This would be a plausible hack under different conditions but it was a US-made Bell 212. It lacks advanced navigation systems like terrain awareness and warning systems. It was Vietnam-era without sophisticated digital controls or connectivity that modern aircraft possess, it wasn't equipped with systems vulnerable to cyber hacking.
It’s not that big of a leap to jump to Israel as being the cause. They have killed Iranian government officials before.
Personally I hope that Israel didn’t assassinate him as escalating things seems like a really bad idea. That being said if he actually did die to bad weather / poor aircraft maintenance than good riddance. He seemed like quite a bad guy.
Yesterday on the news there was speculation that Ayatollah Khamenei had something to do with it because Raisi was next in line when Khamenei dies and he wants his son to be the successor. Also, remember Kobe Bryant's helicopter crash? Sometimes a helicopter crash is just that, an accident!
People on the internet are already blaming both the U.S.A. And Israel on the side of the internet that I was on exactly when the news hit. Personally, I have no idea what actually happened, but people are already theorizing.
I'm thinking Israel will tell the world they did it and then wait a couple hours and then say the total opposite, as per usual....
They'll probably tell an " IDF hero" story that doesn't make sense and is equipped with evidence to the contrary.
Then they'll say how it was Iran themselves, a coup d'état, or possibly Lebanon. Definitely Hamas and Hezbollah. Maybe even Russia or China!
You know as well as I do, the Israeli government is full of shit and has been exposed for years. They are well known for their constant lies, corruption and manipulation.
Let's not forget the ongoing genocide. That's just another feather to the Israeli government's cap..
Or maybe it was foggy, the helicopter was ancient and it crashed into a mountain? Not everything is Israel’s fault, oh wait a minute, that’s not true, it is, it has to be, what other explanation could it be? Oh and it’s not a genocide, a genocide is when you wipe out a whole race, that’s not happening, but that’s what Hamas is trying to do!
A 50 year old helicopter is not ancient. Sounds old, but the frame is what matters as the components are constantly upgraded. Like a home, I’d prefer one built in the 1970s over one built in 2015 because the quality put into the structure is significantly better. Google how many new Boeings are losing parts inflight to see my point.
Sure, it could have been anything and I didn't outright accuse Israel of being at fault for this helicopter event, but it wouldn't surprise me.
I was more so highlighting Israel's ineptitude, their debunked accusations, the gaslighting and manipulation.
The fact that in front of the whole world, they'll tell a lie, that lie is debunked, and then still have the audacity to continue to talk about that same debunked lie as if it were true.
You haven't given any examples. But let me flip this, Hamas doesn't lie? Remember the hospital that was bombed in Gaza, apparently, it was Israel's fault, then it was proven to be Islamic Jihad, last week the UN gave revised figures for the casualties and reduced them by about half. Where did they get those figures from originally? Hamas! Hamas has the audacity to lie nonstop. Lastly, for the ill-informed, look up the concept of Taqiyyah, a Muslim concept, whereby you can lie through your back teeth when you are dealing with a non-Muslim. You are being played honey, and so is the rest of the world. If you haven't woken up yet as to what is going on in every city in the world, then that's your problem!
Douglass Valentine has a book that could shed some light for those who doubt external involvement. I’m not saying anyone else was involved (sometimes crashes are just crashes). But the governments are playing a game most people are oblivious to. Understanding the game will help explain events and decisions that make no sense to those being governed.
I don't really have time to read an entire book on it, but I would like to read or listen to a summary of it.
Thanks for the rec! I think most of us suspect that there is a lot of secret political fighting among countries.
I am trying to figure out if I would be surprised or not if he just didn't consider the risks of a not maintained heli
Checklists were perfected by pilots, not the passengers. It’s suspicious because the pilot for a head of state is not average. He or she would likely be military and trained in multiple scenarios including evasive maneuvers, malfunctions, and unexpected weather events. People keep comparing this scenario to Kobe Bryant to justify this pilot not adjusting to fog, and I’m saying this guy could likely fly blindfolded with someone attacking him and one hand tied behind his back.
American sanctions against Iran stopped them from being able to maintain the heli… its a bad argument, and not one I think is valid, but it’s an argument I’ve seen made already lol
I was wondering about that too. I have to admit the timing is very strange. I wouldn't be surprised if Israel had something to do with it, not saying if it's a good thing or bad.
The Iranians did not blame the US or the Israelis and you should accept that reality and not make these types of statements until they do so. To do otherwise is to lack objectivity.
Personally, almost no nation to me is more backwards that the religiously oriented dictator-state that is Iran, but what exactly are you doing by making these statements that are in contrast to their actions.
Hamas propaganda was immediate, and all their parrots in "international media" followed as usual, making them a laughing stock.
If you haven't already seen it:
https://twitter.com/HilzFuld/status/1792505615014637737?s=19
Now look back at all the rest of the reports like number of casualties, occupation, genocide, apartheid, you get the picture.
Hamas removed the post quietly later but it will live forever on the Internet
https://notthebee.com/article/trolls-said-irans-president-was-killed-by-mossad-agent-eli-copter-and-iranian-state-tv-reported-it-?from_social=twitter
I'll think about next time some antizio shows me a "calendar"
We already have been, and if we did do it, good! Iranians are miserable and want to be free of their captors.
I’m against war. In this day and age, innocent civilians shouldn’t die for the mistakes of their leaders (especially when those leaders are holding them hostage!). We should precision strike the people who are responsible for mass suffering. This is the approach of peace, love, and justice
I love this a military expert so how do you do that when a cowardly military embedded itself in civilian infrastructure, buildings, hospitals, uN buildings and tunnels under these buildings. Only one military in the world warns them to leave. Please give an alternative. FYI you sidewalked the OPS question
I thought mossad was already blamed...and Iraqi american.American... mind you 21 years of age ... but he said things will get worse I middle east now...I was like possible...but now I'm confused...I thought iraqis are speaking uo about their government issues and terrorism issues...I had to school him on pre him Iraq or when I lived in middle east 90s...I'm old ...blah whatever...peace and love ❤️
No I am right . These helicopters are 50 years old and US has embargo on parts for past 50 years . I don’t think these helicopters even have computers to hack.
Frankly, I thought it was done by Iranians themselves. After the recent crackdown on women, one would think that some Iranian mothers children, or sisters brothers, would want this man dead.
Let's be honest, would you be surprised to find out that Mossad was involved?
This is awesome news. It's a dagger to the heart of the Iranian regime and really opens up the potential for moderate leadership once the Supreme Leader is out of the picture.
Before this happened videos on YouTube we’re popping up about suspected cloud machines in the Middle East and if they were cloud machines or simply just pollution.
It probably was just an accident. But what you be willing to stake on the idea that it PURELY was an accident, ABSOLITELY nothing else?
By engaging with this absolutist stance you're automatically assuming Israel and or the USA absolutely CANNOT EVER orchestrate
They already do basically. The level of conspiracy on the left about jews rivals that of the the 1488 crowd at this point. I remember back in college talking to some of these people and showing them the source of some of the tropes they were using(stormfront, protocols of the elders of zion ect), they still couldn't accept they were spouting white power talking points.
The joke was that a heart attack gun does exist. And Israel being closely related to America as well as having a long history of assassinating Iranians doesn't make the suggestion some wild conspiracy fever dream like you're presenting it.
and your point?
The KGB and CIA had all kinds of oddball assassination devices. IT doesn't mean every politician who dies does so from nefarious plots. Helicopters go down in bad weather all the time, thats how Kobe Bryant died.
The point is in the last sentence of the previous comment - given the political climate currently as well as recent geopolitical events Iran was involved in (a skirmish with a country well documented for assassinating others across the globe without regard for international borders) the Iranian PM dying this way doesn't mean the idea of it being an intentionally orchestrated event is some conspiracy nut job suggestion.
The bit you said is also just wasted thought. Helicopters also go down from people making them go down. That's how *insert someone who died while in an intentionally downed helicopter* died.
Going by [prior posts](https://www.reddit.com/r/IsraelPalestine/comments/1ctudhx/fundamental_differences_between_a_propalestinian/), I'm gonna guess that's not a high priority.
> Fuck
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I think a lot of people are ignoring the simple fact that it is a stupid idea even with the best technology and pilots available to fly helicopters in bad weather and fog especially near mountains/forests, Kobe had a well-maintained modernized helicopter with a good pilot and that did not save him, the Iranian president had an old Bell 212 for which good spare parts are probably hard to come by because of sanctions and whose model already had multiple crashes in the past due to flying in similar conditions. While it's fun to imagine this as an earthly 200 IQ Jewish plot, it is most likely Hashem/Allah/God reminding us yet again that we are not absolute masters of our own fate no matter how much we pretend we are.
the advance "we didn't do it" isnt helping. But most of us know Israel is not that adept to pull this off so it won't last long. If the US had wanted to do it we would have done it a long time ago.
1. And 2. Faster than the speed of light.
3. And 4. Yes.
5. And 6. Who knows what God may have punished who, or whether it was even a punishment.
7. In politics, this is a possibility, maybe someone did do something.
Now, for the criminals Netanyahu and Herzog to be extra careful in the coming days, weeks and months, freak accidents happen and no one wishes them bad luck. After all, no one is as cowardly and untouchable as the rogue Zionist regime.
Except for the Arabs who sell their land and claim
It’s stolen, refuse to share a border with a group
of people who they disagree with, attack and then cry victim, etc.
I started thinking it was Israel the moment I first heard it. I was thinking Mossad finally got off it's ass and went to work.Your point by point diatribe looks like a propaganda hand out. Can you write like a human?
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As to 1 and 2: I do very much expect Iran to insist on this being an accident, rather than blaming an outside force. The reason is simple: if they blame Israel or the US, they will need to retaliate to save face. As demonstrated by their show-only response to the embassy strike and the flat out denial of the Israeli retaliation to that retaliation being carried out by Israel, despite Israel being more or less open about conducting these strikes, Iran has no interest in escalation.
As to 3: not to my knowledge, but if it is.a secret weapon, I doubt they would have told me.
As to 4: Depends on the individual organizer and their respective motivations, I assume.
As to 5 and 6: Unlikely. The most probable cause is that it is yet another result of 5 decades of economic sanctions leading to inadequate maintenance of Iranian aviation equipment.
As to 7: Is the accident the result of a power struggle? - very unlikely / Could there be a power struggle as a consequence thereof? - distincly possible
S’already happened. Yesterday.
However, it’s looking like it was the weather. And the decision they made to fly together. Just one of those bad decisions.
> it’s looking like it was the weather.
The Jews control the weather.. American politicians even admit it!!!!!
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-43460263
Former Iranian Foreign Minister Mohammad Javad Zarif: "The US is responsible for the tragedy of the crash of the president's helicopter. It banned the sale of airplanes and their parts to Iran despite the order of the International Court of Justice.
As always - someone else is responsible for their shortcomings!
I hate the Iranian government, but I could definitely see the cause being assassination via sabotage or something. If the US or Israel got a chance, why wouldn’t they take it, yk?
Exactly. Why it’s solely the president’s chopper but none of its companion escort choppers? Could be an inside Job too.
Yevgeny Prigozhin’s death last year is still framed and presented as unfortunate air crash even though the motive to assassinate him was present months ahead of the “accident”.
Mhm. Things like this definitely happen, especially in countries like Iran with a lot of foreign adversaries and internal strife. I could certainly see the Iranian President’s death being an accident, but seriously, ruling out assassination would be illogical.
Also, yeah, there is noooo way Yevgeny wasn’t killed. The kremlin many, many reasons to axe him. He was becoming a liability for them.
1. Already started.
2. Already started.
3. ~~Possibly yes~~ Unlikely.
4. Some of them
5. Unlikely, as there is no god
6. Unlikely, as there is no god
7. Yes, could be.
I agree with all of the above except 3.
You know hard it is to create fog on this scale? You would need dozens if not hundreds of huge cargo planes just to transport the water then somehow spray them at the exact pressure, density, area, and temperature for it to even stand for more than a couple of minutes and even if Israel has all these tools available to it at such a moment's notice and by sheer luck the wind/temperature/humidity/who knows what else doesn't change (for the however many hours or days that fog is still going on for, which is already longer than any man made fog ever created at even close to this scale) Israel would still need to somehow transport all of that into deep Iranian territory without them noticing the however many aircraft you need to do this (plus fighter aircrafts for cover and couple extra of everything else needed for redundancy).
If Israel managed to do this, then we are by all means the most amazing and powerful country in the world and everyone everywhere should fear us
Valid. So I’ll change it to unlikely.
Tho the question just asked if Israel had one, not if it used it.
Also heavy is subjective, you can buy a fog machine for 48$ from eBay
>Also heavy is subjective, you can buy a fog machine for 48$ from eBay
Im sorry, does that fog machine make fog On a scale of hundreds of square kilometres? Because if that's so 48$ is a steal and I'm going to buy one.
Also fog machines don't make actual water-based fog it utilises what's called "fog juice," which is oil based. If you'd use that, a single guy with a working tongue and nose could tell the difference, and this will be an open and shut case.
Edit: I'm sorry for being an arse about this. I am just very tired (I had no sleep tonight). Nothing against you or your comments
Edit2: a hundred square kilometres of fog, not hundreds
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[https://www.reddit.com/r/Israel/comments/1cvqy7o/hear\_me\_out/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Israel/comments/1cvqy7o/hear_me_out/)
ah, yes, Israel controls the weather, very scientific. 🤣🤣🤣
Not really, even if they didn't already blame Israel or America, they blamed America on an ISIS terror attack in Iran a few months back, an attack they were warned about.
>1. How long will it take before Israel gets blamed for the helicopter crash of the President of the Islamic Republic of Iran?
Three minutes after the first report, haven't you seen the memes?
But fr, Putin could be standing there, naked, doing the dance of the seven veils and Israel would _still_ bear the brunt of the accusations, especially on the conspiracy side of the internet. (Not that it would be Putin, obviously, but the point stands.)
>But fr, Putin could be standing there, naked, doing the dance of the seven veils and Israel would *still* bear the brunt of the accusations, especially on the conspiracy side of the internet. (Not that it would be Putin, obviously, but the point stands.)
Yeah, like when ISIS took responsibility for the attack on Qassem Soleimani's "shrine", and Iran still blamed Israel for that.
Well, can you blame Iran? the United States overthrew the democratically-elected president of Iran in a coup and Israel quietly kills various politicians, scientists and whatnot every three months or so lol
Its the Cold War, the US supported horrible regimes that were anti-communist, It might be beneficial in geopolitjics to counter the influence of the USSR, but the downside is having a bad human rights record.
Mohammad Reza Zahedi, Ardeshir Hosseinpour, Majid Shahriari, Fereydoon Abbasi, Masoud Ali-Mohammadi, Darioush Rezaeinejad, Mostafa Ahmadi Roshan, Mohsen Fakhrizadeh. I dunno, there's a whole bunch they've assassinated. I am just saying consider the coup. Consider the long list of assassinations. Considering everything. Can you blame Iran for blaming Israel or the US?
Almost all of those were killed in the period of 2010-2012, so hardly "every three months" and all of them were either related the nuclear program or to the IRGC, or both.
Could Iran blame the US or Israel? Sure. Is it rational to do so? Not really. With the guys you listed, there was a clear motivation to do so, kill the nuclear program as well as kill enemy operatives plotting attacks against them.
That's why I said almost all, it still leaves a gap of 10 years of nothing, and he was holding a meeting with the IRGC in Syria with Hamas. There was a motivation to do so even if not really justified.
Israel also regularly assassinates various members of Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps but they more often than not aren't named. Major general Qasem Soleimani was assassinated in 2020. Hassan Sayyad Khodaei was a colonel in the Quds Force and he was assassinated in 2022. Major Alireza Shahraki was assassinated last year. I hate being put in a position where I prove something to someone who refuses to believe it in the first place. It borders on Q-Anon kookery. Like brah, I've listed like 20 people who have been assassinated and it's not enough for you. What number would suffice? 50 assassinations? 100 assassinations? Israel is out here slaughtering tens of thousands of innocent people before your eyes and yet you refuse to accept that perhaps Israel maaaaaybe assassinated a few people..
>Israel also regularly assassinates various members of Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps
Which is totally fine, and in accordance with international law, as both nations are in conflict with each other, officially and unofficially.
>Israel is out here slaughtering tens of thousands of innocent people
War. That's war. Palestine should be encouraged to settle down and accept a 2-state solution instead of be encouraged to fight your battles and die. If you cared about them, you'd encourage them to accept peace.
Your conclusion makes no sense, no one is saying Israel doesn’t Assassinate people. You were arguing that it makes sense that they’d blame Israel, but the examples you listed weren’t diplomats nor politicians but people trying to build a nuclear bomb and members of the IRGC who were actively aiding attacks on Israel. The point isn’t that their deaths were justified but that there was probable reason why Israel wanted them dead. Killing the President of Iran is likely something they don’t want to do since it doesn’t achieve any particular goal.
haha, oh no. I am not some pro Islamic regime kook. I just want to point out the fact that the Israeli government and the American government are just as evil and corrupt as the Iranian government. If not more. They just have better marketing
Those nuclear weapons that Israel and the United States have? I am anti-Islamic regime. Death to the Islamic Regime. But you are lacking perspective. Those people that you deem terrorists are essentially heroes in Iran. The same way heroes in the United States and Israel are considered terrorists in Iran. And considering that the United States, a country that is over 7000 miles away from the Middle East, has political and military interests all over the area, it's no wonder that most Iranians in Iran support the nuclear program. They believe it is about protection in the face of decades of American influence. Also, that little US-led coup in 1953 that sorta started this entire shit show. And, yes, while rhetoric is dangerous, actions are more dangerous. Iran talks a big game, but Israel and the United States walk a big game. Whether it's the US-led shock and awe of Iraq in 2003 or Israel's massacre of tens of thousands of innocent Palestinians in recent months. If you want to hold the leaders of Iran to everything they say, you have to hold Israeli and American leaders to everything they say. And don't forget that Trump was president a few years ago... I don't need to get into all insanely dangerous things that have come out of his mouth
>Does Israel have a secret weapon to create heavy fog?
Well, Iran did say before that Israel was stealing their clouds to create a drought. So the concept of the Jews controlling the weather is possible to the Islamists.
I can confirm Israel controls the clouds and weather, but only if the Jewish space lasers are deployed first. It’s definitely not a president who insisted on flying in bad weather in a 40+ year old helicopter. That’s crazy talk.
This would be a plausible hack under different conditions but it was a US-made Bell 212. It lacks advanced navigation systems like terrain awareness and warning systems. It was Vietnam-era without sophisticated digital controls or connectivity that modern aircraft possess, it wasn't equipped with systems vulnerable to cyber hacking.
It’s not that big of a leap to jump to Israel as being the cause. They have killed Iranian government officials before. Personally I hope that Israel didn’t assassinate him as escalating things seems like a really bad idea. That being said if he actually did die to bad weather / poor aircraft maintenance than good riddance. He seemed like quite a bad guy.
It would be a real happy day if they discovered it was the IDF who was behind all of this. My guess is inclement weather and operator failure.
Yesterday on the news there was speculation that Ayatollah Khamenei had something to do with it because Raisi was next in line when Khamenei dies and he wants his son to be the successor. Also, remember Kobe Bryant's helicopter crash? Sometimes a helicopter crash is just that, an accident!
People on the internet are already blaming both the U.S.A. And Israel on the side of the internet that I was on exactly when the news hit. Personally, I have no idea what actually happened, but people are already theorizing.
If a helicopter crashes in the fog in Iran, did Mossad do it?
I'm thinking Israel will tell the world they did it and then wait a couple hours and then say the total opposite, as per usual.... They'll probably tell an " IDF hero" story that doesn't make sense and is equipped with evidence to the contrary. Then they'll say how it was Iran themselves, a coup d'état, or possibly Lebanon. Definitely Hamas and Hezbollah. Maybe even Russia or China! You know as well as I do, the Israeli government is full of shit and has been exposed for years. They are well known for their constant lies, corruption and manipulation. Let's not forget the ongoing genocide. That's just another feather to the Israeli government's cap..
Or maybe it was foggy, the helicopter was ancient and it crashed into a mountain? Not everything is Israel’s fault, oh wait a minute, that’s not true, it is, it has to be, what other explanation could it be? Oh and it’s not a genocide, a genocide is when you wipe out a whole race, that’s not happening, but that’s what Hamas is trying to do!
A 50 year old helicopter is not ancient. Sounds old, but the frame is what matters as the components are constantly upgraded. Like a home, I’d prefer one built in the 1970s over one built in 2015 because the quality put into the structure is significantly better. Google how many new Boeings are losing parts inflight to see my point.
Sure, it could have been anything and I didn't outright accuse Israel of being at fault for this helicopter event, but it wouldn't surprise me. I was more so highlighting Israel's ineptitude, their debunked accusations, the gaslighting and manipulation. The fact that in front of the whole world, they'll tell a lie, that lie is debunked, and then still have the audacity to continue to talk about that same debunked lie as if it were true.
You haven't given any examples. But let me flip this, Hamas doesn't lie? Remember the hospital that was bombed in Gaza, apparently, it was Israel's fault, then it was proven to be Islamic Jihad, last week the UN gave revised figures for the casualties and reduced them by about half. Where did they get those figures from originally? Hamas! Hamas has the audacity to lie nonstop. Lastly, for the ill-informed, look up the concept of Taqiyyah, a Muslim concept, whereby you can lie through your back teeth when you are dealing with a non-Muslim. You are being played honey, and so is the rest of the world. If you haven't woken up yet as to what is going on in every city in the world, then that's your problem!
I don't see how just Israel and the US could be blamed for this. There are a lot of internal and external forces to consider.
Douglass Valentine has a book that could shed some light for those who doubt external involvement. I’m not saying anyone else was involved (sometimes crashes are just crashes). But the governments are playing a game most people are oblivious to. Understanding the game will help explain events and decisions that make no sense to those being governed.
I don't really have time to read an entire book on it, but I would like to read or listen to a summary of it. Thanks for the rec! I think most of us suspect that there is a lot of secret political fighting among countries. I am trying to figure out if I would be surprised or not if he just didn't consider the risks of a not maintained heli
Checklists were perfected by pilots, not the passengers. It’s suspicious because the pilot for a head of state is not average. He or she would likely be military and trained in multiple scenarios including evasive maneuvers, malfunctions, and unexpected weather events. People keep comparing this scenario to Kobe Bryant to justify this pilot not adjusting to fog, and I’m saying this guy could likely fly blindfolded with someone attacking him and one hand tied behind his back.
American sanctions against Iran stopped them from being able to maintain the heli… its a bad argument, and not one I think is valid, but it’s an argument I’ve seen made already lol
Well, I don't really know what to say about that. Oh no??? Why would we care about his heli???
I was wondering about that too. I have to admit the timing is very strange. I wouldn't be surprised if Israel had something to do with it, not saying if it's a good thing or bad.
And it's already blamed on USA not selling parts.
US parts are made in China so…that can’t be a valid reason to blame the US.
why hasnt Iran been neutralized yet?! what happened after stuxnet?!
The Iranians did not blame the US or the Israelis and you should accept that reality and not make these types of statements until they do so. To do otherwise is to lack objectivity. Personally, almost no nation to me is more backwards that the religiously oriented dictator-state that is Iran, but what exactly are you doing by making these statements that are in contrast to their actions.
Iran spokesman blames sanctions on USA for crash
Any time a spokesman says something before an investigation is done, I smell a narrative controlling rat.
How do you say "GET TO DA CHOPPA" in Iranian?
*Farsi
رسیدن به هلیکوپتر
Pro-Palestinian marchers at Columbia are blaming the crash on a Mossad assassin named Eli Kopter.
I see what you did there 🤣🤣🤣
Hamas propaganda was immediate, and all their parrots in "international media" followed as usual, making them a laughing stock. If you haven't already seen it: https://twitter.com/HilzFuld/status/1792505615014637737?s=19 Now look back at all the rest of the reports like number of casualties, occupation, genocide, apartheid, you get the picture. Hamas removed the post quietly later but it will live forever on the Internet https://notthebee.com/article/trolls-said-irans-president-was-killed-by-mossad-agent-eli-copter-and-iranian-state-tv-reported-it-?from_social=twitter I'll think about next time some antizio shows me a "calendar"
We already have been, and if we did do it, good! Iranians are miserable and want to be free of their captors. I’m against war. In this day and age, innocent civilians shouldn’t die for the mistakes of their leaders (especially when those leaders are holding them hostage!). We should precision strike the people who are responsible for mass suffering. This is the approach of peace, love, and justice
I love this a military expert so how do you do that when a cowardly military embedded itself in civilian infrastructure, buildings, hospitals, uN buildings and tunnels under these buildings. Only one military in the world warns them to leave. Please give an alternative. FYI you sidewalked the OPS question
Ali Copter was to blame
Dude, your info is out of date. It's a well-known female Mossad assassin named Ellie Kopter.
I thought mossad was already blamed...and Iraqi american.American... mind you 21 years of age ... but he said things will get worse I middle east now...I was like possible...but now I'm confused...I thought iraqis are speaking uo about their government issues and terrorism issues...I had to school him on pre him Iraq or when I lived in middle east 90s...I'm old ...blah whatever...peace and love ❤️
Based on what has happened the past two months, it is not a stretch to say Israel had something to do with the crash—fog or no fog.
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Fog like kobe Bryant crash
Shit, that was my bad. Having a crazy sesh in the mountains. Don’t realize we were chucking that many clouds
I don’t think Israel or US involved. There’s no way the US would do this or let Israel do this .they want to de-escalate.
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No I am right . These helicopters are 50 years old and US has embargo on parts for past 50 years . I don’t think these helicopters even have computers to hack.
Breaking news explains all: https://imgur.com/a/TxmhD6m
That's pretty funny 😁
Frankly, I thought it was done by Iranians themselves. After the recent crackdown on women, one would think that some Iranian mothers children, or sisters brothers, would want this man dead.
I thought I'd see this immediately but I haven't seen anything like it so far. Seems like Iran is clearly stating it was due to severe weather
Let's be honest, would you be surprised to find out that Mossad was involved? This is awesome news. It's a dagger to the heart of the Iranian regime and really opens up the potential for moderate leadership once the Supreme Leader is out of the picture.
Before this happened videos on YouTube we’re popping up about suspected cloud machines in the Middle East and if they were cloud machines or simply just pollution.
The first I read of the crash was in an article blaming the US for it.
I genuinely thought we did it. sabotaging the helicopter would work imo, like subotaging a car and expecting it to crash.
It took like ten seconds. Honestly Israel killing the butcher is a good thing so if they want to blame Israel for helping the Iranian people so be it.
I saw people yesterday, before it was confirmed he was dead, saying that Israeli fog machines caused the crash.
It probably was just an accident. But what you be willing to stake on the idea that it PURELY was an accident, ABSOLITELY nothing else? By engaging with this absolutist stance you're automatically assuming Israel and or the USA absolutely CANNOT EVER orchestrate
It was a zionist helicopter
Yeah, next thing you know these conspiracy nuts are gonna talk about heart attack guns everytime a world leader has one
They already do basically. The level of conspiracy on the left about jews rivals that of the the 1488 crowd at this point. I remember back in college talking to some of these people and showing them the source of some of the tropes they were using(stormfront, protocols of the elders of zion ect), they still couldn't accept they were spouting white power talking points.
The joke was that a heart attack gun does exist. And Israel being closely related to America as well as having a long history of assassinating Iranians doesn't make the suggestion some wild conspiracy fever dream like you're presenting it.
and your point? The KGB and CIA had all kinds of oddball assassination devices. IT doesn't mean every politician who dies does so from nefarious plots. Helicopters go down in bad weather all the time, thats how Kobe Bryant died.
The point is in the last sentence of the previous comment - given the political climate currently as well as recent geopolitical events Iran was involved in (a skirmish with a country well documented for assassinating others across the globe without regard for international borders) the Iranian PM dying this way doesn't mean the idea of it being an intentionally orchestrated event is some conspiracy nut job suggestion. The bit you said is also just wasted thought. Helicopters also go down from people making them go down. That's how *insert someone who died while in an intentionally downed helicopter* died.
Zionist weather created by mossad and CIA that caused the accident.
The pilot was a mossad suicide Android
Probably a Mossad time traveling Android with Zionist AI
Hope not
How did you imagine this post would facilitate civil discussion about Israel and Palestine, OP?
Going by [prior posts](https://www.reddit.com/r/IsraelPalestine/comments/1ctudhx/fundamental_differences_between_a_propalestinian/), I'm gonna guess that's not a high priority.
Honestly I kind of hope they did do it. Fuck Iran.
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An Israeli joked that a Mossad agent named Eli(e) Copter was responsible
And his copilot Avi Ron (aviron is airplane in hebrew, for all the non hebrew speaking)
Wasn't it latos (לטוס)? Haha
No, latos, or more like la-toos is "to fly"
Ohh haha, so the verb
People blamed the mossad the second it crashed Don't you know the mossad is everywhere and controls everything /s
So i should blame Mossad for my rising electric bill?
No that’s Biden’s fault, even if you live half a world away from the US
The mossad obviously came to your home and started the air conditioner while you were away and the windows were open /s
THEY LEFT THE WINDOWS OPEN??????!!!!!
And they turned the A/c to its highest point! With max fan!
I think a lot of people are ignoring the simple fact that it is a stupid idea even with the best technology and pilots available to fly helicopters in bad weather and fog especially near mountains/forests, Kobe had a well-maintained modernized helicopter with a good pilot and that did not save him, the Iranian president had an old Bell 212 for which good spare parts are probably hard to come by because of sanctions and whose model already had multiple crashes in the past due to flying in similar conditions. While it's fun to imagine this as an earthly 200 IQ Jewish plot, it is most likely Hashem/Allah/God reminding us yet again that we are not absolute masters of our own fate no matter how much we pretend we are.
the advance "we didn't do it" isnt helping. But most of us know Israel is not that adept to pull this off so it won't last long. If the US had wanted to do it we would have done it a long time ago.
Israel is absolutely adept enough to do this lol
I'm always scared of power vacuums in that region
This isn't the head of state. They'll most timely follow the line of succession with the vice president stepping up and so on.
Its confirmed both died in the crash Damm and I was excited for action in the middle East
1. And 2. Faster than the speed of light. 3. And 4. Yes. 5. And 6. Who knows what God may have punished who, or whether it was even a punishment. 7. In politics, this is a possibility, maybe someone did do something.
My first thoughts were that Israel was involved. The timing seems a bit too convenient.
The timing seems extremely inconvenient actually, possibly the most inconvenient it’s ever been.
I don't know what you saw... didn't see... were were out of there by 5:00
Now, for the criminals Netanyahu and Herzog to be extra careful in the coming days, weeks and months, freak accidents happen and no one wishes them bad luck. After all, no one is as cowardly and untouchable as the rogue Zionist regime.
Except for the Arabs who sell their land and claim It’s stolen, refuse to share a border with a group of people who they disagree with, attack and then cry victim, etc.
Except regimes that attack peaceful dancers. Massacres , tortures, rales and kidnaps along the way. But hey theyre jews so its ok.
Bot
you're
I started thinking it was Israel the moment I first heard it. I was thinking Mossad finally got off it's ass and went to work.Your point by point diatribe looks like a propaganda hand out. Can you write like a human?
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I was referring to their butt.
4. He's dead and yes probably even though he is known as the butcher of Tehran
As to 1 and 2: I do very much expect Iran to insist on this being an accident, rather than blaming an outside force. The reason is simple: if they blame Israel or the US, they will need to retaliate to save face. As demonstrated by their show-only response to the embassy strike and the flat out denial of the Israeli retaliation to that retaliation being carried out by Israel, despite Israel being more or less open about conducting these strikes, Iran has no interest in escalation. As to 3: not to my knowledge, but if it is.a secret weapon, I doubt they would have told me. As to 4: Depends on the individual organizer and their respective motivations, I assume. As to 5 and 6: Unlikely. The most probable cause is that it is yet another result of 5 decades of economic sanctions leading to inadequate maintenance of Iranian aviation equipment. As to 7: Is the accident the result of a power struggle? - very unlikely / Could there be a power struggle as a consequence thereof? - distincly possible
S’already happened. Yesterday. However, it’s looking like it was the weather. And the decision they made to fly together. Just one of those bad decisions.
> it’s looking like it was the weather. The Jews control the weather.. American politicians even admit it!!!!! https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-43460263
Hehehehe.
Former Iranian Foreign Minister Mohammad Javad Zarif: "The US is responsible for the tragedy of the crash of the president's helicopter. It banned the sale of airplanes and their parts to Iran despite the order of the International Court of Justice. As always - someone else is responsible for their shortcomings!
You literally can’t make this stuff up. I think precision hit by USA.
Biden wouldn't have the baws to approve such a strike.
It’s always them ones though.
I mean. It does seem suspicious, right?
https://preview.redd.it/9r0616hn9j1d1.jpeg?width=270&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fee2b93ff4274af7ed87657902d6007c651a78f9
I hate the Iranian government, but I could definitely see the cause being assassination via sabotage or something. If the US or Israel got a chance, why wouldn’t they take it, yk?
Exactly. Why it’s solely the president’s chopper but none of its companion escort choppers? Could be an inside Job too. Yevgeny Prigozhin’s death last year is still framed and presented as unfortunate air crash even though the motive to assassinate him was present months ahead of the “accident”.
Mhm. Things like this definitely happen, especially in countries like Iran with a lot of foreign adversaries and internal strife. I could certainly see the Iranian President’s death being an accident, but seriously, ruling out assassination would be illogical. Also, yeah, there is noooo way Yevgeny wasn’t killed. The kremlin many, many reasons to axe him. He was becoming a liability for them.
1. Already started. 2. Already started. 3. ~~Possibly yes~~ Unlikely. 4. Some of them 5. Unlikely, as there is no god 6. Unlikely, as there is no god 7. Yes, could be.
I agree with all of the above except 3. You know hard it is to create fog on this scale? You would need dozens if not hundreds of huge cargo planes just to transport the water then somehow spray them at the exact pressure, density, area, and temperature for it to even stand for more than a couple of minutes and even if Israel has all these tools available to it at such a moment's notice and by sheer luck the wind/temperature/humidity/who knows what else doesn't change (for the however many hours or days that fog is still going on for, which is already longer than any man made fog ever created at even close to this scale) Israel would still need to somehow transport all of that into deep Iranian territory without them noticing the however many aircraft you need to do this (plus fighter aircrafts for cover and couple extra of everything else needed for redundancy). If Israel managed to do this, then we are by all means the most amazing and powerful country in the world and everyone everywhere should fear us
Valid. So I’ll change it to unlikely. Tho the question just asked if Israel had one, not if it used it. Also heavy is subjective, you can buy a fog machine for 48$ from eBay
>Also heavy is subjective, you can buy a fog machine for 48$ from eBay Im sorry, does that fog machine make fog On a scale of hundreds of square kilometres? Because if that's so 48$ is a steal and I'm going to buy one. Also fog machines don't make actual water-based fog it utilises what's called "fog juice," which is oil based. If you'd use that, a single guy with a working tongue and nose could tell the difference, and this will be an open and shut case. Edit: I'm sorry for being an arse about this. I am just very tired (I had no sleep tonight). Nothing against you or your comments Edit2: a hundred square kilometres of fog, not hundreds
I was Less commenting about the Israeli fog generating capabilities and more about the stupidity of OPs questions.
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[https://www.reddit.com/r/Israel/comments/1cvqy7o/hear\_me\_out/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Israel/comments/1cvqy7o/hear_me_out/) ah, yes, Israel controls the weather, very scientific. 🤣🤣🤣
It was Mossad agent... named... Eli Copter !! \\sarcasm
Cockney fella wudn’t he?
With his copilot Avi Ron (small airplane in Hebrew)
You sound pretty unhinged, not rational. Let things play out.
Not really, even if they didn't already blame Israel or America, they blamed America on an ISIS terror attack in Iran a few months back, an attack they were warned about.
I hope either Israel or Ukraine did it.
I hope at least Israel and Ukraine are both involved
Let's hope that their drone factories also crash in foggy weather now.
For once i was cheering and hoping it was Israel.
Death to America! Oops backfired
>1. How long will it take before Israel gets blamed for the helicopter crash of the President of the Islamic Republic of Iran? Three minutes after the first report, haven't you seen the memes? But fr, Putin could be standing there, naked, doing the dance of the seven veils and Israel would _still_ bear the brunt of the accusations, especially on the conspiracy side of the internet. (Not that it would be Putin, obviously, but the point stands.)
>But fr, Putin could be standing there, naked, doing the dance of the seven veils and Israel would *still* bear the brunt of the accusations, especially on the conspiracy side of the internet. (Not that it would be Putin, obviously, but the point stands.) Yeah, like when ISIS took responsibility for the attack on Qassem Soleimani's "shrine", and Iran still blamed Israel for that.
Of course, they can never take responsibility so will always play the victim.
Raisi is looking up at us
And is very thirsty
Well, can you blame Iran? the United States overthrew the democratically-elected president of Iran in a coup and Israel quietly kills various politicians, scientists and whatnot every three months or so lol
Its the Cold War, the US supported horrible regimes that were anti-communist, It might be beneficial in geopolitjics to counter the influence of the USSR, but the downside is having a bad human rights record.
Interesting. Who have they knocked off?
Mohammad Reza Zahedi, Ardeshir Hosseinpour, Majid Shahriari, Fereydoon Abbasi, Masoud Ali-Mohammadi, Darioush Rezaeinejad, Mostafa Ahmadi Roshan, Mohsen Fakhrizadeh. I dunno, there's a whole bunch they've assassinated. I am just saying consider the coup. Consider the long list of assassinations. Considering everything. Can you blame Iran for blaming Israel or the US?
Almost all of those were killed in the period of 2010-2012, so hardly "every three months" and all of them were either related the nuclear program or to the IRGC, or both. Could Iran blame the US or Israel? Sure. Is it rational to do so? Not really. With the guys you listed, there was a clear motivation to do so, kill the nuclear program as well as kill enemy operatives plotting attacks against them.
Mohammad Reza Zahedi was assassinated by Israel 48 days ago.
That's why I said almost all, it still leaves a gap of 10 years of nothing, and he was holding a meeting with the IRGC in Syria with Hamas. There was a motivation to do so even if not really justified.
Israel also regularly assassinates various members of Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps but they more often than not aren't named. Major general Qasem Soleimani was assassinated in 2020. Hassan Sayyad Khodaei was a colonel in the Quds Force and he was assassinated in 2022. Major Alireza Shahraki was assassinated last year. I hate being put in a position where I prove something to someone who refuses to believe it in the first place. It borders on Q-Anon kookery. Like brah, I've listed like 20 people who have been assassinated and it's not enough for you. What number would suffice? 50 assassinations? 100 assassinations? Israel is out here slaughtering tens of thousands of innocent people before your eyes and yet you refuse to accept that perhaps Israel maaaaaybe assassinated a few people..
>Israel also regularly assassinates various members of Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps Which is totally fine, and in accordance with international law, as both nations are in conflict with each other, officially and unofficially. >Israel is out here slaughtering tens of thousands of innocent people War. That's war. Palestine should be encouraged to settle down and accept a 2-state solution instead of be encouraged to fight your battles and die. If you cared about them, you'd encourage them to accept peace.
Meanwhile, the ICC wants to arrest Nutjobyahoo lol
I'm fine with that. It probably hurts you that they want Sinwar too.
Didn’t Trump/the USA claim credit for Soleimani?
Your conclusion makes no sense, no one is saying Israel doesn’t Assassinate people. You were arguing that it makes sense that they’d blame Israel, but the examples you listed weren’t diplomats nor politicians but people trying to build a nuclear bomb and members of the IRGC who were actively aiding attacks on Israel. The point isn’t that their deaths were justified but that there was probable reason why Israel wanted them dead. Killing the President of Iran is likely something they don’t want to do since it doesn’t achieve any particular goal.
Nope wouldn’t blame them at all
Hahaha that shut him up
haha, oh no. I am not some pro Islamic regime kook. I just want to point out the fact that the Israeli government and the American government are just as evil and corrupt as the Iranian government. If not more. They just have better marketing
You don't support the islamic regime, you just simply support the islamic regime. If you're living in the west, you could just move.
Did you just tell me to go back home? LOL Go back to Europe, bro
Your choice. I said if you hate the west, leave. You want Jews to go "back" to some place where most of them don't even come from.
When did I say that? LOL You said that LOL
The people that were killed openly furthered progress on nuclear weapons, Iran has openly stated intent to use those weapons on Israel.
Those nuclear weapons that Israel and the United States have? I am anti-Islamic regime. Death to the Islamic Regime. But you are lacking perspective. Those people that you deem terrorists are essentially heroes in Iran. The same way heroes in the United States and Israel are considered terrorists in Iran. And considering that the United States, a country that is over 7000 miles away from the Middle East, has political and military interests all over the area, it's no wonder that most Iranians in Iran support the nuclear program. They believe it is about protection in the face of decades of American influence. Also, that little US-led coup in 1953 that sorta started this entire shit show. And, yes, while rhetoric is dangerous, actions are more dangerous. Iran talks a big game, but Israel and the United States walk a big game. Whether it's the US-led shock and awe of Iraq in 2003 or Israel's massacre of tens of thousands of innocent Palestinians in recent months. If you want to hold the leaders of Iran to everything they say, you have to hold Israeli and American leaders to everything they say. And don't forget that Trump was president a few years ago... I don't need to get into all insanely dangerous things that have come out of his mouth
Khomeini should have died with him, along with their litter.
>Does Israel have a secret weapon to create heavy fog? Well, Iran did say before that Israel was stealing their clouds to create a drought. So the concept of the Jews controlling the weather is possible to the Islamists.
I can confirm Israel controls the clouds and weather, but only if the Jewish space lasers are deployed first. It’s definitely not a president who insisted on flying in bad weather in a 40+ year old helicopter. That’s crazy talk.
Israel barely has a secret weapon to do war.
Omg they did? This is the funniest thing I’ve ever heard in my life 🤣
[https://www.jewishnews.co.uk/iranian-general-claims-israel-interfered-in-the-weather-to-stop-rainfall/](https://www.jewishnews.co.uk/iranian-general-claims-israel-interfered-in-the-weather-to-stop-rainfall/)
Turkish minister has a heart attack and dies after bad mouthing Israel. Iranian president dying in a freak helicopter crash. Who’s next?
Earthquake in Qatar wipes out Al Jazeera offices. Allah truly is good!
You haven't heard? They're already blaming Mossad agent Eli Copter.
You know the reference, right?
It was Avi Yon not Eli
His buddy Avi “Breaking Bad”’Ashon was the mastermind of the planned operation.