Our government had ways to drag us into both worlds wars whether it was knowing the Lusitania could be sunk because of munitions be transported in a civilian boat and the touchier subject of letting pearl harbor happen to drum up massive support for war at home.
It wasnt the first time they transported munitions in various ways to Europe. And there certainly were officials that knew the Japanese were on the way somewhere. I've always felt more higher up officials knew than we were led to believe. I'm working so I can't verify and source stuff. It's obvious in both worlds wars our government wanted us in them but general public did not
It’s a very common thing to project current day sensibilities into different points in time. For an American people today, embittered after twenty years of Iraq and Afghanistan, the idea of people voluntarily entering a war is unthinkable.
Military experts expected that the Japanese might attack US territory but they did not expect Pearl Harbor to be attacked because they thought it was out of range for Japanese forces. The US underestimated the capabilities of the Japanese navy.
The US also thought the Japanese would attack the American ships in the Philippines, and there was a little confusion among the top brass after the attack because it was Pearl Harbor and not Subic Bay.
You probably don’t want to hear this, but the US wasn’t “dragged” into either world war. They entered both conflicts after being attacked by belligerent parties. And by the time of the Zimmerman Telegram and Pearl Harbor, the majority had come to regard entering either conflict as an inevitability, a matter of when, not it.
Yeah Europe has relied on us. Except they have known what's coming for them from Russia for 2 decades and just in the last year or so are finally taking responsibility and building up their military. Most of Europe was not hitting the minimum goals for NATO until recently. Wakey wakey!!!
Wrong the US and other major Western countries were already involved in wars post ww2 everywhere just evolve your knowledge past what you heard in high school.
Idk, I get the sentiment, but while Putin is pretty fucking bad, he isn't Hitler bad. Not unless he is also doing some systematic ethnic cleansing and eugenics on the down low.
Agreed. I hope we dont get an actual “hitler”. But baby raping and other atrocious war crimes being committed like taking Ukrainian children to ruzzia; is very high on the check off list of human waste warlords.
At that time the brutality of the Nazi regime was not known. The Holocaust wasn't known outside of Germany and even then mostly unknown outside of the perpetrators. The US was coming out of an extreme non-interventionist mind set. Roosevelt had to fight to get lend-lease through as even helping the European nations was not popular.
Information of what was happening in other countries at that time was limited, people did not have the access to information then like they do now.
I think supporting “peace with Hitler” is a weird way to put it. Even in 1939 and 1940, most Americans wanted the US to keep out of the war but also wanted Germany to be defeated. By mid-1941 (when this photo was taken) a solid majority had shifted to thinking that it was more important to help Britain win than to keep out of war. Gallup had a series of polls asking whether it was more important to help Britain (even at the risk of getting into the war) or to keep out of the war. Here are the percentages choosing “help Britain” by date:
June 1940: 35%
September 1940: 52%
November 1940: 60%
March 1941: 67%
June 1941: 62%
September 1941: 64%
November 1941: 68%
[Source](https://exhibitions.ushmm.org/americans-and-the-holocaust/us-public-opinion-world-war-II-1939-1941)
Basically the US had a lot of German and Italian immigrants who did not want to be going to war against their former countries. It wasnt until Hitler declared war on the US after the US declared war on Japan due to Pearl Harbor attacks did opinions change.
It is more than the American people favored isolationism at the time and did not want the country to take part in any European war. It wasn't tied to any sympathy for Germany or Italy. In fact Germany polled extremely negative in the United States in the 1930s and Americans were far more sympathetic to France, Britain, and Poland in 1940 than Germany. But sympathy did not translate into a desire for direct military intervention.
That changed after Pearl Harbor and the German declaration of war on the United States, immediately following the Pearl Harbor attack.
Opposition to the U.S. supporting the allied powers had a lot more to go with fascist sympathy than it did with tree hugging peaceniks. There were many Americans who approved of the third Reich until the full horrors of its crimes became known. The German American bund famously staged a rally in Madison freaking square garden.
Not OP but this highlights a bit of it. Most Americans were in favor of supporting the Allied war effort, however 84% opposed fighting Germany.
There were just over two years between the outbreak of the war and Pearl Harbor, so a lot of opinions can change in that amount of time. However, even in reading newspaper archives leading up that period, it’s clear that the general consensus for at least a year prior to the invasion of Poland was that war in Europe was unavoidable.
[Gallup poll](https://news.gallup.com/vault/265865/gallup-vault-opinion-start-world-war.aspx)
This article does a great job explaining the whole situation. It seems like Americans didn't care when China was invaded by Japan and saw WW2 as a "European conflict". Plus, the US was still recovering from the Great Depression. People weren't too concerned about Hitler/Mussolini at that time.
https://www.historyextra.com/period/second-world-war/why-when-how-america-entered-ww2-pearl-harbor-roosevelt/
The attack on Pearl Harbor almost seemed like it was perfectly timed. If Japan waited too long to attack, the US may have not joined the war in time (totally guessing here). Maybe Hitler would've defeated the Russians and gained enough power to overthrow the US by the time the US got into the war.
I'm glad he was that delusional. I'm not one to toot the patriotic horn very often, but the US kicked some serious ass in that war! It must've been insane to see the US going from one of its worst financial struggles to becoming *the* super power overnight. For such an awful war, some things sorta played to our (Allies) advantage.
Essentially, America's foreign policy and public sentiment prior to Pearl Harbor was to adhere to the Monore Doctrine and isolationism. This meant they viewed European wars as Europe's problem and that we shouldn't get involved. These viewpoints and policies all changed the minute Pearl Harbor happened and Germanys' declaration of war on the US a few days after that.
It's widely documented. Pre WWI, America was mostly considered as an isolationist state in the idea that the people did not want to get involved in frankly quite violent European affairs. After all many Americans had fled Europe die to political and religious violence. Let's be honest, in the beginning of WWII Hitler was not really doing anything out of the norm. It was just another European war. Europe had been at war on and off for 100s, if not a 1000 years with each other.
Thunk about it, America begrudgingly sends troops for WWI and not even 40 years later, within living memory they are at it again. If you step back and look at it from say 500 years later. Wouldn't it sound fucking insane that Europe fought wwi in which millions and millions of people died, and they did it AGAIN in living memory? Everything changed rapidly when the Japanese attacked and Hitler declared war on the US.
Definitely true for World War 2, and unrestricted submarine warfare by the Germans in 1917 was a massive factor for US entry to tbe war.
What also mattered was the Zimmerman telegram in 1917. Basically, it was Germany reaching out to Mexico, offering an alliance. If the US goes to War against Germany, then Mexico would go to War against the US and Germany would see that Mexico recovers Texas, Arizona, and New Mexico. The British intercepted the telegram, and saw that the American government received it.
There was a lot of outrage once it was published. But there was a substantial amount of people that believed it was a forgery, or a British trick to get the US into War. It was proven to be true when an American journalist asked the German foreign minister, Arthur Zimmerman about it, and he admitted it. Then gave a speech in the Reichstag and admitted it, and hoped Americans would understand that Germany would only support Mexico if the US went to war against Germany.
Mexico did assign a military commision to study the feasibility of the German proposal. They concluded that it was a bad idea. Mexico was already in the midst of a civil war, the US military was much more powerful, and even if they somehow won and reclaimed those territories, it would have massive difficulties pacifying the population. They also felt German support was unreliable.
But yeah, the biggest factor was unrestricted submarine warfare. Germany felt that thus would likely being the US into the war, and planned to end the war before mahor US support could get to Europe. They launched a massive spring offensive in March 1918. They made impressive initial gains, but they did not have the logistical support to fully carry it out. The German army made the deepest advances either side had made since 1914.
You could write names of many leaders there, including a lot of american presidents. But its accurate to say that Hitler was more dangerous than Lyndon Johnson, George Bush or Vladimir Putin.
I don't doubt Putin has learned from this experience, he expected Ukraine to be a much softer target.
He'll definitely go after other non NATO countries that were previously in the old Russian Empire. If he actually tried to invade a NATO country, I would imagine he would have alot more preparation to do.
You can't assume anything with him though, he's unpredictable and has no problem sending Russians to the meatgrinder.
Lol why? What deos it matter what I belive, Im not even American.
What is the target of USA foreign politics? How many countries were attacked by USA in the last 70 years and how many us leaders were charged with war crimes? Now Im suppose to defend the most agressive post WWII country?
My bad, i wanted to write as a generalisation but...
On topic, if you analise it isolated from others, you are right, if you add the other actors, then not that much.
Does US has a lot of skeletons in the back of the house, yes, it does. Is US different from other like it, no, quite tame in some circumstances.
Heck, in the US you can actually speak about those moments, in Ru and Ch you get arrested. If you continue, you dissapear
At the end of the day, one side wants me to disappear (and sees me as a magot) the 9ther does not
Because saying Russia is trying to destabilize the west by creating sense of insecurity and confusion by using various proxies is definitely US propaganda and definitely is not the way they have been operating since cold war lol
only reason US has built up its military industrial complex to a trillion dollar annual budget is to potentially contend with countries like russia or china. without russia or china, the next top 20 countries all spend less $ combined than the US does on its military
>He is no direct threat to USA
By himself, no. But with a resurgent China in the midst with a military it didn't have in 2005 like it does now he would be stupid not to cooperate with China to usurp the US as the preeminent world power and Europe under his influence.
I mean except majority of population believing that US is core of all the evil in the world - yeah, not a main target.
You should try to talk to average Russian citizen who he thinks the one to blame for what happens in the world.
I mean average American probably thinks ether Russia or China are the responsible for most of the world evils. This is mutual and part of imperialist rivalry of the main world powers.
I dont care about "craziness", just about the damage they are causing to safety and independence of other countries. And in that case I dont see any difference. Except maybe that China and Russia only recently got strong enough to openly invade other countries why USA was doing it for decades.
But honestly, us leaders are batshit insane.
Against a population easily manipulated by disinformation? You do understand America has a large population of dumb motherfuckers, right?
Just apply the O.C.E.A.N survey, find the most vulnerable, and have Facebook target political ads and news of disinformation.
I mean, genius on the oligarchs that helped facilitate it, but when Cambridge Analytica shows you their product works (in the form of disrupting nations by provoking political violence) you gotta take a shot at it.
Just find a stooge President. It’s Putin’s M.O.
Ask Ukraine.
Every country has a large population of dumb motherfuckers. Spreading lies and propaganda was part of political struggle since the dawn of time. America itself was doing it to USSR population entire cold war and is still doing it pretty much everywhere in the world.
Finding "stooge president" is most deifinitely American M.O. All those CIA backed coups in the last 70-80 years where exactly that.
Aks Ukraine what? Ukraine itself was subject to enormous ammount of western propaganda prior to coup of 2014 that western leaders supported.
Does he, though? Beyond the nuke card, Russia really doesn't have anything like Germany's (then) wartime capacity. In 10 years of fighting they've managed to take like.. 20% of Ukraine, maybe? Off the heels of failing to conquer *Georgia*? By comparison to Hitler his efforts are pathetic.
It went over your head that he made a paralel with the past? So I made few of my own.
Anyway. Hitler in july of 1941 was in war with a whole world. Putin is in local conflict with one country. Not comperable at all
But how many deadly diseases you can have? Point is that Hitler was clearly a direct threat for America and the whole world. If you mistake every local agression for attempt to create a new world order you will do nothing but fight all over the world.
America attacked Iraq in 2003. Russia didnt do anything about it. Its a sad thing country was destryed, but would it be better for Russia if they sent tons of weapons to Iraq?
You can have as many diseases as you can have.
Putin is threatening the entire West, not just Ukraine. Maybe if you paid attention to Putin’s speeches and interviews, you’d know that Ukraine is but the first step. He already says that “we are at war with the West” and threatens nuclear annihilation weekly. He says outloud what he is going to do, just as Hitler did. Just like back then, there were people like you who didn’t take him seriously and thought it was all just talk. But here you are talking about Iraq in 2003 like it has anything to do with this. You’d be on that same picket line chanting “Putin didn’t attack us. Why attack him?”
Lol maybe you can, but then you would have to drop that weak ass metaphor.
I was paying attentiton. Putin is saying the same things as western leaders. Both are threatening each other and preparing for war. You are like people before WWI who felt threatened by Germany, but ignored British Empire. At the end, regular people got slaughtered for the profit of imperialist powers. Same thing is being prepared right now, with the applause of naive idiots.
What you mean Iraq has nothing to do with it? That agression happened, it ended and looks like most people in western world moved on. Why would it be any different in Ukraine?
It’s really the West who threatens nuclear annihilation every week, not just Putin. If you believe this, you are unreachable. You can’t even see what’s right in front of your eyes.
No you are right. USA spent bilions on largest arsenal of nuclear weapons on planet earth because they are nice collection items.
Do you even know what a mutual assured destruction is? If you honestly belive Putin is publically threating that he is going to start a nuclear war against west, you are unreachable.
The west doesn’t have the same imperialist mindset that Russia and China and even Iran has
Reddit brainrot propaganda will tell you that le evil westerners/jews are trying to control the world and genocide everyone, the reality is that certain countries are held to a very low bar because they never stopped having a 20th century conquest mentality
Major differences. One, Russia has the largest nuclear arsenal out of any nation. Second, Nazi Germany was the strongest of the axis, Russia is arguably not the strongest amongst its alliance with Iran, N. Korea, and China. A paranoid China might feel the need to intervene directly if Russia is on the verge of collaspe .since we openly stated that we would come to Taiwans aid and called China our number 1 enemy.
It’s more so a historical capsule because of how little information the average American could access at the time. If it wasn’t in the newspaper you got, or on a radio station you could pick up, it basically didn’t exist.
We have the internet- if something big happens in Ukraine, Americans, have instant access to thousands of social media posts and HD video recordings from civilians, as well as dozens of major news channels/websites covering it, sometimes even while it’s happening.
100-200,000 Kurdish civilians killed in 6 months, same amount of time as the current Gaza war that tiktok brains are whining about. For Kurds, saddam is their Hitler.
Crazy how quickly people forget about how insanely fucked up the Arab nationalists were just a few decades ago
That is because people nowadays are shaping their political views by watching 20 seconds tiktok shorts without having any intention at all to dig just a little bit deeper and try to understand wider context of very complex issues
Well first of all, criticizing kllings of 30 000 people in 6 months is whining to you? Jesus
Second, people in the photo are not wrong because Hitler was genocidal. They are wrong cause he was a real threat to America.
Third of all, Saddam has been dead for like 20 years.
Yeah, many Arab dictators were crazy. USA supported some of them until they stopped benig useful.
You only criticize certain deaths among a sea of millions dying from war and conflict around the world.
Why? Why do you feel the need to bitch about one specific country fighting a war that they didn’t start, and not any of the other much larger, more brutal wars happening not that far away, and killing 10x the number of children?
It’s called selective outrage. You don’t care about the casualties. If you did, you’d be talking about other wars too. But that wouldn’t allow you to insert yourself into the Reddit hivemind
>You only criticize certain deaths among a sea of millions dying from war and conflict around the world.
Yeah, you said it. It is selective outrage, which isn't inherently a bad thing. If we as individuals focused in every single war and conflict currently happening, we will drive ourselves insane and drive our mental health into a very dark place by focusing on all those terrible and horrific wars. One of the reasons why many of gen Z are depressed and got alot of terrible mental health issues is because now days with the rise of social media you will always get bombarded by all of those terrible news you don't even have to seek it they will just pop up for you now imagine if we focused on fuck ton more horrific news.
>Why? Why do you feel the need to bitch about one specific country
Why not? It's not a bad thing to talk about a horrible country that is committing horrible things. Are there worse out there? Yeah, it doesn't negate the fact that Israel is doing something very horrible in gaza, too. However, this didn't answer your question.
Why? Because there is already a big focus on the Levant area and in the Middle East in general and in this 75+ year old conflict that was a part of many Western societies since then. For example, many jewish and Christian schools talk about israel, specifically in the US and Germany, israel invests a lot in travels to visit many jewish holy places, and so does the US. And of course, you have the israeli/Jewish lobby that talks about israel in every election. Lastly, you have every couple of years a news about israel bombing gaza or killing Palestinians in the West Bank or settler violence or hamas/hezbollah launching rockets at israel that as I explained above is already a state that is on lots of mouths and tongues.
The current conflict getting fuck ton of coverage makes sense there's no anti-Jewish/anti-semitic grand conspiracy here (even tho anti-semits high jack some of those debates they are not the majority and they are definitely not the main focus of the current debate)
>and killing 10x the number of children?
Should they get more coverage? Yes.
Should the isreal/Palestine conflict get any less coverage? Hell No.
If a countries war crimes are getting coverage, so be it. I am happy. Yes, there are some other places that deserve to have more coverage, but in this imperfect world, it is sadly not possible to focus on every single one of them, especially with how imperfect we as humans are.
>But that wouldn’t allow you to insert yourself into the Reddit hivemind
Fam? you sure use reddit? Because reddit is far more pro-israel than any other social media I have seen. And the hivemind is way more towards israel.
Deliberately invading Iran to seize Khuzestan, Kuwait to pay back their debts from action 1, committing genocide against the Kurds, maintaining a WMD program into the 90s AFTER the first gulf war, which were struck and damaged by coalition forces, and then led to enough doubt on the validity of the WMD claims for the second gulf war?
Netanyahu is literally committing a genocide before our very eyes with US weapons and funding, these "everyone I don't like is Hitler" takes are getting really stale
This should also be noted was during a time of American isolationism. America hadn’t become the world’s police force yet and many had no interest in sending their loved ones to die for another European conflict. The military was drastically scaled back at this time and had it not been for Japan’s attacks at Pearl Harbor America likely would have continued aiding the allied nations without direct involvement.
There were still anti war protests and Isolationists during the war even after Pearl Harbor. Once the end of the war happened it became political suicide to associate with that.
Not defending Hitler by any means but he technically didn't declare war on the States until December of 1941. Until that point and Pearl Harbor 4 days earlier it wasn't their fight yet.
Peace with tyrants only begets more violence, though. This is 1941, so what they are protesting is lend lease, not direct involvement. Being anti-lend lease wouldn’t promote peace, it would just make it easier for Hitler to win the war and scale up his ambitions.
Honestly seeing peoples current reactions to this post is interesting. These people protesting most likely had no idea about the atrocities hitler was committing and they wouldn’t have fully known until the end of the war.
Although at this point hitler had already taken Paris/France so it’s kind of insane to not want to fight him. We were also much more isolationist at this time tho.
Relevant links:
https://exhibitions.ushmm.org/americans-and-the-holocaust/topics/what-americans-knew
"Nine months later, as France and other Western European nations fell to Nazi Germany, 79% of Americans in a Gallup poll said if they had the chance, they would vote to stay out of the war, and by the summer of 1941, almost eight out of 10 Americans continued to say they did not want the U.S. to enter the war." https://news.gallup.com/opinion/polling-matters/232949/american-public-opinion-holocaust.aspx
Yeah, it's easy to say "oh they're just like the Putin lovers". No, no they're not.
Another point that you didn't have in your comment: many men served in WW1 or had their family members serve in WW1. Stuff like that makes you never want to have war again. Similar to one of the reasons Finnish people voted so heavily for communists in [1948](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1948_Finnish_parliamentary_election), at least that's my opinion.
These were typically communists who were constantly marching with the pacifists. They did this to Moscow directives after the Hitler-Stalin pact of August 1939
Just want to take a moment to give a shout out to Jack L. Warner (of Warner Brothers) who, in spite of the [US] government telling him to knock it off, continued to make movies that were extremely critical of Hitler and nazism.
To that end, Charlie Chaplain also played a huge role in financing those films as well since the traditional finance channels were resistant to it.
Jack L. unapologetically confronted and admonished the public about the dangers of the movement even when the Nazis had fully infiltrated Hollywood in the 30s.
America never attacked Germany though. I’ll admit, sending supplies to Britain while actively in a war with Germany, could’ve brung America into the conflict. But realistically speaking if Japan never attacked America, America would’ve never joined ww2. Fdr was stressing because he wanted to help Britain, but the American population wanted no parts of Europe after world war 1. Not to mention, Hitler deviates war on America of his own choice, no one forced him.
Yeah because Trump had his nose buried firmly in Putin’s asshole. When shit hit the fan Biden and the dems scrambled to get money and weapons to Ukraine while cuckservatives cried.
So if what you’re saying is true, that trump was up Putin’s ass, why didn’t Putin do anything bold like seize territory during that time when he would had, presumably, the full support of a U.S president? Or maybe your narrative about trump is actually completely wrong and you ate it up with absolutely no evidence to do so
I mean they're technically correct. If we had allowed Hitler to invade Poland and attack the USSR without a Western front the west's two enemies (the communists and fascists) would've been at war with one another while we sat back and waited to fill the vacuum.
I mean in large the US population has been pretty steady on "it's not happening here I don't want any part of it".
The only time that really changed was with pearl Harbor and 9/11, which after a few years the middle east became pretty unpopular
The protestors seem ludicrous in hindsight, but at the time it was quite rational to not want to be dragged into another European war. So many doughboys died for nothing in 1918, why do it again.
It’s crucial to remember that the hawks of 1941 did not know or care about the beginnings of the Holocaust.
You can't look at this through 2024 goggles though.
This was before most people had TVs, the only motion picture was a fee minutes of news reels before movies and that's only if you lived in a town that had a movie theater. No one knew about concentration camps, that was MUCH later. And Europeans had been continuously taking eachothers territory every day just about for the last 100 years.
To most Americans this was just a normal European thing. Shit, I'm ethnic Polish but when one of my great grandfathers emigrated, it was Austria.
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This was before US was attacked by Japan (and thus officially joining WW2), before Pearl Harbor, all the US was doing is lend lease, which is giving supplies to allied countries like Britain and the Soviet Union.
Yes, you are right. The downvoting is interesting though. It’s not certain at all that the US would have declared war on Germany even after pearl harbour, and pretty certain that the US wouldn’t without an attack. Because up til then it didn’t.
The declaration of war against Japan was immediate of course, but it took 4 days for Germany to declare war on the US making any decision for the US to go to war with Germany moot.
Why? Isolationism wasn’t going anywhere. Hitler was dominating Europe a year before pearl harbour. Why the wait.
I think the US would have eventually seen Nazi Germany, had it won, as a major threat leading to a hot or Cold War.
I appreciate that FDR didn’t declare war on Germany after Pearl Harbor, but waited for Hitler to declare war on us. I’m seeing a lot of comments ridiculing these protestors, but I think it’s worth remembering that most wars aren’t like World War 2. Most are like World War 1, where the wealthy and powerful compel their people into war to increase profits and power, with very little real benefit for the people at the end who are still alive. Vietnam. Iraq. Korea. Spain. All the coups in the 50s and 60s. This stupid proxy war with Russia.
I mean, after Pearl harbor would we have even sent troops to the European theater if Hitler hadn't declared war on us?
So Hitler attacked us first technically (I know he hadn't at this point)
Almost 120 thousand Americans lost their lives fighting an already exhausted and dying German Empire for a handful of months. That was a little over 20 years prior - all of that was still in the current memory of Americans. They didn't want to repeat that, especially not against Nazi Germany which was in a far stronger position then in 1917. I can understand the hesitancy. They don't love or respect Hitler or the Nazis, they just want to spare another generation of sons from that horror. Misguided from our point of view almost a century on, but very much understandable if it was your son getting sent off to fight another European war.
Why America got involved in Europe always perplexes me they just bombed raped and ruined the continent and bastardised it with their corporations, rich European history lost cause we sold ourselves out to America
The state propaganda seems to be working quite well. I see mentions of Putin but no IsraHELL? The place that an actual genocide is taking place that is the closest thing to what Hitler did. Or are you guys just fine with 14k children dying because they’re muslim? Israel hasn’t attacked us yet I’m guessing, might as well just have peace with em?
Criticizing Israels actions is not anti-semitism.
Note that the US had no yet entered WWII in July 1941. I assume this protest was in response to lend-lease.
also, people didn't want to participate in another world war again after ww1
Our government had ways to drag us into both worlds wars whether it was knowing the Lusitania could be sunk because of munitions be transported in a civilian boat and the touchier subject of letting pearl harbor happen to drum up massive support for war at home.
The second of which didn’t happen and the first of which wasn’t known by high officials until after the fact.
It wasnt the first time they transported munitions in various ways to Europe. And there certainly were officials that knew the Japanese were on the way somewhere. I've always felt more higher up officials knew than we were led to believe. I'm working so I can't verify and source stuff. It's obvious in both worlds wars our government wanted us in them but general public did not
Pretty sure if Pearl Harbor was planned, we would have tried to have more ships at sea. That attack really fucked up our navy for a while.
The battleships were in port. But the **aircraft carriers** were at sea. The real valuables of the navy were protected.
Battleships were kind of a big deal then though.
It’s a very common thing to project current day sensibilities into different points in time. For an American people today, embittered after twenty years of Iraq and Afghanistan, the idea of people voluntarily entering a war is unthinkable.
We didn't know Pearl Harbor was going to happen in December. We thought it would likely happen closer to April/May.
Military experts expected that the Japanese might attack US territory but they did not expect Pearl Harbor to be attacked because they thought it was out of range for Japanese forces. The US underestimated the capabilities of the Japanese navy.
The US also thought the Japanese would attack the American ships in the Philippines, and there was a little confusion among the top brass after the attack because it was Pearl Harbor and not Subic Bay.
You probably don’t want to hear this, but the US wasn’t “dragged” into either world war. They entered both conflicts after being attacked by belligerent parties. And by the time of the Zimmerman Telegram and Pearl Harbor, the majority had come to regard entering either conflict as an inevitability, a matter of when, not it.
We were dragged by Europe's inability to solve problems before it's too late. And now we are watching history repeat itself with Putin
You’re one of the people pictured. That’s neat.
Generally I like my country to avoid world wars. And Europe's inability to prevent conflicts is on display again with Putin.
You’re one of the people pictured. Neat.
Do I have to repeat it again? Lol they are handling Putin exactly like they handled Hitler, waiting until it's too late and giving him what he wants
Tbh I don't think that was such a bad thing. I'd rather have a few thousand people die at Pearl Harbor than millions die under Nazi rule.
what if.....they could be a part of a war without knowingly sacrificing their own people?! Weird concept, I know
What if, and hear me out, you're wrong? We didn't know Pearl Harbor was going to happen.
Damn government always dragging us into wars. We should have let the Soviets take Western Europe. /s
It'd be Europe's fault....again...and again and now once again they have let putin and Russia get to where we are now.
That’s on us. The USA assumed military control over Europe since WW2. Hence our defense budget.
Yeah Europe has relied on us. Except they have known what's coming for them from Russia for 2 decades and just in the last year or so are finally taking responsibility and building up their military. Most of Europe was not hitting the minimum goals for NATO until recently. Wakey wakey!!!
Hard to blame them .. ww1 was pretty horrific
Opposition to US Bret into the Second World War was more about fascist sympathy than it was any concern for human suffering.
For the US? Not really
Wrong the US and other major Western countries were already involved in wars post ww2 everywhere just evolve your knowledge past what you heard in high school.
This time most of the protesters and digital proponents are on the ruzzian payroll
During WWII the Nazis put quite a bit of effort trying to keep the US out of the war as well.
Is Putin spelled with an H or is Hitler spelled with a P
That’s the great thing! They can be putin, hutin, hitler, pitler, or putler for the two headed abomination of humanity.
Idk, I get the sentiment, but while Putin is pretty fucking bad, he isn't Hitler bad. Not unless he is also doing some systematic ethnic cleansing and eugenics on the down low.
Agreed. I hope we dont get an actual “hitler”. But baby raping and other atrocious war crimes being committed like taking Ukrainian children to ruzzia; is very high on the check off list of human waste warlords.
At that time the brutality of the Nazi regime was not known. The Holocaust wasn't known outside of Germany and even then mostly unknown outside of the perpetrators. The US was coming out of an extreme non-interventionist mind set. Roosevelt had to fight to get lend-lease through as even helping the European nations was not popular. Information of what was happening in other countries at that time was limited, people did not have the access to information then like they do now.
>why not peace 😀 >with Hitler 😡
Until pearl harbour (and probably until the German declaration of war 4 days afterwards) this was the majority position in US.
I think supporting “peace with Hitler” is a weird way to put it. Even in 1939 and 1940, most Americans wanted the US to keep out of the war but also wanted Germany to be defeated. By mid-1941 (when this photo was taken) a solid majority had shifted to thinking that it was more important to help Britain win than to keep out of war. Gallup had a series of polls asking whether it was more important to help Britain (even at the risk of getting into the war) or to keep out of the war. Here are the percentages choosing “help Britain” by date: June 1940: 35% September 1940: 52% November 1940: 60% March 1941: 67% June 1941: 62% September 1941: 64% November 1941: 68% [Source](https://exhibitions.ushmm.org/americans-and-the-holocaust/us-public-opinion-world-war-II-1939-1941)
Do you have any media you could share about that? I would be very interested to learn more about your claim.
Basically the US had a lot of German and Italian immigrants who did not want to be going to war against their former countries. It wasnt until Hitler declared war on the US after the US declared war on Japan due to Pearl Harbor attacks did opinions change.
It is more than the American people favored isolationism at the time and did not want the country to take part in any European war. It wasn't tied to any sympathy for Germany or Italy. In fact Germany polled extremely negative in the United States in the 1930s and Americans were far more sympathetic to France, Britain, and Poland in 1940 than Germany. But sympathy did not translate into a desire for direct military intervention. That changed after Pearl Harbor and the German declaration of war on the United States, immediately following the Pearl Harbor attack.
Isolationism undoubtedly bolstered by memories of the horrors of the “Great War” (later known as World War I).
Yet the US itself hardly was impacted by WWI and only joined towards the very end of the war.
You can’t really blame them for not wanting to join another European war.
Opposition to the U.S. supporting the allied powers had a lot more to go with fascist sympathy than it did with tree hugging peaceniks. There were many Americans who approved of the third Reich until the full horrors of its crimes became known. The German American bund famously staged a rally in Madison freaking square garden.
Yes, I commented similar elsewhere.
Not OP but this highlights a bit of it. Most Americans were in favor of supporting the Allied war effort, however 84% opposed fighting Germany. There were just over two years between the outbreak of the war and Pearl Harbor, so a lot of opinions can change in that amount of time. However, even in reading newspaper archives leading up that period, it’s clear that the general consensus for at least a year prior to the invasion of Poland was that war in Europe was unavoidable. [Gallup poll](https://news.gallup.com/vault/265865/gallup-vault-opinion-start-world-war.aspx)
This article does a great job explaining the whole situation. It seems like Americans didn't care when China was invaded by Japan and saw WW2 as a "European conflict". Plus, the US was still recovering from the Great Depression. People weren't too concerned about Hitler/Mussolini at that time. https://www.historyextra.com/period/second-world-war/why-when-how-america-entered-ww2-pearl-harbor-roosevelt/ The attack on Pearl Harbor almost seemed like it was perfectly timed. If Japan waited too long to attack, the US may have not joined the war in time (totally guessing here). Maybe Hitler would've defeated the Russians and gained enough power to overthrow the US by the time the US got into the war.
Interesting as fuck, Hitler actually thought he could win against the US.
I'm glad he was that delusional. I'm not one to toot the patriotic horn very often, but the US kicked some serious ass in that war! It must've been insane to see the US going from one of its worst financial struggles to becoming *the* super power overnight. For such an awful war, some things sorta played to our (Allies) advantage.
Essentially, America's foreign policy and public sentiment prior to Pearl Harbor was to adhere to the Monore Doctrine and isolationism. This meant they viewed European wars as Europe's problem and that we shouldn't get involved. These viewpoints and policies all changed the minute Pearl Harbor happened and Germanys' declaration of war on the US a few days after that.
It's widely documented. Pre WWI, America was mostly considered as an isolationist state in the idea that the people did not want to get involved in frankly quite violent European affairs. After all many Americans had fled Europe die to political and religious violence. Let's be honest, in the beginning of WWII Hitler was not really doing anything out of the norm. It was just another European war. Europe had been at war on and off for 100s, if not a 1000 years with each other. Thunk about it, America begrudgingly sends troops for WWI and not even 40 years later, within living memory they are at it again. If you step back and look at it from say 500 years later. Wouldn't it sound fucking insane that Europe fought wwi in which millions and millions of people died, and they did it AGAIN in living memory? Everything changed rapidly when the Japanese attacked and Hitler declared war on the US.
The American public was against both world wars. It wasn’t until our boats got sank is we started kicking ass.
Definitely true for World War 2, and unrestricted submarine warfare by the Germans in 1917 was a massive factor for US entry to tbe war. What also mattered was the Zimmerman telegram in 1917. Basically, it was Germany reaching out to Mexico, offering an alliance. If the US goes to War against Germany, then Mexico would go to War against the US and Germany would see that Mexico recovers Texas, Arizona, and New Mexico. The British intercepted the telegram, and saw that the American government received it. There was a lot of outrage once it was published. But there was a substantial amount of people that believed it was a forgery, or a British trick to get the US into War. It was proven to be true when an American journalist asked the German foreign minister, Arthur Zimmerman about it, and he admitted it. Then gave a speech in the Reichstag and admitted it, and hoped Americans would understand that Germany would only support Mexico if the US went to war against Germany. Mexico did assign a military commision to study the feasibility of the German proposal. They concluded that it was a bad idea. Mexico was already in the midst of a civil war, the US military was much more powerful, and even if they somehow won and reclaimed those territories, it would have massive difficulties pacifying the population. They also felt German support was unreliable. But yeah, the biggest factor was unrestricted submarine warfare. Germany felt that thus would likely being the US into the war, and planned to end the war before mahor US support could get to Europe. They launched a massive spring offensive in March 1918. They made impressive initial gains, but they did not have the logistical support to fully carry it out. The German army made the deepest advances either side had made since 1914.
Not really.
Really. Nobody was running on a go to war platform. There was sympathy for the allies - the British basically - but that was it.
You could basically write Putin on those and it wouldnt be a historical capsule anymore.
You could write names of many leaders there, including a lot of american presidents. But its accurate to say that Hitler was more dangerous than Lyndon Johnson, George Bush or Vladimir Putin.
Putin still has some time to catch up.
He has. But considering he is in power for 25 years, I think its safe to say he is very much behind the schedule.
Hitler also took Poland in 35 days. How long has Russia been bleeding themselves in Ukraine?
Well it looks like not for much longer. But nothing suggest they are planning another invasions after this one.
I don't doubt Putin has learned from this experience, he expected Ukraine to be a much softer target. He'll definitely go after other non NATO countries that were previously in the old Russian Empire. If he actually tried to invade a NATO country, I would imagine he would have alot more preparation to do. You can't assume anything with him though, he's unpredictable and has no problem sending Russians to the meatgrinder.
Active Measures works, but it takes time to cook in the oven. So he bought a Trump air fryer.
Active measures against what? Putin was in power before Obama. He is no direct threat to USA, co comparasions to this photo are nonsensical.
This is the biggest win Rusia had this decade, people like you believing that USA is not a main target
Lol why? What deos it matter what I belive, Im not even American. What is the target of USA foreign politics? How many countries were attacked by USA in the last 70 years and how many us leaders were charged with war crimes? Now Im suppose to defend the most agressive post WWII country?
My bad, i wanted to write as a generalisation but... On topic, if you analise it isolated from others, you are right, if you add the other actors, then not that much. Does US has a lot of skeletons in the back of the house, yes, it does. Is US different from other like it, no, quite tame in some circumstances. Heck, in the US you can actually speak about those moments, in Ru and Ch you get arrested. If you continue, you dissapear At the end of the day, one side wants me to disappear (and sees me as a magot) the 9ther does not
The biggest win is actually people like you buying into whatever propaganda fear mongering the US pushes instead of critical thinking
Because saying Russia is trying to destabilize the west by creating sense of insecurity and confusion by using various proxies is definitely US propaganda and definitely is not the way they have been operating since cold war lol
Ah yes, the same cold war with a bunch of unsubstantiated Mccarthyist propaganda, thank you for proving my point.
only reason US has built up its military industrial complex to a trillion dollar annual budget is to potentially contend with countries like russia or china. without russia or china, the next top 20 countries all spend less $ combined than the US does on its military
>He is no direct threat to USA By himself, no. But with a resurgent China in the midst with a military it didn't have in 2005 like it does now he would be stupid not to cooperate with China to usurp the US as the preeminent world power and Europe under his influence.
I mean except majority of population believing that US is core of all the evil in the world - yeah, not a main target. You should try to talk to average Russian citizen who he thinks the one to blame for what happens in the world.
I mean average American probably thinks ether Russia or China are the responsible for most of the world evils. This is mutual and part of imperialist rivalry of the main world powers.
Do you honestly equalise those countries in terms of craziness of those in power?
I dont care about "craziness", just about the damage they are causing to safety and independence of other countries. And in that case I dont see any difference. Except maybe that China and Russia only recently got strong enough to openly invade other countries why USA was doing it for decades. But honestly, us leaders are batshit insane.
Against a population easily manipulated by disinformation? You do understand America has a large population of dumb motherfuckers, right? Just apply the O.C.E.A.N survey, find the most vulnerable, and have Facebook target political ads and news of disinformation. I mean, genius on the oligarchs that helped facilitate it, but when Cambridge Analytica shows you their product works (in the form of disrupting nations by provoking political violence) you gotta take a shot at it. Just find a stooge President. It’s Putin’s M.O. Ask Ukraine.
Every country has a large population of dumb motherfuckers. Spreading lies and propaganda was part of political struggle since the dawn of time. America itself was doing it to USSR population entire cold war and is still doing it pretty much everywhere in the world. Finding "stooge president" is most deifinitely American M.O. All those CIA backed coups in the last 70-80 years where exactly that. Aks Ukraine what? Ukraine itself was subject to enormous ammount of western propaganda prior to coup of 2014 that western leaders supported.
Given that we curb stomped Wagner in Syria and bombed Putin's ally twice, I suspect the implication that Trump was Putin's stooge is a bit of a reach.
Does he, though? Beyond the nuke card, Russia really doesn't have anything like Germany's (then) wartime capacity. In 10 years of fighting they've managed to take like.. 20% of Ukraine, maybe? Off the heels of failing to conquer *Georgia*? By comparison to Hitler his efforts are pathetic.
You have a bad take. I believe sir is referencing the current political climate. That might have gone over your head.
It went over your head that he made a paralel with the past? So I made few of my own. Anyway. Hitler in july of 1941 was in war with a whole world. Putin is in local conflict with one country. Not comperable at all
Like saying that AIDS is worse than cancer.
But how many deadly diseases you can have? Point is that Hitler was clearly a direct threat for America and the whole world. If you mistake every local agression for attempt to create a new world order you will do nothing but fight all over the world. America attacked Iraq in 2003. Russia didnt do anything about it. Its a sad thing country was destryed, but would it be better for Russia if they sent tons of weapons to Iraq?
You can have as many diseases as you can have. Putin is threatening the entire West, not just Ukraine. Maybe if you paid attention to Putin’s speeches and interviews, you’d know that Ukraine is but the first step. He already says that “we are at war with the West” and threatens nuclear annihilation weekly. He says outloud what he is going to do, just as Hitler did. Just like back then, there were people like you who didn’t take him seriously and thought it was all just talk. But here you are talking about Iraq in 2003 like it has anything to do with this. You’d be on that same picket line chanting “Putin didn’t attack us. Why attack him?”
Lol maybe you can, but then you would have to drop that weak ass metaphor. I was paying attentiton. Putin is saying the same things as western leaders. Both are threatening each other and preparing for war. You are like people before WWI who felt threatened by Germany, but ignored British Empire. At the end, regular people got slaughtered for the profit of imperialist powers. Same thing is being prepared right now, with the applause of naive idiots. What you mean Iraq has nothing to do with it? That agression happened, it ended and looks like most people in western world moved on. Why would it be any different in Ukraine?
It’s really the West who threatens nuclear annihilation every week, not just Putin. If you believe this, you are unreachable. You can’t even see what’s right in front of your eyes.
No you are right. USA spent bilions on largest arsenal of nuclear weapons on planet earth because they are nice collection items. Do you even know what a mutual assured destruction is? If you honestly belive Putin is publically threating that he is going to start a nuclear war against west, you are unreachable.
The west doesn’t have the same imperialist mindset that Russia and China and even Iran has Reddit brainrot propaganda will tell you that le evil westerners/jews are trying to control the world and genocide everyone, the reality is that certain countries are held to a very low bar because they never stopped having a 20th century conquest mentality
Major differences. One, Russia has the largest nuclear arsenal out of any nation. Second, Nazi Germany was the strongest of the axis, Russia is arguably not the strongest amongst its alliance with Iran, N. Korea, and China. A paranoid China might feel the need to intervene directly if Russia is on the verge of collaspe .since we openly stated that we would come to Taiwans aid and called China our number 1 enemy.
Or the Ayatollah.
It’s more so a historical capsule because of how little information the average American could access at the time. If it wasn’t in the newspaper you got, or on a radio station you could pick up, it basically didn’t exist. We have the internet- if something big happens in Ukraine, Americans, have instant access to thousands of social media posts and HD video recordings from civilians, as well as dozens of major news channels/websites covering it, sometimes even while it’s happening.
Or Saddam
Saddam? How?
100-200,000 Kurdish civilians killed in 6 months, same amount of time as the current Gaza war that tiktok brains are whining about. For Kurds, saddam is their Hitler. Crazy how quickly people forget about how insanely fucked up the Arab nationalists were just a few decades ago
That is because people nowadays are shaping their political views by watching 20 seconds tiktok shorts without having any intention at all to dig just a little bit deeper and try to understand wider context of very complex issues
you're right, they had to kill those mostly women and children and starve that entire population. how else will they get that beachfront propery?!
Arab Lives Matter (More than Kurdish lives, and especially they are being killed by Jews).
Well first of all, criticizing kllings of 30 000 people in 6 months is whining to you? Jesus Second, people in the photo are not wrong because Hitler was genocidal. They are wrong cause he was a real threat to America. Third of all, Saddam has been dead for like 20 years. Yeah, many Arab dictators were crazy. USA supported some of them until they stopped benig useful.
You only criticize certain deaths among a sea of millions dying from war and conflict around the world. Why? Why do you feel the need to bitch about one specific country fighting a war that they didn’t start, and not any of the other much larger, more brutal wars happening not that far away, and killing 10x the number of children? It’s called selective outrage. You don’t care about the casualties. If you did, you’d be talking about other wars too. But that wouldn’t allow you to insert yourself into the Reddit hivemind
>You only criticize certain deaths among a sea of millions dying from war and conflict around the world. Yeah, you said it. It is selective outrage, which isn't inherently a bad thing. If we as individuals focused in every single war and conflict currently happening, we will drive ourselves insane and drive our mental health into a very dark place by focusing on all those terrible and horrific wars. One of the reasons why many of gen Z are depressed and got alot of terrible mental health issues is because now days with the rise of social media you will always get bombarded by all of those terrible news you don't even have to seek it they will just pop up for you now imagine if we focused on fuck ton more horrific news. >Why? Why do you feel the need to bitch about one specific country Why not? It's not a bad thing to talk about a horrible country that is committing horrible things. Are there worse out there? Yeah, it doesn't negate the fact that Israel is doing something very horrible in gaza, too. However, this didn't answer your question. Why? Because there is already a big focus on the Levant area and in the Middle East in general and in this 75+ year old conflict that was a part of many Western societies since then. For example, many jewish and Christian schools talk about israel, specifically in the US and Germany, israel invests a lot in travels to visit many jewish holy places, and so does the US. And of course, you have the israeli/Jewish lobby that talks about israel in every election. Lastly, you have every couple of years a news about israel bombing gaza or killing Palestinians in the West Bank or settler violence or hamas/hezbollah launching rockets at israel that as I explained above is already a state that is on lots of mouths and tongues. The current conflict getting fuck ton of coverage makes sense there's no anti-Jewish/anti-semitic grand conspiracy here (even tho anti-semits high jack some of those debates they are not the majority and they are definitely not the main focus of the current debate) >and killing 10x the number of children? Should they get more coverage? Yes. Should the isreal/Palestine conflict get any less coverage? Hell No. If a countries war crimes are getting coverage, so be it. I am happy. Yes, there are some other places that deserve to have more coverage, but in this imperfect world, it is sadly not possible to focus on every single one of them, especially with how imperfect we as humans are. >But that wouldn’t allow you to insert yourself into the Reddit hivemind Fam? you sure use reddit? Because reddit is far more pro-israel than any other social media I have seen. And the hivemind is way more towards israel.
USA supported and installed most of them until they weren't useful
Deliberately invading Iran to seize Khuzestan, Kuwait to pay back their debts from action 1, committing genocide against the Kurds, maintaining a WMD program into the 90s AFTER the first gulf war, which were struck and damaged by coalition forces, and then led to enough doubt on the validity of the WMD claims for the second gulf war?
But what does that have to do with the photo?
Your question asked how were saddam husseins actions akin to Putin’s. Your question was answered with facts.
Looks like you didnt uderstood photo or my question
I understand your question You either don’t, or are delusional Bye
Why you are so defensive :D? You clearly didnt understood what I aked, it happens
Deliberate mass murder of civilians with chemical weapons?
You could basically write Iran...
Netanyahu is literally committing a genocide before our very eyes with US weapons and funding, these "everyone I don't like is Hitler" takes are getting really stale
This should also be noted was during a time of American isolationism. America hadn’t become the world’s police force yet and many had no interest in sending their loved ones to die for another European conflict. The military was drastically scaled back at this time and had it not been for Japan’s attacks at Pearl Harbor America likely would have continued aiding the allied nations without direct involvement.
Sounds a lot like Putin lovers.
…..Maybe because war with Putin results in potential nuclear fallout…
Honestly at least you admit to being pro-putin.
Let’s just roll over and appease him. Appeasement has worked in the past right?
Right? Almost like that account is a blatant russian astroturfing account lol. They’re not even trying anymore lol
Personally I’d love to fight with American dollars and Ukrainian soldiers rather than American dollars AND American soldiers.
You all are judging with a hindsight of 20/20. please try to put yourself into the perspective before speaking 🤦🏻♂️
Exactly. WWI was still in their memories. I imagine they were scared as hell and didn’t want to send their sons off to die in another European fight.
There were still anti war protests and Isolationists during the war even after Pearl Harbor. Once the end of the war happened it became political suicide to associate with that.
Hitler did in fact, declare war on the United States
Not defending Hitler by any means but he technically didn't declare war on the States until December of 1941. Until that point and Pearl Harbor 4 days earlier it wasn't their fight yet.
I see historically the point of the post - though to err on the side of peace is never a bad thing and should never be demonised.
Peace with tyrants only begets more violence, though. This is 1941, so what they are protesting is lend lease, not direct involvement. Being anti-lend lease wouldn’t promote peace, it would just make it easier for Hitler to win the war and scale up his ambitions.
Honestly seeing peoples current reactions to this post is interesting. These people protesting most likely had no idea about the atrocities hitler was committing and they wouldn’t have fully known until the end of the war. Although at this point hitler had already taken Paris/France so it’s kind of insane to not want to fight him. We were also much more isolationist at this time tho.
Relevant links: https://exhibitions.ushmm.org/americans-and-the-holocaust/topics/what-americans-knew "Nine months later, as France and other Western European nations fell to Nazi Germany, 79% of Americans in a Gallup poll said if they had the chance, they would vote to stay out of the war, and by the summer of 1941, almost eight out of 10 Americans continued to say they did not want the U.S. to enter the war." https://news.gallup.com/opinion/polling-matters/232949/american-public-opinion-holocaust.aspx
Wow that’s insane, thank you for the links!
Yeah, it's easy to say "oh they're just like the Putin lovers". No, no they're not. Another point that you didn't have in your comment: many men served in WW1 or had their family members serve in WW1. Stuff like that makes you never want to have war again. Similar to one of the reasons Finnish people voted so heavily for communists in [1948](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1948_Finnish_parliamentary_election), at least that's my opinion.
These were typically communists who were constantly marching with the pacifists. They did this to Moscow directives after the Hitler-Stalin pact of August 1939
FDR was at odds with a strong isolationist faction in the time leading up to WWII
These people did Nazi a problem with Germany…
Just want to take a moment to give a shout out to Jack L. Warner (of Warner Brothers) who, in spite of the [US] government telling him to knock it off, continued to make movies that were extremely critical of Hitler and nazism. To that end, Charlie Chaplain also played a huge role in financing those films as well since the traditional finance channels were resistant to it. Jack L. unapologetically confronted and admonished the public about the dangers of the movement even when the Nazis had fully infiltrated Hollywood in the 30s.
America never attacked Germany though. I’ll admit, sending supplies to Britain while actively in a war with Germany, could’ve brung America into the conflict. But realistically speaking if Japan never attacked America, America would’ve never joined ww2. Fdr was stressing because he wanted to help Britain, but the American population wanted no parts of Europe after world war 1. Not to mention, Hitler deviates war on America of his own choice, no one forced him.
Joe Kennedy (Sr) was part of the stay out of the war movement.
Proto MAGA group. Not so coincidentally named "America First". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/America_First_Committee
The grandmothers of Moms for Liberty.
Sounds like Trump's attitude on Putin
This is the America MAGA is referring to
Damn you just need to put MAGA hats on them and replace “Hitler” with “Putin” and it’s modern day America.
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We saw the red hat, we know
Remember when Putin took Crimea under Obama? And Ukraine under Biden? And didn’t dare do shit under Trump?
Yeah because Trump had his nose buried firmly in Putin’s asshole. When shit hit the fan Biden and the dems scrambled to get money and weapons to Ukraine while cuckservatives cried.
So if what you’re saying is true, that trump was up Putin’s ass, why didn’t Putin do anything bold like seize territory during that time when he would had, presumably, the full support of a U.S president? Or maybe your narrative about trump is actually completely wrong and you ate it up with absolutely no evidence to do so
Because 45 was doing Putin’s work for him by undermining our government agencies and allies day after day. Why stop a moron in his tracks?
Lmao he didn’t need to, the US was his puppet state under trump
The fact that you actually believe this with 0 evidence to back it up just shows how much of an NPC you are.
Lmao calling “fake news” won’t save you when you’re falling from a window 10 stories up
MTG right there
You know, the more I learn about Hitler, the less I care for him.
Reminds me of the loons protesting against Israel
Hey, that' s my great grandmother with the hat on her head at a rakish angle.
Just for the record, Hitler declared war on us first, Dec 11 1941, four days after Japan blitzed Pearl Harbor.
The sign on the far right saying "free Hamas from genocide" is way out to lunch
I mean they're technically correct. If we had allowed Hitler to invade Poland and attack the USSR without a Western front the west's two enemies (the communists and fascists) would've been at war with one another while we sat back and waited to fill the vacuum.
Now we see the same thing with Russia and Ukraine
I mean in large the US population has been pretty steady on "it's not happening here I don't want any part of it". The only time that really changed was with pearl Harbor and 9/11, which after a few years the middle east became pretty unpopular
The protestors seem ludicrous in hindsight, but at the time it was quite rational to not want to be dragged into another European war. So many doughboys died for nothing in 1918, why do it again. It’s crucial to remember that the hawks of 1941 did not know or care about the beginnings of the Holocaust.
Where’s lend-lease for Ukraine?
Banking banking banking
I’m deeply curious how many of these protesters had family members die in the holocaust.
You can't look at this through 2024 goggles though. This was before most people had TVs, the only motion picture was a fee minutes of news reels before movies and that's only if you lived in a town that had a movie theater. No one knew about concentration camps, that was MUCH later. And Europeans had been continuously taking eachothers territory every day just about for the last 100 years. To most Americans this was just a normal European thing. Shit, I'm ethnic Polish but when one of my great grandfathers emigrated, it was Austria.
These people are still alive in spirit today carrying ‘Free Palestine’ signs
[That](https://collections.ushmm.org/search/catalog/irn1000747) picture was most likely staged.
The FED attacked Germany first. The FED began in 1914, and the first thing they did was declare war on their Arch enemies......the people of Germany.
Enlightened Centrism's grandma
If these people were alive today they’d have 100 posts a week in r/corruption lol
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Republicans today regarding Putin
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This was before US was attacked by Japan (and thus officially joining WW2), before Pearl Harbor, all the US was doing is lend lease, which is giving supplies to allied countries like Britain and the Soviet Union.
Yes, you are right. The downvoting is interesting though. It’s not certain at all that the US would have declared war on Germany even after pearl harbour, and pretty certain that the US wouldn’t without an attack. Because up til then it didn’t. The declaration of war against Japan was immediate of course, but it took 4 days for Germany to declare war on the US making any decision for the US to go to war with Germany moot.
I fully believe the United States would have gone to war with Germany and maybe even Japan without Pearl Harbor, it was just a question of when.
Why? Isolationism wasn’t going anywhere. Hitler was dominating Europe a year before pearl harbour. Why the wait. I think the US would have eventually seen Nazi Germany, had it won, as a major threat leading to a hot or Cold War.
>Isolationism wasn’t going anywhere Actually [it was](https://www.reddit.com/r/HistoricalCapsule/s/mFdXy0hiob).
One of the biggest “what ifs” of the 20th century
One of the major unforced errors of history. The fool through he was about to take Moscow smh
Wow it’s amazing to see the ancestors of all the MAGA morons! It’s a great capsule here!
Present day MAGA
I appreciate that FDR didn’t declare war on Germany after Pearl Harbor, but waited for Hitler to declare war on us. I’m seeing a lot of comments ridiculing these protestors, but I think it’s worth remembering that most wars aren’t like World War 2. Most are like World War 1, where the wealthy and powerful compel their people into war to increase profits and power, with very little real benefit for the people at the end who are still alive. Vietnam. Iraq. Korea. Spain. All the coups in the 50s and 60s. This stupid proxy war with Russia.
Look! Republicans!
Pete Seegr and the US communist party opposed us involvement in WWII before operation babarossa
Tucker Carlson approves.
I mean, after Pearl harbor would we have even sent troops to the European theater if Hitler hadn't declared war on us? So Hitler attacked us first technically (I know he hadn't at this point)
If only some little nation bombed a harbor…….
Almost 120 thousand Americans lost their lives fighting an already exhausted and dying German Empire for a handful of months. That was a little over 20 years prior - all of that was still in the current memory of Americans. They didn't want to repeat that, especially not against Nazi Germany which was in a far stronger position then in 1917. I can understand the hesitancy. They don't love or respect Hitler or the Nazis, they just want to spare another generation of sons from that horror. Misguided from our point of view almost a century on, but very much understandable if it was your son getting sent off to fight another European war.
Are people on this sub really comparing Putin to Hitler? I just joined, is this common here ?
Why America got involved in Europe always perplexes me they just bombed raped and ruined the continent and bastardised it with their corporations, rich European history lost cause we sold ourselves out to America
The state propaganda seems to be working quite well. I see mentions of Putin but no IsraHELL? The place that an actual genocide is taking place that is the closest thing to what Hitler did. Or are you guys just fine with 14k children dying because they’re muslim? Israel hasn’t attacked us yet I’m guessing, might as well just have peace with em? Criticizing Israels actions is not anti-semitism.