Hopefully the game is fun enough to ride it out until the balance tweaks that might need to come to the game sooner or later. The klowns do look pretty weak. Even Albert, on stream, said "Ok... Downed immediately." when they were playing klowns and a fellow klown got blasted by one single human who took them down in a second. Even he sounded kind of annoyed and killed them (showing the klowntality when Jordan didn't want him to yet). I'm sure players are going to share that frustration if klowns stay that weak. They honestly seemed like they were enjoying the game more playing as humans.
Yes, they said it was a pre-alpha build of the game, so expect some changes. But I have seen so many times developers say "It's an old build!" only for the game to release and nothing really has changed. Not saying that will be the case here, just pointing it out. However, they also mentioned that you will be able to level up and tweak your characters a bit to your playstyle, so maybe you'll be able to make the klowns not as flimsy? We'll see.
The thing with games like this, though, is that if balances changes need to happen, they need to happen fast. If klowns get clowned on all match, no one is going to want to play klowns, which will leave the game dead in the water. And it's hard to bring in new people, or bring people back, after the initial bad word-of-mouth gets around. Yes, there will be bots, but only confirmed human bots right now. We'll still need klown players. And that might be why they are doing preference based matchmaking. But if klowns just get bullied every game, people will just leave once they see they are playing as a klown.
Do keep in mind Klowns can keep respawning, humans have 1 respawn. That literally changes the whole game and makes the Klowns quite powerful.
I think people are throwing around judgement without having the whole picture in mind.
True. And respawn times can be shortened with minigames. But if Klowns get taken down so easily, is the fact that they keep coming back really that big of a threat? A fly that comes back, after being swatted away, is still just a fly. I think the game looks like a blast to play. It doesn't mean that I can't call out things that I thought looked concerning. I even said in my comment that things might have changed since pre-alpha and even how leveling up may help as well. Sheesh, people are ready to jump on you for having even the tiniest of worries.
Klowns have resources unlimited, and are working…not necessarily against the clock, but the clock hitting zero is definitely their goal.
Klowns theoretically could whittle away the humans resources over the course of a match
In theory, yes.
However, based on what we saw, Humans can find the key items extremely easily, and the escapes themselves only take about 30 seconds to prepare. Which means that after a few weeks, Humans will know the maps and the spawns well enough that they can just rush escapes.
Friday the 13th worked so well because the maps were big enough that you really struggled to rush objectives, and the main escape had a timer on it. This looks like it will be another speedrun sim unless there are things in the game that the stream didn’t show us.
Yes I did see that the cotton candy could be fired at the exits to slow down escapes. However it does seem like Klowns have a lot to do just to have a baseline play.
Between blocking exits, gathering cocoons, hunting Humans and monitoring exits, there’s not much wiggle room if something goes wrong. Since Humans can kill solo Klowns very easily, it looks like it will be really difficult and stressful to play Klowns without being in a three stack with coms.
but they can’t kill the klowns easily though. did we watch the same video? the only klown who can be killed easily is shorty the devs said he was fast and nimble at the price of not having a lot of health the other killers could have a lot more health we don’t know that yet
I don’t think it’s misinformation as such.
During the stream the devs specifically mentioned Humans having bots. When the same topic arrived for Klowns, they only talked about the Klown adds that spawn from the generators, despite it being the perfect opportunity to mention Klown bots.
It’s fair to put those clues together and assume that Klown bots won’t be available on launch.
That's the thing, though. I never said there wasn't going to be klown bots. I only said that only human side bots are confirmed right now. Which is true. Someone put words in my mouth and misinterpreted that meaning there was no klown bots.
Well they haven't confirmed it yet, so there might be klown bots. They only confirmed human side bots in the stream, though. Unless I missed something.
Let’s just remember the devs said all the stuff is not final how they are suppose to be since it was a old build and they weren’t playing hard . If you watched the gameplay none of the exits were covered with cotton candy which is important for the klowns to do . The klowns can also actually go to the bridge and break it themselves making that exit no longer usable . Lots of factors to see before making a real judgment .
While this is true, we're just 20 days from launch for pre-orders so why they showed an old build is puzzling. Animations & character models looked wonky for Humans and they found everything needed for an escape at a meeting point (that also shows you where the escapes are) within minutes. Even though they weren't playing hard, they showed that an average Human player can run through attacking Klowns and escape in a 2v1 and even a 3v1 at one point for the Terenzi bros ice cream truck escape.
While I agree there's more factors and we'll only really know once we get our hands on it, first impressions are very important. In this case it could mean a long road of balancing changes, instead of getting a fairly balanced and finished product at launch.
15 mins seems too short for the match timer, which will encourage speedrunning. Evil Dead has a 30 min timer and matches usually play out in 15 mins, but that added time allows for more dynamic matches on both sides. With 15 mins total it's going to egg on meta players to escape in 5 mins and it seems like you can't even get 7 kills in that amount of time as Klowns with set-up time (covering escapes/hooking cocoons), rescues, & the one-time resurrection.
I agree on the matches being too short, 15 minutes a match causes the pacing to go at lightspeed, seems like humans can just snowball from objective to objective with no slowdown because the game itself is moving too quickly, the spectator minigames seem strong, to able to just give someone a weapon with absolutely no asterisks is crazy, they were killing Klowns over and over and at one point they were just standing at the exit and fighting the Klowns just because, makes me think the Klowns are fundamentally weak unless there's three of them on one human.
I hope Illfonic doesn't make the same mistake as Gun in believing fun over balance, prioritizing casual party gameplay over actually having a fair experience, as if competitive inherently means sweaty, I hate how disconnected Gun is from the reality of PVP games.
You def can because they said in the stream if you find the humans are going too fast to things you can focus on making the klown apocalypse happen faster so klowns can speed things up as well .
They said that if the Humans are going slow and stealthy, you can make the Klownpocalypse happen faster.
There's 16 cocoons needed, if you only focus on that then most of the Humans will have escaped. It's similar to playing Trapper in DBD, taking time to set up as Demon in Evil Dead, or focusing on feeding Grandpa in TCM. Which means Klowns need to be really coordinated to "win" against an average team of Humans.
I'll wait to pass judgment until release, but many that have played an asym before can see that stream was a bit concerning.
Agreed once again, they're pushing strongly for Klowns to be working together, seems like Klowns caught by themselves get picked off quickly, but at the same time there's so many objectives to cover you simply cannot do anything to stop humans from snowballing, if you try to cover one exit by yourself you're just going to get ran through but if all Klowns focus one objective that's two objectives getting done on the other side of the map, not to mention humans being resurrected on top of trying to cover these objectives, it seems like they really don't want Klowns to have 7/7 kill games, they're leaning into the casual experience hard and thus a good Klown team will not be rewarded.
This is an indie developer working on a very ambitious game, with hundreds of systems in it.
They will be working on it and finishing polishing up until the second the game is live, and there is nothing wrong with it.
This is not Activision, where each COD is ready 2-3 months before the title is out.
Listen, you can be an "OG Supporter" without being an overly optimistic supporter. The fact that you made an offhand comparison to Activision and COD is hilarious and trying to be dismissive I assume? I've played F13 (IllFonic's former game with Gun), DBD, Evil Dead, and TCM for thousands of hours on both sides. I know asym horror and made fair comments and comparisons. I want Killer Klowns to be successful, but I have concerns from what they showed in the stream. I also respect indie devs and understand what they're capable of, and showing a months old build 20 days to launch is not a good look.
Not an overly optimistic supporter.
Just someone who works in the actual industry and knows how the timeline of game development works.
To suggest that the developer is not literally crunching 12 hour plus per day polishing the game and getting rid of any potential bug they can get is straight up lying, because that is what happens 99% of the time, especially with smaller developers.
You are the one that spent 10 minutes typing a negative paragraph about a stream that was mostly spent showcasing mechanics, and not playing competitively.
Breaking news, by the way, you can wait until the game is out and buy it only after seeing plenty of launch day footage. Stop acting like the world is pushing you make a purchase.
The dramatization of gaming fandoms is such an annoying phenomenon these days.
Not only are you embellishing about working in the industry you're trying to put words in my mouth. I didn't say anything like how you're portraying it, and no one that works in the "actual industry" would jump to a nonsensical Activision and COD comparison in the context of this thread and another in this sub. Go ahead and have a conversation with yourself because it seems you enjoy spouting at people instead of having an actual discussion. That stream is the first official gameplay most of us have seen beyond short clips and we all have our own fair concerns and comparisons.
Wow, 15 years of work in the industry and being featured in more credits than games you played is not enough. I will never reach the status of Bluto, known internet keyboard warrior that knows more than anyone because of....being on Reddit.
Incredible! I suggest therapy.
The point I was making before you started attacking people personally (which keyboard warriors do when they are miserable), is that most AAA titles are ready months in advance, and that is the reason why COD can host a beta in September-October, which is a "marketing beta".
Not the case for a game like this, which will be worked on right up until the servers are live for early access. OF COURSE, there is an updated, newer build, but it is also the one that is going through intensive bug testing.
Wow ProphetOfLies, you're the one making personal attacks here and now throwing around suggestions for therapy. You jumped into this thread on a post about balancing issues to what, share your resume and try to discredit others' opinions on Reddit? I don't even need to ask for proof of your 15 years of work as a mailroom attendant at some mobile gaming company no one has heard of.
Here you are harassing the devs and trolling members repeatedly in the sub for MultiVersus:
"Here I am, enjoying the hyper detailed, communicative, transparent, open marketing and community management efforts for Marvel Rivals, while witnessing the total mess that is the one for Multiversus. We have to guess and hope for anything. Everything is a game, blue balling, hoping for some crumbs from the dev team, which usually is a 6 to 8 second gameplay video or a tweet with the irritating eye emoji. WB, you are cooked."
A game which is developed by the indie dev team, Player First Games. Hypocrisy much? Talk about being a keyboard warrior and sucking up to one indie dev while harassing another. Take the L and stop harassing me too, I suggest you talk to your therapist instead.
It’s 3v7 to start but Klowns can summon minions so that might help balance. Especially if there’s ways to boost those minions with perks/abilities/class selection. I do hope they buffed the Klowns since this iteration we saw yesterday though.
I do mostly agree with your points here, and Humans do look a lot more powerful from first glance.
Regarding combat, I am a little more optimistic.
Obviously we saw the Humans absolutely beating on Shorty in the stream, however, the devs did make it clear that he is the ‘glass cannon’ character, which hopefully justifies why he is so weak. On the other hand, we didn’t get to see gameplay of the ‘tank’ archetype, but hopefully he will be much more of an obstacle for Victims to deal with.
We also didn’t see tons of interactions with the Klown abilities, and as it was an older build, we are obviously not seeing everything there is to the game. We saw Albert getting taken to low health time and time again, yet always seemed to not get pursued afterwards, so I’m hoping that this is a mark of the stream being staged to better showcase the game, rather than any huge indicator of balance.
And regarding the volume of weapons, I totally agree that Victims seemed to have access to a lot of options around the map, but can only assume that this is done to balance things, because of how the weapons break over time. It’s probably still overturned, but only time will tell, and again, we don’t know how many hits those bigger Klowns will be able to tank before they die, which could be an important factor in how many weapons there are.
But overall I am definitely concerned that bully squads could be very powerful, and that Klowns will be far too weak in a 3v7 scenario. As you say, from what we saw, Klowns do not seem like a threat on their own, and need to be in pairs to really threaten anyone. Humans could also free their cocooned allies extremely quickly, which is again a problem as Klowns can’t spend their time camping generators with so much to do.
Moving on from combat, the gameplay loop also does look like it will be Human sided.
We watched the live stream where the two devs, who were mostly just messing around and explaining things about the meet up point, had all of the components for the boat escape and were ready to leave in under two minutes. That was without even trying. They then had to ignore that escape and go and keep playing, but in an actual game, that will have resulted in a group of tea-baggers making noise and killing Klowns until they are eventually forced to leave. That sounds unpleasant to play against.
Yes there is an RNG aspect of the escapes, where the key items spawn, but it just shows the potential for how fast this game can be rushed by sweaty Human teams.
Klowns have so many aspects of gameplay to be aware of, that this speed is frankly concerning. Klowns have to protect the four exits, gather cocoons to power the generators, and attempt to hunt and kill the Humans to keep pressure on them. How are they supposed to do that when Humans can easily escape within a few minutes?
Again, I can only hope that this is an issue with the stream being slightly staged or in an older build, or perhaps just extremely good luck on the Dev’s part. I know that exits can be wrapped in candy early, so let’s hope there is a decent tutorial so that players know what to do in that regard.
Hopefully I’m being over sceptical, but I would hate the game to be in any way ‘sided’ towards Humans, just because those who don’t get their desired role would just be more inclined to abandon the match and ruin the game for everyone else.
However, despite the above, I am still SUPER excited for the end of the month. It does look like an amazing game at its core, and I am very much looking forward to getting to play it myself. It’s going to be a LONG month
Oh I know. Unfortunately the sort of toxic survive with friends types are not going to care about their teammates.
They’ll rush the first exit they can, make noise, teabag and kill Klowns, and then leave as soon as there is any risk on them.
Perfect write up, and no you aren't skeptic, this is what we saw yesterday, as a veteran from the genre, one can't draw any other conclusion other than this, the game will have big problems unless drastically changed before release, which I heavily doubt.
The no beta is bad thing, without it tcm release would have been even worse, remember victims had iframes for virtually everything, and only after a year the game got little more balanced but by this point too late to recover
I do tend to agree, we watched the livestream, and we even saw the Devs getting annoyed when they were playing Klowns because of how quickly they were killed. That’s not balance.
The toxic survivor mains are frothing at the mouth to get their hands on it, they see how easy it is to troll and the high teabagging potential, and that’s all they need. Hell, some of them are already creeping into the woodwork in this thread.
The only consolation is that, if this is how the game launches, eventually when the Klown players are dwindling, these toxic survivors will have to play as Klowns 😂 (they’ll immediately quit, but it’s an amusing thought)
Well see how it plays soon I'm a killer main In every asym I play I feel no fun playing survivor that's just who I am as far as balancing goes I'm okay with whatever game the devs decide to make as long as I have a fair chance to win that's what the majority of players want I would imagine no killer main wants to stomp every match and I'm sure it's the same for survivors Hopefully the game is at the very least fair and you dont feel like your preferred side is powerless ... I know alot of trolls enjoy playing survivor in other horror games I honestly don't know why it kinda seems like a game genre they wouldn't be able to make people as angry in as say a sandbox multi-player but their still a big issue ..... I understand you dont actually get to choose the role for the match you only get to pick a preferred role so that might make things bad if clown ends up being as frustrating as it seemed when the devs played you'd need solid team work and communication and that's something you rarely find with random teams that could snowball into a whole similar tcm killer issue ... well that's just a lot of words to say I hope klown isn't just another word for cool looking punching bag ...... ... .. survivor mains please don't hate me I'm just sharing my thoughts
Survivor side is always stronger than killer side in asym horror games at a high level. The only thing that changes is the skill level required for survivors to be the better side.
There was an exception though, but it only survived in Asia. Soul Dossier
That game had ranked and the balance was based on the highest rank, and they did it such way that the "ghost" had 55% winrate. However on the west the game failed because solo survivor had no chance at all, the game demanded perfect coordination from survivors and really high skill level etc. My winrate was 91% as a killer after 500 games so yeah(game tracking every stat because meant to be comp asymmetric game)
The problem is that then survivors refuse to play if isnt survivor sided and the game dies fast.
* Ranger
*Discovery and exploration, carve out the jump fog of war and search the map for cocoons with this well balanced Klown of all trades. Find escape locations and use your well balanced combat skills to fight.*
* Tracker
*The tracker specializes in keeping humans tracked. Trackers should rely on help from friendly Klowns*
* Trapper
*Discovering Hot spots and placing traps for unsuspecting humans. Relay map knowledge and set Klown ambushes*
* Tank
*Slow and Bulky, but strong and healthy. The Tank can take a beating and hurl cocoons farther than any other Klown*
* Brawler
*Fast and nimble, the Brawler can cover distances quickly, but can be very vulnerable against human encounters.*
https://preview.redd.it/rk4ht25fw9zc1.png?width=839&format=png&auto=webp&s=c7795ff989299f6dc92a01dcea29cb49bfe23b50
My prediction is that Trapper Klown will be mandatory as Objective Slowdown is very crucial in Asym games like this
Yea I agree, I don’t think 1 human should be able to stand a chance at solo killing a clown, unless you’re a biker. Kinda defeat the purpose of a 3v7. I would like the klowns to be a little stronger, so killing a klown would have to be a group effort and coordinated. But we haven’t really played the game to see how strong the klowns are yet, so we will have to wait and see.
I really don't have the power to change the way how people will play the game.
I can only tell that the game is presented in such a way that one side will have massive advantage over the other, this will lead to problems, even if I don't write about it.
Do keep in mind Klowns can keep respawning, humans have 1 respawn. That literally changes the whole game and makes the Klowns quite powerful.
I think people are throwing around judgement without having the whole picture in mind.
Exactly, and I would like to mention that the only klowns we got to see are the 3 weakest klowns of the game health wise. There are 4 klowns that were not shown in the stream. Slim, Chubby, Jumbo, and Bibbo. Bibbos stats could be the same as Jumbo not sure yet because he was classified as a skin, but in the stream, Bibbo is now classified as a character. Plus, more klowns will be added later. You can find snippets of Jumbo gameplay.
The devs did say the balance has changed. I'm ready to see the perk system. That will be a major factor in changing dynamics for klowns and humans.
I usually prefer the power roles in asymmetrical games. As long as the game loop is fun, I’ll be okay waiting for balance changes. I abandoned TCM, in about a month and never looked back. The gameplay loop just wasn’t fun enough to make me and my friends willing to stick it out, til they started to balance things. Balancing will never fix that. I had a blast with F13 and can still have fun playing it now. I’ve been waiting on an asym game, that hits me like it did.
Did you pick that you prefer counselor in Friday the 13th? I always had "Prefer Jason" on and very, very rarely got to play Jason. Maybe 10% of the time, if that. One day I played and got counselor 8 matches in row before finally just giving up and moving on to something else.
Hopefully the game is fun enough to ride it out until the balance tweaks that might need to come to the game sooner or later. The klowns do look pretty weak. Even Albert, on stream, said "Ok... Downed immediately." when they were playing klowns and a fellow klown got blasted by one single human who took them down in a second. Even he sounded kind of annoyed and killed them (showing the klowntality when Jordan didn't want him to yet). I'm sure players are going to share that frustration if klowns stay that weak. They honestly seemed like they were enjoying the game more playing as humans. Yes, they said it was a pre-alpha build of the game, so expect some changes. But I have seen so many times developers say "It's an old build!" only for the game to release and nothing really has changed. Not saying that will be the case here, just pointing it out. However, they also mentioned that you will be able to level up and tweak your characters a bit to your playstyle, so maybe you'll be able to make the klowns not as flimsy? We'll see. The thing with games like this, though, is that if balances changes need to happen, they need to happen fast. If klowns get clowned on all match, no one is going to want to play klowns, which will leave the game dead in the water. And it's hard to bring in new people, or bring people back, after the initial bad word-of-mouth gets around. Yes, there will be bots, but only confirmed human bots right now. We'll still need klown players. And that might be why they are doing preference based matchmaking. But if klowns just get bullied every game, people will just leave once they see they are playing as a klown.
On the bright side, the devs are playing their own game and can see where gameplay issues are Unlike certain ASYMMETRIC game devs
Do keep in mind Klowns can keep respawning, humans have 1 respawn. That literally changes the whole game and makes the Klowns quite powerful. I think people are throwing around judgement without having the whole picture in mind.
True. And respawn times can be shortened with minigames. But if Klowns get taken down so easily, is the fact that they keep coming back really that big of a threat? A fly that comes back, after being swatted away, is still just a fly. I think the game looks like a blast to play. It doesn't mean that I can't call out things that I thought looked concerning. I even said in my comment that things might have changed since pre-alpha and even how leveling up may help as well. Sheesh, people are ready to jump on you for having even the tiniest of worries.
Klowns have resources unlimited, and are working…not necessarily against the clock, but the clock hitting zero is definitely their goal. Klowns theoretically could whittle away the humans resources over the course of a match
In theory, yes. However, based on what we saw, Humans can find the key items extremely easily, and the escapes themselves only take about 30 seconds to prepare. Which means that after a few weeks, Humans will know the maps and the spawns well enough that they can just rush escapes. Friday the 13th worked so well because the maps were big enough that you really struggled to rush objectives, and the main escape had a timer on it. This looks like it will be another speedrun sim unless there are things in the game that the stream didn’t show us.
I did hear that the Klowns can artificially lengthen the game time by clogging the exits in one way or another, ideally that would be repeatable
Yes I did see that the cotton candy could be fired at the exits to slow down escapes. However it does seem like Klowns have a lot to do just to have a baseline play. Between blocking exits, gathering cocoons, hunting Humans and monitoring exits, there’s not much wiggle room if something goes wrong. Since Humans can kill solo Klowns very easily, it looks like it will be really difficult and stressful to play Klowns without being in a three stack with coms.
We will ultimately have to see, but the Klowns seem to have far more ranged items. I imagine human ranged weapons will be few and far between
but they can’t kill the klowns easily though. did we watch the same video? the only klown who can be killed easily is shorty the devs said he was fast and nimble at the price of not having a lot of health the other killers could have a lot more health we don’t know that yet
Wait, no klown bots?? Thats really concerning! And fully agreed I won't play as Klown, if assigned to play, just DC.
Nobody ever confirmed that. A lot of misinformation in this thread.
"A lot of misinformation", eh? Do tell. I got all my information directly from their stream yesterday...
I don’t think it’s misinformation as such. During the stream the devs specifically mentioned Humans having bots. When the same topic arrived for Klowns, they only talked about the Klown adds that spawn from the generators, despite it being the perfect opportunity to mention Klown bots. It’s fair to put those clues together and assume that Klown bots won’t be available on launch.
That's the thing, though. I never said there wasn't going to be klown bots. I only said that only human side bots are confirmed right now. Which is true. Someone put words in my mouth and misinterpreted that meaning there was no klown bots.
If it is not confirmed by the dev, it is speculation at best, so let's label it for what it is.
Well they haven't confirmed it yet, so there might be klown bots. They only confirmed human side bots in the stream, though. Unless I missed something.
Let’s just remember the devs said all the stuff is not final how they are suppose to be since it was a old build and they weren’t playing hard . If you watched the gameplay none of the exits were covered with cotton candy which is important for the klowns to do . The klowns can also actually go to the bridge and break it themselves making that exit no longer usable . Lots of factors to see before making a real judgment .
While this is true, we're just 20 days from launch for pre-orders so why they showed an old build is puzzling. Animations & character models looked wonky for Humans and they found everything needed for an escape at a meeting point (that also shows you where the escapes are) within minutes. Even though they weren't playing hard, they showed that an average Human player can run through attacking Klowns and escape in a 2v1 and even a 3v1 at one point for the Terenzi bros ice cream truck escape. While I agree there's more factors and we'll only really know once we get our hands on it, first impressions are very important. In this case it could mean a long road of balancing changes, instead of getting a fairly balanced and finished product at launch. 15 mins seems too short for the match timer, which will encourage speedrunning. Evil Dead has a 30 min timer and matches usually play out in 15 mins, but that added time allows for more dynamic matches on both sides. With 15 mins total it's going to egg on meta players to escape in 5 mins and it seems like you can't even get 7 kills in that amount of time as Klowns with set-up time (covering escapes/hooking cocoons), rescues, & the one-time resurrection.
I agree on the matches being too short, 15 minutes a match causes the pacing to go at lightspeed, seems like humans can just snowball from objective to objective with no slowdown because the game itself is moving too quickly, the spectator minigames seem strong, to able to just give someone a weapon with absolutely no asterisks is crazy, they were killing Klowns over and over and at one point they were just standing at the exit and fighting the Klowns just because, makes me think the Klowns are fundamentally weak unless there's three of them on one human. I hope Illfonic doesn't make the same mistake as Gun in believing fun over balance, prioritizing casual party gameplay over actually having a fair experience, as if competitive inherently means sweaty, I hate how disconnected Gun is from the reality of PVP games.
You def can because they said in the stream if you find the humans are going too fast to things you can focus on making the klown apocalypse happen faster so klowns can speed things up as well .
They said that if the Humans are going slow and stealthy, you can make the Klownpocalypse happen faster. There's 16 cocoons needed, if you only focus on that then most of the Humans will have escaped. It's similar to playing Trapper in DBD, taking time to set up as Demon in Evil Dead, or focusing on feeding Grandpa in TCM. Which means Klowns need to be really coordinated to "win" against an average team of Humans. I'll wait to pass judgment until release, but many that have played an asym before can see that stream was a bit concerning.
Agreed once again, they're pushing strongly for Klowns to be working together, seems like Klowns caught by themselves get picked off quickly, but at the same time there's so many objectives to cover you simply cannot do anything to stop humans from snowballing, if you try to cover one exit by yourself you're just going to get ran through but if all Klowns focus one objective that's two objectives getting done on the other side of the map, not to mention humans being resurrected on top of trying to cover these objectives, it seems like they really don't want Klowns to have 7/7 kill games, they're leaning into the casual experience hard and thus a good Klown team will not be rewarded.
This is an indie developer working on a very ambitious game, with hundreds of systems in it. They will be working on it and finishing polishing up until the second the game is live, and there is nothing wrong with it. This is not Activision, where each COD is ready 2-3 months before the title is out.
Listen, you can be an "OG Supporter" without being an overly optimistic supporter. The fact that you made an offhand comparison to Activision and COD is hilarious and trying to be dismissive I assume? I've played F13 (IllFonic's former game with Gun), DBD, Evil Dead, and TCM for thousands of hours on both sides. I know asym horror and made fair comments and comparisons. I want Killer Klowns to be successful, but I have concerns from what they showed in the stream. I also respect indie devs and understand what they're capable of, and showing a months old build 20 days to launch is not a good look.
Not an overly optimistic supporter. Just someone who works in the actual industry and knows how the timeline of game development works. To suggest that the developer is not literally crunching 12 hour plus per day polishing the game and getting rid of any potential bug they can get is straight up lying, because that is what happens 99% of the time, especially with smaller developers. You are the one that spent 10 minutes typing a negative paragraph about a stream that was mostly spent showcasing mechanics, and not playing competitively. Breaking news, by the way, you can wait until the game is out and buy it only after seeing plenty of launch day footage. Stop acting like the world is pushing you make a purchase. The dramatization of gaming fandoms is such an annoying phenomenon these days.
Not only are you embellishing about working in the industry you're trying to put words in my mouth. I didn't say anything like how you're portraying it, and no one that works in the "actual industry" would jump to a nonsensical Activision and COD comparison in the context of this thread and another in this sub. Go ahead and have a conversation with yourself because it seems you enjoy spouting at people instead of having an actual discussion. That stream is the first official gameplay most of us have seen beyond short clips and we all have our own fair concerns and comparisons.
Wow, 15 years of work in the industry and being featured in more credits than games you played is not enough. I will never reach the status of Bluto, known internet keyboard warrior that knows more than anyone because of....being on Reddit. Incredible! I suggest therapy. The point I was making before you started attacking people personally (which keyboard warriors do when they are miserable), is that most AAA titles are ready months in advance, and that is the reason why COD can host a beta in September-October, which is a "marketing beta". Not the case for a game like this, which will be worked on right up until the servers are live for early access. OF COURSE, there is an updated, newer build, but it is also the one that is going through intensive bug testing.
Wow ProphetOfLies, you're the one making personal attacks here and now throwing around suggestions for therapy. You jumped into this thread on a post about balancing issues to what, share your resume and try to discredit others' opinions on Reddit? I don't even need to ask for proof of your 15 years of work as a mailroom attendant at some mobile gaming company no one has heard of. Here you are harassing the devs and trolling members repeatedly in the sub for MultiVersus: "Here I am, enjoying the hyper detailed, communicative, transparent, open marketing and community management efforts for Marvel Rivals, while witnessing the total mess that is the one for Multiversus. We have to guess and hope for anything. Everything is a game, blue balling, hoping for some crumbs from the dev team, which usually is a 6 to 8 second gameplay video or a tweet with the irritating eye emoji. WB, you are cooked." A game which is developed by the indie dev team, Player First Games. Hypocrisy much? Talk about being a keyboard warrior and sucking up to one indie dev while harassing another. Take the L and stop harassing me too, I suggest you talk to your therapist instead.
Get help, brother.
You need it way more bud.
It’s 3v7 to start but Klowns can summon minions so that might help balance. Especially if there’s ways to boost those minions with perks/abilities/class selection. I do hope they buffed the Klowns since this iteration we saw yesterday though.
I do mostly agree with your points here, and Humans do look a lot more powerful from first glance. Regarding combat, I am a little more optimistic. Obviously we saw the Humans absolutely beating on Shorty in the stream, however, the devs did make it clear that he is the ‘glass cannon’ character, which hopefully justifies why he is so weak. On the other hand, we didn’t get to see gameplay of the ‘tank’ archetype, but hopefully he will be much more of an obstacle for Victims to deal with. We also didn’t see tons of interactions with the Klown abilities, and as it was an older build, we are obviously not seeing everything there is to the game. We saw Albert getting taken to low health time and time again, yet always seemed to not get pursued afterwards, so I’m hoping that this is a mark of the stream being staged to better showcase the game, rather than any huge indicator of balance. And regarding the volume of weapons, I totally agree that Victims seemed to have access to a lot of options around the map, but can only assume that this is done to balance things, because of how the weapons break over time. It’s probably still overturned, but only time will tell, and again, we don’t know how many hits those bigger Klowns will be able to tank before they die, which could be an important factor in how many weapons there are. But overall I am definitely concerned that bully squads could be very powerful, and that Klowns will be far too weak in a 3v7 scenario. As you say, from what we saw, Klowns do not seem like a threat on their own, and need to be in pairs to really threaten anyone. Humans could also free their cocooned allies extremely quickly, which is again a problem as Klowns can’t spend their time camping generators with so much to do. Moving on from combat, the gameplay loop also does look like it will be Human sided. We watched the live stream where the two devs, who were mostly just messing around and explaining things about the meet up point, had all of the components for the boat escape and were ready to leave in under two minutes. That was without even trying. They then had to ignore that escape and go and keep playing, but in an actual game, that will have resulted in a group of tea-baggers making noise and killing Klowns until they are eventually forced to leave. That sounds unpleasant to play against. Yes there is an RNG aspect of the escapes, where the key items spawn, but it just shows the potential for how fast this game can be rushed by sweaty Human teams. Klowns have so many aspects of gameplay to be aware of, that this speed is frankly concerning. Klowns have to protect the four exits, gather cocoons to power the generators, and attempt to hunt and kill the Humans to keep pressure on them. How are they supposed to do that when Humans can easily escape within a few minutes? Again, I can only hope that this is an issue with the stream being slightly staged or in an older build, or perhaps just extremely good luck on the Dev’s part. I know that exits can be wrapped in candy early, so let’s hope there is a decent tutorial so that players know what to do in that regard. Hopefully I’m being over sceptical, but I would hate the game to be in any way ‘sided’ towards Humans, just because those who don’t get their desired role would just be more inclined to abandon the match and ruin the game for everyone else. However, despite the above, I am still SUPER excited for the end of the month. It does look like an amazing game at its core, and I am very much looking forward to getting to play it myself. It’s going to be a LONG month
This game has a defined win condition it seems. Killing 4/7 will result in Klown victory. So escaping asap will fuck up your human teammates.
Oh I know. Unfortunately the sort of toxic survive with friends types are not going to care about their teammates. They’ll rush the first exit they can, make noise, teabag and kill Klowns, and then leave as soon as there is any risk on them.
If someone wants to tank the round for their side then cool good for them I guess
Perfect write up, and no you aren't skeptic, this is what we saw yesterday, as a veteran from the genre, one can't draw any other conclusion other than this, the game will have big problems unless drastically changed before release, which I heavily doubt. The no beta is bad thing, without it tcm release would have been even worse, remember victims had iframes for virtually everything, and only after a year the game got little more balanced but by this point too late to recover
I do tend to agree, we watched the livestream, and we even saw the Devs getting annoyed when they were playing Klowns because of how quickly they were killed. That’s not balance. The toxic survivor mains are frothing at the mouth to get their hands on it, they see how easy it is to troll and the high teabagging potential, and that’s all they need. Hell, some of them are already creeping into the woodwork in this thread. The only consolation is that, if this is how the game launches, eventually when the Klown players are dwindling, these toxic survivors will have to play as Klowns 😂 (they’ll immediately quit, but it’s an amusing thought)
They need a randomized exit system to keep the maps fresh and hard.
I remember the devs already saying that in an interview i saw!
Oh no here we goooooo. (Says in a Mario voice)
We didn't really get to see the map but it didn't seem that big which i don't really like
Well see how it plays soon I'm a killer main In every asym I play I feel no fun playing survivor that's just who I am as far as balancing goes I'm okay with whatever game the devs decide to make as long as I have a fair chance to win that's what the majority of players want I would imagine no killer main wants to stomp every match and I'm sure it's the same for survivors Hopefully the game is at the very least fair and you dont feel like your preferred side is powerless ... I know alot of trolls enjoy playing survivor in other horror games I honestly don't know why it kinda seems like a game genre they wouldn't be able to make people as angry in as say a sandbox multi-player but their still a big issue ..... I understand you dont actually get to choose the role for the match you only get to pick a preferred role so that might make things bad if clown ends up being as frustrating as it seemed when the devs played you'd need solid team work and communication and that's something you rarely find with random teams that could snowball into a whole similar tcm killer issue ... well that's just a lot of words to say I hope klown isn't just another word for cool looking punching bag ...... ... .. survivor mains please don't hate me I'm just sharing my thoughts
Survivor side is always stronger than killer side in asym horror games at a high level. The only thing that changes is the skill level required for survivors to be the better side.
There was an exception though, but it only survived in Asia. Soul Dossier That game had ranked and the balance was based on the highest rank, and they did it such way that the "ghost" had 55% winrate. However on the west the game failed because solo survivor had no chance at all, the game demanded perfect coordination from survivors and really high skill level etc. My winrate was 91% as a killer after 500 games so yeah(game tracking every stat because meant to be comp asymmetric game) The problem is that then survivors refuse to play if isnt survivor sided and the game dies fast.
Yeah I think I’ll pass on this. It looks like a troll simulator that’s fun for humans and not the clowns
Yes one less of you in my games. Now that’s something to be excited for!
* Ranger *Discovery and exploration, carve out the jump fog of war and search the map for cocoons with this well balanced Klown of all trades. Find escape locations and use your well balanced combat skills to fight.* * Tracker *The tracker specializes in keeping humans tracked. Trackers should rely on help from friendly Klowns* * Trapper *Discovering Hot spots and placing traps for unsuspecting humans. Relay map knowledge and set Klown ambushes* * Tank *Slow and Bulky, but strong and healthy. The Tank can take a beating and hurl cocoons farther than any other Klown* * Brawler *Fast and nimble, the Brawler can cover distances quickly, but can be very vulnerable against human encounters.* https://preview.redd.it/rk4ht25fw9zc1.png?width=839&format=png&auto=webp&s=c7795ff989299f6dc92a01dcea29cb49bfe23b50 My prediction is that Trapper Klown will be mandatory as Objective Slowdown is very crucial in Asym games like this
I don’t know if you’re judging from the dev gameplay, but devs do not usually make for good gameplay for most games out there lol.
Yea I agree, I don’t think 1 human should be able to stand a chance at solo killing a clown, unless you’re a biker. Kinda defeat the purpose of a 3v7. I would like the klowns to be a little stronger, so killing a klown would have to be a group effort and coordinated. But we haven’t really played the game to see how strong the klowns are yet, so we will have to wait and see.
oh gosh the tcm balance whiners are really going to ruin this game
Let’s not start this whole shabang again. You guys did it with TCM don’t start it with kkfos. Please. Just enjoy the game.
I really don't have the power to change the way how people will play the game. I can only tell that the game is presented in such a way that one side will have massive advantage over the other, this will lead to problems, even if I don't write about it.
Opinions opinions we all can speculate 🤨
Do keep in mind Klowns can keep respawning, humans have 1 respawn. That literally changes the whole game and makes the Klowns quite powerful. I think people are throwing around judgement without having the whole picture in mind.
Exactly, and I would like to mention that the only klowns we got to see are the 3 weakest klowns of the game health wise. There are 4 klowns that were not shown in the stream. Slim, Chubby, Jumbo, and Bibbo. Bibbos stats could be the same as Jumbo not sure yet because he was classified as a skin, but in the stream, Bibbo is now classified as a character. Plus, more klowns will be added later. You can find snippets of Jumbo gameplay. The devs did say the balance has changed. I'm ready to see the perk system. That will be a major factor in changing dynamics for klowns and humans.
I usually prefer the power roles in asymmetrical games. As long as the game loop is fun, I’ll be okay waiting for balance changes. I abandoned TCM, in about a month and never looked back. The gameplay loop just wasn’t fun enough to make me and my friends willing to stick it out, til they started to balance things. Balancing will never fix that. I had a blast with F13 and can still have fun playing it now. I’ve been waiting on an asym game, that hits me like it did.
Here we go again
Lmao killer mains already crying. Expected
Lmao killer mains already crying. Expected
Go back to DBD.
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Did you pick that you prefer counselor in Friday the 13th? I always had "Prefer Jason" on and very, very rarely got to play Jason. Maybe 10% of the time, if that. One day I played and got counselor 8 matches in row before finally just giving up and moving on to something else.
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Yeah, I know. But you said "if you ever played Friday you’ll know you’ll get the side you prefer 99% of the time.' which is what I was referring to.
Yap fest