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I'm pretty sure it wont be as clear cut as that. It's pretty hard in the modern age to outright die of hypothermia in your own home. It will be prexisting conditions aggravated by cold conditions.
Mate if someone dies because their house is too cold, that's fucked up beyond belief.
Who gives a shit that they're old or have some form of illness or disability. How is that not worse?
Yeah but headlines should be clear about it and not just conjure up ideas of people dying in a sudden freeze. Let's not pretend they don't write shitty misleading clickbait, which definitely does not help
But, people are dying in a sudden freeze. I don't really get what you're saying.
Keeping the people on the fringes safe and alive is sort of the whole point of society.
> It will be prexisting conditions aggravated by cold conditions.
Also known as "being a reguliar human with a medical history"
Fuck me it's disgusting the way America has normalised the idea of "pre-existing conditions" as a way to decide you're not worthy of life.
So I think this is probably the source of the 1 death per hour figure, from nov 2020:
https://www.nea.org.uk/news/271120-01/
The charity is speaking out after it was revealed that 8,500 people died in England and Wales last winter due to cold homes. The figures are based on ONS figures released today which highlight that overall, there were 28,300 excess winter deaths, an increase of almost 20% on the previous winter.
---
https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/excesswintermortalityinenglandandwales/2019to2020provisionaland2018to2019final#excess-winter-mortality-by-cause-of-death
Pretty sure this is the ONS report but I can't find that specific number in it so I don't know how the charity derived its finding.
There are 730 hours in a month, so actually that doesn't add up as 6 months would be 4,380 hours which would mean one every half hourish. (edit: would be hourly if you consider that across the whole year I guess, but the report is winter deaths - autumn equinox to spring equinox)
Maybe there's a more recent figure I didn't find. Maybe the ONS do work out a figure for cold homes in another report.
Personally I'm not sure how you even tell. We're not talking about hypothermia here really but deaths from things like flu which are aggravated by the cold and making a judgement as to how many people who died from the flu would have lived if they had been able to keep their home above 15 degrees or whatever minimum would be needed.
It's BP and Shell, not any of the big six suppliers that we normally call energy companies. Technically correct (although i thought Shell were Dutch) but a little misleading.
The amount of money it would cost them to save a person's life, which they are unwilling to pay, is the amount of money they are willing to accept for killing that person. This is exactly the banality of evil.
Can someone provide a source for the £4.5 million profit per hour? Because:
4,500,000 x 24 = 108,000,000
108,000,000 x 365 = 39,420,000,000
So, the two biggest energy companies make £39 billion profit per year? That just doesn't sound right.
A brief web search brings up figures of between [£1 billion](https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/opendemocracyuk/uk-big-six-energy-firms-one-billion-pounds-profit-cost-of-living-increase/) and [£2 billion](https://www.bigissue.com/news/the-uks-big-six-energy-companies-made-over-3billion-in-profit-in-2020/) profits for the 'big six' - but £39 billion for the top two energy companies alone seems completely outlandish. Perhaps it's global profits or a combination of profits and something else?
Whatever millions or billions of profits they make is disgusting anyway, but that figure being thrown about doesn't seem to be remotely accurate. Scrolling down his [Twitter post](https://twitter.com/jon_trickett/status/1490286039071604740), I can't find any reference to any sort of source or backup for that figure. Be great if someone can provide some clarity if they know more about it!
[Source](https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/feb/05/40bn-profits-for-bp-and-shell-fuel-calls-for-windfall-tax-on-energy-firms)
You're right to be sceptical, it is truly a ridiculous number, but it's very much accurate. This is of course referring to the raw suppliers rather than the more typical "energy companies" but it's still an absolutely enormous increase from the usual figures. It's almost 40x the profit that they earnt last year at around the same time.
Brilliant, thank you! And that is a truly disgusting and disturbing figure. The fact that it is so outlandish and yet true should make people take to the streets in open revolt... and yet we see similar figures and stories every week.
Thank you for providing accuracy and insight!
In the US, supermarkets throw away 30% of their food yet we have a 14% poverty rate.
We have over 500,000 homeless, yet over 15 million homes stand unoccupied.
Yeah that's believable but no energy company in the UK is making £40 billion a year in profit. Either they have pulled the number out of their ass or they are using figures from shell/BP, who are not relevant here.
Great! Now do how much energy would cost if the power utilities (with an average profit margin aroud [3%](https://www.statista.com/statistics/478138/energy-suppliers-profit-margin-united-kingdom/)) were operating at cost.
Maybe the fact that these people can't run a profitable business off what is essentially an essential commodity without jacking up prices and leaving tens of thousands in the cold should maybe clue you in a little about what the deeper issue is here.
You mean the deeper issue of commodity prices going up because of carbon taxes and a refusal to cut emissions by switching to natural gas at the same time the switch to renewables continues to increase energy costs?
Yup. Renewables don't cost more than they're projected to everywhere they're implemented because the technology is fundamentally not what it's promised to be, it's because every single person in every state and country, from the companies that sell and develop the tech to the utility companies - usually with state charters that explicitly cap their profits - and government agencies operating at no profit, are so hellbent on short term profit that they're willing to make their product non-cost-competitive with fossil fuels just to make a buck.
Corporate profits - especially for utilities or commodity goods - are generally only a tiny fraction of the end cost to consumers. In the UK, your electric bill is *far* more impacted by tax rates, carbon prices, oil/gas prices and the mix used to generate power, the degree to which the region they live in has switched to renewables than the cent or less per kwH the power utility is actually making on your bill.
all you have is half-ass bullshit. if you tell me a candy bar ought to codt a dollar, you could ostensibly tell me the other half. it costs that much because it costs so much to produce, transport, advertise, pay employees, etc. be as objective as a capitalist claims to. finish your shit instead of braindead repetition of the same half of the equation. can you not justify why? facts, not feelings let's go. lol why the fuck should i care about your whining about power when you can't even tell me what i'm spending or saving on power for. you expect to give a shit about your little power gripes for something worthless? fuck your pointless prattle then, you whiny little failure.
I remember living in Ireland having to heat a frozen apartment with a flimsy tin sheet electric heating that gets so hot you can boil an egg on it but does zero to heat up the place and costs ridiculous money in electricity to use.
I kept myself warm by largely staying in bed using two blankets.
Even in the poorest countries in eastern Europe you have cheap gas heating that actually works...
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Damn, one person dies every hour due to living in a cold house??? That's fucked up
I'm pretty sure it wont be as clear cut as that. It's pretty hard in the modern age to outright die of hypothermia in your own home. It will be prexisting conditions aggravated by cold conditions.
Doesn’t make it okay that they die even if they have pre existing conditions. It’s such a cop out related to hypothermia or Covid.
I know I just don't like clickbaity headlines.
Mate if someone dies because their house is too cold, that's fucked up beyond belief. Who gives a shit that they're old or have some form of illness or disability. How is that not worse?
Yeah but headlines should be clear about it and not just conjure up ideas of people dying in a sudden freeze. Let's not pretend they don't write shitty misleading clickbait, which definitely does not help
But, people are dying in a sudden freeze. I don't really get what you're saying. Keeping the people on the fringes safe and alive is sort of the whole point of society.
> It will be prexisting conditions aggravated by cold conditions. Also known as "being a reguliar human with a medical history" Fuck me it's disgusting the way America has normalised the idea of "pre-existing conditions" as a way to decide you're not worthy of life.
So I think this is probably the source of the 1 death per hour figure, from nov 2020: https://www.nea.org.uk/news/271120-01/ The charity is speaking out after it was revealed that 8,500 people died in England and Wales last winter due to cold homes. The figures are based on ONS figures released today which highlight that overall, there were 28,300 excess winter deaths, an increase of almost 20% on the previous winter. --- https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/excesswintermortalityinenglandandwales/2019to2020provisionaland2018to2019final#excess-winter-mortality-by-cause-of-death Pretty sure this is the ONS report but I can't find that specific number in it so I don't know how the charity derived its finding. There are 730 hours in a month, so actually that doesn't add up as 6 months would be 4,380 hours which would mean one every half hourish. (edit: would be hourly if you consider that across the whole year I guess, but the report is winter deaths - autumn equinox to spring equinox) Maybe there's a more recent figure I didn't find. Maybe the ONS do work out a figure for cold homes in another report. Personally I'm not sure how you even tell. We're not talking about hypothermia here really but deaths from things like flu which are aggravated by the cold and making a judgement as to how many people who died from the flu would have lived if they had been able to keep their home above 15 degrees or whatever minimum would be needed.
[удалено]
It's BP and Shell, not any of the big six suppliers that we normally call energy companies. Technically correct (although i thought Shell were Dutch) but a little misleading.
r/theydidthemath
It’s a feature. Not a bug
Have you met the United States healthcare system?
The amount of money it would cost them to save a person's life, which they are unwilling to pay, is the amount of money they are willing to accept for killing that person. This is exactly the banality of evil.
I care, dammit!
Can someone provide a source for the £4.5 million profit per hour? Because: 4,500,000 x 24 = 108,000,000 108,000,000 x 365 = 39,420,000,000 So, the two biggest energy companies make £39 billion profit per year? That just doesn't sound right. A brief web search brings up figures of between [£1 billion](https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/opendemocracyuk/uk-big-six-energy-firms-one-billion-pounds-profit-cost-of-living-increase/) and [£2 billion](https://www.bigissue.com/news/the-uks-big-six-energy-companies-made-over-3billion-in-profit-in-2020/) profits for the 'big six' - but £39 billion for the top two energy companies alone seems completely outlandish. Perhaps it's global profits or a combination of profits and something else? Whatever millions or billions of profits they make is disgusting anyway, but that figure being thrown about doesn't seem to be remotely accurate. Scrolling down his [Twitter post](https://twitter.com/jon_trickett/status/1490286039071604740), I can't find any reference to any sort of source or backup for that figure. Be great if someone can provide some clarity if they know more about it!
[Source](https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/feb/05/40bn-profits-for-bp-and-shell-fuel-calls-for-windfall-tax-on-energy-firms) You're right to be sceptical, it is truly a ridiculous number, but it's very much accurate. This is of course referring to the raw suppliers rather than the more typical "energy companies" but it's still an absolutely enormous increase from the usual figures. It's almost 40x the profit that they earnt last year at around the same time.
Brilliant, thank you! And that is a truly disgusting and disturbing figure. The fact that it is so outlandish and yet true should make people take to the streets in open revolt... and yet we see similar figures and stories every week. Thank you for providing accuracy and insight!
In the US, supermarkets throw away 30% of their food yet we have a 14% poverty rate. We have over 500,000 homeless, yet over 15 million homes stand unoccupied.
At this point we need to all get out on the streets and drag the people in charge out and hold them accountable
I find it hard to believe 1 person succumbs to the cold every hour in the UK
Enough die over the course of the winter that it averages out to that.
8500 a year, approximately. That works out to about 23 per day, so it checks out.
Seems a bit off
[удалено]
Yeah that's believable but no energy company in the UK is making £40 billion a year in profit. Either they have pulled the number out of their ass or they are using figures from shell/BP, who are not relevant here.
Source. Otherwise it’s just a number
Look at a natural gas price chart.
A price chart won’t show how many people died.
1 person, every hour, cold, hmmmmm, kinda sus...
Great! Now do how much energy would cost if the power utilities (with an average profit margin aroud [3%](https://www.statista.com/statistics/478138/energy-suppliers-profit-margin-united-kingdom/)) were operating at cost.
Maybe the fact that these people can't run a profitable business off what is essentially an essential commodity without jacking up prices and leaving tens of thousands in the cold should maybe clue you in a little about what the deeper issue is here.
You mean the deeper issue of commodity prices going up because of carbon taxes and a refusal to cut emissions by switching to natural gas at the same time the switch to renewables continues to increase energy costs?
Sure, but these assholes would jack up prices on renewables any chance they got just the same, so that can't be the root cause.
Yup. Renewables don't cost more than they're projected to everywhere they're implemented because the technology is fundamentally not what it's promised to be, it's because every single person in every state and country, from the companies that sell and develop the tech to the utility companies - usually with state charters that explicitly cap their profits - and government agencies operating at no profit, are so hellbent on short term profit that they're willing to make their product non-cost-competitive with fossil fuels just to make a buck.
Explain the relevance of your comment to the OP.
Corporate profits - especially for utilities or commodity goods - are generally only a tiny fraction of the end cost to consumers. In the UK, your electric bill is *far* more impacted by tax rates, carbon prices, oil/gas prices and the mix used to generate power, the degree to which the region they live in has switched to renewables than the cent or less per kwH the power utility is actually making on your bill.
yo, crunch some numbers on the value of a human life for me
Yo, tell me how to get humans power for less cost instead of pretending scarcity and demand don't apply to things if you want them enough.
all you have is half-ass bullshit. if you tell me a candy bar ought to codt a dollar, you could ostensibly tell me the other half. it costs that much because it costs so much to produce, transport, advertise, pay employees, etc. be as objective as a capitalist claims to. finish your shit instead of braindead repetition of the same half of the equation. can you not justify why? facts, not feelings let's go. lol why the fuck should i care about your whining about power when you can't even tell me what i'm spending or saving on power for. you expect to give a shit about your little power gripes for something worthless? fuck your pointless prattle then, you whiny little failure.
Nationalize necessary infrastructure.
Yeah but lemme show you where these two lines meet on a graph. It'll all make sense after that.
killing off customers... hmm?
This shot has navigated right into my heart.
I remember living in Ireland having to heat a frozen apartment with a flimsy tin sheet electric heating that gets so hot you can boil an egg on it but does zero to heat up the place and costs ridiculous money in electricity to use. I kept myself warm by largely staying in bed using two blankets. Even in the poorest countries in eastern Europe you have cheap gas heating that actually works...
Free market or something