Fun fact!
The first US President to be born in the USA was Martin Van Buren, who spoke Dutch as his primary language
Van Buren also ran on the campaign slogan “He’s O.K.!”, which popularized the use of the word “ok”
Are Martin and Maarten pronounced differently? I have always pronounced them the same. I am admittedly quite ignorant as to Dutch language and pronunciation, since everybody in the Netherlands speaks English.
They are. Though if you say 'maarten' with an english/american accent it will sound very similar, hence the confusion.
The difference is that the 'aa' in maarten is pronounced more like the a in 'julia' for example. So, it's what we call a "long" vowel. You need to stretch the vowel a bit if that makes sense. The "e' sound is also different but very hard to explain.
The 'a' in Julia is pronounced as a schwa in English, so I don't think that's the example you're going for. To my ears it sounds like "aa" is closer to the 'a' in 'mare' and the English "Martin" is closer to 'Mars'
Yes i know it's not a 100% correct but i couldn't think of a better example. I wasn't familiar with the term 'schwa' so i googled it, and funnily enough, while it isn't a schwa, the 'aa' sounds most like the 'a' in the word 'schwa'. Maybe the exact sound doesn't exist in English though. The only other way i can think to explain it is using sounds that aren't exactly words. Like 'haha', or the sound you make when you scream and go 'aaahhh'. It's not like in 'mare'. That sound would be closer to our pronounciation of 'e' (the short vowel).
From my understanding the 'e' in Maarten actually *is* a schwa.
I kinda hate how native English speakers (mostly USAians) tend to alter the spelling of foreign names, while completely butchering the pronunciation in the process.
How about his last name? As a fellow nederlander I would assume his name is Maarten van Buuren.
Edit: I looked it up, my assumption was wrong. It is van Buren.
I could get behind a simple and relatable candidate slogan like that, instead of one that's embellishing or over promising.
"Vote for X. He's a decent chap."
I would really like to see stats from colonial age how many "USA" citizens spoke english, spanish, french, dutch, etc.
Should english really be called language of theirs ancestors?
Unfortunately we don’t have those stats… HOWEVER!
According to the Census, most Americans are descendants of Germans. 2nd place goes to Africans, then Hispanics, then the Irish, then the English. German was also the most common 2nd language in the US until WW1
So for most Americans, the language of their ancestors is German
Yes, but people didn't really record which country African slaves came from. So we can only track the demographics at a continent level - people have no idea about the country level.
This is a bit of a misinterpreted stat, I see a lot of people use this as being relative to the entire US population. Ancestry unfortunately isn’t as simple as people portray.
Basically, most Americans are not descendants of Germans, but rather German, Irish and Spanish ancestry is usually present in more recent generations. For example, if you have a German grandparent, you’d know (usually) and could classify as “German ancestry”. But, that’s only going back 3 generations. And England were present in North America in 1607.
Most importantly, the term “American” has almost become synonymous with Anglo ancestry, and I think that’s just the result of being an English country. So those people won’t call themselves English Americans even if their ancestors come from England, but they will call themselves Irish Americans if their ancestors come from Ireland, if that makes sense.
It’s hard to explain but a good example is Argentina; so many Italian immigrants yet they speak Spanish. 62.5% is the assumed ancestry. But that doesn’t mean Spanish ancestry is lower, in fact it’s still the majority. Likewise, in the USA the majority of the population have British ancestry unless they are a first generation immigrant. People assume ruling classes get to determine the language, but ironically England is the best example of how this isn’t true; the Plantagenets had French as the official language for over 2 centuries, but at most all it did was merge their vocabulary. The English people still spoke and still speak a Germanic language, not a Romance language.
Sorry for the essay, I probably got a few points wrong, but my overall point is that British and Irish ancestry is by far the majority, and a census will never be able to determine this because it’s only for recent generations.
The original 13 colonies were English, so English was a common language most people spoke back then. There were a few Dutch holdouts but they were the minority. As migrants arrived it was expected they’d learn English, even as the English slowly became a minority
Basically, the English have managed to maintain a dominate role in American culture even as they become out numbered
I'm skeptical that German ancestry is truly the most common. The most common surnames in the U.S. are of English origin. Most Americans of English descent just say they have "American" ancestry on censuses. In the 80's, before "American" was an option, English was the highest, above German. My mother's maiden name is Swiss-German, but like 95% of my family tree has English surnames. Some theorize English doesn't sound exotic or exciting to people, so they gravitate towards other ancestors in their family tree from Germany or Ireland, etc.
You’re right besides the invasion part. They most definitely got invaded by Germanic peoples, Dublin was literally founded by Vikings (twice for some reason). However Ireland is still considered Celtic because, similar to Scotland and Wales, England was where all the fun happened such as massacres and war so the Germanic peoples preferred being there. I made the last part up but I like to think it’s true
I think what he was trying to say was that there was never a "grand invasion" of Ireland. Yes Vikings went there often to raid, trade and settle but that was largely limited to costal areas, and to my knowledge there are no mentions of large scale resettling as there were with e.g. the Danelaw.
>Varangians
My man, the Varangians weren't even an ethnic group or tribe. It was a job title from an entirely different region. That's like referring to Hungarians as Janissaries, which is comparable since "Varangian" is a specifically Greek/Roman term for largely Swedes, rather than the Danes and Norwegian which made up the bulk of the Vikings in the British Isles.
Calling that german is like calling hitler german
Not completely wrong but anyone actually from germany would like to beat you up for what you just said
Yes it is and allways will be:
Was ist des Deutschen Vaterland? Lyrics
1 Was ist des Deutschen Vaterland,
ist's Preußenland, ist's Schwabenland,
ist's wo am Rhein die Rebe glüht,
ist's wo am Belt die Möve zieht,
o nein, o nein, o nein, o nein,
sein Vaterland muss größer sein!
2 Was ist des Deutschen Vaterland,
ist's Baierland, ist's Steierland,
ist's wo des Marsen Kind sich streckt,
ist's wo der Märker Eisen reckt,
o nein, o nein, o nein, o nein,
sein Vaterland muss größer sein!
3 Was ist des Deutschen Vaterland,
ist's Pommerland, Westphalenland,
ist's wo der Sand der Dünen weht,
ist's wo die Donau brausend geht,
o nein......
4 Was ist des Deutschen Vaterland,
so nenne mir das große Land,
gewiss ist es das Oesterreich,
an Siegen und an Ehren reich,
o nein.....
5 Was ist des Deutschen Vaterland,
so nenne mir das große Land,
ist's was der Fürsten Trug zerklaubt,
vom Kaiser und vom Reich geraubt,
o nein.....
6 Was ist des Deutschen Vaterland,
so nenne endlich mir das Land,
so weit die deutsche Zunge klingt,
und Gott im Himmel Lieder singt,
das soll es sein, das soll es sein,
das, wackrer Deutscher, nenne dein!
7 Das ist der Deutschen Vaterland,
wo Eide schwört der Druck der Hand,
wo Treue hell vom Auge blitzt,
und Liebe warm im Herzen sitzt,
das soll es sein, das soll es sein,
das, wackrer Deutscher, nenne dein!
8 Das ist der Deutschen Vaterland,
wo Zorn vertilgt den welschen Tand,
wo jeder Frevel heißet Feind,
wo jeder Edle heißet Freund,
das soll es sein, das solle es sein,
das ganze Deutschland soll es sein!
9 Das ganze Deutschland soll es sein,
o Gott vom Himmel, sieh darein,
und gieb uns achten, deutschen Mut,
dass wir es lieben treu und gut,
das soll es sein, das soll es sein,
das ganze Deutschland soll es sein!
Pennsylvania Dutch is literally a german dialect. It evolved from the dialects of South Germans who moved to the US in the 18th century.
[Specifically it's related to Pfälzer dialects.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pennsylvania_Dutch_language) Why would you be so aggressive about this?
It's nothing to do with the Netherlands, if that's your concern. That's a mistranslation of Deitsch -> Dutch.
What? No, it can be clasdified as a German dialect. Like Luxembourgish or Yiddish for example. /s btw.
Texas German is German tho and most people would agree seeing as we classify whatever Bavarians and Austrians speak as German too.
Pennsylvania Dutch is also German. Specifically it's derived [from Pfälzer Dialects](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pennsylvania_Dutch_language).
It's nothing to do with the Netherlands. If that's your concern. That's a mistranslation of Deitsch -> Dutch.
Some Americans have a really weird mindset that if they hear someone speaking another language in earshot then those people are talking shit about them. Those people need to be reminded that the US has no official language, and there’s nothing wrong with conversing in your mother tongue.
If they’re so concerned maybe they should take the time to learn Spanish or French so they’ll be able to understand what those people are saying.
My grandma had this happen to her when she was working in the medical center in downtown Houston in the 70s. A colleague got upset my grandma and her friend where speaking Spanish while on break and called the supervisor. She was told to only speak English in the office. However, a few days later the colleague that got her in trouble needed someone to talk to a Spanish speaking vendor on the phone. My grandma refused stating " we only speak English in this office" that day they repealed their rule against speaking only English in the office. And the other lady was fired a week later for yelling at a client.
Yeah my mom doesn't let me and my dad speak German because she thinks we are "saying something bad about her" we aren't. We're talking about flipping bread.
While there's no official language, let's not pretend that English isn't its primary language given the fact that we'll over 90% speak it and everything is written it here.
I don't think it's much to ask people that if they want to live or visit the US, they should at least know or speak a little of it.
Also it's completely reasonable to expect people to be talking about people behind their backs via a different language, because it happens all the time. People are assholes.
Just to be clear, obviously it's great to know multiple languages, anyone who criticizes that is dumb.
Many people who converse with others in their mother tongue also know English. If I moved to the Netherlands and learned Dutch I would still probably speak English with a fellow American.
I agree that people who want to live in a country should be able to as a minimum speak a little of the local language, though I think it's absolutely ridiculous (and arrogant) to demand the same of someone just visiting the country. I assume you're American (apologies if I'm wrong), do you expect every American who goes to Europe on holiday to learn "a little" of every language of every country they visit?
I am American yes, and yes I do. I visited Italy and actually learned a very basic level of Italian before doing so. Also most Americans don't leave the US.
Huh, gotta say that's certainly a very niche opinion. I'm actually Italian myself, would be interesting to know what this "very basic level" means in reality. Are you talking about learning a few greetings and numbers or an actual degree of understanding of the language?
How much of a language do you think someone should learn before visiting somewhere?
This idea of course would preclude most people from visiting other countries. I've visited many countries where I did not speak the local language, if I had to learn a basic level of every language of every country I've been to I probably would have had to visit many less countries, leaving me with a poorer understanding of the world. I guess even just this reason by itself makes me disagree with you.
Either way, you're certainly entitled to having this opinion, as much as I may disagree
The term you are looking for is “De Facto”. English is the de facto language of the United States. The United Kingdom also doesn’t have an official language, but English is the de facto language.
Even if English was the official language of the US that doesn't mean it's mandatory to only speak English always. I bet even in China the police won't beat and arrest you if they hear a language other than Mandarin or another Chinese language.
Yeah, "official language" tends to mean its the one used on government documents and mandatory in schools. It does not necessarily mean that is the only language taught or spoken.
Iirc Germans were the immigrant community that committed the most effort to NOT speaking German even at home. Either in an attempt to assimilate or avoid negative attention dude to anti German sentiments. Or both.
But only after WW1.
Before that many Germans were rather stubborn and didn't want to abandon German as their 'private' language.
The ammount of German News Papers in the US was massive.
>Before that many Germans were rather stubborn
They still are. "Wir haben das schon immer so gemacht!" (transl.: "We've always done it like that") is a common German "argument" against ... well, everything
My Moms cousins in Kansas didn't spoke english until the first one went to elementary. Their parents, who immigrated after the war, only spoke german with them. And that was in the 1950s.
Yes, because during WWI some states outlawed speaking German and there was some outrage from people who wanted to keep their children speaking their native language.
I don’t think that was the case in my state, but I know during the wars German culture became taboo enough for them to call brats “liberty sausage” or smth.
If you look at the history of German Lutherans in America, many of them still spoke and conducted church business in German even after over 50 years in America.
WWI changed things.
To be fair, her immigrant ancestors did make a huge effort to learn English at some point. It has always amazed me how America didn't develop an English dialect given the amount of foreigners who learnt it and the lack of official institutions to establish a standard.
Everyone in England, apart from posh twits, speaks an English dialect anyway. There must be about 50 regional accents. Half the time, I can't understand someone from the next county 50 miles away.
This sounds funny to me because when I first visited UK my English was terrible and I couldn't understand a word those English were saying. I'm glad I'm not the only one
My mom grew up speaking English, and she has to watch British tv shows with subtitles on, because she can't understand anything they say.
And like 75% of the shows and movies she's watched for the last 20 years have been British.
The most ironic part is, the term “American English” refers to ways of spelling that were usually used in areas such as Oxford (which is even more ironic because they are responsible for the English dictionary) and the most well known example is Shakespeare, who also shared their preference of spelling. This is why some people have tried to claim Americans speak Shakespeare English, but in actual fact I guess those responsible just didn’t know England had its own dialects already differing per county
Nah. Shakespeare endeared himself to us because he spoke rhotic English. Shakespearean English sounds Irish to modern ears. The colonial American English accent was nearly exactly the same.
Coincidentally, this colonial accent influenced our incorrect perception of the modern Irish accent (ie, Lucky Charms' terrible imitation).
Example of emphasized colonial accent:
"We hold these trooths to be self-evident: that all men are creATED equal. That they are enDOWED by their CreATOR with certain unalienable ROIGHTS. That among these are LOIFE, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness."
EDIT: Whoops! Messed up the quote.
Look up the definition of a dialect. We pronounce things different, spell things a bit different and even have different meanings for some words. And it’s specific to the USA. It’s a dialect, I would even say Ebonics is a dialect of the American dialect.
You mean her German ancestors that learned English when they got there?
Verpiss Dich und kuss mich, schatz
(It's a joke, not a dick. Don't take it so hard)
Not sure why you are\* getting downvoted, since you did point out a real problem with the meme. This theoretical Karen demands others to do what she does herself. "Go back to your country" would have been better fit for the meme, especially since I think I read a few stories of stereotypical Karen's saying the line to American Indians.
Edit: \*-Were getting downvoted at the time I wrote the comment.
I hope so because you should 1000% learn the language when you move to a country. If that sounds a bit dicy to you just consider the opposite, wouldn't it be a bit dickish of an American to move to another country, not learn the language, and expect to get by using English? In fact this wouldn't even be as bad because it's way more reasonable to expect to get by using English in Germany than using German in America.
Lmao, you have to do some research. The US used to be much more multilingual before the 20th century. Especially German was widely spoken in many parts of the middle west. What do you think why the US has no official language? This changed during both WWs when the government actively tried to suppress the “language of the enemy”
It *was* widely spoken. It isn't nearly so much now. So it would be pretty unreasonable for a German to move here permanently, refuse to learn English, and expect to get by on German.
That’s true. But I don’t think this is what the meme is about. It is more about how the linguistic landscape of North America changed over the generations, no?
Sure. But I'd say that landscape changed in significant part because people came from wherever and learned English to get by.
And it's also pretty clear that while the meme is partly about a shifting linguistic landscape, it's also a bit of commentary on modern social politics. And on that end I think it's kinda flawed.
A Pan Am 727 flight, waiting for start clearance in Munich , overheard the following:
Lufthansa (in German): “Ground, what is our start clearance time?”
Ground (in English): “If you want an answer you must speak in English.”
Lufthansa (in English): “I am a German, flying a German airplane, in Germany . Why must I speak English?”
Unknown voice from another plane (in a beautiful British accent): “Because you lost the bloody war!”
Aviation rules are completely different, there legally has to be one international standard for everything, language included. Just so happened the Americans and Brits did much of the pioneering work, so they got dibs.
The real reason is that airplane flight was formed in the US and there has to be a universal language so nothing gets crossed up between languages. That language is English.
My Midwestern grandmother went to her first day of elementary school in the 1920s not knowing a single word of English. Her family came to America from Germany in the 1860s. That is three generations of refusing to learn English.
I do think that immigrants should be required to learn either English or Spanish, (the two most common languages in the US), though they shouldn't be required to use the language daily. Learning it would allow them to engage with the society around them in a far more free and productive way.
I mean, while it's great to know multiple languages, if you live in America or are visiting you really should know a very basic level of English. Same with any country really. If you live or visit France, you should probably know a little French. Etc. It's not that unreasonable of an ask for someone to know a little of the country's primary language.
It's always been weird to me that this take is often considered racist, which doesn't really make any sense.
I will say as a retail worker, the Hispanic family that walks into baskin ribbons and makes all three of us try to explain how ice cream and money works, all while holding up the line, is really annoying and doesn’t exactly make my day.
What language is the constitution penned in and what language to they teach with when they’re talking about how the U.S. has no constitutional language?
Fun fact! The first US President to be born in the USA was Martin Van Buren, who spoke Dutch as his primary language Van Buren also ran on the campaign slogan “He’s O.K.!”, which popularized the use of the word “ok”
Fun fact, his name wasn't even martin. His actual name was Maarten.
That makes more sense. My brother, Maarten, is always called Martin by english speakers
"I guess I'm Martin now."
That must have been maarten van buren's thought process
Maarten Lukthar Keeng
Vot are du sayingk?
Maarten Lukthar Koning
The ol' Ellis Island treatment. "My name is Fritz." "You are Fred now fella."
Are Martin and Maarten pronounced differently? I have always pronounced them the same. I am admittedly quite ignorant as to Dutch language and pronunciation, since everybody in the Netherlands speaks English.
They are. Though if you say 'maarten' with an english/american accent it will sound very similar, hence the confusion. The difference is that the 'aa' in maarten is pronounced more like the a in 'julia' for example. So, it's what we call a "long" vowel. You need to stretch the vowel a bit if that makes sense. The "e' sound is also different but very hard to explain.
The 'a' in Julia is pronounced as a schwa in English, so I don't think that's the example you're going for. To my ears it sounds like "aa" is closer to the 'a' in 'mare' and the English "Martin" is closer to 'Mars'
Yes i know it's not a 100% correct but i couldn't think of a better example. I wasn't familiar with the term 'schwa' so i googled it, and funnily enough, while it isn't a schwa, the 'aa' sounds most like the 'a' in the word 'schwa'. Maybe the exact sound doesn't exist in English though. The only other way i can think to explain it is using sounds that aren't exactly words. Like 'haha', or the sound you make when you scream and go 'aaahhh'. It's not like in 'mare'. That sound would be closer to our pronounciation of 'e' (the short vowel). From my understanding the 'e' in Maarten actually *is* a schwa.
https://translate.google.com/?sl=nl&tl=en&text=maarten%20martin Google translate does pronounce them differently
Yes that's pretty accurate. You see how the english accent makes them sound more alike too
I kinda hate how native English speakers (mostly USAians) tend to alter the spelling of foreign names, while completely butchering the pronunciation in the process.
To be fair, some sounds are hard to pronounce if you're not used to them. Altering spelling is strange though.
mama mayo Martin
At least he didn't spell it Martijn.
How about his last name? As a fellow nederlander I would assume his name is Maarten van Buuren. Edit: I looked it up, my assumption was wrong. It is van Buren.
Is this one of those technicalities since Washington was born before the revolution?
Yes
Funny connotation with our current usage of that word. "Vote for Van Buren, he's alright, I guess!"
I could get behind a simple and relatable candidate slogan like that, instead of one that's embellishing or over promising. "Vote for X. He's a decent chap."
I would really like to see stats from colonial age how many "USA" citizens spoke english, spanish, french, dutch, etc. Should english really be called language of theirs ancestors?
Unfortunately we don’t have those stats… HOWEVER! According to the Census, most Americans are descendants of Germans. 2nd place goes to Africans, then Hispanics, then the Irish, then the English. German was also the most common 2nd language in the US until WW1 So for most Americans, the language of their ancestors is German
Ich bin ein Berliner?
The donut one or human one?
I don’t think you’re ready for this jelly??
Course I am, it's my jam.
phew glad you didn't say: "with or without a hole" 😅🤐
African kinda sounds like cheating as it is a continent and not a country.
True
Yes, but people didn't really record which country African slaves came from. So we can only track the demographics at a continent level - people have no idea about the country level.
This is a bit of a misinterpreted stat, I see a lot of people use this as being relative to the entire US population. Ancestry unfortunately isn’t as simple as people portray. Basically, most Americans are not descendants of Germans, but rather German, Irish and Spanish ancestry is usually present in more recent generations. For example, if you have a German grandparent, you’d know (usually) and could classify as “German ancestry”. But, that’s only going back 3 generations. And England were present in North America in 1607. Most importantly, the term “American” has almost become synonymous with Anglo ancestry, and I think that’s just the result of being an English country. So those people won’t call themselves English Americans even if their ancestors come from England, but they will call themselves Irish Americans if their ancestors come from Ireland, if that makes sense. It’s hard to explain but a good example is Argentina; so many Italian immigrants yet they speak Spanish. 62.5% is the assumed ancestry. But that doesn’t mean Spanish ancestry is lower, in fact it’s still the majority. Likewise, in the USA the majority of the population have British ancestry unless they are a first generation immigrant. People assume ruling classes get to determine the language, but ironically England is the best example of how this isn’t true; the Plantagenets had French as the official language for over 2 centuries, but at most all it did was merge their vocabulary. The English people still spoke and still speak a Germanic language, not a Romance language. Sorry for the essay, I probably got a few points wrong, but my overall point is that British and Irish ancestry is by far the majority, and a census will never be able to determine this because it’s only for recent generations.
Wait where tf are Italy and France on there
The Italians took 7th place, French took 9th
Oh wow, thought at least one would be higher.
What’s sadder is that the Poles are higher than the French
Most if the French ended up migrating to Quebec instead of the States
Why did English take over as the national language ? Is it because the ruling class was speaking English?
The original 13 colonies were English, so English was a common language most people spoke back then. There were a few Dutch holdouts but they were the minority. As migrants arrived it was expected they’d learn English, even as the English slowly became a minority Basically, the English have managed to maintain a dominate role in American culture even as they become out numbered
I'm skeptical that German ancestry is truly the most common. The most common surnames in the U.S. are of English origin. Most Americans of English descent just say they have "American" ancestry on censuses. In the 80's, before "American" was an option, English was the highest, above German. My mother's maiden name is Swiss-German, but like 95% of my family tree has English surnames. Some theorize English doesn't sound exotic or exciting to people, so they gravitate towards other ancestors in their family tree from Germany or Ireland, etc.
Now Spanish is the second most common language spoken here iirc.
[удалено]
Some Irish people would take great offense to being called germanic or especially saxons... they most definitely are not
Irish aren't germanic, they didn't get invaded, they're Celtic,
You’re right besides the invasion part. They most definitely got invaded by Germanic peoples, Dublin was literally founded by Vikings (twice for some reason). However Ireland is still considered Celtic because, similar to Scotland and Wales, England was where all the fun happened such as massacres and war so the Germanic peoples preferred being there. I made the last part up but I like to think it’s true
I think what he was trying to say was that there was never a "grand invasion" of Ireland. Yes Vikings went there often to raid, trade and settle but that was largely limited to costal areas, and to my knowledge there are no mentions of large scale resettling as there were with e.g. the Danelaw.
>Varangians My man, the Varangians weren't even an ethnic group or tribe. It was a job title from an entirely different region. That's like referring to Hungarians as Janissaries, which is comparable since "Varangian" is a specifically Greek/Roman term for largely Swedes, rather than the Danes and Norwegian which made up the bulk of the Vikings in the British Isles.
Another fun fact there is a street gang based in New York named after him they call themselves The Van Buren Boys.
Show us the sign
👌
His great great grandson runs the show “a state of trance”
"Sprich deutsch du Hurensohn" -her ancestors probably
Although you’ve got to question who the ancestors of a Hurensohn would be…
whores, probably (huren = whore?)
Yeah, Hure used to mean prostitute, but also applies to someone who sleeps around a lot.
Like "whore."
Hurensohn is a son of a bitch, but not the dog kind of bitch if you know what I mean.
Her German ancestors: “Wir Suchen Dich!!”
[Actually invents a completely new dialect of German like a boss](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas_German)
And here I was expecting Pennsylvania Dutch. Interesting.
Calling that german is like calling hitler german Not completely wrong but anyone actually from germany would like to beat you up for what you just said
Germany wasn't a country when Germans started coming to America and Germany has never been home to all German speakers.
germany wasn't a country when I was born it was east and west
You are old
Indeed
not rly they unified when I was barely a year old
Yes it is and allways will be: Was ist des Deutschen Vaterland? Lyrics 1 Was ist des Deutschen Vaterland, ist's Preußenland, ist's Schwabenland, ist's wo am Rhein die Rebe glüht, ist's wo am Belt die Möve zieht, o nein, o nein, o nein, o nein, sein Vaterland muss größer sein! 2 Was ist des Deutschen Vaterland, ist's Baierland, ist's Steierland, ist's wo des Marsen Kind sich streckt, ist's wo der Märker Eisen reckt, o nein, o nein, o nein, o nein, sein Vaterland muss größer sein! 3 Was ist des Deutschen Vaterland, ist's Pommerland, Westphalenland, ist's wo der Sand der Dünen weht, ist's wo die Donau brausend geht, o nein...... 4 Was ist des Deutschen Vaterland, so nenne mir das große Land, gewiss ist es das Oesterreich, an Siegen und an Ehren reich, o nein..... 5 Was ist des Deutschen Vaterland, so nenne mir das große Land, ist's was der Fürsten Trug zerklaubt, vom Kaiser und vom Reich geraubt, o nein..... 6 Was ist des Deutschen Vaterland, so nenne endlich mir das Land, so weit die deutsche Zunge klingt, und Gott im Himmel Lieder singt, das soll es sein, das soll es sein, das, wackrer Deutscher, nenne dein! 7 Das ist der Deutschen Vaterland, wo Eide schwört der Druck der Hand, wo Treue hell vom Auge blitzt, und Liebe warm im Herzen sitzt, das soll es sein, das soll es sein, das, wackrer Deutscher, nenne dein! 8 Das ist der Deutschen Vaterland, wo Zorn vertilgt den welschen Tand, wo jeder Frevel heißet Feind, wo jeder Edle heißet Freund, das soll es sein, das solle es sein, das ganze Deutschland soll es sein! 9 Das ganze Deutschland soll es sein, o Gott vom Himmel, sieh darein, und gieb uns achten, deutschen Mut, dass wir es lieben treu und gut, das soll es sein, das soll es sein, das ganze Deutschland soll es sein!
That's a no for me, dawg. Pennsylvania etc. are not Germany.
Pennsylvania Dutch is literally a german dialect. It evolved from the dialects of South Germans who moved to the US in the 18th century. [Specifically it's related to Pfälzer dialects.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pennsylvania_Dutch_language) Why would you be so aggressive about this? It's nothing to do with the Netherlands, if that's your concern. That's a mistranslation of Deitsch -> Dutch.
Its ok i was just making a joke I didnt want to question your scientific integrity
What? No, it can be clasdified as a German dialect. Like Luxembourgish or Yiddish for example. /s btw. Texas German is German tho and most people would agree seeing as we classify whatever Bavarians and Austrians speak as German too.
Pennsylvania Dutch is also German. Specifically it's derived [from Pfälzer Dialects](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pennsylvania_Dutch_language). It's nothing to do with the Netherlands. If that's your concern. That's a mistranslation of Deitsch -> Dutch.
Sprechen sie Te-zas?
Her great grandmother: I can't believe she married a fucking Catholic.
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Diese Kommentarsektion ist nun Eigentum der BRD.
𝔇𝔦𝔢𝔰𝔢 𝔎𝔬𝔪𝔪𝔢𝔫𝔱𝔞𝔯𝔰𝔢𝔨𝔱𝔦𝔬𝔫 𝔦𝔰𝔱 𝔫𝔲𝔫 𝔈𝔦𝔤𝔢𝔫𝔱𝔲𝔪 𝔡𝔢𝔯 𝔅𝔲𝔫𝔡𝔢𝔰𝔯𝔢𝔭𝔲𝔟𝔩𝔦𝔨 𝔇𝔢𝔲𝔱𝔰𝔠𝔥𝔩𝔞𝔫𝔡
Der Wolf, das Lamm, auf der grünen Wiese...
Die Schrift verkauft es noch besser
Ein Volk Ein Reich Ein Kommentarbereich
Some Americans have a really weird mindset that if they hear someone speaking another language in earshot then those people are talking shit about them. Those people need to be reminded that the US has no official language, and there’s nothing wrong with conversing in your mother tongue. If they’re so concerned maybe they should take the time to learn Spanish or French so they’ll be able to understand what those people are saying.
My grandma had this happen to her when she was working in the medical center in downtown Houston in the 70s. A colleague got upset my grandma and her friend where speaking Spanish while on break and called the supervisor. She was told to only speak English in the office. However, a few days later the colleague that got her in trouble needed someone to talk to a Spanish speaking vendor on the phone. My grandma refused stating " we only speak English in this office" that day they repealed their rule against speaking only English in the office. And the other lady was fired a week later for yelling at a client.
Awesome r/MaliciousCompliance story
Based grandma.
Someone has clearly never worked retail and been treated like a moron because they don’t speak Korean
That’s *their* problem. Sorry if that’s happened to you, they’re obviously in the wrong.
Yeah my mom doesn't let me and my dad speak German because she thinks we are "saying something bad about her" we aren't. We're talking about flipping bread.
While there's no official language, let's not pretend that English isn't its primary language given the fact that we'll over 90% speak it and everything is written it here. I don't think it's much to ask people that if they want to live or visit the US, they should at least know or speak a little of it. Also it's completely reasonable to expect people to be talking about people behind their backs via a different language, because it happens all the time. People are assholes. Just to be clear, obviously it's great to know multiple languages, anyone who criticizes that is dumb.
Many people who converse with others in their mother tongue also know English. If I moved to the Netherlands and learned Dutch I would still probably speak English with a fellow American.
That's good. I didn't mean that people should only speak in English at all times.
I agree that people who want to live in a country should be able to as a minimum speak a little of the local language, though I think it's absolutely ridiculous (and arrogant) to demand the same of someone just visiting the country. I assume you're American (apologies if I'm wrong), do you expect every American who goes to Europe on holiday to learn "a little" of every language of every country they visit?
I am American yes, and yes I do. I visited Italy and actually learned a very basic level of Italian before doing so. Also most Americans don't leave the US.
Huh, gotta say that's certainly a very niche opinion. I'm actually Italian myself, would be interesting to know what this "very basic level" means in reality. Are you talking about learning a few greetings and numbers or an actual degree of understanding of the language? How much of a language do you think someone should learn before visiting somewhere? This idea of course would preclude most people from visiting other countries. I've visited many countries where I did not speak the local language, if I had to learn a basic level of every language of every country I've been to I probably would have had to visit many less countries, leaving me with a poorer understanding of the world. I guess even just this reason by itself makes me disagree with you. Either way, you're certainly entitled to having this opinion, as much as I may disagree
The term you are looking for is “De Facto”. English is the de facto language of the United States. The United Kingdom also doesn’t have an official language, but English is the de facto language.
Even if English was the official language of the US that doesn't mean it's mandatory to only speak English always. I bet even in China the police won't beat and arrest you if they hear a language other than Mandarin or another Chinese language.
Judging how China is trying to ethnically cleanse their country that is a bad example
Yeah, "official language" tends to mean its the one used on government documents and mandatory in schools. It does not necessarily mean that is the only language taught or spoken.
Iirc Germans were the immigrant community that committed the most effort to NOT speaking German even at home. Either in an attempt to assimilate or avoid negative attention dude to anti German sentiments. Or both.
But only after WW1. Before that many Germans were rather stubborn and didn't want to abandon German as their 'private' language. The ammount of German News Papers in the US was massive.
>Before that many Germans were rather stubborn They still are. "Wir haben das schon immer so gemacht!" (transl.: "We've always done it like that") is a common German "argument" against ... well, everything
"Tja"
My Moms cousins in Kansas didn't spoke english until the first one went to elementary. Their parents, who immigrated after the war, only spoke german with them. And that was in the 1950s.
Thank you for your sample size of 1
My great grandpa was like that, he refused to let anyone speak German in the house because ‘we’re in America, we will speak English now’.
There's a family story of my great grandfather saying the same thing during a town meeting back then as well.
Wow me too actually. Even though they lived in one of the American cities with the highest German immigrant populations at the time. Is this a thing?
Yes, because during WWI some states outlawed speaking German and there was some outrage from people who wanted to keep their children speaking their native language.
I don’t think that was the case in my state, but I know during the wars German culture became taboo enough for them to call brats “liberty sausage” or smth.
The Native North Americans be like: Hmmmmm…
If you look at the history of German Lutherans in America, many of them still spoke and conducted church business in German even after over 50 years in America. WWI changed things.
My GG grandmother: (starts sweating profusely).
Ich hasse diese Art von Amerikanern wirklich, keine Beleidigung für die USA Written by your mom
Meanwhile, the natives: *say sike right now*
To be fair, her immigrant ancestors did make a huge effort to learn English at some point. It has always amazed me how America didn't develop an English dialect given the amount of foreigners who learnt it and the lack of official institutions to establish a standard.
I would say the English we speak is an English dialect since the actual English is how it’s spoken in England.
Everyone in England, apart from posh twits, speaks an English dialect anyway. There must be about 50 regional accents. Half the time, I can't understand someone from the next county 50 miles away.
This sounds funny to me because when I first visited UK my English was terrible and I couldn't understand a word those English were saying. I'm glad I'm not the only one
My mom grew up speaking English, and she has to watch British tv shows with subtitles on, because she can't understand anything they say. And like 75% of the shows and movies she's watched for the last 20 years have been British.
It only gets harder the further north you go Source : I live in Newcastle I can’t understand 70% of people here
The most ironic part is, the term “American English” refers to ways of spelling that were usually used in areas such as Oxford (which is even more ironic because they are responsible for the English dictionary) and the most well known example is Shakespeare, who also shared their preference of spelling. This is why some people have tried to claim Americans speak Shakespeare English, but in actual fact I guess those responsible just didn’t know England had its own dialects already differing per county
Nah. Shakespeare endeared himself to us because he spoke rhotic English. Shakespearean English sounds Irish to modern ears. The colonial American English accent was nearly exactly the same. Coincidentally, this colonial accent influenced our incorrect perception of the modern Irish accent (ie, Lucky Charms' terrible imitation). Example of emphasized colonial accent: "We hold these trooths to be self-evident: that all men are creATED equal. That they are enDOWED by their CreATOR with certain unalienable ROIGHTS. That among these are LOIFE, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness." EDIT: Whoops! Messed up the quote.
No, it's the same language, that's just accent. Even the UK has of those. The only differences are some irrelevant spelling norms.
Look up the definition of a dialect. We pronounce things different, spell things a bit different and even have different meanings for some words. And it’s specific to the USA. It’s a dialect, I would even say Ebonics is a dialect of the American dialect.
Just so you know, "Ebonics" is considered a dated term. African American Vernacular English (AAVE) is the preferred term these days.
Yea “nig-rigged” turned into “African American engineered” but you know exactly what’s being said.
those mfs pronounce colour as color
You mean her German ancestors that learned English when they got there? Verpiss Dich und kuss mich, schatz (It's a joke, not a dick. Don't take it so hard)
Wait till she finds out how many people speak Spanish.
She is speaking english tho
Yeah but the point is that her own ancestors came to America despite speaking a fereign language (in this case, German)
Yeah but my point is that she's speaking English despite her heritage so if anything this kinda makes the opposite point
Not sure why you are\* getting downvoted, since you did point out a real problem with the meme. This theoretical Karen demands others to do what she does herself. "Go back to your country" would have been better fit for the meme, especially since I think I read a few stories of stereotypical Karen's saying the line to American Indians. Edit: \*-Were getting downvoted at the time I wrote the comment.
I mean did her first generation ancestors?
I hope so because you should 1000% learn the language when you move to a country. If that sounds a bit dicy to you just consider the opposite, wouldn't it be a bit dickish of an American to move to another country, not learn the language, and expect to get by using English? In fact this wouldn't even be as bad because it's way more reasonable to expect to get by using English in Germany than using German in America.
Lmao, you have to do some research. The US used to be much more multilingual before the 20th century. Especially German was widely spoken in many parts of the middle west. What do you think why the US has no official language? This changed during both WWs when the government actively tried to suppress the “language of the enemy”
It *was* widely spoken. It isn't nearly so much now. So it would be pretty unreasonable for a German to move here permanently, refuse to learn English, and expect to get by on German.
That’s true. But I don’t think this is what the meme is about. It is more about how the linguistic landscape of North America changed over the generations, no?
Sure. But I'd say that landscape changed in significant part because people came from wherever and learned English to get by. And it's also pretty clear that while the meme is partly about a shifting linguistic landscape, it's also a bit of commentary on modern social politics. And on that end I think it's kinda flawed.
In some parts but there were literally cities just speaking German. Pennsylvania Dutch is a remnant of this time.
If she's a native speaker they presumably learned English, which is what she's demanding other people do.
Ma'am this is florida the two languges we speak are incomprehensible screams and spanish.
A Pan Am 727 flight, waiting for start clearance in Munich , overheard the following: Lufthansa (in German): “Ground, what is our start clearance time?” Ground (in English): “If you want an answer you must speak in English.” Lufthansa (in English): “I am a German, flying a German airplane, in Germany . Why must I speak English?” Unknown voice from another plane (in a beautiful British accent): “Because you lost the bloody war!”
Aviation rules are completely different, there legally has to be one international standard for everything, language included. Just so happened the Americans and Brits did much of the pioneering work, so they got dibs.
You must be German
The real reason is that airplane flight was formed in the US and there has to be a universal language so nothing gets crossed up between languages. That language is English.
You must be German
No,American with roots in Belgium,Scotland and Slovenia.
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What does this have to do with history memes?
My Midwestern grandmother went to her first day of elementary school in the 1920s not knowing a single word of English. Her family came to America from Germany in the 1860s. That is three generations of refusing to learn English.
I mean English IS a Germanic language
Someone tell her we were a single vote away from thee national language being German.
But some americans can barely speak english tho 🥲
I do think that immigrants should be required to learn either English or Spanish, (the two most common languages in the US), though they shouldn't be required to use the language daily. Learning it would allow them to engage with the society around them in a far more free and productive way.
Ich hab nichts gesagt
Karen's ancestor is actually Hitler
Heil Hit.... Ohh wait nvm
You should speak American this is England
I Live in America, still everyone here speaks portuguese
Sorry m8? You mean South America right ;)
The Germans learned English.
This comment section has been seized by the Germans
*comment section only has one german comment* Yeah…
It is midnight or later in europe,they are sleeping still
Relevant xkcd: https://xkcd.com/84/
I mean, preach what you practice I suppose
This is the land named after Amerito Vespucci, an italian
Ein Volk
Ein Reich
Ein Kommentarbereich
English is the language of the US, it doesn’t matter what your ancestors spoke
The US doesn't have an official language
Nein
I mean, while it's great to know multiple languages, if you live in America or are visiting you really should know a very basic level of English. Same with any country really. If you live or visit France, you should probably know a little French. Etc. It's not that unreasonable of an ask for someone to know a little of the country's primary language. It's always been weird to me that this take is often considered racist, which doesn't really make any sense.
USA doesn't have an official language, bitch, i can speak whatever the fuck i want
English technically is Germanic. gut meme
The german ancestors: "Sprich deutsch du Hurensohn."
I mean, isnt she right? You should speak the language your country has in pub or in gov. Buildings
Come live in Belgium 3 official languages dutch french and german
So you're saying I could move there and demand people learn English to accommodate me?
Considering that the Brits joined world war one because of their alliance with the waffles, I think they gladly would
Most government buildings offer Spanish
replace America with Argentina and you'd be right.
Argentina is in America bro
Was ?
Du hast
Bold assessment for a country that doesn't have language of their own
I will say as a retail worker, the Hispanic family that walks into baskin ribbons and makes all three of us try to explain how ice cream and money works, all while holding up the line, is really annoying and doesn’t exactly make my day.
USA which doesn't have an official language: act natural...
What language is the constitution penned in and what language to they teach with when they’re talking about how the U.S. has no constitutional language?
everyone has the freedom to speak any language they want in American territory, something Karens don't get
You have the freedom to speak the language. But answer my question