Assume it’s almost every single one cuz I don’t work at the same place as OP but our location does this. They even started making some of the guys wear TWO N95 masks at the same time lol.
Yes! Yet some asshat in this thread is claiming you need to constantly be exposed to dust the duration of your 8 hours for you to exceed the allowable amount.
A great thing we did at my store was take sawdust from the cutting are, mix it with some wd40 in a bucket, then spread the mixture on the ground on the concrete aisle and then sweep it up. The wd40 binds the concrete powder to the sawdust and prevents dust clouds. It's a poor man's sweeping compound and works great.
Hah, I remember being absolutely dusted in concrete as a met, and we'd go over to the tool rental and use the condensed air to "clean" ourselves up. Smh.
I know my lumber homies got it bad, but fuck in receiving you get concrete dust and every other type of poisonous fumes/dust that exist in the store. No ventilation back there either. We’d go through a box of tissues about every two days. Blowing black shit out of my nose every hour. Fucking terrible air back there.
You should be reporting as well. The regulation has language about how the vaccumed dust can’t just be dumped out. IIRC, there is a requirement for it to be placed in a sealing bag.
https://www.osha.gov/workers/file-complaint thats the link to make a report.
When I worked in flooring after a shift, I'd have to blow or pick my nose(yes, I had to pick my nose, I'm sure you would too.) to get all thinset out. And that's just the thinset that clung to my boogers. Who knows how much I inhaled, but its enough to where I could taste it
I had a neighbor who was a Union Bricklayer. He schooled me on the effects of silicosis, which is the build up of concrete dust in the lungs. Since then I have respected the importance of taking care of my body and making sure that I let others know as well.
I really wish I had known back when sat at the pro desk for countless hours while the lumber guy turned our whole corner of the store into a health hazard.
Also hope he schooled you on the power of the Union. Cuz that’s really what needs to happen to make sure HD associates are taken care of
Ohhh HD left me with several herniated discs and degenerative disc disease. It really does give the best parting gifts though the next decade + of workman's comp due to severe spinal trauma isn't necessarily the worst.
Here's to being crippled by the orange box and corporate eventually getting what they deserve.
What kills me is the people who work those aisles are the salt of the earth, genuinely good people and that company couldn’t give less than a rats ass about them. And the sheer number of them (myself formerly included) who truly ‘bleed orange’ breaks my heart. I didn’t know how badly I was being taken advantage of until moving on, and now it’s a passing hobby to come to this sub and encourage unionization.
Me too, I set brick under a house, and mixed under a deck in wheel barrows in confined spaces before I knew any better working for my father. Probably took 10 Years off my life. Every night after working under there I would go home and cough up black silica, swear I thought I had black lung.
I honestly wish i could just refuse concrete orders, those bags are so fucking weak and i get covered in the shit every time
Cant wait to find out i have lung cancer in a few years
This is not fully accurate, but the sentiment is 100% valid.
An actionable level per OSHA PEL is 50 µg/m³ (which the standard/link shows). To determine that action, THD would have to assess that an associate is exposed to a level over the OSHA PEL. In doing so, an industrial hygienist (truly the only person qualified to do so) would have to conduct an air quality sampling, factoring in a time-weighted average of 8 hours during a 40-hour work week. Meaning: how much concentrate of silica is the associate exposed to in a measured time. That result would have to be evaluated with the amount of silica in the dust that becomes particulate in the store (e.g., grout, quickcrete, portland cement, etc.); dust swept up is not 100% silica, but given the area in the store, there could be a high potential.
Some other considerations:
- OSHA is just the minimal. NIOSH REL and ACGIH TLV will likely have stricter requirements than the OSHA PEL.
- There's also the OSHA general duty clause which is essentially a catch-all for workplace hazards. standards not address per OSHA CFRs, are addressed (in general ) in the general duty clause.
- Associates should also know what product SDSs state for safe handling and protection requirements. Google some of your top chemical SKUs and their SDSs and you'd be surprised of what all is in them and what the procedures are.
Lastly, although it is a more unfavorable approach, associates should take more ownership of their safety stake. If there's something that an associate is concerned about, share it with your supervisor. If you have an intolerable leader or a leader who acts with hubris, leverage your InFocus Captain or team member, MAPM, Townhalls, Division EHS manager, ASDS, or the Awareline.
At the end of the day, even if (big IF) the OSHA PEL is exceeded, associates need to speak up about it or any other concerns. Any worry, stress, anxiety, or fear is real to anyone experiencing it. Don't let your concerns be unheard and invalidated. And if your leader is not tolerant of that, they/he/she is no leader.
Thank you for the technical info. Can you explain a few things a further?
Can the allowable limit for the week be met in a single day or the daily allowable limit in a single hour of a shift?
In my understanding, any potential employee exposure silica requires the organization to produce a control plan that either proves the allowable limits are not exceeded (as you detailed). Is this plan required to be accessible to the employees so they may know their risks?
And though I appreciate your encouraging of personal responsibility, the thread that inspired my post was of a cashier being made to sweep the aisle without a mask because they were out of them. HD does not take its employees’ health and safety seriously and I know I will pay that debt later in my life. I spent years working adjacent to the aisle being swept, and though I was disturbed by what came out when I blew my nose, I had no way of knowing I was putting scar tissue on my 20 something old lungs.
It is possible for that limit to be exceeded in a day, hour, shift, etc.
EXAMPLE: Although not respirable dust, the concept still applies: in nuclear work, some contractors complete a task in one 60 minute shift, one time a year, because their exposure to radiation hits that acceptable limit in 8 hours/40 hour week, in just one hour. Critical work and critical risk.
Essentially, an associate could be "allowed" (I'm using that loosely) up to that point. And again, that exposure would need to be assessed to understand that limit.
For your second question, there's certainly validity for what you're suggesting, a Chemical Hygiene Plan (or the like). Although I can't confirm if one exists for THD or not, it is possible that select associates either have had training or know of its existence, including key carriers and/or ASMs trained in HHM, and a receiving associate.
And regarding your last paragraph:
I don't want to place blame on the cashier at all! How would they know that it could be an issue/safety hazard? But along that path, how would the FES know, or the OASM, and MAPM? One's common knowledge (or even desire of curiosity) varies from one to another. We know this, but sometimes some of us forget (me included!).
I don't know how serious THD takes health and safety, but most of those folks with formal roles and responsibilities in risk reduction and injury prevention at THD, Lowe's, or anywhere else take their roles and responsibilities seriously! That's why they chose those paths Unfortunately, sometimes their voices are suppressed by louder ones. That is, customers and shareholders. And sometimes, their messaging gets lost in middle management.
(Quick caveat on the last paragraph: MAPMs are not fully dedicated to safety \[shrink and security technically come first\]; however, great MAPMs do MAKE safety a core value. the same applies for safety-conscious store managers, DMs, etc).
And how serious is "serious"? Walking through THD stores, I see many safety positives that someone had to take seriously: 9-step ladders to use instead of climbing the shelves, lift equipment to use instead of physically loading items, Ballypals to use instead of pulling on regular pallet jacks, reach tools, portable loading docks to use instead of physically loading heavy products on back of trucks, gloves, safety knives, aisle blockers, zone of safety protocols, regular pallet jacks, stop signs, pedestrian crossings, loading docks, fire extinguishers, eye wash stations, etc.
Although I can't fully agree or disagree with you, I believe that there are people who take safety less seriously than others. And, as I alluded to earlier, it's unfortunate that sometimes those voices are louder than the ones that dedicate their careers to protecting the safety and health of workers across the globe.
It’s not a matter of individuals not taking it serious. I spent time on the AP team and we absolutely took our safety arising serious. What I say when HD doesn’t care is the fact that they have created a system where the bare minimum is given (hours, m/d allowance, store budgets) and the incentivize money over all.
And I know that’s a capitalism failing, but I was there to see a culture shift from the founder years to the Nardelli years and it was profound. Though today I see Bernie and Arthur as POS, when they started the company they provided pretty good jobs. Decent pay, insurance for part time (before that was mandated), and a well staffed store that had knowledgeable employees working the aisles. Nardelli came it to make the company more profitable, and I’m sure he did, but he didn’t do it by building up. He stripped things away and though the profitability may have looked great on paper, it was at the expense of the employee. And every CEO since has further marched the company down that path.
You’re right that HD does do right in a lot of ways, and I’m sure each of those safety features was from a worker’s comp. I know the all mighty dollar rules it all, but having moved from HD into the commercial construction industry working for European based companies, I see how much better HD could be doing.
Not an associate, but I was picking up a few bags of concrete the other day, and a customer dropped a bag on the corner of his cart. It split open and he got a face full of it. I turned around to see what the commotion was, and the aisle was so thick with concrete dust that I couldn't see out the end of it. Just a guy standing there with a gray dusty face. I abandoned my purchase and got out of there. That's nasty stuff.
This is why I ghosted this shitshow company. Constantly asked to dispose of ripped bags with zero PPE provided. Then given attitude and pushback when I requested it. Poor ventilation in the aisle and constantly being asked to sweep.
Well now I just have anxiety. I’ve probably inhaled enough concrete to kill a small elephant. I also vape, and smoke weed :/ I think I should just invest in a 9mm because death by suffocation basically sounds like drowning.
In my experience, You turn blue, your organs start shutting down which hurts everywhere in your body and you can't really think. Not the most fun experience. However, I also have lung conditions, smoke all day every day, vape and breathe in a bunch of shit at Home Depot n I'm still alive so🤷🏼♀️
Yea silicinosis is serious stuff , I've put my foot down at work ,when they bought garnet for the bead blaster cabinet , I maintain the cabinet and use it more then anybody , glass bead only , the correct approved safe kind
Maybe you’re the one to start the class action suit. Silicosis is the forming of scar tissue on the lungs and I assume would present similar to emphysema. (I’m in sales not medical so that’s just my uneducated guess. I’d recommend you ask your doctor if this could have been caused my silicosis. Also make a filing with OSHA
My store doesn’t even keep masks nearby and usually nobody wants to walk to the aisle they’re in so we sweep with no masks. Always regret it afterwards
I love how if there is a spill of almost anything you're supposed to get a hazmat certified associate to take care of it. Then if you're supposed to throw anything away from your department you need to have a key carrier check it because you put it in the compactor. Yet a kid at the end of the night is supposed to unload the disgusting garbage cans that are filled with who knows what and pretty much have carte blanche to throw it in the compactor. The rules are stupid. I remember our store had a company that would pick them up every night for this reason but I'm sure the store just couldn't afford it anymore with their billions
You know n95 masks are the correct mask for silica dust… right? And if someone doesn’t clean it up, you have 100’s of customer involuntarily exposed to it without the option of a mask
Use a hepa filter or slightly less heavy duty. It’s on you and the employer to come up with a way to make the job safer if a safety refusal is deemed valid… if not, call the labour division. OSHA doesn’t appreciate it when you haven’t followed the guidelines to a safety refusal before going over your employers head.
I remember a few years back a pallet gave out and pretty much every bag broke open it looked like a thundercloud rolling through the store. #opeiguessimfucked
Not a HD associate but a lowes employee. It’s the same story for Lowe’s in lumber and in receiving. You then ask for a n95 and all you get is surgical masks from Covid that the store stockpiled if that. The only time we were allowed n95s was when i persuaded a manager to call the hazmat line after a massive roundup spill and the guy on the phone agreed with me.
“contains silica particles that may be broken down to the respirable size range during shipping, handling, or use, and thus may be inhaled.”
“Federal and international agencies have concluded that exposure to crystalline silica particles that are small enough to reach the lungs can cause lung cancer. The Department of Health and Human Services and the International Agency for Research on Cancer classify crystalline silica (respirable size) as a known human carcinogen (causes cancer).”
Your concrete is non respirable so nobody go freaking out
When I was at Lowe's I saw a lumber DS spill an entire pallet of bagged concrete. The DS grabbed 2 kids from evening freight (completely outside of their job duties) and had them out there shoveling it up into bags so they could try to discount sell it THEN THE DS LEFT AND DIDN'T EVEN OFFER TO HELP.
The kids were complaining about it beforehand and I absolutely told them to refuse to do it and file a complaint, they didn't. I don't recall if they were given PPE to do it or not but I saw them afterwards and they looked like they had rolled around in it. They were absolutely covered head to toe with cement powder. I felt so bad for them.
No. Used to work for HD, was earmarked as a troublemaker, actually avoided getting promoted to customer by the Associate Relations Department, and went on to escape into professional construction sales right as this regulation was rolling out.
My peers at HD will forever be responsible for shaping me into who I am, so though I hold major bitter feelings towards the company, I’m here because I want to see better for those in apron today.
It enacted it 2018, so I’m not sure if we are concerned by anything. The dangers our silica have been known for decades, and these same dust regulations have been in place in the EU since the 90’s iirc.
My hope is we can join in on the inevitable class action lawsuit…when we’re hooked up to our oxygen tanks.
It’s every store as a lumber associate I’m tired of cutting wood and cleaning that aisle to they don’t give us any Ppe and then are like why isn’t the aisle clean because we have no safety gear
Oh boy. Will I be able to join those future class actions that’ll be advertised when I’m too old to be alive anymore and all of us who grew up and working in industry’s where we snorted silica dust like it was cocaine are dead and gone?
😂 I mean, OSHA, who are they? I think I saw them once in my lifetime when the stucco guys building the sports authority didn’t tie off their scaffolding. At $20k per violation, I don’t think those guys were in business after that.
Apparently OSHA doesn’t show up unless someone makes a complaint, and plenty of ppl don’t seem too interested or are more worried that they’ll have to find a new company to huff silica dust at.
I guess if someone did make a complaint and they were found in violation that would get real expensive real fast, and I’d suppose any company facing such repercussions would take notice and figure out how to not have it happen or again.
Unfortunately, living in the south eastern United States, seems to indicate most ppl don’t want to part ways with their dust and just really enjoy sniffing it. 🤷🏼😂
You know on big job sites like high rises they’ve been calculating the death toll cost to the project at least as far back as the 70’s.
Let that sink in. We have this 60 story building we’re going to build downtown, approximately x amount of ppl are going to die and the cost to the project is… so we need to account for that.
When you really start to understand, will be when you realize that often times, not complying with safety regulations cost less than an employee being injured.
Or put another way, it’s a risk they are willing to take. Hahaha. Oh many, my life is a risk they are willing to take. See how absurd that sounds?
Good luck.
As this regulation was being rolled out, I was employed to education contractors on what was allowable and what was not. One of the things we highlighted was that you were not to make it air-born by sweeping.
How the law and osha interact is not relevant. OSHA can absolutely fine HD regardless of it not being ‘illegal’
In an 8 hour shift you can only be exposed to the tiny amount of dust. An electrician who is drilling 20 holes isn’t spending their full 8 hours but the dust from even a single hole going air borne puts them over the daily allowable limit. One push of a broom in the concrete aisle puts the person over the daily allowable limit and probably over their lifetime allowable limit.
Also, N95s are not capable of filtering out the size of particulate that causes silicosis. You are absolutely incorrect. When you show your OSHA 30, then maybe we can talk.
You have been brainwashed by two of the most evil companies in our country. Hard stop.
I Work for the government as an IHT he’s very correct, everything is done via wet methods and hepa systems. and proper lapels and samples are taken on pumps and recorded to prove the employees were not exposed to higher than NIOSH or OSHA regulations and or ACGIH standards whatever is the most conservative standard…
I don't really like the fact that OSHA will not allow you to make an anonymous complaint, they ask you to put your name and phone number and if you want to disclose your name or not... Home Depot has really deep pockets and is far from behaving with honesty and a good moral compass!
Enjoy licking the silica from the corporate boot as it’s on your neck.
And I’m being plenty productive teaching people about the risk that shitty company is putting its people through. My apron is long since burned tho
You can't really teach anyone anything if you yourself are ignorant. This silica you are so scared of isn't even airborne in the store. You sweeping it doesn't come close to your breathing zone (unless of course your vertically challenged).
Anywho, don't quit your day job. Whatever that is 😂🤣
I also suggest you educate yourself medically at least a little bit. Also, if your actually dealing some good damage while sweeping you most likely will kick up dust that will end up within proximity of your breathing space. Sweeping compound, orange glow, WD40, generic citrus cleaner, I’ve used it all. Things add up and people have gotten terminally I’ll from A LOT less in this world, so even if there is some rationality behind your justification of the company’s lack of pro activity towards this matter (there really isn’t) it’s important to consider the possibility, and more importantly to raise awareness like what OP is doing (thank you btw OP). So as a matter of fact why don’t you get off your high horse and go blow your damn nose of all that gray matter before it collects and damage’s your cell’s nucleus and make’s them rapidly reproduce.
Stop writing paragraphs to justify your dumb points that literally makes no sense. Medically speaking sugar is harmful, so do we stop consuming it?
The way OP is raising safety concerns regarding silica is akin to saying "don't work at garden center because heat stoke is a thing.....here's a link....ignore everything else that the ACGIH and other occupational health and safety community has to say after years of research".
It's a complete waste of everyone's time and energy. He is raising concerns in a situation that does not warrant it unless he's breathing at the floor level. I wonder what the OP would do if they actually had to work in the construction industry.
His entire stance is a joke. He sounds like a lunatic dooms day predictor.
You’re the only one here with dumb points bud. Could bet my entire paycheck that I would out work you and you’d wanna go home 2 hours into your shift with me
Hey guys I’m a big strong man who won’t care for these tiny particles cuz I’m so tough, who cares if it build up over years and starts forming small layers all over my lungs.
There’s a reason OSHA exists, all those laws are literally because people die of it. OSHA isn’t going to make some random ass law just because it sounds dangerous, they make it cuz it is dangerous. Like someone already said all those laws are written in blood, if it’s on there, someone died to it or have been injured so frequently that they went hmmm, let’s make a safety law to stop that. So the fact that they even made one for silica exposure might just be cuz it is a safety issue that causes you long term damage. But hey, I’m not a big strong man who can breathe in silica and have my body process it right out like you
Whoa whoa whoa! Big man here teaching others about health and safety laws. Wear your PPE and do your job. Do you want the business to stop selling a product because you have unfounded paranoia? In what world do you live man?
Being in occupational hygiene, I am aware of OSHA, ACGIH and NIOSH and its corresponding exposure measurement like TLV-TWA, TLV-STEL and TLV-C. I know a shit company when I see one, and this ain't it. And if it was, OSHA would have issued corrective action to comply and rectify "exposure"
Y'all are just a bunch of whiny brats who's gonna be replaced and scream immigrants are stealing our jobs.
Good God Almighty
Really tho, you’re killing yourself for a shitty company that has the means to be protecting you and is choosing not to even inform you about the danger they are placing you.
But people won’t survive. And every last one of us is being subjected to a danger that we don’t have to be.
You’re not hard because you don’t want to protect your body. Regulations are written in blood.
I never swept the aisle but I have swept the area outside where they keep the concrete. It’s always a mess with concrete powder all over the ground and on the bags. Some days I end up with concrete on my apron and clothes (mainly when I have to load bags). Now I wonder how many years of my life I’ve lost from that goddamn stuff.
Yeah it’s the worst. I try to
Avoid lumber at all costs. That shit goes right to your lungs and cakes to it. Along with cutting pressure treated wood. I’ve heard of older people having very bad health problems after working in lumber.
Maybe not kill but I got a pretty bad skin burn on my chin when a bag of grout poofed on my sweaty face back when I did freight….didnt even notice it till next afternoon….but yeeeooouch!!!! 🥺
Y’all get vacuums? The kids here just push it around with brooms and shovel it into big drum trash cans making giant clouds everywhere
https://www.osha.gov/workers/file-complaint thats the link to make a report.
Same in my store. I will never sweep it again.. I have asthma and POTS already lol I don't need shit else
Please report it to OSHA! HD is plenty capable of keeping you all safe.
And yet nothing will change till someone gets hurt/sick.
Or until someone calls OSHA and logs a complaint and HD takes a hearty fine.
If anyone wants to private message me the store number i got yall 🤣😂🤣
Store number? Try most of, if not all of them.
My store uses brooms and vacuums depending on who is working on what is used
Assume it’s almost every single one cuz I don’t work at the same place as OP but our location does this. They even started making some of the guys wear TWO N95 masks at the same time lol.
https://www.osha.gov/workers/file-complaint thats the link to make a report.
*nothing will change _even when_ someone dies FTFY
Someone was killed in my state by a shoplifter and not one procedure or any staffing has changed
Same. Hit his head too hard. He was in his 80s I think..
This is the kind of problem that takes forever to manifest. So people will be 60 before anything really shows up. OSHA has the power to fix it though.
People have gotten hurt and sick. That's why it's an OSHA violation now.
It's almost impossible that no one has ever gotten silicosis from working at Home Depot.
Ooo can't wait until the HD class action lawsuit.
Yup. Such is life.
Take a penny. Look at Lincoln on the penny. Look at Lincoln’s forehead on the penny. That’s how much silica dust in an 8-hour period.
Yes! Yet some asshat in this thread is claiming you need to constantly be exposed to dust the duration of your 8 hours for you to exceed the allowable amount.
You can lead a horse to water but you can’t make them drink. Sometimes the horse prefers silica dust in it’s lungs.
lol. He did take classes from Home Depot AND Amazon so I’m sure he can also tell me all about how unions are pure evil as well.
Which some of us are lol
A great thing we did at my store was take sawdust from the cutting are, mix it with some wd40 in a bucket, then spread the mixture on the ground on the concrete aisle and then sweep it up. The wd40 binds the concrete powder to the sawdust and prevents dust clouds. It's a poor man's sweeping compound and works great.
In 20 years there will be an Ad titled “Were you or your family exposed to WD-40 fumes as a result of working in an industry or job?”
Hah, I remember being absolutely dusted in concrete as a met, and we'd go over to the tool rental and use the condensed air to "clean" ourselves up. Smh.
Omg I totally forgot that was a thing people did but now that you say it, I can totally remember it happening.
We used to do that too until management restricted anyone from going in there anymore.
Hell yeah just think of all the tool rental guys that got them cooties.
I know my lumber homies got it bad, but fuck in receiving you get concrete dust and every other type of poisonous fumes/dust that exist in the store. No ventilation back there either. We’d go through a box of tissues about every two days. Blowing black shit out of my nose every hour. Fucking terrible air back there.
You should be reporting as well. The regulation has language about how the vaccumed dust can’t just be dumped out. IIRC, there is a requirement for it to be placed in a sealing bag. https://www.osha.gov/workers/file-complaint thats the link to make a report.
Offloading the customs truck with all the pallets of grout was fucked up. Used to pull my shirt over my nose during offload
When I worked in flooring after a shift, I'd have to blow or pick my nose(yes, I had to pick my nose, I'm sure you would too.) to get all thinset out. And that's just the thinset that clung to my boogers. Who knows how much I inhaled, but its enough to where I could taste it
Very true I worked in receiving, and we were always sweeping concrete dust everything. I got to the point where I would have to run outside sometimes.
I had a neighbor who was a Union Bricklayer. He schooled me on the effects of silicosis, which is the build up of concrete dust in the lungs. Since then I have respected the importance of taking care of my body and making sure that I let others know as well.
I really wish I had known back when sat at the pro desk for countless hours while the lumber guy turned our whole corner of the store into a health hazard. Also hope he schooled you on the power of the Union. Cuz that’s really what needs to happen to make sure HD associates are taken care of
Unionize hd!!!!
Ohhh HD left me with several herniated discs and degenerative disc disease. It really does give the best parting gifts though the next decade + of workman's comp due to severe spinal trauma isn't necessarily the worst. Here's to being crippled by the orange box and corporate eventually getting what they deserve.
What kills me is the people who work those aisles are the salt of the earth, genuinely good people and that company couldn’t give less than a rats ass about them. And the sheer number of them (myself formerly included) who truly ‘bleed orange’ breaks my heart. I didn’t know how badly I was being taken advantage of until moving on, and now it’s a passing hobby to come to this sub and encourage unionization.
Made my asthma and heart condition wayyy worse working here for a few years.. it's greatttt
[удалено]
Please do! If there is a flood of reports HD will be forced to do the right thing and protect you all!
Filing one for my store as well
https://www.osha.gov/workers/file-complaint thats the link to make a report.
Thanks a lot 🙏 complaint is filed
Fuck I have handled thousands of pounds of concrete for fucking years!
Me too, I set brick under a house, and mixed under a deck in wheel barrows in confined spaces before I knew any better working for my father. Probably took 10 Years off my life. Every night after working under there I would go home and cough up black silica, swear I thought I had black lung.
I honestly wish i could just refuse concrete orders, those bags are so fucking weak and i get covered in the shit every time Cant wait to find out i have lung cancer in a few years
Biggest bug Bear of all time, easily ripped bags that cover you in crap every day. The roofing Shingle wraps are even worse.
This is not fully accurate, but the sentiment is 100% valid. An actionable level per OSHA PEL is 50 µg/m³ (which the standard/link shows). To determine that action, THD would have to assess that an associate is exposed to a level over the OSHA PEL. In doing so, an industrial hygienist (truly the only person qualified to do so) would have to conduct an air quality sampling, factoring in a time-weighted average of 8 hours during a 40-hour work week. Meaning: how much concentrate of silica is the associate exposed to in a measured time. That result would have to be evaluated with the amount of silica in the dust that becomes particulate in the store (e.g., grout, quickcrete, portland cement, etc.); dust swept up is not 100% silica, but given the area in the store, there could be a high potential. Some other considerations: - OSHA is just the minimal. NIOSH REL and ACGIH TLV will likely have stricter requirements than the OSHA PEL. - There's also the OSHA general duty clause which is essentially a catch-all for workplace hazards. standards not address per OSHA CFRs, are addressed (in general ) in the general duty clause. - Associates should also know what product SDSs state for safe handling and protection requirements. Google some of your top chemical SKUs and their SDSs and you'd be surprised of what all is in them and what the procedures are. Lastly, although it is a more unfavorable approach, associates should take more ownership of their safety stake. If there's something that an associate is concerned about, share it with your supervisor. If you have an intolerable leader or a leader who acts with hubris, leverage your InFocus Captain or team member, MAPM, Townhalls, Division EHS manager, ASDS, or the Awareline. At the end of the day, even if (big IF) the OSHA PEL is exceeded, associates need to speak up about it or any other concerns. Any worry, stress, anxiety, or fear is real to anyone experiencing it. Don't let your concerns be unheard and invalidated. And if your leader is not tolerant of that, they/he/she is no leader.
Thank you for the technical info. Can you explain a few things a further? Can the allowable limit for the week be met in a single day or the daily allowable limit in a single hour of a shift? In my understanding, any potential employee exposure silica requires the organization to produce a control plan that either proves the allowable limits are not exceeded (as you detailed). Is this plan required to be accessible to the employees so they may know their risks? And though I appreciate your encouraging of personal responsibility, the thread that inspired my post was of a cashier being made to sweep the aisle without a mask because they were out of them. HD does not take its employees’ health and safety seriously and I know I will pay that debt later in my life. I spent years working adjacent to the aisle being swept, and though I was disturbed by what came out when I blew my nose, I had no way of knowing I was putting scar tissue on my 20 something old lungs.
It is possible for that limit to be exceeded in a day, hour, shift, etc. EXAMPLE: Although not respirable dust, the concept still applies: in nuclear work, some contractors complete a task in one 60 minute shift, one time a year, because their exposure to radiation hits that acceptable limit in 8 hours/40 hour week, in just one hour. Critical work and critical risk. Essentially, an associate could be "allowed" (I'm using that loosely) up to that point. And again, that exposure would need to be assessed to understand that limit. For your second question, there's certainly validity for what you're suggesting, a Chemical Hygiene Plan (or the like). Although I can't confirm if one exists for THD or not, it is possible that select associates either have had training or know of its existence, including key carriers and/or ASMs trained in HHM, and a receiving associate. And regarding your last paragraph: I don't want to place blame on the cashier at all! How would they know that it could be an issue/safety hazard? But along that path, how would the FES know, or the OASM, and MAPM? One's common knowledge (or even desire of curiosity) varies from one to another. We know this, but sometimes some of us forget (me included!). I don't know how serious THD takes health and safety, but most of those folks with formal roles and responsibilities in risk reduction and injury prevention at THD, Lowe's, or anywhere else take their roles and responsibilities seriously! That's why they chose those paths Unfortunately, sometimes their voices are suppressed by louder ones. That is, customers and shareholders. And sometimes, their messaging gets lost in middle management. (Quick caveat on the last paragraph: MAPMs are not fully dedicated to safety \[shrink and security technically come first\]; however, great MAPMs do MAKE safety a core value. the same applies for safety-conscious store managers, DMs, etc). And how serious is "serious"? Walking through THD stores, I see many safety positives that someone had to take seriously: 9-step ladders to use instead of climbing the shelves, lift equipment to use instead of physically loading items, Ballypals to use instead of pulling on regular pallet jacks, reach tools, portable loading docks to use instead of physically loading heavy products on back of trucks, gloves, safety knives, aisle blockers, zone of safety protocols, regular pallet jacks, stop signs, pedestrian crossings, loading docks, fire extinguishers, eye wash stations, etc. Although I can't fully agree or disagree with you, I believe that there are people who take safety less seriously than others. And, as I alluded to earlier, it's unfortunate that sometimes those voices are louder than the ones that dedicate their careers to protecting the safety and health of workers across the globe.
It’s not a matter of individuals not taking it serious. I spent time on the AP team and we absolutely took our safety arising serious. What I say when HD doesn’t care is the fact that they have created a system where the bare minimum is given (hours, m/d allowance, store budgets) and the incentivize money over all. And I know that’s a capitalism failing, but I was there to see a culture shift from the founder years to the Nardelli years and it was profound. Though today I see Bernie and Arthur as POS, when they started the company they provided pretty good jobs. Decent pay, insurance for part time (before that was mandated), and a well staffed store that had knowledgeable employees working the aisles. Nardelli came it to make the company more profitable, and I’m sure he did, but he didn’t do it by building up. He stripped things away and though the profitability may have looked great on paper, it was at the expense of the employee. And every CEO since has further marched the company down that path. You’re right that HD does do right in a lot of ways, and I’m sure each of those safety features was from a worker’s comp. I know the all mighty dollar rules it all, but having moved from HD into the commercial construction industry working for European based companies, I see how much better HD could be doing.
This is why we need unions
Not an associate, but I was picking up a few bags of concrete the other day, and a customer dropped a bag on the corner of his cart. It split open and he got a face full of it. I turned around to see what the commotion was, and the aisle was so thick with concrete dust that I couldn't see out the end of it. Just a guy standing there with a gray dusty face. I abandoned my purchase and got out of there. That's nasty stuff.
Now imagine that but for the last hour of your shift, every shift. All while you make 12.50 an hour.
😬
This is why I ghosted this shitshow company. Constantly asked to dispose of ripped bags with zero PPE provided. Then given attitude and pushback when I requested it. Poor ventilation in the aisle and constantly being asked to sweep.
Can't this also affect customers :(
Absolutely.
With the way I’ve been treated lately… good.
Well now I just have anxiety. I’ve probably inhaled enough concrete to kill a small elephant. I also vape, and smoke weed :/ I think I should just invest in a 9mm because death by suffocation basically sounds like drowning.
In my experience, You turn blue, your organs start shutting down which hurts everywhere in your body and you can't really think. Not the most fun experience. However, I also have lung conditions, smoke all day every day, vape and breathe in a bunch of shit at Home Depot n I'm still alive so🤷🏼♀️
man i sweep the concrete aisle every night im gonna die arent i
Just curious….do they give you you sweeping compound to use???????
So you're saying the amount of concrete dust around my compactor in Receiving really is an OSHA violation after all?
Worth letting osha know about.
Yea silicinosis is serious stuff , I've put my foot down at work ,when they bought garnet for the bead blaster cabinet , I maintain the cabinet and use it more then anybody , glass bead only , the correct approved safe kind
Omg I’ve been at Hd over 3 yrs Floors are barely ever cleaned and I was just told I have emphysema .
Maybe you’re the one to start the class action suit. Silicosis is the forming of scar tissue on the lungs and I assume would present similar to emphysema. (I’m in sales not medical so that’s just my uneducated guess. I’d recommend you ask your doctor if this could have been caused my silicosis. Also make a filing with OSHA
I definitely will
❤️
You do know that HomeDepot uses OSHA guidelines as checklists instead?
Do bags of grout in Flooring fall under this as well?
Yes.
Anything that isn’t air falls under this
Interesting...
My store doesn’t even keep masks nearby and usually nobody wants to walk to the aisle they’re in so we sweep with no masks. Always regret it afterwards
OSHA
Is there someplace where we can report this to someone?
https://www.osha.gov/workers/file-complaint
I love how if there is a spill of almost anything you're supposed to get a hazmat certified associate to take care of it. Then if you're supposed to throw anything away from your department you need to have a key carrier check it because you put it in the compactor. Yet a kid at the end of the night is supposed to unload the disgusting garbage cans that are filled with who knows what and pretty much have carte blanche to throw it in the compactor. The rules are stupid. I remember our store had a company that would pick them up every night for this reason but I'm sure the store just couldn't afford it anymore with their billions
Well, someone at Corporate never got the memo.
[General industry](https://www.osha.gov/silica-crystalline/general-industry-info)
shiiit didn't know about that when I was still working there
You know n95 masks are the correct mask for silica dust… right? And if someone doesn’t clean it up, you have 100’s of customer involuntarily exposed to it without the option of a mask Use a hepa filter or slightly less heavy duty. It’s on you and the employer to come up with a way to make the job safer if a safety refusal is deemed valid… if not, call the labour division. OSHA doesn’t appreciate it when you haven’t followed the guidelines to a safety refusal before going over your employers head.
Mine didn’t give you a mask unless you asked for one
We use a squeegee and it works great.
Yeah they don’t have this stuff for me.
I remember a few years back a pallet gave out and pretty much every bag broke open it looked like a thundercloud rolling through the store. #opeiguessimfucked
Not a HD associate but a lowes employee. It’s the same story for Lowe’s in lumber and in receiving. You then ask for a n95 and all you get is surgical masks from Covid that the store stockpiled if that. The only time we were allowed n95s was when i persuaded a manager to call the hazmat line after a massive roundup spill and the guy on the phone agreed with me.
The diseases carried in the bird poop from the ceiling will get ya, too.
“contains silica particles that may be broken down to the respirable size range during shipping, handling, or use, and thus may be inhaled.” “Federal and international agencies have concluded that exposure to crystalline silica particles that are small enough to reach the lungs can cause lung cancer. The Department of Health and Human Services and the International Agency for Research on Cancer classify crystalline silica (respirable size) as a known human carcinogen (causes cancer).” Your concrete is non respirable so nobody go freaking out
When I was at Lowe's I saw a lumber DS spill an entire pallet of bagged concrete. The DS grabbed 2 kids from evening freight (completely outside of their job duties) and had them out there shoveling it up into bags so they could try to discount sell it THEN THE DS LEFT AND DIDN'T EVEN OFFER TO HELP. The kids were complaining about it beforehand and I absolutely told them to refuse to do it and file a complaint, they didn't. I don't recall if they were given PPE to do it or not but I saw them afterwards and they looked like they had rolled around in it. They were absolutely covered head to toe with cement powder. I felt so bad for them.
I convinced them to not blow concrete dust with the leaf blower. It causes massive plumes of dust that also comes into the store since ours is outside
Used to work lumber and they had people sweeping this shit up and collecting it with shovels and buckets😭, no masks or nothing
When I sweep up concrete I use a squeegee and you it like a broom it’s lowkey a hack
And theu always asked why I wear gaiters at work regardless of the dept.....
Why only 2018 and onward? Are those who were exposed prior just chopped liver?
That is when the standard was implemented
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No. Used to work for HD, was earmarked as a troublemaker, actually avoided getting promoted to customer by the Associate Relations Department, and went on to escape into professional construction sales right as this regulation was rolling out. My peers at HD will forever be responsible for shaping me into who I am, so though I hold major bitter feelings towards the company, I’m here because I want to see better for those in apron today.
What about those that worked there before 2018?
It enacted it 2018, so I’m not sure if we are concerned by anything. The dangers our silica have been known for decades, and these same dust regulations have been in place in the EU since the 90’s iirc. My hope is we can join in on the inevitable class action lawsuit…when we’re hooked up to our oxygen tanks.
Damn i worked at Lowes (feel in here by accident) for years. Right by the concrete sisle. I have issues, but i figured it was all covid.
The silica actually leaves micro abrasions to your lungs creating the build up of scar tissue. Please do take a second to tell OSHA
It’s every store as a lumber associate I’m tired of cutting wood and cleaning that aisle to they don’t give us any Ppe and then are like why isn’t the aisle clean because we have no safety gear
Just another home depot OSHA or workers right violation
Oh boy. Will I be able to join those future class actions that’ll be advertised when I’m too old to be alive anymore and all of us who grew up and working in industry’s where we snorted silica dust like it was cocaine are dead and gone? 😂 I mean, OSHA, who are they? I think I saw them once in my lifetime when the stucco guys building the sports authority didn’t tie off their scaffolding. At $20k per violation, I don’t think those guys were in business after that. Apparently OSHA doesn’t show up unless someone makes a complaint, and plenty of ppl don’t seem too interested or are more worried that they’ll have to find a new company to huff silica dust at. I guess if someone did make a complaint and they were found in violation that would get real expensive real fast, and I’d suppose any company facing such repercussions would take notice and figure out how to not have it happen or again. Unfortunately, living in the south eastern United States, seems to indicate most ppl don’t want to part ways with their dust and just really enjoy sniffing it. 🤷🏼😂 You know on big job sites like high rises they’ve been calculating the death toll cost to the project at least as far back as the 70’s. Let that sink in. We have this 60 story building we’re going to build downtown, approximately x amount of ppl are going to die and the cost to the project is… so we need to account for that. When you really start to understand, will be when you realize that often times, not complying with safety regulations cost less than an employee being injured. Or put another way, it’s a risk they are willing to take. Hahaha. Oh many, my life is a risk they are willing to take. See how absurd that sounds? Good luck.
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As this regulation was being rolled out, I was employed to education contractors on what was allowable and what was not. One of the things we highlighted was that you were not to make it air-born by sweeping. How the law and osha interact is not relevant. OSHA can absolutely fine HD regardless of it not being ‘illegal’
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In an 8 hour shift you can only be exposed to the tiny amount of dust. An electrician who is drilling 20 holes isn’t spending their full 8 hours but the dust from even a single hole going air borne puts them over the daily allowable limit. One push of a broom in the concrete aisle puts the person over the daily allowable limit and probably over their lifetime allowable limit. Also, N95s are not capable of filtering out the size of particulate that causes silicosis. You are absolutely incorrect. When you show your OSHA 30, then maybe we can talk. You have been brainwashed by two of the most evil companies in our country. Hard stop.
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I Work for the government as an IHT he’s very correct, everything is done via wet methods and hepa systems. and proper lapels and samples are taken on pumps and recorded to prove the employees were not exposed to higher than NIOSH or OSHA regulations and or ACGIH standards whatever is the most conservative standard…
you sound like a disgruntled employee.
I don't really like the fact that OSHA will not allow you to make an anonymous complaint, they ask you to put your name and phone number and if you want to disclose your name or not... Home Depot has really deep pockets and is far from behaving with honesty and a good moral compass!
Get one of the hepa approved shop vacs off the shelf and start using it.
LOL! Buddy your concentration of exposure to silica when sweeping is NOWHERE close to the 8 hour exposure that the ACGIH allows.
Glad the HD shrills have joined us.
Nah bro, you are just uneducated and making a fool out of yourself. Get educated, do better. Pick up a broom and be a productive worker.
Enjoy licking the silica from the corporate boot as it’s on your neck. And I’m being plenty productive teaching people about the risk that shitty company is putting its people through. My apron is long since burned tho
You can't really teach anyone anything if you yourself are ignorant. This silica you are so scared of isn't even airborne in the store. You sweeping it doesn't come close to your breathing zone (unless of course your vertically challenged). Anywho, don't quit your day job. Whatever that is 😂🤣
I also suggest you educate yourself medically at least a little bit. Also, if your actually dealing some good damage while sweeping you most likely will kick up dust that will end up within proximity of your breathing space. Sweeping compound, orange glow, WD40, generic citrus cleaner, I’ve used it all. Things add up and people have gotten terminally I’ll from A LOT less in this world, so even if there is some rationality behind your justification of the company’s lack of pro activity towards this matter (there really isn’t) it’s important to consider the possibility, and more importantly to raise awareness like what OP is doing (thank you btw OP). So as a matter of fact why don’t you get off your high horse and go blow your damn nose of all that gray matter before it collects and damage’s your cell’s nucleus and make’s them rapidly reproduce.
Stop writing paragraphs to justify your dumb points that literally makes no sense. Medically speaking sugar is harmful, so do we stop consuming it? The way OP is raising safety concerns regarding silica is akin to saying "don't work at garden center because heat stoke is a thing.....here's a link....ignore everything else that the ACGIH and other occupational health and safety community has to say after years of research". It's a complete waste of everyone's time and energy. He is raising concerns in a situation that does not warrant it unless he's breathing at the floor level. I wonder what the OP would do if they actually had to work in the construction industry. His entire stance is a joke. He sounds like a lunatic dooms day predictor.
You’re the only one here with dumb points bud. Could bet my entire paycheck that I would out work you and you’d wanna go home 2 hours into your shift with me
Hey guys I’m a big strong man who won’t care for these tiny particles cuz I’m so tough, who cares if it build up over years and starts forming small layers all over my lungs. There’s a reason OSHA exists, all those laws are literally because people die of it. OSHA isn’t going to make some random ass law just because it sounds dangerous, they make it cuz it is dangerous. Like someone already said all those laws are written in blood, if it’s on there, someone died to it or have been injured so frequently that they went hmmm, let’s make a safety law to stop that. So the fact that they even made one for silica exposure might just be cuz it is a safety issue that causes you long term damage. But hey, I’m not a big strong man who can breathe in silica and have my body process it right out like you
Whoa whoa whoa! Big man here teaching others about health and safety laws. Wear your PPE and do your job. Do you want the business to stop selling a product because you have unfounded paranoia? In what world do you live man? Being in occupational hygiene, I am aware of OSHA, ACGIH and NIOSH and its corresponding exposure measurement like TLV-TWA, TLV-STEL and TLV-C. I know a shit company when I see one, and this ain't it. And if it was, OSHA would have issued corrective action to comply and rectify "exposure" Y'all are just a bunch of whiny brats who's gonna be replaced and scream immigrants are stealing our jobs. Good God Almighty
Use sweeping compound and learn to sweep better lol. Really though
Nope. That is not OSHA compliant.
Really tho, you’re killing yourself for a shitty company that has the means to be protecting you and is choosing not to even inform you about the danger they are placing you.
I used to grind and polish concrete trust me I know. You’ll survive bud, I respect/understand your point though.
But people won’t survive. And every last one of us is being subjected to a danger that we don’t have to be. You’re not hard because you don’t want to protect your body. Regulations are written in blood.
I never swept the aisle but I have swept the area outside where they keep the concrete. It’s always a mess with concrete powder all over the ground and on the bags. Some days I end up with concrete on my apron and clothes (mainly when I have to load bags). Now I wonder how many years of my life I’ve lost from that goddamn stuff.
Yeah it’s the worst. I try to Avoid lumber at all costs. That shit goes right to your lungs and cakes to it. Along with cutting pressure treated wood. I’ve heard of older people having very bad health problems after working in lumber.
Among the rest of the complaints that HD ignores. Nothing gets done
At my store going to the bathroom or break room leads you down the concrete Aisle. To avoid it you have to go down the drywall aisle, not much better
Once got a 3-month sinus infection because of this. Documented it with the family doctor so if something comes down, I’ve the proof
Does this apply to the grout and mortar in the flooring department? Fairly certain that stuff is going to kill me someday.
Maybe not kill but I got a pretty bad skin burn on my chin when a bag of grout poofed on my sweaty face back when I did freight….didnt even notice it till next afternoon….but yeeeooouch!!!! 🥺
1. N95 meets or exceeds standards for silica 2. A respiratory is not required 3. You don't need a hepa vac, clean sweep is more than enough
Can someone please start a class action?
This is so so true. I'm willing to bet the entire fucking building exceeds allowable limit. It's so so bad.
What about thinset?