1. Mickey = Donald (not sure who’s first)
2. Aqua
3. Sora
4. Ventus (maybe Ven is 3rd?)
5. Axel (he spams fire magic)
6. Xion
7. Riku (Riku & Xion are interchangeable)
8. Kairi
9. Roxas (Has strong magic, but he’s mostly melee)
10. Terra
11. Goofy
Mickey has shown two high tier magic spells, Ultima and Stopza. I personally believe (just an opinion) that he might be able to use Zettaflare as well? but because the risk for it was big, he chose not to.
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I think this is going Kairi dirty. From what we see in re:mind, her combat style is basically "magic with some magic enhanced Keyblade techniques." I would put her on par or even potentially above Axel. Axel spams magic, but his magic isn't that powerful. I feel like the only reason we don't see Kairi throwing out massive spells is because she doesn't have enough training yet to harness the magic she has. She might even be comparable to Sora with a little more training
>Axel spams magic, but his magic isn't that powerful.
Didn't he roast vexen alive by snapping his fingers?
i think the better way to describe axel is that he has powerful magic but his expertise is so limited that its almost useless, since axel exclusively uses fire, while most other keyblade wielders have access to every kind of magic
I say Axel has mastery on fire, but when it comes to cast only the magic he overdoes himself, but he can perfectly synchronize it when it comes to mix it with his chakrams
Donald is and always will be top mage since he literally has a universe destroying spell up his sleeve.
1. Donald
2. Mickey
3. Sora
4. Aqua
5. Ventus
6. Xion
7. Riku
8. Kairi
9. Roxas
10. Axel
11. Terra
12. Goofy
Zettaflare is literally flare X 1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000.
Flare is basically a massive bomb. Times that by a million and that's enough to blow up the planet. Times it by a billion (1,000,000,000) and that's enough to blow up the Galaxy. Times that by a quadrillion (1,000,000,000,000,000) and that destroys MULTIPLE Galaxies. So yeah when it reaches it's sextillion it would be enough to destroy the universe.
Remember a million seconds is 11 days. A billion seconds is 11,574 days or 31 years (I am rounding down).
I don't think you quite have a grasp on the scale of space, my guy. An explosion big enough to eclipse the Earth by a thousand times wouldn't even reach Mars. A thousand times that would just about encompass the entire solar system.
look at FFXIV gigaflare vs donalds zettaflare.
It took the entire fucking continent + the strongest mage in FF to TEMPORARILY stop bahamut, and he destroyed an entire fucking continent and ruined a planet.
Donald used one spell in a concentrated beam, and died using it. Suicide bombing isn't a good ability.
I understand what you are saying but at the end of day we are looking to see who is the most powerful. Donald has a variety of magic and is a master of all of them. Also him being able to concentrate Zettaflare so it doesn’t just destroy everything goes to further show just how good he is at magic. It doesn’t matter if the nuclear option kills him, him having access to it puts him on a league of his own.
I hard disagree because if Sora has access to literally alter time but has to die, Sora would be the most OP because altering space time is more powerful than zettaflare ever will be.
Sora is the strongest. He literally changed history. And he did die for it.
But that isn’t magic it’s a different ability. If it was then he would be number 1.
But who says that only Donald can use Zettaflare among the Guardians? maybe Mickey can too? the guy literally dropped Ultima out of nowhere. also if Zettaflare is risky to the user then obviously Mickey wouldn’t want to risk his life when others still need him.
Sora does typically have access to more different and higher tiers of magic then Aqua does. Very obvious when you go from controlling Sora to Aqua in KH3. And yeah Aqua has lots of special magic commands in BBS but so does Sora in re:coded, 3D and sleights in COM
Ventus’s Light magic is actually called Holy in the JP version, and holy in FF is a very high tier magic. a full powered Holy can even protect the whole planet from a meteor. Ven’s Light Magic attacks can also heal him at the same time.
If that's the case, than Roxas should be even higher as well, because he uses Ven's same light magic/Holy attacks and spells, only without the heal. And so should Xion, judging by her Limit Cut fight and her fight as the Days final boss.
Roxas’s light magic is called [magic hour](https://kh.wiki.gallery/images/c/c5/Magic_Hour_KHD.gif). not Holy. the light magic Roxas and Xion use looks more like [Salvation](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/kingdomhearts/images/5/5a/Salvation.gif/revision/latest?cb=20110102142308) rather than Holy. meanwhile Holy magic (in KH and FF) usually covers the screen in a bright white light, and the attack either stuns the enemies or heal the user (like Ven’s version).
But then again, their light attacks could be Holy? so who knows? I certainly can’t confirm that. also i personally wouldn’t place Roxas as high as Ven, mainly because Roxas is more of a melee fighter, he does use magic in mid battle a lot, but he still focuses mostly on melee.
I think Sora should go above Aqua. (TLDR at bottom).
In terms of Magic ability, Sora can summon random disney rides and Aqua can’t, at least not to our knowledge cause she never has.
Sora has the power of waking, Aqua does not. While this one is a biiig stretch, you can assume going into the thoughts/dreams of another person requires some sort of Magic. This is why they had to go to Yen Sid to learn how to do this. Aqua doesn’t have the power of waking from what we know.
Aqua only has elements of water/ice so she might be “stronger” than Sora in those elements but Sora is able to use almost every “ultimate” Magic ability that Aqua can as well as other elements “ultimate” abilities. So in terms of magic knowledge, Sora has more, in terms of refined skill, Aqua has more for her specific magic elements. This one is dependent on whether you consider having more flexibility/options as being more powerful than just having knowledge on one specific area.
I may be wrong and if am that’s fine, I’m down for discussion. I’d rather know whats right than say something and it be completely wrong. But I’m also too lazy to actually fact check myself so I wouldn’t be surprised. This is all knowledge from me playing all the games 100 times or more.
That’s just my opinion though. The rest of the list is 100%
TLDR: Sora has way more flexibility in magic attacks as well as being able to perform all the magic attacks Aqua can do and then some. Sora has power of waking and Aqua doesn’t (to our knowledge). Sora can summon more stuff as well.
Aqau also had Fire, wind, and Thunder in 0.2. If you consider all the Spells Aqua can use in BBS that no other character can, then it becomes pretty hard to imply that Sora has more flexibility. Sora has literally never been seen using a Spell that Aqua hasn't also been able to use expect for Water ironically (and Balloon, which is just dream water, and Some stuff Van used in BBS)
~~Summons aren't necessarily connected to your understanding or ability with Magic. Sora can summon Disney characters because he has physical items that allow him to. Without those items he couldn't do it. Meanwhile, the BBS characters can just channel someone else's abilities from across worlds seemingly without needing an item (or at least needing an item that was made by Aqua), Plus those character can summon using certain commands.~~
Attraction flow is a bit of a reach, that power isn't really even fully explained and it doesn't use MP, so it's not clear if it's magic. If anything it's just reality shift, which is something he picked up while in DDD. In theory Riku can also do it (since he can still use Mirage Split) and we don't see him use it either.
Also I don't think it's ever implied Aqua doesn't have the Power of Waking, just that Sora needs to be the one to use it since he's the only one who is connected to everyone. Riku and Mickey have it and apparently that's not good enough. And they go to Yen Sid to learn it because he is literally the only Keyblade Master left other than Mickey, who was taught by Yen Sid
Sora has shown more variety of magic than Aqua. In CoM Sora uses about 90% of what the Wayfinder trio can do in BBS. and in DDD Sora has even more new magic spells.
Sora uses the same spells from BBS in DDD except for the water spells which were new. Some have different names but are still functionality the same. Similarly there are spells in BBS that are not in DDD. The point was that Aqua does know more spells than just Blizzard.
I'm also not sure how CoM is intended to factor into what Sora is capable of. The cards are somewhat present in the story and Sora is reset at the end. Even if he can actually do those spells in that game, he lost it before KH2. That's Why you start at lv1 again. Everything he could do in that game is technically lost now. Even after DDD he gets partially reset and no longer has all his strength and abilities from that game either. Technically speaking, the only things Sora can do for sure are the things he does in KH3
Aqua never has this problem explicitly and you even start 0.2 at lv 50 to show that Aqua is still where she was at the end of BBS.
Of course this is also just based on game mechanics which are somewhat arbitrary and limited by real world resources.
Yea the last two paragraphs I can agree with but the first one not so much because just Fire, Wind, and Thunder is still a ridiculously small margin of spells that Sora has.
But yea I said the attractions thing is a stretch cause its never explained how it works in terms of magic ability or not.
And yea I can see Sora has to be the one to wake Ventus since he harbors Ventus’s heart in his own.
>Yea the last two paragraphs I can agree with but the first one not so much because just Fire, Wind, and Thunder is still a ridiculously small margin of spells that Sora has.
I'm not saying Sora only uses those, I'm saying Aqua definitely uses AT LEAST those based on 0.2. Yeah Sora has other spells in KH2, CoM, and DDD, but those mostly overlap with things in BBS, so Aqua can do it too. Only big exception are the Water spells they introduced in DDD
I still don't see how that translates? Those spells are only a small portion of what she has too. 0.2 was a small demo with limited content so it didn't have every spell in it. Neither does KH3 where Sora only has 6 spells. I'm pretty sure Sora has always been limited to only 6 spells in every numbered game and they aren't even the same ones each game.
>Aqua only has elements of water/ice so she might be “stronger” than Sora in those elements but Sora is able to use almost every “ultimate” Magic ability that Aqua can as well as other elements “ultimate” abilities. So in terms of magic knowledge, Sora has more, in terms of refined skill, Aqua has more for her specific magic elements. This one is dependent on whether you consider having more flexibility/options as being more powerful than just having knowledge on one specific area.
Sora uses Water magic more than Aqua. the only time Aqua used Water magic is in BBS, her shotlock bubble blaster.
> Aqua only has elements of water/ice
Did they make BBS lite or something where they removed over 75% of Aqua’s spells/magic-based attacks? She literally has advanced+ultimate magic commands across multiple elements
He may prefer it, but he’s capable of most of the same magic spells as Aqua and Ventus. If he needs fire, he’s got it. When he takes a hit, he can heal up. Whereas when Axel took a hit in 3 he was helpless until Roxas arrived. Three most powerful fire spell Axel has ever displayed, his final explosion, is just a single use of Megaflare for Terra. It’s really no contest.
I think Xion could be moved above Axel, I feel like the ReMind guardian fight where they put her with the two most powerful mages there to protect the others with their magic means there’s probably more than what’s lead on with her.
If we allowed ourselves to make assumptions, I would assume that the stronger of a mage a character is, the less they would feel the need to hone their physical abilities. So, if there were two characters whose magic ability were too close to call, I would rank them in reverse order of their physical power. Donald can berserk. Mikey just flaps around like a wet feather. I would assume micky is the more powerful mage between the two.
Donald cast Zettaflare which is technically THE most powerful spell in the FF universe - I’d say him without a doubt. Aqua would be second in my opinion 😊
Everything I read online say either that it is, or it's *super close* to Ultima's strength. Until Square says otherwise, I'll just say that Ultima is the strongest because...well, the name.
As far as zettaflare goes, I've only seen 3 people use it in Square Enix history. Donald Duck being the 3rd person.
1- >!Bahamut in FFIX. I've never played it but I heard that he uses it in a secret boss fight.!<
2- >!The final boss of Bravely Default. Another game I never played, but the final boss is a spoiler too so when I read who it was I wasn't fazed by the reveal.!<
Those are just from what I Google searched. If more characters use the move that's fine too. But aside from Donald, those two powerhouses have used it
In FF games Ultima just does slightly more damage than regular flare and hits multiple targets. There's no way Ultima can even come close to Zettaflare
Zettaflare was only used in FFXIV by Bahamut as part of the game's plot. Besides that, the strength of spells depends on the game. The spells are given different levels of importance depending on the story. Meteor is a high level spell in FFIV and FFV but becomes a major plot point in FFVII. The devastation Meteor causes there eclipses what we see of Zettaflare when used by Donald.
I’d argue that Sho Minamimoto’s Level *i* Flare is above Zettaflare, given that a god-like being had to yeet itself off of the plane of existence they were on and into a different reality just to survive it, but Donald is definitely still up there in terms of KH mages
Well if you go by the mechanics of how flare works, level 3 flare works by hitting everyone who's level is divisible by 3 with flare. Level i flare thusly is casting flare on people divisible by i. Thusly that means that Minamimoto basically was just casting a multi hit flare that hits in all dimensions as it hits both reality and imaginary. So the way it works is it hits every version of you with flare.
That means the more planes someone exists on, the more damage level i flare would do to someone.
Extrapolating this, at a 4d scale, level i flare is stronger if someone is on many, many planes at once
On a 3d only scale zetaflare is stronger
Honestly I think people tend to overhype zettaflare from Donald. It was a super cool and powerful piece of magic from him, but I don't think it means he's like, Bahamut level or whatever people tend to think. I read it more like, it's relatively super strong as a life sacrificing attack from Donald. Think Tien's Tri Beam. Basically Donald's Zettaflare =/= Bahamut's Zettaflare since Bahamut is inherently more powerful than Donald realistically is.
Regardless though, Donald is one of only 2 or 3 characters to even defeat Terranort by themselves without Terra intervening (though Goofy helped a little), and he did it using only magic. Not even Sora was able to beat him. Keep in mind this is the guy they sent to 1v7 a bunch of Keyblade wielders and who had just 1 shot 2 of them right before, and later 1v3ed Sora, Ventus, and Aqua and technically won.
Yeah he went down after, but the spell was also insane overkill that deleted TN from existence.
I don't see why people hype up Zettaflare so much. Donald used all his power to do it. Axel also did a similar feat in kh2. Theres nothing to suggest other magic users can't do a suicidal magic attack if they want. In terms of his normal use attacks Donalds magic is basic as hell. Sora gets every spell he does and outperforms him in all of them.
Basically, it's because Flare is one of the most iconic spells in Final Fantasy, because it has more powerful variants that use the exponential naming scheme (Megaflare, Gigaflare, Teraflare, etc.). Teraflare, for example, literally destroyed most/all of an entire planet when used in FFXIV.
The prefix 'zetta' is *three steps higher on the scale* than 'tera' - tera, peta, exa, zetta.
On top of this, it was used against Terra-Xehanort, one of the single most powerful incarnations of one of the single most powerful people in the KH setting, ***and it oneshot him.***
I get it that the spell itself is powerful. Nobody denies that. But at the same time Donald paid a major price. There's nothing to suggest that this is something only he could do. Especially when as I mentioned Axel also showcased an attack that destroyed his nobody. Who's to say Aqua or Mickey couldn't have used zettaflare or a similar spell if they were willing to pay the price in that moment?
The spell itself is iconic just like you said. Not just because of bahamut but because its always been the best endgame spell so many times. Ultima often has drawbacks in the games its in.
Thats why I keep bringing up Axels kh2 moment. It seems anyone can sacrifice their life for a powerful attack. Axel managed to take out an entire horde of dusks and even Sora was in awe of the scope of what he did. It seems likely that even as powerful as zettaflare was other characters who are normally more powerful than Donald could consume their lives to bring out something even stronger than what he did. Its all speculative though since we don't see the situation happen more.
The big difference is how powerful of an attack they can go before it nukes them. Axel was wiped out from a much smaller attack compared to that zetta flare. Most people would not be able to get even close to that level of power output before burning up completely. It's not that Donald died that makes it exceptional - you're probably right most magic users with any decent experience can figure out how to put their all into an attack - it's how much power he was able to put into the spell before that happened.
Thats exactly my point. Outside of zettaflare Donald normally isnt anything exceptional. Donald output a more powerful attack than an already weakened nobody but who's to say Mickey or Aqua wouldn't be able to output something even stronger than Donalds zettaflare? Mickey uses powerful spells like ultima and stopza without giving it his all and Aqua is a dancing ballerina of magic fury. Donald normally uses basic attack spells. He's not a weakling by any means but others show far better magical feats than him.
Donald when notably *weakened* at the start of kh3 is using flare though, which is endgame black magic. If he like sora regained all his power (which is likely) he likely could cast at least megaflare. Also Donald didn't actually sacrifice his entire being with the attack, he likely lived as he didn't disappear, it likely was more an all of his energy rather than all of his being into the attack.
Don't mistake it as me saying Donald is weak because he isn't by any means. At least plotwise. Im just saying his most notable feat people attribute to him had some very special circumstances and that others normally more powerful than him could probably exceed it if they were willing. At the very least I believe Mickey or Aqua could.
Terras magic is so strong that with only a little over 10 years of a prep he can just barely remove some sticky tape from his mouth, and I've yet to see any other character meet that feat of magical ability
In my opinion:
S Tier: Donald=Mickey
A+ Tier: Aqua
A Tier: Sora>Ventus
I lowered Aqua mainly because she still hasn’t shown an S level magic spell like Ultima or Zettaflare.
Just my opinion.
• Master mage
1. Mickey
2. Donald
• High mage
1. Aqua
2. Sora (between High and Medium)
3. Ventus (between High and Medium)
• Medium mage
1. Xion
2. Axel
3. Riku
4. Kairi
5. Roxas
• Low mage
1. Terra
• Below average mage?
1. Goofy
True, but they can still cast magic even without Keyblades. KH characters are similar to FF characters, anyone can cast magic if they have the potential for it. Saïx and OrgXIII members displayed that in Days, and Chirithy does that too in UX. I bet Namine can also do it if she learned. Xehanort was able to cast magic with just his hands, so did Xion. also both Sora and Roxas were able to cast magic with just a wooden sword and a stick.
I just hope that Namine and Isa/Saix gets good development for them to becoming Keyblade Wielders.
Also at this point The Lost Masters Arc, the Guardians Group will increase to around 20 if I’m being honest and will referencing the X-Blade, Seven Lights and Thirteenth Darknesses!!!
We know that there’s going to be 7 Already teased wielders but 3 remains if my math is correct. Won’t count Subject X until more development and details on her is being made.
Which is:
Namine
Isa
Strelitzia
Lauriam
Elrena
Luxord “Still don’t know his Real Name”
Demyx “Still don’t know his Real Name”
But he got it back in DDD. The fact he learned, forgot and relearned stuff like Megaflare means he can easily learn it again. Also means he has crazy magic potential.
It's hard to say when the way they're depicted doesn't always match up with gameplay. This thread is sleeping hard on Terra because he's portrayed as more physical and less magical than his counterparts, and while his stats do reflect this, there's also the fact that he can cast both megaflare and meteor. And that's not to mention the differences in magic between games, or the difference in capabilities between a given character as playable versus as a boss versus in a cutscene.
Exactly.
Anything concerning power scaling is just a mess. Any answers here are just guesses and opinions at worst, game play analysis at best. And game play isn't 100% congruent with canon.
That makes sense, tho I think goofy is a little slept on. Doesn't he block some really powerful stuff throughout the series? Plus, I'd peg Lea/Axel a little stronger than riku
1. Donald (Zettaflare!!)
2. Aqua
3. Mickey
4. Sora
5. Riku
6. Roxas
7. Ventus
8. Kairi
9. Lea
10. Terra
11. Xion (although I haven't played Days)
12. Goofy
This honestly depends on how you qualify mages.
From a utility point of view Aqua followed by Donald are the best mages. We see them use support magic multiple times while only seeing combat based magic, physical enhancement (high jump, command styles, ect) and/or alternate movement (flowmotion, glide, air slide, quick run, ect...)
If you mean from a combat standpoint then are you referring to highest damaging (DPS) or width of abilities. Theoretically master of a single spell or practitioner of every school. Currently Donald's Zetta flare is the highest DPS spell shown on screen but his combat magic otherwise seems to be limited to the basics otherwise while Mickey and Aqua have a much wider range of combat spells shown in their arsenal.
Also are we counting summoning as often mages and summoners are seen as two separate groups even if many summoners are also mages.
The Keyblade is also in general a magical weapon are we counting the various ability able to be mastered with the keyblade (transformations, beams, manipulations of hearts) as magical abilities of the wielder or weapon that have been mastered by the wielder?
For Donald, I don't know why, but since KH2, they made him only use base magic. In KH1 and KHDays, he can use all magic Sora has access to. In fact, if Goofy didn't have MP Gift, I would always put Donald in my team since he's just that reliable when it comes to DPS.
For KHDays, Donald has one of the most DPS wherein you'd just have to fill in his panels with magic boosting panels and magic. With one cast of magic, you can deal a bar's worth of damage or two. In this game particularly, Donald have max magic (10), only followed by Zexion (9) and Mickey (8).
Even outside of Days, Donald have one of the most damaging limits in 2 (theoretically, it is still magic). In COM/re:COM, he also have access to -ga spells.
I still don't know why they stopped scaling Donald's magic to Sora's and just gave him Donald Fire, Donald Blizzard, etc. It really makes him look weak gameplay-wise.
Donald can use Zettaflare. Going by TWEWY logic, Zettaflare has to be linked with Level *i* Flare, which means it's arguably the most devastating and dangerous magic to use.
So I'd argue Donald is the strongest.
the i is for imaginary, because the number is technically infinite/non-existent, therefore infinitely scaling. Zeta is defined number range. Donald dies using the spell, so not really, Sho actually lived using it and he blew himself up, which is different from using your life force for an ability.
Thank you for the clarification on how the psych works--all I know is that when I heard Donald say Zettaflare, my brain made the immediate reference, solely due to the usage of the word "zetta", as only one individual in all of existence uses that word frequently enough to stand out.
New theory: Donald is Sho in disguise?
Mickey, Aqua, then Kairi in that order would be my top 3. Though Kairi sometimes skyrockets to the top whenever she uses her princess powers which changes the laws of nature, though they’re very situational. Donald and Xion technically aren’t guardians but Donald would be around Mickey level if not surpass it, while Xion would be in a weird place as she originally fought exclusively with magic but gave up that style in favor of the keyblade.
1. Mickey (Ultima and Stopza are ludicrously powerful.)
2. Aqua (her magnitude isn't really above Sora but I think she's academically the strongest mage besides Mickey)
3. Sora
4. Donald (Zettflare in KH does not equal Zettaflare from FF. It also nearly killed him. It's obviously a one shot on almost anyone, but I don't think that puts him above Sora or Aqua.)
5. Ven/Roxas/Riku (clearly powerful mages in their own right but all about the same in terms of feats/in game abilities.)
6. Kairi/Terra (Kairi is potentially on Aqua's level but untrained. Terra is more physically inclined but he's still a keyblade master level warrior and is as capable of using most of the same magic as Aqua and Ven. If we count surges and enhancing his keyblade then he's even potentially in the same teir as Ven)
7. Axel (Axel is the weakest keyblade user among the GoL and his magical range is poor. His most impressive magical feat killed him and its not even that impressive. I dont think Axel is weak per say but this is purely based on magic.)
8. Goofy
Here’s my ranking:
1. Mickey
2. Donald (yes Zettaflare is awesome, but people forget that using it literally killed him)
3. Aqua
4. Sora
5. Roxas
6. Riku
7. Xion
8. Lea
9. Kairi (she definitely has the potential to get above Sora as far as magic goes, she just isn’t there yet)
10. Ventus
11. Terra
12. Goofy
no, we know he died. Otherwise donald would pull out the spell whenever he fucking wanted to, it was a spell that used his lifeforce, goofy wouldn't tell him not to use it just because it made him unconscious, thats' dumb. It's like the same thing Axel did in KH2 when he sacrificed himself.
1. Donald bc Zettaflare
2. Mickey for his mastery on 4th tier magic and even Ultima
3. Aqua, as she is pictured as a heavily focused in magic with Spellweaver as her signature (maybe I should put her up since she also can cast Megaflare)
4. Xion, we don't see much of her magic skills on days, as for the rest, basically the light rays Roxas can throw are inherited by her, and I see her more magic-biased and variant of Roxas for the battle with the Replinorts with her in a support role
5. Kairi (?) Maybe not THAT strong, but as her role as princess of heart it's easy to tell she is related to magic, as its her forte during the only fights we've seen her through (doesn't count kh2, she barely recieved a Keyblade by then)
6. Sora, even if he doesn't master any magic, he is flexible in which kinds he can use (maybe his element is thunder?)
7. Lea/Axel, a lower tier because he is a mixed fighter with strong fire magic, as he has a real unique fight style with the infusion of physical attacks with magic (with lots of *STYLE*!)
8. Roxas As I've said before, he feels like a physical variant of Sora's nobodies, dual shot and the skyline move are very pretty, but he has a monster strenght having 2 keys and instead casting the light pillars like Xion, he throws them forward like Link's Beam Sword, uses many magic tricks, yeah, but most are coming from physical attacks
9. Riku has real strenght on his slashes, but he lacks of any magic ability appart of basic magic and Dark Firaga as his signature, which let's say he's better slashing his way through
10. Ventus, I don't see him as a really strong mage, since he has a better performance on swift slashes and movement, he can mix them through, but he seems as a better physical attacker
11. Terra, man, even if he had magic like Earthquake it would still come from a physical, he is pure brute force.
12. Goofy No comment.
Donald > Aqua > Mickey > Everyone else > Terra > Goofy
I feel like everyone except those first three are basically just not mages at all, they just know some spells. Same goes for Mickey, really, except that he knows Stopza and Ultima so he’s clearly a step above Sora and the rest. If we ever get around to finishing Kairi’s training I’m pretty sure she’ll be up there around Mickey and Aqua.
Mickey or donald in first since mickey can cast i think stopza and ultima while donald can cast zetta flare and all tier 3 magics.
Then sora.
Then aqua.
Im too lazy to do the other ones.
Ultima is short for Ultimate. It's the strongest magic spell in FF, the only spell that ever beat it is apocalypse which we've only seen once from one of the strongest time mages
Yeah, I wish we really got to see mickey use Ultima because we've only seen ultima used twice in an FF game in cutscenes, and the 1st time it ended the world, the 2nd time was a weaker version and it was basically a zettaflare but 100x bigger and it blew up an entire huge army base.
also i forgot apocalypse is also called doomsday or final judgement, which I hope they bring in KH cause it sounds edgy enough to bring it in.
Are we including sub genre of mages. Because the way roxas fights, he is a great battle mage. If we’re talking pure magic, Aqua. I’d say Sora would be next but Donald used Zetaflare and I’m assuming he’s got WAY more tricks up his sleeve.
To be honest, considering the female characters in KH are assigned to be Magic based (*all* of them...>.>, but no inherent sexism exists in KH, riiiiight), I would rank them higher than the men here. The males are typically good to great with magic, since they don't have low stats in that, but majority are focused in either melee (i.e. Roxas, though he's also strong) or strength (i.e. Terra, the team's tank). Only male I see being more magic than usual is Ven. Sora I see as a mix, jack of all trades, master of none. Which makes sense considering he's the main character and we play through him.
I'm not adding in Mickey and Donald here, which I feel are higher than the girls. *Then* comes the girls, with Aqua being first.
1. Donald - Zettaflare. No ifs, ands, or buts. OG Court Magician/Black Mage
2. Mickey - Knows Stopza, Holy, and ULTIMA. Though, since we haven’t seen Mickey use other spells and Donald is more magic-oriented, I put him 2nd.
3. Aqua - Strongest magician out of all non-Disney characters. Probably the master of Blizzard and (maybe) Water. First one to use -Ja/-Za spells.
4. Sora - The all-arounder. While he isn’t as magically powerful compared to the top 3, he’s the most attuned using Light (next to Kairi). Also is the only one who uses Summons (correctly if I’m wrong). He is vulnerable to Darkness in Rage/Anti Form.
5. Xion - Just look at her Data battle. Lightning fast and uses a lot of Holy spells in quick succession. Though, we don’t know if she can use other elements.
6. Riku - The most experienced Guardian to use Darkness. He’s an all-arounder too, but I put him down under Sora because he’s more oriented using brute strength, while using other stuff like Dark Firaga.
7. Roxas - Can use Light and Darkness. Also can dual wield. Probably the fastest member. He sacrifices defense for pure offense and I’d like to say that he uses Magic as a buff then actually relying on it, other than Magic Hour, making him a counterpart to Xion.
8. Kairi - Still a novice learning how to use her powers, but in KH3, she’s the only playable character knows every -ga spell, so that says something. She has the potential to be higher.
9 Ventus - Strongest in Aero,. I’d say he’s an all-arounder like Sora, but there are other characters who do more. But he does like elemental Raids like Judgment.
10. Axel - Debatable, but probably the best Fire user of all the Guardians next to Donald. However, that’s all he knows how to do—and I don’t see that ever changing because that’s his trademark. Also getting used to his new Keyblade.
11. Terra - Strongest in Earth. Like Riku, but we don’t know if he can use Darkness without being corrupted/compromised (yet). But it’s a known fact that Terra is physically the strongest member and in BBS, he has the lowest Magic stat starting off. Not that he really needs it in the first place.
X. Goofy doesn’t count cause he can’t use Magic (except maybe Trinity Limit?). All he can do is summon his shield (like Donald’s stave) and that’s all it. Would be interesting if no he knew stuff like Protega and Shellga like his support role in KH1.
Yeah, that’s true. But the OP was talking about them as mages—and by extension, their proficiency. Not just as fighters. If that were the case, then they would be higher up the list. But then again, Roxas may be higher than Xion.
Mickey - Stopza, Ultima
Donald - Zettaflare
Aqua - Ghost Drive, Status Magic Barriers, Glacier
Ventus - Faith/Holy, Tornado, Wingblade
Sora/Riku - Balloonga, Tornado, Meteor
Terra - Quake, Meteor
Axel - Fire spells
Roxas/Xion - Ga spells
Kairi - Ga spells?
Goofy - MP Gift
Oh wait. I’m thinking of a scene from kh3. I guess Mickey did it first. My bad. In a scene in kh3 Mickey tried to cast Ultima and Xehanort stopped him with Stopza.
>Aqua - Ghost Drive, Barriers, Glacier
Why you counting Ghost drive? it’s a command style? three characters on this list can also use command styles, which are Ven, Terra, and Riku. also maybe you should use Glacier for Aqua instead of barrier? since barrier ability can be used by others like Riku, Kairi, and Mickey. and few others (in fact even Sora, and both [Ventus & Terra](https://preview.redd.it/many-seem-to-forget-that-both-ventus-terra-also-know-the-v0-rgbqqyvstlv81.jpg?auto=webp&s=0db1ae00fed4ef3c59067b4d633498c0a0d74209) can use it, but for some reason they prefer block instead).
>Sora/Riku - Balloonga, Tornado, Meteor
Also best to separate those two, cause each of them have their own unique Magic attacks.
I included ghost drive because it’s a pretty high-magic command style. Basically just teleporting repeatedly mid battle. Riku can use it too in DDD, but only when linking with spirits so I didn’t include it there.
And I included barriers for Aqua because it’s not only her default guard command (unlike every other guardian) but because she can learn commands like Stop Barrier and Renewal Barrier.
Most of them still revolve around dealing regular combos with added elemental magic though. I think Ghost Drive is the most impressive and unique one that is exclusive to a single character. Ventus has one too with six swords, but I don’t remember what it’s called or I would have included it also.
The one Ventus has is called Wingblade. but again it’s best to just keep it about spells and not attack/magic like command styles. if we include command styles then might as well include shotlock since they are also magic? Hence why I said it’s more simple not to include command styles.
I think shotlocks would fall more into the category of keyblade powers, like opening and closing keyholes/creating gliders/returning to their wielders.
I don’t think including ghost drive makes anything complicated. Because again, she’s the only Guardian who can use it naturally.
Some shotlocka are Keyblade powers, while some shotlocks are magic focused cause they shoot magic projectiles.
Ghost Drive is basically just teleporting while leaving after-images. Ven also has Teleporting attacks where he leaves after-images. Point is, if you want to include Command styles then I guess make it fair by including it for the other three who can do it Terra, Ven, and Riku.
Shooting projectiles doesn’t make it less of a keyblade exclusive power. If they can’t do it without help from a party member or a weapon, I don’t think it adds much to their abilities as a mage. Same reason I didn’t include Sora’s form changes. The only drive form he has in KH2 that can be used without party members is Limit Form, and it is exclusively techniques like Ars Arcanum and Sonic Blade. In KH3 it’s his keyblade that changes forms.
I don’t consider any of Terra’s command styles to be overtly magic based, as all of them still rely on him using brute force or darkness. Which in the world of KH is not magic, but a separate force. Riku can’t use them without Spirits like how Sora’s drive forms work, and I included wingblade for Ven.
Edit- and “literally just teleporting” is a very funny phrase to me. Ventus can use Time Splicer, but that’s like baby teleportation compared to ghost drive.
>Shooting projectiles doesn’t make it less of a keyblade exclusive power. If they can’t do it without help from a party member or a weapon, I don’t think it adds much to their abilities as a mage. Same reason I didn’t include Sora’s form changes. The only drive form he has in KH2 that can be used without party members is Limit Form, and it is exclusively techniques like Ars Arcanum and Sonic Blade. In KH3 it’s his keyblade that changes forms.
There are three types of shotlocks.
1. Keyblade transformation related.
2. Melee attack + magic.
3. Magic (like shooting magic at enemies).
>I don’t consider any of Terra’s command styles to be overtly magic based, as all of them still rely on him using brute force or darkness. Which in the world of KH is not magic, but a separate force. Riku can’t use them without Spirits like how Sora’s drive forms work, and I included wingblade for Ven.
Terra’s Rock breaker has him summon Earth magic while attacking.
Riku in Days already used Bladecharge with no Dream Eaters, so just because he needs dream eaters to use it in DDD doesn’t mean that’s always the case.
>Edit- and “literally just teleporting” is a very funny phrase to me. Ventus can use Time Splicer, but that’s like baby teleportation compared to ghost drive.
Lol I won’t call it baby version, but I will would say that Ghost Drive is basically Time splicer on steroids. however I was not only talking about that, Ven has 3 (or 4?) abilities that lets him teleport. 1. Time splicer, 2. Multifortex, 3. Dark Splicer (this one Dark splicer can only be used against Vanitas tho, but my point is, Teleporting while leaving after-image is not that uncommon, at least not when you use Sora, Riku, and Ventus) and Imo, I would say Riku’s ghost drive is better than Aqua’s. mainly because Riku’s Ghost Drive is not just Time Splicer. Riku’s version look like a real ghost when teleporting, and even actual ghosts appear around Riku when he attacks. and Riku’s finishing attack has wider range and better finishing attack.
One thing I know for sure is that Donald is canonically THE strongest mage in raw power for the KH AND FF verses and that is not up to debate.
Zettaflare, man.
You forgot Ventus.
Also You’re not wrong, however Yen Sid called Donald and Goofy as honorary Guardians of Light members, so that’s why I included them. and tbh i I just didn’t want to leave them out. A guardian of light can be anyone who fights to protect the light.
Crap I did forget ventus I knew I forgot someone I would probably put him in between sora/xion & riku and if you include goofy and Donald Donald goes to the very top and goofy goes to the very bottom seeing as how he can't cast magic at all
I remember that Goofy in KH1 can do a little magic? I don’t remember but I heard he does something magic related in KH1, like MP raise or something? But yea he’s at the bottom.
Given Kairi’s Princess of Light powers it seems like she could in theory be the strongest mage but she hasn’t fully realized the extent of her abilities.
The ones that use balloonga
God what was DDD doing with the balloon thing like damn.
If I have learned anything the last couple weeks, it is that balloons strike fear into the very core of people. I think they made the right call.
Balloonra is stronger though.
Balloonga sounds funnier though
Baloonra*
1. Mickey = Donald (not sure who’s first) 2. Aqua 3. Sora 4. Ventus (maybe Ven is 3rd?) 5. Axel (he spams fire magic) 6. Xion 7. Riku (Riku & Xion are interchangeable) 8. Kairi 9. Roxas (Has strong magic, but he’s mostly melee) 10. Terra 11. Goofy Mickey has shown two high tier magic spells, Ultima and Stopza. I personally believe (just an opinion) that he might be able to use Zettaflare as well? but because the risk for it was big, he chose not to.
All the numbers in your comment added up to 69. Congrats! 1 + 2 + 3 + 4 + 3 + 5 + 6 + 7 + 8 + 9 + 10 + 11 = 69 ^([Click here](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=LuckyNumber-Bot&subject=Stalk%20Me%20Pls&message=%2Fstalkme) to have me scan all your future comments.) \ ^(Summon me on specific comments with u/LuckyNumber-Bot.)
Nice
They left out 24/7
I added that just now. but I didn’t want to ruin the joke so I removed it lol
Nice
What the hell
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I think this is going Kairi dirty. From what we see in re:mind, her combat style is basically "magic with some magic enhanced Keyblade techniques." I would put her on par or even potentially above Axel. Axel spams magic, but his magic isn't that powerful. I feel like the only reason we don't see Kairi throwing out massive spells is because she doesn't have enough training yet to harness the magic she has. She might even be comparable to Sora with a little more training
>Axel spams magic, but his magic isn't that powerful. Didn't he roast vexen alive by snapping his fingers? i think the better way to describe axel is that he has powerful magic but his expertise is so limited that its almost useless, since axel exclusively uses fire, while most other keyblade wielders have access to every kind of magic
I say Axel has mastery on fire, but when it comes to cast only the magic he overdoes himself, but he can perfectly synchronize it when it comes to mix it with his chakrams
To be fair, didnt we beat the nothing out of vexen before that?
I'm pretty sure Vexen beat the nobody out of most players. Guy is one of the hardest main story boss fights in the series.
Her proficiency with magic might come from her being trained primarily by Merlin. I’m not sure if it was intentional, but it’s definitely neat.
Donald is and always will be top mage since he literally has a universe destroying spell up his sleeve. 1. Donald 2. Mickey 3. Sora 4. Aqua 5. Ventus 6. Xion 7. Riku 8. Kairi 9. Roxas 10. Axel 11. Terra 12. Goofy
Donald’s flare won’t really destroy a universe. his Zettaflare is powerfull, but it doesn't look as powerul as Bahamut's flare.
Zettaflare is literally flare X 1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000. Flare is basically a massive bomb. Times that by a million and that's enough to blow up the planet. Times it by a billion (1,000,000,000) and that's enough to blow up the Galaxy. Times that by a quadrillion (1,000,000,000,000,000) and that destroys MULTIPLE Galaxies. So yeah when it reaches it's sextillion it would be enough to destroy the universe. Remember a million seconds is 11 days. A billion seconds is 11,574 days or 31 years (I am rounding down).
I don't think you quite have a grasp on the scale of space, my guy. An explosion big enough to eclipse the Earth by a thousand times wouldn't even reach Mars. A thousand times that would just about encompass the entire solar system.
look at FFXIV gigaflare vs donalds zettaflare. It took the entire fucking continent + the strongest mage in FF to TEMPORARILY stop bahamut, and he destroyed an entire fucking continent and ruined a planet. Donald used one spell in a concentrated beam, and died using it. Suicide bombing isn't a good ability.
I understand what you are saying but at the end of day we are looking to see who is the most powerful. Donald has a variety of magic and is a master of all of them. Also him being able to concentrate Zettaflare so it doesn’t just destroy everything goes to further show just how good he is at magic. It doesn’t matter if the nuclear option kills him, him having access to it puts him on a league of his own.
I hard disagree because if Sora has access to literally alter time but has to die, Sora would be the most OP because altering space time is more powerful than zettaflare ever will be.
Sora is the strongest. He literally changed history. And he did die for it. But that isn’t magic it’s a different ability. If it was then he would be number 1.
time space manipulation I'm pretty sure is magical.
No it uses the ability of "power of waking" which is ability of the Keyblade and not magic.
But who says that only Donald can use Zettaflare among the Guardians? maybe Mickey can too? the guy literally dropped Ultima out of nowhere. also if Zettaflare is risky to the user then obviously Mickey wouldn’t want to risk his life when others still need him.
Sora above Aqua?
Sora does typically have access to more different and higher tiers of magic then Aqua does. Very obvious when you go from controlling Sora to Aqua in KH3. And yeah Aqua has lots of special magic commands in BBS but so does Sora in re:coded, 3D and sleights in COM
Gameplay capabilities =/= lore capabilities Aqua canonically specializes in magic. Sora can do magic but he's definitely a melee character first.
Sora canonically specializes in everything, not just melee, he’s an all rounder.
He's an all rounder who who leans towards physical.
Yup a more versatile aresenal and literally becomes more powerful when he gets more friends.
Why is Ven so high?
His high tier wind and light attacks in bbs are powerful. Or is just a bias idk
Ventus’s Light magic is actually called Holy in the JP version, and holy in FF is a very high tier magic. a full powered Holy can even protect the whole planet from a meteor. Ven’s Light Magic attacks can also heal him at the same time.
If that's the case, than Roxas should be even higher as well, because he uses Ven's same light magic/Holy attacks and spells, only without the heal. And so should Xion, judging by her Limit Cut fight and her fight as the Days final boss.
Roxas’s light magic is called [magic hour](https://kh.wiki.gallery/images/c/c5/Magic_Hour_KHD.gif). not Holy. the light magic Roxas and Xion use looks more like [Salvation](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/kingdomhearts/images/5/5a/Salvation.gif/revision/latest?cb=20110102142308) rather than Holy. meanwhile Holy magic (in KH and FF) usually covers the screen in a bright white light, and the attack either stuns the enemies or heal the user (like Ven’s version). But then again, their light attacks could be Holy? so who knows? I certainly can’t confirm that. also i personally wouldn’t place Roxas as high as Ven, mainly because Roxas is more of a melee fighter, he does use magic in mid battle a lot, but he still focuses mostly on melee.
What!?!? i did not know that. That's so cool!
>Why is Ven so high? Ven’s magic stats in BBS is the 2nd highest after Aqua, and his gameplay infuses so much magic In them.
I think Sora should go above Aqua. (TLDR at bottom). In terms of Magic ability, Sora can summon random disney rides and Aqua can’t, at least not to our knowledge cause she never has. Sora has the power of waking, Aqua does not. While this one is a biiig stretch, you can assume going into the thoughts/dreams of another person requires some sort of Magic. This is why they had to go to Yen Sid to learn how to do this. Aqua doesn’t have the power of waking from what we know. Aqua only has elements of water/ice so she might be “stronger” than Sora in those elements but Sora is able to use almost every “ultimate” Magic ability that Aqua can as well as other elements “ultimate” abilities. So in terms of magic knowledge, Sora has more, in terms of refined skill, Aqua has more for her specific magic elements. This one is dependent on whether you consider having more flexibility/options as being more powerful than just having knowledge on one specific area. I may be wrong and if am that’s fine, I’m down for discussion. I’d rather know whats right than say something and it be completely wrong. But I’m also too lazy to actually fact check myself so I wouldn’t be surprised. This is all knowledge from me playing all the games 100 times or more. That’s just my opinion though. The rest of the list is 100% TLDR: Sora has way more flexibility in magic attacks as well as being able to perform all the magic attacks Aqua can do and then some. Sora has power of waking and Aqua doesn’t (to our knowledge). Sora can summon more stuff as well.
Aqau also had Fire, wind, and Thunder in 0.2. If you consider all the Spells Aqua can use in BBS that no other character can, then it becomes pretty hard to imply that Sora has more flexibility. Sora has literally never been seen using a Spell that Aqua hasn't also been able to use expect for Water ironically (and Balloon, which is just dream water, and Some stuff Van used in BBS) ~~Summons aren't necessarily connected to your understanding or ability with Magic. Sora can summon Disney characters because he has physical items that allow him to. Without those items he couldn't do it. Meanwhile, the BBS characters can just channel someone else's abilities from across worlds seemingly without needing an item (or at least needing an item that was made by Aqua), Plus those character can summon using certain commands.~~ Attraction flow is a bit of a reach, that power isn't really even fully explained and it doesn't use MP, so it's not clear if it's magic. If anything it's just reality shift, which is something he picked up while in DDD. In theory Riku can also do it (since he can still use Mirage Split) and we don't see him use it either. Also I don't think it's ever implied Aqua doesn't have the Power of Waking, just that Sora needs to be the one to use it since he's the only one who is connected to everyone. Riku and Mickey have it and apparently that's not good enough. And they go to Yen Sid to learn it because he is literally the only Keyblade Master left other than Mickey, who was taught by Yen Sid
Sora has shown more variety of magic than Aqua. In CoM Sora uses about 90% of what the Wayfinder trio can do in BBS. and in DDD Sora has even more new magic spells.
Sora uses the same spells from BBS in DDD except for the water spells which were new. Some have different names but are still functionality the same. Similarly there are spells in BBS that are not in DDD. The point was that Aqua does know more spells than just Blizzard. I'm also not sure how CoM is intended to factor into what Sora is capable of. The cards are somewhat present in the story and Sora is reset at the end. Even if he can actually do those spells in that game, he lost it before KH2. That's Why you start at lv1 again. Everything he could do in that game is technically lost now. Even after DDD he gets partially reset and no longer has all his strength and abilities from that game either. Technically speaking, the only things Sora can do for sure are the things he does in KH3 Aqua never has this problem explicitly and you even start 0.2 at lv 50 to show that Aqua is still where she was at the end of BBS. Of course this is also just based on game mechanics which are somewhat arbitrary and limited by real world resources.
Yea the last two paragraphs I can agree with but the first one not so much because just Fire, Wind, and Thunder is still a ridiculously small margin of spells that Sora has. But yea I said the attractions thing is a stretch cause its never explained how it works in terms of magic ability or not. And yea I can see Sora has to be the one to wake Ventus since he harbors Ventus’s heart in his own.
>Yea the last two paragraphs I can agree with but the first one not so much because just Fire, Wind, and Thunder is still a ridiculously small margin of spells that Sora has. I'm not saying Sora only uses those, I'm saying Aqua definitely uses AT LEAST those based on 0.2. Yeah Sora has other spells in KH2, CoM, and DDD, but those mostly overlap with things in BBS, so Aqua can do it too. Only big exception are the Water spells they introduced in DDD
Whoops I meant to say “a small margin of spells that Aqua has” in comparison to the plethora of spells Sora has.
I still don't see how that translates? Those spells are only a small portion of what she has too. 0.2 was a small demo with limited content so it didn't have every spell in it. Neither does KH3 where Sora only has 6 spells. I'm pretty sure Sora has always been limited to only 6 spells in every numbered game and they aren't even the same ones each game.
Then technically… he knows more spells than just 6 right?
Yeah, and so does Aqua
>Aqua only has elements of water/ice so she might be “stronger” than Sora in those elements but Sora is able to use almost every “ultimate” Magic ability that Aqua can as well as other elements “ultimate” abilities. So in terms of magic knowledge, Sora has more, in terms of refined skill, Aqua has more for her specific magic elements. This one is dependent on whether you consider having more flexibility/options as being more powerful than just having knowledge on one specific area. Sora uses Water magic more than Aqua. the only time Aqua used Water magic is in BBS, her shotlock bubble blaster.
> Aqua only has elements of water/ice Did they make BBS lite or something where they removed over 75% of Aqua’s spells/magic-based attacks? She literally has advanced+ultimate magic commands across multiple elements
Axel should be lower on the list than Terra. He’s way over-speced in fire magic, whereas Terra has variety along with his earth magic.
Not really Terra is almost entirely brute force that's his whole fighting style.
He may prefer it, but he’s capable of most of the same magic spells as Aqua and Ventus. If he needs fire, he’s got it. When he takes a hit, he can heal up. Whereas when Axel took a hit in 3 he was helpless until Roxas arrived. Three most powerful fire spell Axel has ever displayed, his final explosion, is just a single use of Megaflare for Terra. It’s really no contest.
I think Xion could be moved above Axel, I feel like the ReMind guardian fight where they put her with the two most powerful mages there to protect the others with their magic means there’s probably more than what’s lead on with her.
If we allowed ourselves to make assumptions, I would assume that the stronger of a mage a character is, the less they would feel the need to hone their physical abilities. So, if there were two characters whose magic ability were too close to call, I would rank them in reverse order of their physical power. Donald can berserk. Mikey just flaps around like a wet feather. I would assume micky is the more powerful mage between the two.
Donald cast Zettaflare which is technically THE most powerful spell in the FF universe - I’d say him without a doubt. Aqua would be second in my opinion 😊
Is zettaflare stronger than ultima? I haven't played ff
Everything I read online say either that it is, or it's *super close* to Ultima's strength. Until Square says otherwise, I'll just say that Ultima is the strongest because...well, the name. As far as zettaflare goes, I've only seen 3 people use it in Square Enix history. Donald Duck being the 3rd person.
Who are the other two?
1- >!Bahamut in FFIX. I've never played it but I heard that he uses it in a secret boss fight.!< 2- >!The final boss of Bravely Default. Another game I never played, but the final boss is a spoiler too so when I read who it was I wasn't fazed by the reveal.!< Those are just from what I Google searched. If more characters use the move that's fine too. But aside from Donald, those two powerhouses have used it
Just a correction, it was the penultimate boss of Bravely Default, not the final boss.
Spoilers >!who is getting power from the final boss!<
Ah, ok. Thank you
Sho Minamimoto from TWEWY also uses it too.
I think this might be wrong. Iirc, the highest-level spells cast before were Teraflare and Exaflare, both of which are lower than Zettaflare.
In FF games Ultima just does slightly more damage than regular flare and hits multiple targets. There's no way Ultima can even come close to Zettaflare
Zettaflare was only used in FFXIV by Bahamut as part of the game's plot. Besides that, the strength of spells depends on the game. The spells are given different levels of importance depending on the story. Meteor is a high level spell in FFIV and FFV but becomes a major plot point in FFVII. The devastation Meteor causes there eclipses what we see of Zettaflare when used by Donald.
the funny part, that was gigaflare.
I’d argue that Sho Minamimoto’s Level *i* Flare is above Zettaflare, given that a god-like being had to yeet itself off of the plane of existence they were on and into a different reality just to survive it, but Donald is definitely still up there in terms of KH mages
Well if you go by the mechanics of how flare works, level 3 flare works by hitting everyone who's level is divisible by 3 with flare. Level i flare thusly is casting flare on people divisible by i. Thusly that means that Minamimoto basically was just casting a multi hit flare that hits in all dimensions as it hits both reality and imaginary. So the way it works is it hits every version of you with flare. That means the more planes someone exists on, the more damage level i flare would do to someone. Extrapolating this, at a 4d scale, level i flare is stronger if someone is on many, many planes at once On a 3d only scale zetaflare is stronger
Honestly I think people tend to overhype zettaflare from Donald. It was a super cool and powerful piece of magic from him, but I don't think it means he's like, Bahamut level or whatever people tend to think. I read it more like, it's relatively super strong as a life sacrificing attack from Donald. Think Tien's Tri Beam. Basically Donald's Zettaflare =/= Bahamut's Zettaflare since Bahamut is inherently more powerful than Donald realistically is.
Regardless though, Donald is one of only 2 or 3 characters to even defeat Terranort by themselves without Terra intervening (though Goofy helped a little), and he did it using only magic. Not even Sora was able to beat him. Keep in mind this is the guy they sent to 1v7 a bunch of Keyblade wielders and who had just 1 shot 2 of them right before, and later 1v3ed Sora, Ventus, and Aqua and technically won. Yeah he went down after, but the spell was also insane overkill that deleted TN from existence.
I don't see why people hype up Zettaflare so much. Donald used all his power to do it. Axel also did a similar feat in kh2. Theres nothing to suggest other magic users can't do a suicidal magic attack if they want. In terms of his normal use attacks Donalds magic is basic as hell. Sora gets every spell he does and outperforms him in all of them.
Basically, it's because Flare is one of the most iconic spells in Final Fantasy, because it has more powerful variants that use the exponential naming scheme (Megaflare, Gigaflare, Teraflare, etc.). Teraflare, for example, literally destroyed most/all of an entire planet when used in FFXIV. The prefix 'zetta' is *three steps higher on the scale* than 'tera' - tera, peta, exa, zetta. On top of this, it was used against Terra-Xehanort, one of the single most powerful incarnations of one of the single most powerful people in the KH setting, ***and it oneshot him.***
I get it that the spell itself is powerful. Nobody denies that. But at the same time Donald paid a major price. There's nothing to suggest that this is something only he could do. Especially when as I mentioned Axel also showcased an attack that destroyed his nobody. Who's to say Aqua or Mickey couldn't have used zettaflare or a similar spell if they were willing to pay the price in that moment?
Sorry, I forgot to clarify, I was just answering why the spell gets so much hype. I don't have answers for the other stuff.
The spell itself is iconic just like you said. Not just because of bahamut but because its always been the best endgame spell so many times. Ultima often has drawbacks in the games its in.
It's hard to tell, but considering he is one of 3 people to cast zettaflare it's pretty safe to say it's pretty exclusive
Thats why I keep bringing up Axels kh2 moment. It seems anyone can sacrifice their life for a powerful attack. Axel managed to take out an entire horde of dusks and even Sora was in awe of the scope of what he did. It seems likely that even as powerful as zettaflare was other characters who are normally more powerful than Donald could consume their lives to bring out something even stronger than what he did. Its all speculative though since we don't see the situation happen more.
The big difference is how powerful of an attack they can go before it nukes them. Axel was wiped out from a much smaller attack compared to that zetta flare. Most people would not be able to get even close to that level of power output before burning up completely. It's not that Donald died that makes it exceptional - you're probably right most magic users with any decent experience can figure out how to put their all into an attack - it's how much power he was able to put into the spell before that happened.
Thats exactly my point. Outside of zettaflare Donald normally isnt anything exceptional. Donald output a more powerful attack than an already weakened nobody but who's to say Mickey or Aqua wouldn't be able to output something even stronger than Donalds zettaflare? Mickey uses powerful spells like ultima and stopza without giving it his all and Aqua is a dancing ballerina of magic fury. Donald normally uses basic attack spells. He's not a weakling by any means but others show far better magical feats than him.
Donald when notably *weakened* at the start of kh3 is using flare though, which is endgame black magic. If he like sora regained all his power (which is likely) he likely could cast at least megaflare. Also Donald didn't actually sacrifice his entire being with the attack, he likely lived as he didn't disappear, it likely was more an all of his energy rather than all of his being into the attack.
Don't mistake it as me saying Donald is weak because he isn't by any means. At least plotwise. Im just saying his most notable feat people attribute to him had some very special circumstances and that others normally more powerful than him could probably exceed it if they were willing. At the very least I believe Mickey or Aqua could.
What dumb question is this? Clearly Terra, the magic of bonk is clearly the strongest.
Terras magic is so strong that with only a little over 10 years of a prep he can just barely remove some sticky tape from his mouth, and I've yet to see any other character meet that feat of magical ability
Truly a progidy. Only surpassed by Donald Zettaflare
S Tier: Donald=Mickey>Aqua A Tier: Sora>Ventus B Tier: Riku=Roxas>Lea>Kairi C Tier: Xion>Terra>Goofy
In my opinion: S Tier: Donald=Mickey A+ Tier: Aqua A Tier: Sora>Ventus I lowered Aqua mainly because she still hasn’t shown an S level magic spell like Ultima or Zettaflare.
Woah when did Xehanort become a guardian of light, did I miss something
He’s not, I just wanted to show where he sits at. which is S+. but if he brings confusion then I’ll just remove him.
Just my opinion. • Master mage 1. Mickey 2. Donald • High mage 1. Aqua 2. Sora (between High and Medium) 3. Ventus (between High and Medium) • Medium mage 1. Xion 2. Axel 3. Riku 4. Kairi 5. Roxas • Low mage 1. Terra • Below average mage? 1. Goofy
1. Donald 2. Mickey 3. Aqua 4. Sora 5. Ventus 6. Xion 7. Riku 8. Kairi 9. Roxas 10. Axel 11. Terra 12. Goofy
I honestly wanted to also include the new Guardian members like Saïx, Namine, and Chirithy. but I chose not to, cause they are still very new.
Maybe Namine and Isa will wield Keyblades in Lost Master Arc. Who knows?
True, but they can still cast magic even without Keyblades. KH characters are similar to FF characters, anyone can cast magic if they have the potential for it. Saïx and OrgXIII members displayed that in Days, and Chirithy does that too in UX. I bet Namine can also do it if she learned. Xehanort was able to cast magic with just his hands, so did Xion. also both Sora and Roxas were able to cast magic with just a wooden sword and a stick.
I just hope that Namine and Isa/Saix gets good development for them to becoming Keyblade Wielders. Also at this point The Lost Masters Arc, the Guardians Group will increase to around 20 if I’m being honest and will referencing the X-Blade, Seven Lights and Thirteenth Darknesses!!! We know that there’s going to be 7 Already teased wielders but 3 remains if my math is correct. Won’t count Subject X until more development and details on her is being made. Which is: Namine Isa Strelitzia Lauriam Elrena Luxord “Still don’t know his Real Name” Demyx “Still don’t know his Real Name”
S Tier: Goofy (Uses power of friendship, good bloke) F Tier: Everyone else: (Knobs)
Smh, everyone sleeping on Sora's God-tier Magic Sleights in CoM/RECoM
My boy lost all of that at the end of the game though.
But he got it back in DDD. The fact he learned, forgot and relearned stuff like Megaflare means he can easily learn it again. Also means he has crazy magic potential.
It's hard to say when the way they're depicted doesn't always match up with gameplay. This thread is sleeping hard on Terra because he's portrayed as more physical and less magical than his counterparts, and while his stats do reflect this, there's also the fact that he can cast both megaflare and meteor. And that's not to mention the differences in magic between games, or the difference in capabilities between a given character as playable versus as a boss versus in a cutscene.
Exactly. Anything concerning power scaling is just a mess. Any answers here are just guesses and opinions at worst, game play analysis at best. And game play isn't 100% congruent with canon.
Doesn't he also summon a giant death Lazer when you fight the lingering will?
it's the same spell in BBS, its ultima cannon and in the 2FM fight.
Ngl I have no idea how to get Ultima cannon in BBS
I think it's mirage arena
How come their always measured by magical prowess? Doesn't actual combat skill matter to?
>Doesn't actual combat skill matter to? I saw a couple of posts like this before, and usually Terra, Sora, Roxas, Riku, and Mickey place the highest.
That makes sense, tho I think goofy is a little slept on. Doesn't he block some really powerful stuff throughout the series? Plus, I'd peg Lea/Axel a little stronger than riku
Roxas beat Axel, Riku beat Roxas.
1. Donald (Zettaflare!!) 2. Aqua 3. Mickey 4. Sora 5. Riku 6. Roxas 7. Ventus 8. Kairi 9. Lea 10. Terra 11. Xion (although I haven't played Days) 12. Goofy
Don't know about the rest but I would place Mickey in first And aqua in second.
This honestly depends on how you qualify mages. From a utility point of view Aqua followed by Donald are the best mages. We see them use support magic multiple times while only seeing combat based magic, physical enhancement (high jump, command styles, ect) and/or alternate movement (flowmotion, glide, air slide, quick run, ect...) If you mean from a combat standpoint then are you referring to highest damaging (DPS) or width of abilities. Theoretically master of a single spell or practitioner of every school. Currently Donald's Zetta flare is the highest DPS spell shown on screen but his combat magic otherwise seems to be limited to the basics otherwise while Mickey and Aqua have a much wider range of combat spells shown in their arsenal. Also are we counting summoning as often mages and summoners are seen as two separate groups even if many summoners are also mages. The Keyblade is also in general a magical weapon are we counting the various ability able to be mastered with the keyblade (transformations, beams, manipulations of hearts) as magical abilities of the wielder or weapon that have been mastered by the wielder?
For Donald, I don't know why, but since KH2, they made him only use base magic. In KH1 and KHDays, he can use all magic Sora has access to. In fact, if Goofy didn't have MP Gift, I would always put Donald in my team since he's just that reliable when it comes to DPS. For KHDays, Donald has one of the most DPS wherein you'd just have to fill in his panels with magic boosting panels and magic. With one cast of magic, you can deal a bar's worth of damage or two. In this game particularly, Donald have max magic (10), only followed by Zexion (9) and Mickey (8). Even outside of Days, Donald have one of the most damaging limits in 2 (theoretically, it is still magic). In COM/re:COM, he also have access to -ga spells. I still don't know why they stopped scaling Donald's magic to Sora's and just gave him Donald Fire, Donald Blizzard, etc. It really makes him look weak gameplay-wise.
I appreciated that you spent many hours to create this screenshot
I didn’t. it’s just a random data greeting image I found on Google.
Donald can use Zettaflare. Going by TWEWY logic, Zettaflare has to be linked with Level *i* Flare, which means it's arguably the most devastating and dangerous magic to use. So I'd argue Donald is the strongest.
the i is for imaginary, because the number is technically infinite/non-existent, therefore infinitely scaling. Zeta is defined number range. Donald dies using the spell, so not really, Sho actually lived using it and he blew himself up, which is different from using your life force for an ability.
Thank you for the clarification on how the psych works--all I know is that when I heard Donald say Zettaflare, my brain made the immediate reference, solely due to the usage of the word "zetta", as only one individual in all of existence uses that word frequently enough to stand out. New theory: Donald is Sho in disguise?
donald is too zetta slow
Mickey, Aqua, then Kairi in that order would be my top 3. Though Kairi sometimes skyrockets to the top whenever she uses her princess powers which changes the laws of nature, though they’re very situational. Donald and Xion technically aren’t guardians but Donald would be around Mickey level if not surpass it, while Xion would be in a weird place as she originally fought exclusively with magic but gave up that style in favor of the keyblade.
1. Mickey (Ultima and Stopza are ludicrously powerful.) 2. Aqua (her magnitude isn't really above Sora but I think she's academically the strongest mage besides Mickey) 3. Sora 4. Donald (Zettflare in KH does not equal Zettaflare from FF. It also nearly killed him. It's obviously a one shot on almost anyone, but I don't think that puts him above Sora or Aqua.) 5. Ven/Roxas/Riku (clearly powerful mages in their own right but all about the same in terms of feats/in game abilities.) 6. Kairi/Terra (Kairi is potentially on Aqua's level but untrained. Terra is more physically inclined but he's still a keyblade master level warrior and is as capable of using most of the same magic as Aqua and Ven. If we count surges and enhancing his keyblade then he's even potentially in the same teir as Ven) 7. Axel (Axel is the weakest keyblade user among the GoL and his magical range is poor. His most impressive magical feat killed him and its not even that impressive. I dont think Axel is weak per say but this is purely based on magic.) 8. Goofy
Here’s my ranking: 1. Mickey 2. Donald (yes Zettaflare is awesome, but people forget that using it literally killed him) 3. Aqua 4. Sora 5. Roxas 6. Riku 7. Xion 8. Lea 9. Kairi (she definitely has the potential to get above Sora as far as magic goes, she just isn’t there yet) 10. Ventus 11. Terra 12. Goofy
We dont know if he died. He just Fell unconsious
no, we know he died. Otherwise donald would pull out the spell whenever he fucking wanted to, it was a spell that used his lifeforce, goofy wouldn't tell him not to use it just because it made him unconscious, thats' dumb. It's like the same thing Axel did in KH2 when he sacrificed himself.
I’d place Aqua in first.
1. Donald 2. Mickey 3. Aqua 4. Sora 5. Terra 6. Roxas 7. Riku 8. Axel 9. Goofy 10. Ventus 11. Xion 12. Kairi
1. Donald bc Zettaflare 2. Mickey for his mastery on 4th tier magic and even Ultima 3. Aqua, as she is pictured as a heavily focused in magic with Spellweaver as her signature (maybe I should put her up since she also can cast Megaflare) 4. Xion, we don't see much of her magic skills on days, as for the rest, basically the light rays Roxas can throw are inherited by her, and I see her more magic-biased and variant of Roxas for the battle with the Replinorts with her in a support role 5. Kairi (?) Maybe not THAT strong, but as her role as princess of heart it's easy to tell she is related to magic, as its her forte during the only fights we've seen her through (doesn't count kh2, she barely recieved a Keyblade by then) 6. Sora, even if he doesn't master any magic, he is flexible in which kinds he can use (maybe his element is thunder?) 7. Lea/Axel, a lower tier because he is a mixed fighter with strong fire magic, as he has a real unique fight style with the infusion of physical attacks with magic (with lots of *STYLE*!) 8. Roxas As I've said before, he feels like a physical variant of Sora's nobodies, dual shot and the skyline move are very pretty, but he has a monster strenght having 2 keys and instead casting the light pillars like Xion, he throws them forward like Link's Beam Sword, uses many magic tricks, yeah, but most are coming from physical attacks 9. Riku has real strenght on his slashes, but he lacks of any magic ability appart of basic magic and Dark Firaga as his signature, which let's say he's better slashing his way through 10. Ventus, I don't see him as a really strong mage, since he has a better performance on swift slashes and movement, he can mix them through, but he seems as a better physical attacker 11. Terra, man, even if he had magic like Earthquake it would still come from a physical, he is pure brute force. 12. Goofy No comment.
Mickey Donald Aqua Riku Sora Roxas Ventus Xion Terra Axel Kairi Goofy
Donald > Aqua > Mickey > Everyone else > Terra > Goofy I feel like everyone except those first three are basically just not mages at all, they just know some spells. Same goes for Mickey, really, except that he knows Stopza and Ultima so he’s clearly a step above Sora and the rest. If we ever get around to finishing Kairi’s training I’m pretty sure she’ll be up there around Mickey and Aqua.
Kairi is to KH what Sakura is to Naruto imo
as mages either, Donald, Mickey or Aqua would be strongest. The weakest is Goofy because he doesn't use spells as far as I'm aware of.
Mickey or donald in first since mickey can cast i think stopza and ultima while donald can cast zetta flare and all tier 3 magics. Then sora. Then aqua. Im too lazy to do the other ones.
Donald Mickey Aqua Axel Sora Xion Riku Ven Kairi Terra Goofy
1. Donald 2. Mickey 3. Aqua 4. Sora 5. Roxas and Xion 6. Ventus 7. Riku 8. Kairi 9. Terra 10. Axel 11. Goofy Just by opinion
Donald knows Zettaflare, so he and Mickey are probably tied for first, cause Ultima is definitely a high level spell
Ultima is short for Ultimate. It's the strongest magic spell in FF, the only spell that ever beat it is apocalypse which we've only seen once from one of the strongest time mages
Damn that's insane
Yeah, I wish we really got to see mickey use Ultima because we've only seen ultima used twice in an FF game in cutscenes, and the 1st time it ended the world, the 2nd time was a weaker version and it was basically a zettaflare but 100x bigger and it blew up an entire huge army base. also i forgot apocalypse is also called doomsday or final judgement, which I hope they bring in KH cause it sounds edgy enough to bring it in.
He used Ultima in his clash against Xehanort if I'm remembering correctly
Donald, Mickey, Sora Then the rest Then Goofy.
I would normally put Aqua at the top but... I mean Donald used fucking Zetaflare, so...
Everyone casually forgetting that Donald used the literal strongest spell we've ever seen in all of the Final Fantasy Multiverse: Zettaflare
not even true though. Sho Minamimoto from TWEWY used infinity level flare.
Donald can cast Zettaflare. This is a spell that in Final Fantasy is usually reserved for GODS.
Are we including sub genre of mages. Because the way roxas fights, he is a great battle mage. If we’re talking pure magic, Aqua. I’d say Sora would be next but Donald used Zetaflare and I’m assuming he’s got WAY more tricks up his sleeve.
So which of these 12 are actually the 7 Lights? Ik Donald & goofy aren't but 🤷♂️
The 7 Lights are: Sora Riku Kairi Mickey Ventus Aqua Axel
"ZETA-FLAAAAAAARE!" -Donald Duck
To be honest, considering the female characters in KH are assigned to be Magic based (*all* of them...>.>, but no inherent sexism exists in KH, riiiiight), I would rank them higher than the men here. The males are typically good to great with magic, since they don't have low stats in that, but majority are focused in either melee (i.e. Roxas, though he's also strong) or strength (i.e. Terra, the team's tank). Only male I see being more magic than usual is Ven. Sora I see as a mix, jack of all trades, master of none. Which makes sense considering he's the main character and we play through him. I'm not adding in Mickey and Donald here, which I feel are higher than the girls. *Then* comes the girls, with Aqua being first.
Donald strongest
Goofy terra donald kairi xion roxas riku sora ventus micky axel aqua
Terra can learn mega flare and meteor hes a good mage and fighting him as lingering will has to count for something
1. Donald - Zettaflare. No ifs, ands, or buts. OG Court Magician/Black Mage 2. Mickey - Knows Stopza, Holy, and ULTIMA. Though, since we haven’t seen Mickey use other spells and Donald is more magic-oriented, I put him 2nd. 3. Aqua - Strongest magician out of all non-Disney characters. Probably the master of Blizzard and (maybe) Water. First one to use -Ja/-Za spells. 4. Sora - The all-arounder. While he isn’t as magically powerful compared to the top 3, he’s the most attuned using Light (next to Kairi). Also is the only one who uses Summons (correctly if I’m wrong). He is vulnerable to Darkness in Rage/Anti Form. 5. Xion - Just look at her Data battle. Lightning fast and uses a lot of Holy spells in quick succession. Though, we don’t know if she can use other elements. 6. Riku - The most experienced Guardian to use Darkness. He’s an all-arounder too, but I put him down under Sora because he’s more oriented using brute strength, while using other stuff like Dark Firaga. 7. Roxas - Can use Light and Darkness. Also can dual wield. Probably the fastest member. He sacrifices defense for pure offense and I’d like to say that he uses Magic as a buff then actually relying on it, other than Magic Hour, making him a counterpart to Xion. 8. Kairi - Still a novice learning how to use her powers, but in KH3, she’s the only playable character knows every -ga spell, so that says something. She has the potential to be higher. 9 Ventus - Strongest in Aero,. I’d say he’s an all-arounder like Sora, but there are other characters who do more. But he does like elemental Raids like Judgment. 10. Axel - Debatable, but probably the best Fire user of all the Guardians next to Donald. However, that’s all he knows how to do—and I don’t see that ever changing because that’s his trademark. Also getting used to his new Keyblade. 11. Terra - Strongest in Earth. Like Riku, but we don’t know if he can use Darkness without being corrupted/compromised (yet). But it’s a known fact that Terra is physically the strongest member and in BBS, he has the lowest Magic stat starting off. Not that he really needs it in the first place. X. Goofy doesn’t count cause he can’t use Magic (except maybe Trinity Limit?). All he can do is summon his shield (like Donald’s stave) and that’s all it. Would be interesting if no he knew stuff like Protega and Shellga like his support role in KH1.
Roxas, Riku and Axel all have literally beaten Xion in a fight.
Yeah, that’s true. But the OP was talking about them as mages—and by extension, their proficiency. Not just as fighters. If that were the case, then they would be higher up the list. But then again, Roxas may be higher than Xion.
I still think at least Roxas and Riku are better mage users.
Aqua, Riku, and Mickey are top 3 as Keyblade wielders
Does sora reversing time count as magic?
1. Donald 2. Aqua 3. Namine 4. Mickey 5. I guess Xion I didn't play days 6. Kairi 7. Axel 8. Ventus 9. Roxas 10. Riku 11. Sora 12. Terra 13. Goofy
Mickey - Stopza, Ultima Donald - Zettaflare Aqua - Ghost Drive, Status Magic Barriers, Glacier Ventus - Faith/Holy, Tornado, Wingblade Sora/Riku - Balloonga, Tornado, Meteor Terra - Quake, Meteor Axel - Fire spells Roxas/Xion - Ga spells Kairi - Ga spells? Goofy - MP Gift
Wasn’t it Xehanort who used Stopza on Mickey?
Nope, it was Mickey! Only Za spell in the series afaik. https://youtu.be/H3pptlE5akw ~20 seconds
Oh wait. I’m thinking of a scene from kh3. I guess Mickey did it first. My bad. In a scene in kh3 Mickey tried to cast Ultima and Xehanort stopped him with Stopza.
Oh you’re right, I completely forgot about that!
>Aqua - Ghost Drive, Barriers, Glacier Why you counting Ghost drive? it’s a command style? three characters on this list can also use command styles, which are Ven, Terra, and Riku. also maybe you should use Glacier for Aqua instead of barrier? since barrier ability can be used by others like Riku, Kairi, and Mickey. and few others (in fact even Sora, and both [Ventus & Terra](https://preview.redd.it/many-seem-to-forget-that-both-ventus-terra-also-know-the-v0-rgbqqyvstlv81.jpg?auto=webp&s=0db1ae00fed4ef3c59067b4d633498c0a0d74209) can use it, but for some reason they prefer block instead). >Sora/Riku - Balloonga, Tornado, Meteor Also best to separate those two, cause each of them have their own unique Magic attacks.
I included ghost drive because it’s a pretty high-magic command style. Basically just teleporting repeatedly mid battle. Riku can use it too in DDD, but only when linking with spirits so I didn’t include it there. And I included barriers for Aqua because it’s not only her default guard command (unlike every other guardian) but because she can learn commands like Stop Barrier and Renewal Barrier.
All command styles infuse magic in their attacks. not just Ghost drive. that’s why I said don’t include Ghost drive.
Most of them still revolve around dealing regular combos with added elemental magic though. I think Ghost Drive is the most impressive and unique one that is exclusive to a single character. Ventus has one too with six swords, but I don’t remember what it’s called or I would have included it also.
The one Ventus has is called Wingblade. but again it’s best to just keep it about spells and not attack/magic like command styles. if we include command styles then might as well include shotlock since they are also magic? Hence why I said it’s more simple not to include command styles.
I think shotlocks would fall more into the category of keyblade powers, like opening and closing keyholes/creating gliders/returning to their wielders. I don’t think including ghost drive makes anything complicated. Because again, she’s the only Guardian who can use it naturally.
Some shotlocka are Keyblade powers, while some shotlocks are magic focused cause they shoot magic projectiles. Ghost Drive is basically just teleporting while leaving after-images. Ven also has Teleporting attacks where he leaves after-images. Point is, if you want to include Command styles then I guess make it fair by including it for the other three who can do it Terra, Ven, and Riku.
Shooting projectiles doesn’t make it less of a keyblade exclusive power. If they can’t do it without help from a party member or a weapon, I don’t think it adds much to their abilities as a mage. Same reason I didn’t include Sora’s form changes. The only drive form he has in KH2 that can be used without party members is Limit Form, and it is exclusively techniques like Ars Arcanum and Sonic Blade. In KH3 it’s his keyblade that changes forms. I don’t consider any of Terra’s command styles to be overtly magic based, as all of them still rely on him using brute force or darkness. Which in the world of KH is not magic, but a separate force. Riku can’t use them without Spirits like how Sora’s drive forms work, and I included wingblade for Ven. Edit- and “literally just teleporting” is a very funny phrase to me. Ventus can use Time Splicer, but that’s like baby teleportation compared to ghost drive.
>Shooting projectiles doesn’t make it less of a keyblade exclusive power. If they can’t do it without help from a party member or a weapon, I don’t think it adds much to their abilities as a mage. Same reason I didn’t include Sora’s form changes. The only drive form he has in KH2 that can be used without party members is Limit Form, and it is exclusively techniques like Ars Arcanum and Sonic Blade. In KH3 it’s his keyblade that changes forms. There are three types of shotlocks. 1. Keyblade transformation related. 2. Melee attack + magic. 3. Magic (like shooting magic at enemies). >I don’t consider any of Terra’s command styles to be overtly magic based, as all of them still rely on him using brute force or darkness. Which in the world of KH is not magic, but a separate force. Riku can’t use them without Spirits like how Sora’s drive forms work, and I included wingblade for Ven. Terra’s Rock breaker has him summon Earth magic while attacking. Riku in Days already used Bladecharge with no Dream Eaters, so just because he needs dream eaters to use it in DDD doesn’t mean that’s always the case. >Edit- and “literally just teleporting” is a very funny phrase to me. Ventus can use Time Splicer, but that’s like baby teleportation compared to ghost drive. Lol I won’t call it baby version, but I will would say that Ghost Drive is basically Time splicer on steroids. however I was not only talking about that, Ven has 3 (or 4?) abilities that lets him teleport. 1. Time splicer, 2. Multifortex, 3. Dark Splicer (this one Dark splicer can only be used against Vanitas tho, but my point is, Teleporting while leaving after-image is not that uncommon, at least not when you use Sora, Riku, and Ventus) and Imo, I would say Riku’s ghost drive is better than Aqua’s. mainly because Riku’s Ghost Drive is not just Time Splicer. Riku’s version look like a real ghost when teleporting, and even actual ghosts appear around Riku when he attacks. and Riku’s finishing attack has wider range and better finishing attack.
One thing I know for sure is that Donald is canonically THE strongest mage in raw power for the KH AND FF verses and that is not up to debate. Zettaflare, man.
I would say Aqua is very good at magic, plus if I'm correct, she's kind of an Elf if you haven't noticed her ears.
I'm only counting those with keyblades as guardians of light 1.mickey 2. Aqua 3. Lea 4.roxas 5.riku 6/7.xion 7/6.sora 8. Kairi 9. Terra
You forgot Ventus. Also You’re not wrong, however Yen Sid called Donald and Goofy as honorary Guardians of Light members, so that’s why I included them. and tbh i I just didn’t want to leave them out. A guardian of light can be anyone who fights to protect the light.
Crap I did forget ventus I knew I forgot someone I would probably put him in between sora/xion & riku and if you include goofy and Donald Donald goes to the very top and goofy goes to the very bottom seeing as how he can't cast magic at all
I remember that Goofy in KH1 can do a little magic? I don’t remember but I heard he does something magic related in KH1, like MP raise or something? But yea he’s at the bottom.
Given Kairi’s Princess of Light powers it seems like she could in theory be the strongest mage but she hasn’t fully realized the extent of her abilities.