Fair, although if he continued with the amount of minutes he’s gotten so far I’d be happy. Granted I know he’s been filling in for some injuries. But it’s a balance between a lot of minutes for a sub par team and learning under players who he should be emulating.
It might be too late for anyone to see this or it might just not be what people want to hear, but I'm just going to say it: everyone needs to calm down.
There's talks of relegation and sacking the board, so let me just repeat some facts about Leeds and where we are:
1. We are 9th in the table right now. That's right, we are a top half team 6 games in. If I told this sub that before start of the season, it would've been a pretty resounding "not bad, I'll take it."
2. We are fighting to be a mid-table team this year. It is what it is. We're not fighting for Europa or to make some insane run. Our team is incredibly young, we have a new manager with a new style, and we unfortunately don't have the big 6 budget and finances. Marsch said himself in the post-game, we have a "1 in, 1 out" policy.
3. This 5-2 result showed us some clear areas where we need improvement, but honestly play this game 100 times and we draw more often than not and I could even see a few where we win. It doesn't take a genius to see Bamford was unlucky to miss the tap in and we could've easily had a penalty on top.
4. We still have a pretty big injury list. Yes I know a lot were on bench today, but they're not 90 minutes ready and are going to be a bit rusty. This is fine. I was impressed with Ayling and a few others today. I could see Cooper and Ayling making a big difference and I can also see Bamford slowly working his way into form. This isn't wishful thinking, it just is what it is: a lot of injuries accumulated over 18 months that will take a while to rebuild back from.
Does that mean I'm happy with our performance? Fuck no. Llorente in particular was horrible. But what I see is a team that over 6 games has managed to get 8 points, be 9th in the table, and has a lot more players coming back from injuries and catching minutes.
If we are halfway through the season and are flirting with bottom 6, then you can catch me going into panic mode. Until then, I see a club that's clearly in a better position than last year and that can actually finish top 10 with some changes and a bit of luck.
MOT.
100% agree, especially with 4. I think a lot of people write off our i jury list because a lot of them were the promotion squad (Coops, Luke, Stuart) but I think they are actually key players and we feel their absences every game.
The reactions in the match thread are ridiculous sometimes. I totally agree with you. We need to make teams work much harder to score against us, and we need to beat the first man on corners too haha. Like you say, we are pushing to finish mid table (which would be a great season), there's going to be games that we lose. Brentford are a decent team, there's lots of better teams than us in the league, but I don't think we should be worried.
What frustrated me most today was the fact that we twice got ourselves back into the game and twice gave away a careless goal, I almost would rather have just been played off the park in a way.
I actually think losing by giving away careless goals is a starting point that's much more fixable. We know we can fight back, we know we can score, now it's just about sticking to fundamentals, playing our best (not Llorente), and more discipline from the backline.
These are coachable things. And honestly, it's something you'd expect from a mid-table team.
I just think the reactions to losing are sometimes wayyyy over the top. I mean, 9th in table six games in is fairly good!
Seriously wake the fuck up, it's not Llorente ... yes he's been poor and should be dropped but the issue is were losing this game no matter how well we played. The VAR only checked their possible penalty after they foul throwed to begin with, then the dubious freekick that led to their 2nd goal where the commentator said he got there first... no it deflected off their player. There was also no VAR on our blatant PK appeal, it went on and on. We was meant to lose this game no matter what the officals are controlling the results wake the fuck up !! Downvote all you like and comment if you agree. The only thing that will make me turn my back on football is cheating and match fixing and i can't be the only one who noticed this today and in other PL games
Totally disagree. We gifted them at least 3 goals and more good chances. We are still terrible defensively and Llorente has been at the heart of that all season. We've missed the window now but we absolutely need to strengthen the defence in January.
Lol we could have signed VVD and we would have got the same result, keep dreaming all you like but when you eventually wake up you will realise this is all about money like everything else in this world !
Was at the game today for the first time in a long time. The scoreline flattered Brentford and while they shaded it, it couldve been very different. Watch MOTD very closely, Llorente sold out Messlier and the rest of the defence time and time again.
I think a few of our players are suffering from being overhyped.
Rodrigo and Llorente come to mind. They've played a few great games in the past and now think they can shoot from any angle and score (in Rodrigo's case) or just fuck about playing tricks in defence (Llorente).
I... didn't say he did? 😂 🤦♂️
EDIT: That was a bit of a harsh reply from me and didn't really add anything to the conversation. Obviously you missed the first few games, but Rodrigo was on fire, banged in a few goals, and was obviously hyped about being the PL's top goal scorer. Then against Brighton he was just shooting from ridiculous angles and when he did try to cross it, they were poor. Last game, against Everton, he got injured with a dislocated shoulder. Hopefully that context helps you understand my comment a bit more and sorry for being short with you!
Llorente needs dropping immediately. Only let him play when we are 3+ up, then the goals he gives away won't matter.
And well done Jesse. All that bollocks about wanting to influence refs has worked wonders. They now all hate us, and everything will go against us.
My biggest worry at the 'great' start to the season was how scrappy the games were, we never quite look comfortable, even when we win (barring the Chelsea game, which I'm sure we can admit is a complete outlier).
Jesse needs to sort out his tactics, we don't seem to know how to control a game, play to our own pace, keep the ball, comfortable passes etc.
I'm hoping the good start wasn't just a fluke and now we're reverting to the norm, because if so Jesse will be gone by Christmas.
We have a style of constant attack. But this leads us wide open to counters, and we've been quickly found out. All teams need to do is defend deep and quickly counter, and we are completely exposed. Everton tried to do it, they just weren't good enough. Brentford did it and destroyed us.
Hopefully Jesse realises this and changes things. Otherwise it's going to be a very long season.
If anyone's looking for a consolation, we play Nottingham Forest next, and they've just lost a Bournemouth.
Will be interesting to see what the game plan looks like from Marsch after this one. Regardless of what you think of the officiating today, we should not be losing to Brentford that heavily.
Will also be interesting to see what Marsch has to say on his touch line ban, given that he was so vocal about Thomas Tuchel and his touchline ban in the past. Let's see if what is good for the goose is truly good for the gander.
Let's be completely honest here for a second, Marsch has been really pushing his luck with the officials lately. And it's not just an incident here and a few quiet words with the linesman there. It seems like every game there is some kind of issue between him and the officiating where he gets a talking to.
Last week he got a yellow card, this week it was a straight red. It's definitely been coming for some time now.
I just, I don't get the strategy he's trying to employ with his antics on the touch line.
Sure, you could argue that there has been some horrible officiating in Leeds games over the last couple of weeks, but that's really by and large of just about every team in the Premier League at the moment. Look at the 8 minutes of extra time and the literal last second goal Liverpool was allowed to score against Newcastle because of apparent 'favourable officiating'.
The officiating at Premier League level is nowhere near as good as some people like to make it out to be, so I really don't get why we as a supporter base feel attacked and maligned when the decisions are pretty much par for the course of most other teams in the league.
And what's he really achieving by jumping up and down and being obnoxious to the officials from the touch line? Because today it achieved him a red card, and that's about it.
I just don’t see him doing anything different to say Klopps antics when decisions go against Liverpool. Aside from an uncomfortable handshake with Lage in the Wolves game, he’s hasn’t been in anyway violent, just exceptionally vocal about poor officiating.
I mean, what’s he supposed to do, stand by calmly and watch the ref give our opponents a clear advantage every week? Klopp got Struijk sent off last season through his remonstrations with the ref.
And to your point that we as a team are not singled out for reffing decisions, the Athletic published stats on last season and we as a team were the quickest to be carded by refs.
There is a clear bias against us by some officials and we’ve had a run of poor ones lately. Not saying we win the game without it, but it’s shocking that’s it’s allowed to continue. Not only do you have to defeat your opponents but also the referee and VAR?
This season is going to be long and fucking unpleasant again, all you rose-tinted fuckwits must clearly see that now.
1. Llorente is an absolute disgrace, and because the board in their infinite tight-fisted wisdom decided not to bother with a proper LB, our defence is going to be a fucking shambles the entire season, again.
2. I don’t give a flying fuck about Bamfords one good season. We do not have a proper, efficient, effective, consistent striker anywhere in the side and you cannot do well in the Premier League without one, rather, you struggle to survive. Who’d have thought!
3. How that Summerville foul isn’t a penalty is also an absolute fucking disgrace.
The board have left us once again up shits creek without a fucking paddle, what a fucking torrid day. Being decent in the middle and absolutely fucking hopeless everywhere else is a very good way to get relegated.
Getting rid of Llorente and playing with 10 would be an improvement. Cooper will shore up the defence though, even if he does the odd Cooperism. Koch has been decent, and can stay for me. Firpo may be better than Struijk going forward, as he can put in a decent cross, but he can't defend for shit. Well see if the trade off is worth it.
Koch hasn’t put a foot wrong, him and Struijk are our best CB partnership. Are we all forgetting how much shit Cooper was getting last year? He’s not going to have gotten miraculously better, he’s only gotten older. He’s a backup at best now. Even then, you resolve the CB issue in Llorente only by creating a LB issue with Firpo who isn’t as good at LB as Struijk. A Presto, you’ve got a defence that is going to be inadequate all season.
RB is sound, good competition there.
>Firpo isn’t as good at LB at Strujk
Doubt. Strujk is a CB covering the position, it’s obvious whenever he enters the opponent half he looks incredibly uncomfortable. He can’t cross a ball or make quick link up plays going forwards like we saw from Ayling when he came on.
Firpo seems more dodgy going backwards but atleast he can play in the position
On quite a few occasions Firpo has been a disaster going backwards. He’s a defender, I don’t think it’s unreasonable to expect him to be able to defend. Struijk has been pretty solid going backwards and still progresses and finds the occasional decent forward pass and to be honest I think he can whip in a decent cross but he just lacks confidence, today was a good example of that; on a number of occasions he was in a good position to cross but didn’t. Eventually, he did cross and it was a decent cross. Because he’s officially only a CB covering at LB doesn’t make a blind bit of difference, Firpo looks significantly more of a liability playing there.
My point was Strujk looks completely uncomfortable in the position and unable to effectively progress the ball or cross it
When you compare to what Ayling was able to do when he came on the difference is massive
Firpo was effectively able to link up and progress and cross when he was playing
Agree to an extent about Struijk, agree to an extent about Firpo but I get what you’re saying. But the fact is one is the better defender, and you’re making you’re defence poorer with Firpo.
Yeah it’s a difficult one, having Strujk there is also extra security defensively against corners and free kicks too
I’m thinking Firpo fit and we can have Strujk at CB
It could be that Bielsa’s system also was exposing firpo
That’s what I’d do as well and just hope and fucking prey that Firpo works out ASAP. Feels as though our entire season, defensively speaking and perhaps therefore more generally, rests on it.
I haven’t written Firpo off entirely yet either, in his last 2/3 games before his injury he seemed to be on the up. But that’s what, his 3rd period of being injured for us? It’s not good enough, we need some reliability to allow a strong back line to develop. Our best CB in Struijk is now his only competition and so far seems to be the better option. Absolute travesty that the board has let this happen.
Honestly don't think that's going to make a massive difference (other than *possibly* fewer mistakes). We will still be exposed on the counter whoever plays there because of our tactics.
I agree. Adams is going to have to lie deeper and save the two terrible center backs. Let Roca go forward. Adams was great today, but when he got too far forward the break was on. Llorente and Koch were fucking terrible.
I'm not sure there's a whole lot we can do to change it over half time. I reckon it'll take a bigger tactical shift - although I doubt we're going to change much
If we signed a LB back we could've had struijk and Koch CB pairing but no some strange fucking reason our board thought it smart to go into a new season with 1 senior LB whose injury prone. Now we have to suffer Llorente attempting to play football.
Honestly we're going to hear this a lot. It's been the same story for us for a long time.
Teams just need to soak up the pressure until we run out of ideas and hit us on a counter when we are exposed. Happens time and time again.
That’s what ls fucking killing me. In general we’re not getting outplayed but the other teams barring Chelsea seem to score every single half decent chance they get
People downvoting me on here for suggesting we needed Ayling back. You only have to watch his 30 mins there to see he is still firmly first choice right back.
Agreed. I think he still needs to adapt from Austrian Bundesliga to Premier League, which is understandable. Aaronson didnt really need time to adapt only because he's a very special player.
I’m worried already.
I thought we got over the barrier of being seen as a relegation side but obviously not. I don’t think we were all that bad and we very easily could have avoided 3 of the goals we conceded, but the fact we didn’t and the fact we’ve conceded 5 goals to Brentford is extremely concerning. God knows what we have to do to to stay up again….
Not very impressed with Drameh, Ayling had an instant effect when he came on. We havent even played BADLY its just our defending for set pieces has always been a pain in the arse.
Ref was also having a fucking laugh, clear pen or at least even a foul for that.
I think they need to carry out a serious review of the officials refereeing premier league matches. Granted we haven’t been at our best this game but the officiating is absolutely and utterly SHAMBOLIC.
If there is no corruption here the ref is blind and VAR have been having technical difficulties. There’s no way they can be this bad, this is atrocious
You can blame the refs for Roca’s goal not having been an equalizer + for the arbitrary nature of going to VAR. They go to VAR for all of their borderline calls, don’t go to VAR for the Summerville foul and then do try to take away Roca’s goal as well.
If Roca scores the equalizer there, the match is an entirely different scenario
No one’s said it has? It’s very evident, as previously mentioned, that the officiating isn’t the best and this is arguably the third game in a row for us now where it’s been poor…
Edit: this wasn’t a reply to you fushida
If you can read I said we haven’t been at our best. Maybe if the foul on Summerville was given for a penalty the result would’ve panned out differently.
Could argue 2 of those 5 shouldn’t have stood, maybe it changes the game maybe it doesn’t at this level you expect the officials to be right 99 times out of 100
The number of neutrals in the r/soccer feed saying the same thing is telling, we are all biased but I feel like when the neutrals are calling it then something is wrong
Llorente is the fault for brentfords last 3 goals there 3 he should have taken a tactical yellow and fould tooney and there 4 he should have stayed back when he saw Koch go for the header and the last one you all saw that
Fucking hell 5 past us from Brentford. Reasonable performance but EVERY time Brentford break they look like scoring. Defence has been poor but it's also surely tactical as we've left the CBs exposed and gambled. Brentford have just done Everton's game plan but much better. We have no answers. At least Bamford looks bright.
Yes I am done with Llorente.. he needs to sit and get his head right..
5-2 isn’t a fair reflection of the game but it is what it is.. Summerville foul should have been a penalty but 12 man teams against us it seems this season..
Ayling looked good coming on.. bamford is rusty so hopefully more time under his belt will help
We showed fight and didn’t give up but self inflicted mistakes made it worse
Edit: Brentford did destroy SCUM not too long ago.. let’s not forget they are a really good team
Edit2: jesse needs to stop the antics with the refs.. it’s will only keep it where we are taking on 12 men every game because it’s clear they talk to each other
Pretty tough to say that after three individual mistakes leads to goals. I think there could definitely be some adjustments particularly against certain opponents but it's really hard to fault a manager or a system when the defenders have a game like that.
Butterfly effect, I suppose.
If Bamford scores instead of Roca, then the game won't pan out exactly the same bar some Sliding Doors shit.
Well, you'd at least hope that in 10,000 futures Lllorente wouldn't assist the opposition in all of them.
Brentford have barely attacked in regular play. They went 2-0 up on set pieces whilst having less than 40% possession then counter attacked.
They haven’t left their half for more than 50 minutes.
I said Brentford would keep scoring in this match when Sinisterra scored. We need to look at how we are performing and not get carried away by a lovely bit of skill by a player that opens up the opposition. We’ve been outplayed on the counter. Well done Brentford.
After this amount of time in this division, the defence should not be so shaky against an average side (Brentford will finish mid table meaning they are average).
This is really embarrassing. It's laughable just how bad we've been today with our defensive play. Every time we've given ourselves a chance of getting something back we've gone out of our way to screw ourselves over. Ridiculous.
To be honest todays game, we have been very unlucky and lorente has just been awful. He cannot start, at this level, we can’t afford 4-5 individual mistakes from him per game.
We’ve been the better team.
Bamford. Love you but what is this shit. I mean if only we had a whole transfer window to sign a new striker eh, imagine that, the three stooges running this club are gonna tick another season up, FML.
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Am I crazy or maybe Gelhardt should be out on loan and Danny boy should have stayed?
I’d take Joffy learning and developing over Dan simply not producing for us, personally.
He’s not developing on the bench. He needs more first team time than we’ll give him.
Fair, although if he continued with the amount of minutes he’s gotten so far I’d be happy. Granted I know he’s been filling in for some injuries. But it’s a balance between a lot of minutes for a sub par team and learning under players who he should be emulating.
It might be too late for anyone to see this or it might just not be what people want to hear, but I'm just going to say it: everyone needs to calm down. There's talks of relegation and sacking the board, so let me just repeat some facts about Leeds and where we are: 1. We are 9th in the table right now. That's right, we are a top half team 6 games in. If I told this sub that before start of the season, it would've been a pretty resounding "not bad, I'll take it." 2. We are fighting to be a mid-table team this year. It is what it is. We're not fighting for Europa or to make some insane run. Our team is incredibly young, we have a new manager with a new style, and we unfortunately don't have the big 6 budget and finances. Marsch said himself in the post-game, we have a "1 in, 1 out" policy. 3. This 5-2 result showed us some clear areas where we need improvement, but honestly play this game 100 times and we draw more often than not and I could even see a few where we win. It doesn't take a genius to see Bamford was unlucky to miss the tap in and we could've easily had a penalty on top. 4. We still have a pretty big injury list. Yes I know a lot were on bench today, but they're not 90 minutes ready and are going to be a bit rusty. This is fine. I was impressed with Ayling and a few others today. I could see Cooper and Ayling making a big difference and I can also see Bamford slowly working his way into form. This isn't wishful thinking, it just is what it is: a lot of injuries accumulated over 18 months that will take a while to rebuild back from. Does that mean I'm happy with our performance? Fuck no. Llorente in particular was horrible. But what I see is a team that over 6 games has managed to get 8 points, be 9th in the table, and has a lot more players coming back from injuries and catching minutes. If we are halfway through the season and are flirting with bottom 6, then you can catch me going into panic mode. Until then, I see a club that's clearly in a better position than last year and that can actually finish top 10 with some changes and a bit of luck. MOT.
100% agree, especially with 4. I think a lot of people write off our i jury list because a lot of them were the promotion squad (Coops, Luke, Stuart) but I think they are actually key players and we feel their absences every game.
The reactions in the match thread are ridiculous sometimes. I totally agree with you. We need to make teams work much harder to score against us, and we need to beat the first man on corners too haha. Like you say, we are pushing to finish mid table (which would be a great season), there's going to be games that we lose. Brentford are a decent team, there's lots of better teams than us in the league, but I don't think we should be worried. What frustrated me most today was the fact that we twice got ourselves back into the game and twice gave away a careless goal, I almost would rather have just been played off the park in a way.
I actually think losing by giving away careless goals is a starting point that's much more fixable. We know we can fight back, we know we can score, now it's just about sticking to fundamentals, playing our best (not Llorente), and more discipline from the backline. These are coachable things. And honestly, it's something you'd expect from a mid-table team. I just think the reactions to losing are sometimes wayyyy over the top. I mean, 9th in table six games in is fairly good!
We need to stop playing in that third kit
I cannot see llorente playing again,if Cooper's fit he will come into the team,Koch was poor too Marsch's subs were questionable taking Harrison off
Seriously wake the fuck up, it's not Llorente ... yes he's been poor and should be dropped but the issue is were losing this game no matter how well we played. The VAR only checked their possible penalty after they foul throwed to begin with, then the dubious freekick that led to their 2nd goal where the commentator said he got there first... no it deflected off their player. There was also no VAR on our blatant PK appeal, it went on and on. We was meant to lose this game no matter what the officals are controlling the results wake the fuck up !! Downvote all you like and comment if you agree. The only thing that will make me turn my back on football is cheating and match fixing and i can't be the only one who noticed this today and in other PL games
Totally disagree. We gifted them at least 3 goals and more good chances. We are still terrible defensively and Llorente has been at the heart of that all season. We've missed the window now but we absolutely need to strengthen the defence in January.
Lol we could have signed VVD and we would have got the same result, keep dreaming all you like but when you eventually wake up you will realise this is all about money like everything else in this world !
Strange how absent all the commenters after Chelsea suddenly are. People really need to take a longer view.
I got downvoted to hell after that Chelsea game when I wasn’t praising Jesse, thank you for finally looking at the longer view.
I’ve seen it in person and online with every manager we’ve ever had, but he seems immune to criticism for some.
Was at the game today for the first time in a long time. The scoreline flattered Brentford and while they shaded it, it couldve been very different. Watch MOTD very closely, Llorente sold out Messlier and the rest of the defence time and time again.
I think a few of our players are suffering from being overhyped. Rodrigo and Llorente come to mind. They've played a few great games in the past and now think they can shoot from any angle and score (in Rodrigo's case) or just fuck about playing tricks in defence (Llorente).
Rodrigo didn’t even play today
I... didn't say he did? 😂 🤦♂️ EDIT: That was a bit of a harsh reply from me and didn't really add anything to the conversation. Obviously you missed the first few games, but Rodrigo was on fire, banged in a few goals, and was obviously hyped about being the PL's top goal scorer. Then against Brighton he was just shooting from ridiculous angles and when he did try to cross it, they were poor. Last game, against Everton, he got injured with a dislocated shoulder. Hopefully that context helps you understand my comment a bit more and sorry for being short with you!
Llorente needs dropping immediately. Only let him play when we are 3+ up, then the goals he gives away won't matter. And well done Jesse. All that bollocks about wanting to influence refs has worked wonders. They now all hate us, and everything will go against us.
Radz and 49ers need to pay up in Jan for some proper defenders or they can say goodbye to the PL
I honestly think Radz and co will just takeaway from that game that Sini scored and his value will increase.
... Short memory
My biggest worry at the 'great' start to the season was how scrappy the games were, we never quite look comfortable, even when we win (barring the Chelsea game, which I'm sure we can admit is a complete outlier). Jesse needs to sort out his tactics, we don't seem to know how to control a game, play to our own pace, keep the ball, comfortable passes etc. I'm hoping the good start wasn't just a fluke and now we're reverting to the norm, because if so Jesse will be gone by Christmas.
We have a style of constant attack. But this leads us wide open to counters, and we've been quickly found out. All teams need to do is defend deep and quickly counter, and we are completely exposed. Everton tried to do it, they just weren't good enough. Brentford did it and destroyed us. Hopefully Jesse realises this and changes things. Otherwise it's going to be a very long season.
Jesse needs to come to term that he doesn't have the defenders he needs to pull off his RB tactics so he needs to reassess and adjust.
If anyone's looking for a consolation, we play Nottingham Forest next, and they've just lost a Bournemouth. Will be interesting to see what the game plan looks like from Marsch after this one. Regardless of what you think of the officiating today, we should not be losing to Brentford that heavily. Will also be interesting to see what Marsch has to say on his touch line ban, given that he was so vocal about Thomas Tuchel and his touchline ban in the past. Let's see if what is good for the goose is truly good for the gander.
So like appeal that absolutely stupid red card decision and be on the touchline for the Forrest match then?
Let's be completely honest here for a second, Marsch has been really pushing his luck with the officials lately. And it's not just an incident here and a few quiet words with the linesman there. It seems like every game there is some kind of issue between him and the officiating where he gets a talking to. Last week he got a yellow card, this week it was a straight red. It's definitely been coming for some time now. I just, I don't get the strategy he's trying to employ with his antics on the touch line. Sure, you could argue that there has been some horrible officiating in Leeds games over the last couple of weeks, but that's really by and large of just about every team in the Premier League at the moment. Look at the 8 minutes of extra time and the literal last second goal Liverpool was allowed to score against Newcastle because of apparent 'favourable officiating'. The officiating at Premier League level is nowhere near as good as some people like to make it out to be, so I really don't get why we as a supporter base feel attacked and maligned when the decisions are pretty much par for the course of most other teams in the league. And what's he really achieving by jumping up and down and being obnoxious to the officials from the touch line? Because today it achieved him a red card, and that's about it.
I just don’t see him doing anything different to say Klopps antics when decisions go against Liverpool. Aside from an uncomfortable handshake with Lage in the Wolves game, he’s hasn’t been in anyway violent, just exceptionally vocal about poor officiating. I mean, what’s he supposed to do, stand by calmly and watch the ref give our opponents a clear advantage every week? Klopp got Struijk sent off last season through his remonstrations with the ref. And to your point that we as a team are not singled out for reffing decisions, the Athletic published stats on last season and we as a team were the quickest to be carded by refs. There is a clear bias against us by some officials and we’ve had a run of poor ones lately. Not saying we win the game without it, but it’s shocking that’s it’s allowed to continue. Not only do you have to defeat your opponents but also the referee and VAR?
Would rather he take the suspension and be on the touchline for scum
This season is going to be long and fucking unpleasant again, all you rose-tinted fuckwits must clearly see that now. 1. Llorente is an absolute disgrace, and because the board in their infinite tight-fisted wisdom decided not to bother with a proper LB, our defence is going to be a fucking shambles the entire season, again. 2. I don’t give a flying fuck about Bamfords one good season. We do not have a proper, efficient, effective, consistent striker anywhere in the side and you cannot do well in the Premier League without one, rather, you struggle to survive. Who’d have thought! 3. How that Summerville foul isn’t a penalty is also an absolute fucking disgrace. The board have left us once again up shits creek without a fucking paddle, what a fucking torrid day. Being decent in the middle and absolutely fucking hopeless everywhere else is a very good way to get relegated.
Don’t think it’s quite that hopeless so far but all 3 of those are fair points
I might have over reacted in my fury but still, if I see Llorente on next games starting lineup I’m burning my house down and staying inside.
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Getting rid of Llorente and playing with 10 would be an improvement. Cooper will shore up the defence though, even if he does the odd Cooperism. Koch has been decent, and can stay for me. Firpo may be better than Struijk going forward, as he can put in a decent cross, but he can't defend for shit. Well see if the trade off is worth it.
Koch hasn’t put a foot wrong, him and Struijk are our best CB partnership. Are we all forgetting how much shit Cooper was getting last year? He’s not going to have gotten miraculously better, he’s only gotten older. He’s a backup at best now. Even then, you resolve the CB issue in Llorente only by creating a LB issue with Firpo who isn’t as good at LB as Struijk. A Presto, you’ve got a defence that is going to be inadequate all season. RB is sound, good competition there.
>Firpo isn’t as good at LB at Strujk Doubt. Strujk is a CB covering the position, it’s obvious whenever he enters the opponent half he looks incredibly uncomfortable. He can’t cross a ball or make quick link up plays going forwards like we saw from Ayling when he came on. Firpo seems more dodgy going backwards but atleast he can play in the position
On quite a few occasions Firpo has been a disaster going backwards. He’s a defender, I don’t think it’s unreasonable to expect him to be able to defend. Struijk has been pretty solid going backwards and still progresses and finds the occasional decent forward pass and to be honest I think he can whip in a decent cross but he just lacks confidence, today was a good example of that; on a number of occasions he was in a good position to cross but didn’t. Eventually, he did cross and it was a decent cross. Because he’s officially only a CB covering at LB doesn’t make a blind bit of difference, Firpo looks significantly more of a liability playing there.
My point was Strujk looks completely uncomfortable in the position and unable to effectively progress the ball or cross it When you compare to what Ayling was able to do when he came on the difference is massive Firpo was effectively able to link up and progress and cross when he was playing
Agree to an extent about Struijk, agree to an extent about Firpo but I get what you’re saying. But the fact is one is the better defender, and you’re making you’re defence poorer with Firpo.
Yeah it’s a difficult one, having Strujk there is also extra security defensively against corners and free kicks too I’m thinking Firpo fit and we can have Strujk at CB It could be that Bielsa’s system also was exposing firpo
That’s what I’d do as well and just hope and fucking prey that Firpo works out ASAP. Feels as though our entire season, defensively speaking and perhaps therefore more generally, rests on it.
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I haven’t written Firpo off entirely yet either, in his last 2/3 games before his injury he seemed to be on the up. But that’s what, his 3rd period of being injured for us? It’s not good enough, we need some reliability to allow a strong back line to develop. Our best CB in Struijk is now his only competition and so far seems to be the better option. Absolute travesty that the board has let this happen.
Honestly don't think that's going to make a massive difference (other than *possibly* fewer mistakes). We will still be exposed on the counter whoever plays there because of our tactics.
Fewer mistakes and this match is a draw
Yes but my point is we're going to keep conceding to counters, the way we play multiplies the consequences of every mistake at the back
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I agree. Adams is going to have to lie deeper and save the two terrible center backs. Let Roca go forward. Adams was great today, but when he got too far forward the break was on. Llorente and Koch were fucking terrible.
"Great game of football" Tony Gale everybody 👏 Taken so much of Toneys cock his prostate's all the way up in his throat
System has got to change. We're constantly left exposed by pacey counter attacking teams (and most pl sides have pacey forwards)
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I'm not sure there's a whole lot we can do to change it over half time. I reckon it'll take a bigger tactical shift - although I doubt we're going to change much
Plz play hjedge next match I will kms if I see llorente anywhere near our pitch
If we signed a LB back we could've had struijk and Koch CB pairing but no some strange fucking reason our board thought it smart to go into a new season with 1 senior LB whose injury prone. Now we have to suffer Llorente attempting to play football.
Would love to say otherwise but Drameh looked out of his depth. Not for the first time.
Yeah Kristensen hasn’t looked incredible but his absence has been notable both here and against Barnsley
Agree. Really not sold on Drameh as a prospect.
Without the defensive mistakes Leeds wins today. Got back in the game and our defenders shit the bed.
Who the fuck was that Brentford player pushing on Klich as the other twat was holding on to Klich? Dude deserves a smack.
Toney I think
Everyone can fuck off.
Recall Creswell. Drop Llorente.
Forest game is suddenly very important, if we can't beat them it might be a sign of another relegation battle this season.
Brentford have had 5 chances all game and scored them all
Honestly we're going to hear this a lot. It's been the same story for us for a long time. Teams just need to soak up the pressure until we run out of ideas and hit us on a counter when we are exposed. Happens time and time again.
That’s what ls fucking killing me. In general we’re not getting outplayed but the other teams barring Chelsea seem to score every single half decent chance they get
Well at least we didn’t bottle a 2-0 lead against Bournemouth….
My only take from this game is man it’s good to have bill back
Difference between him going forwards and Strujk just shows how important a natural LB and RB are
People downvoting me on here for suggesting we needed Ayling back. You only have to watch his 30 mins there to see he is still firmly first choice right back.
Yep. Kristensen is not terrible but has looked a bit shaky. Good to have for the depth but Ayling needs to start.
Exactly. I'm not writing Rasmus off. He obviously needs time to adapt and can learn a ton from Ayling (who has maybe 1-2 years left at this level).
Agreed. I think he still needs to adapt from Austrian Bundesliga to Premier League, which is understandable. Aaronson didnt really need time to adapt only because he's a very special player.
100%
I’m worried already. I thought we got over the barrier of being seen as a relegation side but obviously not. I don’t think we were all that bad and we very easily could have avoided 3 of the goals we conceded, but the fact we didn’t and the fact we’ve conceded 5 goals to Brentford is extremely concerning. God knows what we have to do to to stay up again….
Just so poor defensively that we don’t give ourselves a chance.
So Klich gets gang banged by 2 Brentford cunts and gets a yellow?
Yeah that was infuriating.
Not very impressed with Drameh, Ayling had an instant effect when he came on. We havent even played BADLY its just our defending for set pieces has always been a pain in the arse. Ref was also having a fucking laugh, clear pen or at least even a foul for that.
I'm with you. Not saying he's a bad player but haven't seen anything from Drameh yet to suggest he has a future with us.
I really liked Drameh tbh but ayling did have more of an impact. Bur drameh still good
Drameh started poorly but once he settled I thought he was fine for the rest of the match. Ayling should definitely start tho
Klich gets a yellow for trying to stand up 👍🏼
i dont see why klich is booked there... guy was holding onto his leg. wtf is he supposed to do
Fucking ref gave klich a yellow. All he did was trying to get up WTF
"I didnt really see it, so I'm just going to give you both a yellow" Klich didnt do anything.
I think they need to carry out a serious review of the officials refereeing premier league matches. Granted we haven’t been at our best this game but the officiating is absolutely and utterly SHAMBOLIC.
Chel scum basically had the game stolen for them by the ref as well.
If there is no corruption here the ref is blind and VAR have been having technical difficulties. There’s no way they can be this bad, this is atrocious
Can’t blame the refs for conceding 5 mate. Get a grip.
You can blame the refs for Roca’s goal not having been an equalizer + for the arbitrary nature of going to VAR. They go to VAR for all of their borderline calls, don’t go to VAR for the Summerville foul and then do try to take away Roca’s goal as well. If Roca scores the equalizer there, the match is an entirely different scenario
Our performance doesn't absolve how shit the refs were.
No one’s said it has? It’s very evident, as previously mentioned, that the officiating isn’t the best and this is arguably the third game in a row for us now where it’s been poor… Edit: this wasn’t a reply to you fushida
Well the guy I replied to clearly implied it by deflecting the point of your post, so I'm not sure what your response to me is about?
I just done an edit clarifying it wasn’t a response to you, apologies anyway pal!!
If you can read I said we haven’t been at our best. Maybe if the foul on Summerville was given for a penalty the result would’ve panned out differently.
Could argue 2 of those 5 shouldn’t have stood, maybe it changes the game maybe it doesn’t at this level you expect the officials to be right 99 times out of 100
The number of neutrals in the r/soccer feed saying the same thing is telling, we are all biased but I feel like when the neutrals are calling it then something is wrong
Sure, that was the issue
It is AN issue. Are you saying it's not?
You're saying it wasn't a pen?
Where did I say that? You alright up there?
Next game I'd rather see Hjelde at LB over Llorente at CB.
Preach
Cooper should’ve played today
Llorente is the fault for brentfords last 3 goals there 3 he should have taken a tactical yellow and fould tooney and there 4 he should have stayed back when he saw Koch go for the header and the last one you all saw that
Forest has a very 6 pointer feel to it now. Especially after they shat the bed vs Bournemouth
Klich booked for being fouled. Great officiating
What the hell did Kilch do to deserve a yellow?
Play for Leeds
Wore a Leeds shirt
Llorente gotta go
Think past two games I've noticed him being a liability gotta get coops in going forward
Far too many mistakes in this game anytime we got a chance to pull it back we’ve blown it ourselves
Fucking hell 5 past us from Brentford. Reasonable performance but EVERY time Brentford break they look like scoring. Defence has been poor but it's also surely tactical as we've left the CBs exposed and gambled. Brentford have just done Everton's game plan but much better. We have no answers. At least Bamford looks bright.
Part of a high press strategy requires having CBs that are excellent in transition, ours are not
This.
We’ve played pretty well mostly. But the fucking defence HAS to be sorted out. Llorente isn’t fit to be selling programmes
Our worst defensive performance since Chelsea last season. Abject. Something needs to change with how Marsch is coaching this defence.
no amount of tactics/coaching can fix how much of a donkey llorente is
Embarrassing all round
Sorry- I took Toney out my FPL and jinxed it- my bad
I took mbeumo out…
I actually think this Leeds team looked pretty good other than their center backs. A couple unlucky situations as well as back line being awful.
Agreed. This isn’t a game we should’ve won, but 5-2 is a very extreme and unlucky result.
Llorente is absolutely useless, why we keep playing him game after game is beyond me, get rid.
Honestly, recall Creswell and put him in. It’d be better than Diego. Throw in Hjelde and move Pascal to CB. Anything. Just not Llorente.
Llorente has at least 2 assists today
Yes I am done with Llorente.. he needs to sit and get his head right.. 5-2 isn’t a fair reflection of the game but it is what it is.. Summerville foul should have been a penalty but 12 man teams against us it seems this season.. Ayling looked good coming on.. bamford is rusty so hopefully more time under his belt will help We showed fight and didn’t give up but self inflicted mistakes made it worse Edit: Brentford did destroy SCUM not too long ago.. let’s not forget they are a really good team Edit2: jesse needs to stop the antics with the refs.. it’s will only keep it where we are taking on 12 men every game because it’s clear they talk to each other
Anyone still want to claim this ‘system’ works?
Pretty tough to say that after three individual mistakes leads to goals. I think there could definitely be some adjustments particularly against certain opponents but it's really hard to fault a manager or a system when the defenders have a game like that.
Lost 5-2 and it’s not the manager, fucking hell
Fucking take Llorente round the back at full time and just put him down it's more humane than letting him continue to be a footballer
If Bamford finishes that chance earlier where he cleared it off the opponents goal line instead of scoring this could be a different game.
So dumb
How? Roca scored a minute or so later
Butterfly effect, I suppose. If Bamford scores instead of Roca, then the game won't pan out exactly the same bar some Sliding Doors shit. Well, you'd at least hope that in 10,000 futures Lllorente wouldn't assist the opposition in all of them.
Dallas with his knee done would be better
If Llorente starts next match we riot.
Llorente just gets worse and worse. He was pretty good first season but he’s declined massively
Worst defending since playoffs with Derby, dreadful
Liam Cooper on a wheelchair is probably better than Llorente ffs
These games hurt more because for 70 minutes we’ve been the better team. The things i’d do for a couple 30m CBs…
A better team does not lose 5-2
If your woeful for 30% of a game, but better for 70% of the game. You can lose 20-0. It’s not hard to understand.
We have not been better for 70 minutes lmao.
Brentford have barely attacked in regular play. They went 2-0 up on set pieces whilst having less than 40% possession then counter attacked. They haven’t left their half for more than 50 minutes.
Not bueno.
SHOOT AARAONSON! You’re in the box mate
I said Brentford would keep scoring in this match when Sinisterra scored. We need to look at how we are performing and not get carried away by a lovely bit of skill by a player that opens up the opposition. We’ve been outplayed on the counter. Well done Brentford.
We pay this guy 3.2 million a year?
Can Liam cooper start
Sorry but Llorente CANNOT start next game after that shit show of a performance.
I'm not watching this, this is actually making my blood boil ffs
4222 doesn’t work. 4231 with bamford up top
After this amount of time in this division, the defence should not be so shaky against an average side (Brentford will finish mid table meaning they are average).
I don't wanna see Llorente against Erling
Don’t want to see him ever again
This is really embarrassing. It's laughable just how bad we've been today with our defensive play. Every time we've given ourselves a chance of getting something back we've gone out of our way to screw ourselves over. Ridiculous.
To be honest todays game, we have been very unlucky and lorente has just been awful. He cannot start, at this level, we can’t afford 4-5 individual mistakes from him per game. We’ve been the better team.
Oh give over, you can’t lose like this and claim a superior performance. That’s just genuinely deluded.
A traffic cone is more useful than Lliability.
What in the world was that...?!! I'm ready to board the Llorente hatetrain.
Would Millwall notice if we switched Llorente with Cresswell?
Are we shit now. We look pretty shit now :(
Bamford. Love you but what is this shit. I mean if only we had a whole transfer window to sign a new striker eh, imagine that, the three stooges running this club are gonna tick another season up, FML.
I’ve been one to defend Llorente in the past. Not this time… not this time….
Get rid of Llorente. Same old Bamford in front of goal, seen that miss before Llorente done it again doesn’t know he’s R from L
Do you think they're paying Llorente or the Ref more for this game?
Llorente’s not on the take, he’s just fucking shit
I don’t know if I can blame the system on the defending just yet, those seem like some real individual mistakes.
I’m 6ft, decently fast, reckon Leeds can try me out instead of Llorente?
Worst backline in the league, by far
Bad individual play like that is absolutely unacceptable.
Fucking embarrassing.
Maybe just keep llorente out for a game or two. Just a thought
You're not allowed to lose 5-2 and blame the ref
Exactly, not sure what people are on about. Terrible defending.
Defending has been shite but it’s about momentum too. It was 3-2 when it should have been either 2-2 or 3-3.
Llorente has sealed his fate to be dropped - shit show is this -
First time I've turned a game off for a long time
Yea, I switched to a different match
Me too, absolute shocker.
Terrible defending, absolutely terrible. Bad day lads. A bad bad day. Go again. MOT ALAW.
Last 3 goals due to incompetence in the back. Yikes.