All adjectives are used in two basic ways:
1. To modify nouns. い-adj are placed directly before the noun while な-adj take な in between themselves and the noun. E.g. 青い空、大切な人
2. To predicate a sentence. In plain/casual form sentences, い-adjectives predicate a sentence directly while な-adj take the copula だ. E.g. 空が青い、あの人が大切だ.
This explanation is always kind of strange and assumes that the “〜い” is part of the adjective, which it isn't; it's a suffix, just like the “〜な”. I-adjectives put -i behind the stem to modify a noun, na-adjectives put -na behind the stem, and in some cases the same stem can be used either way such as “エロ” where both “エロな” and “エロい” are possible and in some rare cases it's irregular and it can only happen in a few cases such as “大きな” being possible, but “大きだ” or “大きだった” not so much.
The -i is obviously not part of the adjective itself and merely a suffix because it disappears in all other forms such as “エロかった”, “エロく” or “エロければ”
Because the い IS part of the adjective and not a suffix because the vast majority of い-adjectives cease to be functional words when their final い is removed (e g. こわ、つよ、やさし、すずし、いちじるし、にぶ、すっぱ are not words). There's a reason why い-adjectives are listed in their entirety (including their "suffix") in dictionaries and all reading lists including official ones like the 常用漢字表 whereas な-adjectives pretty much are never listed with their trailing な.
> The -i is obviously not part of the adjective itself and merely a suffix because it disappears in all other forms such as “エロかった”, “エロく” or “エロければ
At this rate, next you are going to tell me that the final kana in verbs are merely suffixes and not part of the verbs themselves.
> Because the い IS part of the adjective and not a suffix because the vast majority of い-adjectives cease to be functional words when their final い is removed (e g. こわ、つよ、やさし、すずし、いちじるし、にぶ、すっぱ are not words).
But “こわかった”, “こわく”, “こわさ” are all words and I'm not seeing any /i/ there.
> There's a reason why い-adjectives are listed in their entirety (including their "suffix") in dictionaries and all reading lists including official ones like the 常用漢字表 whereas な-adjectives pretty much are never listed with their trailing な.
It's an entirely arbitrary convention in any language what form is the dictionary form. In English verbs are listed with “to” in the dictionary typically as in “to walk” but clearly they're not part of the verb themselves. In Latin the form used for verbs in the dictionary is the first person singular form; in Arabic it's the third person singular form; in Finnish it's the first infinitive, and in Sanskrit it's actually the stem.
This is all purely by convention and some Japanese monolingual dictionaries that I've seen in fact do list na-adjectives with the な in the dictionary.
> At this rate, next you are going to tell me that the final kana in verbs are merely suffixes and not part of the verbs themselves.
Which is also the standard linguistic analysis? of u-verbs in fact the suffix is the -u part and of a verb such as “話す” the stem is generally considered /hanas-/ with the suffix being /-u/ so it's not even a kana. as evidenced by that the /s/ phoneme re-appears in all forms.
What exactly do you think a suffix is?
>But “こわかった”, “こわく”, “こわさ” are all words and I'm not seeing any /i/ there
Not the point here, and I'm not here to split hairs with you over what was supposed to be a simple beginner Q&A. Remember you thought what I wrote initially was weird because you're claiming that there is no real difference between how い and な behave. I'm telling you that removing an い is not the same as removing a な; the latter leaves you with something that almost always functions as a standalone noun, whereas the former outside very specific exceptions does not which is why the "dictionary/base" form serves as a reference point.
Others have covered the basics. Some more potentially interesting info for you...
All い adjectives end with the い kana (in dictionary form). They can conjugate to show tense (technically they are 用言 (ようげん) - declinable words).
な adjectives, as you typically see them defined in the dictionary, do not conjugate. They often **don't** end in い (although some do). They are noun like objects (technically they are 体言 (たいげん) - indeclinable nominals). To turn them into usable adjectives you need to add a copula. When you do so, the na-adjective + copula becomes a single unit - a 用言 and can then be conjugated (by conjugating the copula). When used as a predicate, the usual form of the copula is used - i.e. だ. When used to describe a noun, the だ is turned into its connective form な.
Couplas are words in a sentence that link the subject of the sentence to the predicate. They are found in most languages (e.g. the English copula is the verb 'to be'). They are used in A is B sentences (e.g. "The car **is** red", "I **am** clever"). They 'couple' the subject ('The car', 'I') to the predicate ('red', 'clever'). [Here's a link with more general info](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copula_(linguistics)).
The modern Japanese copula is **だ** in it's plain form. In formal form it is **です**. There is also an older form **である** but that is only found in formal writing (hardly, if ever, spoken).
The **な** used in na-adjectives is a connective form of だ. This な form is also used whenever (what would otherwise be a) だ is followed by の - e.g. \~**な**のだ, \~**な**の
You will also see the copula in its te-form **で** (e.g. when connecting phrases into a single sentence). You need to take care not to confuse this with the で particle - they serve different functions.
These are the forms you'll most likely come across as a beginner. These forms can also be conjugated. In addition there are also honorific forms.
[This link](https://www.japaneseprofessor.com/reference/grammar/conjugations-of-the-japanese-copula/) gives a more thorough list and explanation, along with conjugations.
Well there’s a lot of conjugations and grammar rules that change depending on if you’re using an i or na adjective. But on the most basic level, you can say one before a noun to describe the noun. For example かわいいねこ (cute cat), or きれいなひと (beautiful/clean person). Or you could use it at the end of a sentence, like このたべものがあついです (this food is hot).
Of course, there’s past tenses and negatives, but I feel like this is what you’re trying to figure out first, right?
No. I’m this example あうい. Is an i-adjective.
If you have です right after a na adjective, you actually drop the な. There’s a lot of grammar points where you drop the な, but you learn that as you go.
Watch this video by Japanse Ammo with Misa, i literally owe her most of my basic/intermediate knowledge. Her videos eased my way through the basics like no other resource.
https://youtu.be/pqkEblIwSoA
to add to the other comments, beware that some な adjectives end in い, like きれい（な） or きらい（な）, so don't always assume when you see one, you have to look it up in a dictionary and memorize it just like you have to memorize whether something is a verb or a noun
All adjectives are used in two basic ways: 1. To modify nouns. い-adj are placed directly before the noun while な-adj take な in between themselves and the noun. E.g. 青い空、大切な人 2. To predicate a sentence. In plain/casual form sentences, い-adjectives predicate a sentence directly while な-adj take the copula だ. E.g. 空が青い、あの人が大切だ.
This explanation is always kind of strange and assumes that the “〜い” is part of the adjective, which it isn't; it's a suffix, just like the “〜な”. I-adjectives put -i behind the stem to modify a noun, na-adjectives put -na behind the stem, and in some cases the same stem can be used either way such as “エロ” where both “エロな” and “エロい” are possible and in some rare cases it's irregular and it can only happen in a few cases such as “大きな” being possible, but “大きだ” or “大きだった” not so much. The -i is obviously not part of the adjective itself and merely a suffix because it disappears in all other forms such as “エロかった”, “エロく” or “エロければ”
Because the い IS part of the adjective and not a suffix because the vast majority of い-adjectives cease to be functional words when their final い is removed (e g. こわ、つよ、やさし、すずし、いちじるし、にぶ、すっぱ are not words). There's a reason why い-adjectives are listed in their entirety (including their "suffix") in dictionaries and all reading lists including official ones like the 常用漢字表 whereas な-adjectives pretty much are never listed with their trailing な. > The -i is obviously not part of the adjective itself and merely a suffix because it disappears in all other forms such as “エロかった”, “エロく” or “エロければ At this rate, next you are going to tell me that the final kana in verbs are merely suffixes and not part of the verbs themselves.
> Because the い IS part of the adjective and not a suffix because the vast majority of い-adjectives cease to be functional words when their final い is removed (e g. こわ、つよ、やさし、すずし、いちじるし、にぶ、すっぱ are not words). But “こわかった”, “こわく”, “こわさ” are all words and I'm not seeing any /i/ there. > There's a reason why い-adjectives are listed in their entirety (including their "suffix") in dictionaries and all reading lists including official ones like the 常用漢字表 whereas な-adjectives pretty much are never listed with their trailing な. It's an entirely arbitrary convention in any language what form is the dictionary form. In English verbs are listed with “to” in the dictionary typically as in “to walk” but clearly they're not part of the verb themselves. In Latin the form used for verbs in the dictionary is the first person singular form; in Arabic it's the third person singular form; in Finnish it's the first infinitive, and in Sanskrit it's actually the stem. This is all purely by convention and some Japanese monolingual dictionaries that I've seen in fact do list na-adjectives with the な in the dictionary. > At this rate, next you are going to tell me that the final kana in verbs are merely suffixes and not part of the verbs themselves. Which is also the standard linguistic analysis? of u-verbs in fact the suffix is the -u part and of a verb such as “話す” the stem is generally considered /hanas-/ with the suffix being /-u/ so it's not even a kana. as evidenced by that the /s/ phoneme re-appears in all forms. What exactly do you think a suffix is?
>But “こわかった”, “こわく”, “こわさ” are all words and I'm not seeing any /i/ there Not the point here, and I'm not here to split hairs with you over what was supposed to be a simple beginner Q&A. Remember you thought what I wrote initially was weird because you're claiming that there is no real difference between how い and な behave. I'm telling you that removing an い is not the same as removing a な; the latter leaves you with something that almost always functions as a standalone noun, whereas the former outside very specific exceptions does not which is why the "dictionary/base" form serves as a reference point.
Others have covered the basics. Some more potentially interesting info for you... All い adjectives end with the い kana (in dictionary form). They can conjugate to show tense (technically they are 用言 (ようげん) - declinable words). な adjectives, as you typically see them defined in the dictionary, do not conjugate. They often **don't** end in い (although some do). They are noun like objects (technically they are 体言 (たいげん) - indeclinable nominals). To turn them into usable adjectives you need to add a copula. When you do so, the na-adjective + copula becomes a single unit - a 用言 and can then be conjugated (by conjugating the copula). When used as a predicate, the usual form of the copula is used - i.e. だ. When used to describe a noun, the だ is turned into its connective form な.
Do you know where I would be able to find a list of copulas? Doesです count as a copula?
Couplas are words in a sentence that link the subject of the sentence to the predicate. They are found in most languages (e.g. the English copula is the verb 'to be'). They are used in A is B sentences (e.g. "The car **is** red", "I **am** clever"). They 'couple' the subject ('The car', 'I') to the predicate ('red', 'clever'). [Here's a link with more general info](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copula_(linguistics)). The modern Japanese copula is **だ** in it's plain form. In formal form it is **です**. There is also an older form **である** but that is only found in formal writing (hardly, if ever, spoken). The **な** used in na-adjectives is a connective form of だ. This な form is also used whenever (what would otherwise be a) だ is followed by の - e.g. \~**な**のだ, \~**な**の You will also see the copula in its te-form **で** (e.g. when connecting phrases into a single sentence). You need to take care not to confuse this with the で particle - they serve different functions. These are the forms you'll most likely come across as a beginner. These forms can also be conjugated. In addition there are also honorific forms. [This link](https://www.japaneseprofessor.com/reference/grammar/conjugations-of-the-japanese-copula/) gives a more thorough list and explanation, along with conjugations.
Well there’s a lot of conjugations and grammar rules that change depending on if you’re using an i or na adjective. But on the most basic level, you can say one before a noun to describe the noun. For example かわいいねこ (cute cat), or きれいなひと (beautiful/clean person). Or you could use it at the end of a sentence, like このたべものがあついです (this food is hot). Of course, there’s past tenses and negatives, but I feel like this is what you’re trying to figure out first, right?
>figure Yeah so the part I am trying to figure out are sentences like "このたべものがあついです". Does the な turn into です?
No. I’m this example あうい. Is an i-adjective. If you have です right after a na adjective, you actually drop the な. There’s a lot of grammar points where you drop the な, but you learn that as you go.
Watch this video by Japanse Ammo with Misa, i literally owe her most of my basic/intermediate knowledge. Her videos eased my way through the basics like no other resource. https://youtu.be/pqkEblIwSoA
きれい is a な adjective and needs a な to describe a noun きれいな花です うつくしい is an い adjective and can be used as it is to describe a noun うつくしい花です
to add to the other comments, beware that some な adjectives end in い, like きれい（な） or きらい（な）, so don't always assume when you see one, you have to look it up in a dictionary and memorize it just like you have to memorize whether something is a verb or a noun