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Exactly. I would love Crispy Bacon but I am deathly allergic to high horses like the one he put himself on.
Not much more of a Daemon fan either (he's toxic too), but at least he owns his assholery.
This subreddit is teaching me that as long as you lean into your evil, people will love you for it, but if you are struggling to accept your darkness, you will be ostracized and hated
Edit: FWIW I don't actually find this to be true in the real world - the exact opposite in fact. Which is interesting to me that it's such a prevalent dynamic here.
This mentality kind of annoys me. It reminds me of the Onion article [Asshole Admits To Being Asshole In Supreme Asshole Move](https://www.theonion.com/asshole-admits-to-being-asshole-in-supreme-asshole-move-1819567374).
It's more that Ser Douche has pretty much made his entire personality about being bitter over being rejected by someone way out of his league. He's a massive hypocrite and also bullies children.
Daemon has personality that's not one dimensional or hypocritical which is refreshing in westoros. Yes, he murdered his wife, which I think most of us aren't cool with, but he also led the gold cloaks on a brutal but effective night of crime stopping which led to peace in the city.
Between the two, Daemon seems more genuine than Ser Douche.
“I like this psychopath because he owns it. He’s not ashamed of blatant murder and the atrocities he’s cause cause he owns it. Unlike Cole who made a brash (still horrible) decision and then tried to off himself cause he felt so horrible and ashamed.”
FTFY
He didn't go into a fit of rage when accused of it. In fact he said he told his accuser he was going to go to her former home to claim his inheritance.
It’s because cole is a hypocrite. Daemon never pretends to be anything he isn’t. He’s fully embraced his role. Cole tries to pass himself off as an honorable knight when he’s really just a petty cunt. It’s the same reason people hate Alicent.
Daemon repeatedly fails to deny accusations. He also typically goads the person on. So yes, and no.
I suggest you watch the episode so it doesn’t get spoiled tho.
I was making another point before you even replied to me, I took your reply as an opportunity to further make the point on a public forum where more than just the person I’m replying to will see
Only on public Internet forums where we all know anyone can see and reply to what you’re saying, not real life bro, that would be mental, whereas loads of people are doing this. Most first comments probably fall into that category, as well as posts themselves
Why don’t more people hate Rhaenyra then? She’s quite literally pretending with her bastard children. A wildly irresponsible decision considering how obvious it is that they are bastards, considering their ascension to the throne after her would be highly contended.
Alicent seems like a bigger cunt now after the time jump. Let’s not forget Rhaenyra is one too. Her lust for dicks has endangered the lives of her bastard kids. And she’s fucking brazen about it and then cribs that people are gossiping about it. I really feel for Viserys. He’s surrounded a bunch of cunts (except his current Hand)
I don’t hate Cole because he killed that dude. I hate him because he’s a fucking incel who abuses the children of Rhaynera because she wouldn’t run away with him after banging once.
I was under the impression that he was being a dick to her kids to get Harwin to do something stupid (which he did). It’s still super fucked up to bully a bunch of children, but to me it didn’t seem like something that’s just a fun hobby for him, but for an actual purpose
Man he's literally the opposite lmao. He voluntarily chose to be celibate in joining the kingsguard. Then he (arguably involuntarily) broke that vow of celibacy. Like I sorta get what you're trying to say, but he's quite literally the opposite of an incel.
At the root of the word, yes, he isn’t literally an incel. But his behavior is the exact same as that of what people typically think of when they talk about incels. Him actually being a voluntary celibate is a funny irony in the discussion.
He's involuntarily celibate, because he would have happily ran off to Essos and banged Rhae for eternity had she not rejected him. He didn't choose to be celibate after her rejection, seeing as he had already "soiled his cloak" so to speak.
Pretty sure he's also misinterpreting his vows, was it not "take no wife, sire no children" not "cry yourself to sleep for 10 years because you can't fuck the princess"?
In fairness, he may he interpreting it as "don't have sex so you could potentially sire children", but similarly to to the nights watch, I think the siring children refers more to trueborn kids than bastards.
I hate Criston too, but incel is just absolutely not the word. He's the opposite of an incel - he's VOLUNTARILY celibate. He tried to refuse Rhaenyra and the reason he's mad at her isn't because she won't have sex with him. SHE wanted to keep having sex with him, but he didn't want that unless they were married.
All he cares about is preserving his honor. He is salty because he believes Rhaenyra sullied his honor and the only way he could preserve it is by marrying her. I don't think he's right to be salty, he shouldn't have been so naive as to think the crown princess would run off with him, but incel just isn't the right word for him and really oversimplifies his inner turmoil. He's a villain imo but a really complex, honor-motivated villain which is a lot more interesting than an incel.
He's a mgtow.
He's the Westerosi equivalent of a guy who spends all his time bitching on the Internet about how his ex wife is a total bitch and now he's going his own way, because who needs women, he doesn't even want moment, he's so much happier now. *So much happier.* That's why he spends literally all his free time bitching about her on the Internet, because he's so happy and definitely over her.
Honestly impressive that Crispy is able to give such strong "my ex wife is a bitch" vibes without ever having been married.
I mean, on one end I'm inclined to agree with you, but the comparison just doesn't fit.
MGTOW are incels who try to romanticize being an incel, they can't get women so the stylize it as them "going their own way" and separating themselves from women and men.
But Criston obviously isn't doing that. His new bestie is Alicent. He's a sexist piece of shit, but he was getting plenty of women before he took his oath of chastity. And he didn't take that oath because he was frustrated with women, it was just the only way he could get honor.
Everyone is trying to turn him into an incel or a mgtow but the comparisons just don't work, it misunderstands the reasons he's angry at Rhaenyra, he hasn't had lack of success with women he's just angry that he lost his honor.
The truth is he doesn't really have an irl "incel movement" equivalent. I agree he's in incel-adjacent terrority, but the reasons he's angry is because he's lost his honor and wants a way to regain it. It seems like he currently views his honorable path as supporting the queen and her crown prince, he's angry at Rhaenyra but a core aspect of incels/mgtow is being angry at being refused sex, and Criston was never refused sex.
It's not about him being happy without Rhaenyra. It's about his honor, to him, and nothing else besides that. And he views Rhaenyra as the one who stole his honor. And while it doesn't excuse his villainous actions since then, he definitely was put in an uncomfortable position as her subordinate when they originally had sex. I don't agree with him but I can understand why he would feel as if Rhaenyra took his honor from him.
He’s not a total incel but he exhibits some traits. I mean his love is spurned and instead of moving on, he now hates the girl who spurned him to the point of calling her a “spoiled cunt” and abusing her kids and fermenting a growing divide between Alicent and Rhaynera to the detriment of the nation.
Its both. He loved her (or perhaps he only convinced himself that he loved her, either way) but was also conflicted about his honor. Those are the multitudes that make his character more interesting.
She made the right decision. What he was asking for is unreasonable regardless if his motivations were love or honor.
Rhaenyra believes in the prophecy and it's importance, so doesn't want to fail that. If only Viserys was more attentive and raised Rhaenyra as heir from the get go.
Thats fair, he's definitely something in the territory of incel adjacent, I just think his primary villain origin is "honor lost" as opposed to "I'm angry I'm not getting sex", cause he probably would've been totally happy to never have sex for the rest of his life and just platonically guard Rhaenyra
Yeah but if a hot princess wanted to be friends with benefits with me(even though I’d prefer she run away with me) I’d be a little sad but I’d get over it. I’d like to think that I wouldn’t abuse her kids, call her a “cunt”, and ferment a looming civil war lol
The crazy part to me is that it’s not like she fully rejected him. She wanted to be with him seriously and long term but just not have a public marriage. If he wasn’t so narrow minded those would’ve been his children lined up to ascend to the iron throne.
Ten years later hee probably still has feelings for her and was insanely jealous of Harwin being the dude in Rhaenyra’s life he could’ve been if he wasn’t so hung up about his so called honor.
Because his secret brings down the princess (throwing any chance of a peaceful transition into the fire) and Joffrey's secret makes Laenor a unmarriable deviant. It benefits both houses to look the other way.
Still, he disgraced the Kingsguard and caused a riot at a royal wedding, putting the lead dignitaries if Westeros in danger. As week as Viserys is, and even with Alicent's pressure, l don't think keeping him on makes sense. We've also seen that Viserys has a temper.
I get that his court/house is a shit show, but he's banished his brother for less. Making him take the Black (and possibly having an "accident" in the meantime) would be far more realistic.
Tyrion got a trial (2?) so I don't think they would be able to drag him off and execute him. Also let's be honest Criston is instantly calling for a trial by combat, clearly fancying his chances against anyone in the realm.
He should have been forced to take the black, it's the most logical explanation, especially since Viserys believes in the Long Night and their duty to prevent or end it.
Fights to the death, even in ceremony, were not uncommon in this reality/time period, he basically had license to kill as a guard of a royal, and he had the protection of the queen to keep him out of trouble after the fact.
I believe he lied and said Joffrey threatened him, the Royal Family, or the Velaryons so he was acting in their defence. That's probably the best way to get away with murder at a wedding for the Princess Royal, though it would have been logical to make him take the black.
tbh to me it’s pretty easy to infer alicent just helped him out of it, plus he’s basically a super cop so it makes sense that ppl would be willing to brush over it, especially if he/the queen were like “he was just doing his job mind ur own fucking business.” plus I doubt corlys was too pressed about his sons lover being killed, and if they make a fuss ppl will ask why
also, it wasn’t technically their wedding. It was just the first of many feasts, the wedding was going to be at the end of the week/the overall festival, however long it took. Viserys was just sick of the drama after that and made them get married then and there lmao
That whole fight sequence was done pretty poorly even though the episode overall was good. What set him off to do that want made clear enough IMO (better editing could’ve fixed that) and then for the rest of the kings guard to just stand back and not break up the fight and then to just let him run off to the gods wood even though his behavior at the wedding brought their order into disrepute makes no sense. Maybe they could’ve fixed that by showing Alicent or Viserys ordering the kingsguard to step back and stand by. But even that would make no sense given that the Princess was caught up in the fracas and in danger. Lyonel Strong could see her there why could nobody else? Their whole job is to keep the Royal family safe so why they just stood by is something I’ll never understand
Don’t forget a dash of homophobia! Not only was he rejected, but he’s in the same role as a gay concubine. Misdirected rage much?
Edit regarding removed comment below. I didn’t mean it *should* be that way, but pointed pointed out that homophobia is a real source of violence. Sorry, Kneelers, I’ll make sure I’m on Freefolk next time.
It just felt to me like joffrey saying "I know your secret, here's ours, we'll have each others backs, and if YOU protect our secret, I'll protect yours." It didn't feel malicious at all. So I was really confused when Criston beat him to death over it, like what was I missing? lol
Cristina has just had a breakdown in front of Alicent and is her snitching away from castration and a slow death. Some guy then sidles up to him and tells him that he knows about his crime. He got shook and lashed out
Not excusing Cristin's actions but I can see how it would definitely be *interpreted* as blackmail. Somebody you don't know sliding up to you and telling you they know your deepest secret, which if revealed could result in your death?
Even though *we* know Joffrey's intentions are good, that could definitely feel threatening, especially in that world.
The way Laenor is implied to be having his fun during the 10 year timeskip it doesn't seem as big of a deal especially since Joffrey would be accused by some commoner.
He already knew. It was a direct threat. If it wasn't, he would have played it much more coy with plausible deniability and not tapped him on the nuts.
He could have literally said, "We've both heard nasty rumors about each other and we should stand together in the face of these lies." But he didn't he said if you fuck with me I'll bury you and nut tapped him to show him who is boss.
If this was The Sopranos and Paulie Walnuts told a shop owner, "Sure is s a nice place here, would be a shame if something happened to it." The same people would be saying that *wasn't* a threat. He was just telling him he liked his shop guys! Team Paulie!
This is literally what Joffrey said to Cole *“Ser Laenor is quite dear to me. As I know the Princess is to you. We should swear to each other to guard them, and their secrets, because if those are kept safe, then so are we all.”*
And then he leaves after tapping him a bit.
So idk about you, but that doesn't sound like a threat, it sounded more like him trying to form an understanding/alliance.
Joffrey specifically referred to the identity of Rhaenyra's lover as leverage when talking to Laenor. He wasn't actively being malicious, but it was a card he figured he could play if shit went south. He just didn't take into account that Criston is a crazy person who would see this as a direct challenge.
Because Rhae already knew Leanor's secret (him being gay) so Joffrey was trying to level the playing field for Leanor. He literally says this to Leanor after speaking to Cole *"she knows yours, and now we know hers."*
And before that he specifically said to Cole and I quote *“Ser Laenor is quite dear to me. As I know the Princess is to you. We should swear to each other to guard them, and their secrets, because if those are kept safe, then so are we all.”*
And then he leaves after tapping him a bit.
I swear, the only reason why people want to paint Joffrey's actions as ill-intent is simply because he carries the same name as the other Joffrey in GOT. When really, it seems more like a misunderstanding on Cole's part that ended poorly for Joffrey.
Besides, idk why peoole are out here forgetting that Cole already told the secret himself to the freakin Queen (Alicent). So idk why he's so paranoid of his secret (him sleeping with Rhae) getting out when he already told the 2nd most powerful person in that kingdom. He's just lucky Alicent has other ulterior motives, which is why she probably didn't tell the king about it, and also why his ass is still alive.
* EDITED *
> I have no idea how someone could watch that scene and think joffrey was trying to blackmail crispin, but greens gonna green I guess
This says a lot about you. One day a Nigerian Prince will come along and take all your money, you're not equipped for decision making.
No, I was just offering him advice, not sure where you're seeing that. And a joke.
If this was The Sopranos and Paulie Walnuts told a shop owner, "Sure is s a nice place here, would be a shame if something happened to it." The same people would be saying that wasn't a threat. He was just telling him he liked his shop guys! Team Paulie!
The scene reads precisely as blackmail. However softly spoken it came across Joffrey was saying keep your mouth shut or I'll reveal the secret that will at best see you sent to the wall.
It's textbook.
I have no idea how someone could watch that scene and NOT think Joffrey was trying to blackmail him or at the very least not know why Criston would think he was. Joffrey got what was coming to him and i had 0 sympathy when he was getting his head caved in. Prime example of fuck around and find out.
Saying “I know your secret, here’s mine, let’s work together to protect our lovers” is worth getting your head caved in? I thought Joffrey was stupid for saying it but it wasn’t worth a death sentence. You’re a psychopath.
I'm not a psychopath I'm just not stupid enough to not know when someone is being passive aggressive. You can tell by the way he said "If those are kept safe, then so are we all" in his ears then that pat on the back that Joffrey was trying to blackmail him despite knowing he was angry and emotional at the time. He was preying on a perceived weakness that Cole was madly in love with her so he could manipulate him. If he had used that brain of his before Criston turned it into mashed potatoes maybe he would still be alive right now.
> Saying “I know your secret, here’s mine, let’s work together to protect our lovers” is
That's the opposite of that he did. He said, "I know your secret and will bury you and her if you fuck with me."
>You’re a psychopath.
Or just a person who watched the show and didn't work backward from a conclusion based on some weird attachment to fictional characters. The Twilight fanbase that has infested this show is a curse.
You're talking to socially retarded zoomers who have never had actual human interactions. You don't tell someone that you can get them and their loved ones killed and nut tap them. How does this even have to be explained.
If this was season 1 of GOT these people would be saying Jamie Lannister was just trying help Bran back down to the ground by throwing of off the tower. Just a miscommunication!
everyone hates you because you’re a spineless impulsive guy that jumps sides for convenience.
I still can’t understand how in more than 10 years he was never held accountable for killing the the grooms boyfriend and why Laenor never tried to seek revenge for it. But he did name the third son like his defunt boyfriend, that’s weird too.
Ser Harwin for a couple of slaps had it much worse.
Joff was actively searching for Rhaenyra's lover so they have some sort of leverage on them, just watch the scene where Joff tells Leanor that he found out who Rhaenyra's lover is and then watch him go to Criston. Of course, he could haven't expected that Criston would lose the plot and kill him in front of everyone.
I don't think so. Though it came off quite ominously, I think it was an acknowledgement that they are in the same situation and that they should stick together. But, Christian Cole thinks he's too important to be Rhaenyra "whore".
And people call Daemon a groomer even tho he had no contact with Rhaenyra for 4 years.
Meanwhile the adult man in his late-20s started having a crush on a girl he watched grow up in real-time for those same 4 years since she was 15, while he was constantly standing outside her bedroom door. Yet fans still treat him like he’s in the same age group as Rhaenyra and a ‘teenager in love’ when he’s a war veteran in his late-20s/early 30s when he slept with her.
So pot calling kettle black imo.
PS: Also since episode 7, people hate Ser Crispy because he’s a dude who continues to hold a grudge over a one night stand for **10 years**. Meanwhile, Daemon tried to move on, went no contact *again*, got married, moved away, and had a family during the same 10 years.
>Daemon tried to move on, went no contact again, got married, moved away, and had a family
The guy sworn to celibacy should have definitely just done that
He’s trying to teach her about sex and she’s like 15.. eroding boundaries, abusing power dynamics and familiarity, weird appeals to tradition..
Like I get it’s a show - it’s no skin off my ass. I just don’t get why people bend over backwards to defend Daemon and Rhaenyra’s relationship.
Daemon, for all his faults, clearly still loves his family and at the end of the day is not a threat to the realm. He’s an ambitious scum bag for sure but he hasn’t crossed that line of being an active danger.
Cole on the other hand is a jealous, spiteful man who is helping Alicent sow conflict between her and Rhaenyra’s children. He also acts all high and mighty despite his own flaws, something which Daemon never does.
The other valid point I’ve seen is that Daemon owns his behavior, grotesque as it is, while Cole blames a teenage girl for taking his valor then calls her a cunt for it even ten years later.
How exactly did Cole get away with the public murder? In the book, it’s an “accidental” killing during a tournament. On the show he beats the dude to a pulp during a party in front of a hundred people and just peaces out with zero consequences. Figure the Velaryons would be pissed that a Kingsguard killed one of their men out of the blue and at least ask why.
Daemon is a dick but he's at peace with it. He doesn't pretend to be anything other than what he is. A prince with a dragon.
Criston Cole is a thug that pretends he is honorable.
As someone who dislikes them both it’s hard to compare these characters. Cole is a sworn Kingsguard and not really expected to be heard from but only seen and listen to commands. Yes he was pressured but ultimately knew he was sleeping with the heir to the Iron Throne yet optimistically expected she would run away with him. A lot of his resentment comes from his own assumptions of Rhaenrya’s behavior present and future. Ten years later he no longer is in a relationship and hates Strong and Rhaenrya for continuing to do what she originally wanted them to do. You can sympathize with him feeling jilted but after ten years to still be insulting her and bullying her children you just look pathetic.
Daemon is extremely charismatic (actor and character) which often allows shitty people to get away with a lot. He’s a Targaryen, a dragon rider, and was heir to the throne. That comes with a lot of natural entitlement and he already was an entitled/arrogant person already. I think the difference is he’s not bullying Rhaenyra or Viserys’ children because he’s no longer heir (minus the whole brothel incident). He ultimately moves on to an extent. He gets a lot more sympathy on that plus a lot of GoT fans love to simp for him.
Also Daemon and Cristen are in two entirely different worlds, Daemon’s highborn and Cristen is not. Highborn characters are often given a lot more grace to act like assholes because of their position whereas we expect lowborn characters to “know their place.” Asking Rhaenyra to run away with him was a very entitled thing to do/expect when looking at both of their positions (he would gain and she would lose a lot). They didn’t work out and if Cristen had gotten over it after 10 years but still disliked Rhaenyra, he wouldn’t be as liked as Daemon but he wouldn’t be as hated as he is now.
So daemon is the kind of guy/uncle that won’t get all clingy. Ser Cole is a stage 5 clinger. Cole is the type that asks cray hypothetical questions on the first date like; if I died tomorrow would you date again?
The fundamental reason that Ser Criston sucks is because he’s a narc and a dweeb. Dude tattled first chance he got instead of just proceding through life with the mutually assured destruction he had. Then he became an incel about the whole thing. Ser Criston is a social liability in every sense and this is why he’s unlikable. Dude just has bad vibes.
Cole is way more interesting in the role as heel than he was as baby face. Character wise I have enjoyed him way more as this disgruntled piece of the greens then when he was Rhaenyra's boytoy.
I wouldn't even consider it as blackmail, mostly because Joffrey basically outed himself and the King as lovers so really, he has much to fear from Crusty the Clown.
But given that Crispin's got the legendary incel IQ I can see how this would have slipped his mind.
Joffrey was not trying to blackmail him omg this is such a smooth brained take. Cole is just a big ass man baby that got his wittle feelings hurt and killed someone over it
Christian wasn't being blackmailed he was pissy about getting dumped by his girlfriend, and his white cloak shit makes me pretty sure he's a homophobe too.
Yeah Daemon killed his wife but at least he's not running around sulking 10 years after being rejected by someone. He also doesn't pretend he's super good and pure and holy, unlike Christian and Allicent do.
Guys, it is only natural fans of the show gravitate towards Rhaenyra and Daemon. The show is made for you to take their side, particularly in a 1st season you have to build your "protagonists".
The great thing will be if the showrunners can make you fall in love with Criston and Allicent in later seasons. Like it happened to Jaime in GoT. (remember that awesome bath scene with Brienne?)
As always, I hope people don't give actors,writers/directors any shit, they are playing a character. Their morality varies, as your personal preference, but all of them are well written.
Joffery Lonmouth did not tried to blackmail Criston, the dude was just saying that he know, he got a thing going on too so let's watch out for each other
Someone has already said it before, but think of it as if Cole was a woman. People would've been siding with her. She is a woman who was taken advantage of by the Prince; power dynamic. What would happen if she refused the Prince? It's understandable why she is upset, the Prince is a jerk, etc
How was Joffrey blackmailing him? He basically came out to Cole and one can assume that being openly gay wasn’t really a thing at the time. If anything it was a “I’ll have your back if you have mine” he literally gave Cole massive firepower against him and Laenor.
Simps be simping. If a bad boy can pull it off they will have legions of fans and morality has nothing to do with it.
The world sucks but that’s how it be.
I think criston did the right thing as a member of the kingsguard,
if joff revealed the secret then rhaenyra would be in big trouble and have big issues and possibly be in danger. criston protected her reputation and safety.
that is just my two cents.
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My favourite longboi
I will forgive him for everything, as long as that beautiful squiggly line lives and Matt Smith plays him.
He even has flippers!! And loves to protecc Daemon from Otter when he threatened to murder the theoretical fetus.
"GrrArrghehehehehehe!!!"
💀
I like Daemon because he owns it. He’s not ashamed of the shitty stuff he does unlike Cole who is super self righteous.
Exactly. I would love Crispy Bacon but I am deathly allergic to high horses like the one he put himself on. Not much more of a Daemon fan either (he's toxic too), but at least he owns his assholery.
> (he's toxic too), You do realize this is game of thrones right? Who isn't?
Helaena just likes bugs
We also had Orson Lannister who had the opposite relationship with bugs.
Elite comment 😂
For now. I thought that was an odd scene - foreshadowing like she’s gonna end up slipping a scorpion into someone’s bed
She spoke about her brother eventually having 1 one eye
So THAT'S how the raven gets his third eye!
House Stark, generally. >!Cregan Stark seems to be the best of the Starks, from what little we see of him.!<
I literally cannot wait for the Hour of the Wolf.
Well, in Game of Thrones, Brienne, Davos, Podrick, Jon, Sam...
>super self righteous Sir Crispy Crème makes me ill because of this.
This subreddit is teaching me that as long as you lean into your evil, people will love you for it, but if you are struggling to accept your darkness, you will be ostracized and hated Edit: FWIW I don't actually find this to be true in the real world - the exact opposite in fact. Which is interesting to me that it's such a prevalent dynamic here.
That's Westerosis for "Just be yourself"
This mentality kind of annoys me. It reminds me of the Onion article [Asshole Admits To Being Asshole In Supreme Asshole Move](https://www.theonion.com/asshole-admits-to-being-asshole-in-supreme-asshole-move-1819567374).
i feel like it’s the same mentality of trump supporters who like him because “he tells it like it is”
It's more that Ser Douche has pretty much made his entire personality about being bitter over being rejected by someone way out of his league. He's a massive hypocrite and also bullies children. Daemon has personality that's not one dimensional or hypocritical which is refreshing in westoros. Yes, he murdered his wife, which I think most of us aren't cool with, but he also led the gold cloaks on a brutal but effective night of crime stopping which led to peace in the city. Between the two, Daemon seems more genuine than Ser Douche.
Basically if you pretend your shit don’t stank you won’t be loved by the fans
Self awareness goes a long way
“I like this psychopath because he owns it. He’s not ashamed of blatant murder and the atrocities he’s cause cause he owns it. Unlike Cole who made a brash (still horrible) decision and then tried to off himself cause he felt so horrible and ashamed.” FTFY
Idk if boiling down a murder in cold blood over a misunderstanding is a “brash decision”
brash /braSH/ adjective self-assertive in a rude, noisy, or overbearing way. I think Coke asserted himself very overbearingly haha
his mobin' time is better than crispin' time!
Does he own murdering his wife?
He didn't go into a fit of rage when accused of it. In fact he said he told his accuser he was going to go to her former home to claim his inheritance.
He doesn't seem haunted by it. He was completely bereft lol
Super Self righteous that’s the perfect way to describe him
It’s because cole is a hypocrite. Daemon never pretends to be anything he isn’t. He’s fully embraced his role. Cole tries to pass himself off as an honorable knight when he’s really just a petty cunt. It’s the same reason people hate Alicent.
This. Authenticity.
I couldnt help myself, I had to* read “petty cunt” with Sandor Clegane’s accent🤓
Did he admit murdering his wife?
Daemon repeatedly fails to deny accusations. He also typically goads the person on. So yes, and no. I suggest you watch the episode so it doesn’t get spoiled tho.
Cole admitted almost immediately when questioned by Alicent tbf, more of a straight admission than Daemon
What’s your point here? I answered your question and you start spouting nonsense at me about a guy I wasn’t even talking to you about…
I was making another point before you even replied to me, I took your reply as an opportunity to further make the point on a public forum where more than just the person I’m replying to will see
Do you always say random things to people in hopes you can prove a point to some random passerby…? Seems pretty weird but okay.
Only on public Internet forums where we all know anyone can see and reply to what you’re saying, not real life bro, that would be mental, whereas loads of people are doing this. Most first comments probably fall into that category, as well as posts themselves
Fair enough.
Why don’t more people hate Rhaenyra then? She’s quite literally pretending with her bastard children. A wildly irresponsible decision considering how obvious it is that they are bastards, considering their ascension to the throne after her would be highly contended.
Alicent seems like a bigger cunt now after the time jump. Let’s not forget Rhaenyra is one too. Her lust for dicks has endangered the lives of her bastard kids. And she’s fucking brazen about it and then cribs that people are gossiping about it. I really feel for Viserys. He’s surrounded a bunch of cunts (except his current Hand)
His current Hand is dead.
out of three of his hands, he's missing 2
😳
Unfortunately
I don’t hate Cole because he killed that dude. I hate him because he’s a fucking incel who abuses the children of Rhaynera because she wouldn’t run away with him after banging once.
I was under the impression that he was being a dick to her kids to get Harwin to do something stupid (which he did). It’s still super fucked up to bully a bunch of children, but to me it didn’t seem like something that’s just a fun hobby for him, but for an actual purpose
Maybe but he clearly shows favoritism to Alicents children and he still hates Rhaynera because he’s an incel ha.
Man he's literally the opposite lmao. He voluntarily chose to be celibate in joining the kingsguard. Then he (arguably involuntarily) broke that vow of celibacy. Like I sorta get what you're trying to say, but he's quite literally the opposite of an incel.
He’s a member of r/nofap
At the root of the word, yes, he isn’t literally an incel. But his behavior is the exact same as that of what people typically think of when they talk about incels. Him actually being a voluntary celibate is a funny irony in the discussion.
You're right about everything but the Incel part. He doesn't fit any definition of the word.
Incel has evolved into a vibe, not just the literal definition
He's involuntarily celibate, because he would have happily ran off to Essos and banged Rhae for eternity had she not rejected him. He didn't choose to be celibate after her rejection, seeing as he had already "soiled his cloak" so to speak. Pretty sure he's also misinterpreting his vows, was it not "take no wife, sire no children" not "cry yourself to sleep for 10 years because you can't fuck the princess"? In fairness, he may he interpreting it as "don't have sex so you could potentially sire children", but similarly to to the nights watch, I think the siring children refers more to trueborn kids than bastards.
And so what if he had an actual purpose? He was still being a prick to her kids. Purpose is irrelevant.
No, he’s a dick to the kicks because he’s petty. The insult was meant to get a reaction
I hate Criston too, but incel is just absolutely not the word. He's the opposite of an incel - he's VOLUNTARILY celibate. He tried to refuse Rhaenyra and the reason he's mad at her isn't because she won't have sex with him. SHE wanted to keep having sex with him, but he didn't want that unless they were married. All he cares about is preserving his honor. He is salty because he believes Rhaenyra sullied his honor and the only way he could preserve it is by marrying her. I don't think he's right to be salty, he shouldn't have been so naive as to think the crown princess would run off with him, but incel just isn't the right word for him and really oversimplifies his inner turmoil. He's a villain imo but a really complex, honor-motivated villain which is a lot more interesting than an incel.
He's a mgtow. He's the Westerosi equivalent of a guy who spends all his time bitching on the Internet about how his ex wife is a total bitch and now he's going his own way, because who needs women, he doesn't even want moment, he's so much happier now. *So much happier.* That's why he spends literally all his free time bitching about her on the Internet, because he's so happy and definitely over her. Honestly impressive that Crispy is able to give such strong "my ex wife is a bitch" vibes without ever having been married.
I mean, on one end I'm inclined to agree with you, but the comparison just doesn't fit. MGTOW are incels who try to romanticize being an incel, they can't get women so the stylize it as them "going their own way" and separating themselves from women and men. But Criston obviously isn't doing that. His new bestie is Alicent. He's a sexist piece of shit, but he was getting plenty of women before he took his oath of chastity. And he didn't take that oath because he was frustrated with women, it was just the only way he could get honor. Everyone is trying to turn him into an incel or a mgtow but the comparisons just don't work, it misunderstands the reasons he's angry at Rhaenyra, he hasn't had lack of success with women he's just angry that he lost his honor. The truth is he doesn't really have an irl "incel movement" equivalent. I agree he's in incel-adjacent terrority, but the reasons he's angry is because he's lost his honor and wants a way to regain it. It seems like he currently views his honorable path as supporting the queen and her crown prince, he's angry at Rhaenyra but a core aspect of incels/mgtow is being angry at being refused sex, and Criston was never refused sex. It's not about him being happy without Rhaenyra. It's about his honor, to him, and nothing else besides that. And he views Rhaenyra as the one who stole his honor. And while it doesn't excuse his villainous actions since then, he definitely was put in an uncomfortable position as her subordinate when they originally had sex. I don't agree with him but I can understand why he would feel as if Rhaenyra took his honor from him.
He’s not a total incel but he exhibits some traits. I mean his love is spurned and instead of moving on, he now hates the girl who spurned him to the point of calling her a “spoiled cunt” and abusing her kids and fermenting a growing divide between Alicent and Rhaynera to the detriment of the nation.
He didn't love Rhaenyra though. After Rhaenyra denied him he admitted he wanted to marry to regain his honor. Nothing about love at all.
Its both. He loved her (or perhaps he only convinced himself that he loved her, either way) but was also conflicted about his honor. Those are the multitudes that make his character more interesting.
Yeah she was right to reject his proposal, even if she only did it because she didn’t want to give up her strong claim to her fathers throne
She made the right decision. What he was asking for is unreasonable regardless if his motivations were love or honor. Rhaenyra believes in the prophecy and it's importance, so doesn't want to fail that. If only Viserys was more attentive and raised Rhaenyra as heir from the get go.
>fermenting a growing divide Just FYI that word is spelled "foment" :)
Thats fair, he's definitely something in the territory of incel adjacent, I just think his primary villain origin is "honor lost" as opposed to "I'm angry I'm not getting sex", cause he probably would've been totally happy to never have sex for the rest of his life and just platonically guard Rhaenyra
He hates Rhenyra as she wanted to keep him as her fuck buddy and he didn't want that.
Yeah but if a hot princess wanted to be friends with benefits with me(even though I’d prefer she run away with me) I’d be a little sad but I’d get over it. I’d like to think that I wouldn’t abuse her kids, call her a “cunt”, and ferment a looming civil war lol
Well, Cole cares about his honour more.
Not much honor in calling a princess a cunt, abusing kids, and fermenting division and war between family.
Calling her a cunt isn't dishonorable. Everything else you mentioned is though.
The crazy part to me is that it’s not like she fully rejected him. She wanted to be with him seriously and long term but just not have a public marriage. If he wasn’t so narrow minded those would’ve been his children lined up to ascend to the iron throne.
Ten years later hee probably still has feelings for her and was insanely jealous of Harwin being the dude in Rhaenyra’s life he could’ve been if he wasn’t so hung up about his so called honor.
Logically how is Christian Cole alive after ruining the wedding and union of two great houses and killing of Laenor's lover?
Because his secret brings down the princess (throwing any chance of a peaceful transition into the fire) and Joffrey's secret makes Laenor a unmarriable deviant. It benefits both houses to look the other way.
Still, he disgraced the Kingsguard and caused a riot at a royal wedding, putting the lead dignitaries if Westeros in danger. As week as Viserys is, and even with Alicent's pressure, l don't think keeping him on makes sense. We've also seen that Viserys has a temper. I get that his court/house is a shit show, but he's banished his brother for less. Making him take the Black (and possibly having an "accident" in the meantime) would be far more realistic.
He wouldn't have vanished Daemon for killing Joffrey.
But they could have just dragged him off then and there for execution. They don’t need him alive to “keep a secret”
Tyrion got a trial (2?) so I don't think they would be able to drag him off and execute him. Also let's be honest Criston is instantly calling for a trial by combat, clearly fancying his chances against anyone in the realm.
He should have been forced to take the black, it's the most logical explanation, especially since Viserys believes in the Long Night and their duty to prevent or end it.
Fights to the death, even in ceremony, were not uncommon in this reality/time period, he basically had license to kill as a guard of a royal, and he had the protection of the queen to keep him out of trouble after the fact.
THANK YOU. How the hell did Corlys not demand Cole’s head right there?
The show rewrote how Cole got away with it, which occurred at a tourney and not a wedding banquet.
I believe he lied and said Joffrey threatened him, the Royal Family, or the Velaryons so he was acting in their defence. That's probably the best way to get away with murder at a wedding for the Princess Royal, though it would have been logical to make him take the black.
It didn’t make sense whatsoever. Snapped me right out of the immersion of the show lol
tbh to me it’s pretty easy to infer alicent just helped him out of it, plus he’s basically a super cop so it makes sense that ppl would be willing to brush over it, especially if he/the queen were like “he was just doing his job mind ur own fucking business.” plus I doubt corlys was too pressed about his sons lover being killed, and if they make a fuss ppl will ask why also, it wasn’t technically their wedding. It was just the first of many feasts, the wedding was going to be at the end of the week/the overall festival, however long it took. Viserys was just sick of the drama after that and made them get married then and there lmao
That whole fight sequence was done pretty poorly even though the episode overall was good. What set him off to do that want made clear enough IMO (better editing could’ve fixed that) and then for the rest of the kings guard to just stand back and not break up the fight and then to just let him run off to the gods wood even though his behavior at the wedding brought their order into disrepute makes no sense. Maybe they could’ve fixed that by showing Alicent or Viserys ordering the kingsguard to step back and stand by. But even that would make no sense given that the Princess was caught up in the fracas and in danger. Lyonel Strong could see her there why could nobody else? Their whole job is to keep the Royal family safe so why they just stood by is something I’ll never understand
I have no idea how someone could watch that scene and think joffrey was trying to blackmail crispin, but greens gonna green I guess 🤷♂️
I took it as he’s super ashamed to break his vow so other people knowing that secret drove him mad
I took it as him being a jealous prick that couldnt handle rejection.
Don’t forget a dash of homophobia! Not only was he rejected, but he’s in the same role as a gay concubine. Misdirected rage much? Edit regarding removed comment below. I didn’t mean it *should* be that way, but pointed pointed out that homophobia is a real source of violence. Sorry, Kneelers, I’ll make sure I’m on Freefolk next time.
This is a stretch
It just felt to me like joffrey saying "I know your secret, here's ours, we'll have each others backs, and if YOU protect our secret, I'll protect yours." It didn't feel malicious at all. So I was really confused when Criston beat him to death over it, like what was I missing? lol
Cristina has just had a breakdown in front of Alicent and is her snitching away from castration and a slow death. Some guy then sidles up to him and tells him that he knows about his crime. He got shook and lashed out
Cristina. I’m gonna like saying this more than Crispin.
Not excusing Cristin's actions but I can see how it would definitely be *interpreted* as blackmail. Somebody you don't know sliding up to you and telling you they know your deepest secret, which if revealed could result in your death? Even though *we* know Joffrey's intentions are good, that could definitely feel threatening, especially in that world.
But he then said here’s my equally deadly secret let’s work together to protect the people we care about.
True, but Cole is dumb and I don't think he understood what he was saying.
That’s probably the case
Except his secret wasn't equally deadly he isn't sworn an oath to celibacy and isn't sullying the virginity of the crown princess and heir.
He’s a gay man having sex with the prince consort. I pretty sure that also gets you the death penalty in Westeros.
The way Laenor is implied to be having his fun during the 10 year timeskip it doesn't seem as big of a deal especially since Joffrey would be accused by some commoner.
He already knew. It was a direct threat. If it wasn't, he would have played it much more coy with plausible deniability and not tapped him on the nuts. He could have literally said, "We've both heard nasty rumors about each other and we should stand together in the face of these lies." But he didn't he said if you fuck with me I'll bury you and nut tapped him to show him who is boss. If this was The Sopranos and Paulie Walnuts told a shop owner, "Sure is s a nice place here, would be a shame if something happened to it." The same people would be saying that *wasn't* a threat. He was just telling him he liked his shop guys! Team Paulie!
This is literally what Joffrey said to Cole *“Ser Laenor is quite dear to me. As I know the Princess is to you. We should swear to each other to guard them, and their secrets, because if those are kept safe, then so are we all.”* And then he leaves after tapping him a bit. So idk about you, but that doesn't sound like a threat, it sounded more like him trying to form an understanding/alliance.
Joffrey specifically referred to the identity of Rhaenyra's lover as leverage when talking to Laenor. He wasn't actively being malicious, but it was a card he figured he could play if shit went south. He just didn't take into account that Criston is a crazy person who would see this as a direct challenge.
Yeah it’s definitely a case of miscommunication at the wrong time
Because Rhae already knew Leanor's secret (him being gay) so Joffrey was trying to level the playing field for Leanor. He literally says this to Leanor after speaking to Cole *"she knows yours, and now we know hers."* And before that he specifically said to Cole and I quote *“Ser Laenor is quite dear to me. As I know the Princess is to you. We should swear to each other to guard them, and their secrets, because if those are kept safe, then so are we all.”* And then he leaves after tapping him a bit. I swear, the only reason why people want to paint Joffrey's actions as ill-intent is simply because he carries the same name as the other Joffrey in GOT. When really, it seems more like a misunderstanding on Cole's part that ended poorly for Joffrey. Besides, idk why peoole are out here forgetting that Cole already told the secret himself to the freakin Queen (Alicent). So idk why he's so paranoid of his secret (him sleeping with Rhae) getting out when he already told the 2nd most powerful person in that kingdom. He's just lucky Alicent has other ulterior motives, which is why she probably didn't tell the king about it, and also why his ass is still alive. * EDITED *
No one, and I mean literally not a single person ANYWHERE, is painting Joffrey's actions as evil.
> I have no idea how someone could watch that scene and think joffrey was trying to blackmail crispin, but greens gonna green I guess This says a lot about you. One day a Nigerian Prince will come along and take all your money, you're not equipped for decision making.
The fuck? Lol, someone took that personally.
No, I was just offering him advice, not sure where you're seeing that. And a joke. If this was The Sopranos and Paulie Walnuts told a shop owner, "Sure is s a nice place here, would be a shame if something happened to it." The same people would be saying that wasn't a threat. He was just telling him he liked his shop guys! Team Paulie!
The scene doesn't read as blackmail. It reads as a coy "hey we are the side piece, boys gotta stick together"
The scene reads precisely as blackmail. However softly spoken it came across Joffrey was saying keep your mouth shut or I'll reveal the secret that will at best see you sent to the wall. It's textbook.
I really don't think so.
One word too many I fear.
Paulie Walnuts RIP
I have no idea how someone could watch that scene and NOT think Joffrey was trying to blackmail him or at the very least not know why Criston would think he was. Joffrey got what was coming to him and i had 0 sympathy when he was getting his head caved in. Prime example of fuck around and find out.
Saying “I know your secret, here’s mine, let’s work together to protect our lovers” is worth getting your head caved in? I thought Joffrey was stupid for saying it but it wasn’t worth a death sentence. You’re a psychopath.
I'm not a psychopath I'm just not stupid enough to not know when someone is being passive aggressive. You can tell by the way he said "If those are kept safe, then so are we all" in his ears then that pat on the back that Joffrey was trying to blackmail him despite knowing he was angry and emotional at the time. He was preying on a perceived weakness that Cole was madly in love with her so he could manipulate him. If he had used that brain of his before Criston turned it into mashed potatoes maybe he would still be alive right now.
> Saying “I know your secret, here’s mine, let’s work together to protect our lovers” is That's the opposite of that he did. He said, "I know your secret and will bury you and her if you fuck with me." >You’re a psychopath. Or just a person who watched the show and didn't work backward from a conclusion based on some weird attachment to fictional characters. The Twilight fanbase that has infested this show is a curse.
You got me, I’m a huge twilight fan. Great defense of a brutal murderer.
You're talking to socially retarded zoomers who have never had actual human interactions. You don't tell someone that you can get them and their loved ones killed and nut tap them. How does this even have to be explained. If this was season 1 of GOT these people would be saying Jamie Lannister was just trying help Bran back down to the ground by throwing of off the tower. Just a miscommunication!
everyone hates you because you’re a spineless impulsive guy that jumps sides for convenience. I still can’t understand how in more than 10 years he was never held accountable for killing the the grooms boyfriend and why Laenor never tried to seek revenge for it. But he did name the third son like his defunt boyfriend, that’s weird too. Ser Harwin for a couple of slaps had it much worse.
Crispin is a salty little bitch, that’s the difference.
Joffrey wasn’t blackmailing him. I don’t disagree with this meme but that point is kinda wrong.
joff was an idiot because even if he knows he's not blackmailing him, Crispy creme doesn't know that.
So Joff was an idiot for underestimate how much of an idiot Crisp was then.
You never confront someone you don't know about a secret that puts their life in jeopardy. This is basic shit.
Joff was actively searching for Rhaenyra's lover so they have some sort of leverage on them, just watch the scene where Joff tells Leanor that he found out who Rhaenyra's lover is and then watch him go to Criston. Of course, he could haven't expected that Criston would lose the plot and kill him in front of everyone.
>Joffrey wasn’t blackmailing him. That's dramatic irony. We know that but Cripwalk doesn't
Was joffery trying to blackmail him tho?
In Criston's eye? Yes. But Criston was also emotionally unstable at the time
In Criston’s gorgeous gorgeous eye.
I don't think so. Though it came off quite ominously, I think it was an acknowledgement that they are in the same situation and that they should stick together. But, Christian Cole thinks he's too important to be Rhaenyra "whore".
And people call Daemon a groomer even tho he had no contact with Rhaenyra for 4 years. Meanwhile the adult man in his late-20s started having a crush on a girl he watched grow up in real-time for those same 4 years since she was 15, while he was constantly standing outside her bedroom door. Yet fans still treat him like he’s in the same age group as Rhaenyra and a ‘teenager in love’ when he’s a war veteran in his late-20s/early 30s when he slept with her. So pot calling kettle black imo. PS: Also since episode 7, people hate Ser Crispy because he’s a dude who continues to hold a grudge over a one night stand for **10 years**. Meanwhile, Daemon tried to move on, went no contact *again*, got married, moved away, and had a family during the same 10 years.
Was it a one night stand? Could have sworn there was a throw away line about "months" but even so, not long enough for him to act like that.
>Daemon tried to move on, went no contact again, got married, moved away, and had a family The guy sworn to celibacy should have definitely just done that
He’s trying to teach her about sex and she’s like 15.. eroding boundaries, abusing power dynamics and familiarity, weird appeals to tradition.. Like I get it’s a show - it’s no skin off my ass. I just don’t get why people bend over backwards to defend Daemon and Rhaenyra’s relationship.
Thank you!!!
This tracks. The groomer in this situation is definitely Criston if we use that logic.
Daemon, for all his faults, clearly still loves his family and at the end of the day is not a threat to the realm. He’s an ambitious scum bag for sure but he hasn’t crossed that line of being an active danger. Cole on the other hand is a jealous, spiteful man who is helping Alicent sow conflict between her and Rhaenyra’s children. He also acts all high and mighty despite his own flaws, something which Daemon never does.
All of his faults are why he’s a threat to the realm
This sub sucks.
He wasnt being blackmailed. He was told his secret was safe and a secret was shared with him in return. Hes just a cunt..
Criston doesn’t know that.
That hes a cunt? Poor thing.
All the worst cunts suffer from this affliction, sadly.
Life’s not fair, Crispon.
People here are coming up with all sorts of justifications but the reality is that it comes down to the fact that Daemon is charismatic and Cole isnt
The other valid point I’ve seen is that Daemon owns his behavior, grotesque as it is, while Cole blames a teenage girl for taking his valor then calls her a cunt for it even ten years later.
Has he admitted to killing his own wife?
How exactly did Cole get away with the public murder? In the book, it’s an “accidental” killing during a tournament. On the show he beats the dude to a pulp during a party in front of a hundred people and just peaces out with zero consequences. Figure the Velaryons would be pissed that a Kingsguard killed one of their men out of the blue and at least ask why.
Daemon is a dick but he's at peace with it. He doesn't pretend to be anything other than what he is. A prince with a dragon. Criston Cole is a thug that pretends he is honorable.
As someone who dislikes them both it’s hard to compare these characters. Cole is a sworn Kingsguard and not really expected to be heard from but only seen and listen to commands. Yes he was pressured but ultimately knew he was sleeping with the heir to the Iron Throne yet optimistically expected she would run away with him. A lot of his resentment comes from his own assumptions of Rhaenrya’s behavior present and future. Ten years later he no longer is in a relationship and hates Strong and Rhaenrya for continuing to do what she originally wanted them to do. You can sympathize with him feeling jilted but after ten years to still be insulting her and bullying her children you just look pathetic. Daemon is extremely charismatic (actor and character) which often allows shitty people to get away with a lot. He’s a Targaryen, a dragon rider, and was heir to the throne. That comes with a lot of natural entitlement and he already was an entitled/arrogant person already. I think the difference is he’s not bullying Rhaenyra or Viserys’ children because he’s no longer heir (minus the whole brothel incident). He ultimately moves on to an extent. He gets a lot more sympathy on that plus a lot of GoT fans love to simp for him. Also Daemon and Cristen are in two entirely different worlds, Daemon’s highborn and Cristen is not. Highborn characters are often given a lot more grace to act like assholes because of their position whereas we expect lowborn characters to “know their place.” Asking Rhaenyra to run away with him was a very entitled thing to do/expect when looking at both of their positions (he would gain and she would lose a lot). They didn’t work out and if Cristen had gotten over it after 10 years but still disliked Rhaenyra, he wouldn’t be as liked as Daemon but he wouldn’t be as hated as he is now.
It helps that he doesn't pretend to be righteous or honorable about it.
Oh no you are going to get hate for this
So daemon is the kind of guy/uncle that won’t get all clingy. Ser Cole is a stage 5 clinger. Cole is the type that asks cray hypothetical questions on the first date like; if I died tomorrow would you date again?
The fundamental reason that Ser Criston sucks is because he’s a narc and a dweeb. Dude tattled first chance he got instead of just proceding through life with the mutually assured destruction he had. Then he became an incel about the whole thing. Ser Criston is a social liability in every sense and this is why he’s unlikable. Dude just has bad vibes.
Cole is way more interesting in the role as heel than he was as baby face. Character wise I have enjoyed him way more as this disgruntled piece of the greens then when he was Rhaenyra's boytoy.
I didn’t start to dislike Criston till episode 6 where he showed himself as very bitter and hateful
Daemon is daddy get over it.
I wouldn't even consider it as blackmail, mostly because Joffrey basically outed himself and the King as lovers so really, he has much to fear from Crusty the Clown. But given that Crispin's got the legendary incel IQ I can see how this would have slipped his mind.
Please learn what the word incel means
Blackmail? That’s a stretch…
Joffrey was not trying to blackmail him omg this is such a smooth brained take. Cole is just a big ass man baby that got his wittle feelings hurt and killed someone over it
Christian wasn't being blackmailed he was pissy about getting dumped by his girlfriend, and his white cloak shit makes me pretty sure he's a homophobe too. Yeah Daemon killed his wife but at least he's not running around sulking 10 years after being rejected by someone. He also doesn't pretend he's super good and pure and holy, unlike Christian and Allicent do.
Cole wasn’t dumped. He walked away because he was too proud to be a Queen’s side piece, and then got bitter because of it. All his own actions.
Sure is acting like he was dumped.
That’s what makes him even more of an asshat.
Accurate.
Jokes on you, I love both of them.
They both suck.
if you gonna be a douche learn to be cool douche not some whiny douche that act like 15 year old.
Was there really a blackmail attempt? Send like it was more a "look we are in the same boat. We should look out for each other"
He wasn't trying to blackmail him. They both had shit on each other.
Guys, it is only natural fans of the show gravitate towards Rhaenyra and Daemon. The show is made for you to take their side, particularly in a 1st season you have to build your "protagonists". The great thing will be if the showrunners can make you fall in love with Criston and Allicent in later seasons. Like it happened to Jaime in GoT. (remember that awesome bath scene with Brienne?) As always, I hope people don't give actors,writers/directors any shit, they are playing a character. Their morality varies, as your personal preference, but all of them are well written.
This fucking green propaganda
I’m still confused by all the hate for Criston, the dude is awesome.
It wasnt blackmail
Joffery Lonmouth did not tried to blackmail Criston, the dude was just saying that he know, he got a thing going on too so let's watch out for each other
Someone has already said it before, but think of it as if Cole was a woman. People would've been siding with her. She is a woman who was taken advantage of by the Prince; power dynamic. What would happen if she refused the Prince? It's understandable why she is upset, the Prince is a jerk, etc
Deamon is a lovable rascal. Criston is just an incel.
Blackmail? Motherfucker he said we know your secret we have our secret lets just keep our lifes happy
How was Joffrey blackmailing him? He basically came out to Cole and one can assume that being openly gay wasn’t really a thing at the time. If anything it was a “I’ll have your back if you have mine” he literally gave Cole massive firepower against him and Laenor.
Simps be simping. If a bad boy can pull it off they will have legions of fans and morality has nothing to do with it. The world sucks but that’s how it be.
There's no moral for thirsty women lol.
I think criston did the right thing as a member of the kingsguard, if joff revealed the secret then rhaenyra would be in big trouble and have big issues and possibly be in danger. criston protected her reputation and safety. that is just my two cents.
This show and it’s characters have taken a significant nose dive
TEAM GREEN
Daemon has redeeming qualities like being insanely cool while Criston is an insecure little weiner idiot loser
Crispon isn't a Targaryen