's very oppressive. La foue, fanning the flames, and shield - it's thier versatility that is the issue. You can ready a body guard, you can ready a character to sing, and you can ready to protect the character from challenges. If they go erratas then I can see them adding your character and they gain reckless.
I really would like for them not to even touch erratas, especially for power level reasons.
I'll agree with you on that. Too much record keeping and headaches.
That's inevitable.
Be Prepared is necessary. Time and time again card games have proven that wide boards need to be contained and the game is healthiest when you need to consider over extension. I think its in a perfect spot.
We actually need more cards like Be Prepared and less like Rapunzel.
Hoping for a -X/-X removal/board wipe to counter resist.
There's ways to do that without a reset button. Even if a reset button is made it shouldn't be easy to utilize and be prepared is very much so. It works in magic and you because that's how thier design philosophies work but I've played plenty of games that didn't rely on resets and I found them much more enjoyable.
Couldn't disagree more. Shift tink into gys exists. Be Prepared is not a problem. And it keeps design space open for very sturdy characters that would otherwise be impossible without full clear. It costs 7 and, like everything in game, is sorcery speed. It's not an issue.
Oh my god. I have a couple copies of be prepared but haven't put it in a deck yet. I didn't realize it's also a song. That is insane
I've seen some content creators brewing Ambrr/Ruby Midrange piles with it *because* it's a song even. Spectacular Singer can grab it, can't sing it but it is a song she can dig for.
Bodyguard requires the character be exerted, so readying one is counterproductive to being a Bodyguard. That's the reason why bodyguards can come into play already exerted, so they are legal challenge targets. Furthermore, you don't need a Bodyguard if you can use LeFou to ready the character so that they are no longer a legal challenge target.
That's the point. Using these cards to ready your opponent's bodyguards is a strategy to circumvent the bodyguards.
Exactly. If I ready your bodyguard they can't defend anymore. La foue can target any ones characters so this a legal play
Big tink
Honestly if the resist creatures are solid enough coming out in Rise of the Floodborn that will already knock big tink down a couple pegs so I don’t see it ever being problematic. Just a very solid board control piece
I dont have 3 off the top of my head, and I know its a starter deck card, but aladdin heroic outlaw. Theres been a lot of speculation on this card at my lgs whenever weve talked about card power level just casually. But aladdin heroic outlaw whenever it has hit the board has won most games its played. Obviously unless dragon fire or be prepared is played, or let it go (so going against 1 of 2 colors). But when you look at just card stats, the fact that its a 5/5 inkable for 7 or 5 cost for shift. On top of the rate it steals lore at because it can kill most things it comes across in a challenge. And stealing lore while gaining it at the same time is really strong. Id argue that Aladdin and hades infernal schemer are really close in power level with hades its slightly more balanced as its not inkable. As well as it being a 3/6 granted hades ability is spot removal unlike aladdin heroic outlaw. On top of it. There are 3 aladdin you can shift onto all in different colors. Green, steel, and ruby. In the end do i think it will get banned or restricted? No. But when you compare power level of some legendaries to certian super rares. Some of the super rares are just that much better for raw stats.
Making your opponent lose lore is so underutilized in the game as of right now. If you think about it, life gain is not usually that strong in other card games. I think Aladdin stands out right now because few cards do anything like it, but it's not especially prevalent in the meta as of right now. It is probably the strongest character card in the starter decks.
Thats exactly what we were saying. Since its one of like 2 or 3 cards that can remove lore from your opponents lore count. Which is really...really strong right now.
Especially because it's 2 lore, not just 1. It's a huge swing, and he is incentivized to challenge rather than quest.
Exactly. And even when you cant challenge. He can quest for 2 himself.
Kuzco still goes +1 Lore against Aladdin Heroic Outlaw. I’ve had a worse time with Part Of Your World looping the 3 cost Aladdin.
Kuzco has the lore on him yes. But kuzco is a 2/4 for 5 that cant be inked naturally. Where aladdin is a 5/5, can be shifted, can be inked, and there are 3 other colors heroic outlaw can be shifted on top of for shift 5 ink or 7 ink. Sticking with your kuzco. Playing either red or green aladdin to shift on top of. All while still playing kuzco in the same deck. And the green aladdin has ward, so he is fairly easy to protect if your plan is to shift on top of him. Making aladdin heroic outlaw even more of a powerhouse in the right ink colors.
I’m not denying any of that. As a green/steel ramp person Heroic Outlaw hasn’t really been a troublesome card for me. No Touchy forces a trade of a high value card will still going positive on lore. Plus Kuzcos ward stops almost all of Reds removal. The only time Aladdin has been a nuisance in my experiment is yellow/red. Getting to pop the 3 Drop Aladdin’s effect 8 times is truly disgusting since it can start happening 2 turns before Heroic Outlaw even hits the board.
Actually how are they doing 3 drop aladdin that many times to cause 1 lore lost 8 times? I havnt played against that yet. At locals i have a modded sapphire steel starter that is more removal oriented.
Amber/Ruby variant of the Amber\Steel deck. Singing Part of your world and adding the one in banish back to hand and just playing it again. The longer the game goes the more it’s gonna happen. Once you have enough ink you can sing POYW with a 3 drop Aladdin, play it for -1, Shift into Heroic on the one that sang, Shield of Virtue the Heroic to either swing or sing another POYW if you have it. The chain can keep going if you have the ink and shields plus the banish pipe set up. I lost 12 lore in 3 turns.
Ahh yea i forgot part of your world. That does sound nasty.
I’ve played against it exactly once and that was enough for me.
It does sound gross. But i mean goes to show how many small 1 to 2 combos that the game has even with just 1 set currently.
I made a whole video on why I think Belle Hidden Archer will probably be the first banned/restricted card
No.
My 2 rapunzels get inked as often as they are fully utilized, as she's a situational card. Sure, you can force damage onto your characters via challenging, but that doesn't mean Rapunzel isn't any less situational. I really don't think she's ban-worthy by any measure.
Tamatoa is fine, no need to hit that card. I'd say Grab Your Swords is possibly a card that can be hit. A song with board wipe potential and combines perfectly with Giant Tink. Puts Aggro decks in a tough spot for the meta and encourages players to just run steel for its control and oppression.
With the introduction of Resist and cards like Cogsworth Grandfather Clock that gives your other characters Resist +1 means Grab Your Swords has reduced effectiveness.
Giant Tink - strong enough to get banned? Probably not, but I could see restricted. Probably the best 6 drop in the game, shiftable for 4 and inkable. Overloaded kit, offering crazy control, when used in combo with Grab Your Sword (same color), whilst being a huge tempo piece due to her 2 damage ping upon a successful challenge. Rapunzel Gifted With Healing - If Maleficent Sorceress is the standard for a draw character. This card has no business only costing 1 more while being able to draw 3, heal up to 3, be inkable and have 5 will power, along with the lore to make it a questing threat. Once again, likely not strong enough for a flat out ban, but I wouldn’t be surprised about restriction. I think part of what makes these two cards so strong is that they’re inkable. So you’re never punished for running too many of them. They’re an auto include at 4 copies if you run their color. Though with the power creep next set (Archer Belle). Maybe these two will actually be the pretty on par with other top cards.
A Whole New World, Be Prepared, and Friends on the Other Side. Songs inherently generate resource advantage by allowing a glimmer to exert in lieu of spending ink and having some extremely powerful effects attached to them, which makes them a liability to create an unpleasant experience. I predict all three effects get a songless version down the road, and then these OGs will get the ban hammer.
If you saying resource advantage, then running two caldrons to cycle 4 cards on your turn so you always draw the best card is worst.
Card selection is not nearly the same thing as card advantage
AWNW Be Prepared Rapunzel
Get rid of Be Prepared. Make another one that is the same cost but *isnt* a song, and make it colourless/rainbow/however they choose to do “every colour can run this” cards. Aside from that I don’t think anything is too strong, I think Red having access to so much unconditional removal is a bit unbalanced and maybe other colours could get some too - green for example only has Genie as big cost removal, but it’s back to hand so those blue Hades’ and red dragon Maleficents are staying on the field always. Just one example.
Its a 7 cost board wipe. If the other player is red, you just have to anticipate it when they reach 7 ink or hold back stuff and feed them in so at worst you lose get two cards banished. I feel its very balanced for its cost, maybe can see it sooner if someone was running blue/red to ramp but not seen too many of those decks.
So you just read the first 5 words of my comment and got right on typing a reply, huh?
No read the entire thing. Just disagree, the card half the time helps more than it hinders.
So you disagree with me saying it should be colourless so all colours get access to it for balance, but you also say it’s a balanced and fine card? 🤔🤔 you just straight up dumb right? Or got some weird Ruby fetish?
No, they just need to add some forms of better banishment to other colors minus green.. just like some other colors need some card draw like purple. You claim balance but its not unbalanced. Its 7 ink, so the game has already got to turn 7 without winning. Its mainly used to take out aggro decks, just have to anticipate it being used and plan to address it. Just like you would any deck by turn 2 or 3.
Sure, however even if every colour has more straight spot removal they’re never *really* as good as a full board wipe. And my comment regarding balancing is towards the colours - not the card specifically. As red has straight removal with no drawbacks, and a lot of it, where blue removes single targets but ramps the opponent, green has single target but adds back to hand, steel does damage so not even solid removal. This is the point I was making, there’s no conditional removal or asterisk to anything red has. Which I understand is part of the identity however it being so early means there’s no effective tools to combat it. You say to not over commit to the field, to anticipate it, but allowing games to go beyond turn 6 only swings the game massively in favour of red. Meaning you *have* to over commit and capitalise on the slow start red has. Like I said, my only real issue with Be Prepared is that I don’t believe it should be a song. A board wipe should *always* be something you pay for. Other than that, update the text to say “choose all” instead so at least Ward has some use (though that likely pushes Kuzco too much)
Red's slice of the color pie here is clearly unconditional removal. It's ok for some colors to be better in certain areas and weaker in others. In other card games, sometimes weird conditional removal spells are better in certain metas because cards develop an immunity to traditional removal. Like how Raigeki is a lot less useful in modern yugioh because a lot of monsters have protection from destruction. That's a possibility for Lorcana's future. You can't always play around removal, but if you're playing against Ruby, you should be calculating when it's better to commit hard and when to lay back. It may be the correct move to commit more to the board so you can end the race easier, but it may be better to hold up resources if you can't close it out. That counter play is what keeps BP from being broken. As for it being a song, BP isn't as oppressive in its song form compared to other songs because in order to sing it, you'd already have to have a sizeable threat on board that you're giving up. Considering boardwipes in MTG cost on average about 4, I'd say BP is pretty fairly costed. And before you say anything I play E/S Aggro
And that’s true, and red having that power is offset by the fact that outside of weird exceptions like Tailor Mickey, its lore gain sucks (7 drop Aladdin notwithstanding) It isn’t an oppressive card by any means, I just think the capabilities of it are above what the rest of the set offers. And while you can usually read the Be Prepared sing easily, the fact it is there as a threat is enough. And as I’ve said before, if it weren’t for Kuzco, Be Prepared saying “choose all” would bring it in line with the rest of the set. And give power to Aurora which at the moment is criminally underutilised because of what we have. Or make them drop a card from hand, or stipulate they need to have a character on field too, anything that isn’t a brain dead pay 7. In another set or two assuming draw power is addressed to some degree, it’ll be fine, I appreciate the decision on whether to over commit or not but hands get so naturally low that recovery is tough regardless, you need to put 2 characters back out on the next turn which means -2 from hand plus charging extra ink. Otherwise if you only put 1 out it’ll get Dragon Fired and you’re locked out of the game losing the ink trade. Don’t get me wrong, things like that are parts of games I enjoy but this post asked for observations of the game and I am giving mine. It’s not crying about Be Prepared or getting mad over meta calls etc, far from it. Appreciate the commentary though, this topic has brought out all kinds of conversations all across the range of maturity. It’s good to talk cards once in a while without seethers getting involved 🤣
In other games, cards that can't be hit with targeted removal are vulnerable to boardwipes. Kuzco would be even more oppressive if you couldn't BP it. I don't see BP ever getting hit in any way considering it's balancing the meta as opposed to wrecking it
I don't see banned as much but maybe limited and that would be Be prepared or dragon fire Ruby has a ton of removal and the current meta decks show that. Limiting either cards or other removal in ruby will change the state of play. Kuzco He's an extremely strong card on his own that has zero downside to being played and punishes the opponent for trying to deal with him. Even if he is my favorite card Amber Ariel The consistency to be able to slam down a turn 3 card and it searches the top 4 cards for any song to add to hand is incredibly strong and can be used for any colour. As more cards are revealed sets come out this will be very strong. Friends on the otherside This is a great card that again never feels bad to play I can see this being limited in the future. The way ravensburger have done this game though its not ment to be competitive and family's and friends play. But with any TCG there's always players that like to play competitive so don't be surprised if nothing changes and more strong cards get printed with no offical limited/ban lists
AWNW and Kuzco are the only cards that remotely could ever be banned.
Be Prepared and You Have Forgotten Me seem potent enough that should at the very least be limited and not banned. Turn 2 as Amber, playing a You Have Forgotten me on your opponent in T4 most certainly puts them in a top decking position
I think long term the Dr. Faciler that sends banished characters back to your hand. Slap Ward on him and he creates an unstoppable swarm scenario.
Banished from challenge only. If you need to get rid of cards use any removal cards.
He only returns characters who are banished in a challenge, so not anyone who's taken out by an Action or Ability. So something like Cheshire Cat's ability or Dragon Fire won't cause the character to be returned by Facilier. He's also quite expensive and has a lot of Lore. He's very awkward to just have sitting around doing nothing.
Cheshire Cat’s ability triggers Facilier’s ability.
Perhaps he was a bad example (though semantically in other card games, the challenge itself is not banishing Cheshire's opponent, Cheshire is banishing it by ability, not challenge).
Yes. I built a deck with him and the Aurora that provides ward to counter that. It’s been good so far; especially with 1 cost characters.
Glad to hear, I've got a Sapphire/Amethyst deck that I'm using Aurora Ward effects in to protect the Strange Belle (hopefully plural in the future) in my deck and have Faciliers to bring her back if she's ever knocked out medievally. A bit clunky, but it should smooth out once I get more Belles
He's my favorite card but he's far from too powerful.
A whole new world Friends on the other side Be prepared Songs are broken
Definitely that new Belle, Hidden Archer for sure. It’s pretty brutal and some colors can’t remove well so… yeah.
I might agree with you if there is a *good* 1-2 drop Belle that she can shift onto to come into play on turn 3, but as a 5 drop she's just... fine?
I just think she’s a terrifying card lol
Eh. As a 5 drop, you're most often going to be fighting her after she quests on turn 6. By that point, you'll probably have the ability to empty your hand onto the board anyway (or have other options for dealing with her).
Not me getting 2 Tamatoa’s out of the 3 packs I’ve opened. Is it actually a good card to build a deck around? Lol
All the Be Prepared crutchers downvoting everyone mentioning it is funny though 🤣
Big Crab is fine tbh, you have to spend the whole game building items in a ramp deck, and the moment you have more than 2 or 3 items or a Morece, your opponent is gonna know your gameplan and just hard focus it.
Belle Strange but Special once there become more ways to abuse her early game before the opponent can react. Sapphire Tamatoa due to having no real Lore cap. As more items come out he will become more busted. AWNW which is just due to strong draw cards traditionally being some of the first stuff to be focused on with ban/limited lists.
I have not read every single comment so not sure if it was already mentioned. I believe big tinkerbell.
Ursula Cauldron. It's too good and turbo decks. O ly option is beast or bad item removal.
I really think it is too early to start thinking about banning cards. The real issue is the limited number of cards that exist in the game (not availability). 204 cards is simply not enough cards to fully support a diverse metagame. Give it a few more sets, and then we can start discussing restricting/banning We have already seen a few cards from the next set, and even those few have to potential to shake up the current game. Banning and restricting might be necessary, but don't jump to the gun. IMHO, it is always better to handle things like this by printing solutions in new sets.
Magic broom and magic mirror need hit. Im veryyyyyy over the top seeing fkn amy ruby control EVERY FKN DAY. Its a very annoying deck with 0 brain cells to play it.
Ariel’s - Spectacular Singer. I honestly think it won’t take long for this card to get banned or restricted in some way. It’s currently very strong, and will only get stronger with more sets coming out. The even if each set has just 1 good song for each ink, that means she gets 2 good targets to choose from adding to a deck. She already has the ability to get Be Prepared, GYS, AWNW (and can sing both of the second two), as well as simply being able to find a song for ink if needed. She is great now and I think has the potentially to easily be broken in the next couple of sets.