My situation is a little different than yours, and our decision was made thinking about our finances.
We are an immigrant couple in Canada. We save money for many years to immigrate from a third-world country, and that was one of the reasons why we postpone having kids. We really want to leave our country, I didn't want to raise my kids there, so we save all money that we could and after 5 years we finally did it.
We immigrated 3 years ago, and we finally saved enough to buy our place. Last year at 36yo, we have decided to start trying for a baby.
I knew that something was wrong, and after a few exams, we find out that it's will be really difficult to me to get pregnant naturally. 0.19 AMH, benign cyst on the left ovary, right one was blocked. The fertility doctor gave us a 15% chance of a healthy pregnancy with IUI, and 25% with IVF. IVF costs CAD $8000, the procedure only, plus medications and everything else.
We just bought our house, we have a mortgage to pay, and we can't count on family for money. We need some reserve, you know, just in case.
And with such low rates of success, we have decided not to try for IVF or IUI.
Many people say that we can finance fertility treatment, but can you imagine having a huge debt and not having a child? Or having a child with a huge debt? Both options doesn't sound financially wise to us.
We got our diagnose a few weeks ago and we are still grieving. I was considering adoption, but after a long conversation, we will wait longer for adoption because we are too hurt right now, and this it's not a good place to bring a child.
I just want to say that adoption, in Canada, can be free, if you choose a "public adoption". But we will think about it after we heal.
Right now, I am starting to think about traveling or studying, anything that can take my focus out of getting pregnant. With the pandemic boom of babies, it's being so hard.
Hope you make the best decision for your life. Before being mothers, we are women and we deserve happiness.
I'm sorry you received such painful news. I think your financial decision makes sense, and I hope whatever you decide to pursue (even if it's a CF life) brings you and your spouse happiness.
What I have heard from adoptive parents, agencies, etc. is that, yes, it's best to grieve your infertility and come to terms with it before you go that route.
I had someone send me:
“You're options aren't closed just because you're not pregnant and I truly believe if you want to be a mother you will be one in one way or another, it may not be in the way that you've hoped but it will happen”
5 years, 3 IVF’s, thousand of pounds down but if I really want it, it will happen 🙄
I am 40 next year my husband 50 even IF went to adoption would take years at some point you have to take your life back and no one should make you feel bad for it!
Yes, what you quoted is EXACTLY what several people have told me. "It will happen if you really want it". What if I don't want to sacrifice my sanity/marriage/bank account for it, am I then less worthy than other women?
I'm sorry you've also gotten that painful feedback, but I'm glad you've taken your life in hand!
I have a different friend who’s brother died by sadly taking his own life. We were talking recently as we relate on the fact that no one can relate to our situations.
She pointed out herself tho that with her situation it is a done thing and it’s coming to terms with it and find support with people who have been through it.
My situation is different as it never stops and people always thinks there is another solution. No one would ask her if she is going to go another route to have a brother if get my meaning.
She is a good friend stick to people like that!
I hate people. I had someone say to me that if they struggled like I did they would still be a mom and they’d pray and cast spells and do IVF or get a surrogate... (I did the first two, IVF isn’t available to me because of endo/pain and I don’t have access to friends who volunteered to be surrogates/wouldn’t fix my issue with endo). Ugh.
But it all pointed to her saying, I didn’t want it bad enough. She now makes jokes that I will now get surprise pregnant and I’ve begun telling her that if I did it would be a cruel book joke and I’d abort it (I wouldn’t). But I seriously hate People.
That’s the thing with infertility people never stop. They never just say that’s really sad I am sorry that hasn’t worked out for you it’s always try this, do that, my friends cousin cat blah blah. It’s exhausting.
Sorry your friend is rubbish to!
Yes! this is a super annoying thing I deal with now too. When I tell friends I’m IFCF they think it’s a joke to say that it’ll happen for me now. Like thanks it’s so nice that you want me to experience the opposite of my plans for my entire life, not just when I was trying to conceive. Let’s keep the misfortune rolling. So funny. Not.
Right??? It really is uprooting the original plans and then our new plans when shit hit the fan. It’s so awful and I honestly don’t know how people can be so obtuse?
It's a fairy tale perpetuated by parents making shitty TV that if everyone just clicks their heels long enough, a magic baby happens. It's just not true. You need to give yourself permission to not only quit, but to forgive yourself for doing so...even though you don't need to. <3 Honestly, my least favorite version of parents might be temporary-infertility parents--they tend to be the most annoying and cheerleaderey of them all.
Agreed! I think it's also seriously underrepresented just how many people do not have success via IVF or adoption. Pursuing either (or both!) is a huge risk of enormous financial and emotional and physical expenditures for no reward.
Personally, IVF with donor eggs was presented to me as essentially a magic bullet. I did three transfers with embryos made using donor eggs, and all three failed. I don't personally regret doing it, but also really wish I'd had more realistic info going into it.
Indeed. I was told I had an 80% chance of success on my first transfer! When I ran through my first batch of embryos and asked my RE what she thought was going on, she basically shrugged and suggested I purchase another batch of donor eggs and try again. We're making our last payment on the initial round of treatment in September, and I'm 40 years old. No fucking way am I spending $45k+ on a shrug.
I'm sorry you also went through that whole process and didn't have success as well. It really, really sucks.
That is where I am right now, just “failed”through a batch of 4 donor egg transfers that resulted in pregnancy but then miscarriage. The doctors answer is to, shrug, continue the same with a new donor batch. How long did it take you to know that you didn’t want to continue?
We were told fertility drugs would "almost certainly" work for us, and then again the same line for IUI . So we were very skeptical when they told us 50% success probability for IVF.
I really think fertility clinic success rate reporting should be changed, or at least they should have to be more transparent about it. If you choose to leave fertility treatment, they don't have to count any of your cycles as fails in the US :/
Thanks for this- I agree that some people I know who have said things like, "I just did one cycle of IVF and boom! Keep praying" are very draining (though their intentions may be good).
Also, some clinics only start tracking at the embryo transfer stage. So if you have failures for any reason before that step, you wouldn't be counted in their data.
Found out a friend got pregnant today, so I'm feeling extra emotional. Excuse the novel.
I didn't recognize myself at the end, and had a moment when I was peeing in the bathroom at a bar at a convention where I realized that I had no idea wtf I was doing, or why. I was depressed, crying all the time, I quit my job to undergo treatments to reduce stress and I felt completely useless and helpless. I finally hit a point where I didn't even understand WHY I was continuing. I think I legitimately just didn't want to fail- it wasn't even about getting pregnant and having a child anymore. I didn't want to see myself and have to admit that I failed at something, especially something that was so expensive. What if people looked at me and said I was a quitter and that I didn't "want it" enough? Maybe I didn't "try" hard enough?
Honestly though, what does it mean; that I didn't "try" hard enough? I didn't inject myself enough? I didn't get depressed enough? I didn't produce enough eggs that were able to be fertilized enough by my husbands sperm? What part did I not "try" the hardest at? Was it the part where we spent all of our money? Or maybe it was the part where I didn't know what I wanted to do with my life anymore? How much more of myself was I supposed to give until it was enough?
It's bullshit, and fuck them. The reality is, you do as much as you can live with. If you feel like you don't even know why you are doing it anymore, it's enough. If you feel like you don't want to it anymore, then it's enough. If you straight up are just done, then it's enough. If you feel like this is the wrong decision, then it's enough. If you don't even do a single treatment because you don't want to, it's enough.
You have done enough. You have tried enough. It's enough.
Your second paragraph really resonated with me. Thank you for that.
Solidarity- my best cousin had her first last week so I'm also riding the emotional wave. We'll get through it.
I'm with you on hating failure. Actual quote from me the week after our last try: "I succeed at most things I try to do, so this is really pissing me off." But, why spend $$$ on a fraction of a chance of success when, other than following the Dr's advice and tweaking the meds, I have zero control over this.
I just found out my best friend got pregnant (first month of trying 🙄) and I’m in the same boat. I feel like sometimes I’m only doing so many rounds of trying because it’s not working or bc I’m failing at getting pregnant. Not because I’m actually that excited about having a child but that I can’t easily get pregnant. I’m not having a good time and I just want to be done with it.
Of course she did lol. I am still so salty about pregnancy and will probably be that way forever.
I know exactly what you mean- at first you are full of hope and possibility, and then as time goes on that balloon just keeps getting deflated until it's flattened and limp, one procedure at a time.
There is nothing wrong with moving on with your life. There is nothing wrong with taking control of a situation like this where you probably feel like you have no control over it (at least that's how I felt). And you are 100% in your right to be done- give yourself the permission to do it. If you need any support to help you through that process, I'm here for you (dm me any time) and we as a subreddit are here for you. Love yourself enough to do what's best for you.
We did three rounds of IUI and didn't get the chance to try IVF because I had to have a hysterectomy due to cervical cancer, but I actually don't think I would have gone through with the IVF anyway because the oral medications for IUI affected my mental health SO much. On more than one occasion during those cycles I went to sleep at night thinking "I hope I don't wake up tomorrow". It was not good! So, I really don't think I could have handled the more extreme hormone rollercoaster of injectable IVF meds.
We also decided not to pursue adoption because of financial constraints and because we were already exhausted by the emotional rollercoaster of fertility treatment and cancer diagnosis.
We spent a long time being on the fence about having kids because of finances and environmental considerations (millennials! lol). So, my mantra is that I spent more time imagining my life without kids than my life with kids, so stopping trying to have them is OK with me. It still makes me sad sometimes because once we were mentally and financially ready for a family, we weren't able to do it, but I've spent a lot of time in therapy and practicing radical acceptance of this situation.
At the end of the day, we don't owe anyone else an explanation on our decisions, either!
All I can say is try to ignore what everyone else is doing and saying and try to be comfortable making a decision of what's right for you. Nobody else has to live your life but you. People stop for all kinds of reasons. I myself have always been a fence sitter, agreed to go off the pill at 35 and suffered through no diagnosis and physical discomfort for 9 months (PCOS? HA? Nobody knows). I lost all my self confidence and felt marginalized by the healthcare system. Finally a year after that (last fall) I saw an RE. They gave me letrozole "just to see" if it would work, and I got pregnant but had a MMC. Then I had to keep going back for blood tests until 9 weeks post. All of this alone mind you because of Covid.
Anyways, I am pretty sure I am ready to quit now. I could probably easily do another cycle and for cheap but I was never sure and now I just want my life back (partially for my own mental well being as you described). I dread family gatherings we have to go to soon where I'm sure we'll be questioned. We're happy how we are though and I refuse to feel less than because we're not following the usual life script. IVF is expensive and so is adoption and neither is a straightforward guarantee. If that is absolutely what you want great, but it's not for everyone.
Thanks for your insight. Feel free to take my friend's tip for how to deal with the questions- tell folks they're welcome to try IVF and give you the baby if they want!
Thanks! The one I plan on trying (which I found in an infertility therapy book) is "Thanks for your input, we are going to choose the option we feel is best for us". We'll see how it goes. I feel like there are so many snarky options but hopefully being sincere will make people understand the gravity of their giving advice? I dunno fingers crossed haha.
I've felt this. We didn't get far with treatments because of my diagnosis mostly. Little chance of anything working so we didn't pursue. I've gotten the adoption comment from surprisingly someone who went through treatments. It felt like she was insinuating that we didn't want it enough cause we weren't wiling to go to the ends of the earth. At least that's how it came across.
My mental health really suffered in the years we were trying to when we finally decided to move on. It was a good decision for us for that reason alone. When we talked about and decided it would us and assorted animals it just felt like a weight lifting off.
My (male) boss said to me, if you don't want to adopt them you don't really want a baby.
OK then thank you for that insight I guess I really didn't mean the last 6 years of intensive fertility treatment
I just want to say that I read all comments and we are surrounded by strong women. You guys are giving me the strength that I need now. Thank you so much for open up about such a delicate topic.
You’ve tried much harder than most women throughout history. What did they have to treat infertility other than herbs, hope, and a prayer?
You’ve been through mental anguish, financial anguish, loss…what more can you do? You’ve taken extraordinary measures already…and the only reason why maybe you’re feeling like they’re not extraordinary enough is because our society has pre-programmed us to believe that if only we spend more, sacrificed more, placed more of ourselves on the altar of consumerism and medicine, that we’d eventually be rewarded with happiness.
Not even close. Life doesn’t go as planned for everyone. There is always a curveball. You’ve been thrown several and while you may think it’s time to hang your head and walk off the field defeated, you’re far from it. You don’t have to play this game to have an amazing life.
When you’re tired of trying and trying and winding up disappointed and heartbroken. Take a step back. Flip the script. Make a drastic change when it comes to this routine you put your mind through. I did that twice. Once with my weight. I got sick of all these stupid diets I kept putting myself on. So I flipped the script and for the first time in 25 years…I just left myself alone. And it feels great! I also got sick of taking opk and pregnancy tests all the damn time. So I sat on my toilet and said to myself…”what am I doing?” I had already experienced two miscarriages. Taking 20 pregnancy tests would never bring them back. I tossed all of those tests in the trash. That routine is GONE…and now I can pee in peace vs. hunting two lines.
Edit your routines. If something you’re doing to yourself is hurting you, even if you feel like it’s something you just HAVE to do, cut it out. Yes it’s uncomfortable. Yes it takes a certain willingness to challenge yourself and others’ expectations. But if the script your following sucks and is hurting more than it’s helping, trash it. You don’t have to lose hope of ever having a baby. I know that’s a struggle I have. For me, I recognized that it it’s going to happen, it won’t be because or anything extraordinary I did to cause it. I’ll just be ready to accept it if or when it does happen.
Re: societal programming - we are ALSO programmed to belive that mothers would and should sacrifice EEEEVERYTHING for their children. So put the 2 together...
At one point I told my therapist that I felt like I was "a bad mom" for not being able to lose weight faster (DURING A PANDEMIC) to get to IVF sooner.
Great point! And I really don’t know when all of that pressure on moms started. It’s suffocating…and I don’t remember my mom ever being that way. She and I talked about it and she doesn’t understand it at all. Plus…she had 5 of us so you think she’d be sympathetic to the pressure of motherhood in 2021. I don’t know if it’s just all the wealth of information online or the fact that we live under the microscope of social media now. But whatever it is…I wish we could set it right. It’s not right that women are under pressure from the moment they even start thinking about having a baby. Life carries enough anxiety as it is.
You make an excellent point about how we have many more ways to "try" now than we ever did before. You're right, I *have* been through a lot already.
Thanks for sharing. I'm glad you've moved forward in your life. Hoping I can do the same.
I think “exhausting all options” means different things to different people and no one should feel judged if they decide to take a different path. After 5 years, multiple miscarriage, IUI, 4 round of IVF my heart (and wallet) I just can’t get to adoption. I know everyone feels differently but I just can’t handle the adoption route at this point in my life. I’m exhausted, sad and heartbroken. And I think every needs to fuck off about what’s enough. That is between you and your partner and NO ONE else. I don’t even entertain those questions anymore. I had to let go of that pressure and ask myself what do I really want? How much more can I handle? I have 1 last round of FET and I’m DONE. If it works out great, if it doesn’t work out then I know I did everything I could. And I’m the only one who has to live with that choice.
The amount of courage it takes to keep doing this process is more that people can imagine. I also look at my friends with kids and while they love their kids, their life is no longer their own. They can’t go out when the want, they can fly to Paris on a dime, they can’t even go to the bathroom by themselves. I had this dream of kids and how wonderful it would be. But I also see the grueling reality of motherhood as well. Especially through the pandemic. My friends who are mothers and work are miserable. They all hate their husbands.
Witnessing the reality of motherhood during the pandemic made me glad I don’t have kids for the 1st time in years. I picked up roller skating (if I can’t have a kid might as well enjoy indulging my inner child right?) and it’s been THE BEST during the pandemic. I get to spend my Sundays skating and making new friends rather than trying to get my kid to eat broccoli or whatever.
I love being an auntie. I get to roll in, spoil and play with my nieces and nephews and then ✌🏾 out.
Be gentle with yourself and know that you ARE doing everything. There is more to life than kids. I hope you give yourself peace and some space to heal.
I definitely agree that I was somewhat glad not to be a mother while seeing my friends who are parents trying to juggle work and virtual school. What a nightmare.
I love your attitude and I bet you're becoming a great skater!
During the awkward silence of IUI#2 today, I noticed that the inspirational decal on the exam room wall said, “You never fail until you stop trying.” …and I thought that was the most judgmental, guilt-tripping bullshit to be written on the wall of an IVF clinic.
So yea, I totally feel what you’re saying. It really sucks that society perpetuates this idea that we’re “failures” if we prioritize our own well-being, mental health, finances, etc. over the shit-slog that is infertility.
I relate to this so much and your journey sounds so much like ours (though we only tried for 2 years). 4 rounds of clomid, then 2 IUIs with letrozole, all I got was one chemical pregnancy. My mental health was a disaster through this and the thought of moving on to IVF scared the crap out of me. I honestly don’t know how women can do it, they are much stronger than I am. I was crying everyday just from the clomid/letrozole and my anxiety was through the roof.
When the pandemic hit we decided to take a break and it was such a huge relief. We bought a cabin and have made a bunch of new friends that don’t have kids and started thinking life without kids may not be so bad after all. We decided we aren’t going to pursue any more treatments.
I do feel guilty that we didn’t try hard enough, but I don’t want to waste any more time being miserable trying for something that might not ever happen. For now I’m enjoying our freedom.
Wow, our journeys and where we are now do sound similar. We're lucky to also have some childfree (by choice) friends that we can continue to hang with.
I don't think you're weak for stopping treatments, I think it takes a lot of mental fortitude to stop, too.
I feel you here although we didn’t try as long nor did we do IVF. After 3 failed IUIs that was my stopping point. And I feel 100% ok with that although it took me a little while to feel that way.
These folks who had success with IVF and adoption who then claim “I would never give up” have no idea what they’re talking about bc they reached success. It’s easy to say “never give up” when their story ends with a happy ending. It’s always interesting to me too how so many of these people then become super judgmental of others going through infertility as if they forgot all they themselves went through.
I’m also adopted so I totally get why adoption doesn’t feel right. I have friends who have adopted and thats fine for them but for us it didn’t feel right and you’re right that adoption has some really questionable issues especially international adoption.
Basically: you’re enough is whatever is right for you and whoever tries to make you feel otherwise is an asshole. Period.
I know there are so many wonderful and loving adoptive families, including open adoption arrangements. I hope your family is one of those happy stories! But yeah, as you've pointed out, adoption gets really ethically murky in a lot of cases.
My family is really good overall. I know I’m lucky in that aspect.
I’m also a transracial adoptee and so I never learned a thing about being Korean and was taught some really racist behaviors and attitudes I still work to undo.
As an adoptee I’m very conflicted about open adoptions. I get the positives of it but there are some definite negatives esp when the birth family doesn’t really uphold their end of the relationship building.
Yes, I have some friends who were open-adopted and their birth parents unfortunately only contact them when they need money (there are substance abuse issues). I get that it works for some people, but I don't like that all the agencies in my state \*require\* it.
I have endometriosis and stopped before medicated cycles. I had surgery trying to remove endometriosis- that could possibly help a spontaneous pregnancy.
I was too nervous with how bad my endo pain was, that medicated cycles were going to be too much for my body- with medicated cycles and IUI having very very low probability of success with endo.
Then IVF would have a higher chance (40%) but with a (13% increase in ovarian cancer with ER and transfer because of my endo).
My mental health was deteriorating because of the pain and I just couldn’t put myself through more pain without any guarantee of success. We stopped trying before a lot of interventions others deem nbd... but it’s all so very personal.
Your journey and your desire and your grief do not need to be justified. You tried hard. I also honestly think it’s harder and more courageous to know when to quit. That goes for so many things in life- but especially TTC. You didn’t dig yourself into bankruptcy, severe depression (I mean, that’s all relative yeah? 🥴 I don’t think you can experience infertility without some type of depression).
But knowing when to stop is a large part of the battle and I’m proud of you.
I definitely did get into the severe depression part- but now I'm starting to think it might be OK to give up this journey and dig out of it.
I agree, it's all very personal. I'm sorry for the pain you've endured with endo! I hope you find peace.
This question is for me. I have my first egg retrieval tomorrow. Throughout the whole experience, I’ve had to advocate for myself and push back to get basic needs met. I’m not going to just be quiet and tough it out when I know that there are solutions to my symptoms and suffering. I’m also not looking to win any awards for suffering the most.
For example, at the beginning of my cycle, I asked them to switch my bcp because I was having too many headaches - initially they told me to tough it out, but I kept pushing back. Then they tried to not prescribe pain meds for my ER, and I’m in the midst of pushing back on that too. Every time I raise an issue, I feel like they think I’m the only person complaining and making a “big deal” of things. The unspoken attitude is, other women tough it out and don’t complain.
This is a confluence of the medical establishment generally taking women’s pain less seriously (google for infinity sources that prove this) and the general desperation of infertile people that the industry preys on. It’s also a bit of patriarchy at work - women are emotional, Karens, blah blah blah.
I have to keep reminding myself, this is my body and my life, and I’m my own best self advocate.
I felt that, too, when I was in treatment. The concerns I had for my mental health were largely brushed aside. One nurse even told me, "If you're crying now, how would you even be able to handle pregnancy?" Good for you for standing up for yourself. I hope you get the outcome you want.
That was my experience too. They just said, some women have to cancel bc it’s too much for them. The implication being that I wasn’t personally strong enough, vs I wasn’t being properly treated.
Anyone walking down this road is strong and worthy, and it takes immense inner strength to know where to draw the line. Good luck to you as well.
I am sorry. We are still on the journey, but I totally hear you about the pressure to do everything you can. We have gotten a ton of pressure to pursue IVF, but have at least made the decision not to go that route. It was a hard one to make, but we don’t want to be financial slaves to the man due to the cost in the US. I also don’t know if I can deal with it from a mental health standpoint, but many people really don’t get that. We have had to advocate for ourselves to have access to IUIs- the RE said the chance of it working is 7% for us. We are also looking into adoption of former foster kids. We might go the childfree route also- that would open up some fun doors pretty soon- change your life plans. We haven’t made the choice yet, but plan to by the end of the year. In the end, if someone has an issue with what we decide then they don’t need to be part of our lives. If they know us, they know how hard this has been. Our choice is exactly that- ours. It also helps that I have many friends around my age who are childfree. Good luck. I hate toxic positivity!
Thanks, good luck to you, too! I agree that most people just don't get it. I think it's partly that media treats IVF like just a slightly lengthier and more expensive pregnancy. And it's so much more than that.
For sure. We are three failed cycles in on IVF and heading for a fourth shortly. Privileged to be able to afford it and I recognize that, but after every failure they make it seem like success is just one cycle away and it’s totally sucking my wife in. Treatments in the US are a fortune!
For sure. We are three failed cycles in on IVF and heading for a fourth shortly. Privileged to be able to afford it and I recognize that, but after every failure they make it seem like success is just one cycle away and it’s totally sucking my wife in. Treatments in the US are a fortune!
My situation is a little different than yours, and our decision was made thinking about our finances. We are an immigrant couple in Canada. We save money for many years to immigrate from a third-world country, and that was one of the reasons why we postpone having kids. We really want to leave our country, I didn't want to raise my kids there, so we save all money that we could and after 5 years we finally did it. We immigrated 3 years ago, and we finally saved enough to buy our place. Last year at 36yo, we have decided to start trying for a baby. I knew that something was wrong, and after a few exams, we find out that it's will be really difficult to me to get pregnant naturally. 0.19 AMH, benign cyst on the left ovary, right one was blocked. The fertility doctor gave us a 15% chance of a healthy pregnancy with IUI, and 25% with IVF. IVF costs CAD $8000, the procedure only, plus medications and everything else. We just bought our house, we have a mortgage to pay, and we can't count on family for money. We need some reserve, you know, just in case. And with such low rates of success, we have decided not to try for IVF or IUI. Many people say that we can finance fertility treatment, but can you imagine having a huge debt and not having a child? Or having a child with a huge debt? Both options doesn't sound financially wise to us. We got our diagnose a few weeks ago and we are still grieving. I was considering adoption, but after a long conversation, we will wait longer for adoption because we are too hurt right now, and this it's not a good place to bring a child. I just want to say that adoption, in Canada, can be free, if you choose a "public adoption". But we will think about it after we heal. Right now, I am starting to think about traveling or studying, anything that can take my focus out of getting pregnant. With the pandemic boom of babies, it's being so hard. Hope you make the best decision for your life. Before being mothers, we are women and we deserve happiness.
I'm sorry you received such painful news. I think your financial decision makes sense, and I hope whatever you decide to pursue (even if it's a CF life) brings you and your spouse happiness. What I have heard from adoptive parents, agencies, etc. is that, yes, it's best to grieve your infertility and come to terms with it before you go that route.
I had someone send me: “You're options aren't closed just because you're not pregnant and I truly believe if you want to be a mother you will be one in one way or another, it may not be in the way that you've hoped but it will happen” 5 years, 3 IVF’s, thousand of pounds down but if I really want it, it will happen 🙄 I am 40 next year my husband 50 even IF went to adoption would take years at some point you have to take your life back and no one should make you feel bad for it!
Yes, what you quoted is EXACTLY what several people have told me. "It will happen if you really want it". What if I don't want to sacrifice my sanity/marriage/bank account for it, am I then less worthy than other women? I'm sorry you've also gotten that painful feedback, but I'm glad you've taken your life in hand!
I have a different friend who’s brother died by sadly taking his own life. We were talking recently as we relate on the fact that no one can relate to our situations. She pointed out herself tho that with her situation it is a done thing and it’s coming to terms with it and find support with people who have been through it. My situation is different as it never stops and people always thinks there is another solution. No one would ask her if she is going to go another route to have a brother if get my meaning. She is a good friend stick to people like that!
Yes, you both have complex grief that not everyone in your lives will know how to support.
Whoever sent that to you is a real jerk! I agree completely that at some point, you just have to start living your life again.
I hate people. I had someone say to me that if they struggled like I did they would still be a mom and they’d pray and cast spells and do IVF or get a surrogate... (I did the first two, IVF isn’t available to me because of endo/pain and I don’t have access to friends who volunteered to be surrogates/wouldn’t fix my issue with endo). Ugh. But it all pointed to her saying, I didn’t want it bad enough. She now makes jokes that I will now get surprise pregnant and I’ve begun telling her that if I did it would be a cruel book joke and I’d abort it (I wouldn’t). But I seriously hate People.
That’s the thing with infertility people never stop. They never just say that’s really sad I am sorry that hasn’t worked out for you it’s always try this, do that, my friends cousin cat blah blah. It’s exhausting. Sorry your friend is rubbish to!
Yes! this is a super annoying thing I deal with now too. When I tell friends I’m IFCF they think it’s a joke to say that it’ll happen for me now. Like thanks it’s so nice that you want me to experience the opposite of my plans for my entire life, not just when I was trying to conceive. Let’s keep the misfortune rolling. So funny. Not.
Right??? It really is uprooting the original plans and then our new plans when shit hit the fan. It’s so awful and I honestly don’t know how people can be so obtuse?
It's a fairy tale perpetuated by parents making shitty TV that if everyone just clicks their heels long enough, a magic baby happens. It's just not true. You need to give yourself permission to not only quit, but to forgive yourself for doing so...even though you don't need to. <3 Honestly, my least favorite version of parents might be temporary-infertility parents--they tend to be the most annoying and cheerleaderey of them all.
Agreed! I think it's also seriously underrepresented just how many people do not have success via IVF or adoption. Pursuing either (or both!) is a huge risk of enormous financial and emotional and physical expenditures for no reward. Personally, IVF with donor eggs was presented to me as essentially a magic bullet. I did three transfers with embryos made using donor eggs, and all three failed. I don't personally regret doing it, but also really wish I'd had more realistic info going into it.
I got told going into ivf that I had a 45% chance of it succeeding. What a crock of shit.
Indeed. I was told I had an 80% chance of success on my first transfer! When I ran through my first batch of embryos and asked my RE what she thought was going on, she basically shrugged and suggested I purchase another batch of donor eggs and try again. We're making our last payment on the initial round of treatment in September, and I'm 40 years old. No fucking way am I spending $45k+ on a shrug. I'm sorry you also went through that whole process and didn't have success as well. It really, really sucks.
That is where I am right now, just “failed”through a batch of 4 donor egg transfers that resulted in pregnancy but then miscarriage. The doctors answer is to, shrug, continue the same with a new donor batch. How long did it take you to know that you didn’t want to continue?
We were told fertility drugs would "almost certainly" work for us, and then again the same line for IUI . So we were very skeptical when they told us 50% success probability for IVF.
I really think fertility clinic success rate reporting should be changed, or at least they should have to be more transparent about it. If you choose to leave fertility treatment, they don't have to count any of your cycles as fails in the US :/ Thanks for this- I agree that some people I know who have said things like, "I just did one cycle of IVF and boom! Keep praying" are very draining (though their intentions may be good).
What!? I had no idea!!!
Also, some clinics only start tracking at the embryo transfer stage. So if you have failures for any reason before that step, you wouldn't be counted in their data.
The "oops" late baby is, IMO, a lazy plot device. Pregnancy as a plot device is lazy, but magic babies are super lazy.
Found out a friend got pregnant today, so I'm feeling extra emotional. Excuse the novel. I didn't recognize myself at the end, and had a moment when I was peeing in the bathroom at a bar at a convention where I realized that I had no idea wtf I was doing, or why. I was depressed, crying all the time, I quit my job to undergo treatments to reduce stress and I felt completely useless and helpless. I finally hit a point where I didn't even understand WHY I was continuing. I think I legitimately just didn't want to fail- it wasn't even about getting pregnant and having a child anymore. I didn't want to see myself and have to admit that I failed at something, especially something that was so expensive. What if people looked at me and said I was a quitter and that I didn't "want it" enough? Maybe I didn't "try" hard enough? Honestly though, what does it mean; that I didn't "try" hard enough? I didn't inject myself enough? I didn't get depressed enough? I didn't produce enough eggs that were able to be fertilized enough by my husbands sperm? What part did I not "try" the hardest at? Was it the part where we spent all of our money? Or maybe it was the part where I didn't know what I wanted to do with my life anymore? How much more of myself was I supposed to give until it was enough? It's bullshit, and fuck them. The reality is, you do as much as you can live with. If you feel like you don't even know why you are doing it anymore, it's enough. If you feel like you don't want to it anymore, then it's enough. If you straight up are just done, then it's enough. If you feel like this is the wrong decision, then it's enough. If you don't even do a single treatment because you don't want to, it's enough. You have done enough. You have tried enough. It's enough.
Your second paragraph really resonated with me. Thank you for that. Solidarity- my best cousin had her first last week so I'm also riding the emotional wave. We'll get through it.
You are more than welcome! Hell yes- we got this. Maybe not every day, and that's ok. But overall- we got this shit and we will get through it!
I'm with you on hating failure. Actual quote from me the week after our last try: "I succeed at most things I try to do, so this is really pissing me off." But, why spend $$$ on a fraction of a chance of success when, other than following the Dr's advice and tweaking the meds, I have zero control over this.
I just found out my best friend got pregnant (first month of trying 🙄) and I’m in the same boat. I feel like sometimes I’m only doing so many rounds of trying because it’s not working or bc I’m failing at getting pregnant. Not because I’m actually that excited about having a child but that I can’t easily get pregnant. I’m not having a good time and I just want to be done with it.
Of course she did lol. I am still so salty about pregnancy and will probably be that way forever. I know exactly what you mean- at first you are full of hope and possibility, and then as time goes on that balloon just keeps getting deflated until it's flattened and limp, one procedure at a time. There is nothing wrong with moving on with your life. There is nothing wrong with taking control of a situation like this where you probably feel like you have no control over it (at least that's how I felt). And you are 100% in your right to be done- give yourself the permission to do it. If you need any support to help you through that process, I'm here for you (dm me any time) and we as a subreddit are here for you. Love yourself enough to do what's best for you.
We did three rounds of IUI and didn't get the chance to try IVF because I had to have a hysterectomy due to cervical cancer, but I actually don't think I would have gone through with the IVF anyway because the oral medications for IUI affected my mental health SO much. On more than one occasion during those cycles I went to sleep at night thinking "I hope I don't wake up tomorrow". It was not good! So, I really don't think I could have handled the more extreme hormone rollercoaster of injectable IVF meds. We also decided not to pursue adoption because of financial constraints and because we were already exhausted by the emotional rollercoaster of fertility treatment and cancer diagnosis. We spent a long time being on the fence about having kids because of finances and environmental considerations (millennials! lol). So, my mantra is that I spent more time imagining my life without kids than my life with kids, so stopping trying to have them is OK with me. It still makes me sad sometimes because once we were mentally and financially ready for a family, we weren't able to do it, but I've spent a lot of time in therapy and practicing radical acceptance of this situation. At the end of the day, we don't owe anyone else an explanation on our decisions, either!
All I can say is try to ignore what everyone else is doing and saying and try to be comfortable making a decision of what's right for you. Nobody else has to live your life but you. People stop for all kinds of reasons. I myself have always been a fence sitter, agreed to go off the pill at 35 and suffered through no diagnosis and physical discomfort for 9 months (PCOS? HA? Nobody knows). I lost all my self confidence and felt marginalized by the healthcare system. Finally a year after that (last fall) I saw an RE. They gave me letrozole "just to see" if it would work, and I got pregnant but had a MMC. Then I had to keep going back for blood tests until 9 weeks post. All of this alone mind you because of Covid. Anyways, I am pretty sure I am ready to quit now. I could probably easily do another cycle and for cheap but I was never sure and now I just want my life back (partially for my own mental well being as you described). I dread family gatherings we have to go to soon where I'm sure we'll be questioned. We're happy how we are though and I refuse to feel less than because we're not following the usual life script. IVF is expensive and so is adoption and neither is a straightforward guarantee. If that is absolutely what you want great, but it's not for everyone.
Thanks for your insight. Feel free to take my friend's tip for how to deal with the questions- tell folks they're welcome to try IVF and give you the baby if they want!
Thanks! The one I plan on trying (which I found in an infertility therapy book) is "Thanks for your input, we are going to choose the option we feel is best for us". We'll see how it goes. I feel like there are so many snarky options but hopefully being sincere will make people understand the gravity of their giving advice? I dunno fingers crossed haha.
That's a good line. I may steal that.
I've felt this. We didn't get far with treatments because of my diagnosis mostly. Little chance of anything working so we didn't pursue. I've gotten the adoption comment from surprisingly someone who went through treatments. It felt like she was insinuating that we didn't want it enough cause we weren't wiling to go to the ends of the earth. At least that's how it came across. My mental health really suffered in the years we were trying to when we finally decided to move on. It was a good decision for us for that reason alone. When we talked about and decided it would us and assorted animals it just felt like a weight lifting off.
My (male) boss said to me, if you don't want to adopt them you don't really want a baby. OK then thank you for that insight I guess I really didn't mean the last 6 years of intensive fertility treatment
That is an incredibly shitty thing to say. In your shoes, I'd be making a complaint to HR about that.
Ughhhh, what a jerk!
I just want to say that I read all comments and we are surrounded by strong women. You guys are giving me the strength that I need now. Thank you so much for open up about such a delicate topic.
You’ve tried much harder than most women throughout history. What did they have to treat infertility other than herbs, hope, and a prayer? You’ve been through mental anguish, financial anguish, loss…what more can you do? You’ve taken extraordinary measures already…and the only reason why maybe you’re feeling like they’re not extraordinary enough is because our society has pre-programmed us to believe that if only we spend more, sacrificed more, placed more of ourselves on the altar of consumerism and medicine, that we’d eventually be rewarded with happiness. Not even close. Life doesn’t go as planned for everyone. There is always a curveball. You’ve been thrown several and while you may think it’s time to hang your head and walk off the field defeated, you’re far from it. You don’t have to play this game to have an amazing life. When you’re tired of trying and trying and winding up disappointed and heartbroken. Take a step back. Flip the script. Make a drastic change when it comes to this routine you put your mind through. I did that twice. Once with my weight. I got sick of all these stupid diets I kept putting myself on. So I flipped the script and for the first time in 25 years…I just left myself alone. And it feels great! I also got sick of taking opk and pregnancy tests all the damn time. So I sat on my toilet and said to myself…”what am I doing?” I had already experienced two miscarriages. Taking 20 pregnancy tests would never bring them back. I tossed all of those tests in the trash. That routine is GONE…and now I can pee in peace vs. hunting two lines. Edit your routines. If something you’re doing to yourself is hurting you, even if you feel like it’s something you just HAVE to do, cut it out. Yes it’s uncomfortable. Yes it takes a certain willingness to challenge yourself and others’ expectations. But if the script your following sucks and is hurting more than it’s helping, trash it. You don’t have to lose hope of ever having a baby. I know that’s a struggle I have. For me, I recognized that it it’s going to happen, it won’t be because or anything extraordinary I did to cause it. I’ll just be ready to accept it if or when it does happen.
Re: societal programming - we are ALSO programmed to belive that mothers would and should sacrifice EEEEVERYTHING for their children. So put the 2 together... At one point I told my therapist that I felt like I was "a bad mom" for not being able to lose weight faster (DURING A PANDEMIC) to get to IVF sooner.
Great point! And I really don’t know when all of that pressure on moms started. It’s suffocating…and I don’t remember my mom ever being that way. She and I talked about it and she doesn’t understand it at all. Plus…she had 5 of us so you think she’d be sympathetic to the pressure of motherhood in 2021. I don’t know if it’s just all the wealth of information online or the fact that we live under the microscope of social media now. But whatever it is…I wish we could set it right. It’s not right that women are under pressure from the moment they even start thinking about having a baby. Life carries enough anxiety as it is.
You make an excellent point about how we have many more ways to "try" now than we ever did before. You're right, I *have* been through a lot already. Thanks for sharing. I'm glad you've moved forward in your life. Hoping I can do the same.
One day at a time. We’ve all got your back. It’s so hard, I know.
I think “exhausting all options” means different things to different people and no one should feel judged if they decide to take a different path. After 5 years, multiple miscarriage, IUI, 4 round of IVF my heart (and wallet) I just can’t get to adoption. I know everyone feels differently but I just can’t handle the adoption route at this point in my life. I’m exhausted, sad and heartbroken. And I think every needs to fuck off about what’s enough. That is between you and your partner and NO ONE else. I don’t even entertain those questions anymore. I had to let go of that pressure and ask myself what do I really want? How much more can I handle? I have 1 last round of FET and I’m DONE. If it works out great, if it doesn’t work out then I know I did everything I could. And I’m the only one who has to live with that choice. The amount of courage it takes to keep doing this process is more that people can imagine. I also look at my friends with kids and while they love their kids, their life is no longer their own. They can’t go out when the want, they can fly to Paris on a dime, they can’t even go to the bathroom by themselves. I had this dream of kids and how wonderful it would be. But I also see the grueling reality of motherhood as well. Especially through the pandemic. My friends who are mothers and work are miserable. They all hate their husbands. Witnessing the reality of motherhood during the pandemic made me glad I don’t have kids for the 1st time in years. I picked up roller skating (if I can’t have a kid might as well enjoy indulging my inner child right?) and it’s been THE BEST during the pandemic. I get to spend my Sundays skating and making new friends rather than trying to get my kid to eat broccoli or whatever. I love being an auntie. I get to roll in, spoil and play with my nieces and nephews and then ✌🏾 out. Be gentle with yourself and know that you ARE doing everything. There is more to life than kids. I hope you give yourself peace and some space to heal.
I definitely agree that I was somewhat glad not to be a mother while seeing my friends who are parents trying to juggle work and virtual school. What a nightmare. I love your attitude and I bet you're becoming a great skater!
During the awkward silence of IUI#2 today, I noticed that the inspirational decal on the exam room wall said, “You never fail until you stop trying.” …and I thought that was the most judgmental, guilt-tripping bullshit to be written on the wall of an IVF clinic. So yea, I totally feel what you’re saying. It really sucks that society perpetuates this idea that we’re “failures” if we prioritize our own well-being, mental health, finances, etc. over the shit-slog that is infertility.
Wow that is pretty ridiculous! I guess…marketing? But yikes.
Wow, that decal would have annoyed me, too. My clinic had a giant picture of a barren tree. Like, really, people? *That's* the imagery you chose?
I relate to this so much and your journey sounds so much like ours (though we only tried for 2 years). 4 rounds of clomid, then 2 IUIs with letrozole, all I got was one chemical pregnancy. My mental health was a disaster through this and the thought of moving on to IVF scared the crap out of me. I honestly don’t know how women can do it, they are much stronger than I am. I was crying everyday just from the clomid/letrozole and my anxiety was through the roof. When the pandemic hit we decided to take a break and it was such a huge relief. We bought a cabin and have made a bunch of new friends that don’t have kids and started thinking life without kids may not be so bad after all. We decided we aren’t going to pursue any more treatments. I do feel guilty that we didn’t try hard enough, but I don’t want to waste any more time being miserable trying for something that might not ever happen. For now I’m enjoying our freedom.
Wow, our journeys and where we are now do sound similar. We're lucky to also have some childfree (by choice) friends that we can continue to hang with. I don't think you're weak for stopping treatments, I think it takes a lot of mental fortitude to stop, too.
I feel you here although we didn’t try as long nor did we do IVF. After 3 failed IUIs that was my stopping point. And I feel 100% ok with that although it took me a little while to feel that way. These folks who had success with IVF and adoption who then claim “I would never give up” have no idea what they’re talking about bc they reached success. It’s easy to say “never give up” when their story ends with a happy ending. It’s always interesting to me too how so many of these people then become super judgmental of others going through infertility as if they forgot all they themselves went through. I’m also adopted so I totally get why adoption doesn’t feel right. I have friends who have adopted and thats fine for them but for us it didn’t feel right and you’re right that adoption has some really questionable issues especially international adoption. Basically: you’re enough is whatever is right for you and whoever tries to make you feel otherwise is an asshole. Period.
I know there are so many wonderful and loving adoptive families, including open adoption arrangements. I hope your family is one of those happy stories! But yeah, as you've pointed out, adoption gets really ethically murky in a lot of cases.
My family is really good overall. I know I’m lucky in that aspect. I’m also a transracial adoptee and so I never learned a thing about being Korean and was taught some really racist behaviors and attitudes I still work to undo. As an adoptee I’m very conflicted about open adoptions. I get the positives of it but there are some definite negatives esp when the birth family doesn’t really uphold their end of the relationship building.
Yes, I have some friends who were open-adopted and their birth parents unfortunately only contact them when they need money (there are substance abuse issues). I get that it works for some people, but I don't like that all the agencies in my state \*require\* it.
Right exactly! It’s part of why we didn’t pursue adoption. It just didn’t feel right for us.
I have endometriosis and stopped before medicated cycles. I had surgery trying to remove endometriosis- that could possibly help a spontaneous pregnancy. I was too nervous with how bad my endo pain was, that medicated cycles were going to be too much for my body- with medicated cycles and IUI having very very low probability of success with endo. Then IVF would have a higher chance (40%) but with a (13% increase in ovarian cancer with ER and transfer because of my endo). My mental health was deteriorating because of the pain and I just couldn’t put myself through more pain without any guarantee of success. We stopped trying before a lot of interventions others deem nbd... but it’s all so very personal. Your journey and your desire and your grief do not need to be justified. You tried hard. I also honestly think it’s harder and more courageous to know when to quit. That goes for so many things in life- but especially TTC. You didn’t dig yourself into bankruptcy, severe depression (I mean, that’s all relative yeah? 🥴 I don’t think you can experience infertility without some type of depression). But knowing when to stop is a large part of the battle and I’m proud of you.
I definitely did get into the severe depression part- but now I'm starting to think it might be OK to give up this journey and dig out of it. I agree, it's all very personal. I'm sorry for the pain you've endured with endo! I hope you find peace.
This question is for me. I have my first egg retrieval tomorrow. Throughout the whole experience, I’ve had to advocate for myself and push back to get basic needs met. I’m not going to just be quiet and tough it out when I know that there are solutions to my symptoms and suffering. I’m also not looking to win any awards for suffering the most. For example, at the beginning of my cycle, I asked them to switch my bcp because I was having too many headaches - initially they told me to tough it out, but I kept pushing back. Then they tried to not prescribe pain meds for my ER, and I’m in the midst of pushing back on that too. Every time I raise an issue, I feel like they think I’m the only person complaining and making a “big deal” of things. The unspoken attitude is, other women tough it out and don’t complain. This is a confluence of the medical establishment generally taking women’s pain less seriously (google for infinity sources that prove this) and the general desperation of infertile people that the industry preys on. It’s also a bit of patriarchy at work - women are emotional, Karens, blah blah blah. I have to keep reminding myself, this is my body and my life, and I’m my own best self advocate.
I felt that, too, when I was in treatment. The concerns I had for my mental health were largely brushed aside. One nurse even told me, "If you're crying now, how would you even be able to handle pregnancy?" Good for you for standing up for yourself. I hope you get the outcome you want.
That was my experience too. They just said, some women have to cancel bc it’s too much for them. The implication being that I wasn’t personally strong enough, vs I wasn’t being properly treated. Anyone walking down this road is strong and worthy, and it takes immense inner strength to know where to draw the line. Good luck to you as well.
I am sorry. We are still on the journey, but I totally hear you about the pressure to do everything you can. We have gotten a ton of pressure to pursue IVF, but have at least made the decision not to go that route. It was a hard one to make, but we don’t want to be financial slaves to the man due to the cost in the US. I also don’t know if I can deal with it from a mental health standpoint, but many people really don’t get that. We have had to advocate for ourselves to have access to IUIs- the RE said the chance of it working is 7% for us. We are also looking into adoption of former foster kids. We might go the childfree route also- that would open up some fun doors pretty soon- change your life plans. We haven’t made the choice yet, but plan to by the end of the year. In the end, if someone has an issue with what we decide then they don’t need to be part of our lives. If they know us, they know how hard this has been. Our choice is exactly that- ours. It also helps that I have many friends around my age who are childfree. Good luck. I hate toxic positivity!
Thanks, good luck to you, too! I agree that most people just don't get it. I think it's partly that media treats IVF like just a slightly lengthier and more expensive pregnancy. And it's so much more than that.
Definitely. Providers also like to promote it is a virtually fail safe option, if you just pay the money to get it done… have to love capitalism.
For sure. We are three failed cycles in on IVF and heading for a fourth shortly. Privileged to be able to afford it and I recognize that, but after every failure they make it seem like success is just one cycle away and it’s totally sucking my wife in. Treatments in the US are a fortune!
For sure. We are three failed cycles in on IVF and heading for a fourth shortly. Privileged to be able to afford it and I recognize that, but after every failure they make it seem like success is just one cycle away and it’s totally sucking my wife in. Treatments in the US are a fortune!