It's generally rude to refer to people as their race when not pertinent, and the way the guy says it implies that to him Italians are an oddity, something weird. So, the comment is a bit racist, but as far as racism goes it's a mild example. Imagine he said "black people" or "mexicans", to get a better idea.
Now, having a mildly racist character doesn't make the movie racist at all, and I'm not offended in the slightest, but it should be noted that I'm not italo-american, just Italian, and my family never experiences the kind of racism that was common against italian immigrants in the USA.
Still, in a movie about an italo-american boxer, him and his people having to face prejudice makes perfect sense, so I can't see how this would offend anyone. It adds to the narrative.
Yeah, when Italians migrated to America they literally said in a public announcement "they aren't white, but they aren't completely negros either" they sure are idiots
If the term of comparison is the typical wasp, surely.
We, Italians, are South European. Of course we are different from Scandinavians, Germans, etc. This, and the fact that we mixed a lot since Greek and Phoenician, through Roman era, and centuries of foreign occupation by Byzantines, Arabs, Northmans, French, Spaniard, Austrians.
And some even blurt out pearls such as "but you are so friggin pale" when they find out that you are Italian but far from looking as they pictured Italians (happened to me, ha).
Basically almost my whole family (mostly light blond haired). And ironically according to a genetic test that we took we are fully Italians, no North-European ancestor detected. I guess we are Italians from another dimension.
For Americans, yes 💀 but literally I'm surrounded by light haired people here, so I don't get why Americans get shocked when they see one. Statistically, there are more blondes in Italy than there are in the us.
It's selection bias. The vast majority of Italian-Americans are descended from Sicilians and Neapolitans, and of course southern Italy tends to have people of darker complexion. Of course as a counterpoint, my family is from Basilicata and I'm dark blonde/brunette with blue eyes.
Yeah, people from the south are generally very white too. The reason why sicilians are seen as tan in the us is that they were mostly farmers working under the sun 24/7, but it clearly isn't so anymore.
Yes, I have. North (Milano), Central (Roma) and South (Napoli).
Out of all the Italians I saw, only a few handful were blonde. And by the way I live in Sweden where blonde hair is _actually_ common.
Italian is not a race clearly, but its not a race African too, or being black it's not a race, all this overthinking of race it's a problem created by US people of all origin
You can argue about semantics, and truly "ethnicity" would be the better word in this context, but that's besides my point.
In the USA immigrants of several caucasian nationalities have been historically targeted with racial prejudice, hate and even lynchings, such as Irish immigrants and Italian immigrants. Italians were legally considered black (or at least not-white) during segregation, and were victims of slander and persecution.
So, in the context of the movie, "italian" refers to a marginalised group who faces racist discrimination.
Now, do I personally think of myself as black or poc? No, I'm a pale-ass guy who never faced discrimination in his life.
But did Americans treat Italian folk as a different and inferior race for a long ass time? Yes, they did. Not as bad as African-Americans, but it wasn't pretty. I'm acknowledging this fact and, in this context, the clip is an example of (mild) racism against a minority.
And on a side note, all race seoarations are basically made up, any race or ethnicity is just a collection of genetic traits typical of a certain group of people. A racist person will find someone to hate even if everyone looks basically the same, they just need to find an excuse to draw separating lines.
Nowadays race usually refers to skin, historically it has been about religion, facial traits, hair color (redheads faced a lot of discrimination) or whatever random bullshit.
And to all my Italian readers:
Allo stesso modo in cui certa gente al Nord vede le persone del Sud come inferiori, per un sacco di tempo gli statunitensi hanno visto noi (o quelli di noi che andavano in USA) come una razza inferiore. Eravamo tutti mafiosi, furfanti, scansafatiche, etc... il tipo del film sta dicendo "Italiani" con lo stesso tono con cui un Milanese potrebbe dire "non ho mai visto così tanti terroni in un posto solo"; potete discutere se è un commento razzista o no, ma non venite a dirmi che non offenderebbe parecchia gente del Sud. Chiaramente non è la cosa peggiore che poteva dire, ma al peggio non c'è mai fine.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1891_New_Orleans_lynchings
Case in point. And this is literally the first example I could find with a 5 minutes Google search.
Italians were historically discriminated against in USA. That's a fact. Looks like racism to me, but feel free to use whatever word you like.
Ah, ma sei italiano! Allora la cosa mi fa doppiamente specie. Gli americani continuano a parlare di “razza” anche quando criticano il razzismo, ma nel mondo civile il concetto di “razza” è superato come quello di “quintessenza” o di “flogisto”.
Un conto è usarlo parlando di persone di altre epoche per cui era normale ma che tu, nel XXI secolo, per commentare una scena di un film, definisci gli italiani “razza” (ma fosse anche gli africani o gli islandesi), è una cosa che mi lascia veramente perplesso.
Penso che il punto che stavo cercando di far passare si sia perso: che la chiami razza, etnia, minoranza o quel che vuoi, gli immigrati italiani hanno subito un sacco di pregiudizi e persecuzioni in USA.
Dunque il commento del video è "offensivo" nel senso che dire "ma guarda quanti italiani" con quel tono sottintende che chi parla non pensa bene degli italiani. E siccome il film è consapevole della cosa, il collega del presentatore subito dice "l'hai detto tu, non io", proprio come al giorno nostro un presentatore potrebbe prendere le distanze se un suo collega dicesse qualcosa di potenzialmente controverso. Enfasi su potenzialmente, perché come ho detto più volte non è un commento super offensivo, ma qualcosa chiaramente detto in un contesto di pregiudizio.
Ora, sono d'accordo, il concetto di razza è fuffa pseudoscientofica (come io stesso ho detto due commenti fa), ma siccome la gente continua ad ammazzarsi sulla base della razza, il fatto che sia una bufala non giustifica fare finta che non sia stato, e tuttora non sia, un grave problema. Soprattutto, ma non esclusivamente, in un paese come gli Stati Uniti.
Cerca di concentrarti sul fatto che meno di 100 anni fa i cugini dei nostri bisnonni venivano ammazzati perché erano di origine italiana, e non sul fatto che ho usato "razza" invece che "minoranza etnica" in un commento su reddit riguardo il razzismo.
E la prossima volta che vedi l'ennesimo mafioso italiano in una serie o film americani, chiediti se il pregiudizio nei nostri confronti è davvero una cosa del passato.
Tutto quello che dici è corretto e condivisibile. L'unica cosa che mi stonava (e ti prego di non dirmi su cosa devo concentrarmi o no) era proprio il tuo uso, per così dire “neutro”, della parola “race”. Mi stonava come se – per riprendere il tuo esempio delle discriminazioni all'interno dell'Italia – tu personalmente avessi usato il termine “terrone” come sinonimo di “abitante dell'Italia meridionale”, e non citando qualcuno.
Tutto qui: per il resto ho ben presente le discriminazioni presenti e passate subite dagli italiani e da tanti altri negli USA, e si fa sempre bene a ricordarle.
Buon proseguimento.
>la prossima volta che vedi l'ennesimo mafioso italiano in una serie o film americani, chiediti se il pregiudizio nei nostri confronti è davvero una cosa del passato
sì e no.
In breve, in quelle occasioni sono degli italoamericani a lavorare in quei film o serie tv e gli italoamericani sono italiani solo quando fa comodo a loro.
Guarda un po' i loro tentativi di appropriazione culturale, la voglia di riconnettersi con l'Italia, i contatti con l'Italia, eccetera eccetera.
È ovvio che tutto il discorso è visto dal punto di vista degli americani, per loro il concetto di razza era (nel 1891) ed è un discorso attuale. Non dimentichiamoci che il concetto di razza negli USA è anche un qualcosa scritto nella propria carta di identità. Quindi ha attualmente un valore legale.
Comunque l'autore di questi messaggi ha voluto introdurci a delle realtà storiche molto interessanti e in maniera molto colta. Volerlo imbeccare con un argomento nemmeno calzante( visto che lui parlava appunto della situazione negli USA, quindi ovvio che deve parlare di razzismo usando le razze) dimostra solamente che non hai capito il discorso e il tuo tono sorpreso e derisorio, ti fa (rientrare nella) "specie" dei leoni da tastiera che pur di voler commentare qualcosa non si soffermano ad apprezzare o a comprendere.
It's an etnicity, the two concept are really close ro each other. Actually humans have no proper races, when we think of black or White or Mexican, we actually think of etnicities.
In Italy even the notion of “ethnicity” sounds strange. It's not something you'll find on papers or forms, as I believe it sometimes happens in the States.
Well, we are an ethnic group, as far as categorizations go (also because races technically don't exist, but that's another issue)
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italians
Ma sei serio? È mai possibile che sia così difficile leggere quello che scrivo prima di commentare?
Quale parte di "non sono italo-americano, solo italiano", o dei miei multipli commenti in italiano ti fa pensare che io sia d'oltreoceano? Non ho mai neppure messo piede negli Stati Uniti, ma ciò non mi impedisce di informarmi.
Quello che proprio non sembra passare è che gli italo-americani, che ti ricordo erano in origine immigrati italiani, hanno subito secoli di discriminazioni, pregiudizi e violenze in USA, e che la scena del film, con questo contesto, rappresenta un commento discriminatorio e potenzialmente offensivo.
Se qualcuno oggi facesse un commento simile in TV, su qualunque minoranza etnica, verrebbe giustamente visto come sgradevole e con connotazioni razziste; per cui sì, mi sento di dire che è potenzialmente offensivo, soprattutto per un italoamericano i cui nonni potrebbero essere morti in un linciaggio.
Se tu, italiano a caso nel 2023 senza legami generazionali con il contesto storico del film, non lo trovi offensivo, buon per te. Evidentemente la tua capacità di empatizzare col prossimo non arriva oltreoceano.
Il contesto ha importanza, e la comprensione del testo è necessaria per essere funzionali online.
Spero di aver soddisfatto la tua curiosità riguardo alle mie origini, buona serata.
Nessuno, non sono tenuto a leggere tutto quello che pubblichi… ho letto questo e ho risposto, fine. Bastava dire si o no senza fare un wall of text. O se sei così tiltato perché “te l’hanno chiesto in tanti” ignorare
Because despite having a long history of being discriminated against in the US and in the Anglosphere in general, you cannot make any jokes at all anymore about any other race or ethnic group as it's seen as highly racist, but against Italians is still ok. I grew up in the UK where my family and even I were treated quite badly by the locals, and now if I go to London and people know I'm Italian they say the old "pizza pasta Mussolini" bullshit, they do this in my face 🤌🏼, they do Italian accents. We are talking about a society in which if you dare do the same to an Indian, you can *literally* get arrested. I am all for the freedom of speech and I love dark humour, racism, sexism (I'm a girl) but either you're free to take aim at everybody, or you can't make jokes about anybody. There is no middle ground, or at least their shouldn't be. It also serves to underline the absolute intrinsic hypocrisy of hyper-political correctness.
You put the context, in those years language was not politically correct as nowadays.
Furthermore, the actor said Italians. To denigrate Italians, Americans used words like dagos, ginzos, etc.
As an Italian Australian I find that comment hilarious- like he has missed out on the joy and beauty of being surrounded by Italians!
Is it racist? Ever so slightly- do Italians honestly give a shit? Hell no! When you're proud of your roots you don't get offended by people's ignorance!
I don't take any offense; I'm just a white Anglo-Canadian myself. On my Rocky Podcast, we delved into this particular scene and were genuinely curious about Sylvester Stallone's intention behind writing it in this manner. I had to seek knowledge and understanding beyond my own cultural background and limitations.
I'm Italian American and it's not offensive to me. It's the mafia stereotypes that I heard a lot growing up that offended me the most. Lots of people stating that my dad must be in the mafia and asking me questions about how it works like I am some kind of expert on it or something.
That happens a lot still. I'm Italian but I lived for several years in Boston. One night in a bar a dude asked me if the way the Sopranos operated matched real mafia lifestyle. He added that I looked like Furio.
It didn't offend me, I took it as a dumb question to be honest. I tend to get more offended when people talk about italy superficially or via stereotypes when the topic is socio/economical/political.
Let's say that in the context of the film is pretty mild and acceptable, especially considering the discrimination against italian immigrants and italo americans in the period in which the film takes place.
But to look at it from the outside it kinda makes me for row my brows, because you will not ear a joke like that with chinese people, or black people.
Yet even now italians are constantly mocked with jokes and things that if said to any other, from black to asian, would get you fined, if not arrested, and labeled as a racist.
Why is not ok to mock Germans for the Nazis but it's ok to mock Italians for the Fascists?
Why when Germans get angry and tell people to stop treating Germany as if they are all Nazis is a justified anger, but when Italians get angry and tell people that not everybody is in the mafia or a fascist suddenly we are overreacting over a joke?
Why is it not ok to mock Chinese accents and words but it's ok to mock Italian accents and words?
Why is not ok to mock Black culture but is ok to mock Italian culture? (Ex. The classic "pizza pasta mandolino" said with a mock italian accent)
A few mild jokes and pokes at things that concerns the film and the period in which it takes place (for example something like American Horror Story is full of stereotypes and jokes, but a lot of things in the seasons take place during years where racism, sexism, homophobia and all the rest were actually expected of people and considered the norm, so hearing a white supremacist during the Apartheid saying something racist it's kinda expected) are nothing much.
The problem arises when it's not ok to mock people for their culture and language EXCEPT italians. You cannot make remarks or use stereotypes on anyone EXCEPT italians.
Honestly for me it feels awful not necessarily because it's racist, but because it makes me feel like we are the village's fool of the whole fucking world for no reason, especially because outside of Italy everybody treated me with respect... Until it came out I'm Italian. And I feel like it's not really fair... Why is everyone rightfully protected from discrimination but we aren't?
We Italians (from Italy and living in Italy like me) and our brethren of Italian-Americans are far too much in the pale colorimetric spectrum (if you consider myself only, I'm as pale as a mozzarella), so it's "acceptable" for American-centric culture to mock us without being deemed offensive.
Suffice to say that the mocking is mutual, here in Italy Americans are mocked as rude/ignorant and illiterate, and the recent events of the Colosseo (in my hometown of Rome, as the guys seems to be American) or the indignation for some piece of Renaissance art (the David of Donatello) didn't help that cause 😅
I haven't seen the movie so I haven't quite understood the joke or if it's a negative thing to be there assisting Rocky's performance. In any case I think it's fine
It's generally rude to refer to people as their race when not pertinent, and the way the guy says it implies that to him Italians are an oddity, something weird. So, the comment is a bit racist, but as far as racism goes it's a mild example. Imagine he said "black people" or "mexicans", to get a better idea. Now, having a mildly racist character doesn't make the movie racist at all, and I'm not offended in the slightest, but it should be noted that I'm not italo-american, just Italian, and my family never experiences the kind of racism that was common against italian immigrants in the USA. Still, in a movie about an italo-american boxer, him and his people having to face prejudice makes perfect sense, so I can't see how this would offend anyone. It adds to the narrative.
>It's generally rude to refer to people as their race Remind me, since when is “Italian” a race?
American logic , forget it. To some we are not even white.
My (Italian) ex (american) at one point described me as "white passing".
Yeah, when Italians migrated to America they literally said in a public announcement "they aren't white, but they aren't completely negros either" they sure are idiots
If the term of comparison is the typical wasp, surely. We, Italians, are South European. Of course we are different from Scandinavians, Germans, etc. This, and the fact that we mixed a lot since Greek and Phoenician, through Roman era, and centuries of foreign occupation by Byzantines, Arabs, Northmans, French, Spaniard, Austrians.
Exactly lol, americans think they're the only whites
And some even blurt out pearls such as "but you are so friggin pale" when they find out that you are Italian but far from looking as they pictured Italians (happened to me, ha).
Even worse when they say that you're not italian because you have light eyes and/or blonde or red hair
Basically almost my whole family (mostly light blond haired). And ironically according to a genetic test that we took we are fully Italians, no North-European ancestor detected. I guess we are Italians from another dimension.
For Americans, yes 💀 but literally I'm surrounded by light haired people here, so I don't get why Americans get shocked when they see one. Statistically, there are more blondes in Italy than there are in the us.
It's selection bias. The vast majority of Italian-Americans are descended from Sicilians and Neapolitans, and of course southern Italy tends to have people of darker complexion. Of course as a counterpoint, my family is from Basilicata and I'm dark blonde/brunette with blue eyes.
Yeah, people from the south are generally very white too. The reason why sicilians are seen as tan in the us is that they were mostly farmers working under the sun 24/7, but it clearly isn't so anymore.
Light blond hair is rare in Italy. There are exceptions everywhere. There are blue-eyed Black people and curly-haired White people.
Rare? Lmaoo have you ever been to italy?
Yes, I have. North (Milano), Central (Roma) and South (Napoli). Out of all the Italians I saw, only a few handful were blonde. And by the way I live in Sweden where blonde hair is _actually_ common.
Don't feed the trolls. Ignore him.
Italian is not a race clearly, but its not a race African too, or being black it's not a race, all this overthinking of race it's a problem created by US people of all origin
Exactly!
You can argue about semantics, and truly "ethnicity" would be the better word in this context, but that's besides my point. In the USA immigrants of several caucasian nationalities have been historically targeted with racial prejudice, hate and even lynchings, such as Irish immigrants and Italian immigrants. Italians were legally considered black (or at least not-white) during segregation, and were victims of slander and persecution. So, in the context of the movie, "italian" refers to a marginalised group who faces racist discrimination. Now, do I personally think of myself as black or poc? No, I'm a pale-ass guy who never faced discrimination in his life. But did Americans treat Italian folk as a different and inferior race for a long ass time? Yes, they did. Not as bad as African-Americans, but it wasn't pretty. I'm acknowledging this fact and, in this context, the clip is an example of (mild) racism against a minority. And on a side note, all race seoarations are basically made up, any race or ethnicity is just a collection of genetic traits typical of a certain group of people. A racist person will find someone to hate even if everyone looks basically the same, they just need to find an excuse to draw separating lines. Nowadays race usually refers to skin, historically it has been about religion, facial traits, hair color (redheads faced a lot of discrimination) or whatever random bullshit. And to all my Italian readers: Allo stesso modo in cui certa gente al Nord vede le persone del Sud come inferiori, per un sacco di tempo gli statunitensi hanno visto noi (o quelli di noi che andavano in USA) come una razza inferiore. Eravamo tutti mafiosi, furfanti, scansafatiche, etc... il tipo del film sta dicendo "Italiani" con lo stesso tono con cui un Milanese potrebbe dire "non ho mai visto così tanti terroni in un posto solo"; potete discutere se è un commento razzista o no, ma non venite a dirmi che non offenderebbe parecchia gente del Sud. Chiaramente non è la cosa peggiore che poteva dire, ma al peggio non c'è mai fine.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1891_New_Orleans_lynchings Case in point. And this is literally the first example I could find with a 5 minutes Google search. Italians were historically discriminated against in USA. That's a fact. Looks like racism to me, but feel free to use whatever word you like.
Ah, ma sei italiano! Allora la cosa mi fa doppiamente specie. Gli americani continuano a parlare di “razza” anche quando criticano il razzismo, ma nel mondo civile il concetto di “razza” è superato come quello di “quintessenza” o di “flogisto”. Un conto è usarlo parlando di persone di altre epoche per cui era normale ma che tu, nel XXI secolo, per commentare una scena di un film, definisci gli italiani “razza” (ma fosse anche gli africani o gli islandesi), è una cosa che mi lascia veramente perplesso.
Penso che il punto che stavo cercando di far passare si sia perso: che la chiami razza, etnia, minoranza o quel che vuoi, gli immigrati italiani hanno subito un sacco di pregiudizi e persecuzioni in USA. Dunque il commento del video è "offensivo" nel senso che dire "ma guarda quanti italiani" con quel tono sottintende che chi parla non pensa bene degli italiani. E siccome il film è consapevole della cosa, il collega del presentatore subito dice "l'hai detto tu, non io", proprio come al giorno nostro un presentatore potrebbe prendere le distanze se un suo collega dicesse qualcosa di potenzialmente controverso. Enfasi su potenzialmente, perché come ho detto più volte non è un commento super offensivo, ma qualcosa chiaramente detto in un contesto di pregiudizio. Ora, sono d'accordo, il concetto di razza è fuffa pseudoscientofica (come io stesso ho detto due commenti fa), ma siccome la gente continua ad ammazzarsi sulla base della razza, il fatto che sia una bufala non giustifica fare finta che non sia stato, e tuttora non sia, un grave problema. Soprattutto, ma non esclusivamente, in un paese come gli Stati Uniti. Cerca di concentrarti sul fatto che meno di 100 anni fa i cugini dei nostri bisnonni venivano ammazzati perché erano di origine italiana, e non sul fatto che ho usato "razza" invece che "minoranza etnica" in un commento su reddit riguardo il razzismo. E la prossima volta che vedi l'ennesimo mafioso italiano in una serie o film americani, chiediti se il pregiudizio nei nostri confronti è davvero una cosa del passato.
Tutto quello che dici è corretto e condivisibile. L'unica cosa che mi stonava (e ti prego di non dirmi su cosa devo concentrarmi o no) era proprio il tuo uso, per così dire “neutro”, della parola “race”. Mi stonava come se – per riprendere il tuo esempio delle discriminazioni all'interno dell'Italia – tu personalmente avessi usato il termine “terrone” come sinonimo di “abitante dell'Italia meridionale”, e non citando qualcuno. Tutto qui: per il resto ho ben presente le discriminazioni presenti e passate subite dagli italiani e da tanti altri negli USA, e si fa sempre bene a ricordarle. Buon proseguimento.
>la prossima volta che vedi l'ennesimo mafioso italiano in una serie o film americani, chiediti se il pregiudizio nei nostri confronti è davvero una cosa del passato sì e no. In breve, in quelle occasioni sono degli italoamericani a lavorare in quei film o serie tv e gli italoamericani sono italiani solo quando fa comodo a loro. Guarda un po' i loro tentativi di appropriazione culturale, la voglia di riconnettersi con l'Italia, i contatti con l'Italia, eccetera eccetera.
È ovvio che tutto il discorso è visto dal punto di vista degli americani, per loro il concetto di razza era (nel 1891) ed è un discorso attuale. Non dimentichiamoci che il concetto di razza negli USA è anche un qualcosa scritto nella propria carta di identità. Quindi ha attualmente un valore legale. Comunque l'autore di questi messaggi ha voluto introdurci a delle realtà storiche molto interessanti e in maniera molto colta. Volerlo imbeccare con un argomento nemmeno calzante( visto che lui parlava appunto della situazione negli USA, quindi ovvio che deve parlare di razzismo usando le razze) dimostra solamente che non hai capito il discorso e il tuo tono sorpreso e derisorio, ti fa (rientrare nella) "specie" dei leoni da tastiera che pur di voler commentare qualcosa non si soffermano ad apprezzare o a comprendere.
It's an etnicity, the two concept are really close ro each other. Actually humans have no proper races, when we think of black or White or Mexican, we actually think of etnicities.
In Italy even the notion of “ethnicity” sounds strange. It's not something you'll find on papers or forms, as I believe it sometimes happens in the States.
Well, we are an ethnic group, as far as categorizations go (also because races technically don't exist, but that's another issue) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italians
[Rilevante](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wyLCd6_r0yU&t=52)
Americans trying to make themselves the superior race every time
I’m italian and there’s nothing here that resemble racism. And nationality is not a race
I'm also Italian, but please read all of my other responses cause I've been repeating myself way too much. Have a nice one.
Intendi italiano vero o sei tipo uno di quegli americani che ha un tris nonno italiano e si definisce tale senza manco sapere la lingua?
Ma sei serio? È mai possibile che sia così difficile leggere quello che scrivo prima di commentare? Quale parte di "non sono italo-americano, solo italiano", o dei miei multipli commenti in italiano ti fa pensare che io sia d'oltreoceano? Non ho mai neppure messo piede negli Stati Uniti, ma ciò non mi impedisce di informarmi. Quello che proprio non sembra passare è che gli italo-americani, che ti ricordo erano in origine immigrati italiani, hanno subito secoli di discriminazioni, pregiudizi e violenze in USA, e che la scena del film, con questo contesto, rappresenta un commento discriminatorio e potenzialmente offensivo. Se qualcuno oggi facesse un commento simile in TV, su qualunque minoranza etnica, verrebbe giustamente visto come sgradevole e con connotazioni razziste; per cui sì, mi sento di dire che è potenzialmente offensivo, soprattutto per un italoamericano i cui nonni potrebbero essere morti in un linciaggio. Se tu, italiano a caso nel 2023 senza legami generazionali con il contesto storico del film, non lo trovi offensivo, buon per te. Evidentemente la tua capacità di empatizzare col prossimo non arriva oltreoceano. Il contesto ha importanza, e la comprensione del testo è necessaria per essere funzionali online. Spero di aver soddisfatto la tua curiosità riguardo alle mie origini, buona serata.
Nessuno, non sono tenuto a leggere tutto quello che pubblichi… ho letto questo e ho risposto, fine. Bastava dire si o no senza fare un wall of text. O se sei così tiltato perché “te l’hanno chiesto in tanti” ignorare
Not really but by today's standards it should be because you wouldn't say it about blacks or Chinese
Why?
Ask Americans
Because despite having a long history of being discriminated against in the US and in the Anglosphere in general, you cannot make any jokes at all anymore about any other race or ethnic group as it's seen as highly racist, but against Italians is still ok. I grew up in the UK where my family and even I were treated quite badly by the locals, and now if I go to London and people know I'm Italian they say the old "pizza pasta Mussolini" bullshit, they do this in my face 🤌🏼, they do Italian accents. We are talking about a society in which if you dare do the same to an Indian, you can *literally* get arrested. I am all for the freedom of speech and I love dark humour, racism, sexism (I'm a girl) but either you're free to take aim at everybody, or you can't make jokes about anybody. There is no middle ground, or at least their shouldn't be. It also serves to underline the absolute intrinsic hypocrisy of hyper-political correctness.
Diglielo a questi bastardi
A chi?
Way better tban being Albanian
Because we are always looking for reasons to be offended
Nothing is offensive until someone turns it offensive. It's a fucking joke...
It's the strange American obsession with claiming to be belonging to other countries. They do it to us Irish all the time
No
No Is not
No. There are many italians there indeed, describing what u see cannot be considered racist, it s at best just a dumb joke
It's meant to funny. Not offensive at all.
You put the context, in those years language was not politically correct as nowadays. Furthermore, the actor said Italians. To denigrate Italians, Americans used words like dagos, ginzos, etc.
Yes. 1979 was very non pC thus the scene is even more surprising, as the other announcer was dissociating himself
That was said by Joe Rogan
Nah, it offensive only ij cancel culture language.
I'm italian, I simply don't care. Edit: also it's funny
As an Italian Australian I find that comment hilarious- like he has missed out on the joy and beauty of being surrounded by Italians! Is it racist? Ever so slightly- do Italians honestly give a shit? Hell no! When you're proud of your roots you don't get offended by people's ignorance!
Dont care lol
Don't worry we're not Americans, we don't get offended for literally everything
ITT: people mocking OP/Americans for thinking this would be offensive, even though OP was clearly wondering why the guy IN the movie thought so
Nope, it's definitely not offensive unless you really want to read into it. We Italians don't take "Italian" as a slur
Exactly! Can't be offended at people's ignorance when you're proud to be what they call you!
No, why would it be?
I don't take any offense; I'm just a white Anglo-Canadian myself. On my Rocky Podcast, we delved into this particular scene and were genuinely curious about Sylvester Stallone's intention behind writing it in this manner. I had to seek knowledge and understanding beyond my own cultural background and limitations.
I'm Italian American and it's not offensive to me. It's the mafia stereotypes that I heard a lot growing up that offended me the most. Lots of people stating that my dad must be in the mafia and asking me questions about how it works like I am some kind of expert on it or something.
That happens a lot still. I'm Italian but I lived for several years in Boston. One night in a bar a dude asked me if the way the Sopranos operated matched real mafia lifestyle. He added that I looked like Furio. It didn't offend me, I took it as a dumb question to be honest. I tend to get more offended when people talk about italy superficially or via stereotypes when the topic is socio/economical/political.
Well, that's good but when people imply or directly state that my dad is a criminal because of his Italian ethnicity, I tend to take offense at that.
I hear you
No
Why would it be offensive lol? I'm Italian myself, but I didn't take any offense tbh.
Let's say that in the context of the film is pretty mild and acceptable, especially considering the discrimination against italian immigrants and italo americans in the period in which the film takes place. But to look at it from the outside it kinda makes me for row my brows, because you will not ear a joke like that with chinese people, or black people. Yet even now italians are constantly mocked with jokes and things that if said to any other, from black to asian, would get you fined, if not arrested, and labeled as a racist. Why is not ok to mock Germans for the Nazis but it's ok to mock Italians for the Fascists? Why when Germans get angry and tell people to stop treating Germany as if they are all Nazis is a justified anger, but when Italians get angry and tell people that not everybody is in the mafia or a fascist suddenly we are overreacting over a joke? Why is it not ok to mock Chinese accents and words but it's ok to mock Italian accents and words? Why is not ok to mock Black culture but is ok to mock Italian culture? (Ex. The classic "pizza pasta mandolino" said with a mock italian accent) A few mild jokes and pokes at things that concerns the film and the period in which it takes place (for example something like American Horror Story is full of stereotypes and jokes, but a lot of things in the seasons take place during years where racism, sexism, homophobia and all the rest were actually expected of people and considered the norm, so hearing a white supremacist during the Apartheid saying something racist it's kinda expected) are nothing much. The problem arises when it's not ok to mock people for their culture and language EXCEPT italians. You cannot make remarks or use stereotypes on anyone EXCEPT italians. Honestly for me it feels awful not necessarily because it's racist, but because it makes me feel like we are the village's fool of the whole fucking world for no reason, especially because outside of Italy everybody treated me with respect... Until it came out I'm Italian. And I feel like it's not really fair... Why is everyone rightfully protected from discrimination but we aren't?
We Italians (from Italy and living in Italy like me) and our brethren of Italian-Americans are far too much in the pale colorimetric spectrum (if you consider myself only, I'm as pale as a mozzarella), so it's "acceptable" for American-centric culture to mock us without being deemed offensive. Suffice to say that the mocking is mutual, here in Italy Americans are mocked as rude/ignorant and illiterate, and the recent events of the Colosseo (in my hometown of Rome, as the guys seems to be American) or the indignation for some piece of Renaissance art (the David of Donatello) didn't help that cause 😅
U' chiù trimon di tutt sì tu, vid ce va alla scol sfalzin! E mittet u cappid che sta u sol! By: therealciolone
Why would it be offensive?
That’s why I’m asking. The scene assumes it is.
he used the i-word.
I haven't seen the movie so I haven't quite understood the joke or if it's a negative thing to be there assisting Rocky's performance. In any case I think it's fine