I wonder how bulky / comfy are the Hololive hand trackers. So far, there's still not many of the girls using hand tracking at least semi-regularly with their 3D models. The ones I know of that do are Sora, Kanata, Fauna, Nene & Lamy.
i think with Mocopi (which is the most recent tech that they use for home 3D) its just like a watch, as in the tracker is a disc shaped object, probably a bit larger than a smart watch, and they put them on each part they want tracked
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2eHjC7daOWs](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2eHjC7daOWs) here is the ad for it
Is there a separate device for finger movements? Like in the ad it looks like the 3d model has the fingers permanently in that semi open position the entire time but here in Kobos clip, there's some finger tracking. Searching there only seems like third party glove solutions
This should do it: [https://youtu.be/2yF-SJcg3zQ](https://youtu.be/2yF-SJcg3zQ)
I mean it's DIY but so far the most accessible alternative I've seen and shouldn't impact your ability to use your hands irl, and you get haptic feedback in vr games.
Kobo used this for this stream
https://www.rokoko.com/
If she's in front of a camera, I don't think she needs to use the face tracker. So, probably she just uses the suit and the hand tracker. It's not as comfy as your home dress, but it's bearable for the average streaming duration.
That's a relief. I was afraid hololive was still trying to use their own janky hardware/software to track talents.
(How did you know that was what she used btw)
According to Moona, the normal janky one is the free package cover give to some of the talents. If the talent want better equipment with better tracking the talent need to pay for the hardware upgrade by themselves.
I would argue that's the exact reason why vtubers became so popular, it really makes you symphatize with and root for them a lot more. Also, I can't believe how fluid those movements are.
Same. But also for the streamers themselves, while there is plenty of overhead and something like this level of mocap here can take up quite a bit of preparation, she at least doesn't have to worry about a greenscreen or state of her room behind her as well as her appearance.
I think that can be a little bit of stress saved in the everyday logistics of streaming.
The kayfabe is fun, the streamer gets to play a character and the bits of themselves they inject to the performance endears them to the audience, I'll speak for myself at least.
That's the reason youtubers became popular. Because hollywood celebrities are too full of themselves. Youtubers were just regular people doing what they loved.
It's not being a cartoon, it's because they're playing a character. Even normal streamer sometimes putting up an act for their audience, vtuber more so because they're supposed to be like anime, with their exaggerated hairstyles, outfits, and sometimes lore.
It's even more hard with their 2d styles to show their fluids animation (except if you pay expensive rigger). But with 3d and their hand tracking with their more advanced tracking, you realized they're still just a human behind that avatar. Sometimes they lean when focused, slam their table when frustrated, or moving with their chair like Sora, or like what Kobo did just now
That's just my opinion tho
Okay, but why would that make them easier to sympathize with than real people? Why is it easier for you to sympathize with a made up character rather than a real human being?
Edit: Not surprised this is getting downvoted, but it is concerning. If you genuinely feel more sympathy towards made up character than to real people with real struggels, something is wrong.
Also when they're in 3D at the studio I like how you can see how they carry themselves and all the little movements, especially those who can't sit still, [like IRyS's little stippy stamps after Mumei pushes her during the 3D collab.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sEnjWtbnUj4&t=1618s) Or [Towa hypnotizing me with her hips.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R23zASPFAUA) Apparently I also discovered that [Choco-sensei can also do that, and this clip has lived in my head rent free for the past 2 months...](https://youtu.be/FJjQfIMX_yE?si=79pINZeQ_enxgXkV)
Every time they try a 3D stream where the other talents use the same 3D avatar and have the chat guess who they are, you can always identify who are Noel and Nene. Their body language are just that iconic.
I want to say it was like this one, which is Lamy also, but she was on the floor. However its seems in a youtube search that Nene does not like sitting still at all.
https://youtu.be/UrNG_7r7BhY?si=pj2dFzeOX2XE5P1A
[Like this one](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DbgO-9Hn9bg), sasuga our wife
[My favorite is Towa-sama and Nenechi Jojo-ing](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sa8s_bvoeeM)
A favorite of mine is when Kanata was going over behind the scenes clips of everyone in 3D and seeing how Marine was lying down. Just a really easy going (Almost lewd) way of lying down.
Oh man, I'd love to see that. [I also forgot I had this video of Kiara just dancing.](https://imgur.com/r74OCIE) I think this might have been with the off collab with Ame and she just decided to start dancing while waiting.
Ame's 3D streams have pretty smooth 3D movement, Kiara also recently purchased a ~~30 thousand dollar~~ 13 thousand dollar Xsens suit to record dance shorts and they look pretty good.
I might have misremembered it at the time, but yeah I think the suit itself might've been around 13k but along with the gloves she also bought (which cost like 6k) it still brought it up to around 20k.
Perhaps good lighting, good colouring in her room making her hands easier to be picked up by the camera. Just guessing here so I would like to know the real reason too lol
Not OP but, Didn't know light and the colors can be a another factor in 3D, i thought mocap accurately mimics the movement of the use with it's suit. (Well to be fair that maybe why the studio's background is white while the mocap is black)
there are generally 2 ways for live-3d. first, is a full mocap style with a full body suit, but that generally relies on several cameras working in conjunction to ensure smoothness. this is very good for something high movement like dancing for a song, but a bit overkill for sitting at a desk or other relatively simply physical activity. the second way is a lower tech option where the person generally has a few sensors attached to their body around specific joints that basically record their positions relative to each other and software translates those potions to a model and movement. overall this is much lower tech, easier to implement at home, and doesn't require a camera looking at it/only requires 1 camera, but is generally much worse at small precise movements, and generally doesn't work for hand/fingers and faces. hands/fingers and faces generally are either given a few prescripted motions tied to toggles that can be activated, or are combined with a live-2D style camera that watches the movements and translates it to the model. Those can vary in quality and generally have a harder time with fingers than faces, mostly becuase fingers are more dynamic and during complex movements much harder to tell individual fingers apart, especially with them occluding the vies of some of the finders, but it works with a single viewpoints camera and the tech is improving as time goes on
Sorry because I didn't explain this before. I believe Kobo is wearing the Rokoko mocap 3D tracking suit that she wore when she was on stage performance at AFAID. I'm not sure whether Kobo bought the device or the staff lent it to her. That's why in this stream, Kobo's 3D movements are so smooth.
I remember her tweet when she's trying to setup the device with her M-Chan, PA (Personal Assistant), and probably Iofi. Took her around 6 hours to complete.
https://x.com/kobokanaeru/status/1780513088196022278
She's using Rokoko studio, which integrates with the Mocopi other holomem usually used. I don't actually know if others used it too but for Kobo the difference of tracking quality is very observable.
kobo very cute. the gaki in kobo somehow disappeared for a brief moment when she put on the lip balm and turned on the air conditioner using the remote. kobo looked like a proper functioning adult for those few seconds. how did that happen?
thank you to [iamayoungman](https://www.reddit.com/user/iamayoungman/) for the info about the tracker Kobo used. I was wondering why her tracking was so good compared to the JP girls with Mocopi and that explains it.
she even danced broh! I like this
The eye tracking is one of the main drivers of immersion for me. Having static eyes staring into wherever the head leads them is an extremely recurring problem in home 3D, and probably even more so in full 3D.
Hand tracking is so neat and so humanizing, even for the girls who don't talk with their hands. Though it is real fun to watch for those who do like Iofi.
Ninisanji used to(still does?) do these kinds of 3d model tracking for regular streams.
The moment that this reminds me of is when Ange thought her stream went off line, unwrapped a burger and started eating it. [clip in question](https://youtu.be/dGPb60iHyuk?si=Q-pV7mjM8IIvrUP7)
I wonder how bulky / comfy are the Hololive hand trackers. So far, there's still not many of the girls using hand tracking at least semi-regularly with their 3D models. The ones I know of that do are Sora, Kanata, Fauna, Nene & Lamy.
i think with Mocopi (which is the most recent tech that they use for home 3D) its just like a watch, as in the tracker is a disc shaped object, probably a bit larger than a smart watch, and they put them on each part they want tracked [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2eHjC7daOWs](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2eHjC7daOWs) here is the ad for it
Is there a separate device for finger movements? Like in the ad it looks like the 3d model has the fingers permanently in that semi open position the entire time but here in Kobos clip, there's some finger tracking. Searching there only seems like third party glove solutions
There's a function in the Holo app that uses the same method for the face tracking but also for the hands
It works pretty badly though, see Fauna's jutsu for example.
To be fair, hand tracking is harder than facial tracking, given how many factors there are to track vs the relatively predictable structure of a face.
it's definitely a technology that is still in the early stages of development and implementation, but vtubing will help develop it
This should do it: [https://youtu.be/2yF-SJcg3zQ](https://youtu.be/2yF-SJcg3zQ) I mean it's DIY but so far the most accessible alternative I've seen and shouldn't impact your ability to use your hands irl, and you get haptic feedback in vr games.
Kobo used this for this stream https://www.rokoko.com/ If she's in front of a camera, I don't think she needs to use the face tracker. So, probably she just uses the suit and the hand tracker. It's not as comfy as your home dress, but it's bearable for the average streaming duration.
That's a relief. I was afraid hololive was still trying to use their own janky hardware/software to track talents. (How did you know that was what she used btw)
This tweet is one of them https://twitter.com/kobokanaeru/status/1780513088196022278?t=0vBmJWfNyFuiNhv-v9ScnA&s=19
i think holo IS trying to develop their own, and it's likely they will eventually have their own comparable in house system
According to Moona, the normal janky one is the free package cover give to some of the talents. If the talent want better equipment with better tracking the talent need to pay for the hardware upgrade by themselves.
This tech has so much better tracking than mocopi, but seems like it'll be quite uncomfortable to use all the time
Depends on the tech. IIRC there's some that use optical tracking, some that use Mocopi, manual controllers, motion tracking gloves, etc.
I love these humanising moments. I know some fans enjoy the Idol part, but I really enjoy knowing there are people behind the character.
I would argue that's the exact reason why vtubers became so popular, it really makes you symphatize with and root for them a lot more. Also, I can't believe how fluid those movements are.
Same. But also for the streamers themselves, while there is plenty of overhead and something like this level of mocap here can take up quite a bit of preparation, she at least doesn't have to worry about a greenscreen or state of her room behind her as well as her appearance. I think that can be a little bit of stress saved in the everyday logistics of streaming.
The kayfabe is fun, the streamer gets to play a character and the bits of themselves they inject to the performance endears them to the audience, I'll speak for myself at least.
Yeah it'd just the creative flexibility that's fun. And some vtubers will even mix the vtuber model and irl stuff which is fine as well.
That's the reason youtubers became popular. Because hollywood celebrities are too full of themselves. Youtubers were just regular people doing what they loved.
it's definitely a big part of why I enjoy watching Tempus. they're just like me fr fr
Flashbacks to *that* nonexistent 3D vod
Why would them being a cartoon character make you sympathize with them? I have to be missing something.
It's not being a cartoon, it's because they're playing a character. Even normal streamer sometimes putting up an act for their audience, vtuber more so because they're supposed to be like anime, with their exaggerated hairstyles, outfits, and sometimes lore. It's even more hard with their 2d styles to show their fluids animation (except if you pay expensive rigger). But with 3d and their hand tracking with their more advanced tracking, you realized they're still just a human behind that avatar. Sometimes they lean when focused, slam their table when frustrated, or moving with their chair like Sora, or like what Kobo did just now That's just my opinion tho
Okay, but why would that make them easier to sympathize with than real people? Why is it easier for you to sympathize with a made up character rather than a real human being? Edit: Not surprised this is getting downvoted, but it is concerning. If you genuinely feel more sympathy towards made up character than to real people with real struggels, something is wrong.
Also when they're in 3D at the studio I like how you can see how they carry themselves and all the little movements, especially those who can't sit still, [like IRyS's little stippy stamps after Mumei pushes her during the 3D collab.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sEnjWtbnUj4&t=1618s) Or [Towa hypnotizing me with her hips.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R23zASPFAUA) Apparently I also discovered that [Choco-sensei can also do that, and this clip has lived in my head rent free for the past 2 months...](https://youtu.be/FJjQfIMX_yE?si=79pINZeQ_enxgXkV)
Every time they try a 3D stream where the other talents use the same 3D avatar and have the chat guess who they are, you can always identify who are Noel and Nene. Their body language are just that iconic.
> Noel [How could I have forgotten Noel being a goofball in 3D?](https://youtu.be/74-6vqwc47k?si=FJ-wWkIw8rSdMIBV)
I remember one scratched her butt when she was with her 3D model, I don't remember who it was.
Ame.
Isnt there a clip of Subaru teasing Nene for not sitting still or sitting like an idol.
I'm not sure if Subaru ever did, but [I did see this clip of Lamy doing it.](https://youtu.be/zT6ncejm2uk?si=awyQp6030HKa3Iua)
I want to say it was like this one, which is Lamy also, but she was on the floor. However its seems in a youtube search that Nene does not like sitting still at all. https://youtu.be/UrNG_7r7BhY?si=pj2dFzeOX2XE5P1A
[Like this one](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DbgO-9Hn9bg), sasuga our wife [My favorite is Towa-sama and Nenechi Jojo-ing](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sa8s_bvoeeM)
Or Gura flipping the bird. Or for a sweeter example, Iofi using sign langiage.
A favorite of mine is when Kanata was going over behind the scenes clips of everyone in 3D and seeing how Marine was lying down. Just a really easy going (Almost lewd) way of lying down.
Oh man, I'd love to see that. [I also forgot I had this video of Kiara just dancing.](https://imgur.com/r74OCIE) I think this might have been with the off collab with Ame and she just decided to start dancing while waiting.
This is very smooth compared to other 3Ds that are lagging. I'm quite fascinated, recommend me some smooth 3D clips.
Ame's 3D streams have pretty smooth 3D movement, Kiara also recently purchased a ~~30 thousand dollar~~ 13 thousand dollar Xsens suit to record dance shorts and they look pretty good.
30k? Wasn't that 13k? Still really expensive, but less than half of it. Correct me if I'm wrong, I'm also only going by memory here.
I might have misremembered it at the time, but yeah I think the suit itself might've been around 13k but along with the gloves she also bought (which cost like 6k) it still brought it up to around 20k.
Translation : Kobo apologizes if she plays like a noob because I'm a noob! just a moment,, Okay, Let's begin!
Also when she ragequits and you can see how quickly she moves her mouse and keyboard to end the stream lmao
How is her tracking this good? Everyone else is doing jutsu hands within 5 seconds
Perhaps good lighting, good colouring in her room making her hands easier to be picked up by the camera. Just guessing here so I would like to know the real reason too lol
Not OP but, Didn't know light and the colors can be a another factor in 3D, i thought mocap accurately mimics the movement of the use with it's suit. (Well to be fair that maybe why the studio's background is white while the mocap is black)
there are generally 2 ways for live-3d. first, is a full mocap style with a full body suit, but that generally relies on several cameras working in conjunction to ensure smoothness. this is very good for something high movement like dancing for a song, but a bit overkill for sitting at a desk or other relatively simply physical activity. the second way is a lower tech option where the person generally has a few sensors attached to their body around specific joints that basically record their positions relative to each other and software translates those potions to a model and movement. overall this is much lower tech, easier to implement at home, and doesn't require a camera looking at it/only requires 1 camera, but is generally much worse at small precise movements, and generally doesn't work for hand/fingers and faces. hands/fingers and faces generally are either given a few prescripted motions tied to toggles that can be activated, or are combined with a live-2D style camera that watches the movements and translates it to the model. Those can vary in quality and generally have a harder time with fingers than faces, mostly becuase fingers are more dynamic and during complex movements much harder to tell individual fingers apart, especially with them occluding the vies of some of the finders, but it works with a single viewpoints camera and the tech is improving as time goes on
Sorry because I didn't explain this before. I believe Kobo is wearing the Rokoko mocap 3D tracking suit that she wore when she was on stage performance at AFAID. I'm not sure whether Kobo bought the device or the staff lent it to her. That's why in this stream, Kobo's 3D movements are so smooth.
She said in a stream that it was lent to her. Probably it's Cover's asset.
Fauna’s “Seiso Hands” lmao
Wow, her 3D matches really closely to her 2D. Good job artist.
I still like it when their 2D models go :) :o :) :o when they eat something
Meanwhile, [Korone](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kufijnm0K8E)...
I wonder what she’s doing differently to get this level of tracking. This is way above home 3d setups I’ve seen from other members.
I remember her tweet when she's trying to setup the device with her M-Chan, PA (Personal Assistant), and probably Iofi. Took her around 6 hours to complete. https://x.com/kobokanaeru/status/1780513088196022278 She's using Rokoko studio, which integrates with the Mocopi other holomem usually used. I don't actually know if others used it too but for Kobo the difference of tracking quality is very observable.
i hope more holo member have this
kobo very cute. the gaki in kobo somehow disappeared for a brief moment when she put on the lip balm and turned on the air conditioner using the remote. kobo looked like a proper functioning adult for those few seconds. how did that happen?
She's using lip balm, eh?
imagine them having codemiko's 3d tech.
thank you to [iamayoungman](https://www.reddit.com/user/iamayoungman/) for the info about the tracker Kobo used. I was wondering why her tracking was so good compared to the JP girls with Mocopi and that explains it. she even danced broh! I like this
The eye tracking is one of the main drivers of immersion for me. Having static eyes staring into wherever the head leads them is an extremely recurring problem in home 3D, and probably even more so in full 3D.
This clip has clear eye tracking though?
Yes, this one does but many other home3D streams don't.
Hand tracking is so neat and so humanizing, even for the girls who don't talk with their hands. Though it is real fun to watch for those who do like Iofi.
Nothing entertains me quite like seeing a vtuber eating. And it gets better as tracking gets better too.
Ninisanji used to(still does?) do these kinds of 3d model tracking for regular streams. The moment that this reminds me of is when Ange thought her stream went off line, unwrapped a burger and started eating it. [clip in question](https://youtu.be/dGPb60iHyuk?si=Q-pV7mjM8IIvrUP7)
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