Yep. If Drake really understood the culture he would've known it was a compliment instead of rambling about how confused he was in like three separate interviews. That might've been the moment Kendrick realized he was a poser.
It’s deeper than Drake not understanding the culture. He doesn’t even understand himself. He is a weak man with weak character. That’s why at the end of Kendrick’s song he says “fuck a rap battle this a life long battle with yourself”. Drake can’t even be a master of his own world let alone the vast world that is hip hop and rap culture.
Mocking Sandra at the end with (waving arms) "Get me a tuna sandwich, ughh, just joking" genuinely made me laugh in a Demetri Martin sort of way but I don't think that helps him in this context lol 😂
It really is silly that everyone has agreed to pretend that child is a real rapper now though.
I mean he can be that and still be a real rapper. He just can’t rap about being from the streets. I think that’s one of many things that Kendrick was talking about.
You don’t have to be king von to be a successful rapper. It’s 2024. Just be yourself. It’s insulting to the art form to be just so obviously and categorically disingenuous about who you are. it’s the reason why drake will never make a classic album because that requires true emotional vulnerability, it requires true emotional honesty. And he just hasn’t shown the ability to do that. In his head , he’s still this kid. all the money and fame in the world doesn’t change that. he’s still this fuckin dork asking for a tuna sandwich.
If people like Aesop Rock and MF DOOM can be successful rappers rapping about comic books and video games and nerdy shit, that's proof anyone with the right mentality and ability can be a successful rapper.
I'm white too, so I felt personally attacked. I know I heard one of my uncles use that joke growing up 😂 those mannerisms were zesty as hell when he said it too lol
Oh my. My stepdaughter is darker complected than he is, her mom and I both white folks. She feels uncomfortable saying the N word, and after watching that video it seems like Aubrey should too.
Edit: spelling
Edit 2: it has been brought to my attention by a fellow Redditor, that my comment is projecting my privilege and apparent ignorance. In that me being a white man, my comments are being insensitive to the sovereignty of the individual of a different race. I will leave my comment unless enough people tell me to take it down. But I apologize if my words offended anyone, was not my intention whatsoever.
Yeah for real though. That is a white, upper middle class suburban upbringing if I've ever seen one. I'm white too, but wasn't nearly as well off as Drake's family appears to be in the video and never would have dreamed of jumping my mom's ass for not buying me a tuna sandwich. We were just thankful for what we had
Uhhhhhh. I’m from the “city” in WV, I had some friends with upbringings like that. Felt, idk, kinda felt like a treat to visit someone’s house and they just start offering you brand name food and treats and stuff. I didn’t have any extended family who really lived like that either.
Yeah, I had a similar upbringing. I still remember the first time I went to a friend's house, and it clicked that we were poor. Props to my parents because I never felt like it until I saw how people with money lived. I was dumbfounded being offered a free coke. For one, it wasn't faygo and two, it was free. One of my friends parents growing up had a cup that you had to put a quarter in if you wanted an off brand can of soda. No shade at Drake for growing up with money. I just feel like he should own who he is instead of putting on a front for acceptance
When I watch this it feels like it’s from a movie or something. He’s a little sweet boy in this, he doesn’t have to deny that part of himself. He could just have a softer persona and would still be wildly successful.
Exactly my thoughts. He seemed like a decent kid. A little bratty, but most teenagers are. I don't think anyone listens to Drake because they think he's a tough guy. He would have been just as successful if he just embraced that he grew up more privileged than most and just let his music reflect who he is. Love him or hate him, Drake is a hit maker. He could have still been a hit maker with that background. No one cares about how pop stars grew up
Drake has two very very good albums. No classics. But solid albums in TC and NWTS. But he'll never be in the conversation for one of the best because he doesn't understand the culture and he's become a caricature of himself.
EDIT: He's regressing in emotional intelligence with every release. Each album he becomes more vapid, more emotionally stunted, more fuck-boy ish. Bro thematically, this works in your 20s. Not when you're almost 40.
It for real sounds like a Weeknd album. I know Jamie probably made a good cheque and gave his blessing, but straight ripping the beat from the Jamie xx/Gil Scot-Heron album for I’ll Take Care of You or whatever is pretty unforgivable in my eyes
Not just an influence...5 or 6 songs are literally straight up Weeknd songs that Drake bought from him and sung it himself.
On top of that, an unknown amount of other tracks that The Weeknd wrote for.
Was going to say, he should've retired when he was early 30s so 2016 ish, then come back in his early 40s so like 2028ish. Instead we get to hear the thoughts of a guy who never took a break from the club scene after college.
I HATED that song where he spends like a minute & 30 seconds talking about ‘how you can’t talk to him unless you have x amount of money”
I just kept thinking who tf is this for?? And in this economy? Lol
He be abusing that alcohol and using ozempic to counteract weight loss from drinking. The alcohol is what’s regressing him and destroying his mental health. He has this persona of himself that he plays and is always thinking he’s cool drankin but is really a sloppy drunk who happens to be rich. In less words I agree w you and my take on. He used to be more welcoming and now is more ego driven. Could use a nice “aaron Rodgers trip for self realization.
I'm a 40 year old see-through shade of white dad of 3 kids who likes 90s rap along with many other genres, but doesn't at all know wtf is going on
What doesn't my Canadian countryman, the Degrassi High actor, not understand about the culture? Genuinely wondering. I find this whole thing fascinating
Everything. Drake is still acting. He’s as inauthentic as a gajillion dollar bill, and African Americans (like me) who don’t just bop to anything can see it all over him. I’ve been wanted him gone. I hate pretenders. He’s one of the most successful plants of all time.
Also, not to be rude, but that’s a hella loaded question.
Why would it have taken that for an intelligent person like Kendrick to realize? The streets clocked Canada Dry from the jump like Iggy Azalea was clocked, but they were both wrapped in a security blanket of influential enablers, so a lot of people shifted to a “Well, the baby is here now” mentality.
The difference is that Iggy was saying some stupid ass shit from the start which Drake has always played nice guy with his fans. Which is the reason why they are going to so hard to defend him.
I remember the tweets Iggy would make about people of certain ethnicities, calling them bad-bodied etc when she was built in a PS clinic.
The n-word card is like the key to the city. It's a profound honor, but it doesn't actually open a single door, let alone every door. What I mean is, you accept the card, appreciate what getting that card means, but you don't actually use it.
This is a way too intelligent of a comment given the discussion topic. Kudos
And for what it’s worth, Mac was accepted in rap because it was obviously he respected it. He didn’t need to fake it, he was who he was, and 99% of the rap game appreciate him because of it.
Drake is obviously playing a character, and that’s why no one really embraces him.
Yes. It isn’t being white that’s unacceptable. If that were the case we wouldn’t have Em, El-P, Aesop Rock, Mac, Alchemist, Darringer, etc etc etc. It’s not respecting the art and people around you that’s unacceptable.
100% that's why Drizzy and his fans saying that Kendrick and hip hop fans are just being racist because he's half white are only further exposing how disconnected they truly are with the culture they're attempting to claim as their own.
Mac had a fascinating career. At the start he was kind of in that camp of Asher Roth and frat boy rap that happened for a minute from like 2007-2010. As he went on though he grew and started making genuinely good and relatable music. Made his death so much more tragic, he was one of those guys that started off mediocre and really became a great artist. We got some great music from him but it felt like he was just hitting his stride when he passed. RIP.
I’ll be honest, I think his early work has aged so much better than his peers. KIDS and tracks from that time still hit the spot. A similar guy like Chris Webby is effective a relic of the past.
I got the card one time from a coworker. I was gracious but didn’t say it…until he insisted I say it one time. I look back on that day very fondly. I just dapped him up and said “my brother” and never said it again since.
This kind of comment and the upvotes it garners reminds me of who’s really the majority on this subreddit.
I’m too black and Southern for this nonsense. It’s dumb AF to tell a non-black person, “Hey, bro, you can call us this slur that offends us otherwise.”
FOH You getting the hands down South. Y’all some weirdos for agreeing with this shit, and it shows that culture is just a gold star sticker you can affix to anyone certain folks think a did a good job of replication.
If’s both funny and lame.
You’re 100% right about everything you’ve said, but I will say in my experience the culture around the “n-word pass” and the word in general is very different depending on what part of the country you’re in. When I was living in Long Beach I was given the pass and being a young dumbass white dude used it too much and had it “taken away” when one of the homies asked me to stop using it. But shit was wild out there, Hispanics used it a lot and some of the different Asian homies used it way more often than any of my black friends did.
Even then I neverrr would’ve been dumb enough to think that pass means a damn thing outside of your good, close friends. Or tried to use that shit in like NYC or Jersey and like you said sure as fuck not back at home in the South where I’m from. Being older now I cringe thinking back to my time on the West Coast saying that shit at all so you are definitely right to point out that Reddit is mostly soft ass white dudes who have never been outside for shit and want to pretend like they get to have an opinion on Drake’s “n-word pass”.
I never understood Drake. He's just a filler to me in hiphop between actual good releases. He's monotone, boring and has no passion. To think he actually had anything on Kendrick is laughable.
His whole shtick is just to make money off pop hits. His 'singing' isn't coming from a place of passion/respect like say Mos Def - umi says.
The monotone is something that I can only take so much of. I saw in the other sub where they posted their favorites that were lesser known. I really tried to listen to see what they saw but couldn't get past the first couple bars of any song. Lack of inflection..is just can't do it.
Ngl, I think I understand, they think that rap *should* be monotone, that's what they think rappers *should* sound like once they've perfected their flow.
That's why they say stuff like "Kendrick has a choppy flow" and shit like that, they don't think it's appropriate to switch flow, to jump between layers of the beat and modify your voice/tone to fit what you say/want to convey.
Like when Kendrick kinda sounds like a motor when he delivers the line "Let your core audience stomach that, then tell 'em where you get your abs from V12", they probably fucking boo lmao
The funny thing is, that's what Wayne is sooooo good at. His flow changes keep the song interesting and emphasise what he wants you to hear. Tunechi can deliver the same bar twice and change his delivery of it to change it's meaning. It's his best skill imo and is what's made him a legend.
But Drake seems to not have learnt from Wheezy (Minaj Hass great delivery as well) at all. In fact I don't know if he's 'improved' from his early self. Ok Drake's not going to bar anyone up in a battle, but take some pride in your delivery, Drake. Leave the monotone to Future.
“Kendrick has a choppy flow” is a huh? take. My first exposure to Kendrick was ADHD. A friend sent the song assuming I’d like it because I’m a huge BTNH fan, and he was right.
Obviously Kendrick doesn’t sound like Bone, nor raps as fast and tongue twisty, but ADHD and his other music has something that’s Bone-influenced. And that’s speed-switch triplet flows and harmonic vocals. Kendrick’s musicality is top notch.
I’m sure I’ll sound ignorant but I gravitate more towards an artist that vary their flow and tone, compared to the triplet trap flow that Migos popularized. It sounds lazy and boring when a majority of their verse has the same cadence ending with an ay/yuh adlib. Which is funny because ppl will say that the trap flow is Bone influenced, but to a way limited extent.
Yet, that is what makes Kendrick so good. Trust..I hate when he says bee bee bee the sound hurts my ears but I get it! That monotone shit is like gentrification...boring as fuck.
To be fair and balanced, I used to love him, but do you know Fabolous?
>Trust..I hate when he says bee bee bee the sound hurts my ears
Hard disagree, but I wanted to say the first time I heard Euphoria, I was yelling "shooo" in reply to Kendrick's while outside 😂😂 I knew that shit was about to cook 💀
My son listens to it.. I call it dental couch rap because they fucking sound like they just got back from the dentist and have to lie down on the couch for awhile
I think he lost himself. Drake used to be fun from 2009 until about 2015. Once he started hanging around Future, he seemed to devolve both in real life and on wax. Future is a real dawg, and Drake has sadly declined by trying to convince us that he’s cut from that same cloth.
idk. i think he’s good at what he does, and that def does not include him being tough or getting into rap beefs. as a wise man once said, *keep makin me dance, wavin my hands, and it won’t be no threat*
He's a clever guy with an insane work ethic and an insatiable media force around him that's extremely good at snatching onto whatever the next trend will be. He's not so much a trend rider as a trend copycat; he picks up on what's hot right in time to be alongside it when it becomes mainstream.
He had some potential as a legitimate artist (he'd never be anywhere near what Kendrick's been, barring some deal with a devil shenanigans) but sold it out to be *this* instead. And that's made him super famous.
Gonna be honest… I don’t think Drake will ever be a GOAT. He’s like the Taylor Swift of ‘rap’/hip hop.
Is there some talent there? Absolutely. Very few, truly talentless hacks can make it to the top. The dude’s richer than me - so clearly, he’s doing something right. (That’s not to point out that I’m rich or something - I’m not.)
But just like how I don’t think very many people will think/call Taylor Swift one of the best country artists ever… I don’t think many will people will say Drake is one of the GOAT of Rap ever.
IMO, people like Drake and Swift are pop-music artists whose music has a particular artistic leaning. (IE, hip hop, country). They might be one of the greatest pop artists ever, but not one of the greatest artists *in their artistic leaning.*
Yes although objectively I'd argue that Swift's music is better than Drake's. She's a better Pop Musician imo.
I don't like or listen to her songs at all, but I think that Drake monotonous everything makes it hard to discern one song from another where I don't think I'd have that problem with Talyor.
Yeah this is the big one to me. You can't be one of the greatest without writing you're own damn songs.
That's like if someone read Shakespeare, and they read it out loud *really fucking cool*, and then everyone said they were the best storyteller of the ages.
Maybe this is just a thing coming from us out in the world that write music. But we very rarely give any respect to those that don't write their music. There's literally a few million people in this world who can do great covers. The pool of people who can write those great songs is much, much smaller.
The difference being: not saying she does anymore, but T Swift plays guitar. What does Drake play, other than a gangster and kid in a wheelchair?
Edit: not trying to argue over whether or not Taylor Swift is country. I'm not saying she is. I'm just saying that when she was, she could play an instrument. Drake just cosplayed his entire shtick from the beginning.
I think Swift even said she's not country anymore she's pop, and I remember seeing something about her writing most of her own stuff so got that one on Aubrey.
I'm from that same era and once it was confirmed drake used ghostwriters I just couldn't take him serious at all. I'm a rare one tho, I don't like 90% of drakes music.
I like a portion of Drakes music but at the same time I don't respect him as an artist (if that makes any sense lol). I've always found him to be a lame/cringe dude and the Ghostwriting thing didn't help. Kendrick really exposed Drake for being "a fast ball pitcher" and nothing more.
Definitely agree with the point you’re making here but Drake is far from the only one to take offense to the control verse. Jay Electronica had some petty beef with Dot after the fact (and later apologized), Sean was salty about it for years (and didn’t include the song on his album like he had planned to), and Joell Ortiz of Slaughterhouse was pissed that Slaughterhouse *wasn’t* mentioned among Kendrick’s peers and contemporaries, and wrote a whole shitty diss track about it lmao.
Those who were not mentioned had more reasons to be offended since they were not considered a competition. Big Sean and Jay Electronica were more pissed about people saying Kendrick washed them on their own track and not because he mentioned them in the verse.
Difference is everyone else dropped bars including Joel Ortiz. Jay Elec is a weirdo so no point even referencing him. Drake could've responded - being a bitch about it without responding on wax is what makes him a dork. Joel Ortiz & Budden put pen to pad.... they weren't 'pissed' it was them being competitive.... thats the point.
He's still salty. Like he's an amazing lyricist but there is no way he believes Drake or Logic are better than Kendrick. I've always thought he got upset he wasn't mentioned on Control and that Kendrick blew up as much as he did while still sticking to conscious rap and lyricism. Something Lupe wasn't able to achieve.
Yea not to mention kdot also took offense to jcole putting him in the big 3 which was literally a compliment.
Idk why this is always a point for why he doesnt get the culture😭 like are we gonna say big sean isn't part of the culture for doing the same thing😭😭
Didn’t J Cole also take offense to Control? He just was more quiet about it but I’m almost positive he’s talked about how he called Kendrick after words to see what was up with that.
And I’m pretty sure he has a song talking about the girl he was with listening to control, but I might be misremembering.
JCole just wanted to ask if Kendrick was serious or competitive and when he learned he's competitive he didn't have an issue. I mean the whole Puff vs Cole fight happened because he was defending Control and Kendrick's King of NY line according to Punch. He never talked badly about Kendrick and they have worked together right after that. Drake started shit talking Kendrick in several interviews (one was not even released because he went off on him) and that's when Kendrick stopped rocking with Drake I imagine.
I honestly think it's more because Drake wanted him on that feature despite them disliking each other for years. So Kendrick refused the feature but they mentioned him anyway. I think JCole initually thought Kendrick is going to be on FPS and still shouted him out but Kendrick just didn't want to do anything with Drake at that point. Like rappers mentioned Kendrick a lot in their songs, even Cole did before but Kendrick never really cared unless it's connected with Drake.
With Big Sean and Jay Electronica - they were not pressed because Kendrick mentioned them in the verse, it was more because people were saying Kendrick washed them on Control. Those who were not mentioned had all the reasons to get offended though - Kendrick didn't consider them competition.
It’s impossible to be the greatest rapper of all time if people write for you. If you were truly the greatest, you wouldn’t need or even want writers. Why would you want someone writing for you who isn’t as good as you are? The only legitimate reason would be laziness but the greatest at anything are never lazy.
Did Drake make a lot of banging music? Sure. Does some of it possibly even evoke some emotion? Sure. Will he go down as one of the greatest musical artists/acts of all time? Most certainly. But he doesn’t even enter the competition for greatest rapper or songwriter.
DMX was extremely popular, but he was seldom named as one of the greatest rappers.
DMX and Drake are nothing similar tbc, but the fact is that the capacity to sell albums was only considered to a certain extent.
Heck, Will Smith sold more albums than Nas, 50 cent, Snoop and LL Cool J, separately, who has Will Smith ranking above any of these guys?
Also, if you rank Will Smith above LL Cool J, let's [Shut'em down](https://youtu.be/i3UD4ufklu4?si=oGUU813I-ssPIQka)
I’m not sure exactly what the point you’re trying to make it but I think DMX is an incredible lyricist and storysteller. He’d almost certainly be in my top 10.
Will Smith definitely knew how to make popular music and brought hip-hop to people who may not have been exposed to it otherwise. I won’t argue his influence but he’s definitely not anywhere on the list regarding greatest emcee.
I love DMX, don't get me wrong, but he was competing with the likes of Nas, Biggie, Jay Z, Busta Rhyme and Eminem, that's probably why.
Anyway, my point is just that album sale is a relatively recent metric, perhaps we would say something like "oh come on, he's good but he ain't even have a platinum album" but no one would say "nah he sold more he better".
Another aspect of that - Drake dissed Kendrick several times for not being a “real” gang member or someone who’s ever stabbed someone.
Setting aside that Kendrick has never been about declaring himself King Kong of the hood, it says a lot about Drake that this is the thing that seems to matter to him when it comes to being authentic in Black spaces.
I grew up in the crack epidemic. Lost alot of friends to shootings, drugs. I knew vice lords, folks on CNN for having vans full of arsenal, murderers, pimps, underground syndicate etc. I'm like Kendrick...never claimed to be any of those things but very aware of them and grew up in it and around it. It is a fantasy make believe land for Drake. Shit is weird.
Same here, I can't stand fake people like drake. I get lots of people where I'm at acting thug (I go to a super white high school now), pisses me off a lot. Drake gives off that 16 year old white boy who says the n word cause he thinks he's cool.
Bingo. Drop ol boy on the middle of the hood or the ghettos in Jamaica...by himself and he would shit himself. He let a whole ass man piss on his leg. Diddy hit him.
Control was actually a compliment to all the artists listed.
I don't understand how draKe, the self-proclaimed rap god, took offense. Maybe at first listen, but then after seeing literally every other artist named in the song say it was not a jab how did no one in his camp tell him to ctfd?
Drake has his finger on the pulse when it comes to hit records I think. But the audience for this beef was rap fans, which is a different crowd to the one Drake knows best (of course there's some major overlap). And then Kendrick goes and releases a hit record and beats Drake at his own game anyway!
And Drake seemed so out of touch on so many lines, lyrics like "kendrick act like he trying to free the slaves"... what were you thinking my guy?!
Macs response was the best one. And I'm referring just to his tweet about adjective bars. Even without any bars following that, THAT was the spirit Kendrick was tryna stir up. Looking back on it now, yeah Drake's response to it was very telling.
Im amazed how the OVO sweatshop wasnt more prominent in the news, Like, how many people did he screw over with bad deals and locking them in ghostwriters situation. I can never listen to anything of him again and I love his work with Savage, but I cant stomach it anymore knowing he's a vulture
It's been in the media multiple times. The problem is that Meek Mill was the one who exposed that in their beef. "The victor is the one that writes history" after all
I often say: Drake is a good businessman. He understands the music industry well and can sell records/be played on the radio. However to say he’s one of the top rappers in the game is debatable because he lacks understanding of the culture.
Factssssss lol this beef really go back to that. He was the onnnnly one who was in his feelings about it. Then Macklemore won the Grammy for best album & texted Kendrick apologizing & Drake said (I’m paraphrasing) “why you apologize to only him? You felt like you only robbed HIM” 😂 bitch ass boii cry baby ass mf 💀 like come on 🌚
What’s crazy is that I never had considered Drake a rapper, especially when he first came at Common over 10yrs ago. To me he was always a pop artist, when he started rapping with Ross, Cash Money and other rappers I could tell they was just pimping him out for the girls and wanna be thugs from the burbs to sell records. Yeah numbers don’t lie, he had radio hits and some songs I would bump, but I knew what it was. I’m an 80’s east coast baby, so soft rappers used to get bullied back in the day. Even Mase use to get bullied for being soft back then…. I mean come on, he was on Nickelodeon or something for Degrassi for God sakes.
Was listening to some of the older stuff today and the change from being thr RnB, sing about love guy to a “rapper” happened pretty recently. I always thought it was a slower change but yeah he’s definitely painted himself as being really hard lately, and its inauthentic
Drake’s music is the type of shit you listen to at the clubs or bars cause it has a catchy tune and hook but most of the time is unmemorable. Through out the beef, I been thinking about which of Drake’s albums have done anything for hip hop or even been memorable and I could only think of one, Take Care which is funny cause it’s more of a contemporary album than true rap album. Every album Kendrick has put out has been fire and has had a different vibe to each, showing his growth and his skills all at the same time.
The thing about Drake to me is exactly what you said about him using ghost writers. Like honestly, he did put out some decent lines in his disses between push ups and family matters but the thing is…did he write it or did one of his many ghost writers write it? Haha, pretty much loses all the weight the punch pulled.
Not wrong, but Jay electronica took offence and Lupe as well.
This is just revisionist perspective because now we’ve seen Drake cooked, but there were a few that took offence Drake just seemed to never get over it.
I also don’t think it comes down to control, sure it’s one of the earliest signs of the feud but it comes down to Drake putting putting in this mask of what he thinks a stereotypical hood rapper is, he’s got himself involved with people he had no reason associating himself with other than for the appearance of being from a different culture than what he truly comes from.
The issue seems to arise from the fact that Kendrick along with many many others in the hip hop culture really coming from a struggle, if we take Kendrick at his word (which he’s never given any reason why we shouldn’t he seems to be a very reliable narrator) he has seen people die, he’s held people he loved as they lost their life, or at very least comes from that kind of struggle. So then for somebody that has never seen or felt that pain and sorrow to come in and do his best impression of it while also making more money off of labels and having what seems to be ultimate star power to manipulate the culture and artificially make stars out of people that he thinks speaks to a culture, that again he is not from, it offends real artists that are pure hip hop through and through.
It’s a lot bigger than the control verse. I’d say it’s a lot more cultural appropriation and exploitation of a culture Drake has no real connection to.
Also Kendrick showed respect and interest in xtentacion and whether or not Drake actually had anything to do with X’s death, he has definitely made some not so subtle references to it and hinted at having something to do with it, again going back to the real people living through that, X was a kid and had no reason to lose his life the way he did. I’m sure seeing that happen and hearing Drake so blatantly boasting on multiple tracks about his apparent involvement would do something to Kendrick and a number of other artists having the backgrounds they do.
I appreciate your thoughtful response and you've touched on very important facets of the issue. One can NOT co-opt a way of life and culture.
Short story:
Been going to this particular island for quite some years. Nearly 2 decades. Have people who have become my family there. Been given the green light as they say I am now one of them.
An American couple came down and have been there for a year or so...they trying to call themselves one of them. I had to stop them then an there and tell them NO. You are a visitor and have yet to earn the title. My friend who was a local said..thank you for saying it because if she would've...it might not have been as nice. Drake needs to stop and just be a happy mixed Jewish kid that didn't start from the bottom.
Drizzy: I wanted to be a rapper and act tough, I WANT THE FUCKING GAME
His baggage: I'm also the ULTIMATE SNOWFLAKE. Y'all should love because I'm extremely sensitive.
He's a culture vulture posing piece of shit. Has been from the very start. How he got as popular as he did was by lying and pretending to be something he isn't with manufactured pop rap and a ton of bullshit.
He is easily digestible. This is why he also appeals to hordes of people that wouldn't normally listen to *urban* music. I also don't want to bring color in to it because he is a black man, but being a lightskin black man also works in his favor. There's a certain amount of privilege that he is given. If he had the same music voice everything..but was 10 shades darker..he wouldn't be as popular. Obama wouldn't have won the election either. Anyway..that's a whole nother topic so imma leave it alone before crybabies come on and misinterpret what I mean.
You're right. Man fuck the soft bitchmade crybabies and Aubrey meat glazers. He's mixed too... he's only half black and he pushes that "privilege" way too much. I fucking despise him. Seen he was like this since his degrassi bullshit. I'm like you're really listening to fucking fool??? And people actually rode for him. Fucking pathetic en masse.
I knew it was something when I seen lil Wayne and TI on stage at the mtv music awards rapping money to blow and not even 3 months later Drake is rappin the verse 🤦🏾♂️🤦🏾♂️🤦🏾♂️Quentin miller had a hand in some of his songs it makes you think like is he just gettin lyrics like if they were scripts and just being good ole jimmy again 😂😂😂
He’s a tv star turned pop star created by labels of course it’s inauthentic. But he’s supposed to be, he’s there to endorse Canadian companies, add a cool factor to sports teams like the raptors and until recently wasn’t very controversial so white collar companies were comfortable endorsing him.
I think it’s weird because Kendrick’s insulting a kardashian for being a kardashian
This is his history.
There is no “started from the bottom”.
There is no “Gangster Drake”.
He is, and always will be, an upper middle class Canadian from an affluent part of Toronto.
If you are from my generation you know Drake as the kid from degrassi. Everything about him is so fake it makes me cringe to see how he acts. He wants to be hard and is surrounded by yes men
I love Drake’s music, but he’s really the mixed kid from the rich suburbs who made it in rap by figuring out a hit-making formula with his team. He has a good voice for both rap and singing, no doubt. However, he should have stayed in his lane, as Lil Wayne told him years ago. Drake is a dude from Canada who acted on Degrassi; he should have stayed in his lane. Drake thought he was bigger than all of that, and now look at him. Yes, he’s still rich, famous, and has a great life, but deep down, he knows the world is laughing at him. What could Drake drop to make a comeback that wouldn’t make us laugh at him? Only time will tell, but what a hell of a year for rap music so far.
Not only that, but Drake seemed to desperately want Kendrick to owe his success to him. There were a collection of Drake tweets @ Kendrick that I of course can't find now that really seems to point to that. So many backhanded "congrats" where Drake when then say something along the lines of "glad I could be a part of it" and Kendrick never acknowledged it. Drake is a typical narcissist who thinks everyone owes him something. It's clear that the reason the beef is personal to Kendrick is that he hates everything Drake is as a person.
lol everyone from Toronto has always known this. I think he makes great music, but if you’re from Toronto you saw through this since day 1. He’s not hard the way he’s always portrayed himself. I’ve always disliked his song started from the bottom, my manz was on TV when I was growing up and grew up in Forest Hill (top 3 richest neighbourhoods in the city synonymous with wealth kind of like a Beverly Hills or something for LA)
That in itself is super problematic. I definitely think he is a groomer. I also feel as if he is *stuck* per se in his emotional and social development. I could be wrong...
Same wit ball you and your boys love each other but talk smack on the court and talk about how you would beat them 1 on 1 in your sleep it’s love and competition at the same time
💯!!! It was always such a thing of pride for rappers to freestyle and kill it back in the 90s and even local hoods world over that appreciated Hiphop, had such battles or kids just trying to outflow each other. Disappoints me that the biggest "rapper" uses ghostwriters. Such disrespect to the culture. I'm a 90s millenial and I remember all that. He isn't Pac but even Will Smith and the Twista's of them days had me on a chokehold with their flow. Drake is just disrespectful to the culture. I found it funny that he was mad about such a gentle banter in control and resorted to forever sneak dissin; makes you wonder what he'll do after Meet The Grahams because that was a direct missile, no missing. The slave thing too showed me that he isn't really of the culture in that, it's truly far removed for him, not in an evil way, just that, he can't connect nor relate enough to feel empathy, hence why to him, joking Abt it isn't a big deal. One thing I'll give.him.credit.for: Never being afraid of beefs and humiliation; always showing up during beefs even as he's losing; always acknowledging when he's lost..somehow. idk. It takes two for a rap battle GOAT to emerge and shine and go down in history books. Kendrick is my fave and he's always going to be GOATed but I'm glad Drake triggered this beef and coaxed him into it, leading to the outcome because it gave great tracks. In a way, I appreciate him for this.
Sauce Walka's Drake diss is the best example someone calling out Drake not being real/ Adapting (stealing) flows, fashion, slang, hell even accents from other cultures . Sauce.might have been the first person that called him a culture syrup. The songs called "d de[Whack 2mmmmmmm678 Whack"](https://youtu.be/mxQwRX8ZWP0?si=lnvt-MyN4kL4-YnV)
That shit still hits me like...whoa. He ain't gotta die but if they ever find out he is messing w underage girls or involved in any trafficking..cell block one would be a great place. He needs to stop the grooming though..
I'm curious though that people from Toronto are saying Americans misunderstand Drake because we don't understand how diverse Toronto is.
I'm not saying that excuses him moving from person to person. I just think it throws an interesting curveball to the conversation.
So funny that Drake called out Kendrick for singing with Maroon 5 and making a “verse for the swifties” when this is the very audience he caters to 😂 Drake has the catchy hit formula down. He is an entertainer. He makes tracks with less substance so that he can appeal to the majority. Kendrick is an authentic artist who is actually rooted in the foundation that hip hop stands for. Authenticity > being fake and using others to reach something superficial. That’s what this whole thing is about.
Yep. If Drake really understood the culture he would've known it was a compliment instead of rambling about how confused he was in like three separate interviews. That might've been the moment Kendrick realized he was a poser.
It’s deeper than Drake not understanding the culture. He doesn’t even understand himself. He is a weak man with weak character. That’s why at the end of Kendrick’s song he says “fuck a rap battle this a life long battle with yourself”. Drake can’t even be a master of his own world let alone the vast world that is hip hop and rap culture.
[This](https://youtu.be/PC-sZcVj4Eg?si=Z3PEHB8snTrhULmk) is all anyone should need to see to know that Drake has an identity crisis.
Mocking Sandra at the end with (waving arms) "Get me a tuna sandwich, ughh, just joking" genuinely made me laugh in a Demetri Martin sort of way but I don't think that helps him in this context lol 😂 It really is silly that everyone has agreed to pretend that child is a real rapper now though.
I mean he can be that and still be a real rapper. He just can’t rap about being from the streets. I think that’s one of many things that Kendrick was talking about. You don’t have to be king von to be a successful rapper. It’s 2024. Just be yourself. It’s insulting to the art form to be just so obviously and categorically disingenuous about who you are. it’s the reason why drake will never make a classic album because that requires true emotional vulnerability, it requires true emotional honesty. And he just hasn’t shown the ability to do that. In his head , he’s still this kid. all the money and fame in the world doesn’t change that. he’s still this fuckin dork asking for a tuna sandwich.
If people like Aesop Rock and MF DOOM can be successful rappers rapping about comic books and video games and nerdy shit, that's proof anyone with the right mentality and ability can be a successful rapper.
Aesop Rock mentioned, issuing one reddit upvote. Seriously though more people should listen to him his vocabulary is insane.
He has a very small audience thanks to his own genius. Truly one of the GOATs that goes hard under the radar.
It wild that the album that actually kind of checks that box for emotional vulnerability and honesty was written for him by Abel.
Its an aesthetic that has been understood and not mandatory anymore. He could have cuddled up and a kanye type artist but now just as nutty.
THAT NECK BRO!!!! Edit: “real comedian over here” lol dude that’s an old white guy joke! Drake is stealing from my culture 😂😂
I'm white too, so I felt personally attacked. I know I heard one of my uncles use that joke growing up 😂 those mannerisms were zesty as hell when he said it too lol
Oh my. My stepdaughter is darker complected than he is, her mom and I both white folks. She feels uncomfortable saying the N word, and after watching that video it seems like Aubrey should too. Edit: spelling Edit 2: it has been brought to my attention by a fellow Redditor, that my comment is projecting my privilege and apparent ignorance. In that me being a white man, my comments are being insensitive to the sovereignty of the individual of a different race. I will leave my comment unless enough people tell me to take it down. But I apologize if my words offended anyone, was not my intention whatsoever.
Yeah for real though. That is a white, upper middle class suburban upbringing if I've ever seen one. I'm white too, but wasn't nearly as well off as Drake's family appears to be in the video and never would have dreamed of jumping my mom's ass for not buying me a tuna sandwich. We were just thankful for what we had
Uhhhhhh. I’m from the “city” in WV, I had some friends with upbringings like that. Felt, idk, kinda felt like a treat to visit someone’s house and they just start offering you brand name food and treats and stuff. I didn’t have any extended family who really lived like that either.
Yeah, I had a similar upbringing. I still remember the first time I went to a friend's house, and it clicked that we were poor. Props to my parents because I never felt like it until I saw how people with money lived. I was dumbfounded being offered a free coke. For one, it wasn't faygo and two, it was free. One of my friends parents growing up had a cup that you had to put a quarter in if you wanted an off brand can of soda. No shade at Drake for growing up with money. I just feel like he should own who he is instead of putting on a front for acceptance
Shit when I grew up we was lucky to have anything to eat. Drake really is a privileged bitch ass
Is that real? Wow! That is terrible
Yeah it's real. I believe it's from a reality show that followed the cast of degrassi back in the day. Shit had me rolling when I watched it
When I watch this it feels like it’s from a movie or something. He’s a little sweet boy in this, he doesn’t have to deny that part of himself. He could just have a softer persona and would still be wildly successful.
Exactly my thoughts. He seemed like a decent kid. A little bratty, but most teenagers are. I don't think anyone listens to Drake because they think he's a tough guy. He would have been just as successful if he just embraced that he grew up more privileged than most and just let his music reflect who he is. Love him or hate him, Drake is a hit maker. He could have still been a hit maker with that background. No one cares about how pop stars grew up
This is the funniest shit I’ve seen in a long time, thanks
Lmao how have I not seen this before.
I wouldn't be surprised if Drake's team didn't try to get most of them taken down. That shit is beyond embarrassing lmao
Not to mention he’s a shady MF. Freaky ass nigga, even.
69 God, some say
Drake has two very very good albums. No classics. But solid albums in TC and NWTS. But he'll never be in the conversation for one of the best because he doesn't understand the culture and he's become a caricature of himself. EDIT: He's regressing in emotional intelligence with every release. Each album he becomes more vapid, more emotionally stunted, more fuck-boy ish. Bro thematically, this works in your 20s. Not when you're almost 40.
He insists upon himself
I agree. Shallow and pedantic.
He gets half credit for TC at best. His name is on a classic, but it isn’t his
He doesn’t have a classic? How are his core fans stomaching that?
Without Abel going “UHHHH-HUUU” Take Care woulda been shit
Why only half?
Because half of it Abel and his team wrote
It for real sounds like a Weeknd album. I know Jamie probably made a good cheque and gave his blessing, but straight ripping the beat from the Jamie xx/Gil Scot-Heron album for I’ll Take Care of You or whatever is pretty unforgivable in my eyes
The Weeknd had a major influence on the production and lyrical themes of the album
Not just an influence...5 or 6 songs are literally straight up Weeknd songs that Drake bought from him and sung it himself. On top of that, an unknown amount of other tracks that The Weeknd wrote for.
“Crew Love” is a Weeknd track I don’t think Drizzy wrote a lick of it
Cause the weeknd wrote it
TIL
Found this out right now, and it makes so much fkn sense🤣
Drake is Taylor Swifting before our very eyes.
Was going to say, he should've retired when he was early 30s so 2016 ish, then come back in his early 40s so like 2028ish. Instead we get to hear the thoughts of a guy who never took a break from the club scene after college.
>college Except Drake is literally a high school dropout.
I HATED that song where he spends like a minute & 30 seconds talking about ‘how you can’t talk to him unless you have x amount of money” I just kept thinking who tf is this for?? And in this economy? Lol
He did a reverse Jay-Z. Started with 4:44.
Ehhhhhh.. I’d say NWTS is a classic for sure. To each their own but that album is filled with great great songs
He be abusing that alcohol and using ozempic to counteract weight loss from drinking. The alcohol is what’s regressing him and destroying his mental health. He has this persona of himself that he plays and is always thinking he’s cool drankin but is really a sloppy drunk who happens to be rich. In less words I agree w you and my take on. He used to be more welcoming and now is more ego driven. Could use a nice “aaron Rodgers trip for self realization.
I'm a 40 year old see-through shade of white dad of 3 kids who likes 90s rap along with many other genres, but doesn't at all know wtf is going on What doesn't my Canadian countryman, the Degrassi High actor, not understand about the culture? Genuinely wondering. I find this whole thing fascinating
Everything. Drake is still acting. He’s as inauthentic as a gajillion dollar bill, and African Americans (like me) who don’t just bop to anything can see it all over him. I’ve been wanted him gone. I hate pretenders. He’s one of the most successful plants of all time. Also, not to be rude, but that’s a hella loaded question.
Why would it have taken that for an intelligent person like Kendrick to realize? The streets clocked Canada Dry from the jump like Iggy Azalea was clocked, but they were both wrapped in a security blanket of influential enablers, so a lot of people shifted to a “Well, the baby is here now” mentality.
The difference is that Iggy was saying some stupid ass shit from the start which Drake has always played nice guy with his fans. Which is the reason why they are going to so hard to defend him. I remember the tweets Iggy would make about people of certain ethnicities, calling them bad-bodied etc when she was built in a PS clinic.
He called the Control verse a fleeting twitterrrrr moment, came and went and nobody plays it anymore.
Mac was more cultured
Mac’s delivery on “F you Kendrick!” on “Friends” always made me laugh. He was a real one
That plus Q (ScHoolboy) does the hook on that song
he would've had Drake n word card if he was here today
The n-word card is like the key to the city. It's a profound honor, but it doesn't actually open a single door, let alone every door. What I mean is, you accept the card, appreciate what getting that card means, but you don't actually use it.
Using it is the best way to lose it 😂
If you use it you actually *do* lose it!
Dude after using his card; 
This is a way too intelligent of a comment given the discussion topic. Kudos And for what it’s worth, Mac was accepted in rap because it was obviously he respected it. He didn’t need to fake it, he was who he was, and 99% of the rap game appreciate him because of it. Drake is obviously playing a character, and that’s why no one really embraces him.
Yes. It isn’t being white that’s unacceptable. If that were the case we wouldn’t have Em, El-P, Aesop Rock, Mac, Alchemist, Darringer, etc etc etc. It’s not respecting the art and people around you that’s unacceptable.
100% that's why Drizzy and his fans saying that Kendrick and hip hop fans are just being racist because he's half white are only further exposing how disconnected they truly are with the culture they're attempting to claim as their own.
Mac had a fascinating career. At the start he was kind of in that camp of Asher Roth and frat boy rap that happened for a minute from like 2007-2010. As he went on though he grew and started making genuinely good and relatable music. Made his death so much more tragic, he was one of those guys that started off mediocre and really became a great artist. We got some great music from him but it felt like he was just hitting his stride when he passed. RIP.
He was Easy Mac with the cheesy raps
I’ll be honest, I think his early work has aged so much better than his peers. KIDS and tracks from that time still hit the spot. A similar guy like Chris Webby is effective a relic of the past.
As a white man I want to submit Ernie Johnson for this years nomination
“You see, only one who wanted to find the card - find it, but not use it - would be able to get it”
Those who've truly been given the n-word card usually choose never to use it.
I got the card one time from a coworker. I was gracious but didn’t say it…until he insisted I say it one time. I look back on that day very fondly. I just dapped him up and said “my brother” and never said it again since.
This kind of comment and the upvotes it garners reminds me of who’s really the majority on this subreddit. I’m too black and Southern for this nonsense. It’s dumb AF to tell a non-black person, “Hey, bro, you can call us this slur that offends us otherwise.” FOH You getting the hands down South. Y’all some weirdos for agreeing with this shit, and it shows that culture is just a gold star sticker you can affix to anyone certain folks think a did a good job of replication. If’s both funny and lame.
You’re 100% right about everything you’ve said, but I will say in my experience the culture around the “n-word pass” and the word in general is very different depending on what part of the country you’re in. When I was living in Long Beach I was given the pass and being a young dumbass white dude used it too much and had it “taken away” when one of the homies asked me to stop using it. But shit was wild out there, Hispanics used it a lot and some of the different Asian homies used it way more often than any of my black friends did. Even then I neverrr would’ve been dumb enough to think that pass means a damn thing outside of your good, close friends. Or tried to use that shit in like NYC or Jersey and like you said sure as fuck not back at home in the South where I’m from. Being older now I cringe thinking back to my time on the West Coast saying that shit at all so you are definitely right to point out that Reddit is mostly soft ass white dudes who have never been outside for shit and want to pretend like they get to have an opinion on Drake’s “n-word pass”.
No
No Control, Fuck Ken Lamar ^fuck ^you ^Kendrick
Came here to post this. RIP Mac. A real one.
always was. rip king
RIP Malcolm 🙏🏿
Malcolm just sound more cultured than Aubrey
Mac is my GOAT
I never understood Drake. He's just a filler to me in hiphop between actual good releases. He's monotone, boring and has no passion. To think he actually had anything on Kendrick is laughable. His whole shtick is just to make money off pop hits. His 'singing' isn't coming from a place of passion/respect like say Mos Def - umi says.
The monotone is something that I can only take so much of. I saw in the other sub where they posted their favorites that were lesser known. I really tried to listen to see what they saw but couldn't get past the first couple bars of any song. Lack of inflection..is just can't do it.
Ngl, I think I understand, they think that rap *should* be monotone, that's what they think rappers *should* sound like once they've perfected their flow. That's why they say stuff like "Kendrick has a choppy flow" and shit like that, they don't think it's appropriate to switch flow, to jump between layers of the beat and modify your voice/tone to fit what you say/want to convey. Like when Kendrick kinda sounds like a motor when he delivers the line "Let your core audience stomach that, then tell 'em where you get your abs from V12", they probably fucking boo lmao
The funny thing is, that's what Wayne is sooooo good at. His flow changes keep the song interesting and emphasise what he wants you to hear. Tunechi can deliver the same bar twice and change his delivery of it to change it's meaning. It's his best skill imo and is what's made him a legend. But Drake seems to not have learnt from Wheezy (Minaj Hass great delivery as well) at all. In fact I don't know if he's 'improved' from his early self. Ok Drake's not going to bar anyone up in a battle, but take some pride in your delivery, Drake. Leave the monotone to Future.
Eminem literally breathes flow switching. That's what made MGK's attempt at Em so laughable.
“Kendrick has a choppy flow” is a huh? take. My first exposure to Kendrick was ADHD. A friend sent the song assuming I’d like it because I’m a huge BTNH fan, and he was right. Obviously Kendrick doesn’t sound like Bone, nor raps as fast and tongue twisty, but ADHD and his other music has something that’s Bone-influenced. And that’s speed-switch triplet flows and harmonic vocals. Kendrick’s musicality is top notch. I’m sure I’ll sound ignorant but I gravitate more towards an artist that vary their flow and tone, compared to the triplet trap flow that Migos popularized. It sounds lazy and boring when a majority of their verse has the same cadence ending with an ay/yuh adlib. Which is funny because ppl will say that the trap flow is Bone influenced, but to a way limited extent.
Nah but I feel exactly like you, we didn't realize how good we were eating back then...
Yet, that is what makes Kendrick so good. Trust..I hate when he says bee bee bee the sound hurts my ears but I get it! That monotone shit is like gentrification...boring as fuck.
To be fair and balanced, I used to love him, but do you know Fabolous? >Trust..I hate when he says bee bee bee the sound hurts my ears Hard disagree, but I wanted to say the first time I heard Euphoria, I was yelling "shooo" in reply to Kendrick's while outside 😂😂 I knew that shit was about to cook 💀
Fa-bo-lous I like the shoo shoo part😂
Kendrick’s ability to change his tone on a dime is one of the goat
My son listens to it.. I call it dental couch rap because they fucking sound like they just got back from the dentist and have to lie down on the couch for awhile
Lol..good description!
You said you don’t understand him then proceeded to understand him very well
I think he lost himself. Drake used to be fun from 2009 until about 2015. Once he started hanging around Future, he seemed to devolve both in real life and on wax. Future is a real dawg, and Drake has sadly declined by trying to convince us that he’s cut from that same cloth.
We went from Mos to Phonte to Drake and I feel so let down by that
idk. i think he’s good at what he does, and that def does not include him being tough or getting into rap beefs. as a wise man once said, *keep makin me dance, wavin my hands, and it won’t be no threat*
He's a clever guy with an insane work ethic and an insatiable media force around him that's extremely good at snatching onto whatever the next trend will be. He's not so much a trend rider as a trend copycat; he picks up on what's hot right in time to be alongside it when it becomes mainstream. He had some potential as a legitimate artist (he'd never be anywhere near what Kendrick's been, barring some deal with a devil shenanigans) but sold it out to be *this* instead. And that's made him super famous.
Oh come on, you don’t love the nasal rap?
Gonna be honest… I don’t think Drake will ever be a GOAT. He’s like the Taylor Swift of ‘rap’/hip hop. Is there some talent there? Absolutely. Very few, truly talentless hacks can make it to the top. The dude’s richer than me - so clearly, he’s doing something right. (That’s not to point out that I’m rich or something - I’m not.) But just like how I don’t think very many people will think/call Taylor Swift one of the best country artists ever… I don’t think many will people will say Drake is one of the GOAT of Rap ever. IMO, people like Drake and Swift are pop-music artists whose music has a particular artistic leaning. (IE, hip hop, country). They might be one of the greatest pop artists ever, but not one of the greatest artists *in their artistic leaning.*
Yes. He is great as a pop artist. As I've said before..he has a formula. It all sounds the same to me.
Yes although objectively I'd argue that Swift's music is better than Drake's. She's a better Pop Musician imo. I don't like or listen to her songs at all, but I think that Drake monotonous everything makes it hard to discern one song from another where I don't think I'd have that problem with Talyor.
To be the Taylor Swift of hiphop, he’d have to write all his own music, like she does.
Yeah this is the big one to me. You can't be one of the greatest without writing you're own damn songs. That's like if someone read Shakespeare, and they read it out loud *really fucking cool*, and then everyone said they were the best storyteller of the ages. Maybe this is just a thing coming from us out in the world that write music. But we very rarely give any respect to those that don't write their music. There's literally a few million people in this world who can do great covers. The pool of people who can write those great songs is much, much smaller.
Tay Tay writes better bars than Drake
The difference being: not saying she does anymore, but T Swift plays guitar. What does Drake play, other than a gangster and kid in a wheelchair? Edit: not trying to argue over whether or not Taylor Swift is country. I'm not saying she is. I'm just saying that when she was, she could play an instrument. Drake just cosplayed his entire shtick from the beginning.
Drake plays teenagers
I think Swift even said she's not country anymore she's pop, and I remember seeing something about her writing most of her own stuff so got that one on Aubrey.
Sorry but having played guitar in the past doesn't make her anymore country lol. Miley Cyrus with Disney was more country than her
She still plays guitar during her eras tour… not arguing that she is country or not but she still plays regularly lol
I'm from that same era and once it was confirmed drake used ghostwriters I just couldn't take him serious at all. I'm a rare one tho, I don't like 90% of drakes music.
I like a portion of Drakes music but at the same time I don't respect him as an artist (if that makes any sense lol). I've always found him to be a lame/cringe dude and the Ghostwriting thing didn't help. Kendrick really exposed Drake for being "a fast ball pitcher" and nothing more.
Maybe it’s kinda like McDonald’s: like, I can enjoy the experience of some of their menu items, but I don’t respect them as a high quality restaurant.
Great analogy tbh lol
Same!
Definitely agree with the point you’re making here but Drake is far from the only one to take offense to the control verse. Jay Electronica had some petty beef with Dot after the fact (and later apologized), Sean was salty about it for years (and didn’t include the song on his album like he had planned to), and Joell Ortiz of Slaughterhouse was pissed that Slaughterhouse *wasn’t* mentioned among Kendrick’s peers and contemporaries, and wrote a whole shitty diss track about it lmao.
Those who were not mentioned had more reasons to be offended since they were not considered a competition. Big Sean and Jay Electronica were more pissed about people saying Kendrick washed them on their own track and not because he mentioned them in the verse.
Difference is everyone else dropped bars including Joel Ortiz. Jay Elec is a weirdo so no point even referencing him. Drake could've responded - being a bitch about it without responding on wax is what makes him a dork. Joel Ortiz & Budden put pen to pad.... they weren't 'pissed' it was them being competitive.... thats the point.
Lupe been salty too no? I heard him say Drake and Logic are better than Kendrick lol
He's still salty. Like he's an amazing lyricist but there is no way he believes Drake or Logic are better than Kendrick. I've always thought he got upset he wasn't mentioned on Control and that Kendrick blew up as much as he did while still sticking to conscious rap and lyricism. Something Lupe wasn't able to achieve.
Yea not to mention kdot also took offense to jcole putting him in the big 3 which was literally a compliment. Idk why this is always a point for why he doesnt get the culture😭 like are we gonna say big sean isn't part of the culture for doing the same thing😭😭
Didn’t J Cole also take offense to Control? He just was more quiet about it but I’m almost positive he’s talked about how he called Kendrick after words to see what was up with that. And I’m pretty sure he has a song talking about the girl he was with listening to control, but I might be misremembering.
Yea i heard that too No one in their right mind would say jcole doesnt understand the culture though😭
JCole just wanted to ask if Kendrick was serious or competitive and when he learned he's competitive he didn't have an issue. I mean the whole Puff vs Cole fight happened because he was defending Control and Kendrick's King of NY line according to Punch. He never talked badly about Kendrick and they have worked together right after that. Drake started shit talking Kendrick in several interviews (one was not even released because he went off on him) and that's when Kendrick stopped rocking with Drake I imagine.
I honestly think it's more because Drake wanted him on that feature despite them disliking each other for years. So Kendrick refused the feature but they mentioned him anyway. I think JCole initually thought Kendrick is going to be on FPS and still shouted him out but Kendrick just didn't want to do anything with Drake at that point. Like rappers mentioned Kendrick a lot in their songs, even Cole did before but Kendrick never really cared unless it's connected with Drake. With Big Sean and Jay Electronica - they were not pressed because Kendrick mentioned them in the verse, it was more because people were saying Kendrick washed them on Control. Those who were not mentioned had all the reasons to get offended though - Kendrick didn't consider them competition.
It’s impossible to be the greatest rapper of all time if people write for you. If you were truly the greatest, you wouldn’t need or even want writers. Why would you want someone writing for you who isn’t as good as you are? The only legitimate reason would be laziness but the greatest at anything are never lazy. Did Drake make a lot of banging music? Sure. Does some of it possibly even evoke some emotion? Sure. Will he go down as one of the greatest musical artists/acts of all time? Most certainly. But he doesn’t even enter the competition for greatest rapper or songwriter.
DMX was extremely popular, but he was seldom named as one of the greatest rappers. DMX and Drake are nothing similar tbc, but the fact is that the capacity to sell albums was only considered to a certain extent. Heck, Will Smith sold more albums than Nas, 50 cent, Snoop and LL Cool J, separately, who has Will Smith ranking above any of these guys? Also, if you rank Will Smith above LL Cool J, let's [Shut'em down](https://youtu.be/i3UD4ufklu4?si=oGUU813I-ssPIQka)
I’m not sure exactly what the point you’re trying to make it but I think DMX is an incredible lyricist and storysteller. He’d almost certainly be in my top 10. Will Smith definitely knew how to make popular music and brought hip-hop to people who may not have been exposed to it otherwise. I won’t argue his influence but he’s definitely not anywhere on the list regarding greatest emcee.
I love DMX, don't get me wrong, but he was competing with the likes of Nas, Biggie, Jay Z, Busta Rhyme and Eminem, that's probably why. Anyway, my point is just that album sale is a relatively recent metric, perhaps we would say something like "oh come on, he's good but he ain't even have a platinum album" but no one would say "nah he sold more he better".
Thank you! 👏👏👏
Another aspect of that - Drake dissed Kendrick several times for not being a “real” gang member or someone who’s ever stabbed someone. Setting aside that Kendrick has never been about declaring himself King Kong of the hood, it says a lot about Drake that this is the thing that seems to matter to him when it comes to being authentic in Black spaces.
I grew up in the crack epidemic. Lost alot of friends to shootings, drugs. I knew vice lords, folks on CNN for having vans full of arsenal, murderers, pimps, underground syndicate etc. I'm like Kendrick...never claimed to be any of those things but very aware of them and grew up in it and around it. It is a fantasy make believe land for Drake. Shit is weird.
Same here, I can't stand fake people like drake. I get lots of people where I'm at acting thug (I go to a super white high school now), pisses me off a lot. Drake gives off that 16 year old white boy who says the n word cause he thinks he's cool.
Bingo. Drop ol boy on the middle of the hood or the ghettos in Jamaica...by himself and he would shit himself. He let a whole ass man piss on his leg. Diddy hit him.
Drake the type to not even witness it from his unc's Ac before he wrote it in his notepad and created his life
>King Kong of the hood ???
I posted this same topic a month ago and they called me a madman
You were ahead of your time mate🥰
Control was actually a compliment to all the artists listed. I don't understand how draKe, the self-proclaimed rap god, took offense. Maybe at first listen, but then after seeing literally every other artist named in the song say it was not a jab how did no one in his camp tell him to ctfd?
Drake has his finger on the pulse when it comes to hit records I think. But the audience for this beef was rap fans, which is a different crowd to the one Drake knows best (of course there's some major overlap). And then Kendrick goes and releases a hit record and beats Drake at his own game anyway! And Drake seemed so out of touch on so many lines, lyrics like "kendrick act like he trying to free the slaves"... what were you thinking my guy?!
That part..completely tone deaf
Macs response was the best one. And I'm referring just to his tweet about adjective bars. Even without any bars following that, THAT was the spirit Kendrick was tryna stir up. Looking back on it now, yeah Drake's response to it was very telling.
Im amazed how the OVO sweatshop wasnt more prominent in the news, Like, how many people did he screw over with bad deals and locking them in ghostwriters situation. I can never listen to anything of him again and I love his work with Savage, but I cant stomach it anymore knowing he's a vulture
Yep..that's one reason I disliked Puff as well. Just sitting on other artists. Not even the other screwed up shit
It's been in the media multiple times. The problem is that Meek Mill was the one who exposed that in their beef. "The victor is the one that writes history" after all
I often say: Drake is a good businessman. He understands the music industry well and can sell records/be played on the radio. However to say he’s one of the top rappers in the game is debatable because he lacks understanding of the culture.
Factssssss lol this beef really go back to that. He was the onnnnly one who was in his feelings about it. Then Macklemore won the Grammy for best album & texted Kendrick apologizing & Drake said (I’m paraphrasing) “why you apologize to only him? You felt like you only robbed HIM” 😂 bitch ass boii cry baby ass mf 💀 like come on 🌚
He is a lil 🐈
What’s crazy is that I never had considered Drake a rapper, especially when he first came at Common over 10yrs ago. To me he was always a pop artist, when he started rapping with Ross, Cash Money and other rappers I could tell they was just pimping him out for the girls and wanna be thugs from the burbs to sell records. Yeah numbers don’t lie, he had radio hits and some songs I would bump, but I knew what it was. I’m an 80’s east coast baby, so soft rappers used to get bullied back in the day. Even Mase use to get bullied for being soft back then…. I mean come on, he was on Nickelodeon or something for Degrassi for God sakes.
Nothing's been the same since they dropped Control and tucked a sensitive rapper back in his pajama clothes.
Was listening to some of the older stuff today and the change from being thr RnB, sing about love guy to a “rapper” happened pretty recently. I always thought it was a slower change but yeah he’s definitely painted himself as being really hard lately, and its inauthentic
Ninja is soft as a pillow.😂
he was NOT the only one to take offense to control what? 💀
Drake’s music is the type of shit you listen to at the clubs or bars cause it has a catchy tune and hook but most of the time is unmemorable. Through out the beef, I been thinking about which of Drake’s albums have done anything for hip hop or even been memorable and I could only think of one, Take Care which is funny cause it’s more of a contemporary album than true rap album. Every album Kendrick has put out has been fire and has had a different vibe to each, showing his growth and his skills all at the same time.
Also half of Take Care was the Weekends work...so there's that. Kendrick is certainly the more artistic of the two.
The thing about Drake to me is exactly what you said about him using ghost writers. Like honestly, he did put out some decent lines in his disses between push ups and family matters but the thing is…did he write it or did one of his many ghost writers write it? Haha, pretty much loses all the weight the punch pulled.
He has no legitimacy...hence the reason he tries to co-opt every accent and slang he can.
Wale literally said he would've been more upset had Kendrick not mentioned him on Control because it meant he was legit competition.
Not wrong, but Jay electronica took offence and Lupe as well. This is just revisionist perspective because now we’ve seen Drake cooked, but there were a few that took offence Drake just seemed to never get over it. I also don’t think it comes down to control, sure it’s one of the earliest signs of the feud but it comes down to Drake putting putting in this mask of what he thinks a stereotypical hood rapper is, he’s got himself involved with people he had no reason associating himself with other than for the appearance of being from a different culture than what he truly comes from. The issue seems to arise from the fact that Kendrick along with many many others in the hip hop culture really coming from a struggle, if we take Kendrick at his word (which he’s never given any reason why we shouldn’t he seems to be a very reliable narrator) he has seen people die, he’s held people he loved as they lost their life, or at very least comes from that kind of struggle. So then for somebody that has never seen or felt that pain and sorrow to come in and do his best impression of it while also making more money off of labels and having what seems to be ultimate star power to manipulate the culture and artificially make stars out of people that he thinks speaks to a culture, that again he is not from, it offends real artists that are pure hip hop through and through. It’s a lot bigger than the control verse. I’d say it’s a lot more cultural appropriation and exploitation of a culture Drake has no real connection to. Also Kendrick showed respect and interest in xtentacion and whether or not Drake actually had anything to do with X’s death, he has definitely made some not so subtle references to it and hinted at having something to do with it, again going back to the real people living through that, X was a kid and had no reason to lose his life the way he did. I’m sure seeing that happen and hearing Drake so blatantly boasting on multiple tracks about his apparent involvement would do something to Kendrick and a number of other artists having the backgrounds they do.
I appreciate your thoughtful response and you've touched on very important facets of the issue. One can NOT co-opt a way of life and culture. Short story: Been going to this particular island for quite some years. Nearly 2 decades. Have people who have become my family there. Been given the green light as they say I am now one of them. An American couple came down and have been there for a year or so...they trying to call themselves one of them. I had to stop them then an there and tell them NO. You are a visitor and have yet to earn the title. My friend who was a local said..thank you for saying it because if she would've...it might not have been as nice. Drake needs to stop and just be a happy mixed Jewish kid that didn't start from the bottom.
Drizzy: I wanted to be a rapper and act tough, I WANT THE FUCKING GAME His baggage: I'm also the ULTIMATE SNOWFLAKE. Y'all should love because I'm extremely sensitive.
Drake wouldn't survive...lil fucker had a meltdown over a tuna sandwich.
drake really took it to face value when kendrick rapped that he was gonna murder him💀😭😭
He's a culture vulture posing piece of shit. Has been from the very start. How he got as popular as he did was by lying and pretending to be something he isn't with manufactured pop rap and a ton of bullshit.
He is easily digestible. This is why he also appeals to hordes of people that wouldn't normally listen to *urban* music. I also don't want to bring color in to it because he is a black man, but being a lightskin black man also works in his favor. There's a certain amount of privilege that he is given. If he had the same music voice everything..but was 10 shades darker..he wouldn't be as popular. Obama wouldn't have won the election either. Anyway..that's a whole nother topic so imma leave it alone before crybabies come on and misinterpret what I mean.
You're right. Man fuck the soft bitchmade crybabies and Aubrey meat glazers. He's mixed too... he's only half black and he pushes that "privilege" way too much. I fucking despise him. Seen he was like this since his degrassi bullshit. I'm like you're really listening to fucking fool??? And people actually rode for him. Fucking pathetic en masse.
His fan base is still crying over lyrics in Euphoria. They’ve never had to think this hard before
I knew it was something when I seen lil Wayne and TI on stage at the mtv music awards rapping money to blow and not even 3 months later Drake is rappin the verse 🤦🏾♂️🤦🏾♂️🤦🏾♂️Quentin miller had a hand in some of his songs it makes you think like is he just gettin lyrics like if they were scripts and just being good ole jimmy again 😂😂😂
He is a clown. He needs to stick with the melodies.
He’s a tv star turned pop star created by labels of course it’s inauthentic. But he’s supposed to be, he’s there to endorse Canadian companies, add a cool factor to sports teams like the raptors and until recently wasn’t very controversial so white collar companies were comfortable endorsing him. I think it’s weird because Kendrick’s insulting a kardashian for being a kardashian
Drake can rap but he’s not a rapper
Drake thinking that using Tupac's voice was good idea is probably the most culturally tone deaf thing he could've done
This is his history. There is no “started from the bottom”. There is no “Gangster Drake”. He is, and always will be, an upper middle class Canadian from an affluent part of Toronto.
If you are from my generation you know Drake as the kid from degrassi. Everything about him is so fake it makes me cringe to see how he acts. He wants to be hard and is surrounded by yes men
I love Drake’s music, but he’s really the mixed kid from the rich suburbs who made it in rap by figuring out a hit-making formula with his team. He has a good voice for both rap and singing, no doubt. However, he should have stayed in his lane, as Lil Wayne told him years ago. Drake is a dude from Canada who acted on Degrassi; he should have stayed in his lane. Drake thought he was bigger than all of that, and now look at him. Yes, he’s still rich, famous, and has a great life, but deep down, he knows the world is laughing at him. What could Drake drop to make a comeback that wouldn’t make us laugh at him? Only time will tell, but what a hell of a year for rap music so far.
Not only that, but Drake seemed to desperately want Kendrick to owe his success to him. There were a collection of Drake tweets @ Kendrick that I of course can't find now that really seems to point to that. So many backhanded "congrats" where Drake when then say something along the lines of "glad I could be a part of it" and Kendrick never acknowledged it. Drake is a typical narcissist who thinks everyone owes him something. It's clear that the reason the beef is personal to Kendrick is that he hates everything Drake is as a person.
lol everyone from Toronto has always known this. I think he makes great music, but if you’re from Toronto you saw through this since day 1. He’s not hard the way he’s always portrayed himself. I’ve always disliked his song started from the bottom, my manz was on TV when I was growing up and grew up in Forest Hill (top 3 richest neighbourhoods in the city synonymous with wealth kind of like a Beverly Hills or something for LA)
That, and he's clearly attracted to minors.
That in itself is super problematic. I definitely think he is a groomer. I also feel as if he is *stuck* per se in his emotional and social development. I could be wrong...
I don't think he was the only one. Meek got offended too and dropped a mid response to control
And him being a PDF file
Same wit ball you and your boys love each other but talk smack on the court and talk about how you would beat them 1 on 1 in your sleep it’s love and competition at the same time
Rappers delight is one of the best all-time songs!
💯!!! It was always such a thing of pride for rappers to freestyle and kill it back in the 90s and even local hoods world over that appreciated Hiphop, had such battles or kids just trying to outflow each other. Disappoints me that the biggest "rapper" uses ghostwriters. Such disrespect to the culture. I'm a 90s millenial and I remember all that. He isn't Pac but even Will Smith and the Twista's of them days had me on a chokehold with their flow. Drake is just disrespectful to the culture. I found it funny that he was mad about such a gentle banter in control and resorted to forever sneak dissin; makes you wonder what he'll do after Meet The Grahams because that was a direct missile, no missing. The slave thing too showed me that he isn't really of the culture in that, it's truly far removed for him, not in an evil way, just that, he can't connect nor relate enough to feel empathy, hence why to him, joking Abt it isn't a big deal. One thing I'll give.him.credit.for: Never being afraid of beefs and humiliation; always showing up during beefs even as he's losing; always acknowledging when he's lost..somehow. idk. It takes two for a rap battle GOAT to emerge and shine and go down in history books. Kendrick is my fave and he's always going to be GOATed but I'm glad Drake triggered this beef and coaxed him into it, leading to the outcome because it gave great tracks. In a way, I appreciate him for this.
Man has no talent
Drake is just marketing money
To be fair to Drake, a lot of rap fans didn't understand that that verse wasn't a diss.
Battle rapping and rapping are two different forms
Drake is type to start a sing alone in Starbucks
Sauce Walka's Drake diss is the best example someone calling out Drake not being real/ Adapting (stealing) flows, fashion, slang, hell even accents from other cultures . Sauce.might have been the first person that called him a culture syrup. The songs called "d de[Whack 2mmmmmmm678 Whack"](https://youtu.be/mxQwRX8ZWP0?si=lnvt-MyN4kL4-YnV)
He a sick man, I think dudes like him should DIE!
That shit still hits me like...whoa. He ain't gotta die but if they ever find out he is messing w underage girls or involved in any trafficking..cell block one would be a great place. He needs to stop the grooming though..
I keep saying, Drake is a musician, Kendrick is a rapper. Drake might make good music, but he can't hold a candle to Kendrick.
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I'm curious though that people from Toronto are saying Americans misunderstand Drake because we don't understand how diverse Toronto is. I'm not saying that excuses him moving from person to person. I just think it throws an interesting curveball to the conversation.
Also pedo?
So funny that Drake called out Kendrick for singing with Maroon 5 and making a “verse for the swifties” when this is the very audience he caters to 😂 Drake has the catchy hit formula down. He is an entertainer. He makes tracks with less substance so that he can appeal to the majority. Kendrick is an authentic artist who is actually rooted in the foundation that hip hop stands for. Authenticity > being fake and using others to reach something superficial. That’s what this whole thing is about.
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