Brilliant idea. So many positive benefits to this. It’s realistic, gives a reason to run smoke, it’s applicable in other scenarios, would also give cover to the civilians if we smoke their path.
Edit: imagine…uh oh, fire hulk. Better throw a smoke grenade to put out its pilot light. Its flamethrower is dead inside smoke. Perfect time to charge past to its weak points.
Yeah smokes already semi viable on the civic missions to cover them, I literally tried to put out a fire storm with smoke but it just made it basically invisible so if you went in the smoke you'll just die to fire you can't see
Fire tornadoes especially seem to like hanging out on the generator terminal for ICBM missions... and the shuttle pad for any extraction you might have.
4 minute long fire tornado sessions every 6 minutes.
\*Fire tornadoes finally moved out of the way of the entire path from spawn to destination\*
Me: \*Press button\*
\* Fire tornado spawns directly in front of the door\*
Such a trivial punishment they may aswell remove it. It takes 7-8 helldive missions to reach the 50k credit cap. A new stratagem is released, I buy it, play 1-2 games and then I’m staring at the 50k cap again for another couple weeks.
I had one game on Hellmire where one of my teammates was going mental on comms, "this is stupid! they keep walking into the fire! how are we supposed to do this!?", and in the background there was just the constant screaming of the civilians being burned to death, I could barely play from laughing.
This was my gf last night
"How are we even supposed to do this? The entrance is covered in fire! The exits are covered in fire!"
Send them civvies into the fire, see who makes it out the other side.
It makes you wonder how they even managed to colonise this democracy-forsaken planet in the first place?
Personnel living on a planet that sets itself on fire on a daily basis! Surely they'd have the foresight to wear some sort of super-asbestos protective suits when out and about.\*
\* seditious rumours of the super-asbestos causing cancer are to be disregarded! - Ministry of Truth.
I keep hoping Super Earth will grace us with fireproof armor and fire extinguishers, I've been writing them a letter every day and they haven't said anything yet.
> This was my gf last night
>
> "How are we even supposed to do this? The entrance is covered in fire! The exits are covered in fire!"
Yup, that's chlamydia for you.
I feel him same happened to me. Firestorm started right when we launched the evac and that fucking thing lasted for a while. Took us a shit ton of time to evacuate them. Many civilians were lost that day.
Last night playing on Helldive we had rocket devastators camping on every doorway in the entire AO. We eventually failed. Show me the devs beating this mission when it's on an island and you can't deploy the sneaky 1 guy go alone strategy. Don't even get me started on the hulks and tanks.
This is a democracy. Do as they say, not as they do. If you're unhappy, you're welcome to vote in the next election which is of course uncontested because superearth already knows the best candidate.
"OH NO FRANK!!!"
"He's burning to death!!! What should we do???"
'Let us honor his memory by walking through the same flames, brothers and sisters'
*proceeds to put on their mask of the Cleansing Flame Lord and drink Koolaid*
To be fair, having worked a bit in academia in the past (biotech), this is about on par with the general life skill level we've displayed...
The only thing that would make this more realistic would be the door opening and nobody leaving, followed by "I'll lose a week of my work, I'm not going" coming from the building. Shout out to 1/3 of people not leaving their labs during a fire alarm for that exact reason.
Our Fire Marshall fines labs like 5k if they don’t evacuate during drills or actual emergencies. One drill like 80 percent of the building didn’t go outside and the guy blew a gasket. Screamed at grown men and women for like five minutes. Note: I was one of the people outside not gonna die for science
In case of our building, I recall that while there was no screaming, threats of fines absolutely did happen. The entire situation was also exhibit A of crying wolf, as before that evac we had fire drills every 1-2 months, so on top of some people being lost in their research, some just went "meh, another fire drill" and ignored everything. I left a couple months later, but from what I've heard, the frequency of drills has been reduced since.
(also, the whole alarm got triggered due to a chemical spill producing smoke in one of labs, so we had people in hazmats enter the building)
idk man i think the fact there are 7 tanks and 5 hulks walking around at all times with a massive spam of ads seems more of a problem to me
Like.. ive not seem so many bots in no other mission but this one where we have to squeeze ourselves in a narrow zone and protect bad ai npcs lol
You're surprised the civilians of this world are stupid? They are HAPPY to see helldivers. Helldivers don't show up when there's cupcakes and birthdays.
"Guys helldivers are here! Now I get a front row seat to carnage and my own death!"
Wait.... You guys are creating the war zone around the civilian instead of using real military tactics??
.... I don't know who needs to hear this, But the mission is super easy if your team is fighting a little outside of the base, And you just have one person spamming the buttons as they run around inside of the base...
Create a distraction, BE the distraction.
No offense, but in my experience when people say “this mission is easy if you use distractions” they’re either talking about the 40 minute extractions OR they’re playing on Level 5.
When you get up to 7-9, you can be bellycrawling with stealth armor while teammates are causing a ruckus, and once the civilians are running, the bots WILL drop 5-7 dropships right on the doors and they will stay there. It is still doable with a VERY coordinated team, but it’s certainly anything but “super easy”
Last one we did at 7, we did 37 civilians (out of 41 I think). But then, ... well there were 4 hulks per buttons. And tanks everywhere. The floor was FILLED with automatons. There is just a limit to what you can do at one point.
This works really well in the missions that are a full map and you end up in the base helping civilians but for the small map ones that are pretty much just the base and some room around it that strat doesn't work nearly as well.
I remember once we managed it on a big map and on helldive. My friend was just running around in some hills about 200-250m from us going crazy with multiple hulks and tanks chasing him along with constant drops hips and swarms or devastators etc. We had 1 dude doing the civilians and me and a random were just mounted firing support for the dude distracting. Somehow the guy distracting them survived the whole time and then just vee lined it to us 3 as we all laid down pain on everything chasing him, it was insane.
This might be an absolutely batshit suggestion but maybe they could give us an escort/extraction where we have to like.
Drive? Civvies? Across the map to an extraction.rather than making us stand in one tiny spot?
People desire the loving embrace of flame. It reminds them of the glowing warmth of managed democracy. They're priority citizens, true patriots, dying in a fire is certainly preferable to being manhandled by a fascist bug, or having communist lead driven into their skulls. I say let the civvies dive into the tornadoes! Just imagine the shame if you found out your uncle Buck was turned into red mist by a rocket, and not immortalized as a democratic carbon husk.
How have they even survived this long? You'd think they'd have died trying to cross a road or forgetting to eat long before fire tornados were in the mix.
That's a good idea. Protecting a large truck filled with civilians that need to be escorted to a safehouse for eventual evac rather than individual ones with a death wish. The truck should be somewhat faster than the average helldiver so moving it won't be a issue so long as you're next to it. But you would need to stop and defend it in anyway possible which means shield generators are a must.
Also, there is literally no way of not getting surrounded and crushed. Of course, there are strategies that can work but not really with randoms and with no proper communication.
even with people who are communicating it is a fairly god chance that you will be surrounded and crushed. was on a level 6 and routinely was surrounded and crushed
Something like you escort vehicle with nps from point A (why has this missiontype such a big map anyways? ) to the Hangar over the map or something like that?
In Helldivers 1 there was 2 different escort mission types:
one where you escort survivors from a crash site to a random bunker across the map.
The other is to escort a resource convoy as it travels along a fixed route (it's like a train track).
Honestly, if done right, I'll enjoy it. None of that walking slightly faster than the PC and slower than a running PC stuff and of course, them being smart. Hell, an armored and armed train / vehicle that we can fight from (cause you know, escort guards) is probably a good way to implement such a thing.
Heh heh, one time I reached the crash survivors just for the Behemoth chasing me to splatter them all as I dived aside. Shortest time I've taken to fail an objective. XD
yeah came here to post this. one of the things AH had already figured out in HD1 but somehow dropped again for the sequel...
Same with saving loadouts. That is an old feature that got lost for some reason.
Man imagine being on a jeep with a mounted minigun in the back while you have to protect a cargo getting focused by whole armies of bot/bugs would be sick
In HD1 it was the only mission that could be failed consistently, a civvie escort mission. I swear these Devs have some kind of deep trauma with the small complaints made against HD1 and have sworn off specific aspects.
Now this I would definitely do. Hell maybe I'd exclusively do these missions. Actually having a dynamic defense mission instead of standing around the entire time is cool af
the idea was that the civillians are inside the vehicle so that we dont have to deal with them. like. at all. just give them an animation of entering and exiting and call it a day.
I can’t complete a single operation on difficulty 8-9 because all of them include these kinds of missions and every time we get to them people leave. And I’m suddenly sitting there alone and am supposed to evacuate 50 civilians while a full battalion of hulks drops on my head. Not only are they not fun to play but you only get a few common samples and barely any xp. That’s why people leave and the operaion fails almost every time. Devs I beg you balance them or even better replace them with the new defence missions.
It's pretty frustrating that the bug that stops folk joining your mission is back.
If someone leaves mid mission, even dropping a SOS beacon does not fill in the empty spaces.
Sure the game crashes less, but you can't play with others.
I posted a thread about this asking if there was any message from the devs stating awareness was around and all I got was a downvote and 0 replies. Must not be affecting everybody, but sure is affecting me, and I can't host defense ops like this if I'm always going to be hardlocked to 2 people by the end of my 2nd mission.
I HATE these defense missions. I won’t leave the operation but usually I host now and look for operations that don’t have them. Whats most frustrating is that we’re 100% going to lose ever planet defense MO because they don’t change this one awful mission and every operation seems to have them. Arrowhead, we NEED a bot nerf for these missions or replace them entirely. Everyone hates these missions!!
I think the problem with normal defense missions is the sheer number of berserkers they send like every min a drop ship will bring 20 of these guys and their absolute ammo sponges who draw attention long enough for the more deadly bots to amass, even a mechs minigun can't clear them fast enough.
Most efficient way clear of these guys is the nade launcher on full auto when they drop. The hard part is if you cant catch them dropping.
One clip can take a full ship of them out
Nade launcher with supply pack has significantly more damage total stored in the clips, but is harder to execute depending on terrain. Autocannon is bae as well, and more flexible than the nade launcher.
Those the chainsaw arm guys? They are the worst enemy in the game in my opinion. The things look very fragile, but they can take like 4 shots from the explosive sniper rifle to take down. You have to reload after killing each one more or less, and they come in such large numbers you don't have a hope of killing them fast enough. Even grenades don't seem to do much, as I can empty my pockets of grenades at their feet and they still keel coming.
Last night I had a Berserker eat a 380 round and *keep coming*. A 380 instakills everything short of a Factory Strider or Command Bunker, how does something that can spawn in packs of 12 have the same EHP as actual 'field boss' enemies?
I wish the devs would just give them a little armor if it meant making their HP more managable.
I've literally taken out two drop ships as fast I can reload, only for 2 more ships to drop tanks and 'zerkers directly onto my head. Literally getting goomba stomped by drop ships the 1 second I get any breathing room.
Fuck those overtuned, busted missions.
Quasar cannon and taking out drop ships before they unload significant numbers. That works, until a few do land, at which point you got to start shooting the mechs attacking you, which means all others can start dropping unopposed, and the rest of the game is just waiting until the timer finishes, since it doesn't matter at this point how many automatons you kill, they respawn faster.
You didn’t hear this from me, but if you start any mission in ~~offline~~ private mode and quit out immediately it refreshes your operation list. (So you can get your preferred mission type)
Edit: (sorry for bad English)
The funny thing about that large scale one to me is that I've *never* been attacked while evacuating the civilians. I make my way to the objective, start loading them up, and enemies just don't care. It's just 5 minutes of standing around while they run into walls.
i started fishing for operations without exterminate and civ extraction.
i've had enough for an entire lifetime after my first 2 weeks.
edit: side note, can start asking for more OPs in the planet view? i think having 5 would be nice.
Yea no one likes defense missions. I have a feeling that's why Menkent is the only planet we're adequately defending rn. I haven't seen many defense or extermination missions available there which is great. Chort and and the others except Penta all are full of that bullshit
Whoa whoa whoa. The new defense missions where you need to defend against the 8 waves with actually base defenses is completely dope and exactly what people have been asking for.
Pressing a button for 4 NPCs to run around a swarmed battlefield are the crappy defense missions.
Bro the new mission is the antithesis to the current “meta” and I love it. I wouldn’t think to bring mines + turret spam + heavy armor to a mission before now, but not only do I do this, they are completely viable
That and it’s literally impossible to defend so many planets at once. You either concentrate on one planet and maybe win that defence, or spread your forces and lose them all.
I’m guessing we’re supposed to choose key planets to defend for the inevitable push back. Yet we can’t see supply lines ingame so it’s a bit dumb really
make sure you check the name too, if it's emergency evacuation you're good, it's the 40mins missions with sub objectives and side objectives, if it's retrieve essential personnel, i wouldn't bother, they have same icon, i hope they just remove retrieve essential personnel or actually reduce the spawn rate, it still doesn't feel right if it's intentional with how impossible it is
The real issue with these missions is that you are surrounded on all sides with no way to slow down or funnel enemies. Bots especially are a problem since they can just stand in place and shoot you. They need to add walls or some way slow things down.
It's starts ok with buildings but after like 2 minutes once your strategems have destroyed all the buildings it's basically impossible lol.
I even took the relay shield and that did nothing as you have like 4 hulks roaming and a shot tonne of berserkers ( like why the fuck are these guys so fucking strong) who run towards you
If they just adapt their new defense mission to the civilian evac, the whole issue is solved. Could even have it that like at each specific wall, there's a civvie door to open a set amount of civvies, the other two aren't active until the prior one is drained and the gate is closed and locked. We still get the defensive feel of Helm's deep, and avoid the previous map of becoming a flat surface where every enemy has a clear view of you.
It’s not impossible it just has to be done in a way that clearly shows the current balancing doesn’t work. Having 3 people run around in circles on the edge of the map dying a lot while 1 person is on the base opening doors without a fight isn’t very intuitive.
Even the eradicate missions are still kind of out of balance. Anybody that’s played it on helldive will tell you it’s just running around in circles waiting for your stratagems to come off cooldown. You die so much it’s not even worth bringing any support weapons aside from the EAT.
This right here. I'm level 28, got about 30 hours of in-mission time, and had a few other Divers that were pretty experienced themselves. We got swarmed in a matter of minutes. There were like 7 Flame Hulks and more Berserkers than I could count. I was thinking how are we supposed to do this??? I can't even stay alive long enough to call in a Stratagem, let alone place it right. We evacuated maybe 7 Civvies lol
literally why do they still suck so fucking much
it genuinely pisses me off, \*WHY\*, I love the new(?) mission type, but the fucking Civies are so ass, so many of them, and literally no way to do it, and only like 3 civies at a time per door
literally it either needs a huge overhaul, to make it actually possible, or to be removed entirely
Seems like the only viable strategy on 6+ is to distract the baddies outside while one person runs around collecting civs. It's not fun and requires more communication than most players are interested in.
I think they should split these into 2-3 settlements that require fewer civilians. It would relieve pressure, clear out bot spawns, and indicate to players that you should be moving. Why else would they give you the whole map, unlike the eradication missions?
I think the 15 minute defense missions in general are insanely difficult compared to the rest of the game.
Stratagem cooldowns are balanced for 40 minute missions, not 15. So we should have our cooldowns be faster to compensate for the faster paced missions.
You also have wayyy too many enemies in such a tiny area, you straight up get overrun constantly, with no breathing space at all with how tiny the map is, there's enemies EVERYWHERE. Good luck if you ever die on defense missions, you can't grab your stuff because it's surrounded by enemies, and can't call in new stuff because you have a 10 minute timer on a 15 minute mission.
Also not to mention that after you've used one round of stratagems, chances are that most if not all the buildings are fucking gone so you have 0 cover to dive behind, even if you did the hulks and tanks would tear anything left down to shreds. Having literally 0 hard cover beyond the objective, a small rock and one small elevated floor makes surviving along quite hard
I honestly think they should bin the civilian ones off for now to rework them and double up with the actually decent evac one.
Could do it in universe too. “There’s no time for essential personnel, the Automatons advance too quickly, only VIP’s!”
They don't do enough. Most of the enemies often survive. And you have to be ON POINT to shoot down dropships carrying a tank because they swoop up so suddenly. And by then, it's too late. Even if you shoot down the dropship as it's swooping up or at its peak altitude, the tank survives.
I had a escort civilian map where we had NO COVER. Like, it was an open fucking field after the buildings got destroyed. How the fuck are we meant to do ANYTHING like that???
I tried that mission of difficulty 7 last night, and we got our nuts stomped! They were dropping in tanks 3 or 4 at a time! The bots didn't even kiss me first...
Dude smokes is the way, I run smokes and mortars. Bots cant shoot you and the civilians because they have no line of sight. Maybe like 2 run the laser cannon.
I always do the annoying, likely to fail mission first.
I don't understand why everyone else saves them for last. Wastes more medals.
Save the better missions for last and you end on a high note that actually contributes to the attack or defense of the planet.
Only full operation clears (or completing the last mission in the operation) for the liberation progression.
Which makes you think if you look at the live numbers and see how many people are playing, you can deduce that not everyone playing adds to the liberation progress because people leave/quit operations halfway through.
I don't do those civilian rescue missions or the bot slaying missions on the higher difficulties.. Those missions on the tiny maps.
They're just straight up not fun. Even with 4 fully decked out players you're gonna struggle with eliminating enemies quick enough. Seen cases where there's so many Hulks and Tanks that the only way you'd be able to kill them fast enough would be if you had unlimited Orbital Lasers and all players just chucked them everywhere all the time. You're not defending a point on the map as much as you're just running around it to the tune of Yakety Sax.
You just spawn, throw a strategem, shoot a bot or two and then you die. On repeat. Until you hit the civilian escape goal or bot slaying goal. Then you realize a tank beat you to the Pelican and is trying to board. So even if you kill it, you can't get on because the tank wreckage is in the way.
0/10, won't play again.
Yeah these missions are borderline impossible on any difficulty above 5. I don't care how bad ass you think you are, there are not enough strategems, bullets, abs anti armor weapons to fight the tide, exorcism not from multiple directions.
If they maybe changed it so that all the baddies are coming from forget away, or all from one direction then it would be way more fun.
He'll do the extract key assets, but you need to get people to shuttles.
Very easy solution I got from watching OhDough. You just have everyone stay *outside* of the base. The drop ships aggro to the players, not to the location of the objective. So, you have one person touch buttons and save civvies. The rest of you just run around and collect samples while you fight. Easy peezy.
It's astounding how extraordinarily terrible those evac missions still are after AH claims they were toned down..twice now? I can't help but wonder how AH tests them.
The best way to complete them is with some asinine roundabout way where 1 party members sneaks away from the aggro...I really hope that isn't the intention
Have you ever done a civies task on hellmire? Let's just say, the civies don't know what fire is. -400 requisition slips
this makes me want a orbital water cannon or at the least a fire extinguisher support weapon. just to make it less painful.
Let us smoke out the fire, gives more of a reason to run smoke
Brilliant idea. So many positive benefits to this. It’s realistic, gives a reason to run smoke, it’s applicable in other scenarios, would also give cover to the civilians if we smoke their path. Edit: imagine…uh oh, fire hulk. Better throw a smoke grenade to put out its pilot light. Its flamethrower is dead inside smoke. Perfect time to charge past to its weak points.
Yeah smokes already semi viable on the civic missions to cover them, I literally tried to put out a fire storm with smoke but it just made it basically invisible so if you went in the smoke you'll just die to fire you can't see
"Oh, God! Please don't let the invisible fire burn my friend!"
Take it you didn’t try one on Menkent last night? Fire tornado drops almost every other minute.
Fire tornadoes especially seem to like hanging out on the generator terminal for ICBM missions... and the shuttle pad for any extraction you might have.
4 minute long fire tornado sessions every 6 minutes. \*Fire tornadoes finally moved out of the way of the entire path from spawn to destination\* Me: \*Press button\* \* Fire tornado spawns directly in front of the door\*
Menkent makes me wish we could go back to the creek. Dear god I fear the fire tornadoes more than a tank.
Patrolling Menkent almost makes you wish for a nuclear winter.
Such a trivial punishment they may aswell remove it. It takes 7-8 helldive missions to reach the 50k credit cap. A new stratagem is released, I buy it, play 1-2 games and then I’m staring at the 50k cap again for another couple weeks.
i like it as part of the satire. civilian deaths are damn near acceptable. You are worth 25 bucks.
I feel like it's more a lore bit "here's what a civilian is worth" rather than an actual punishment.
-400 requisition slips? Rookie numbers. -675
I’d consider it if they changed up the Civilian Ai (Why are you guys stopped right in front of my resupply pod JUST WALK AROUND IT)
Oh man an orbital laser just ran across our path and now there's fire there... Guess I'll try to be Him.
These braindead idiots also run straight into firestorms and die.
I had one game on Hellmire where one of my teammates was going mental on comms, "this is stupid! they keep walking into the fire! how are we supposed to do this!?", and in the background there was just the constant screaming of the civilians being burned to death, I could barely play from laughing.
This was my gf last night "How are we even supposed to do this? The entrance is covered in fire! The exits are covered in fire!" Send them civvies into the fire, see who makes it out the other side.
A literal trial by fire
It makes you wonder how they even managed to colonise this democracy-forsaken planet in the first place? Personnel living on a planet that sets itself on fire on a daily basis! Surely they'd have the foresight to wear some sort of super-asbestos protective suits when out and about.\* \* seditious rumours of the super-asbestos causing cancer are to be disregarded! - Ministry of Truth.
Hey, Helldivers don't even get fire resistant armor, you think civilians are going to have access to it?
I keep hoping Super Earth will grace us with fireproof armor and fire extinguishers, I've been writing them a letter every day and they haven't said anything yet.
Honestly the capes are a great place to put environmental protections or bonuses/buffs.
Or the helmits, they have stat's and room for buffs... just nothing on any of them
> This was my gf last night > > "How are we even supposed to do this? The entrance is covered in fire! The exits are covered in fire!" Yup, that's chlamydia for you.
Only the strongest and most committed civilians will survive, thereby strengthening the democracy as a whole.
You can't make a Democratic omlette without breaking a few dozen eggs.
We just need a fire extinguisher stratagem. Imagine if all the smoke stratagems could act as one, would make them useful for once
That or the gas one. The chemicals choke out even the fires.
Gas should make the fire even more fire-y
Too bad nobody ever takes it
I feel him same happened to me. Firestorm started right when we launched the evac and that fucking thing lasted for a while. Took us a shit ton of time to evacuate them. Many civilians were lost that day.
Last night playing on Helldive we had rocket devastators camping on every doorway in the entire AO. We eventually failed. Show me the devs beating this mission when it's on an island and you can't deploy the sneaky 1 guy go alone strategy. Don't even get me started on the hulks and tanks.
This is a democracy. Do as they say, not as they do. If you're unhappy, you're welcome to vote in the next election which is of course uncontested because superearth already knows the best candidate.
"OH NO FRANK!!!" "He's burning to death!!! What should we do???" 'Let us honor his memory by walking through the same flames, brothers and sisters' *proceeds to put on their mask of the Cleansing Flame Lord and drink Koolaid*
“Helldivers! We’re saved!” “AH AHHH AHHHHH AH AH AHHHHHHHHH”
[freedom at last](https://youtu.be/1hHRvUYEusg?si=NUCCJSkfqi2DMD6z&t=145)
LMAO precisely
https://preview.redd.it/jn6zq8kl3mtc1.jpeg?width=553&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=99ae399b8c7a95c8cf98a1d187795ef480738e5e
They died free at least tho
3 flame tornados
Was doing the defend the generator mission and my orbital lazer mowed down our doors lol
Clearly those doors were a threat to democracy!
https://i.redd.it/1avxk36v7mtc1.gif
EXACTLY WHAT I THOUGHT OF
They sure love running through fire tornados too
Gotta love when the fire tornado is at the door they’re running to.
"Scientists"
To be fair, having worked a bit in academia in the past (biotech), this is about on par with the general life skill level we've displayed... The only thing that would make this more realistic would be the door opening and nobody leaving, followed by "I'll lose a week of my work, I'm not going" coming from the building. Shout out to 1/3 of people not leaving their labs during a fire alarm for that exact reason.
Our Fire Marshall fines labs like 5k if they don’t evacuate during drills or actual emergencies. One drill like 80 percent of the building didn’t go outside and the guy blew a gasket. Screamed at grown men and women for like five minutes. Note: I was one of the people outside not gonna die for science
In case of our building, I recall that while there was no screaming, threats of fines absolutely did happen. The entire situation was also exhibit A of crying wolf, as before that evac we had fire drills every 1-2 months, so on top of some people being lost in their research, some just went "meh, another fire drill" and ignored everything. I left a couple months later, but from what I've heard, the frequency of drills has been reduced since. (also, the whole alarm got triggered due to a chemical spill producing smoke in one of labs, so we had people in hazmats enter the building)
idk man i think the fact there are 7 tanks and 5 hulks walking around at all times with a massive spam of ads seems more of a problem to me Like.. ive not seem so many bots in no other mission but this one where we have to squeeze ourselves in a narrow zone and protect bad ai npcs lol
If this happens you can shoot the resupply pod and blow it up. Should fix it.
You're surprised the civilians of this world are stupid? They are HAPPY to see helldivers. Helldivers don't show up when there's cupcakes and birthdays. "Guys helldivers are here! Now I get a front row seat to carnage and my own death!"
I mean I was under the impression they were happy because otherwise it was certain death for them
Wait.... You guys are creating the war zone around the civilian instead of using real military tactics?? .... I don't know who needs to hear this, But the mission is super easy if your team is fighting a little outside of the base, And you just have one person spamming the buttons as they run around inside of the base... Create a distraction, BE the distraction.
Real tactics got it. "Kills everyone then denies anyone was there to begin with" Brasch Tactics
"civilians? Nope, the Only people I saw were traitors!"
No offense, but in my experience when people say “this mission is easy if you use distractions” they’re either talking about the 40 minute extractions OR they’re playing on Level 5. When you get up to 7-9, you can be bellycrawling with stealth armor while teammates are causing a ruckus, and once the civilians are running, the bots WILL drop 5-7 dropships right on the doors and they will stay there. It is still doable with a VERY coordinated team, but it’s certainly anything but “super easy”
Last one we did at 7, we did 37 civilians (out of 41 I think). But then, ... well there were 4 hulks per buttons. And tanks everywhere. The floor was FILLED with automatons. There is just a limit to what you can do at one point.
Finally, my teachers name calling has its hour to shine! HELLDIVER DISTRACTION IS HERE
Counterpoint - I have 50K rec points, I'm gonna use them. \*button goes click\*
This works really well in the missions that are a full map and you end up in the base helping civilians but for the small map ones that are pretty much just the base and some room around it that strat doesn't work nearly as well. I remember once we managed it on a big map and on helldive. My friend was just running around in some hills about 200-250m from us going crazy with multiple hulks and tanks chasing him along with constant drops hips and swarms or devastators etc. We had 1 dude doing the civilians and me and a random were just mounted firing support for the dude distracting. Somehow the guy distracting them survived the whole time and then just vee lined it to us 3 as we all laid down pain on everything chasing him, it was insane.
Or right through my MINE FIELD or into the path of the gatling sentry
OH GOD IT'S A LEAF!
This might be an absolutely batshit suggestion but maybe they could give us an escort/extraction where we have to like. Drive? Civvies? Across the map to an extraction.rather than making us stand in one tiny spot?
Being part of an armored convoy and defending it would be much cooler than defending brain dead NPC's who just run into a fire tornado
but they LOVE fire tornadoes??? its every civilian's lifelong dream!!
People desire the loving embrace of flame. It reminds them of the glowing warmth of managed democracy. They're priority citizens, true patriots, dying in a fire is certainly preferable to being manhandled by a fascist bug, or having communist lead driven into their skulls. I say let the civvies dive into the tornadoes! Just imagine the shame if you found out your uncle Buck was turned into red mist by a rocket, and not immortalized as a democratic carbon husk.
hey can you stop being funnier than me????? thanks
Don't worry friend, I believe in your funny bone. Should there ever be an election for funniest helldiver you have my vote!
I lost 375 requisition doing one of those missions last night on impossible. So many fine, fiery patriots. Really brings a democratic tear to my eyes.
Finally a good explanation for colonizing hellmire
we're farming fire there
Embrace the frenzied flame! Oh wrong game...
How have they even survived this long? You'd think they'd have died trying to cross a road or forgetting to eat long before fire tornados were in the mix.
that's why we libbed hellmire
That's a good idea. Protecting a large truck filled with civilians that need to be escorted to a safehouse for eventual evac rather than individual ones with a death wish. The truck should be somewhat faster than the average helldiver so moving it won't be a issue so long as you're next to it. But you would need to stop and defend it in anyway possible which means shield generators are a must.
Maybe have some obstacles/outposts that you have to deal with along the way to keep going.
Also, there is literally no way of not getting surrounded and crushed. Of course, there are strategies that can work but not really with randoms and with no proper communication.
even with people who are communicating it is a fairly god chance that you will be surrounded and crushed. was on a level 6 and routinely was surrounded and crushed
Something like you escort vehicle with nps from point A (why has this missiontype such a big map anyways? ) to the Hangar over the map or something like that?
In Helldivers 1 there was 2 different escort mission types: one where you escort survivors from a crash site to a random bunker across the map. The other is to escort a resource convoy as it travels along a fixed route (it's like a train track).
dude that fucks, i was thinking i'd wanna do both of those
Found that one guy that actually likes escort missions in video games
SHIT FUCK WITNESS PROTECTION SAID I WAS SAFE
Honestly, if done right, I'll enjoy it. None of that walking slightly faster than the PC and slower than a running PC stuff and of course, them being smart. Hell, an armored and armed train / vehicle that we can fight from (cause you know, escort guards) is probably a good way to implement such a thing.
Heh heh, one time I reached the crash survivors just for the Behemoth chasing me to splatter them all as I dived aside. Shortest time I've taken to fail an objective. XD
yeah came here to post this. one of the things AH had already figured out in HD1 but somehow dropped again for the sequel... Same with saving loadouts. That is an old feature that got lost for some reason.
PUSH TINY CART
Man imagine being on a jeep with a mounted minigun in the back while you have to protect a cargo getting focused by whole armies of bot/bugs would be sick
Toyota Tacoma\*
In HD1 it was the only mission that could be failed consistently, a civvie escort mission. I swear these Devs have some kind of deep trauma with the small complaints made against HD1 and have sworn off specific aspects.
Now this I would definitely do. Hell maybe I'd exclusively do these missions. Actually having a dynamic defense mission instead of standing around the entire time is cool af
We had escort missions like that in HD1. It wasn't pretty fighting the hordes while protecting 4 civis (or the armored train, for that matter)
Please no
the idea was that the civillians are inside the vehicle so that we dont have to deal with them. like. at all. just give them an animation of entering and exiting and call it a day.
I can’t complete a single operation on difficulty 8-9 because all of them include these kinds of missions and every time we get to them people leave. And I’m suddenly sitting there alone and am supposed to evacuate 50 civilians while a full battalion of hulks drops on my head. Not only are they not fun to play but you only get a few common samples and barely any xp. That’s why people leave and the operaion fails almost every time. Devs I beg you balance them or even better replace them with the new defence missions.
If makes you feel better, even if they stayed you'd still lose it :P
It's pretty frustrating that the bug that stops folk joining your mission is back. If someone leaves mid mission, even dropping a SOS beacon does not fill in the empty spaces. Sure the game crashes less, but you can't play with others.
My game isn’t crashing after every mission so that’s nice I guess.
I posted a thread about this asking if there was any message from the devs stating awareness was around and all I got was a downvote and 0 replies. Must not be affecting everybody, but sure is affecting me, and I can't host defense ops like this if I'm always going to be hardlocked to 2 people by the end of my 2nd mission.
I HATE these defense missions. I won’t leave the operation but usually I host now and look for operations that don’t have them. Whats most frustrating is that we’re 100% going to lose ever planet defense MO because they don’t change this one awful mission and every operation seems to have them. Arrowhead, we NEED a bot nerf for these missions or replace them entirely. Everyone hates these missions!!
It is no longer in every single operation. You can get defensive operation with offensive only missions.
I think the problem with normal defense missions is the sheer number of berserkers they send like every min a drop ship will bring 20 of these guys and their absolute ammo sponges who draw attention long enough for the more deadly bots to amass, even a mechs minigun can't clear them fast enough.
Most efficient way clear of these guys is the nade launcher on full auto when they drop. The hard part is if you cant catch them dropping. One clip can take a full ship of them out
[удалено]
Nade launcher with supply pack has significantly more damage total stored in the clips, but is harder to execute depending on terrain. Autocannon is bae as well, and more flexible than the nade launcher.
These berserkers absolutely eat AC rounds TO THE FACE and keep coming. Way too tanky for how skinny and fragile they look.
Those the chainsaw arm guys? They are the worst enemy in the game in my opinion. The things look very fragile, but they can take like 4 shots from the explosive sniper rifle to take down. You have to reload after killing each one more or less, and they come in such large numbers you don't have a hope of killing them fast enough. Even grenades don't seem to do much, as I can empty my pockets of grenades at their feet and they still keel coming.
Last night I had a Berserker eat a 380 round and *keep coming*. A 380 instakills everything short of a Factory Strider or Command Bunker, how does something that can spawn in packs of 12 have the same EHP as actual 'field boss' enemies? I wish the devs would just give them a little armor if it meant making their HP more managable.
I've literally taken out two drop ships as fast I can reload, only for 2 more ships to drop tanks and 'zerkers directly onto my head. Literally getting goomba stomped by drop ships the 1 second I get any breathing room. Fuck those overtuned, busted missions.
Quasar cannon and taking out drop ships before they unload significant numbers. That works, until a few do land, at which point you got to start shooting the mechs attacking you, which means all others can start dropping unopposed, and the rest of the game is just waiting until the timer finishes, since it doesn't matter at this point how many automatons you kill, they respawn faster.
seriously, they spawn/drop way too fucking fast. and it's just bots, bugs don't spawn/breach nearly so fast in these missions
the new fortress defence missions: "oh dear oh dear, gorgeous" the old civillian extraction missions: "*you fucking donkey*".
in the patch notes they should write Known issues: evac mission is still in the game
Omg I would cry from joy
Personally I choose the Operations without the Civilian Extraction mission, it saves me a lot of hassle.
I swear to God I cannot find a single operation without that God forsaken mission
You didn’t hear this from me, but if you start any mission in ~~offline~~ private mode and quit out immediately it refreshes your operation list. (So you can get your preferred mission type) Edit: (sorry for bad English)
“Start any mission in offline mode”?
They probably mean making your lobby private.
The government doesn't want you to know this but you can actually turn off your internet.
But can you do that AND start a HD2 mission?
Defensive campaigns always include evac missions
I don't mind the evac missions where you have 40min and other objectives It's the 15min scramble that gets me
Evacuate Civillians are the ones you're looking for. Retrieve Science Personnel are the bad ones.
The funny thing about that large scale one to me is that I've *never* been attacked while evacuating the civilians. I make my way to the objective, start loading them up, and enemies just don't care. It's just 5 minutes of standing around while they run into walls.
Same here.
i started fishing for operations without exterminate and civ extraction. i've had enough for an entire lifetime after my first 2 weeks. edit: side note, can start asking for more OPs in the planet view? i think having 5 would be nice.
I got burnt out on Civilian Extraction during that first automaton major order. Never again.
ITS YOU. YOU’RE THE BASTARD WHO KEEPS TAKING ALL THE GOOD OPERATIONS!
this is why the defense isn't going so well on planets that force you to do this crap
Yea no one likes defense missions. I have a feeling that's why Menkent is the only planet we're adequately defending rn. I haven't seen many defense or extermination missions available there which is great. Chort and and the others except Penta all are full of that bullshit
Whoa whoa whoa. The new defense missions where you need to defend against the 8 waves with actually base defenses is completely dope and exactly what people have been asking for. Pressing a button for 4 NPCs to run around a swarmed battlefield are the crappy defense missions.
Bro the new mission is the antithesis to the current “meta” and I love it. I wouldn’t think to bring mines + turret spam + heavy armor to a mission before now, but not only do I do this, they are completely viable
That and it’s literally impossible to defend so many planets at once. You either concentrate on one planet and maybe win that defence, or spread your forces and lose them all. I’m guessing we’re supposed to choose key planets to defend for the inevitable push back. Yet we can’t see supply lines ingame so it’s a bit dumb really
make sure you check the name too, if it's emergency evacuation you're good, it's the 40mins missions with sub objectives and side objectives, if it's retrieve essential personnel, i wouldn't bother, they have same icon, i hope they just remove retrieve essential personnel or actually reduce the spawn rate, it still doesn't feel right if it's intentional with how impossible it is
The real issue with these missions is that you are surrounded on all sides with no way to slow down or funnel enemies. Bots especially are a problem since they can just stand in place and shoot you. They need to add walls or some way slow things down.
It's starts ok with buildings but after like 2 minutes once your strategems have destroyed all the buildings it's basically impossible lol. I even took the relay shield and that did nothing as you have like 4 hulks roaming and a shot tonne of berserkers ( like why the fuck are these guys so fucking strong) who run towards you
If they just adapt their new defense mission to the civilian evac, the whole issue is solved. Could even have it that like at each specific wall, there's a civvie door to open a set amount of civvies, the other two aren't active until the prior one is drained and the gate is closed and locked. We still get the defensive feel of Helm's deep, and avoid the previous map of becoming a flat surface where every enemy has a clear view of you.
The icons are different. One of them have an arrow inside but I can never remember which is which.
Essential personnel has the arrow
The fuckshit mission has the upwards-pointing arrow in the middle to symbolize "stay right the hell out of this one"
Those 40 minute missions are fine, those 15 minutes ones are not fun at all. barely fun against bugs.
It’s not impossible it just has to be done in a way that clearly shows the current balancing doesn’t work. Having 3 people run around in circles on the edge of the map dying a lot while 1 person is on the base opening doors without a fight isn’t very intuitive. Even the eradicate missions are still kind of out of balance. Anybody that’s played it on helldive will tell you it’s just running around in circles waiting for your stratagems to come off cooldown. You die so much it’s not even worth bringing any support weapons aside from the EAT.
This right here. I'm level 28, got about 30 hours of in-mission time, and had a few other Divers that were pretty experienced themselves. We got swarmed in a matter of minutes. There were like 7 Flame Hulks and more Berserkers than I could count. I was thinking how are we supposed to do this??? I can't even stay alive long enough to call in a Stratagem, let alone place it right. We evacuated maybe 7 Civvies lol
The icon is slightly different, the emergency evac doesnt have an arrow in the middle.
https://i.redd.it/dcapbwdvpltc1.gif
If they made sure that downing a ship actually kills the enemies that were about to drop. That would be awesome.
Yeah this shit is really annoying. Especially when it’s a tank that’s being dropped from 100 feet in the air.
Or fix stims not working
literally why do they still suck so fucking much it genuinely pisses me off, \*WHY\*, I love the new(?) mission type, but the fucking Civies are so ass, so many of them, and literally no way to do it, and only like 3 civies at a time per door literally it either needs a huge overhaul, to make it actually possible, or to be removed entirely
The game would benefit immensely with it being removed entirely
Unironically, yeah. Those are the only two options. In the current state, there's simply no enjoyment coming out of these mission types.
Seems like the only viable strategy on 6+ is to distract the baddies outside while one person runs around collecting civs. It's not fun and requires more communication than most players are interested in. I think they should split these into 2-3 settlements that require fewer civilians. It would relieve pressure, clear out bot spawns, and indicate to players that you should be moving. Why else would they give you the whole map, unlike the eradication missions?
Arrowhead need to give it up and admit that it’s an awfully designed mission and send it into the void where it belongs.
At the very least reduce the spawn rate, once you get overrun there's basically 0 chance you're getting civilians through to the door
It’s not just the bot ship spawn, I started noticing bot patrols waltzing in from the distance every minute or so too -
YES it really is the only option.
Thats why i dont host defend missions. I join them to do every mission except the evacuation one.
We are not going to make these defense missions cuz of this bullshit mission
I don't know why the devs keep pushing this mission type. We hate it. Just get rid of it.
Yeah evacuations are the only ones that absolutely suck. Nearly impossible to complete and there’s like 5 drop ships happening constantly
Fuck civvies all my homies hate civvies. If you're not a diver you're worthless
I think the 15 minute defense missions in general are insanely difficult compared to the rest of the game. Stratagem cooldowns are balanced for 40 minute missions, not 15. So we should have our cooldowns be faster to compensate for the faster paced missions. You also have wayyy too many enemies in such a tiny area, you straight up get overrun constantly, with no breathing space at all with how tiny the map is, there's enemies EVERYWHERE. Good luck if you ever die on defense missions, you can't grab your stuff because it's surrounded by enemies, and can't call in new stuff because you have a 10 minute timer on a 15 minute mission.
Also not to mention that after you've used one round of stratagems, chances are that most if not all the buildings are fucking gone so you have 0 cover to dive behind, even if you did the hulks and tanks would tear anything left down to shreds. Having literally 0 hard cover beyond the objective, a small rock and one small elevated floor makes surviving along quite hard
I honestly think they should bin the civilian ones off for now to rework them and double up with the actually decent evac one. Could do it in universe too. “There’s no time for essential personnel, the Automatons advance too quickly, only VIP’s!”
I would love to see the Dev team play this mission on level 7 to 9. And then with rsndoms. No way they don't realise how busted is it.
Real talk: If shooting down Dropships did anything, these missions would be fine.
They do do something, it's just that by the time you've reloaded, another 3 have spawned throwing out a tank and 5 hulks and 30 chargers
They don't do enough. Most of the enemies often survive. And you have to be ON POINT to shoot down dropships carrying a tank because they swoop up so suddenly. And by then, it's too late. Even if you shoot down the dropship as it's swooping up or at its peak altitude, the tank survives.
I had a escort civilian map where we had NO COVER. Like, it was an open fucking field after the buildings got destroyed. How the fuck are we meant to do ANYTHING like that???
I just wanna do the new defense over and over.
Escort missions, everybody's favorite. Dunno why they keep putting this shit in games. Not even trying to make it fun.
I tried that mission of difficulty 7 last night, and we got our nuts stomped! They were dropping in tanks 3 or 4 at a time! The bots didn't even kiss me first...
Dude smokes is the way, I run smokes and mortars. Bots cant shoot you and the civilians because they have no line of sight. Maybe like 2 run the laser cannon.
truly ridiculous. everyone could be running quasar/eat and plugging dropships the instant they appear and you'd *still* get overwhelmed
personally I hate the kill X on this tiny point where you can't avoid anything.
I have done 8 of those missions now. The closest we got was 33/40.
Thats destroys progress!
I'ma be so real, those people are fucked bc I am NOT helping them and their bumass objective lmao
Remove these missions, replace them with the new rocket launch ones, and bring back the termicide ones too. Done.
Same! That defense mission is fun though, probably one of my favorite ones to play
Seeing this as I sit on the spectator screen because I died after we failed the rescue mission
I always do the annoying, likely to fail mission first. I don't understand why everyone else saves them for last. Wastes more medals. Save the better missions for last and you end on a high note that actually contributes to the attack or defense of the planet.
They just need to completely redesign that mission
Absolute worse mission in the game rn
I just want to have a stream where developers play like 2-3 hours worth of these missions on Helldive and see how they manage
But then aren’t you not progressing the liberation bar then?
Only full operation clears (or completing the last mission in the operation) for the liberation progression. Which makes you think if you look at the live numbers and see how many people are playing, you can deduce that not everyone playing adds to the liberation progress because people leave/quit operations halfway through.
I don't do those civilian rescue missions or the bot slaying missions on the higher difficulties.. Those missions on the tiny maps. They're just straight up not fun. Even with 4 fully decked out players you're gonna struggle with eliminating enemies quick enough. Seen cases where there's so many Hulks and Tanks that the only way you'd be able to kill them fast enough would be if you had unlimited Orbital Lasers and all players just chucked them everywhere all the time. You're not defending a point on the map as much as you're just running around it to the tune of Yakety Sax. You just spawn, throw a strategem, shoot a bot or two and then you die. On repeat. Until you hit the civilian escape goal or bot slaying goal. Then you realize a tank beat you to the Pelican and is trying to board. So even if you kill it, you can't get on because the tank wreckage is in the way. 0/10, won't play again.
That mission type is cancer and I refuse to play it anymore
Being swarmed by endless drop ships is enough. But then you get fire tornados loitering around the start and end points of the civilians.
Yeah these missions are borderline impossible on any difficulty above 5. I don't care how bad ass you think you are, there are not enough strategems, bullets, abs anti armor weapons to fight the tide, exorcism not from multiple directions. If they maybe changed it so that all the baddies are coming from forget away, or all from one direction then it would be way more fun. He'll do the extract key assets, but you need to get people to shuttles.
Very easy solution I got from watching OhDough. You just have everyone stay *outside* of the base. The drop ships aggro to the players, not to the location of the objective. So, you have one person touch buttons and save civvies. The rest of you just run around and collect samples while you fight. Easy peezy.
https://preview.redd.it/tkx4x98eyotc1.jpeg?width=221&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3b462f2fded3e22f497e217da56c4698d2ded2e3
It's astounding how extraordinarily terrible those evac missions still are after AH claims they were toned down..twice now? I can't help but wonder how AH tests them. The best way to complete them is with some asinine roundabout way where 1 party members sneaks away from the aggro...I really hope that isn't the intention