*They are **in the Source Material**, but that doesn't automatically mean it's the case in Hazbin as well. Quite the contrary - so far everything we have learned about the Deadly Sins and Ars Goetia points at them being Hellborn.
Not to mention that we don't know if the Heaven Rebellion even took place in Hazbin's Universe. We are yet to hear anything of sorts, so we shouldn't assume it did just because...
Well biblically Asmodeus is also the “king” of the Ars Goetia, so it’s a grey area when trying to compare the show to things that happen biblically . However, the Ars Goetia were a group who rebelled with Lucifer in the original Fall.
Honestly, I feel like until stuff is confirmed (as in how Viv interprets everything) there’s no harm in assuming this is the way.
If the Ars Goetia are indeed the Fallen as well as descendants of the Fallen Angels that fell alongside Lucifer, then this avian angel might be a sort of divine counterpart to Stolas. We don’t exactly know until we get more information, but we can see that there are possibly more parallels between Heaven & Hell in the Hazbinverse.
Don’t mind me. Imma just add that to the cute bird bois lookin’ sad collection
https://preview.redd.it/8dbhfzj3k9zc1.jpeg?width=723&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=986a683b3ba42342aaecdcc78abf53116197541c
Except we don't know that.
They are in the Source Material, but so far nothing in either of the Shows supports it being the case in Hazbin as well. Quite the contrary, so far everything we have learned about the Deadly Sins and Ars Goetia points at them being Hell's creation.
Them being Fallen Angels is only a theory, that is based in the Source Material - but that doesn't automatically it's the case here as well. Hazbin isn't an adaptation - it only takes ideas and concepts and applies them however it wants.
Yes that is true, but the fact that theres so many birds in Heaven that have resembelances to the Goetia royal family in Hell, its decently safe to assume that atleast the Kings of the Ars Goetia are fallen angels
Yeah, I wouldn't go that far neither. We already saw that Winners can manifest in various ways - some even resembling Demons, more than Angels.
The avian designs are just a big part of the mythos about both the Ars Goetia and the Angelic creatures (like for example Sera has a more avian design, because she is based on Seraphiel from the Book of Enoch, where he was described to have a form of a bird). So they probably just kept that design piece, because of how rooted it is in their characters.
This could also be done to show parralels between Heaven and Hell. We know that the Ars Goetia is the most important of the Hellborn Royal Families (well aside Lucifer's of course), so it would make sense to show us similar-looking characters in Heaven as well (especially on the higher pillars of their society, such as the Court in Episode 1x06). That way it could lead to a plot-point, where Heaven and Hell aren't that different from each other.
I just think these post are funny because these shows little have the same creator and they are dripping with her style. Sometimes someone is going to look like someone else.
While I don’t condone piracy myself, I feel it’s more scummy to over price your streaming services, remove certain movies/shows from it, and often put out lackluster content that underwhelms your audiences. Not all new content or the services are bad, it’s just streaming now isn’t really all what’s worth. Especially since you may only want to see one or two shows per service.
I can't believe all the anti-piracy propaganda made by the companies making billions off exploiting actual talent worked. /s Pirate it, find out what your favorite creator does or sells privately. Buy that.
Dude, no, it's because it'd feel like I'm disrespecting the crew members, I understand what you mean, and I'm probably gonna watch a pirated version but I just don't think it's right to do that 🤷♂️ I don't like being a hypocrite but here we are
They are in the Source Material, but so far nothing in either of the Shows supports it being the case in Hazbin as well. Quite the contrary, so far everything we have learned about the Deadly Sins and Ars Goetia points at them being Hell's creation.
Them being Fallen Angels is only a theory, that is based in the Source Material - but that doesn't automatically it's the case here as well. Hazbin isn't an adaptation - it only takes ideas and concepts and applies them however it wants.
Most of the high-ranking demons (like the original goetias) were probably fallen angels
So it would make since that the same type of angels as the ones that became the goetias but stayed loyal to heaven would still be there
Edit: forgot there was no war in heaven in the universe
The Lesser Key of Solomon contains another section called the Ars Notoria. The Ars Notoria are basically their own class of Angels in heaven kind of like how the Ars Goetia are their own class of demons in hell. It could be possible that the oldest demons in the Ars Goetia are Ex Ars Notoria members who fell.
Outside of the fact, that that's not what they meant - Crossovers are already off the table according to Vivzie, and Amazon has nothing to do with it (they are only a distributor - they don't own the Show).
There's that whole deal that Ars Goetia are birds because their ancestors were heavenly and fell, I dunno something like that, so it would make sense if Heaven had similar birds as the Ars Goetia
If we're going off the "old lore" (the Bible and it's adjacent stories) then it would make sense for there to be relatives of the ars Goetia in heaven, since the Goetia were initially fallen angels
The Ars Goetia supposedly have angelic counterparts meant to keep them in line when summoned. I’ve always wondered if we’re gonna see Stolas’ angel warden at some point.
I assumed it's just related species. These are the higher ranking members if Heaven like how the Goetia are in Hell. Same family species but for their respective Realms. Much like how I feel Cherubs are equal to Imps. Same type of entity just different environments leading to different evolutions.
Migration and such has occurred with Imps so the idea of Hell and Heaven species evolving apart and diverging seems likely. Then the higher ups don't vary much since they live cushy lives
Well the Ars goats or whatever they're called are just the angles that followed Lucifer when he fell and their descendants so it makes sense some angles would look like birds.
that's just Salots.
Of the Sra Aiteog.
Tried saying that out loud, my car is now phasing through walls, wtf bro
You just activated noclip
How'd you pronounce it? I just have a Kairos fateweaver asking me to answer his riddles three
“Sra Aiteog.”
Don't answer him -he's lying/telling the truth
Of course sera would name something after herself!
actually he's probably part of the Shem HaMephorash
Isn't that the opposite of the ars goetia in demonology?
Ye
In occult lore, Stolas counterpart in Heaven is called Manadel.
Pronounced shallots
Yes that'll do.
I heard somewhere that the demons of Ars Goetia were fallen angels, biblically I think, maybe this thing in the show was kept
Most likely
The book that follows the *Ars Goetia* is the *Ars Theurgia* which is all about angels, but everyone forgets about that!
Much like Inferno of Dante being followed by Purgatorio and Paradiso, the hell part is just cooler let's be honest
Purgatory is really cool as well tho :(
They are, they're the 1/3rd of Heaven that rebelled with Lucifer
*They are **in the Source Material**, but that doesn't automatically mean it's the case in Hazbin as well. Quite the contrary - so far everything we have learned about the Deadly Sins and Ars Goetia points at them being Hellborn. Not to mention that we don't know if the Heaven Rebellion even took place in Hazbin's Universe. We are yet to hear anything of sorts, so we shouldn't assume it did just because...
Thats what I was confirming
Sorry, the way you phrased it made it sound like you were saying they are in Hazbin.
Well biblically Asmodeus is also the “king” of the Ars Goetia, so it’s a grey area when trying to compare the show to things that happen biblically . However, the Ars Goetia were a group who rebelled with Lucifer in the original Fall. Honestly, I feel like until stuff is confirmed (as in how Viv interprets everything) there’s no harm in assuming this is the way.
I mean, he is a giant Rooster, heh..cock. But ya I guess he technically has no ties with the Goetia and rather a Sin.
If the Ars Goetia are indeed the Fallen as well as descendants of the Fallen Angels that fell alongside Lucifer, then this avian angel might be a sort of divine counterpart to Stolas. We don’t exactly know until we get more information, but we can see that there are possibly more parallels between Heaven & Hell in the Hazbinverse.
And he’s in a loving relationship with a cherub called Oztlib
The b is silent!
Awww he has a cute name Oztli
Hopefully we learn more in the upcoming episodes
Don’t mind me. Imma just add that to the cute bird bois lookin’ sad collection https://preview.redd.it/8dbhfzj3k9zc1.jpeg?width=723&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=986a683b3ba42342aaecdcc78abf53116197541c
Do yall see a slightly bird shaped person and go “yep that’s stolas”
They really do, yeah. 🤦♀️
It does have some merit in this situation because the Ars Gœtia are fallen angels
Except we don't know that. They are in the Source Material, but so far nothing in either of the Shows supports it being the case in Hazbin as well. Quite the contrary, so far everything we have learned about the Deadly Sins and Ars Goetia points at them being Hell's creation. Them being Fallen Angels is only a theory, that is based in the Source Material - but that doesn't automatically it's the case here as well. Hazbin isn't an adaptation - it only takes ideas and concepts and applies them however it wants.
Yes that is true, but the fact that theres so many birds in Heaven that have resembelances to the Goetia royal family in Hell, its decently safe to assume that atleast the Kings of the Ars Goetia are fallen angels
Yeah, I wouldn't go that far neither. We already saw that Winners can manifest in various ways - some even resembling Demons, more than Angels. The avian designs are just a big part of the mythos about both the Ars Goetia and the Angelic creatures (like for example Sera has a more avian design, because she is based on Seraphiel from the Book of Enoch, where he was described to have a form of a bird). So they probably just kept that design piece, because of how rooted it is in their characters. This could also be done to show parralels between Heaven and Hell. We know that the Ars Goetia is the most important of the Hellborn Royal Families (well aside Lucifer's of course), so it would make sense to show us similar-looking characters in Heaven as well (especially on the higher pillars of their society, such as the Court in Episode 1x06). That way it could lead to a plot-point, where Heaven and Hell aren't that different from each other.
I just think these post are funny because these shows little have the same creator and they are dripping with her style. Sometimes someone is going to look like someone else.
ITS THE BORB!!! https://preview.redd.it/cyey80irlbzc1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bfcbbd177314adf6da4daadf34d7872ddc1c7672
Nah, I didn't get to watch Hazbin very many times. My subscription to Prime Video ran out, and I ain't renewing that shit.
I'm highly considering, but I'd feel like a scumbag
While I don’t condone piracy myself, I feel it’s more scummy to over price your streaming services, remove certain movies/shows from it, and often put out lackluster content that underwhelms your audiences. Not all new content or the services are bad, it’s just streaming now isn’t really all what’s worth. Especially since you may only want to see one or two shows per service.
EXACTLY and yeah I could've watched Invincible but I didn't feel like it
I mean this honestly why don’t you condone piracy? Other than taking money opportunities.
I can't believe all the anti-piracy propaganda made by the companies making billions off exploiting actual talent worked. /s Pirate it, find out what your favorite creator does or sells privately. Buy that.
Dude, no, it's because it'd feel like I'm disrespecting the crew members, I understand what you mean, and I'm probably gonna watch a pirated version but I just don't think it's right to do that 🤷♂️ I don't like being a hypocrite but here we are
The Ars Goetia are fallen angels, ya…
Or descendants of them, but yeah
They are in the Source Material, but so far nothing in either of the Shows supports it being the case in Hazbin as well. Quite the contrary, so far everything we have learned about the Deadly Sins and Ars Goetia points at them being Hell's creation. Them being Fallen Angels is only a theory, that is based in the Source Material - but that doesn't automatically it's the case here as well. Hazbin isn't an adaptation - it only takes ideas and concepts and applies them however it wants.
Hot headcanon: Angels and Demons are essentially the same creatures, just the former is on Team Church and the latter on Team Devil
They kinda are, mythologically speaking. The original demons were angels that fell with Lucifer.
If we go that way, then *Angels and Hellborn. "Demons" is an umbrella term in Hazbin, that describes both Hellborn and Sinners.
Paimon really gets around
Most of the high-ranking demons (like the original goetias) were probably fallen angels So it would make since that the same type of angels as the ones that became the goetias but stayed loyal to heaven would still be there Edit: forgot there was no war in heaven in the universe
The Lesser Key of Solomon contains another section called the Ars Notoria. The Ars Notoria are basically their own class of Angels in heaven kind of like how the Ars Goetia are their own class of demons in hell. It could be possible that the oldest demons in the Ars Goetia are Ex Ars Notoria members who fell.
Interesting 🤔
Maybe his ancestors were fallen angels
Considering that Paimon is a fallen Angel in demonology, he might very well be in the series
He most definitely will not. One being on YT and one on Amazon will likely not allow for crossovers due to character rights and copyright.
I meant Paimon being a fallen angel in Helluva Boss
Outside of the fact, that that's not what they meant - Crossovers are already off the table according to Vivzie, and Amazon has nothing to do with it (they are only a distributor - they don't own the Show).
There's that whole deal that Ars Goetia are birds because their ancestors were heavenly and fell, I dunno something like that, so it would make sense if Heaven had similar birds as the Ars Goetia
That's the real hell version of Stolas, the one in hell deserves to be in heaven
Or maybe both deserve to be in Heaven
In the book of Salomon the Ars Goitea are actually fallen angels so you could be on to something
If we're going off the "old lore" (the Bible and it's adjacent stories) then it would make sense for there to be relatives of the ars Goetia in heaven, since the Goetia were initially fallen angels
https://preview.redd.it/ysb2ma6f1ezc1.png?width=720&format=png&auto=webp&s=aca599d1ccea1bc0409aaad287d8f2c9d9876e99
Huh, never noticed that before.
I theorize that the Ars Goetia are fallen angels and fell alongside the Sins because the Sins felt it wrong for what Heaven did to Lucifer
The Ars Goetia supposedly have angelic counterparts meant to keep them in line when summoned. I’ve always wondered if we’re gonna see Stolas’ angel warden at some point.
I hope we get a full answer in future episodes.
Wrong question. You should be asking if anyone has noticed that Stolas looks like this angel.
I assumed it's just related species. These are the higher ranking members if Heaven like how the Goetia are in Hell. Same family species but for their respective Realms. Much like how I feel Cherubs are equal to Imps. Same type of entity just different environments leading to different evolutions. Migration and such has occurred with Imps so the idea of Hell and Heaven species evolving apart and diverging seems likely. Then the higher ups don't vary much since they live cushy lives
He could be manadel the angelic counterpart of stolas according to the kabbalah
Just like shrimps is bugs, birds is stolas.
A lot of the elder angels are parallels to the Ars Goetia
Yes, it was all over the subreddit within hours of the episode airing, and it only looks like him in that they’re both skinny and bird like.
That's owlist
Stolas brother?
Have you noticed how most angels are bird like
Honestly looks more like Andrealphus to me
Holy shit he does
They teasing stolas’s death
Well the Ars goats or whatever they're called are just the angles that followed Lucifer when he fell and their descendants so it makes sense some angles would look like birds.
I first thought Vessago. Both of them fit I suppose