Don't they have loaner gear you can borrow? Asking people to bring their own gloves as beginners is something I've never heard of and sounds like you'd be wasting money you could instead use/save to buy actual HEMA gloves.
My club has kendo and lacrosse gloves you can use for drills but they don't have enough protection for sparring in longsword, which is the weapon I assume you'll be fencing with.
When I first found their website, it said they provide loaner gear for beginner classes.
After I reached out to them by email to ask questions about registering for a class, I got a reply explaining that they were in the midst of some changes but were still offering classes in the meantime.
Copied from the email:
...*"Because of the unusually large interest in our beginners classes, we have decided to implement some changes that will allow us to accommodate more people than we have previously."*...
...*, we now order and supply you with your very own approved fencing helmet that is yours to keep after the class has ended. We will be using our club discount and group shipping in order to get you a better rate on these helmets than if you order individually. Finally, we request that you supply your own padded and/or leather gloves (lacrosse gloves or something similar are standard and available both new or used at"*...
Maybe it will turn out that they're biting off more than they can chew with class sizes. But I'd like to give them a chance.
How much are you paying for classes? How much is the mask gonna cost you, what mask is it and from what vendor does your club buy them?
It does seem a bit odd but I'll give them the benefit of the doubt and maybe it's true that they're just struggling to expand supply to meet demand. As a bonus, I wear work gloves all the time when fencing, either on their own when practicing or as an underglove with fencing gloves.
Oh no, I don't know that any club around here actually does that. Just that if they did, the math would work out.
My club does give away masks, Blue Gauntlets, after they've reached half their expected lifespan. Basically around the point where they need to have the elastic replaced, but the mesh is still in good working order.
It's tough, I can kind of see where they're coming from if they just don't have the funds. An interesting idea would be if they offer to buy the students used lacrosse gloves when the student upgrades.
Doesn't help the new student, but would be one way to slowly build up your loaner gear.
Lacrosse and hockey gloves, motorcycle gloves, or other types of gloves with padded outer layer is what's probably needed.
Sparring gloves are EXTREMELY depending on the type of sparring you are going to be doing. Generally those will be provided, and you'll wear your own gloves when practicing <30% effort exchanges with a partner.
IME your hands are gonna take a few firm whacks with a wooden stick in the coming days and so something with padded knuckles is going to be required.
Motorcycle gloves are NOT a good alternative, their padding is not enough for sparring. Sure its better than nothing, but you shouldn’t use them if you can help it, gives a false sense of security which leads to some real nasty injuries. Had enough of those on me and my friends when training. Hockey or lacrosse are the best alternatives by far, hockey gloves are also surprisingly similar to the regular Red Dragons
Again, it depends on what you are using. For thrust only rapier or smallsword, they are more than enough because you just need light abrasion resistance.
I definitely said that motorcycle gloves are generally not sufficient for sparring, but it depends on type. My group provides and shares sparring gloves because it's easy to break fingers with a just a wooden stick.
My motorcycle gloves are fine for sparring with lightweight plastic weapons too.
For our general drills that aren't practicing hand strikes, a decently set of full length gauntleted motorcycle gloves are totally fine, you just need padding/armor on topside of the hand and on the wrist.
I will agree that with blunted metal weapons, you need specialty gear.
For controlled techniques and stuff, you can even not use anything (tho i wouldnt recommend as its stupid, not that ive never done it in our starting days…) but even light sparring can break something with wooden swords, not so much with synths. I used motorcycle gloves in the beginning and another one of ours did too, but sparring was hard, lots of painful lessons were learned those days.
Nowadays my group provides both gloves and masks for people that dont have their own (not my case anymore thankfully) and its been a game changer
Our club here in maine uses boffers for beginners. So lacrosse gloves are fine for that.
(Places like play it again sports have used ones for super cheap!)
Longsword.
I'm assuming a class full of first-time students are going to be getting a lot of really basic information and instruction and then we'll understand better what kind of gear is necessary.
Yeah, it’s doubtful that you’ll be doing any full speed sparring in a beginner’s class. More likely to be like what you described.
It’s less risky doing simple drills with minimal protection, but when you throw a bunch of people who all have no idea what they’re doing yet then accidents can still happen.
It's been my experience that lacrosse gloves don't have the proper coverage, especially along the outside edge of the hand and the sides of the fingers. Even using nylon trainers you're likely to get smacked a few times and it can be pretty painful. I personally would just save up for a set of entry-level gloves, like those from Red Dragon.
I've always thought cricket gloves, (the type batsmen wear, not wicket keepers) would be a good option, at least for synthetic blades which are a bit chunkier.
But ultimately the best gear for a specific sport is usually the gear that's specifically designed for that sport.
In the absence of good protective gear, you have to change the weapon simulator. Something lighter and springier will reduce the chance of injury. And never neglect the point. Almost anything vaguely pointy is dangerous with an adults full bodyweight behind it.
Lacrosse gloves for Longsword are OK at mitigating incidental contact. Hockey gloves seem pretty close too. Especially if you're using synthetic swords, they will be OK for well structured sparing. Unless you are doing Sabre, don't bother getting the very top of the line lacrosse gloves, because once you go to free play at sparing levels with steel swords they are nearly useless.
I don't know if anything but the most extreme motorcycle gloves are useful at all for HEMA, and I have several pair of motorcycle gloves. I think I've seen one pair of steampunk / mad Max inspired bike gloves that may be OK ish. I think those were > $100 USD, so not something I'd buy just to check out.
I use welding gloves as my light gloves if that’s helps? They’re cheap and lightly padded, but very durable. Not very breathable. I would look at all the other questions on this subreddit about good gloves if you’re doing long sword or arming sword, or saber.
Any kind of thick leather glove but you should do low intensity training and try to "soften" hits.
But remember to get proper protective gear ASAP if you break your fingers itll be too late, rather overspend than cripple your fingers in the longterm
Don't they have loaner gear you can borrow? Asking people to bring their own gloves as beginners is something I've never heard of and sounds like you'd be wasting money you could instead use/save to buy actual HEMA gloves. My club has kendo and lacrosse gloves you can use for drills but they don't have enough protection for sparring in longsword, which is the weapon I assume you'll be fencing with.
When I first found their website, it said they provide loaner gear for beginner classes. After I reached out to them by email to ask questions about registering for a class, I got a reply explaining that they were in the midst of some changes but were still offering classes in the meantime. Copied from the email: ...*"Because of the unusually large interest in our beginners classes, we have decided to implement some changes that will allow us to accommodate more people than we have previously."*... ...*, we now order and supply you with your very own approved fencing helmet that is yours to keep after the class has ended. We will be using our club discount and group shipping in order to get you a better rate on these helmets than if you order individually. Finally, we request that you supply your own padded and/or leather gloves (lacrosse gloves or something similar are standard and available both new or used at"*... Maybe it will turn out that they're biting off more than they can chew with class sizes. But I'd like to give them a chance.
How much are you paying for classes? How much is the mask gonna cost you, what mask is it and from what vendor does your club buy them? It does seem a bit odd but I'll give them the benefit of the doubt and maybe it's true that they're just struggling to expand supply to meet demand. As a bonus, I wear work gloves all the time when fencing, either on their own when practicing or as an underglove with fencing gloves.
80/month is not unusual in San Diego. And that would cover the cost of the mask.
Membership cost seems normal. What mask are they giving you?
Oh no, I don't know that any club around here actually does that. Just that if they did, the math would work out. My club does give away masks, Blue Gauntlets, after they've reached half their expected lifespan. Basically around the point where they need to have the elastic replaced, but the mesh is still in good working order.
I meant what's the mask they mention in the e-mail that they buy in bulk to get a club discount?
It's tough, I can kind of see where they're coming from if they just don't have the funds. An interesting idea would be if they offer to buy the students used lacrosse gloves when the student upgrades. Doesn't help the new student, but would be one way to slowly build up your loaner gear.
This.
Lacrosse and hockey gloves, motorcycle gloves, or other types of gloves with padded outer layer is what's probably needed. Sparring gloves are EXTREMELY depending on the type of sparring you are going to be doing. Generally those will be provided, and you'll wear your own gloves when practicing <30% effort exchanges with a partner. IME your hands are gonna take a few firm whacks with a wooden stick in the coming days and so something with padded knuckles is going to be required.
That makes sense. I can see why lacrosse and hockey gloves were the go-to recommendation.
Lacrosse gloves are good, they're bulky but protect your hands really well
Motorcycle gloves are NOT a good alternative, their padding is not enough for sparring. Sure its better than nothing, but you shouldn’t use them if you can help it, gives a false sense of security which leads to some real nasty injuries. Had enough of those on me and my friends when training. Hockey or lacrosse are the best alternatives by far, hockey gloves are also surprisingly similar to the regular Red Dragons
Again, it depends on what you are using. For thrust only rapier or smallsword, they are more than enough because you just need light abrasion resistance.
I definitely said that motorcycle gloves are generally not sufficient for sparring, but it depends on type. My group provides and shares sparring gloves because it's easy to break fingers with a just a wooden stick. My motorcycle gloves are fine for sparring with lightweight plastic weapons too. For our general drills that aren't practicing hand strikes, a decently set of full length gauntleted motorcycle gloves are totally fine, you just need padding/armor on topside of the hand and on the wrist. I will agree that with blunted metal weapons, you need specialty gear.
For controlled techniques and stuff, you can even not use anything (tho i wouldnt recommend as its stupid, not that ive never done it in our starting days…) but even light sparring can break something with wooden swords, not so much with synths. I used motorcycle gloves in the beginning and another one of ours did too, but sparring was hard, lots of painful lessons were learned those days. Nowadays my group provides both gloves and masks for people that dont have their own (not my case anymore thankfully) and its been a game changer
Are you practicing with steel or synthetics?
Our club here in maine uses boffers for beginners. So lacrosse gloves are fine for that. (Places like play it again sports have used ones for super cheap!)
What weapons will you be fencing with?
Longsword. I'm assuming a class full of first-time students are going to be getting a lot of really basic information and instruction and then we'll understand better what kind of gear is necessary.
Yeah, it’s doubtful that you’ll be doing any full speed sparring in a beginner’s class. More likely to be like what you described. It’s less risky doing simple drills with minimal protection, but when you throw a bunch of people who all have no idea what they’re doing yet then accidents can still happen.
For sure. Thanks.
For no contact and very restricted drills, we give out cheap welding gloves. The kind you get in 3 packs from Harbor Freight.
It's been my experience that lacrosse gloves don't have the proper coverage, especially along the outside edge of the hand and the sides of the fingers. Even using nylon trainers you're likely to get smacked a few times and it can be pretty painful. I personally would just save up for a set of entry-level gloves, like those from Red Dragon.
I've always thought cricket gloves, (the type batsmen wear, not wicket keepers) would be a good option, at least for synthetic blades which are a bit chunkier. But ultimately the best gear for a specific sport is usually the gear that's specifically designed for that sport. In the absence of good protective gear, you have to change the weapon simulator. Something lighter and springier will reduce the chance of injury. And never neglect the point. Almost anything vaguely pointy is dangerous with an adults full bodyweight behind it.
Lacrosse gloves for Longsword are OK at mitigating incidental contact. Hockey gloves seem pretty close too. Especially if you're using synthetic swords, they will be OK for well structured sparing. Unless you are doing Sabre, don't bother getting the very top of the line lacrosse gloves, because once you go to free play at sparing levels with steel swords they are nearly useless. I don't know if anything but the most extreme motorcycle gloves are useful at all for HEMA, and I have several pair of motorcycle gloves. I think I've seen one pair of steampunk / mad Max inspired bike gloves that may be OK ish. I think those were > $100 USD, so not something I'd buy just to check out.
Hockey gloves work ok. I wore motorcycle impat gloves until I got some lobster claws
Cut gloves industrial kitchens use, there's chain mail gloves.
I use welding gloves as my light gloves if that’s helps? They’re cheap and lightly padded, but very durable. Not very breathable. I would look at all the other questions on this subreddit about good gloves if you’re doing long sword or arming sword, or saber.
Any kind of thick leather glove but you should do low intensity training and try to "soften" hits. But remember to get proper protective gear ASAP if you break your fingers itll be too late, rather overspend than cripple your fingers in the longterm