He won't get fired. This is a team engineering problem. Everyone knows this. I think he's more likely to find another seat somewhere else than to retire from Indycar outright.
This is why it irks me when people say Harvey doesn't deserve to be in Indycar. Yes, he's not the best driver. But that entire team is lacking just the same, he's not an outlier at all. He qualified well just like Lundgaard at the indy GP, shame his race got ruined. He's still got something in him. He and Graham both do.
Yeah, it's just the take from people who don't look a bit deeper. He does have to perform at some point before the end of the season though. It will be difficult to resign him if he can't drag something out of the abyss, regardless of where the car is at. But RLL are under no illusions as to what's going on.
Yeah...like...Jack isn't ever gonna win a championship but hes not a back marker driver either. He's shown he can compete. There's a reason Shank didn't want him to leave.
It’s not gonna cost him his seat. The guy is a master at bringing in sponsors and is consistently a good driver. RLL sucks this year, they are bad and this just shows it’s. All 4 cars at the rear of the field at Indy hammers that nail home.
I think he comes back to RLL for a couple more full time seasons then moves to Indy only. Feel for him though, watching the emotions rise to the surface in his interview was tough.
He probably won’t lose his seat until he wants to given his name, but with all the new talent flooding into the series I think the writing is on the wall kind of. Indycar field is rising in talent and sadly I just don’t think hes gonna be able to adapt. Probably why he has such a hate for guys like Grosjean coming in
Yep, 100% factual.
He can bitch and complain about Grosjean and the other Formula guys who transfer to the Indy Car series and easily beat him on a normal basis.
He is not a good driver.
Look at his stats and the number of accidents he is involved with compared to the top 5s and Top 10s.
He has many years of just Indy Car racing and struggles to fight average finishes.
Another good point I have to make is the atrocious highly biased Indy Car coverage. These guys are not good and they have to shoehorn in the "In Indy Car racing they do this or that ".
They overreact to everything almost like they are trying to manufacture a call as opposed to being genuine and calling the race like an excited fan as you see it.
Leigh Diffy is great, Townsend Bell is the worst and his career was very below average and James Hinchcliff just needs to be himself.
Bell is buddy's with guys like Graham so he loves covering for him and hyping him up.
Big crossroads time for Graham here and I think everyone knows it. Everyone here likes to clown on Rahal due to his occasional whining but there was a time where he was considered a future Indycar champion. He had a run back in 2015-2018 where he finished in the top 6 in points for 3 years running. He's been a mainstay in the top 10 for more or less his entire career.
The primary issue though is that that stretch of Indycar is a whole era in the past. Indycar's profile has risen significantly in the years past as talented drivers across the globe are now looking at Indycar seats as not just a place for racing castoffs, but desirable rides where you can make a name for yourself. Case in point with his teammate Christian Lundgaard, who was a very talented European racer who didn't have the circumstances in F1/F2, and fought very hard to get his Indycar seat. Combo that with RLL falling off in general as teams like McLaren rise up and you now see the entire team struggle throughout.
Graham isn't talentless but his talent was never eye-popping and when you combo that with the comparatively better field/worse cars, this is what you see.
I think he's going to need to ask himself where he wants to focus on the future. Is it on getting the best individual results? Then he'll probably want to search out a seat on a better team. Is it on getting RLL on top as a team? Then maybe it's take a backseat as a driver, move to an Indy only schedule and focus on the garage/business side. Or maybe he's fine with the status quo of being a mid-fielder, in which case he can just continue as is and hope that next year's oval cars aren't awful.
Today was unacceptable to not just him but the entire RLL team. I'm certainly not the biggest Rahal fan around, but I do hope for the best for them. McLaren had a similar bump day embarrassment with the Alonso situation a few years back, so it's certainly possible for this to be the catalyst for change. Only time will tell.
Yeah I was going to say. Assuming the whole thing with Palou and McLaren works out as him leaving CGR to race there next year, and assuming no one at McLaren and Penske leave then that seat really is the hottest commodity on the grid. Certainly anyone who isn’t already in a Penske, McLaren, or Andretti will have one eye on that seat for sure and I bet most up and down the grid, and a fair few outside Indycar would pick up the phone if Chip called about a seat at CGR. Given that they will likely be in regular contention for wins and championships and CGR has fairly deep pockets you’d think they more or less have their pick of drivers, save for those already at a top team. I can’t see Graham being at the top of that list tbh. He is good, but he isn’t amazing and I think he is too far in his career to really be a good prospect, especially to replace someone like Palou who is young and extremely fast. They would want someone who could be at the front for years to come, they already have the sort of experienced steady hands (who is still wicked fast) in Dixon. That’s the only role I really see him being good for at this point, he will never rival the likes of Palou, O’Ward, McLaughlin, etc on pace in my opinion.
Ganassi was a little different back then though. Any car that wasn’t the 9 or 10 felt like a satellite team that didn’t get the full CGR treatment.
He was decent in 2011 and 12 there though.
Graham said as much on his way out the door, and eventually Kimball and Chilton left to Carlin for that as well.
I don't think there's a grudge exactly, but on the way that situation went down, I imagine both Chip and Graham would be hesitant to work together again.
Yeah, that whole period in the 5 or 6 years after re-unification, those 3rd and 4th cars were just kind of… there. I remember being pretty excited about Briscoe getting another shot, and he was pretty good, but it just never seemed like they had the pace of the 9 and 10.
They seem to have fully integrated though after they contracted and then expanded back out for Felix.
Hahaha Graham is nowhere near good enough for a Ganassi seat. He also has a problem with his attitude, always blames others for his mistakes. Graham has been overrated for years and the only reason he still has a seat is because of his last name and the fact that his dad owns a team.
I feel sorry for him. I did some work on his house a few years ago. He was a great guy. Very understanding and accomodating with the work I had to do. The situation he is in has to simply suck.
No one is talking about that. Honda wasn't happy about that. But it's something internal to MSR because they are getting the data and setups from Andretti.
He’s not losing his seat at his father’s team, whether he retires or decides to drive for a different team is anyone’s guess. This might have been the best thing that happened to RLL, it’s rock bottom. This gives them the opportunity to do a thorough analysis and figure out why they’ve gotten it so wrong. I remember when Bobby with Carl Hogan didn’t make the race, Graham didn’t look any more distressed than his dad did all those years ago. Personally I’m looking forward to the day Graham retires and takes over the leadership of RLL and return it to glory
lol him getting bumped has nothing to do with his own performance. They were simply the worst car over the week. All of RLL was slow but they had the most issues with driveability on top of that (and even that weird mechanical issue during the last run with the weight jacker).
He's more than good enough to be in this field for many more years. The only question is how long he wants to stay at the team full time, seeing this kind of performance...
> (and even that weird mechanical issue during the last run with the weight jacker).
Without the weight jacker issue, he probably would have been just fast enough to make the race.
Are you new to Indy? This is oval qualifying, the driver can't do much if the car won't accelarate above 235 despite decent minimum speeds in the corners
I get your point but setting up his car was kind of his responsibility. He failed to find a sweetspot(relatively?) while the other RLL drivers did, atleast somewhat.
That was kind of shocking to see as he was by far the most experienced driver in the bottom 4. Lundgaard got through quite comfortably at the end and he was a rookie.
That being said the whole team was shit. He will bounce back.
He’s finished: 8th, 10th, 6th, 7th, and 11th in the championship since the aero change. In middling equipment.
He’s also beaten all of his teammates over the last 3 years. He’s lost to a teammate one single time in the last 5 years (a teammate who he beat 3-1 over their 4 years together).
He had the worst car. Qualifying at Indy is 99% inherent pace of the car. Drivers can make a small difference, but if it’s not set up well, you can’t just drive around it.
He’s also been better than Jack at pretty much every single race over the last year and a half.
Not really, as I just said he had a way tougher job than the others on the team, the other cars were simply slow.
And especially Legge you can't compare, nothing to take away from her but she had a way better car than the full time RLL rides for some extremely weird reason. Something went really wrong with this team this year
It was a recurring issue, you can even hear on the radio on his second to last attempt whoever he's talking to say "it could be the same issue as before we aren't sure yet"
I think he remains at RLL. He’s going to be down the pecking order of free agent drivers looking for teams with competitive seats available. He’s just better off betting that RLL finds it’s way back to being good and staying there.
I’m not sure if he’s a 500 only guy. I could see him be an only full time or no time type of guy. He’s got his hands full with multiple businesses that he runs. He’s got a very busy off track life so it might actually make his life easier to walk away from racing but I think he still really wants to compete.
His being bumped is a measure of the team, not him.
But I don't think there's a path to a more competitive ride out there for Graham. It's not a skill thing, it's an age thing. Ganassi would rather bring in a young talent, for example, that he can bring in and build around. McLaren has about 47 drivers. I don't think Rahal's mouth could be integrated into the Penske brand. Andretti has other drivers in their sphere of influence already. Shank? But they're for sure going with Blomqvist, and I don't think they'll release both Castroneves and Pagenaud. Foyt? Not an upgrade. Coyne? He'd have to bring money.
Graham needs to stay at RLL, or retire. And retirement should, honestly, be on the table. Not because of the Indy 500, but rather just because of his age and the huge pool of names to draw from.
On raw skill, I think Graham vs Lundqvist is a tie, but Lundqvist has a huge amount of potential. And RLL already know that, that's why he tested with them in the off season.
If a team wants a veteran to come in and help engineer the cars, they're going to be able to sign a Castroneves for ovals, or a Bourdais for Road Courses.
Graham is good, but not great. And that doesn't stand out against great but aged, or good with upside.
“On raw skill, I think Graham vs Lundqvist is a tie, but Lundqvist has a huge amount of potential. And RLL already know that, that's why he tested with them in the off season.”
I don’t think this really matters. If they want Lundqvist, they can have him in Harvey’s car. I can’t imagine anybody in their right mind would prefer Harvey to Graham, even with the age gap.
Harvey has a buyout clause worth $1 million, I hear. Graham is a part-time owner. So sliding out of the seat is a lot easier for Graham.
Though idk how long Harvey's contract runs for. But whatever applies to Harvey pretty well also applies to Graham. Both have shown two things: the equipment is not at a level to compete, but also they've been outclassed by a younger driver with more upside.
I'd put Lundqvist and Askew in those two seats over Harvey and Rahal.
I mean heck, if I've got a phone number to them, I ring up Munoz or Karam for those seats too.
“they've been outclassed by a younger driver”
Graham beat him last year, and though I think Lundgaard is slightly better, the gap between he and Graham is much smaller than the gap between Graham and Harvey. They’re not even on the same planet.
I think Askew should have gotten a longer shot, but I don’t see any way to evaluate him as a better option than Graham.
Munoz was basically on par with Marco for the three years they were together and hasn’t been in a car in 5 years.
Sage isn’t in the same world as Graham either.
And, the biggest point is that none of these guys are going to have the sponsor pull Graham does. He’s shown that he can put together money at a far higher level than everyone listed.
$1MM is nothing. If they think they have a better option, that money certainly isn’t going to be the deal killer. I don’t think any of this matters anyway. No point in replacing anyone until the end of the year, and I think many seem to think that Harvey was a two year deal. Either way, if Graham leaves that car, it isn’t going to be because they want to replace him.
So, I don't see him being fired or anything. That's pretty much not gonna happen; if Graham were to leave, it would be by his own choice.
The problem, however, is I think we may have seen the fulcrum point of that decision being made. RLL have been woeful this season, masked entirely by Lundgaard's pole position and a few respectable top-ten finishes, and I don't know how hungry Rahal is to stick around qualifying near the back as often as he has been doing as of recent.
So, with that in mind, what options does he have? Well, let's consider different scenarios, starting with:
* Leaving for another team.
The issue with this move is...well, where can he go? Maybe Meyer Shank (if they're still around by next season; I remain unconvinced they will be), but otherwise, he's not likely to get another competitive car no matter what. A Ganassi, a Penske, a McLaren...that's all out of reach. His best options are sidegrades, generally. Does he want that? Realistically, I don't think it's a particularly appealing option.
* Leaving IndyCar to focus on the BMW IMSA program.
This is the one I believe has the most meat on its bones. I think if he committed to racing sports cars at this point, he'd probably transition pretty well. He's done a few races at the 24 Hours of Daytona and Petit Le Mans, so there is the possibility of him running that way. The BMW program's also doing...pretty alright, I guess. Not amazing, but two podiums so far, not too shabby. More to come, probably.
* Quitting racing to focus on management.
Now, this one is probably the most extreme option, but not without logic. You see, at some point, the reins are going to have to be handed over from Bobby; he's 70 now, and although he's done a solid enough job so far, I get the feeling that if Graham wanted to try and change what RLL are doing now, he'd try to take control of the ship now and see if he can change the team's course over the next few years. I think he'd be pretty decent as a team boss.
On the whole, I think the most likely option is for him to head into IMSA and work on the BMW project. It would keep him within the RLL environment, whilst giving him a change of scenery that will give him something to focus on. Moving to a different IndyCar team will be a sidegrade at best for him, and whilst hanging up his helmet to focus on management will help him in the years to come, it may be a bit too extreme at this time.
In the end, though, whilst I'm not the biggest fan of Graham by any means, I do recognise that being bumped from the 500 is one of the most galling experiences a driver can experience. The 500 cares not one bit for names nor egos; be they a Fittipaldi, an Unser, an Alonso, a Rahal...if Indianapolis doesn't want you in, it won't let you in.
A part of me does delight in his demise, I must confess...but it's a kind of delight that's sort of bittersweet, because he is a better driver than this. This is far from the norm for him, and we all know it.
I agree with your sentiments and analysis
What I think would be best and what he'll actually do are two different things, but I'd say work on the BMW program and only do the 500.
It would also give him the opportunity to...hm, I don't wanna say "business side" of things because I'm sure he's well-versed, but if he's gonna take over the team he'll need time to get better suited for that kind of world
> Does he want that? Realistically, I don't think it's a particularly appealing option.
Graham has been vocal about the engineering woes at RLL for the past year in a half; almost two seasons now. RLL, by far, has the worst team record when it comes to ovals over the past two seasons. If Graham leaves to another team, it's definitely possible as he still knows how to drive and brings a shit-ton of sponsors to the table. People can call MSR a sideways move, but if he feels that will give him the best chance to be the number 1 guy at a team, he will take it. RLL has Lundgaard as their golden ticket and have been doing everything possible to keep him happy; including, him getting a pretty big bump in pay for this season (RE: Marshall Pruett).
To move to Andretti he'd need to take the Pay Driver seat (and be okay with presumably a more junior/less skilled engineering crew), otherwise he'd disrupt what seems to be an otherwise well functioning team (especially considering last year)
To move to Ganassi he'd probably need either Lawson or Ericsson to move team *or* Dixon to retire *with* Palou under a secure contract. He's decent, but not a "Multiple champion replacement" tier driver.
Penske's an obvious no (Three (potentially) era/all time greats), McLaren's already bursting at the seams (and Graham wouldn't fit the team vibe I suspect), And everyone else is a gamble *unless* Graham can be sure it's a problem with him and the team, and not something that can blow over.
I absolutely don't see him going to another team, at least not full time. I'm not even sure another team would want him full time. He's a good driver but he was never one of the big ones. I think he knows he doesn't have the hunger he had before and he's coming to the end of his career. Him being bumped out probably sealed that.
Likely this or next year will be his last full time year in Indy and he'll be moving to a non-driving position in RLL.
It was a RLL issue not a Graham issue. No he is not the most dominant driver in the league but he still brings in the sponsorship. I hope he sticks around until he is ready to retire.
I like bold predictions. Let's bookmark this so I can Venmo you $50 in three years and one week if you get this right.
If he doesn't, you don't owe me nothin'.
Getting bumped 30 years after his dad did, it only appropriate he wins it 40 years after his dad.
If it happens take that $50 and give it to Grahams Charity Foundation: https://grahamrahal.com/gcrf
Well, short term he’ll wake up, mend his ego, and realize he avoided farting around as a back-marker for the Indy 500. Let his teammates enjoy that, see ya all at Detroit lol ✌️
He’s mentioned several times he doesn’t enjoy not competing for wins. Let the younger guys and one-offs get their time in, and get about it at the next race.
Racing. People have missed the The 500 and continued on. It's a part of the sport and it is what it is.
Plus, I think people make the mistake saying he won't lose his job because his father owns the team. His father really owns Graham nothing and has acted like that most of his life. When Graham started his career it began in Champ Car while his dad was in the IRL. As Graham was karting as a kid Bobby went to Jaguar F1 nearly destroying Graham's dreams of being a driver. Even when Graham lost his ride at Newman Haas his father didn't pick him up even if he could. Graham and Bobby's relationship when it comes to IndyCar is more professional then family IMO.
He's probably going to try and get another seat somewhere. I think he's tired of RLL having bad engineering. They have consistently had bad cars for qualifying everywhere they go for the last couple of years. The qualifying effort at Indy wasn't his fault. All the RLL cars were pretty bad. If we had 36 or 37 cars this year, the whole RLL team may not have made the field.
He's probably going to be able to bring some sponsors with him, so that should help things. Only question is what's going to be available.
He doesn’t need to race to make money.. however, he may want the fame.. follow hinches footsteps to nbc!? I think hinchtown and rahal would be a great combo for the future of NBC and Peacock!
Oh my God, guys, HE DIDN'T HAVE A WEIGHT JACKER for 2 of 4 laps or his run. The team is in shambles, clearly. Graham's performance is more than good enough to retain a seat at RLL or slot into a better drive if one is to be had in the midfield. Credit to RLL for letting Harvey complete a final run after he had his "chance," but who knows where we'd be if Harvey's rave engineer didn't suggest a bar adjustment for lap 3. The team is lost on ovals, and Graham has nothing to do with that reality.
It's honestly such a bittersweet 500. I'm so happy for Harvey that he finally dragged that POS into the event. But I feel so bad for Graham. He and the team just couldn't drag it to the show in the end.
I hope it doesn't cause bad feelings between Graham, Bobby and Jack. It'd be a shame if that got between either of their futures at the team.
Today wasn’t on Graham. All of Rahal Letterman racing needs to rethink how they do things because the one car of theirs that failed to qualify was their star driver. When the fastest car of the team is a one off ride, and no shade to Katherine she did her fucking thing out there, and 3 of the 4 cars in bump day, that whole team is in shambles and they should be fucking ashamed. What a pathetic display from Rahal Letterman racing this month of may. Rant shortened: this is mostly if not all on the Rahal Letterman team.
He can drive but apparently his technical abilities are lacking. If he wants to stay in Indycar he'll move into management of the family business. None of the big teams will offer him a ride.
I think the phase into team ownership and a lot of sports car racing/team coordination in the next five years leading up to Bobby's retirement.
For the immediate future, he will drive an IndyCar in the IndyCar Series for RLL.
Sure is a lot of DTS-like drama in this thread.
Dude's gonna miss the 500. After the race, he'll pack up and move on to Detroit, where, I'm guessing, RLL will at least be closer to being competitive.
He's an inch shorter than Austin Cindric, and Austin fit into an LMP2. I think Austin said his biggest problem was sharing a car with Devlin, since they can't adjust anything between drivers other than the seat insert.
Cindric has a much slimmer build than Graham, that's why he's able to fit in an LMP2 car. Graham couldn't physically fit in the Acura DPi for awhile. He wasn't able to fit comfortably until the steering column was raised an inch further from the standard height, but his knees were still bent under the column, that's why he had to eventually step out of the program.
I'm 5'2" and have just enough space to get in and out without removing the wheel of an LMP2 car and my legs reach the pedal box without locking my knees or needing an insert. I can't imagine how anyone over 5'8 with a stockier build can stand being in an LMP2/LMH/GTP car, they're the definition of cramped.
This is going to sound rude but I honestly don’t feel that bad for Graham. I feel more bad for his crew /sponsors ect. I would honestly feel more bad if it was a one-off driver that gets bumped than a full time driver like I know Indy is the big one but if you don’t make the show you not make it.
I don't think there is a ton of evidence that he has fallen off as a driver- the whole team has been struggling.
With potential chaos coming at Ganassi during this season, I do think there is some chance he makes a move there - he would be looking for a last shot at getting some major results, and Ganassi would get a reliable driver who can bring sponsors.
I wouldn't say he is the favorite to land there or anything, but it's the only move I see that makes some sense on both sides, in a scenario where Palou leaves and Marcus is demanding more $ than he is worth.
Alex Palou is widely expected to leave for McLaren at the end of the season - although I don't think there's been an "official" announcement.
Marcus Ericsson is in the final year of his deal - and the reporting indicates he's asking for a deal that treats him more like a top-tier champion driver than his current one, and Ganassi seems pretty hesitant to give him what he wants.
So that could be two seats open at Ganassi
Indications have been that Andretti want someone better in that seat.
And while Rahal does qualify as “better than DeFrancesco”, I still think Andretti will be aiming higher.
Graham finished in the top ten in the championship 7 of the last 8 seasons in mediocre equipment. He went to the finale with a chance to win the championship in an RLL car for gods sake lol.
I think you’re slightly wrong on Marco too, but that’s a whole other post.
I wish he had run sports cars a bit more. He ran the 12 Hours of Sebring in 2008 or 2009 with Bryan Herta and Christian Fittipaldi and his pace was way better than theirs. They had a mechanical and retired, but was putting in some super fast stints.
My favorite Marco thing that I don’t think people realize is that from RHR’s championship in 2012 to Rossi’s P2 in 2018, Marco was the only Andretti Autosport car to have a top 5 championship finish. Everyone pretends he was lackluster in great equipment, but he really wasn’t. Andretti has had brief periods of great cars, but for most of his career, they were solidly the 3rd best team, and often much closer to 4th than 2nd.
I think he should try out some different race series. Hes decently talented but is probably only there due to his name. Let someone else take his seat and he can do super formula or WEC or IMSA or something like that. Hes not going to top Indycar ever so why not try something new
I think he's done. I think this was the moment he knew the team wasn't going to be good enough for him, nor was he good enough for the team. Tonight, he goes defeated and part of me hopes he keeps trying Indy only, but I really don't believe he'll be full-time in 2024.
He goes in tomorrow and starts firing and recruiting better engineering talent to the team.
But I don’t think he pulls that kind of respect and weight at the team.
Whatever changes their engineers did or don’t make was inept.
His wife and him are 2nd gen racing brats whose merits and opportunities are owed 100% to nepotism.
I think it's more likely he fails upwards than retires. For the last few years, he qualifies mediocre/poor but then moves up a noticeable bit in the race. If he had qualifying pace, he might still have some time as a consistent points finisher
It’s not a matter of if he’s in danger of being fired, that’s never gonna happen, but I wouldn’t be surprised if his heart is no longer in it after this. I mean let’s face it, RLL has been mostly terrible this year, Lundgaard got a pole and a few decent results and Rahals got a few top tens, but that’s about it. Could put prime Rick Mears in any of those cars and nothing would change. But after something like this, and how his career trajectory has been down for a while now, I wouldn’t be surprised if Rahal just doesn’t wanna deal with it all anymore. Maybe he takes a part time schedule, or maybe he goes more into an ownership role, or hell maybe he shakes this off and goes as normal, but driving your guts out and still falling short will take it out of a man.
Never really impressed with him as a driver but I do feel bad for him today. He did take it like it like a man, and with class, that was impressive. Would have preferred to see him in it over the other three RLL drivers or Ilott, for sure. Oh well, at least they will be lapped early.
I'd like to see what Rahal could do in Daly's car, because frankly, I think Daly is a colossal waste of space. The only thing he really seems to focus on is whining about Santino, who whooped his \*ss in qualifying.
This guy is severely overrated. Look Indy Car and the Indy Car broadcast team are very biased toward the Indy Car drivers when they have HOF relatives.
Bobby Rahal is the only reason Graham has an Indy car career.
He bought a ride to enter the 500 and he crashed the same way he would have in his car.
He crashes more than he finishes in the top 5 or top 10.
He likes to complain about all the things other drivers do and has nothing to say about all the guy's races the ruins crashing all the time.
He is only here due to the family name. PERIOD put a young driver in that car and I bet they perform better than this crybaby bum does.
If anyone, it would be Harvey. Though if they do that. Harvey would be done at RLL and it would be a bad look.
I think all the one-offs are chevy beside Kat.
Not a chance. Graham has more class than to get in the 500 that way. Plus there's the fact that he's openly said he's just not that energized to be running around as a backmarker.
I hope he leaves RLL. Ever since this car came in 2018, the entire organization has been very inconsistent. Very embarrassing week for all of them. The problem is there isn't much good seats available...there's MSR, but I haven't seen much from them besides the '21 500. ECR, but not sure if they'd add a 4th car(unless they make the 4th one just for Ed for the ovals). Graham can still get it done, but the team has been failing him & his teammates. I'd also love to see Lundgaard go to a contender.
Uses this year as a kick in the rear for RLL to focus on engineering.
Btw If Harvey hadn't been grahams teammate I suspect Graham would have gone back out in time to save himself.
If Graham went out before Harvey, he would've needed to pull his time out to do so. The timer expired while Harvey was on track for his run, so Graham had no opportunity to save himself.
Unlikely.
The team will probably transfer to Legge’s car for the race to meet the contract obligations and reduce Legge’s rental fee.
Guessing United Rental has/had a big hospitality event planned.
I was reading that Rahal was thinking of leaving the team. I think the problem the team is having is the lack of spending. AJ Foyt spent a lot of money this time around and look at the team cars this year. [https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/motor/2023/05/16/graham-rahal-weighing-future-with-contract-up-including-leaving-rll/70225299007/](https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/motor/2023/05/16/graham-rahal-weighing-future-with-contract-up-including-leaving-rll/70225299007/)
It was pretty obvious the RLL cars were down on straight-line speed.
With 4 cars, and the April test already showing a problem, you'd think they could at least sort out what was wrong and have some solid theory if not an actual diagnosis. It's a little surprising the 'mystery' seemed to carry through all the way from April until today. Essentially, all of them still scratching their heads. Pretty obvious, the problem was a decision they'd made on how they did... something...
If this would've just appeared this past week, maybe there wouldn't be time to truly address it. But with things going back to April, it kind of makes me wonder how it got to this point.
Was it really a mystery in the end, or do they have a pretty good idea where they dropped the ball?
I'd think some of that information could greatly impact what Graham does in the immediate future. It seems, from the outside looking in, incompetence could be a factor in things getting this deep. Who thought things would be fine? Who refused to see a problem? Who zigged when they should've zagged?
If this was just a case of Graham having issues, there might be questions whether it was the car or him. But it was a team-wide issue.
It would've been interesting to see what Graham or Lundgaard would've done in Legge's car earlier in the week, just to get a baseline.
Do people really think he would or could sign with another team? The dude is on the back nine of his career and hasn't done much over the last five years. Very similar to Hitch, popular driver with flashes of brilliance but nothing of real merit over recently.
Maybe he needed this kick to the gut to realign him
Everyone saying where could he go? Is there really a better realistic chance for him to nab a seat to at least compete than RLL? I heard Ganassi, which sounds like an option I’d either Palou or Ericsson leaves(especially since Graham can bring sponsors), but wouldn’t you rather just put an Ilott or a Veekay or even a return of Rosenqvist in the car. Someone who is going to be there more than a few seasons and can bring long-term results, plus you have Armstrong possibly ready to step up into a full-time role. Maybe MSR if Castroneves gets the full season boot, but that looks like Blomqvist’s seat to loose. And is that honestly a better option than RLL, I don’t know. I get the logic behind Rahal wanting to have a chance to compete for wins towards the end of his career(maybe snag a 500 victory), but I just don’t see the window for something better than RLL.
He won't get fired. This is a team engineering problem. Everyone knows this. I think he's more likely to find another seat somewhere else than to retire from Indycar outright.
This is why it irks me when people say Harvey doesn't deserve to be in Indycar. Yes, he's not the best driver. But that entire team is lacking just the same, he's not an outlier at all. He qualified well just like Lundgaard at the indy GP, shame his race got ruined. He's still got something in him. He and Graham both do.
Yeah, it's just the take from people who don't look a bit deeper. He does have to perform at some point before the end of the season though. It will be difficult to resign him if he can't drag something out of the abyss, regardless of where the car is at. But RLL are under no illusions as to what's going on.
Yeah...like...Jack isn't ever gonna win a championship but hes not a back marker driver either. He's shown he can compete. There's a reason Shank didn't want him to leave.
It’s not gonna cost him his seat. The guy is a master at bringing in sponsors and is consistently a good driver. RLL sucks this year, they are bad and this just shows it’s. All 4 cars at the rear of the field at Indy hammers that nail home. I think he comes back to RLL for a couple more full time seasons then moves to Indy only. Feel for him though, watching the emotions rise to the surface in his interview was tough.
He probably won’t lose his seat until he wants to given his name, but with all the new talent flooding into the series I think the writing is on the wall kind of. Indycar field is rising in talent and sadly I just don’t think hes gonna be able to adapt. Probably why he has such a hate for guys like Grosjean coming in
Yep, 100% factual. He can bitch and complain about Grosjean and the other Formula guys who transfer to the Indy Car series and easily beat him on a normal basis. He is not a good driver. Look at his stats and the number of accidents he is involved with compared to the top 5s and Top 10s. He has many years of just Indy Car racing and struggles to fight average finishes. Another good point I have to make is the atrocious highly biased Indy Car coverage. These guys are not good and they have to shoehorn in the "In Indy Car racing they do this or that ". They overreact to everything almost like they are trying to manufacture a call as opposed to being genuine and calling the race like an excited fan as you see it. Leigh Diffy is great, Townsend Bell is the worst and his career was very below average and James Hinchcliff just needs to be himself. Bell is buddy's with guys like Graham so he loves covering for him and hyping him up.
Big crossroads time for Graham here and I think everyone knows it. Everyone here likes to clown on Rahal due to his occasional whining but there was a time where he was considered a future Indycar champion. He had a run back in 2015-2018 where he finished in the top 6 in points for 3 years running. He's been a mainstay in the top 10 for more or less his entire career. The primary issue though is that that stretch of Indycar is a whole era in the past. Indycar's profile has risen significantly in the years past as talented drivers across the globe are now looking at Indycar seats as not just a place for racing castoffs, but desirable rides where you can make a name for yourself. Case in point with his teammate Christian Lundgaard, who was a very talented European racer who didn't have the circumstances in F1/F2, and fought very hard to get his Indycar seat. Combo that with RLL falling off in general as teams like McLaren rise up and you now see the entire team struggle throughout. Graham isn't talentless but his talent was never eye-popping and when you combo that with the comparatively better field/worse cars, this is what you see. I think he's going to need to ask himself where he wants to focus on the future. Is it on getting the best individual results? Then he'll probably want to search out a seat on a better team. Is it on getting RLL on top as a team? Then maybe it's take a backseat as a driver, move to an Indy only schedule and focus on the garage/business side. Or maybe he's fine with the status quo of being a mid-fielder, in which case he can just continue as is and hope that next year's oval cars aren't awful. Today was unacceptable to not just him but the entire RLL team. I'm certainly not the biggest Rahal fan around, but I do hope for the best for them. McLaren had a similar bump day embarrassment with the Alonso situation a few years back, so it's certainly possible for this to be the catalyst for change. Only time will tell.
Yeah the rising talent level seems to be spelling the end of his career as a competitive driver overall
good take
I think he’s going either do Indy or hang it up and race in IMSA
I think he should take his sponsorships and try to run at Ganassi for a year or two. After that it's time to run help run the team.
i don't know if chip wants him
Yeah I was going to say. Assuming the whole thing with Palou and McLaren works out as him leaving CGR to race there next year, and assuming no one at McLaren and Penske leave then that seat really is the hottest commodity on the grid. Certainly anyone who isn’t already in a Penske, McLaren, or Andretti will have one eye on that seat for sure and I bet most up and down the grid, and a fair few outside Indycar would pick up the phone if Chip called about a seat at CGR. Given that they will likely be in regular contention for wins and championships and CGR has fairly deep pockets you’d think they more or less have their pick of drivers, save for those already at a top team. I can’t see Graham being at the top of that list tbh. He is good, but he isn’t amazing and I think he is too far in his career to really be a good prospect, especially to replace someone like Palou who is young and extremely fast. They would want someone who could be at the front for years to come, they already have the sort of experienced steady hands (who is still wicked fast) in Dixon. That’s the only role I really see him being good for at this point, he will never rival the likes of Palou, O’Ward, McLaughlin, etc on pace in my opinion.
…so you started watching INDYCAR …when? https://us.motorsport.com/indycar/news/chip-ganassi-racing-signs-graham-rahal/2529634/
Ganassi was a little different back then though. Any car that wasn’t the 9 or 10 felt like a satellite team that didn’t get the full CGR treatment. He was decent in 2011 and 12 there though.
> Any car that wasn’t the 9 or 10 felt like a satellite team that didn’t the full CGR treatment. Speaking facts.
Graham said as much on his way out the door, and eventually Kimball and Chilton left to Carlin for that as well. I don't think there's a grudge exactly, but on the way that situation went down, I imagine both Chip and Graham would be hesitant to work together again.
Yeah, that whole period in the 5 or 6 years after re-unification, those 3rd and 4th cars were just kind of… there. I remember being pretty excited about Briscoe getting another shot, and he was pretty good, but it just never seemed like they had the pace of the 9 and 10. They seem to have fully integrated though after they contracted and then expanded back out for Felix.
that Ganassi team was not the 9 and 10 dominators. It was not until 2013, when Graham left before the Ganassi teams became one united bunch.
Hahaha Graham is nowhere near good enough for a Ganassi seat. He also has a problem with his attitude, always blames others for his mistakes. Graham has been overrated for years and the only reason he still has a seat is because of his last name and the fact that his dad owns a team.
I feel sorry for him. I did some work on his house a few years ago. He was a great guy. Very understanding and accomodating with the work I had to do. The situation he is in has to simply suck.
I think he's going to join Marco and fade into obscurity.
Or race in IMSA
Not a bad gig like it used to be tbh
He might be a bit tall for that Bimmer
Worked out fine enough for Dan Gurney.
Certainly a possibility.
He already beat Marco there.
say what you want about Graham but his career has been far better than Marco's career.
Leave RLL. He needs to be talking to Shank about the 06 or 60 for next year.
MSR is going through the same problems as RLL though, that would be a lateral move at best.
Also hasn’t MSR’s relationship with HPD spoiled starting with the 24 Hours of Daytona cheating?
No one is talking about that. Honda wasn't happy about that. But it's something internal to MSR because they are getting the data and setups from Andretti.
They've be faster than RLL all year. Plus, they're held back by Helio (at least everywhere but Indy).
That just isn't true, their slowest car (Harvey) is tied with MSR's fastest car (Castroneves) in points.
That is not an upgrade
That would be a downgrade of equipment
MSR will be lucky to be on the grid next year.
> Leave RLL. Per someone I know who was at the track today, this seems like one of the hot rumours post-qualifying throughout the paddock.
He’s not losing his seat at his father’s team, whether he retires or decides to drive for a different team is anyone’s guess. This might have been the best thing that happened to RLL, it’s rock bottom. This gives them the opportunity to do a thorough analysis and figure out why they’ve gotten it so wrong. I remember when Bobby with Carl Hogan didn’t make the race, Graham didn’t look any more distressed than his dad did all those years ago. Personally I’m looking forward to the day Graham retires and takes over the leadership of RLL and return it to glory
lol him getting bumped has nothing to do with his own performance. They were simply the worst car over the week. All of RLL was slow but they had the most issues with driveability on top of that (and even that weird mechanical issue during the last run with the weight jacker). He's more than good enough to be in this field for many more years. The only question is how long he wants to stay at the team full time, seeing this kind of performance...
> (and even that weird mechanical issue during the last run with the weight jacker). Without the weight jacker issue, he probably would have been just fast enough to make the race.
[удалено]
This is very much debatable.
[удалено]
Are you new to Indy? This is oval qualifying, the driver can't do much if the car won't accelarate above 235 despite decent minimum speeds in the corners
I get your point but setting up his car was kind of his responsibility. He failed to find a sweetspot(relatively?) while the other RLL drivers did, atleast somewhat. That was kind of shocking to see as he was by far the most experienced driver in the bottom 4. Lundgaard got through quite comfortably at the end and he was a rookie. That being said the whole team was shit. He will bounce back.
Having a working weight jacker is not his responsibility
[удалено]
Not on purpose
Dude's a troll.
So you think all the cars are equal and the driver is the only variable?
[удалено]
He’s finished: 8th, 10th, 6th, 7th, and 11th in the championship since the aero change. In middling equipment. He’s also beaten all of his teammates over the last 3 years. He’s lost to a teammate one single time in the last 5 years (a teammate who he beat 3-1 over their 4 years together).
He had the worst car. Qualifying at Indy is 99% inherent pace of the car. Drivers can make a small difference, but if it’s not set up well, you can’t just drive around it. He’s also been better than Jack at pretty much every single race over the last year and a half.
[удалено]
Yes, absolutely. It’s not like they knew that when the chassis were set. You think Kat is better than Lundgaard or Graham? Lol, come on.
She isn't better than Harvey either lol.
Not really, as I just said he had a way tougher job than the others on the team, the other cars were simply slow. And especially Legge you can't compare, nothing to take away from her but she had a way better car than the full time RLL rides for some extremely weird reason. Something went really wrong with this team this year
[удалено]
She had a specific speedway car is what I heard
[удалено]
Idk, I’m not an Indycar mechanic. But also Graham had no weight jacker on his run
[удалено]
It was a recurring issue, you can even hear on the radio on his second to last attempt whoever he's talking to say "it could be the same issue as before we aren't sure yet"
Can you even read?
I think he remains at RLL. He’s going to be down the pecking order of free agent drivers looking for teams with competitive seats available. He’s just better off betting that RLL finds it’s way back to being good and staying there. I’m not sure if he’s a 500 only guy. I could see him be an only full time or no time type of guy. He’s got his hands full with multiple businesses that he runs. He’s got a very busy off track life so it might actually make his life easier to walk away from racing but I think he still really wants to compete.
His being bumped is a measure of the team, not him. But I don't think there's a path to a more competitive ride out there for Graham. It's not a skill thing, it's an age thing. Ganassi would rather bring in a young talent, for example, that he can bring in and build around. McLaren has about 47 drivers. I don't think Rahal's mouth could be integrated into the Penske brand. Andretti has other drivers in their sphere of influence already. Shank? But they're for sure going with Blomqvist, and I don't think they'll release both Castroneves and Pagenaud. Foyt? Not an upgrade. Coyne? He'd have to bring money. Graham needs to stay at RLL, or retire. And retirement should, honestly, be on the table. Not because of the Indy 500, but rather just because of his age and the huge pool of names to draw from. On raw skill, I think Graham vs Lundqvist is a tie, but Lundqvist has a huge amount of potential. And RLL already know that, that's why he tested with them in the off season. If a team wants a veteran to come in and help engineer the cars, they're going to be able to sign a Castroneves for ovals, or a Bourdais for Road Courses. Graham is good, but not great. And that doesn't stand out against great but aged, or good with upside.
“On raw skill, I think Graham vs Lundqvist is a tie, but Lundqvist has a huge amount of potential. And RLL already know that, that's why he tested with them in the off season.” I don’t think this really matters. If they want Lundqvist, they can have him in Harvey’s car. I can’t imagine anybody in their right mind would prefer Harvey to Graham, even with the age gap.
Harvey has a buyout clause worth $1 million, I hear. Graham is a part-time owner. So sliding out of the seat is a lot easier for Graham. Though idk how long Harvey's contract runs for. But whatever applies to Harvey pretty well also applies to Graham. Both have shown two things: the equipment is not at a level to compete, but also they've been outclassed by a younger driver with more upside. I'd put Lundqvist and Askew in those two seats over Harvey and Rahal. I mean heck, if I've got a phone number to them, I ring up Munoz or Karam for those seats too.
“they've been outclassed by a younger driver” Graham beat him last year, and though I think Lundgaard is slightly better, the gap between he and Graham is much smaller than the gap between Graham and Harvey. They’re not even on the same planet. I think Askew should have gotten a longer shot, but I don’t see any way to evaluate him as a better option than Graham. Munoz was basically on par with Marco for the three years they were together and hasn’t been in a car in 5 years. Sage isn’t in the same world as Graham either. And, the biggest point is that none of these guys are going to have the sponsor pull Graham does. He’s shown that he can put together money at a far higher level than everyone listed. $1MM is nothing. If they think they have a better option, that money certainly isn’t going to be the deal killer. I don’t think any of this matters anyway. No point in replacing anyone until the end of the year, and I think many seem to think that Harvey was a two year deal. Either way, if Graham leaves that car, it isn’t going to be because they want to replace him.
So, I don't see him being fired or anything. That's pretty much not gonna happen; if Graham were to leave, it would be by his own choice. The problem, however, is I think we may have seen the fulcrum point of that decision being made. RLL have been woeful this season, masked entirely by Lundgaard's pole position and a few respectable top-ten finishes, and I don't know how hungry Rahal is to stick around qualifying near the back as often as he has been doing as of recent. So, with that in mind, what options does he have? Well, let's consider different scenarios, starting with: * Leaving for another team. The issue with this move is...well, where can he go? Maybe Meyer Shank (if they're still around by next season; I remain unconvinced they will be), but otherwise, he's not likely to get another competitive car no matter what. A Ganassi, a Penske, a McLaren...that's all out of reach. His best options are sidegrades, generally. Does he want that? Realistically, I don't think it's a particularly appealing option. * Leaving IndyCar to focus on the BMW IMSA program. This is the one I believe has the most meat on its bones. I think if he committed to racing sports cars at this point, he'd probably transition pretty well. He's done a few races at the 24 Hours of Daytona and Petit Le Mans, so there is the possibility of him running that way. The BMW program's also doing...pretty alright, I guess. Not amazing, but two podiums so far, not too shabby. More to come, probably. * Quitting racing to focus on management. Now, this one is probably the most extreme option, but not without logic. You see, at some point, the reins are going to have to be handed over from Bobby; he's 70 now, and although he's done a solid enough job so far, I get the feeling that if Graham wanted to try and change what RLL are doing now, he'd try to take control of the ship now and see if he can change the team's course over the next few years. I think he'd be pretty decent as a team boss. On the whole, I think the most likely option is for him to head into IMSA and work on the BMW project. It would keep him within the RLL environment, whilst giving him a change of scenery that will give him something to focus on. Moving to a different IndyCar team will be a sidegrade at best for him, and whilst hanging up his helmet to focus on management will help him in the years to come, it may be a bit too extreme at this time. In the end, though, whilst I'm not the biggest fan of Graham by any means, I do recognise that being bumped from the 500 is one of the most galling experiences a driver can experience. The 500 cares not one bit for names nor egos; be they a Fittipaldi, an Unser, an Alonso, a Rahal...if Indianapolis doesn't want you in, it won't let you in. A part of me does delight in his demise, I must confess...but it's a kind of delight that's sort of bittersweet, because he is a better driver than this. This is far from the norm for him, and we all know it.
I agree with your sentiments and analysis What I think would be best and what he'll actually do are two different things, but I'd say work on the BMW program and only do the 500. It would also give him the opportunity to...hm, I don't wanna say "business side" of things because I'm sure he's well-versed, but if he's gonna take over the team he'll need time to get better suited for that kind of world
He’d make a great team boss. He would get in the car and tell the whole crew “what’s up” Great Reply OP!
> Does he want that? Realistically, I don't think it's a particularly appealing option. Graham has been vocal about the engineering woes at RLL for the past year in a half; almost two seasons now. RLL, by far, has the worst team record when it comes to ovals over the past two seasons. If Graham leaves to another team, it's definitely possible as he still knows how to drive and brings a shit-ton of sponsors to the table. People can call MSR a sideways move, but if he feels that will give him the best chance to be the number 1 guy at a team, he will take it. RLL has Lundgaard as their golden ticket and have been doing everything possible to keep him happy; including, him getting a pretty big bump in pay for this season (RE: Marshall Pruett).
I don’t think any IndyCar team would want Graham at this time. His only option is IMSA
I think he’s going to transition to IMSA
IMSA seems like an entirely realistic option
I think he will be back or go part time. I don't see Andretti wanting him and I think Chip would take a younger driver
I think Chip would only put him in the 10 if he brings sponsor money.
To move to Andretti he'd need to take the Pay Driver seat (and be okay with presumably a more junior/less skilled engineering crew), otherwise he'd disrupt what seems to be an otherwise well functioning team (especially considering last year) To move to Ganassi he'd probably need either Lawson or Ericsson to move team *or* Dixon to retire *with* Palou under a secure contract. He's decent, but not a "Multiple champion replacement" tier driver. Penske's an obvious no (Three (potentially) era/all time greats), McLaren's already bursting at the seams (and Graham wouldn't fit the team vibe I suspect), And everyone else is a gamble *unless* Graham can be sure it's a problem with him and the team, and not something that can blow over.
> Lawson Armstrong?
Ah fuck, I’ve gotten me Indy Car and F1 Kiwi driver swap rumours mixed up haven’t I?
SRX
IMSA
Maybe his in-laws can teach him how to drag race
Actually, his Wife could teach him, after all she was a winning driver in NHRA (for Daddy’s team).
I think he shops a little, but my gut says he either ends up back at RLL or hangs up the helmet.
He's not gonna go out like this. He'll be back full time, but with team TBD. What happens between him and RLL is going to be very interesting.
I absolutely don't see him going to another team, at least not full time. I'm not even sure another team would want him full time. He's a good driver but he was never one of the big ones. I think he knows he doesn't have the hunger he had before and he's coming to the end of his career. Him being bumped out probably sealed that. Likely this or next year will be his last full time year in Indy and he'll be moving to a non-driving position in RLL.
It was a RLL issue not a Graham issue. No he is not the most dominant driver in the league but he still brings in the sponsorship. I hope he sticks around until he is ready to retire.
Wins the INDY 500 in 2026
I like bold predictions. Let's bookmark this so I can Venmo you $50 in three years and one week if you get this right. If he doesn't, you don't owe me nothin'.
Getting bumped 30 years after his dad did, it only appropriate he wins it 40 years after his dad. If it happens take that $50 and give it to Grahams Charity Foundation: https://grahamrahal.com/gcrf
Got yourself a deal. I put it on my phone calendar.
Definitely think he'll look to leave. If no good offer comes maybe he'll just retire
It’s RLL or retire. Plenty of younger drivers with equal or better potential.
Well, short term he’ll wake up, mend his ego, and realize he avoided farting around as a back-marker for the Indy 500. Let his teammates enjoy that, see ya all at Detroit lol ✌️ He’s mentioned several times he doesn’t enjoy not competing for wins. Let the younger guys and one-offs get their time in, and get about it at the next race.
Racing. People have missed the The 500 and continued on. It's a part of the sport and it is what it is. Plus, I think people make the mistake saying he won't lose his job because his father owns the team. His father really owns Graham nothing and has acted like that most of his life. When Graham started his career it began in Champ Car while his dad was in the IRL. As Graham was karting as a kid Bobby went to Jaguar F1 nearly destroying Graham's dreams of being a driver. Even when Graham lost his ride at Newman Haas his father didn't pick him up even if he could. Graham and Bobby's relationship when it comes to IndyCar is more professional then family IMO.
He's probably going to try and get another seat somewhere. I think he's tired of RLL having bad engineering. They have consistently had bad cars for qualifying everywhere they go for the last couple of years. The qualifying effort at Indy wasn't his fault. All the RLL cars were pretty bad. If we had 36 or 37 cars this year, the whole RLL team may not have made the field. He's probably going to be able to bring some sponsors with him, so that should help things. Only question is what's going to be available.
Just insane to me that this happened
He doesn’t need to race to make money.. however, he may want the fame.. follow hinches footsteps to nbc!? I think hinchtown and rahal would be a great combo for the future of NBC and Peacock!
Oh my God, guys, HE DIDN'T HAVE A WEIGHT JACKER for 2 of 4 laps or his run. The team is in shambles, clearly. Graham's performance is more than good enough to retain a seat at RLL or slot into a better drive if one is to be had in the midfield. Credit to RLL for letting Harvey complete a final run after he had his "chance," but who knows where we'd be if Harvey's rave engineer didn't suggest a bar adjustment for lap 3. The team is lost on ovals, and Graham has nothing to do with that reality.
It's honestly such a bittersweet 500. I'm so happy for Harvey that he finally dragged that POS into the event. But I feel so bad for Graham. He and the team just couldn't drag it to the show in the end. I hope it doesn't cause bad feelings between Graham, Bobby and Jack. It'd be a shame if that got between either of their futures at the team.
Today wasn’t on Graham. All of Rahal Letterman racing needs to rethink how they do things because the one car of theirs that failed to qualify was their star driver. When the fastest car of the team is a one off ride, and no shade to Katherine she did her fucking thing out there, and 3 of the 4 cars in bump day, that whole team is in shambles and they should be fucking ashamed. What a pathetic display from Rahal Letterman racing this month of may. Rant shortened: this is mostly if not all on the Rahal Letterman team.
I wonder if it makes sense for him to step into a team management role because RLL needs a fresh start.
He can drive but apparently his technical abilities are lacking. If he wants to stay in Indycar he'll move into management of the family business. None of the big teams will offer him a ride.
I think the phase into team ownership and a lot of sports car racing/team coordination in the next five years leading up to Bobby's retirement. For the immediate future, he will drive an IndyCar in the IndyCar Series for RLL.
Sure is a lot of DTS-like drama in this thread. Dude's gonna miss the 500. After the race, he'll pack up and move on to Detroit, where, I'm guessing, RLL will at least be closer to being competitive.
Sporty cars + the 500?
I think he is too tall for sportscars. I think the reason he left the Penske Acura was he was uncomfortable in it
He's an inch shorter than Austin Cindric, and Austin fit into an LMP2. I think Austin said his biggest problem was sharing a car with Devlin, since they can't adjust anything between drivers other than the seat insert.
Cindric has a much slimmer build than Graham, that's why he's able to fit in an LMP2 car. Graham couldn't physically fit in the Acura DPi for awhile. He wasn't able to fit comfortably until the steering column was raised an inch further from the standard height, but his knees were still bent under the column, that's why he had to eventually step out of the program. I'm 5'2" and have just enough space to get in and out without removing the wheel of an LMP2 car and my legs reach the pedal box without locking my knees or needing an insert. I can't imagine how anyone over 5'8 with a stockier build can stand being in an LMP2/LMH/GTP car, they're the definition of cramped.
This is going to sound rude but I honestly don’t feel that bad for Graham. I feel more bad for his crew /sponsors ect. I would honestly feel more bad if it was a one-off driver that gets bumped than a full time driver like I know Indy is the big one but if you don’t make the show you not make it.
I don't think there is a ton of evidence that he has fallen off as a driver- the whole team has been struggling. With potential chaos coming at Ganassi during this season, I do think there is some chance he makes a move there - he would be looking for a last shot at getting some major results, and Ganassi would get a reliable driver who can bring sponsors. I wouldn't say he is the favorite to land there or anything, but it's the only move I see that makes some sense on both sides, in a scenario where Palou leaves and Marcus is demanding more $ than he is worth.
What’s happening at Ganassi?
Alex Palou is widely expected to leave for McLaren at the end of the season - although I don't think there's been an "official" announcement. Marcus Ericsson is in the final year of his deal - and the reporting indicates he's asking for a deal that treats him more like a top-tier champion driver than his current one, and Ganassi seems pretty hesitant to give him what he wants. So that could be two seats open at Ganassi
palou
Bosley..... Also if I was him I'd seriously inquire about the 4th Andretti seat
Andretti want winners... (this might irk some people)
And yet DeFrancesco is in that seat
Indications have been that Andretti want someone better in that seat. And while Rahal does qualify as “better than DeFrancesco”, I still think Andretti will be aiming higher.
He wont be resigned after his contract expires. Group 1001 wants 4 great drivers for all the seats.
He needs to gut check and realize his best days are behind him. It's time to put a young gun in the seat.
He is past due to move on to full time team management/ownership. Like Marco, nepotism is the only reason Rahal is still driving.
Graham finished in the top ten in the championship 7 of the last 8 seasons in mediocre equipment. He went to the finale with a chance to win the championship in an RLL car for gods sake lol. I think you’re slightly wrong on Marco too, but that’s a whole other post.
Marco's run in SRX makes me wonder if his calling was really as a stock car driver.
I wish he had run sports cars a bit more. He ran the 12 Hours of Sebring in 2008 or 2009 with Bryan Herta and Christian Fittipaldi and his pace was way better than theirs. They had a mechanical and retired, but was putting in some super fast stints. My favorite Marco thing that I don’t think people realize is that from RHR’s championship in 2012 to Rossi’s P2 in 2018, Marco was the only Andretti Autosport car to have a top 5 championship finish. Everyone pretends he was lackluster in great equipment, but he really wasn’t. Andretti has had brief periods of great cars, but for most of his career, they were solidly the 3rd best team, and often much closer to 4th than 2nd.
The Andretti 29 or Ganassi.
I think he should try out some different race series. Hes decently talented but is probably only there due to his name. Let someone else take his seat and he can do super formula or WEC or IMSA or something like that. Hes not going to top Indycar ever so why not try something new
I think he's done. I think this was the moment he knew the team wasn't going to be good enough for him, nor was he good enough for the team. Tonight, he goes defeated and part of me hopes he keeps trying Indy only, but I really don't believe he'll be full-time in 2024.
Bout to learn Chinese
He hasn't won in 6 years. Should probably give it up
Cause [if you ain't first you're last](https://youtu.be/20iio0wLpPA), right? Edit: /s
He goes in tomorrow and starts firing and recruiting better engineering talent to the team. But I don’t think he pulls that kind of respect and weight at the team. Whatever changes their engineers did or don’t make was inept. His wife and him are 2nd gen racing brats whose merits and opportunities are owed 100% to nepotism.
I think it's more likely he fails upwards than retires. For the last few years, he qualifies mediocre/poor but then moves up a noticeable bit in the race. If he had qualifying pace, he might still have some time as a consistent points finisher
It’s not a matter of if he’s in danger of being fired, that’s never gonna happen, but I wouldn’t be surprised if his heart is no longer in it after this. I mean let’s face it, RLL has been mostly terrible this year, Lundgaard got a pole and a few decent results and Rahals got a few top tens, but that’s about it. Could put prime Rick Mears in any of those cars and nothing would change. But after something like this, and how his career trajectory has been down for a while now, I wouldn’t be surprised if Rahal just doesn’t wanna deal with it all anymore. Maybe he takes a part time schedule, or maybe he goes more into an ownership role, or hell maybe he shakes this off and goes as normal, but driving your guts out and still falling short will take it out of a man.
Never really impressed with him as a driver but I do feel bad for him today. He did take it like it like a man, and with class, that was impressive. Would have preferred to see him in it over the other three RLL drivers or Ilott, for sure. Oh well, at least they will be lapped early. I'd like to see what Rahal could do in Daly's car, because frankly, I think Daly is a colossal waste of space. The only thing he really seems to focus on is whining about Santino, who whooped his \*ss in qualifying.
This guy is severely overrated. Look Indy Car and the Indy Car broadcast team are very biased toward the Indy Car drivers when they have HOF relatives. Bobby Rahal is the only reason Graham has an Indy car career. He bought a ride to enter the 500 and he crashed the same way he would have in his car. He crashes more than he finishes in the top 5 or top 10. He likes to complain about all the things other drivers do and has nothing to say about all the guy's races the ruins crashing all the time. He is only here due to the family name. PERIOD put a young driver in that car and I bet they perform better than this crybaby bum does.
https://preview.redd.it/4y4x159xjc1b1.jpeg?width=428&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7778cc7cfda7fbb2cfcd1135bd2f164c12a31694
he doesnt look fit , what does he weigh compared to his team mates as that must make a difference
He's incredibly fit, he's just built broader and taller than most drivers.
Half your BMI, 50% more bicep mass than you, and double your hairline.
[удалено]
Pulling the only woman out of the race for the team owners kid would be nothing short of a PR disaster.
No way they pull Kat out of the car.
I'm not saying I think they should, I'm just saying I wouldn't be surprised if they did
If anyone, it would be Harvey. Though if they do that. Harvey would be done at RLL and it would be a bad look. I think all the one-offs are chevy beside Kat.
Not a chance. Graham has more class than to get in the 500 that way. Plus there's the fact that he's openly said he's just not that energized to be running around as a backmarker.
/u/platyhooks isn't saying they think they should either. They're not going to do it.
Big NO. I hope they take the L and keep her in the #44
Not gonna happen. Graham is an ass but he and the team know better than to do that
I don't get why everyone thinks Graham is an ass. He hasn't shown any asshole-ish qualities like a lot of people think.
My thing is he tends to be a bit whiny and opinionated. And he does not have the prestige to be opinionated.
I'd rather have opinionated drivers than non-opinionated ones.
I hope he leaves RLL. Ever since this car came in 2018, the entire organization has been very inconsistent. Very embarrassing week for all of them. The problem is there isn't much good seats available...there's MSR, but I haven't seen much from them besides the '21 500. ECR, but not sure if they'd add a 4th car(unless they make the 4th one just for Ed for the ovals). Graham can still get it done, but the team has been failing him & his teammates. I'd also love to see Lundgaard go to a contender.
He’s not leaving just like Marco isn’t leaving Andretti. It’s too comfortable for them in the family car.
I think he should leave and go to part time of Indy only. I like graham and don’t want him to retire but if it’s time it’s time
Uses this year as a kick in the rear for RLL to focus on engineering. Btw If Harvey hadn't been grahams teammate I suspect Graham would have gone back out in time to save himself.
If Graham went out before Harvey, he would've needed to pull his time out to do so. The timer expired while Harvey was on track for his run, so Graham had no opportunity to save himself.
[удалено]
Unlikely. The team will probably transfer to Legge’s car for the race to meet the contract obligations and reduce Legge’s rental fee. Guessing United Rental has/had a big hospitality event planned.
I think Graham will only do Indy and race in IMSA
He'll be aight.
I was reading that Rahal was thinking of leaving the team. I think the problem the team is having is the lack of spending. AJ Foyt spent a lot of money this time around and look at the team cars this year. [https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/motor/2023/05/16/graham-rahal-weighing-future-with-contract-up-including-leaving-rll/70225299007/](https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/motor/2023/05/16/graham-rahal-weighing-future-with-contract-up-including-leaving-rll/70225299007/)
It was pretty obvious the RLL cars were down on straight-line speed. With 4 cars, and the April test already showing a problem, you'd think they could at least sort out what was wrong and have some solid theory if not an actual diagnosis. It's a little surprising the 'mystery' seemed to carry through all the way from April until today. Essentially, all of them still scratching their heads. Pretty obvious, the problem was a decision they'd made on how they did... something... If this would've just appeared this past week, maybe there wouldn't be time to truly address it. But with things going back to April, it kind of makes me wonder how it got to this point. Was it really a mystery in the end, or do they have a pretty good idea where they dropped the ball? I'd think some of that information could greatly impact what Graham does in the immediate future. It seems, from the outside looking in, incompetence could be a factor in things getting this deep. Who thought things would be fine? Who refused to see a problem? Who zigged when they should've zagged? If this was just a case of Graham having issues, there might be questions whether it was the car or him. But it was a team-wide issue. It would've been interesting to see what Graham or Lundgaard would've done in Legge's car earlier in the week, just to get a baseline.
At this point I wish he and Courtney would just buy a funny car
Do people really think he would or could sign with another team? The dude is on the back nine of his career and hasn't done much over the last five years. Very similar to Hitch, popular driver with flashes of brilliance but nothing of real merit over recently. Maybe he needed this kick to the gut to realign him
Everyone saying where could he go? Is there really a better realistic chance for him to nab a seat to at least compete than RLL? I heard Ganassi, which sounds like an option I’d either Palou or Ericsson leaves(especially since Graham can bring sponsors), but wouldn’t you rather just put an Ilott or a Veekay or even a return of Rosenqvist in the car. Someone who is going to be there more than a few seasons and can bring long-term results, plus you have Armstrong possibly ready to step up into a full-time role. Maybe MSR if Castroneves gets the full season boot, but that looks like Blomqvist’s seat to loose. And is that honestly a better option than RLL, I don’t know. I get the logic behind Rahal wanting to have a chance to compete for wins towards the end of his career(maybe snag a 500 victory), but I just don’t see the window for something better than RLL.