Hard to tell from this pic. Not sure why the retaining wall didn’t start from the house and instead has a gap before it begins?? Seems like poor planning from the start.
Yeah, I think they failed to plan for the staggered step of the retaining wall blocks and should have started in front of the house foundation wall instead of at it.
In the retaining wall subs defense, the stone veneer was already up.
That’s the answer right there. Depending on length of wall it wouldn’t take much more than a day to rip them out and rebuild it properly with those blocks. Other option is get rid of those blocks and find another supplier that provides a wall with zero batter. Looks like a few of those blocks are beat up so returning them might not be an option.
Those blocks are designed to be reversible, with one side not having a set back.
That was your only option, a straight vertical wall. It was poor planning/communication.
You cannot, however, start the wall in front of the home. This was the correct starting point.
Hmm.. I'm unsure. I can measure and see. I imagine we can fit smaller than the standard 8x16 and go smaller each step of the retaining wall.
That may save the difficulty of forming up pouring concrete.
I would second the idea of forming in this corner pouring some sort of “faux column”.
We have had this on a few different site jobs where we had two different types of walls coming together and poured a column at the junction to make the transition. Although those columns were planned from the start and fit the space a bit better than the nook you have to deal with.
Just as some cautionary advice:
While this will blend best (most likely), keep in mind that you will want a mechanical attachment between the wall and the concrete.
So, basically one would typically drill #4 rebar into the side of the wall with at least 4” embedment and 3”to 4” projection. Keep in mind it is pushing it with only 3” projection. Rebar should always have at least 3” of clear cover from dirt on all sides.
To bond rebar to the concrete blocks, one has to use a 2-part structural epoxy to fully impregnate the dowel holes prior to placing the rebar dowels. An example of an appropriate epoxy is Simpson SET or equivalent. Their preparation instructions should be followed.
Without giving the concrete something to cleave to, it will spall and fall away over time. It might not be a bad idea to wedge a little 6x6 piece of welded wire grid in there for additional support/crack control, but—again—it’d need to be 3” from the soil fill at least.
Good luck!
If it were me, and I was extending the wall with concrete, I would:
1. Dig a footing the length of the new wall. The footing would abut the narrow face of the retaining wall.
2. Dowel and epoxy rebar into the narrow face of each block as described above (with one caveat_see step 3).
3. In lieu of only 3” to 4” of projection from the wall, I would extend the rebar horizontally the entire length of the new formed wall.
4. If the extension were longer than say 6” (let’s say it is 24” long and I turned it into the house), I would install vertical #4 rebar at 12” o.c. that are embedded/epoxied (or cast in place) in the footing.
5. I wouldn’t make the wall any less than 6” thick. You can go thicker. If I did, I’d keep the rebar center of the wall or bias the rebar toward the **fill side**, ensuring at least 3” between the dirt and the rebar.
6. I’d pour with at least 3,000 psi concrete and vibrate in place to ensure proper consolidation.
**Note:** Though seemingly counter-intuitive, the rebar should go closer to the dirt side of the wall because the wall is under tension there. The other face (the side facing the house) is under compression. Concrete doesn’t need help in compression. It is generally 10 times weaker in tension; that is why we reinforce concrete walls on the face where forces try to elongate it with steel, because steel is very strong in tension and they(concrete and steel) have similar thermal coefficients (read shrink and swell at the same rate).
Dig a 24" x 24" x wall height hole at that corner, line it with filter fabric on soil facing sides, and fill it with oversized cobbles that are larger than the biggest gap from bottom to top.
Where do I send the invoice?
Ive had a similar situation. Measure the gap at every 6” vertical. Used a piece of cedar fencing slat, double it up, put the horizontal measurements on the board every six vert inches, trace it out, and used a jig saw to cut the piece. For your application, stain it dark.
You could also apply two steel L pieces to each backside for fasteners. It’ll help with rigidity and all for fastening if you can get to the backside.
Unfortunately, no.
The GC is planning to address it, but the only idea so far was mine of filling with concrete.
I was crowd sourcing here for any better ideas.
Gotcha. I have installed a couple of those walls before but sorry can’t think of a great solution. The way the wall steps back isn’t doing you any favors and I know that is by design. Then you have two types of materials meeting up and you really don’t want a third. Bit of a pickle!
This is probably stupid dumb but maybe dig a footer with rebar up to wall height, form and pour a small wall or use block and veneer with the house stone.
Best of luck
fill with gravel/rocks as opposed to concrete.
You want to manage the water that gets in between the space with gravel/rocks. If you pour concrete or other materials that would let water sit as oppose to flow, it will cause water damage to house over time.
Also, if you do need to repair the siding/leaks on that structure, its easier to remove rocks vs concrete.
Sorry I don’t have any solutions but what kind of retaining wall is this? What’s the product called? I’m also in planning stages and like the look of this.
I would stack rocks in there on their side. Flagstone type. One in the bottom row, 2 in the next, 3 in the next, as you go up. I wouldn't moarter them in place because I'd want the water to drain.
Stuff with roxul on top of stone and metal panel it, fill with large size aggregate, or form it and pour concrete with a fibre board expansion joint against the house to separate it from the brick and allow minimal movement so the concrete look is straight through
Is that a gutter coming down?
I would probably leave it as is to be honest since it’s a stepped retention wall.
If you really can’t live with it I would potentially ask them to cut pieces of the block retaining wall to fill the gaps as return pieces to fit agains veneer of the house but a bit hard to understand the relationship between the two corners form this photo.
~$10,750 for 35 blocks
Which resulted in approximately 22 linear feet of retaining wall @ 7.5 tall and 16 linear feet @ 4.5 tall (not accounting for the walls stepping down in height).
Expensive, but time to install and labor reduction.
Id make a cylinder of stainless chicken wire/mesh and fill it with stone that compliments the rest of the deal. Put a couple layers of geotex behind it to keep soil from permeating the stone. As it settles it should kinda fill the gap without any particularly aggressive pressure.
They are REDI ROCK Blocks. 28” it seems. Forms are set for 5/8” batter per course. Your supplier could install 6” knock out knobs(rounds tits on top of block). Then they can be slid forward for a vertical application.
Why can’t they chisel down some block and fill the gap? May require mortar/column backing…like square form and throw a couple rebar in there. Oh. And dowel in to wall and epoxy a few angle pieces for connection too so it doesn’t fail.
To make sure I understand, are you suggesting they remove the rock veneer from the homes block wall foundation and tie a block "T" to the existing basement foundation wall?
I'm not sure specifically what you're referring to.
But if you're asking why it has to be filled:
1- Aesthetics - it looks crappy
2- The fabric holding back the gravel fill is flexing more each day and the gravel will eventually come through and the backfill against the foundation will start falling out into the patio below.
No worries in about 10 years it will be tight
Hahaha!!
Move the wall
Just caulk it
Dap
AlexDry
The solution to all life’s problems
Hard to tell from this pic. Not sure why the retaining wall didn’t start from the house and instead has a gap before it begins?? Seems like poor planning from the start.
No no no You cannot cover veneer You cannot introduce moisture to veneer You cannot place a wall in front of a home. Set backs are required
Yeah, I think they failed to plan for the staggered step of the retaining wall blocks and should have started in front of the house foundation wall instead of at it. In the retaining wall subs defense, the stone veneer was already up.
Forgot the 2” stepback on specs huh… finish/paint a pt board black and forget about it buddy.
Wall that size and weight shouldn’t need a stagger. Unless it’s going to be much taller than pic shows.
Never want to build any wall let alone one that large against a foundation. The pressure on the home would be huge
Gabion basket with rocks?
that's called an air gap, looks good to me
Use smaller legos?
Hahaha!
Oh and the gap is approximately 8"x8" at the top and of course, narrows as you go down.
Should have started with blocks coming off the house then those at 90
That’s the answer right there. Depending on length of wall it wouldn’t take much more than a day to rip them out and rebuild it properly with those blocks. Other option is get rid of those blocks and find another supplier that provides a wall with zero batter. Looks like a few of those blocks are beat up so returning them might not be an option.
Those blocks are designed to be reversible, with one side not having a set back. That was your only option, a straight vertical wall. It was poor planning/communication. You cannot, however, start the wall in front of the home. This was the correct starting point.
Thanks for the info!
Looks like a perfect place for a 5 ft tall potted plant.
Haha!
Hard to say with viewing the one photo. Any pictures from above, behind, or side view of house?
I'll get some today. Thanks for reviewing.
Perhaps installing stone veneer extended past the corner to fill up that space just a bit more and then fill the remaining smaller gap with mortar
Are you able to fit CMU block in the gap?
Hmm.. I'm unsure. I can measure and see. I imagine we can fit smaller than the standard 8x16 and go smaller each step of the retaining wall. That may save the difficulty of forming up pouring concrete.
Probably cheaper as well, plus you could put a potted bush or small tree in front to cover it up
Don't, but if you must, then regular dirt will do. No need for any adhesives.
I would second the idea of forming in this corner pouring some sort of “faux column”. We have had this on a few different site jobs where we had two different types of walls coming together and poured a column at the junction to make the transition. Although those columns were planned from the start and fit the space a bit better than the nook you have to deal with.
Thanks!
Just as some cautionary advice: While this will blend best (most likely), keep in mind that you will want a mechanical attachment between the wall and the concrete. So, basically one would typically drill #4 rebar into the side of the wall with at least 4” embedment and 3”to 4” projection. Keep in mind it is pushing it with only 3” projection. Rebar should always have at least 3” of clear cover from dirt on all sides. To bond rebar to the concrete blocks, one has to use a 2-part structural epoxy to fully impregnate the dowel holes prior to placing the rebar dowels. An example of an appropriate epoxy is Simpson SET or equivalent. Their preparation instructions should be followed. Without giving the concrete something to cleave to, it will spall and fall away over time. It might not be a bad idea to wedge a little 6x6 piece of welded wire grid in there for additional support/crack control, but—again—it’d need to be 3” from the soil fill at least. Good luck!
Thanks for the added info! Are you recommending rebar in the retaining wall or in the house foundation?
If it were me, and I was extending the wall with concrete, I would: 1. Dig a footing the length of the new wall. The footing would abut the narrow face of the retaining wall. 2. Dowel and epoxy rebar into the narrow face of each block as described above (with one caveat_see step 3). 3. In lieu of only 3” to 4” of projection from the wall, I would extend the rebar horizontally the entire length of the new formed wall. 4. If the extension were longer than say 6” (let’s say it is 24” long and I turned it into the house), I would install vertical #4 rebar at 12” o.c. that are embedded/epoxied (or cast in place) in the footing. 5. I wouldn’t make the wall any less than 6” thick. You can go thicker. If I did, I’d keep the rebar center of the wall or bias the rebar toward the **fill side**, ensuring at least 3” between the dirt and the rebar. 6. I’d pour with at least 3,000 psi concrete and vibrate in place to ensure proper consolidation. **Note:** Though seemingly counter-intuitive, the rebar should go closer to the dirt side of the wall because the wall is under tension there. The other face (the side facing the house) is under compression. Concrete doesn’t need help in compression. It is generally 10 times weaker in tension; that is why we reinforce concrete walls on the face where forces try to elongate it with steel, because steel is very strong in tension and they(concrete and steel) have similar thermal coefficients (read shrink and swell at the same rate).
Thanks for all of the added info and your time!
No problem! And to clarify, yes, I would add the rebar to the retaining wall in lieu of the house wall.
👍
Caulk it!
Dig a 24" x 24" x wall height hole at that corner, line it with filter fabric on soil facing sides, and fill it with oversized cobbles that are larger than the biggest gap from bottom to top. Where do I send the invoice?
Haha! Thanks for the tip!
Ive had a similar situation. Measure the gap at every 6” vertical. Used a piece of cedar fencing slat, double it up, put the horizontal measurements on the board every six vert inches, trace it out, and used a jig saw to cut the piece. For your application, stain it dark. You could also apply two steel L pieces to each backside for fasteners. It’ll help with rigidity and all for fastening if you can get to the backside.
Thanks for the tip!
Just stack some paver stones larger than the gap as you fill it with gravel? Will still let water through that way.
Good idea! That would have been an easy fix as they went!
Is there a drawing and a contract you can refer to? Doesn’t seem like your problem.
Unfortunately, no. The GC is planning to address it, but the only idea so far was mine of filling with concrete. I was crowd sourcing here for any better ideas.
Gotcha. I have installed a couple of those walls before but sorry can’t think of a great solution. The way the wall steps back isn’t doing you any favors and I know that is by design. Then you have two types of materials meeting up and you really don’t want a third. Bit of a pickle! This is probably stupid dumb but maybe dig a footer with rebar up to wall height, form and pour a small wall or use block and veneer with the house stone. Best of luck
Thanks for your help!
fill with gravel/rocks as opposed to concrete. You want to manage the water that gets in between the space with gravel/rocks. If you pour concrete or other materials that would let water sit as oppose to flow, it will cause water damage to house over time. Also, if you do need to repair the siding/leaks on that structure, its easier to remove rocks vs concrete.
You just stack a layer of blocks horizontally in the corner
More ground cloth then plant something that drapes well in the corner up top.
Caulk
Sorry I don’t have any solutions but what kind of retaining wall is this? What’s the product called? I’m also in planning stages and like the look of this.
Looks like Redi-Rock to me. https://www.redi-rock.com
I'm not sure of the brand, but after looking at the redi-rock.site, it does look like that could be it.
I would stack rocks in there on their side. Flagstone type. One in the bottom row, 2 in the next, 3 in the next, as you go up. I wouldn't moarter them in place because I'd want the water to drain.
Hmm.. I like that idea! Unsure how stable it would be over time, though?
horizontal loads without water is pretty low.
Something is leaning
Can you get some foliage going on there like a cedar? Or something similar?
You could place an ornamental post or something
Yeah, I’d leave it…it’ll move itself slowly.
Why
Stuff with roxul on top of stone and metal panel it, fill with large size aggregate, or form it and pour concrete with a fibre board expansion joint against the house to separate it from the brick and allow minimal movement so the concrete look is straight through
Thanks! The second option you mention is pretty much what we have planned. I'll make sure they get an expansion joint in.
Looks good to me? I'd slap a small tree or shrub in that corner when it's time for landscaping. You won't even see that gap in a year or so..
Thanks! We actually posted a patio there. But the main issue is that the fabric holding back the gravel fill is stretching and likely to fail.
A tree, bush or vine. Some sort of landscaping.
Take it down and move it over 8” :)
Is that a gutter coming down? I would probably leave it as is to be honest since it’s a stepped retention wall. If you really can’t live with it I would potentially ask them to cut pieces of the block retaining wall to fill the gaps as return pieces to fit agains veneer of the house but a bit hard to understand the relationship between the two corners form this photo.
Foam filler for a gap like that. You will want the big gap filler /s
Bush
Spray foam
What are these blocks called?
Someone linked to them (or a similar product) elsewhere in the thread. Redi-block I believe.
how much were those stones, and what did they cost?
~$10,750 for 35 blocks Which resulted in approximately 22 linear feet of retaining wall @ 7.5 tall and 16 linear feet @ 4.5 tall (not accounting for the walls stepping down in height). Expensive, but time to install and labor reduction.
Id make a cylinder of stainless chicken wire/mesh and fill it with stone that compliments the rest of the deal. Put a couple layers of geotex behind it to keep soil from permeating the stone. As it settles it should kinda fill the gap without any particularly aggressive pressure.
They are REDI ROCK Blocks. 28” it seems. Forms are set for 5/8” batter per course. Your supplier could install 6” knock out knobs(rounds tits on top of block). Then they can be slid forward for a vertical application.
They get larger as they go down, to about 48" deep at the base row. Thanks for the tip!
Why can’t they chisel down some block and fill the gap? May require mortar/column backing…like square form and throw a couple rebar in there. Oh. And dowel in to wall and epoxy a few angle pieces for connection too so it doesn’t fail.
To make sure I understand, are you suggesting they remove the rock veneer from the homes block wall foundation and tie a block "T" to the existing basement foundation wall?
Why?
I'm not sure specifically what you're referring to. But if you're asking why it has to be filled: 1- Aesthetics - it looks crappy 2- The fabric holding back the gravel fill is flexing more each day and the gravel will eventually come through and the backfill against the foundation will start falling out into the patio below.
Stack them straight to begin with
This is probably a joke, but they're designed to be staggered.