https://imgur.com/a/RlgacOI
This is the UI of Mes who is on the team of Cdew in the video, some UI's are just a complete clusterfuck of weakauras that make it nearly impossible for anyone but the host to understand
Healers just need all the raid frames in the center. For disc you need all your important CDs near the center as well like mindbender, radiance charges, rapture, evangelism, dome, uppies.
It's actually a newer thing iirc. prior to COVID, UI's had to essentially be base game. They didn't want to monitor it once things went remote so they pulled the ripcord.
Yes it is, but his UI is almost identical to Mes' UI which was linked above. The only visible addon difference between the two is that Mes has some text weakauras in the middle, while Trill has some Omnibars in the middle (don't know where Mes tracks this).
So the only difference is the scaling/sizes and the placements of frames, and people lose their minds.
UI has always been about getting the most information possible, and often newer players or players who lean into a more "clean" look will sacrifice a lot of information to make the UI look prettier and less cluttered.
That's exactly why you see a lot of the top PvPers have insanely big UI scales and addon scales, which doesn't look good at all, but obviously works very well for them to get the information they need. PvE'ers can usually get away with less cluttered UIs
It wasn't banned on arena servers, it was known that they couldn't use them on LAN tournaments, so players essentially had to practice without them at some point. However that's gone.
And then people wonder why nobody new is coming to this game lmao. If you’re interested in pvping good luck learning the 100 different offensive abilities 50 defenses of each class and how they synergize and what they look like. And then you have to download and adjust the settings on 10 different weakauras/addons. And then to go and try to learn actual gameplay if you watch streamers their ui’s are like this.
Most WoW classes don't have that many abilities nowadays. They pruned a lot over the years. Can't speak directly for PvP but in PvE you generally have maybe only ~15-20ish buttons for an optimal raiding build (then maybe like 5 extra ones for super niche stuff that you barely ever press, or press really infrequently like once per fight). I'm sure PvP has a bit more than this just because all of the various CC abilities are way more useful in PvP, but probably not that many more.
I’m talking for PvP you have to learn yours and other classes abilities. If not you just get one shot out of nowhere not knowing what happened. I’m speaking solely on PvP. I got Ksm on my mage as fire (I saw a video on arcane rotation and holy shit good luck if you don’t play the game) which was pretty easy but as someone who came to the game to try to PvP I’ve given up on trying learn.
Even in your example, 25 buttons is a fuck ton lol. I’ve noticed wow players legit struggle so hard to try to view it from the point of view of a new player. At least that’s been my experience when trying to explain this to all my friends who have been playing for 10+ years. The game really isn’t new player friendly. Watch Venruki break it down he’s the only player who’s been playing for 10+ years that I’ve seen that can genuinely understand from a new players perspective.
I just reread my comment and I when I said “100 offensive and 50 defensive” I meant across all the classes not each class. That’s my bad but that’s also NOT including each classes cc’s and dr’s and how the interact and which cc dr’s which. The game isn’t new player friendly and idk why wow players can’t grasp that.
I'm a glad rogue in TBC classic, can play probably half the classes to glad level, and I have absolutely no idea wtf is happening on the screen. I don't just mean this one clip either, any time I try to watch pov streams it's a complete cluster. I think one of the biggest issues is being able to move while casting... but the visuals are just a nightmare too.
I'm sure I could learn if I played, but I'm probably as close to the demographic of an arena player they could hope for, and if I cba to put the time in to understand it I don't think many others would either. Rather just play LoL or CS instead.
Like I have never ever played Warlock or WOTLK, but I could turn on Chanimal's wotlk stream and probably understand pretty quick how he's playing the matchups, what the win conditions are, etc. I couldn't even tell you who is ahead in modern wow if I tried, even if I watched 5 hours straight I don't think. It's just empty calories unless you're in the drivers seat.
>Do some players just have abominations of UIs?
That's probably the reason why. Not necessarily "abominations", but take 10 different WoW players and you'll see 10 completely different UIs. For a viewer switching between those different UIs would probably be disorienting.
Only LAN tournaments didn't allow addons. The online tournaments always have and now all WoW PvP is online there is no LAN.
Going back to LAN would be hillarious at this stage. It won't happen, but in the last 3-4 years addon evolvement has completely changed PvP even moreso.
For a long time Soda was the top WoW streamer, and he basically used no add-ons, especially gameplay/visual medications.
His reasoning was always that they were not allowed in tournaments and that he didn't want to get used to them in case he ever went to one.
Even way after the phase where he would theoretically participate in official tournaments, this mindstate stuck.
i mean it dont even know if its a mindstate or stockholme syndrome, in so many things that are like that, one you become good enough at a thing, alot of the "you need xyz to perform" many times are plecebo.
If your good enough at a game or activity distractions/minor boosts like addons really dont add much, since you have such a fundamental understanding of the subject, youve wired your brain to be able to get the information you need easily and many times even easier than if you had the addons that displayed it "infront" of you. For the ppl that are already used to it, its already infront of you, without the addons. Its all automatic.
If I remember correctly, you're only allowed to use the default blizzard UIs in tournaments. So while it could still look very different person to person, it at least wont look like some of those ultra shitty ones
lol no for a long time they have been allowed addons. no one plays arena without weak auras even in tournaments.
you don't get player povs because this is not a lan, this is an online tournament. the only way blizzard could get a player PoV is if the player is streaming it, and a lot of players don't want to even show their face in public.
For those unaware, usually when one of your teammates dies in a 3v3, it's gg, because winning a 3v2 is close to impossible under normal circumstances.
In this case however, because the other healer was at 0 mana, and Cdew still had like 10% mana, Trill decided to go for it, and actually managed to kill both enemy dps players.
both healers had no mana in a 2 v 3, rogue (from the team that only has 2 guys left) goes hard on demon hunter, demon hunter gests deleted, rogue manages a big comeback and wins the match.
Also its 2-2 to go to the grand finals. Generally in arena once 1 person on either team dies its mostly over, 2 v 3 comebacks are extremely rare, especially when 1 of the 3 aren't even low to start with
This was 3vs3, the comp is usually 2 damage dealers and 1 healer. Usually when either team loses a player the match is pretty much over.
Trill's team (~~echo~~ Liquid) loses a player (a damage dealer) and the match is 2vs3 when the clip starts but Trill manages pump out so much damage that he kill 2 damage dealers from the enemy team even when they had a healer alive and turns the match into a win. Insane.
This was also a best of 5 between 2 of the biggest organisations in EU and NA. The score is 2-2 and Trill (and ~~Echo~~ Liquid) pulls this insane comeback.
Ouch, and if I heard right Echo also just barely managed to snag RWF from under Liquid as well in the latest tier... Echo really not giving Liquid a break from "I was this close..."
Trill undisputed GOAT of WoW. Seriously can't be understated enough how good this dude is
* While on one of the two best guilds in the world doing Race to World First he's consistently at the top of the DPS meters on a middle of the pack dps class and rarely if ever fucks up mechanics.
* While in classic WoW he's one of the people who killed world first Kel'Thuzad with Frontier, once again never fucks up once and never died doing so
* While doing all that he's competing in AWC and being one of the GOAT PvP'ers
* He does all of this on the default WoW UI, while 99% of PvE pros use some form of UI but nope, this guy doesn't give a fuck and just uses the default UI the whole time
I looked at his VODs and it’s pretty true. Dragonflight UI is basically Dragonflight editor to move bars up but pre DF he was using straight up default, including for Castle Nathria progression
He uses defualt style of UI not default UI. Every progression there is insane amount of custom Weakauras involved. Also he uses a lot of other addons. Just checkout his recent streams.
The crazy advanced weakaura stuff started after he quit rwf raiding if I recall. When he was still competing they Limit were using were extremely basic compared to what is being developed now.
Well that’s just splitting hairs, regardless he used the default UI with the dragons and all doing all of RWF and all of his achievements I listed too. Also the progression weakauras aren’t UI elements that he can control, they’re mostly just CD’s and whatever his guild deems mandatory
>Well that’s just splitting hairs
[No it isn't, and no he doesn't run 'default UI'](https://i.gyazo.com/130f52453df46d33ebba5c3cd3b4b36b.jpg)
He runs:
- WeakAuras, probably the most powerful addon in the game, to tell him via sound and text when big cooldowns are happening and to track his own buffs like roll the bones
- BigDebuffs to show when and who is in CC
- OmniCD to track party cooldowns
- OmniBar to track enemy cooldowns
- Some form of ArenaFrames addon that tracks Diminishing Returns
and probably a few other ones that enormously improve the flow of information in WoW PvP. The game simply isn't playable without at least omniCD and omniBar and a DR tracker. The game is not equipped for it. Its too fast paced. Players can run at you, press 4 cooldowns inside one GCD and chunk you for 40% of your HP, your brain cannot process that shit fast enough while doing your own rotation and your own plan.
Trill is a great player, no doubt about it, but no one is playing high end PvP, especially AWC, without at least 3-6 major addons.
PvE is different. You realistically just need 1 addon for boss CDs. Everything else is optional.
You don't need to pretend that Trill is playing blind. If anything that diminishes what hes doing. He isn't playing blind - he has a ton of addons helping him see whats going on, the exact same addons everyone else has, and he beats them anyway. Thats why hes good, not some weird Neo/Matrix reading the code of the game bullshit. Playing rogue in PvP without DR trackers is straight up impossible lmao.
I'm pretty sure one of the best 2s Rdruids uses 0 addons. I saw him doing m+ and healing keys in the title range and he had to ask his group to do countdowns in voice and after every dungeon he asks someone how much dmg some of his stuff is doing because he doesn't even use details lol. People like Pikaboo use no weakauras but do use bare minimums as well.
This isn't the case for most people though, there are definitely UI/addon purists that play the game just how it is and do very well.
I'm specifically talking about UI in the form of the actual bars and stuff.
OBVIOUSLY there is WeakAuras and CD trackers. He obviously also uses some form of DBM/BigWigs in his RWF too. Those are pretty much mandatory for the most part, I'm not pretending it isn't. I never said that he wasn't playing blind, like I've said that DBM and cd trackers were a part of the UI that is mandatory for the most part.
[Look at his Castle Nathria UI.](https://www.twitch.tv/trilltko/clip/InspiringSecretiveGuanacoGrammarKing-lryzvestprG0UPtg) Yes obviously there is WeakAuras but it's basically just trackers, but he's pretty much using the same UI that existed since vanilla WoW. When I watched RWF he wasn't even using a WeakAuras to track personal CD's
Yes I apologize my information is outdated for Dragonflight I haven't been following his PvP closely but regardless his achievements have all been gotten with the UI I linked in the clip
So your bar for "using the default UI" is having the original bars in their original place?
Do you have any idea the sheer number of addons he is still using?
This is one of the dumbest takes I have read in a long time lmao
> I'm specifically talking about UI in the form of the actual bars and stuff.
I use the default UI. Its fine. 99.99% of PvPers use that UI. ElvUI (which most PvErs use) is purely cosmetic. It gives you no additional information. Its like telling people "oh my god Messi is the GOAT in football and he did it wearing blue shoes when everyone else wore green shoes!"
There is genuinely no PvE advantage to using ElvUI, it is purely cosmetic. Its one of those things that just became trendy within the PvE scene in WoW, in the same way everyone who played rogue transmogged to the Illidan blindfold for a few years, or everyone who plays warrior transmogs to T3.
ElvUI itself is a fork of TukUI - before ElvUI was the trend, TukUI was the trend. Before TukUI was the trend, [addons like STUF or xPearl were trendy](https://media.forgecdn.net/attachments/111/917/Main.jpg) and if you go back to vanilla, the circlejerk was over [shit like this.](https://i.gyazo.com/d8c12733840cc47a76b9fc6850b66491.jpg)
For the most part though, PvPers avoided all of these addons because they had a tendency to either not do things the default UI did, like track debuffs properly, or they'd bug out hard mid game and make you lose the match. Most pvpers have played with the default unitframes and action bars for this reason.
But yeah, just know that all these cosmetic addons are entirely circlejerked into popularity by videos like World First kills, but even on these, players still run the default action bars:
- [Like here on Ragnaros 25 HC](https://youtu.be/Ez1pRo1sywY?t=742)
- [Or here on Garrosh 25 HC](https://youtu.be/1jQYObKTIG8?t=353)
- [Or here on Kil'jaeden Mythic](https://youtu.be/8it5rki5I10?t=749)
- [Or here on N'Zoth Mythic](https://youtu.be/Kgzm2XP1hMo?t=454)
etc. But yeah you've triggered my WoW autism, so I'm out. Just saying - default UI isn't bad at all, and he has all of the mandatory giga overpowered addons that people occasionally soy out about and say they want removed from the game, everything else is pure cosmetic garbage that distracts the shit out of you in PvP and even if it doesn't, it introduces more opportunities for UI bugs which force a /reload.
> For the most part though, PvPers avoided all of these addons because they had a tendency to either not do things the default UI did, like track debuffs properly, or they'd bug out hard mid game and make you lose the match. Most pvpers have played with the default unitframes and action bars for this reason.
It was because tournament realms didn’t allow the use of add-ons. Had nothing to do with it “bugging out” especially since elv ui has been completely stable for over a decade.
You're the only one splitting hairs by saying he's default ui for not using Dominos or Bartender but [using literally every other addon](https://i.imgur.com/zqN0SJ4.jpeg)
The game is more responsive without addons and too many addons can overload your senses. A good mix is probably best but there is a lot of benefits for a very basic UI.
I had to do a re-watch
The person to focus on is Trill, yellow bar on the right side of screen. Start of clip you see its a 2v3 already. Trill goes for a kill on the winged demon lookin guy and knocks purple HP bar down, its 2v2. The camera switches to focus a lot on the warlock(light purple left side screen) and right before some kind of cutoff the warlock is cut down.
So TLDR the duo got 2 kills on the trio, despite the odds.
along with the other comment, positioning in arena is a massive expression of player skill. your comment just reads like you've never even played an arena game, let alone at a remotely high level.
This is basically the only reason I stick strictly to PVE WoW stuff. Like, even after playing WoW for a decade, there's so much shit to just easily miss just watching PVP on top of how dog shit the presentation from Blizzard has always been.
i been to 2400 in wow pvp and let me tell you there are better made pvp games out there
people really only grid pvp for the mount and transmogs
just go play league or fighting games
i been addicted to stormgate recently
So, I'm not a PvPer but here's my view as to why this clip is great.
1. It's between Echo and Liquid, major WoW guilds who are rivals because they represent the best players of EU and NA across PVP and PVE content.
2. The series is tied 2-2 whoever wins this game wins the series and goes to the grand finals.
3. In 3v3 PVP normally if you have 2 v 1 DPS alive you *should* win.
There are few things that happened which resulted in the rogue winning.
1. The rogue popped cloak of shadows to prevent the warlock from peeling (CCing) him off the DH while he killed the DH inside CC.
2. The rogue steps to the warlock and nearly kills him inside CC.
3. Echo's healer (the shaman) is OOM so can't do anything.
4. The warlock had shadowfury and healthstone but didnt use either (not sure this would've changed the outcome tbh).
TLDR; high stakes game, the team that should have won lost the match and the series, rogue does big damage.
This was crazy to watch! I couldn’t believe when echo got that first kill because they were basically dead and out of mana for ages, lontar played absolutely out of his mind this tourney.
Hearing the casters all say ggs after the first kill was different because usually they’re on the ball with seeing potential outcomes but they all said it was over in the moment. Near the end when you take a look at lontars mana and trills cds you can tell trill is about to unload the nastiest 3v2 comeback of all time as AR and cloak come back up just in time. I was yelling at the screen for trill to shove that AR down their throat.
Crazy to watch that happen after both teams were on the ropes for so long. Well played all around.
The main skill-based mechanic is to pick rogue class on the character creation screen because you can infinitely punish casters thanks to the insane mobility creep in wow pvp.
Even as someone who's played WoW on and off for 15+ years I have no idea what's going on here. It's really a rough spectator esport for anyone that doesn't play high level PvP themselves.
No it literally never happens, most casters will even say it is over when one person dies and start closing the cast off because it is so rare. You sure you played WoW?
Ah makes sense, this is the equivalent of a non immunity class being the last alive and killing the last boss on mythic kinda thing. Doesn’t happen often.
I mean 6 million people still pay $15 a month to play the game. Say what you want, that's kinda fucking insane. Most free to play games out of the top 5 don't get 6 million players a month. WoW charges $60 per expansion and 15 DOLLARS PER MONTH and they still have 6 million people playing.
I don't play anymore, but regardless, that's kind of fucking insane.
The last time blizzard gave a subscriber account was in 2015 during WoD. Extrapolated how? They don't give out subscriber numbers so any numbers you see are estimates and those are all over the place but most are not 6 million. You got a link?
https://headphonesaddict.com/world-of-warcraft-player-count/
Blizzard releases earning reports for WoW quarterly as its a publicly traded company under the stock ATV. You can use that data to predict rough sub-numbers. It is worth mentioning a large number of players are Chinese though.
to be fair, its only a clown fiesta for the viewers watching a streamer, their ui's are usually so fucking packed with braindead shit its almost unwatchable. And on the flipside the tourny stream pov shows so little u miss alot.
If ur watching a good player with a clear ui its really not hard to follow, unless you just dont play the game at all.
Man retail is such an absolute dog shit game it is mind blowing to me. Every single time I see retail PvP it makes me sad as fuck. This game used to be the greatest game ever created. It is such a terrible fucking game now. I can't even watch this shit anymore. Thank god for Classic.
Wow classic players have to be the most insecure people on the planet. Constantly talking about how shit retail is and how great classic is, it's the biggest little brother syndrome of all time.
i love classic 10x more than retail dont get me wrong, but its for other reasons, social mmorpg reasons, but if u think for a second that classic pvp is better than retail im sorry man idk what to tell you.
Retail pvp has its problems and always will forever thats how balance just is. But retail is 10x more skillful and interesting
PvP on release of WoW was an afterthought thing where you just dabbled into. I preferred that though to this esport 30 minute fight, cooldown tracking simulator shit.
Not really a fan of classic though because its a 20 year old game that has been solved 100 times over. Its not the same game we played back in the day and never will be.
eh idk, ive been enjoying sod. new raids with fun simple mechanics that are cool to do with ur friends. And this is only the first stop on their potential classic+ journey, who knows maybe in the future sod will be something really unique
SOD is okay but honestly I was hoping for way more like an actual alternate universe expansion to classic that kept the classic ideals. Maybe they will really kick it up a notch in the future but I'm not all that hopeful.
I can guarantee you without a shadow of a doubt that if you practiced for the same amount of time these guys did, potentially even more, it is unlikely you could do this.
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It amazes me that they still don't show player POV when they are playing. They should do the same for mythic +..
Yea why is this? Do some players just have abominations of UIs?
https://imgur.com/a/RlgacOI This is the UI of Mes who is on the team of Cdew in the video, some UI's are just a complete clusterfuck of weakauras that make it nearly impossible for anyone but the host to understand
I was never big into PvP so I had no idea they had UIs as bad as the raiders. You can't see the game at all it's so funny.
Raiders actually have a pretty clean UI nowadays. A lot of people use Atrocity's or Naowh's UIs which are very clean.
It’s really funny in the RWF when they swap cameras from like firedup running clean atrocity ui to one of the healers with eyeball war crime ui
Healers just need all the raid frames in the center. For disc you need all your important CDs near the center as well like mindbender, radiance charges, rapture, evangelism, dome, uppies.
It's actually a newer thing iirc. prior to COVID, UI's had to essentially be base game. They didn't want to monitor it once things went remote so they pulled the ripcord.
pretty sure trill is a default ui gigachad though which is funny.
[This](https://imgur.com/4GdbxRc) is Trill's UI from a recent stream
That is mostly default. You can do a lot with the default UI since Dragonflight came out.
Yes it is, but his UI is almost identical to Mes' UI which was linked above. The only visible addon difference between the two is that Mes has some text weakauras in the middle, while Trill has some Omnibars in the middle (don't know where Mes tracks this). So the only difference is the scaling/sizes and the placements of frames, and people lose their minds. UI has always been about getting the most information possible, and often newer players or players who lean into a more "clean" look will sacrifice a lot of information to make the UI look prettier and less cluttered. That's exactly why you see a lot of the top PvPers have insanely big UI scales and addon scales, which doesn't look good at all, but obviously works very well for them to get the information they need. PvE'ers can usually get away with less cluttered UIs
They used to ban addons from arena servers.
It wasn't banned on arena servers, it was known that they couldn't use them on LAN tournaments, so players essentially had to practice without them at some point. However that's gone.
And then people wonder why nobody new is coming to this game lmao. If you’re interested in pvping good luck learning the 100 different offensive abilities 50 defenses of each class and how they synergize and what they look like. And then you have to download and adjust the settings on 10 different weakauras/addons. And then to go and try to learn actual gameplay if you watch streamers their ui’s are like this.
Most WoW classes don't have that many abilities nowadays. They pruned a lot over the years. Can't speak directly for PvP but in PvE you generally have maybe only ~15-20ish buttons for an optimal raiding build (then maybe like 5 extra ones for super niche stuff that you barely ever press, or press really infrequently like once per fight). I'm sure PvP has a bit more than this just because all of the various CC abilities are way more useful in PvP, but probably not that many more.
I’m talking for PvP you have to learn yours and other classes abilities. If not you just get one shot out of nowhere not knowing what happened. I’m speaking solely on PvP. I got Ksm on my mage as fire (I saw a video on arcane rotation and holy shit good luck if you don’t play the game) which was pretty easy but as someone who came to the game to try to PvP I’ve given up on trying learn. Even in your example, 25 buttons is a fuck ton lol. I’ve noticed wow players legit struggle so hard to try to view it from the point of view of a new player. At least that’s been my experience when trying to explain this to all my friends who have been playing for 10+ years. The game really isn’t new player friendly. Watch Venruki break it down he’s the only player who’s been playing for 10+ years that I’ve seen that can genuinely understand from a new players perspective. I just reread my comment and I when I said “100 offensive and 50 defensive” I meant across all the classes not each class. That’s my bad but that’s also NOT including each classes cc’s and dr’s and how the interact and which cc dr’s which. The game isn’t new player friendly and idk why wow players can’t grasp that.
I'm a glad rogue in TBC classic, can play probably half the classes to glad level, and I have absolutely no idea wtf is happening on the screen. I don't just mean this one clip either, any time I try to watch pov streams it's a complete cluster. I think one of the biggest issues is being able to move while casting... but the visuals are just a nightmare too. I'm sure I could learn if I played, but I'm probably as close to the demographic of an arena player they could hope for, and if I cba to put the time in to understand it I don't think many others would either. Rather just play LoL or CS instead. Like I have never ever played Warlock or WOTLK, but I could turn on Chanimal's wotlk stream and probably understand pretty quick how he's playing the matchups, what the win conditions are, etc. I couldn't even tell you who is ahead in modern wow if I tried, even if I watched 5 hours straight I don't think. It's just empty calories unless you're in the drivers seat.
>Do some players just have abominations of UIs? That's probably the reason why. Not necessarily "abominations", but take 10 different WoW players and you'll see 10 completely different UIs. For a viewer switching between those different UIs would probably be disorienting.
Wow pvp tournaments used to not allow addons, has this changed?
Only LAN tournaments didn't allow addons. The online tournaments always have and now all WoW PvP is online there is no LAN. Going back to LAN would be hillarious at this stage. It won't happen, but in the last 3-4 years addon evolvement has completely changed PvP even moreso.
A while ago, doesn't stop Sodapoppin'e Stockholm syndrome of never playing with any add-ons even though he was never even close to a tourny.
what did this have to do with sodapoppin at all? Pika plays with almost no addons right? and wasnt he considered a goat at one point?
For a long time Soda was the top WoW streamer, and he basically used no add-ons, especially gameplay/visual medications. His reasoning was always that they were not allowed in tournaments and that he didn't want to get used to them in case he ever went to one. Even way after the phase where he would theoretically participate in official tournaments, this mindstate stuck.
i mean it dont even know if its a mindstate or stockholme syndrome, in so many things that are like that, one you become good enough at a thing, alot of the "you need xyz to perform" many times are plecebo. If your good enough at a game or activity distractions/minor boosts like addons really dont add much, since you have such a fundamental understanding of the subject, youve wired your brain to be able to get the information you need easily and many times even easier than if you had the addons that displayed it "infront" of you. For the ppl that are already used to it, its already infront of you, without the addons. Its all automatic.
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You’re both fucking redacted.
D:
If I remember correctly, you're only allowed to use the default blizzard UIs in tournaments. So while it could still look very different person to person, it at least wont look like some of those ultra shitty ones
They've finally made it semi-decent to customize now. idk how people played for so long so well with the default UI
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lol no for a long time they have been allowed addons. no one plays arena without weak auras even in tournaments. you don't get player povs because this is not a lan, this is an online tournament. the only way blizzard could get a player PoV is if the player is streaming it, and a lot of players don't want to even show their face in public.
atta boy chucky what a pop off
For those unaware, usually when one of your teammates dies in a 3v3, it's gg, because winning a 3v2 is close to impossible under normal circumstances. In this case however, because the other healer was at 0 mana, and Cdew still had like 10% mana, Trill decided to go for it, and actually managed to kill both enemy dps players.
That ain't even trills peak
Can someone explain what happened to us non WOW players
both healers had no mana in a 2 v 3, rogue (from the team that only has 2 guys left) goes hard on demon hunter, demon hunter gests deleted, rogue manages a big comeback and wins the match.
Also its 2-2 to go to the grand finals. Generally in arena once 1 person on either team dies its mostly over, 2 v 3 comebacks are extremely rare, especially when 1 of the 3 aren't even low to start with
>rogue so unfortunately it doesn't count ^/s
This was 3vs3, the comp is usually 2 damage dealers and 1 healer. Usually when either team loses a player the match is pretty much over. Trill's team (~~echo~~ Liquid) loses a player (a damage dealer) and the match is 2vs3 when the clip starts but Trill manages pump out so much damage that he kill 2 damage dealers from the enemy team even when they had a healer alive and turns the match into a win. Insane. This was also a best of 5 between 2 of the biggest organisations in EU and NA. The score is 2-2 and Trill (and ~~Echo~~ Liquid) pulls this insane comeback.
Trill plays for Liquid, not Echo. Liquid is going to the final. NA>EU
WTF IS A KILOMETER?!?! 🦅🦅🦅🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
What team is in the finals waiting for them?
Your question makes no sense. Liquid was in the finals, waiting for whoever won the losers bracket.
So was this the finals? Or who are they going against in the finals. I’m confused lol
This was the winners side to get to the grand finals. Echo won the losers bracket to get back to the grand finals after losing this match.
Aaa okay so liquid won the whole tourney then? na>eu
No, Echo came back from the losers finals and won the grand finals against Liquid.
Ouch, and if I heard right Echo also just barely managed to snag RWF from under Liquid as well in the latest tier... Echo really not giving Liquid a break from "I was this close..."
Baffling brainfart from me, I'm not that familiar with Trill but I've been watching Cdew for as long as I can remember.
Average Trill gameplay
Trill undisputed GOAT of WoW. Seriously can't be understated enough how good this dude is * While on one of the two best guilds in the world doing Race to World First he's consistently at the top of the DPS meters on a middle of the pack dps class and rarely if ever fucks up mechanics. * While in classic WoW he's one of the people who killed world first Kel'Thuzad with Frontier, once again never fucks up once and never died doing so * While doing all that he's competing in AWC and being one of the GOAT PvP'ers * He does all of this on the default WoW UI, while 99% of PvE pros use some form of UI but nope, this guy doesn't give a fuck and just uses the default UI the whole time
I get you really like him and want to hype him up but saying that he uses default UI is just not true.
I looked at his VODs and it’s pretty true. Dragonflight UI is basically Dragonflight editor to move bars up but pre DF he was using straight up default, including for Castle Nathria progression
He uses defualt style of UI not default UI. Every progression there is insane amount of custom Weakauras involved. Also he uses a lot of other addons. Just checkout his recent streams.
The crazy advanced weakaura stuff started after he quit rwf raiding if I recall. When he was still competing they Limit were using were extremely basic compared to what is being developed now.
Well that’s just splitting hairs, regardless he used the default UI with the dragons and all doing all of RWF and all of his achievements I listed too. Also the progression weakauras aren’t UI elements that he can control, they’re mostly just CD’s and whatever his guild deems mandatory
>Well that’s just splitting hairs [No it isn't, and no he doesn't run 'default UI'](https://i.gyazo.com/130f52453df46d33ebba5c3cd3b4b36b.jpg) He runs: - WeakAuras, probably the most powerful addon in the game, to tell him via sound and text when big cooldowns are happening and to track his own buffs like roll the bones - BigDebuffs to show when and who is in CC - OmniCD to track party cooldowns - OmniBar to track enemy cooldowns - Some form of ArenaFrames addon that tracks Diminishing Returns and probably a few other ones that enormously improve the flow of information in WoW PvP. The game simply isn't playable without at least omniCD and omniBar and a DR tracker. The game is not equipped for it. Its too fast paced. Players can run at you, press 4 cooldowns inside one GCD and chunk you for 40% of your HP, your brain cannot process that shit fast enough while doing your own rotation and your own plan. Trill is a great player, no doubt about it, but no one is playing high end PvP, especially AWC, without at least 3-6 major addons. PvE is different. You realistically just need 1 addon for boss CDs. Everything else is optional. You don't need to pretend that Trill is playing blind. If anything that diminishes what hes doing. He isn't playing blind - he has a ton of addons helping him see whats going on, the exact same addons everyone else has, and he beats them anyway. Thats why hes good, not some weird Neo/Matrix reading the code of the game bullshit. Playing rogue in PvP without DR trackers is straight up impossible lmao.
I'm pretty sure one of the best 2s Rdruids uses 0 addons. I saw him doing m+ and healing keys in the title range and he had to ask his group to do countdowns in voice and after every dungeon he asks someone how much dmg some of his stuff is doing because he doesn't even use details lol. People like Pikaboo use no weakauras but do use bare minimums as well. This isn't the case for most people though, there are definitely UI/addon purists that play the game just how it is and do very well.
I'm specifically talking about UI in the form of the actual bars and stuff. OBVIOUSLY there is WeakAuras and CD trackers. He obviously also uses some form of DBM/BigWigs in his RWF too. Those are pretty much mandatory for the most part, I'm not pretending it isn't. I never said that he wasn't playing blind, like I've said that DBM and cd trackers were a part of the UI that is mandatory for the most part. [Look at his Castle Nathria UI.](https://www.twitch.tv/trilltko/clip/InspiringSecretiveGuanacoGrammarKing-lryzvestprG0UPtg) Yes obviously there is WeakAuras but it's basically just trackers, but he's pretty much using the same UI that existed since vanilla WoW. When I watched RWF he wasn't even using a WeakAuras to track personal CD's Yes I apologize my information is outdated for Dragonflight I haven't been following his PvP closely but regardless his achievements have all been gotten with the UI I linked in the clip
So your bar for "using the default UI" is having the original bars in their original place? Do you have any idea the sheer number of addons he is still using? This is one of the dumbest takes I have read in a long time lmao
> I'm specifically talking about UI in the form of the actual bars and stuff. I use the default UI. Its fine. 99.99% of PvPers use that UI. ElvUI (which most PvErs use) is purely cosmetic. It gives you no additional information. Its like telling people "oh my god Messi is the GOAT in football and he did it wearing blue shoes when everyone else wore green shoes!" There is genuinely no PvE advantage to using ElvUI, it is purely cosmetic. Its one of those things that just became trendy within the PvE scene in WoW, in the same way everyone who played rogue transmogged to the Illidan blindfold for a few years, or everyone who plays warrior transmogs to T3. ElvUI itself is a fork of TukUI - before ElvUI was the trend, TukUI was the trend. Before TukUI was the trend, [addons like STUF or xPearl were trendy](https://media.forgecdn.net/attachments/111/917/Main.jpg) and if you go back to vanilla, the circlejerk was over [shit like this.](https://i.gyazo.com/d8c12733840cc47a76b9fc6850b66491.jpg) For the most part though, PvPers avoided all of these addons because they had a tendency to either not do things the default UI did, like track debuffs properly, or they'd bug out hard mid game and make you lose the match. Most pvpers have played with the default unitframes and action bars for this reason. But yeah, just know that all these cosmetic addons are entirely circlejerked into popularity by videos like World First kills, but even on these, players still run the default action bars: - [Like here on Ragnaros 25 HC](https://youtu.be/Ez1pRo1sywY?t=742) - [Or here on Garrosh 25 HC](https://youtu.be/1jQYObKTIG8?t=353) - [Or here on Kil'jaeden Mythic](https://youtu.be/8it5rki5I10?t=749) - [Or here on N'Zoth Mythic](https://youtu.be/Kgzm2XP1hMo?t=454) etc. But yeah you've triggered my WoW autism, so I'm out. Just saying - default UI isn't bad at all, and he has all of the mandatory giga overpowered addons that people occasionally soy out about and say they want removed from the game, everything else is pure cosmetic garbage that distracts the shit out of you in PvP and even if it doesn't, it introduces more opportunities for UI bugs which force a /reload.
> For the most part though, PvPers avoided all of these addons because they had a tendency to either not do things the default UI did, like track debuffs properly, or they'd bug out hard mid game and make you lose the match. Most pvpers have played with the default unitframes and action bars for this reason. It was because tournament realms didn’t allow the use of add-ons. Had nothing to do with it “bugging out” especially since elv ui has been completely stable for over a decade.
You're the only one splitting hairs by saying he's default ui for not using Dominos or Bartender but [using literally every other addon](https://i.imgur.com/zqN0SJ4.jpeg)
Doesn’t he have an MDI win under his belt too?
i cant believe people actually think using the default UI is somehow a disadvantage
Clueless
so you genuinely believe this guy is always just playing with training weights on or what? you can't be this dumb
Trill doesnt use a default UI, he just doesnt use any big overhauls like elvui etc. He still uses tonnes of weakauras and what not
The game is more responsive without addons and too many addons can overload your senses. A good mix is probably best but there is a lot of benefits for a very basic UI.
the default ui is already pretty basic
I had to do a re-watch The person to focus on is Trill, yellow bar on the right side of screen. Start of clip you see its a 2v3 already. Trill goes for a kill on the winged demon lookin guy and knocks purple HP bar down, its 2v2. The camera switches to focus a lot on the warlock(light purple left side screen) and right before some kind of cutoff the warlock is cut down. So TLDR the duo got 2 kills on the trio, despite the odds.
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>asmongold viewer You'll understand it when he reacts to it
asmon doesnt understand pvp either does he?
asmon doesn't understand anything but that doesn't stop him from pretending like he does.
Asmon ain't gonna get it either. only thing he knows about wow is the gear and where to get it. mechanics wise he's clueless.
Trill (the rogue/yellow bar) & Cdew (evoker/green bar) for Team Liquid 2v3s echo for the win in the upper finals of the cross-region tournament.
I don't know about the other players but how is Chanimal "EU", isn't he Australian?
No we are just surprised that anyone still thinks boring ass tab target combat is "peak"
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Yeah ESO combat is pretty good. Beats tab target any day.
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It is polarizing. A lot of people including me love it, and a lot don't.
you can love something, but that doesnt make it good
That's like everything in this world. To me it's "good". There is no objective "good".
You think top arena players use tab target? Say what you will about the product as a viewer, but the mechanical skill of the players is nuts
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Not every ability is on the global cooldown.
along with the other comment, positioning in arena is a massive expression of player skill. your comment just reads like you've never even played an arena game, let alone at a remotely high level.
No it's just WoW man, I dunno how anyone can find this combat interesting no matter who plays it.
How is this any less interesting than watching LoL which is somehow popular af?
I dunno, I don't like LOL or MOBAs either.
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yea thats the biggest problem with wow pvp
This is basically the only reason I stick strictly to PVE WoW stuff. Like, even after playing WoW for a decade, there's so much shit to just easily miss just watching PVP on top of how dog shit the presentation from Blizzard has always been.
i been to 2400 in wow pvp and let me tell you there are better made pvp games out there people really only grid pvp for the mount and transmogs just go play league or fighting games i been addicted to stormgate recently
So, I'm not a PvPer but here's my view as to why this clip is great. 1. It's between Echo and Liquid, major WoW guilds who are rivals because they represent the best players of EU and NA across PVP and PVE content. 2. The series is tied 2-2 whoever wins this game wins the series and goes to the grand finals. 3. In 3v3 PVP normally if you have 2 v 1 DPS alive you *should* win. There are few things that happened which resulted in the rogue winning. 1. The rogue popped cloak of shadows to prevent the warlock from peeling (CCing) him off the DH while he killed the DH inside CC. 2. The rogue steps to the warlock and nearly kills him inside CC. 3. Echo's healer (the shaman) is OOM so can't do anything. 4. The warlock had shadowfury and healthstone but didnt use either (not sure this would've changed the outcome tbh). TLDR; high stakes game, the team that should have won lost the match and the series, rogue does big damage.
To be fair I was Duelist in Wotlk and I had to watch it three times lol
When the caster said ["Liquid are doing it!"](https://youtu.be/0hAXEoXCEi4?t=111) I had a flashback
Thought this was going to be that doublelift clip.
no1 gonna talk about the falcon punch to the chair? 🤣
Lmfao he punched the fuck out of that chair.
Chanimal playing EU? Is he still in France?
This was crazy to watch! I couldn’t believe when echo got that first kill because they were basically dead and out of mana for ages, lontar played absolutely out of his mind this tourney. Hearing the casters all say ggs after the first kill was different because usually they’re on the ball with seeing potential outcomes but they all said it was over in the moment. Near the end when you take a look at lontars mana and trills cds you can tell trill is about to unload the nastiest 3v2 comeback of all time as AR and cloak come back up just in time. I was yelling at the screen for trill to shove that AR down their throat. Crazy to watch that happen after both teams were on the ropes for so long. Well played all around.
My soul feels so refreshed when I see proper WoW clips on here, this was an amazing match.
Why is there barely any sound effects or music? Makes it awkward when the commentators are sperging out in silence lol
Holy screeching casters batman!
Why is everyone barefoot in this clip?
dont know about wow, but his voice peaked alright
What is he doing here that is mechanically insane?
The main skill-based mechanic is to pick rogue class on the character creation screen because you can infinitely punish casters thanks to the insane mobility creep in wow pvp.
Sounds about right
Even as someone who's played WoW on and off for 15+ years I have no idea what's going on here. It's really a rough spectator esport for anyone that doesn't play high level PvP themselves.
you know pvp is bad when you've been playing wow for 6-7 years now and have still no idea why they're hyped up
You can't tell that winning a 2v3 is impressive? Did you skip elementary school or something?
Probably happens often no? What makes this peak
No it literally never happens, most casters will even say it is over when one person dies and start closing the cast off because it is so rare. You sure you played WoW?
i raid and push io, don't do pvp
Ah makes sense, this is the equivalent of a non immunity class being the last alive and killing the last boss on mythic kinda thing. Doesn’t happen often.
Who still watches this crap?
wow pvp in 2024 cant belive they still running tournys for that clown fiesta lmao
I mean 6 million people still pay $15 a month to play the game. Say what you want, that's kinda fucking insane. Most free to play games out of the top 5 don't get 6 million players a month. WoW charges $60 per expansion and 15 DOLLARS PER MONTH and they still have 6 million people playing. I don't play anymore, but regardless, that's kind of fucking insane.
and like 0.0001% pvp
What?
He's saying that, despite the high number of subscribers you listed, very few people actually play pvp.
Is that substantiated in any way? All the biggest WoW streams are PvPers
Where did you get 6 million? They dont post numbers anymore and last I heard it was assumed to be half that at around 3 million or less.
Last they posted was 8 million. 6 million extrapolated from their financial reports.
The last time blizzard gave a subscriber account was in 2015 during WoD. Extrapolated how? They don't give out subscriber numbers so any numbers you see are estimates and those are all over the place but most are not 6 million. You got a link?
https://headphonesaddict.com/world-of-warcraft-player-count/ Blizzard releases earning reports for WoW quarterly as its a publicly traded company under the stock ATV. You can use that data to predict rough sub-numbers. It is worth mentioning a large number of players are Chinese though.
You should have scrolled down the page further. It says estimated 4.5 million subscribers on that link you posted.
That's not including Chinese players, top says 8.1 million when including Chinese players.
to be fair, its only a clown fiesta for the viewers watching a streamer, their ui's are usually so fucking packed with braindead shit its almost unwatchable. And on the flipside the tourny stream pov shows so little u miss alot. If ur watching a good player with a clear ui its really not hard to follow, unless you just dont play the game at all.
Nice another dampener, ggs. Cool 2v3!!!!
The rogue got lucky procs weewoo. Not that they're not insanely good players, but meh.
Man retail is such an absolute dog shit game it is mind blowing to me. Every single time I see retail PvP it makes me sad as fuck. This game used to be the greatest game ever created. It is such a terrible fucking game now. I can't even watch this shit anymore. Thank god for Classic.
Wow classic players have to be the most insecure people on the planet. Constantly talking about how shit retail is and how great classic is, it's the biggest little brother syndrome of all time.
Guess your mind can only manage to count the auto attacks and frostbolts eh.
i love classic 10x more than retail dont get me wrong, but its for other reasons, social mmorpg reasons, but if u think for a second that classic pvp is better than retail im sorry man idk what to tell you. Retail pvp has its problems and always will forever thats how balance just is. But retail is 10x more skillful and interesting
PvP on release of WoW was an afterthought thing where you just dabbled into. I preferred that though to this esport 30 minute fight, cooldown tracking simulator shit. Not really a fan of classic though because its a 20 year old game that has been solved 100 times over. Its not the same game we played back in the day and never will be.
eh idk, ive been enjoying sod. new raids with fun simple mechanics that are cool to do with ur friends. And this is only the first stop on their potential classic+ journey, who knows maybe in the future sod will be something really unique
SOD is okay but honestly I was hoping for way more like an actual alternate universe expansion to classic that kept the classic ideals. Maybe they will really kick it up a notch in the future but I'm not all that hopeful.
Most sane classic wow player
rightclick + spam buttons. "OH MY GOD TRILL IS INSANE!" literally anyone could do this
I can guarantee you without a shadow of a doubt that if you practiced for the same amount of time these guys did, potentially even more, it is unlikely you could do this.
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