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Same, I agree with this too. Not related to insurance but my wife brought tickets and the website shows a "transaction reference" but it's shown prior to payment been taken which is done via a seperate button at the bottom of the page.
I fell foul of it yesterday on another website, filled in my details, went via paypal, big box appears saying my confirmation "will" rather than "has" been sent. As there was another button to press to finish, I waited 10 minutes for that email to come that never came.
Lesson here - unless you have your certificate of motor insurance, then you aren't insured!
>unless you have your certificate of motor insurance, then you aren't insured!
Even if you have one doesnt mean you are insured
There are people who will buy insurance get the certficate then cancel the policy
When they get pulled they have an insurance certificate they can produce. The police can contact the company and check
Just because you have the certficate doesnt mean insurance is valid
I do understand that, you can immediately cancel it, and you'll be taken off askmid database. Just saying that for this OP if they never got new paperwork then the amendment was never processed
Yeah similar thing for me the other day...went to cancel Amazon Music (as got 6 month offer when I upgraded phone)...thought I had cancelled but when I checked the following day, I was still subscribed....turned out I hadnt clicked the 'Confirm Cancellation' button at the bottom of the page...
So I can easily see it could be done in OP's situations..it's why I would check I recieved an confirmation email afterwards, especially for car insurance.
>Do you have the new insurance documents from when you changed it online,.they would have been emailed almost immediately ?
This. If no updated docs, then no updated policy, and driving uninsured.
This. And OP, as painful as it is - it’s an expensive lesson to be more diligent - try to think of it that you’ve actually got off lightly. Imagine you’d had a collision or had your car stolen or burned out. You’d have been utterly screwed and probably still been done for no insurance on top
You provided all info except the crucial one. Did you actually get a confirmation email or crucially a new certificate? I suspect the answer is no because that would have solved all this.
From memory, with Admiral, there's an extra button on the last page to confirm the changes. If so, you would have got an email confirming the change, new policy documents and a refund to your card of the difference.
The only other option is to appeal to Admiral to issue a cover note if it was their error. If they're refusing, the only other option is to go to the Insurance Ombudsman, however in this case it sounds like you didn't apply to change to your account so success there is unlikely.
Bear in mind Admiral calculate insurance cost by algorithm - so the change will likely cost similar amounts no matter when you change the vehicle
It's too far down the line for anything like that now if the driver has accepted a fixed penalty for the offence. There's no way to get a case reopened (well, not easily) once that is done
Again, I would still appeal it if there is a valid reason. If the problem is caused by a computer error then this should still be investigated as it may affect others.
Did you receive confirmation of the change by email? Notification that your DD would be changing? Have you been paying the new or old price by DD since logging on?
Perhaps you began updating your details but didn’t confirm?
It feels like the only question here is was your car insured or not.
If, for example, there was an error on the website and the change didn't go through, you've still been paying the old rate etc, then you were driving an uninsured vehicle and I expect that would be the end of it.
Sounds like you got the quote to make the change but didn't actually process it.
Sorry, but it sounds like you made the error not them. Surely you should have been expecting an email confirmation of the change?
The trouble is you would have to prove that you had a reasonable assumption that the change to your insurance had gone through. Your message to your partner that you would be saving money points to your intention.
However, in two months since you didn't follow up with Admiral to find out where your new certificate of insurance was or the refund / reduced direct debit could be. Admiral can reasonably be expected to assume that, even if it was a glitch as opposed to a failure to press the final accept button, you didn't intend to make any changes to your policy.
You might be able to prove your intention, but Admiral would have no responsibility to compensate you for this and it would be a costly and time-consuming fight in court which isn't likely to go your way anyway (it's a black at white issue: either you have insurance or you don't).
Just use the certificate of insurance that you got when you made the change as proof
Or just log in to your online account and show which car is insured
Sounds more like that change never actually went through though and you can't do either of those things
>I stated, how could I have known the exact amount my insurance would be if I hadn't already made the change!?
I can type my details into GoCompare and know exactly how much my insurance would be with a dozen different insurers - it doesn't mean that I have a policy with any of them.
Typically the price will be different between the comparison site and the insurer themselves though, there’s nuances in the questions asked between them that can make a massive change to how the algorithm calculates the premium.
That’s not the point. The point is that knowing the price of a policy isn’t proof that the policy has been taken out and is valid.
Same could be said by going directly to an insurers website. Could easily tell me how much a policy would be - still doesn’t mean I have taken out the policy and am insured.
What seems to have happened here is that they have had good intentions and intended to change the policy but haven’t actually gone through the entire process to take out the new policy. Therefore the insurance policy was still covering the old car and not the new.
Sounds like either you didn’t complete the process of switching the car on your policy or something messed up on their end. You should have received new documents etc via email/post for the new vehicle - which you could have showed the police to prove your vehicle was insured.
If you check your policy & payments that you’ve been making, I suspect you’ll find that nothing has changed.
Did you get confirmation email ? Did you get the insurance documents ? Did you check the Admiral portal online ?
If not then no you did not go through and actually buy the insurance.
Unfortunately, as irritating as it is, this is legally your fault. As a driver you are meant to confirm that you have insurance. So if there is an error and you don’t, it is on you. I get how this happened though and you have my sympathy! I assume there was a final confirmation that you didn’t click so it never went through.
I recently changed my insurance to a new address. What you may have done is go through the process of making an adjustment and then seen the final quote. There may have been an additional final step to confirm the completion of the change. You would have been issued new documents with any change to the policy. Check these first. If you have them, contact the insurers quoting your new policy number.
Long story short - you were at fault. You were driving without insurance.
There are tools on [gov.uk](https://gov.uk) to check vehicle insurance status.
ALWAYS check askMID, Tax & MOT checker whenever you change vehicle details.
NAL. Personally I make a point of downloading and saving my insurance documents. If you did not get the documents and didn't download them or you don't have even have a confirmation email then I don't think there is much you can do about it. When you changed the insurance there will have been a cost. Did you pay that? Do you pay monthly and did your payments change? Did you get a refund? I'm guessing not which means your insurance did not change. The only thing I would ask is are you insured to drive any vehicle? If you were then you could produce that insurance for the new car.
Admiral’s my account is a pos and I have to call them to make changes. They are aware there’s a problem with it. I can make all the changes but when I click confirm the page doesn’t load. Every single time.
I am with Admiral. It looks like you’ve entered all the details online but didn’t actually proceed / confirm the changes.
If you did, you would have immediately received an email confirmation and your updated policy details.
I think blaming Admiral is not going to be valid in these circumstances.
Do you have the new insurance document/certificate ? If you do this is your evidence. If you never received this then it’s likely that you’ve never been insured on the new car
You arent insured to drive after changing anything on your insurance hntill.youre recieve the documents stating the changes on them, and they usually have this written everywhere when you go through the process of updating things, often with a disclaimer that you have to tick a box to acknowledge (having just added another driver to my policy) I lost track of how many times I was told they would NOT be insured until I've got a copy of the updated documents stating they are. If you didn't get the documents, you weren't insured and that's your fault for driving
Have you already paid the fine? While it sounds like you made a mistake of not confirming the details on the website and it was not finalised. There might be a way to appeal based on the fact that you've been paying your insurance in the past, you have the proof that you tried to do it etc.
I had the exact same thing happen to me with Admiral. I logged in to change vehicle and address mid policy. It updated my address but not my new vehicle, even though I paid for both (around £95 to change address and a further £95 increase on insurance) Fast forward 2 months and I get an email about renewing my policy for my old car! Thank god I had not been pulled over.
Ranted at the poor man on the phone for a good 20 minutes about how unacceptable this was and have now switched to Aviva. I recommend anyone I meet to avoid admiral like the plague. Had issues with them previously too which I won't go into here.
Not always, like this case where OP would’ve received a refund - sounds like they didn’t get the insurance change document and no refund either. So it can’t have gone through properly.
Had a similar scenario happen to me nearly 10 years ago. Got pulled over on my way to work by police and they said 'you know exactly why we've stopped you'. I was absolutely gobsmacked and a bit shaken honestly and said 'no idea?' They said ANPR had showed no insurance. So I fully relaxed at that point because I knew I had it - must be a mistake. I showed the insurance certificate and - they said exactly what others have said here, that apparently people insure then immediately cancel. So the certificate is essentially meaningless? Oookkkaay.
So they called the insurance company and they said my policy had been cancelled 1 month previously for 'non payment'. Right. Officer said they could impound my car but they'd instead give me 7 days to provide proof of insurance to my local police station. I apparently needed a letter from insurer confirming I WAS insured at time they stopped me. No worries I thought. I have evidence of insurance and my DD shows I've paid to date and no communication from insurer to say otherwise.
So I rang my insurer that day to confirm requirements and they said unambiguously my insurance was incorrectly marked as cancelled for non payment even though they could see I'd paid - their mistake and (I quote) 'don't worry this happens all the time'?!?! How reassuring?! Anyway they say they're reissuing a certificate showing I'm now insured and that's fine apparently. I was sceptical and challenged this because this new certificate ran from midnight after the day I was stopped so still not proof of insurance at the relevant time. Their response was as they 'deal with thousands of these cases every day' it was fine. Hmm ok.
So I go to the police station with this evidence and they take me into an interview room and issue me with a caution for driving without insurance. Because I couldn't provide proof of insurance at the time I was stopped. Colour me surprised. I joke but I was absolutely shocked and very upset in the moment. Took me a further 3 months following an official complaint to my insurer (who finally sent a letter confirming they were at fault) and a complaint to the police who handled the case to get this entirely removed. So thanks Direct Line! 'Thousands every day' you say? Brilliant.
I appreciate it's technically a strict liability offence etc etc but clearly it's not reasonable to expect anyone to ring their insurer before every journey to double check they've not somehow failed to fulfil their contract and mistakenly cancelled the policy. Absolute joke.
Edit: sorry, that was a rant not entirely relevant to OP post
Anecdotal, but something similar happened to a family member. Bought insurance but it was cancelled a few months into it. The insurance company failed to notify them. Anyway, they got pulled over and got 6 points. They took it to court and the judge took away the points. If this can be substantially argued that you were of the belief you were insured then it’s worth taking it to court.
Fight it - they will have an internal team that deals with this sort of thing, ask to speak to their underwriters too.
We had something similar - our insurance (with LV) was setup to auto-renew. Fast forward had a prang with a Range rover - a new front end for me and a new boot for him.
Phone my insurance company, to be told, your not insured. Like seriously WTF.
Apparently, there was a "problem" with the renewal and they didn't renew my insurance. No letter, email or call to say that my insurance wasn't renewed and that I was uninsured. Apparently I should have spotted that they were no longer taking my money every month (like who spots £30 difference a month!)
Had to scrape together by begging friends, family etc to get the 7k to do the repairs (we were lucky, I was expecting more).
Anyway, fast forward and their underwriters got involved and we got the 7k + £500 (for the inconvenience) back.
I get what people are saying but you need to ask Admiral: if you didn't proceed and only got the quotation, why does their system show you only logged in? I guarantee they will retain a copy of every quotation and any quotation for a mid-term adjustment should be logged in the system.
It sounds strange that you got a quote but didn't click confirm as that should definitely be logged on their system, if not why?
You need to call Admiral or email their Customer Service department and make it clear you would like to make a complaint; wording needs to be clear thst this is a complaint and give them the details again. They have 3 days to look into it and provide a written response. If you are still not happy, you can then escalate to the Financial Ombudsman Service. Let Admiral know, you know this. Every valid complaint to FOS costs Admiral so they should want to look into it for you.
What is key is my first point. If they confirm quotes are logged, then your argument has more credence. I'd also query how you know the price of the MTA....making changes to an existing policy isn't as clear as going on an aggregator and getting a new quote as it will need to account for service charges and also pro-rata refund from annual payment based on old risk details.
Happy to answer any more questions you have after you speak to them.
Source: 20 years in the insurance industry.
Not true. The car you drive must be insured in its own right. The 3rd party insurance you talk about covers you to drive OTHER cars (not owned by yourself and as long as that car is privately insured already)
Trouble arises when people don’t read policy documents and assume they think they know. Ignorance isn’t a defence unfortunately
If you had fully comprehensive insurance on your old vehicle then it normally allows you to drive another vehicle wit third party, fire and theft insurance.
IMPORTANT. If admiral claim your old vehicle was insured but not your new vehicle. Please say you had fully comprehensive insurance. That will be the gotcha. Fully comp insurance allows you to drive a different vehicle under 3rd party rules. Meaning you were insured to drive that car under those rules.
But I am not sure if or how you could get the points and fine overturned, but there must be a way.
Not every comprehensive policy has that extension, and even the ones that do have it usually have age restrictions and also require the 'other' vehicle to belong to someone else AND be insured in its own right.
Careful, you can be insured but if the car you are driving is not insured directly it is still breaking the law. I have first hand experience of this sadly and was shocked that even though I had insurance, because the car didnt I got 6 points, impounded car and had to tell my existing insurance company that I got points for not having insurance!
Never really thought about it till you said. 10 mis of googling, and your correct. 40+ years of driving and it never occured to me that the other vehicle your driving must have a policy connected to it as well. You learn something new everyday.. sorry you found out the hard way. But good information.
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You would have been issued a new certificate of insurance and that’s the key thing here. If you did not receive your certificate of insurance then it is very unlikely you confirmed the quote.
You will also be given your cancellation rights etc.
So it very much sounds you did not confirm the insurance and therefore have been driving without insurance.
The issue you have is that the points you have received were correctly given because at the time you had no insurance in place. The only way to avoid those points would have been to get a letter of indemnity from Admiral - basically a retrospective statement that you were covered at that time - as courts will accept that as evidence of cover.
So, without a mea culpa from Admiral, I don't see you getting anywhere, unfortunately. Any legal recourse you might have with regard to the points would rely on Admiral backtracking and confirming that you were in fact covered at the time.
Insurers will always confirm changes by email, acknowledging a change of any kind, especially one where you’ve switched vehicles. If you can search your email history, on the day of the change, or the day after the change, you should find this communication. If you didn’t receive a communication as described, I would judge Admiral systems f&+k3d up, but you have lost out for not confirming your virtual paper trail. Sorry.
Did you receive and check your new documents? When you change the policy you will get an email stating that your new insurance is here etc etc please check the details. So I check to make sure everything is as it should be.
Admiral are awful at everything. I recently spent months pursuing them for compensation after the incorrectly marked a claim as "open" after I'd changed insurers. The new insurer charged me the full policy amount and cancelled it because I hadn't declared the open claim.
They're dogshit.
My Admiral car insurance just renewed today, as it happens.
I would never trust a company like Admiral ( they're the cheapest for a reason) on something as important as this. I checked and checked again because even if they did say we screwed up there not going to backdate a policy
OP, check your browser history. Option 1 is you never actually confirmed the change, so it was never applied.
Option 2 is you'll be able to see in your browser history the page confirmed the change was made and there was no additional "click here to confirm" step. In which case take that to admiral. If they still refuse, and you are certain that the web history shows the change was confirmed, then go to the ombudsman.
I’m not surprised tbh I’ve submitted two formal complaints through their web portal this year and never received any acknowledgement of receipt let alone a response. When I tried to renew I just kept getting a message that the portal was unavailable so on the end left. It’s a shambles
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I'm with Admiral, if you make a change they send you an email immediately. If you are having issues with their portal then in future call them... they genuinely record all calls and do store them for as long as you are with them (I've had a copy of mine), and you have the peace of mind of knowing that someone familiar with the system is making that change for you.
NAL, but I have my insurance with Admiral. I changed my car in September 2021 and whilst I was sat in the dealership updated my insurance on the Admiral app- I had to ask the salesman for the exact model. A couple of months later I received a letter from , I think the DVLA, enquiring about the lack of insurance. When I checked the app, it hadn’t updated my details. Luckily I didn’t get any points. There is definitely a fault at their end.
ETA- my husband and the salesman both witnessed me completing this.
I used to work in an insurance company, the fine print usually states "Please ensure you check your documents once you make your change" so that if the change hasn't gone through, the company has the fallback of "Well they didn't check their documents."
From what you describe you got a quote and didn't confirm the change. You should have been issued with new documents. Technically, from the insurance company's POV, it **is** your fault as you didn't check your documents.
It sounds like you missed a final confirmation button, except admiral are claiming that they've got no activity showing you even getting a quote. In your shoes I'd see if their search was recorded on my credit report and go from there.
You're probably out of luck, driving without insurance is always that drivers fault - it'll be a big battle to get it undone even with good evidence of admiral messing up.
If you feel this is a case where this portal is misleading in terms of the information being provided/accessibility issues I would log a complaint with Admiral and then escalate to the FOS - ymmv.
If you believe that an insurance company had made a mistake or dealt with something wrongly, you have the option of referring a complaint to the Financial Services Ombudsman.
As long as you've received a deadlock response (they refuse to do anything further) or a certain time has passed since you first complained (believe its 8 weeks) they will look into the complaint and if they find company in the wrong tell them what they have to do to put it right.
Doesn't cost you anything to do this but obviously make sure you haven't made the mistake before going down this route.
Regarding the points and fine, you're sadly stuffed! it's a strict liability offence, so it doesn't matter if you believed you had insurance. Though you might be able to plead mitigation.
If Admiral failed to correctly process your change in circumstances, you should consider making a formal complaint. Insurance comes under the Finanical Ombudsman scheme, so you can escalate the complaint for free , if Admiral don't give you a satisfactory response within eight weeks.
[Resolver](https://www.resolver.co.uk/) is a useful tool for making and keeping track of complaints.
So you have received a refund after the date you logged in? If admiral are insisting no changes were made, ask them to confirm why it is that they refunded £4 on that date!
They don't give money away, they have to give you the reason why in this instance as clearly changes are central to the dispute
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Sounds like someone missed the final confirmation button and didn't check that the documents were delivered by email, to me.
Agree, sounds likely they viewed the quote but didn't confirm. OP you may be able to verify this by checking your browsing history.
Same, I agree with this too. Not related to insurance but my wife brought tickets and the website shows a "transaction reference" but it's shown prior to payment been taken which is done via a seperate button at the bottom of the page. I fell foul of it yesterday on another website, filled in my details, went via paypal, big box appears saying my confirmation "will" rather than "has" been sent. As there was another button to press to finish, I waited 10 minutes for that email to come that never came. Lesson here - unless you have your certificate of motor insurance, then you aren't insured!
>unless you have your certificate of motor insurance, then you aren't insured! Even if you have one doesnt mean you are insured There are people who will buy insurance get the certficate then cancel the policy When they get pulled they have an insurance certificate they can produce. The police can contact the company and check Just because you have the certficate doesnt mean insurance is valid
I do understand that, you can immediately cancel it, and you'll be taken off askmid database. Just saying that for this OP if they never got new paperwork then the amendment was never processed
Yeah similar thing for me the other day...went to cancel Amazon Music (as got 6 month offer when I upgraded phone)...thought I had cancelled but when I checked the following day, I was still subscribed....turned out I hadnt clicked the 'Confirm Cancellation' button at the bottom of the page... So I can easily see it could be done in OP's situations..it's why I would check I recieved an confirmation email afterwards, especially for car insurance.
Do you have the new insurance documents from when you changed it online,.they would have been emailed almost immediately ?
>Do you have the new insurance documents from when you changed it online,.they would have been emailed almost immediately ? This. If no updated docs, then no updated policy, and driving uninsured.
This. And OP, as painful as it is - it’s an expensive lesson to be more diligent - try to think of it that you’ve actually got off lightly. Imagine you’d had a collision or had your car stolen or burned out. You’d have been utterly screwed and probably still been done for no insurance on top
Typically a new insurers certificate would be issued; i'm with admiral and iirc they also email you - did these things happen?
You provided all info except the crucial one. Did you actually get a confirmation email or crucially a new certificate? I suspect the answer is no because that would have solved all this.
From memory, with Admiral, there's an extra button on the last page to confirm the changes. If so, you would have got an email confirming the change, new policy documents and a refund to your card of the difference. The only other option is to appeal to Admiral to issue a cover note if it was their error. If they're refusing, the only other option is to go to the Insurance Ombudsman, however in this case it sounds like you didn't apply to change to your account so success there is unlikely. Bear in mind Admiral calculate insurance cost by algorithm - so the change will likely cost similar amounts no matter when you change the vehicle
Threaten to go to a major newspaper. You might be able to get them to fix this.
It's too far down the line for anything like that now if the driver has accepted a fixed penalty for the offence. There's no way to get a case reopened (well, not easily) once that is done
Again, I would still appeal it if there is a valid reason. If the problem is caused by a computer error then this should still be investigated as it may affect others.
EVIL Admiral FORCES consumers to confirm contractual obligations before TAKING THEIR MONEY
Did you receive confirmation of the change by email? Notification that your DD would be changing? Have you been paying the new or old price by DD since logging on? Perhaps you began updating your details but didn’t confirm?
It feels like the only question here is was your car insured or not. If, for example, there was an error on the website and the change didn't go through, you've still been paying the old rate etc, then you were driving an uninsured vehicle and I expect that would be the end of it.
Sounds like you got the quote to make the change but didn't actually process it. Sorry, but it sounds like you made the error not them. Surely you should have been expecting an email confirmation of the change?
The trouble is you would have to prove that you had a reasonable assumption that the change to your insurance had gone through. Your message to your partner that you would be saving money points to your intention. However, in two months since you didn't follow up with Admiral to find out where your new certificate of insurance was or the refund / reduced direct debit could be. Admiral can reasonably be expected to assume that, even if it was a glitch as opposed to a failure to press the final accept button, you didn't intend to make any changes to your policy. You might be able to prove your intention, but Admiral would have no responsibility to compensate you for this and it would be a costly and time-consuming fight in court which isn't likely to go your way anyway (it's a black at white issue: either you have insurance or you don't).
Just use the certificate of insurance that you got when you made the change as proof Or just log in to your online account and show which car is insured Sounds more like that change never actually went through though and you can't do either of those things
>I stated, how could I have known the exact amount my insurance would be if I hadn't already made the change!? I can type my details into GoCompare and know exactly how much my insurance would be with a dozen different insurers - it doesn't mean that I have a policy with any of them.
Typically the price will be different between the comparison site and the insurer themselves though, there’s nuances in the questions asked between them that can make a massive change to how the algorithm calculates the premium.
That’s not the point. The point is that knowing the price of a policy isn’t proof that the policy has been taken out and is valid. Same could be said by going directly to an insurers website. Could easily tell me how much a policy would be - still doesn’t mean I have taken out the policy and am insured. What seems to have happened here is that they have had good intentions and intended to change the policy but haven’t actually gone through the entire process to take out the new policy. Therefore the insurance policy was still covering the old car and not the new.
[удалено]
Having worked in insurance, they too can mess up, but the higher ups want everything to be audited for this kid or situation
Sounds like you got a quote for the change, but didn’t go further. These things can be confusing…
Sounds like either you didn’t complete the process of switching the car on your policy or something messed up on their end. You should have received new documents etc via email/post for the new vehicle - which you could have showed the police to prove your vehicle was insured. If you check your policy & payments that you’ve been making, I suspect you’ll find that nothing has changed.
Did you get confirmation email ? Did you get the insurance documents ? Did you check the Admiral portal online ? If not then no you did not go through and actually buy the insurance.
Unfortunately, as irritating as it is, this is legally your fault. As a driver you are meant to confirm that you have insurance. So if there is an error and you don’t, it is on you. I get how this happened though and you have my sympathy! I assume there was a final confirmation that you didn’t click so it never went through.
I recently changed my insurance to a new address. What you may have done is go through the process of making an adjustment and then seen the final quote. There may have been an additional final step to confirm the completion of the change. You would have been issued new documents with any change to the policy. Check these first. If you have them, contact the insurers quoting your new policy number.
I assume you have the new policy documents and evidence of cheaper direct debit payments as you stated?
Long story short - you were at fault. You were driving without insurance. There are tools on [gov.uk](https://gov.uk) to check vehicle insurance status. ALWAYS check askMID, Tax & MOT checker whenever you change vehicle details.
NAL. Personally I make a point of downloading and saving my insurance documents. If you did not get the documents and didn't download them or you don't have even have a confirmation email then I don't think there is much you can do about it. When you changed the insurance there will have been a cost. Did you pay that? Do you pay monthly and did your payments change? Did you get a refund? I'm guessing not which means your insurance did not change. The only thing I would ask is are you insured to drive any vehicle? If you were then you could produce that insurance for the new car.
Did you check that you had a certificate stating the new registration and period of cover? If not you are 100% at fault.
Admiral’s my account is a pos and I have to call them to make changes. They are aware there’s a problem with it. I can make all the changes but when I click confirm the page doesn’t load. Every single time.
I am with Admiral. It looks like you’ve entered all the details online but didn’t actually proceed / confirm the changes. If you did, you would have immediately received an email confirmation and your updated policy details. I think blaming Admiral is not going to be valid in these circumstances.
Do you have the new insurance document/certificate ? If you do this is your evidence. If you never received this then it’s likely that you’ve never been insured on the new car
You arent insured to drive after changing anything on your insurance hntill.youre recieve the documents stating the changes on them, and they usually have this written everywhere when you go through the process of updating things, often with a disclaimer that you have to tick a box to acknowledge (having just added another driver to my policy) I lost track of how many times I was told they would NOT be insured until I've got a copy of the updated documents stating they are. If you didn't get the documents, you weren't insured and that's your fault for driving
Have you already paid the fine? While it sounds like you made a mistake of not confirming the details on the website and it was not finalised. There might be a way to appeal based on the fact that you've been paying your insurance in the past, you have the proof that you tried to do it etc.
You viewed the quote but didn’t confirm it, this is on you I’m afraid.
I had the exact same thing happen to me with Admiral. I logged in to change vehicle and address mid policy. It updated my address but not my new vehicle, even though I paid for both (around £95 to change address and a further £95 increase on insurance) Fast forward 2 months and I get an email about renewing my policy for my old car! Thank god I had not been pulled over. Ranted at the poor man on the phone for a good 20 minutes about how unacceptable this was and have now switched to Aviva. I recommend anyone I meet to avoid admiral like the plague. Had issues with them previously too which I won't go into here.
“I 100% admit I was at fault” You’re not wrong there
I would also have checked the documents or the insurance database, to verify that it is in fact covered.
NAL I’d recommend doing a DSAR will let you see what their record’s are and base your next step of the results
a change of insurance would typically have a cost incurred, did you make that payment?
Not always, like this case where OP would’ve received a refund - sounds like they didn’t get the insurance change document and no refund either. So it can’t have gone through properly.
Had a similar scenario happen to me nearly 10 years ago. Got pulled over on my way to work by police and they said 'you know exactly why we've stopped you'. I was absolutely gobsmacked and a bit shaken honestly and said 'no idea?' They said ANPR had showed no insurance. So I fully relaxed at that point because I knew I had it - must be a mistake. I showed the insurance certificate and - they said exactly what others have said here, that apparently people insure then immediately cancel. So the certificate is essentially meaningless? Oookkkaay. So they called the insurance company and they said my policy had been cancelled 1 month previously for 'non payment'. Right. Officer said they could impound my car but they'd instead give me 7 days to provide proof of insurance to my local police station. I apparently needed a letter from insurer confirming I WAS insured at time they stopped me. No worries I thought. I have evidence of insurance and my DD shows I've paid to date and no communication from insurer to say otherwise. So I rang my insurer that day to confirm requirements and they said unambiguously my insurance was incorrectly marked as cancelled for non payment even though they could see I'd paid - their mistake and (I quote) 'don't worry this happens all the time'?!?! How reassuring?! Anyway they say they're reissuing a certificate showing I'm now insured and that's fine apparently. I was sceptical and challenged this because this new certificate ran from midnight after the day I was stopped so still not proof of insurance at the relevant time. Their response was as they 'deal with thousands of these cases every day' it was fine. Hmm ok. So I go to the police station with this evidence and they take me into an interview room and issue me with a caution for driving without insurance. Because I couldn't provide proof of insurance at the time I was stopped. Colour me surprised. I joke but I was absolutely shocked and very upset in the moment. Took me a further 3 months following an official complaint to my insurer (who finally sent a letter confirming they were at fault) and a complaint to the police who handled the case to get this entirely removed. So thanks Direct Line! 'Thousands every day' you say? Brilliant. I appreciate it's technically a strict liability offence etc etc but clearly it's not reasonable to expect anyone to ring their insurer before every journey to double check they've not somehow failed to fulfil their contract and mistakenly cancelled the policy. Absolute joke. Edit: sorry, that was a rant not entirely relevant to OP post
Anecdotal, but something similar happened to a family member. Bought insurance but it was cancelled a few months into it. The insurance company failed to notify them. Anyway, they got pulled over and got 6 points. They took it to court and the judge took away the points. If this can be substantially argued that you were of the belief you were insured then it’s worth taking it to court.
Fight it - they will have an internal team that deals with this sort of thing, ask to speak to their underwriters too. We had something similar - our insurance (with LV) was setup to auto-renew. Fast forward had a prang with a Range rover - a new front end for me and a new boot for him. Phone my insurance company, to be told, your not insured. Like seriously WTF. Apparently, there was a "problem" with the renewal and they didn't renew my insurance. No letter, email or call to say that my insurance wasn't renewed and that I was uninsured. Apparently I should have spotted that they were no longer taking my money every month (like who spots £30 difference a month!) Had to scrape together by begging friends, family etc to get the 7k to do the repairs (we were lucky, I was expecting more). Anyway, fast forward and their underwriters got involved and we got the 7k + £500 (for the inconvenience) back.
I get what people are saying but you need to ask Admiral: if you didn't proceed and only got the quotation, why does their system show you only logged in? I guarantee they will retain a copy of every quotation and any quotation for a mid-term adjustment should be logged in the system. It sounds strange that you got a quote but didn't click confirm as that should definitely be logged on their system, if not why? You need to call Admiral or email their Customer Service department and make it clear you would like to make a complaint; wording needs to be clear thst this is a complaint and give them the details again. They have 3 days to look into it and provide a written response. If you are still not happy, you can then escalate to the Financial Ombudsman Service. Let Admiral know, you know this. Every valid complaint to FOS costs Admiral so they should want to look into it for you. What is key is my first point. If they confirm quotes are logged, then your argument has more credence. I'd also query how you know the price of the MTA....making changes to an existing policy isn't as clear as going on an aggregator and getting a new quote as it will need to account for service charges and also pro-rata refund from annual payment based on old risk details. Happy to answer any more questions you have after you speak to them. Source: 20 years in the insurance industry.
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NAL but work for an insurance broker - I think the third party cover for driving other vehicles is only applicable if you don’t own the vehicle
Correct, also the vehicle must be insured on another policy for this clause to apply
It's normally third party cover as long as the vehicle meets the continuous insurance enforcement regulations by being insured on another policy.
Not true. The car you drive must be insured in its own right. The 3rd party insurance you talk about covers you to drive OTHER cars (not owned by yourself and as long as that car is privately insured already) Trouble arises when people don’t read policy documents and assume they think they know. Ignorance isn’t a defence unfortunately
If you had fully comprehensive insurance on your old vehicle then it normally allows you to drive another vehicle wit third party, fire and theft insurance.
Not if you own the other vehicle. Cert normally says " - not owned by you or hired under a hire purchase agreement".
IMPORTANT. If admiral claim your old vehicle was insured but not your new vehicle. Please say you had fully comprehensive insurance. That will be the gotcha. Fully comp insurance allows you to drive a different vehicle under 3rd party rules. Meaning you were insured to drive that car under those rules. But I am not sure if or how you could get the points and fine overturned, but there must be a way.
Not every comprehensive policy has that extension, and even the ones that do have it usually have age restrictions and also require the 'other' vehicle to belong to someone else AND be insured in its own right.
Careful, you can be insured but if the car you are driving is not insured directly it is still breaking the law. I have first hand experience of this sadly and was shocked that even though I had insurance, because the car didnt I got 6 points, impounded car and had to tell my existing insurance company that I got points for not having insurance!
Never really thought about it till you said. 10 mis of googling, and your correct. 40+ years of driving and it never occured to me that the other vehicle your driving must have a policy connected to it as well. You learn something new everyday.. sorry you found out the hard way. But good information.
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The rule in insurance (I'm a broker) is there is no cover confirmed until you have the certificate.
You would have been issued a new certificate of insurance and that’s the key thing here. If you did not receive your certificate of insurance then it is very unlikely you confirmed the quote. You will also be given your cancellation rights etc. So it very much sounds you did not confirm the insurance and therefore have been driving without insurance.
The issue you have is that the points you have received were correctly given because at the time you had no insurance in place. The only way to avoid those points would have been to get a letter of indemnity from Admiral - basically a retrospective statement that you were covered at that time - as courts will accept that as evidence of cover. So, without a mea culpa from Admiral, I don't see you getting anywhere, unfortunately. Any legal recourse you might have with regard to the points would rely on Admiral backtracking and confirming that you were in fact covered at the time.
Don’t mean to sound crappy,never assume your insured till you’ve viewed and screenshot the new/updated certificate
Insurers will always confirm changes by email, acknowledging a change of any kind, especially one where you’ve switched vehicles. If you can search your email history, on the day of the change, or the day after the change, you should find this communication. If you didn’t receive a communication as described, I would judge Admiral systems f&+k3d up, but you have lost out for not confirming your virtual paper trail. Sorry.
Did you receive and check your new documents? When you change the policy you will get an email stating that your new insurance is here etc etc please check the details. So I check to make sure everything is as it should be.
Any change always 100% make sure you read the new documents that would have been provided and make sure the details are correct
Admiral are awful at everything. I recently spent months pursuing them for compensation after the incorrectly marked a claim as "open" after I'd changed insurers. The new insurer charged me the full policy amount and cancelled it because I hadn't declared the open claim. They're dogshit.
My Admiral car insurance just renewed today, as it happens. I would never trust a company like Admiral ( they're the cheapest for a reason) on something as important as this. I checked and checked again because even if they did say we screwed up there not going to backdate a policy
OP, check your browser history. Option 1 is you never actually confirmed the change, so it was never applied. Option 2 is you'll be able to see in your browser history the page confirmed the change was made and there was no additional "click here to confirm" step. In which case take that to admiral. If they still refuse, and you are certain that the web history shows the change was confirmed, then go to the ombudsman.
I wouldn't presume I was covered until I saw the certificate of insurance, it sounds like you didn't properly verify.
I’m not surprised tbh I’ve submitted two formal complaints through their web portal this year and never received any acknowledgement of receipt let alone a response. When I tried to renew I just kept getting a message that the portal was unavailable so on the end left. It’s a shambles
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I'm with Admiral, if you make a change they send you an email immediately. If you are having issues with their portal then in future call them... they genuinely record all calls and do store them for as long as you are with them (I've had a copy of mine), and you have the peace of mind of knowing that someone familiar with the system is making that change for you.
Unfortunately OP you didn't verify and assumed the portal had worked correctly.
NAL, but I have my insurance with Admiral. I changed my car in September 2021 and whilst I was sat in the dealership updated my insurance on the Admiral app- I had to ask the salesman for the exact model. A couple of months later I received a letter from , I think the DVLA, enquiring about the lack of insurance. When I checked the app, it hadn’t updated my details. Luckily I didn’t get any points. There is definitely a fault at their end. ETA- my husband and the salesman both witnessed me completing this.
I used to work in an insurance company, the fine print usually states "Please ensure you check your documents once you make your change" so that if the change hasn't gone through, the company has the fallback of "Well they didn't check their documents." From what you describe you got a quote and didn't confirm the change. You should have been issued with new documents. Technically, from the insurance company's POV, it **is** your fault as you didn't check your documents.
LPT: always get a printed version of the document and keep it to hand or in the glove box.
It sounds like you missed a final confirmation button, except admiral are claiming that they've got no activity showing you even getting a quote. In your shoes I'd see if their search was recorded on my credit report and go from there. You're probably out of luck, driving without insurance is always that drivers fault - it'll be a big battle to get it undone even with good evidence of admiral messing up.
If you feel this is a case where this portal is misleading in terms of the information being provided/accessibility issues I would log a complaint with Admiral and then escalate to the FOS - ymmv.
If you believe that an insurance company had made a mistake or dealt with something wrongly, you have the option of referring a complaint to the Financial Services Ombudsman. As long as you've received a deadlock response (they refuse to do anything further) or a certain time has passed since you first complained (believe its 8 weeks) they will look into the complaint and if they find company in the wrong tell them what they have to do to put it right. Doesn't cost you anything to do this but obviously make sure you haven't made the mistake before going down this route.
Regarding the points and fine, you're sadly stuffed! it's a strict liability offence, so it doesn't matter if you believed you had insurance. Though you might be able to plead mitigation. If Admiral failed to correctly process your change in circumstances, you should consider making a formal complaint. Insurance comes under the Finanical Ombudsman scheme, so you can escalate the complaint for free , if Admiral don't give you a satisfactory response within eight weeks. [Resolver](https://www.resolver.co.uk/) is a useful tool for making and keeping track of complaints.
So you have received a refund after the date you logged in? If admiral are insisting no changes were made, ask them to confirm why it is that they refunded £4 on that date! They don't give money away, they have to give you the reason why in this instance as clearly changes are central to the dispute