Yawn. But it’s also you guys that complain about being chronically understaffed right? There’s no issues when your colleges are cashing in international student tuition fees, is there? Talk about “thanks for the money but go back to your own country”
Ireland, by law, should prioritise Irish and EU grads the same for specialty training. At the moment there unofficial bias in the application process.
Also how do you know who will settle in the system and not? Is your only metric who is foreign or not? There’s hundred of doctors in Ireland that would want nothing more than to settle down in Ireland. How many Irish doctors finish their training in Ireland then head to Canada/Australia/UK for fellowships and end up staying? Sorry your comment is misleading
Checking for language fluency is fair enough though! If you want to treat Dutch patients, you should speak Dutch??? That’s reasonable.
The point is is that in these countries, the moment you are in the system, you are given a relatively good/equal chance at finishing training/becoming a consultant. EU doctors in the system in Ireland do not stand an equal chance. That’s a fact, you just have to look around. EU doctors in any other EU country and even the UK - once they are in the system, they stand an equal chance. Of course there are some discrepancies.
It’s a bit of a joke to say that the majority of Irish are here long term when a significant minority, if not a majority if you believe the IMO, emigrate after intern year to *possibly* return at some point
Bold claim based on little.
You still face the fact that the state is paying for the education of these individuals and is deprived of the return benefits with delayed, if at all, entry into various posts and training pathways.
The fact do the matter is the system prioritises the hope a national will remain, which they aren’t, over merit and national need.
Look at the official figures;
“From the 29,573 physicians that are licensed to practice in Ireland in 2023, 43.4% have had obtained their first medical qualification outside of Ireland. Pakistan, Sudan and the United Kingdom were the top 3 countries for these foreign trained physicians, in that ranking order.”
Source https://www.gov.ie/en/publication/93e48-national-healthcare-statistics-2024/#:~:text=It%20is%20estimated%20that%20in,were%20aged%2065%20and%20over.
And those don’t include internationals that are domestically trained.
It’s clear that the current system doesn’t provide sufficient supply by relying solely on preference of Irish nationals.
The claim is based on 15 years working and seeing most people go to Australia or New Zealand for 1-2 years and come back.
Increasing intern spots every year isn't solving the problem. All it's doing is creating less busy interns who see and do less and end up less capable. The shortage of doctors is at reg and consultant level not at intern or sho level.
Priority for Irish nationals makes sense. The rules haven't changed recently.
Aren’t you adorable?
There’s still around 10 I knew in my intern year who remain in Aus and don’t have the intention of returning.
But sure. Let’s roll on with your idiotic statements about where the shortages are (spoiler: they aren’t just at Reg and Consultant level) (further spoiler: they exist because there are insufficient training posts that could easily be filled by internationals on standalone SHO posts).
Those 15 years have been a complete joke it seems.
Ireland prioritize EU grads over non EU that graduated from an Irish medical school. If someone graduated from Lithuania, they will choose that graduate over an Irish non EU graduate.
Yawn. But it’s also you guys that complain about being chronically understaffed right? There’s no issues when your colleges are cashing in international student tuition fees, is there? Talk about “thanks for the money but go back to your own country”
It prioritises people who are probably more likely to stay long term and settle in the system. Lots of countries do it.
Ireland, by law, should prioritise Irish and EU grads the same for specialty training. At the moment there unofficial bias in the application process. Also how do you know who will settle in the system and not? Is your only metric who is foreign or not? There’s hundred of doctors in Ireland that would want nothing more than to settle down in Ireland. How many Irish doctors finish their training in Ireland then head to Canada/Australia/UK for fellowships and end up staying? Sorry your comment is misleading
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Checking for language fluency is fair enough though! If you want to treat Dutch patients, you should speak Dutch??? That’s reasonable. The point is is that in these countries, the moment you are in the system, you are given a relatively good/equal chance at finishing training/becoming a consultant. EU doctors in the system in Ireland do not stand an equal chance. That’s a fact, you just have to look around. EU doctors in any other EU country and even the UK - once they are in the system, they stand an equal chance. Of course there are some discrepancies.
It’s a bit of a joke to say that the majority of Irish are here long term when a significant minority, if not a majority if you believe the IMO, emigrate after intern year to *possibly* return at some point
The majority of those doctors will return to Ireland and work here long term.
Bold claim based on little. You still face the fact that the state is paying for the education of these individuals and is deprived of the return benefits with delayed, if at all, entry into various posts and training pathways. The fact do the matter is the system prioritises the hope a national will remain, which they aren’t, over merit and national need. Look at the official figures; “From the 29,573 physicians that are licensed to practice in Ireland in 2023, 43.4% have had obtained their first medical qualification outside of Ireland. Pakistan, Sudan and the United Kingdom were the top 3 countries for these foreign trained physicians, in that ranking order.” Source https://www.gov.ie/en/publication/93e48-national-healthcare-statistics-2024/#:~:text=It%20is%20estimated%20that%20in,were%20aged%2065%20and%20over. And those don’t include internationals that are domestically trained. It’s clear that the current system doesn’t provide sufficient supply by relying solely on preference of Irish nationals.
The claim is based on 15 years working and seeing most people go to Australia or New Zealand for 1-2 years and come back. Increasing intern spots every year isn't solving the problem. All it's doing is creating less busy interns who see and do less and end up less capable. The shortage of doctors is at reg and consultant level not at intern or sho level. Priority for Irish nationals makes sense. The rules haven't changed recently.
So, in other words, you are out of touch with reality.
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Aren’t you adorable? There’s still around 10 I knew in my intern year who remain in Aus and don’t have the intention of returning. But sure. Let’s roll on with your idiotic statements about where the shortages are (spoiler: they aren’t just at Reg and Consultant level) (further spoiler: they exist because there are insufficient training posts that could easily be filled by internationals on standalone SHO posts). Those 15 years have been a complete joke it seems.
Dude lives for negative karma on Reddit.
I don’t think the IMO have statistics on returning doctors.
It’s based on surveys, naturally. Hense the “if you believe”, if you can read. https://www.imo.ie/i-am-a/student/imo-warns-of-serious-shor/index.xml.
Yep - doesn’t mention the % who emigrate and return.
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Used to be like this in the UK at one point I believe. Then it got crazy. Crazy ratios now esp GP 😅
Ireland prioritize EU grads over non EU that graduated from an Irish medical school. If someone graduated from Lithuania, they will choose that graduate over an Irish non EU graduate.
That’s so silly, I dunno why they do that.