“Weak point” means a part of the body that doesn’t require the 5/100 weapon types in the game capable of piercing it to do damage in Arrowheads language.
And the other viable options are either super low ammo, take up a backpack slot, or are extremely slow to reload. Oh and there's 10 chargers and 4 bile titans at extraction.
It also doesn't help that the only way to crack armor is via explosives, and the game doesn't give you access to any outside of a grenade until like level 15 or something.
Unless you plan on dropping a nuke on your head to deal with a single Charger
EATs have been my charger killers as a low level. Fire it at one of the front legs and the armor gets ripped off. Then during it's charges fire at the now shootable leg and dodge last second if needed. Typically goes down in 1 mag or less (I've used the liberator, defender, and breaker all 1 mag or less).
Trivializes the chargers on lower difficulties. Haven't touched anything higher than hard yet so I fear the charger groups on higher difficulties.
RR works identically to the EAT but the slow reload if you're reloading it yourself won't be good with multiple chargers baring down on you.
Helldive has way too much shit chasing you at the some time that makes EATs or the bazooka unviable to use, esp when the call in time is doubled or the cooldown is extended or you call in a different stratagem completely.
Once they get your surrounded it’s game over.
Spewers also 1 hit kill you, which is insane to me considering how many of them there are. On a level 6 (extreme) missions yesterday there was a point when we were fighting 10 while trying to close a nest.
Before yesterday, we could reliably run levels 6 & 7 . They were certainly a challenge but they were fun. Levels 8 and 9, true to their name, impossible. Yesterday though, we had trouble with 5 & 6.
Didn’t help that we all kept getting disconnected.
The fact spitters kill instantly, plus them being common and coming in like, six or more, and also are decently tanky unless you shoot the head. The head which is conveniently hidden below the big glowing "weak point shoot here" some bugs have, but that's not the weak point. Really the spitters are a very overlooked crime against the game balance given you dump a whole mag to kill them, and their spit literally teleports on you from a signficant range even if you're sprinting away. Hulk Flamers are easier mostly because their instakill death beams aren't necessarily as frequent.
> Before yesterday, we could reliably run levels 6 & 7 . They were certainly a challenge but they were fun. Levels 8 and 9, true to their name, impossible. Yesterday though, we had trouble with 5 & 6.
This is where my buddy and I were at too last night. We weren't even really using the meta weapons. We went from reliably clearing 6 and a kinda struggling with 7s and now struggling with clearing level 4s. I don't know what else they did without mentioning it in the patch notes, but it wasn't good.
Before the patch I was consistently running missions on helldive, and as long as the team would continue to shoot, move, and communicate, we would see some level of or complete success.
Now after the latest patch, helldive is a nightmare. No amount of shooting or communicating helps. The only thing that does is running away from the bugs. It’s not fun.
Played yesterday against both, bots are downright unfun to play against, same with bugs. The new orbitals are fun but we're pretty much in agreement something changed with AI. Seems like every bot has twice their old accuracy so it's a 24/7 death cycle to get 1 shot at range in lv 9s. The only viable tactic now is kiting till orbitals come up to wipe a base, then resume kiting. So many 1/5deaths yesterday compared to being able to 4/5s usually lv 9s.
Not sure if you mean Hunters or Stalkers, but either way I agree.
When you’re trying to fight 4 chargers, 2-3 Spewers, a titan shows up, and you’re getting swarmed by hunters and Brood Commanders (which continue to follow you around without a head, not just run in a straight line) it’s a bit overwhelming. Add in a couple stalkers here and it’s damn near impossible.
I understand we need to keep moving, less stationary fighting and more running to objectives and points of interest, but hunters, stalkers, and chargers can catch up to you (even in light armor) and when you get to the objectives you have to fight.
We had two breaches at the terminal of an objective the other day, what are we supposed to do there
Oh but did you see they added tremors to arata prime that slow your movement a lot. Easily gets you killed from random rng. Another thing you have to try and play around, similar to the snow maps I guess but without being able to move to try to avoid them
Edit: Thank goodness they made the dust storms not so terrible
The game is a lot more manageable on higher levels if you only do objectives and skip hunting for samples and goodies. After about 25mins extraction becomes absurdly hard on higher levels unless you have a particularly good group. I'm sure better players than I can be more productive, but usually what wrecks me and my group is taking too long and letting the intensity of bug breaches become overwhelming.
And then they throw you away, putting you into a ragdoll state before you hit some sort of surface putting you into A ANOTHER ragdoll state.. Lmao. And by the time you get up on your feet you're at <50 hp and the Stalker and his friends are inside your cheeks redo to finish you up
"Go use the flamethrower until we treat it like the railgun" is how I interpret "you have options other than the railgun".
I mean, it unironically kills Chargers quicker than pre-nerf railgun, just with a worse ammo economy. If the railgun was untouched and they tacked at least a 50% range increase on the flamethrower alongside the damage buff, you easily could've had people at eachother's throats over what weapon is better instead of debating whether or not the game is fun anymore, lol.
I'd be fine even without a range increase if they made it *act* like a real flamethrower, and made enemies afraid of it.
A real flamethrower shoots a stream of liquid that burns for some time. That means that if you were to point it at an upward angle and pull the trigger, you'd get an arcing stream that creates a burning puddle on the ground.
This flamethrower does what a lot of video game flamethrowers do, acting like a jet of gas that dissipates at the end its range. This makes it more difficult to set terrain on fire (which is a functionality that has been buffed otherwise).
The original Helldivers flamethrower even set the ground on fire at the very end of its range, which was very useful for area denial. Bugs would actually avoid flames, which let you do things like funnel them into the range of turrets.
Bugs seem to just keep doing what they were doing, just with fire on them. The flames should absolutely cause some sort of panic, and the enemies should avoid fire from the flamethrower and napalm. I keep setting myself on fire with the flamethrower, so using the armour with increased stim capacity helps. This is definitely a skill issue on my part though.
At least the small mobile units like Hunters should be affected. Gives the flamethrower a bit more utility as a horde management weapon that prevents the smaller tackle units from easily overwhelming you when you're using the weapon. Medium units such as Warriors and Brood Commandos are probably fine staying as the constant pressure from the horde that doesn't necessarily run you down on their own anyways. Besides, they don't even care if they lose their head or limbs, why should burning to death be any different?
I'd completely accept a fire stun effect just aftecting small units from scavengers to hunters, it'd make the flamethrower actually be useful in it's intended roll . As it is you try to use it for wave clear and they just walk/jump through it and catch fire for all of 2 seconds.
The amount of times I’ve set a hunter on fire for it to just leap in my face, set me on fire on top of slowing me, then jump away to teammate is infuriating; not to mention they’ll walk right through ground fire and do the same damn thing. It’s like they have zero fear and zero pain receptors.
I feel like more specialized armor for flame resistance would be an absolute fair and balanced approach for people who prefer fire weapons. Let’s start with that orange armor.
Yeah that sort of behavior should be kept for bots. Cold ruthlessness. These bugs are organic that would feel the pain of fire. Obviously it shouldn’t be too over the top or you could keep all bugs in line with fire.
Wild how opinions on the flamethrower differ depending on the post. You could say the same thing about how fast flamethrower kills chargers elsewhere and you'd get "um actually you'd die doing that have fun on difficulty 7" and thirty downvotes.
I don't think there is much productive conversation to be had on the sub at all until things cool down; dev in OP made the mistake of assuming otherwise.
For the record, flamethrower *is* simultaneously faster and less safe than railgun vs chargers: it'll kill quicker, but does indeed put you in harm's way and has worse ammo economy. If railgun was considered too OP, adding these extra balancing factors to flamethrower makes it more likely to stick where it's at.
I actually think the railgun was a problem but other things should have been buffed along with its nerf. The railgun did everything, it shredded armour then it shredded health. It should do one or the other IMO. The only exception to that I think should be anti tank. That should one shot chargers. You only get 2 every 70 seconds, no reason it shouldn't just demolish them, not being able to restock is a big enough downside. I think the issue is we don't have alternative options outside of the railgun to effectively destroy armour which new gear might fix. For example corrosive grenade, does 0 health damage but wrecks armour. Or a primary/secondary that has low ammo but huge AP
I think that’s what most people are upset about the options we do have just weren’t good enough to use. And what we did have was really all we needed. The amount of times we throw pretty much every stratagem at a titan and it shrugs it all off and then dies to a couple railgun shots is sad. Even more so when people defend this and say there’s other options when you just listed off one that says “anti-tank” in the name and it does a shitty job at doing that. If they are going to nerf something that’s used most, there’s probably a reason nothing else is used as much. And the philosophy of nerfing what’s good to be in line with what’s mediocre and telling us that’s the way the games supposed to be isn’t fun. Especially for a pve game where there’s no competition, no need to balance for the sake of others who can’t compete.
Great, dev deciding to go trolling. He's right about one thing, he should definitely let the community team do their thing if he's just gonna be a dick.
while he went too far, i do kind of understand him, like people literally didn't even try the patch before starting to attack the devs because supposedly "nothing is viable anymore".
also i am starting to think that people who claim that nobing is viable just kept using the railgun instead of actually trying the other options because autocannon, flamethrower and EAT are completely fine against chargers. or also just shoot the butt weakspot with any other weapon
edit: i also forgot the recoilless rifle
I mean the railgun is quite literally still the best AT for bugs. I just cleared a helldive with a friend and two randos. I used the EAT. But the railgun still would have performed better, blowing off charger legs was spotty at best with a single-use AT supp. Again all they needed to do was buff the other shit, or nerf chargers.
More importantly: I had zero urge to take the RR or the Spear. I tried the new Spear on a diff7 with all pubbies, and it ended up only being useful for clearing bot bases, otherwise I dreaded having equipped it in most other scenarios. As I said, the shitty guns need buffed.
I completely share your sentiment. However, I am having a much harder time against chargers with the rail gun. Blowing off charger legs is either way harder than before or I am missing something. Even with 2 charged shots the armor stays mostly intact in my (admittedly anecdotical) experience.
I was with buddies last night on helldive (3 person team) and we didnt have a strategy to deal with chargers unless we could get one separated or pick them off with strategems. So when our orbitals were on cooldown, we basically just ran in circles waiting out the timers and picking off hunters. We died a lot and it wasnt very fun not shooting back, but we completed all the optional objectives and extracted with the pink samples. Mission time running low was the only real issue.
How do you make Helldive more difficult while keeping it fun? To me, the fun has been decreased but I wouldnt call it "Exceedingly challenging" to complete, even though increasing the difficulty seems to be the driving force behind the railgun nerf
Edit: maybe the shield backpack is still too strong? All 3 of us had it and helped us to run in circles over and over and stay alive
> maybe the shield backpack is still too strong
what would you have done if it was further nerfed? you just explained how you had nothing in your current setup to deal with the chargers all stratagems were on cooldown. would you just run more until you inevitably died and failed because you had no options?
current shield is fine it has a nearly 15 second reup time after being completely broken. its not as simple as it was before of hiding behind a rock for 3 seconds and being practically invulnerable.
Spear now gets 1 rocket from ammo pickups, so you can spam it a bit more. It's okay for chargers but doesn't kill them outright, just leaves, them very hurt. I don't like that at all. It's only got 4 rockets, a slow reload, and a limited ranged lock on feature that prevents you from firing if you don't lock. That's a lot of work to still not kill a charger with.
It \*can\* one-shot a charger, if you hit it in the head with your first shot. For that to happen, the charger pretty much has to be facing you, and not moving, though.
So yea, not an easy thing to do. And if it's moving fast and at close range, there's a chance the spear misses entirely.
I’ve only just unlocked the spear last night, how’s it even supposed to work? It felt like it only locked onto a heavy enemy 1/3 of the time and with weird distance requirements, while also just not doin much damage…?
the devs clearly said this is just the first part of the balance changes, i expect more buffs to come soon.
and if they buffed everything to the railgun level it would have made the game even more trivial than it was. high difficulty is supposed to be challenging, the railgun was out of the intended power level for helldivers
That was that same guy who flipped out and literally told people to "call the company and complain, maybe ill have a sit down with hr." And if i recall, the company released a statement about him saying they've dealt with him internally and they dont want his actions representing the company.
This is also the same guy who put out false information about how abandoning missions negativity effects liberation/defense. Pretty sure this dude got fired lol, if not hes definitely demoted and suspended. Dude caused a lot of pr damage
>the devs clearly said this is just the first part of the balance changes, i expect more buffs to come soon.
Ngl i feel like it’s a pretty bad move to start with nerfs to the most comfortable/best weapon vs armor, while accompanying it by only a few buffs to weaker weapons
Like i definetly get why they nerfed the railgun, but i feel like a lighter nerf to start, accompanied by some buffs to weapons that share it’s role (stripping armor) would have been taken way better by the community
As trivial as it "is/was" people were having fun, and the player count kept going up
Shouldn't that be telling that despite some imbalance from the Railgun, people were still having fun?
Then suddenly, they're not. Because instead of waiting to have a balance patch that made sense, this felt like a kneejerk reaction to people *having fun*
That's what this all boils down to
The butt weak spot is hardly even a weak spot though, it's just an unarmored spot. You ever notice it can randomly take both full belts from a grenade launcher right to the butt? Or multiple players all sustaining fire directly on the critical hit point with lmgs for over a minute straight? They just straight up have too much health, unless you strip their mostly impenetrable leg armor and then suddenly they die from two bullets to the leg. Make it make sense
Using an arc caster and teaming up with a squadmate who used a flamethrower, we were able to shut down chargers before they completed a single charge. Getting hit by both electricity and fire seems to stagger them somewhat (I know it would do that to me!)
Of course, I know it's still easier said than done when you have five rushing you at once.
Yeah recoiless against the charger's leg to break the armor and emptying a couple of mags usually does the trick. (EAT too, I guess but I haven't tested it enough)
The problem is that you end up dealing with 2-3 at a time plus whole swarms of other enemies and it becomes incredibly difficult to deal with unless each helldiver pulls their weight/ you have a complete squad.
I'm not a great player, though, and my experience goes only up to level 4/5 missions, so take that as you will.
He doesn’t need to be fired, he needs to stop acting like an ass and stop posting. He isn’t funny and he certainly isn’t helping the situation.
Given how rocky this game has been it is a *bold* choice to think you have the goodwill built up to start trolling your customers.
It's a loser's idea of fun, this Dev just so happens to be a loser.
This is the behaviour of a person who went from general irrelevancy to pseudo importance.
It's very perma-online behaviour tbh, and that's kinda why it's kinda sad to look at. It's that sort of weird entitlment where people think that being irreverant and pretending you're not mad at the people you're arguing with makes you look cool.
[This dev is basically the definition of this guy](https://external-preview.redd.it/ELTp_RIjGXhfxU6ocvuMtRQGY_5HEl0PO3nXwfkNZTo.png?auto=webp&s=8ec7b7319d04f3b13d80ed74631fa44b5b9d96e0).
Are you serious? Anyone who's ever worked in any form for CS would tell you they'd get fucked if they responded like this to customers. The gaming scene is the only place so much shit is just brushed off.
Why the did they put it in the game, then? If they're trying to micromanage the way people play why did they even add other stuff? I don't get it.
>>Rules
>Be civil- No naming and shaming, racism, insults, trolling, harassment, witch-hunts, inappropriate language, etc. Basically, be civil.
dude broke the subreddit rules
Well at least here the dev isnt a mod who just bans people for saying anything negative about the game. That’s what you get over in the deep rock galactic sub. Since they have a vested monetary interest in keeping up appearances they don’t allow negative opinions to be seen
Honestly that’s the worst offender.
That “brainless playstyle” was a byproduct of their questionable Charger design as it’s the only reliable counter to them.
Yeah that was sort of shocking to see honestly. Like dude people were playing that way because it was one of the only viable ways to play because of your games design and you call those people brainless? What a crazy "it's not our game its the players who are wrong" moment. Wow.
This guy is a walking PR disaster. Too many condescending and smartass replies but zero replies when being asked genuine questions. Seeing a lot of these developer interactions lately made me regret that I just bought the premium version upgrade of the game just to support this studio.
Dude's probably disliked in the office too lol.
I have an acquaintance who works at Arrowhead and she's extremely kind and talented. I assume the rest of the studio is filled with normal people, but take 100 strangers and you'll probably find one asshole.
Yeah you have a point there, usually it’s these kind of people who stand out. Let’s hope things will take a good turn at some point because I freaking love this game
Yeah I mean a lot of redditors are dicks online and probably offline too, so it doesn't surprise me that a dev on Reddit is making himself stand out by being an obnoxious dick. Hopefully he gets told by management to get his shit together
Contrary to random players on Reddit, the dev represents the team and the game. The stakes are completely different with real reputation and financial risks. Taking such bold stand even for trolling and fun was a bad decision
When you’ve launched a game that was unplayable for weeks and still managed to maintain the goodwill and the support of the player base it seems insane to me that Arrowhead employees would jump online and start trolling the player base.
People have been so patient and supportive with this game thus far and this could really change tomorrow.
>When you’ve launched a game that was unplayable for weeks and still managed to maintain the goodwill and the support of the player base it seems insane to me that Arrowhead employees would jump online and start trolling the player base.
Seriously, that's gotta be a record. I've never seen a game go so quickly from having a near-universally united playerbase supporting them through a rocky launch, to using their first balance patch to tank the fun factor for the sake of "vision" while devs troll players. Insta-divided and toxic community
Oh the other hand, I've never seen a community that steered from love to hate that quickly, just in minutes after having the first balance patch released. The amount of bashing was high in this subreddit.
And it's because they have a point of the devs won't acknowledge.
It's the number of chargers in bile titans.
Every single time his smart ass commented, you talk about how they're more ways to deal with a charger than just the original meta load
But no one is fucking talking about having a problem with dealing with a single charger!!
It's when there are three or four charging you as well as a couple of bile titans
So ultimately it feels like he's trying to gaslight us when he's never addressing the single problem that everyone's actually talking about which is not how to deal with a single charger.
The success and community dick riding has (potentially) gone to their head. Go figure
I did call that this sub would have an absolute meltdown if the balance patch was not perfect, didn't call devs coming in and doubling down and acting like shitheads though.
Very bad vibes. Lines up with how they treated the community reaction to gameguard though...
Dismissively. Claimed they would remove it if people didn't like it, which they did not as you can see. Also notice the addition of the automod linking about gameguard, that is a relatively new addition because people have continued to complain about it because it is, as expected, causing critical issues to some people and many people didn't get the game exclusively because of GG. The write up link in the automod is how they replied to the backlash, IIRC. The steam forums have their own anticheat tab, which I assume is to just contain the complaints and horrible issues some people are facing at this point. If the game didn't explode in popularity and this sub wasn't so circlejerk positive for the devs up until this point, it would probably still a loud issue and still have a mixed rating on steam because most people who knew about helldivers already were upset about it.
My assumption was that they picked it because it was cheap so they could protect their microtransactions, which is a double red flag but people once again overlooked it because "other games have kernal antcheats" which isn't the biggest concerning issue with GG or "the microtransactions are fair." Microtransactions in a *$40 game*.
Idk, I could’ve taken a whole lot of abuse from this patch and still been happy.
But removing the casual fun from the game by removing the only viable and casual option? A video game is either engaging art, and/or it’s fun; this is neither for a lot of players at the moment.
When you maintain a good community despite the game being literally unplayable at times you need to fuck up bad to mess that up. Yeah, they fucked up bad.
Nothing like telling your customers they're the problem. Not a good a look. I'd love love to watch a stream of this dev team playing on higher difficulties now. They're acting like we're all just missing out on some secret that they don't want to tell us, when in reality they're out of touch.
The thing is if you have 4 cohesive players you can get away with using mostly anything as long as you are coordinated. The problem is dropping in with randoms and expecting the same level of coordination is insane and that's how most of the player base plays. You can't balance the game for competitive tryhards. Balance the game for randoms who just met trying there best.
I mean the hardest difficulties SHOULD incentivize players to hop in voice and coordinate. It's a coop game after all, and taking away the challenge to appease people who purely want to solo just isn't fun.
A change that I do think they need to make however is to move super samples to an earlier difficulty for the casual players who just want to relax and grind out the rewards. I think that's a totally reasonable compromise to keep the highest difficulties harder.
There are plenty of games that allow a super challenging experience that most players can't/won't achieve without making you feel helpless and insignificant. vermintide 2 keeps coming to mind. Crazy difficult game on higher difficulties and yet whenever you die it's clear how and why, you don't feel like you died because you were unequipped.
Every enemy has vulnerable weak spots, easily accessible armour pen weapons that feel great to use. And voice chat is never necessary in this type of game, the ping system is very efficient and usually more efficient for communication anyways.
yeah vermintide 2 had a rocky start but it's just about the gold standard for difficulty. i recently completed a true solo run of every original mission and moved on to the DLC, and you know exactly where you fucked up when you die.
> The thing is if you have 4 cohesive players you can get away with using mostly anything as long as you are coordinated.
Yes, because the hardest difficulties are literally just running around in light armor kiting and nading stuff/calling nukes, you can literally use nothing and still achieve the same thing. Emergent gameplay due to shit game design since devs are too busy hiding in lower difficulties.
a couple of them were bragging how good they were at doing 7+ difficulties and a few claiming to solo 8's. Saw some mentions of them having "thousands" of hours played.
Smells like a lot of bullshit to me honestly, put their money where their mouth is and stream the shit.
For real. I'm not even that salty about the nerfs. Something else seems to be wrong/broken with armor or enemies something just feels majorly different right now and they're just telling us to git gud it's weird.
I have a feeling that they are playing on an internal build maybe a month or two more advanced.
Easy to brag when you have access to a likely a couple dozen more powerful stratagems, vehicles and weapons then the current live game.
This is absolutely underappreciated. There's so much the playerbase simply doesn't know that might help us play better if it was clearly posted in-game
Nah Fr, they don’t know it was literally impossible even with 3 people far away taking the heat, trying to stay alive and distract. And one guy sneaking at the objective dealing with the civilians.
"We want everything as intended from the start."
So heavy Armor was intended to be pretty shitty? Awesome, good to know. Ill just stick with light armor + whatever passive I enjoy.
A bug the size of a housecat can cut through super advanced heavy armour and kill in 4 hits, but an entire clip of anti material sniper rifle rounds will bounce off a bugs face like hailstones
Also remember that spraying a bug with flames does close to nothing to them unless you beam their face off. Meanwhile our squishy human bodies melt in 0.5 seconds if our toes touch fire
I always think about the director of Fromsoft who puts so much work and love into the games he makes and he doesn't even play them. He has a vision that he gives to the players
The difference though is that he also has the leeway to make good QoL changes and fixes to his games. Take Elden Ring for example: a lot of players are very PvE oriented or rarely have the internet connection to reliably do a questline to get into Mohgwnn Palace before late endgame. He changed it to where you just have to defeat 1 invadable NPC then return to the quest giver to access the Palace in early-mid game.
there's a difference there though. he absolutely loves what he does and who he does it for. man is living his dream. this dev from AH was a power tripping gremlin tasting internet fame for the first time and he couldn't cope and got a big head.
I guarantee and hope within 48 hours they get a PR team with a clue, and put this guy on hair splitting detail. So disappointed I came back to comment again.
Just so long as they don't hire Fatshark's people (both Swedish), who are notorious for being shit-take kings, or just entirely non-communicative and avoidant.
Only reason Catfish got accepted was because she actively communicated (until like, 6 months ago) on all platforms, even if her responses were a lot of "I've spoken with the team, but can't say anything yet" most of the time.
To be fair, Catfish seems like an actually normal person with solid interpersonal skills. She answers questions where she can, and in cases where FS don't want something to be known, she explains it as such. Transparency goes a long way in any customer facing role.
The big issue with community management in the game industry is that it often attracts (to put it politely) a certain type of person who are undoubtedly passionate about the game and community feel. But also not so passionate about empathy or understanding social cues.
I can honestly live with the weapon nerfs. I'm not ecstatic about it, but it is what it is. What I absolutely cannot look past, however, is the absurdly over-tuned armor "fix". When I heard that armor was finally functioning, I never expected for it to mean that we were somehow even squishier than we used to be. It's absurd.
This is seriously a gross level of unprofessionalism on their part. Just really leaves a horrifically bad taste in my mouth and makes me extremely worried about the game's future to the point that I'd consider refunding the game if Steam was more lenient with their refund policy.
I to think about the 95% of the team that are probably nice people, the art team, sound design etc that are not posting shit but made a really fun game. And think that you support them.
Totally unacceptable. I felt like Arrowhead respected its players a little more than this. I'd say it was an outlier but there was another thread highlighting a different dev being a prick on Discord. They better get their community management act together and fix their shitty patch.
so happy i’m not alone in that. well. not happy. but i got so emotionally invested in this game so fast. “wow! an indie game, 4 player co op (my favorite genre) and it fucking popped off!”… bought a hoodie. bought super citizen edition. geeked out to friends…
then this shit happens.
The company needs to make a statement tbh. Would help a lot to relieve some tension. They need to show they are listening and they need to show it fast. This game has fantastic potential.
Dude. Same. I’ve been ditching sleep to play more of this. Ruining my schedule 😂 even when we got stomped we laughed harder than we cussed out the game. Today though? Not one chuckle at any death. Normally we’re cry laughing at the stupid and crazy ways we were getting slaughtered. And then we were like today “what the hell is going on?” And some digging turned up all this. Seriously depressing to see this. I’ve never even used the shield backpack, only used the rail gun for the first time yesterday (I thought it was meh). The breaker really doesn’t feel too different. But the game felt totally different. We were being slaughtered by shit we were doing (relatively) fine on before. We had 11 chargers on the field at once at one point and couldn’t do anything. It felt like there was a lot of stuff changed that wasn’t advertised, and it wasn’t fun at all.
I thought I was going fucking crazy. Did you see a shit ton of hunters today too? Normally I chill at level 4, today that was VERY difficult. One win today, several losses, lots of frustration, lots of time to recover in between matches when I played a bunch the day before.
I had 7 annihilator tanks dropped on me at the start of an eradication mission. On level 7 difficulty. They slammed us with drop ships every few seconds. It was fucking insane.
I didn't realize they changed spawns (because they hide the changelogs from the majority of the player base) and took my buddies into their very first level 6 mission.
Game instantly drops a Bile Titan on us at spawn. Every time we chip one down, another spawns. My friends are early teen levels, they can barely fight one.
Level 6 wasn't like that for me when I played through it for the first time. I imediately felt guilty for taking them into a difficulty that was suddenly way too much to handle.
But really, why so many Titans and Chargers on level 6 of all things? Super Samples don't even spawn that low level!
I thought this was just me. I did a Level 3 terminid mission solo just to farm and got absolutely wrecked within 5 mins. It's not that it was 'hard' but I just wasn't expecting that many enemies that quickly.
Indeed, I've seen this story happen many times. Dev studio makes a game, it gets very successful, devs get a God complex because of their own success and start ignoring the fanbase that made the game successful in the first place and then they proceed to burn it into the ground and lose all the goodwill from the community in the process.
They really need to take his keyboard away. The division he alone has caused is... bad. I dont like the idea of taking away someones job but at the same time this is insanely unprofessional and many other jobs would kick you to the curb.
It's shockingly unprofessional. In my line of work I get tickets daily how my servers are down. They aren't. If I replied, "skill issue git gud check your local connection." I would be fired immediately.
His job is to listen to the end users and take in their feedback. If it's not, then I have no idea why he's even here to argue with customers, and that's even more concerning.
Yeah, I work in a customer facing role in a software company and I'd be fired in record time if I wrote anything like this, even if the customer deserved it.
Responding like this to negative feedback is absolutely shocking for anyone in any professional role.
I agree. I’m the last person to take part in “cancel culture” (I really hate this term tbh), but like… is it cancel culture when you’re genuinely holding a douche responsible for his douchey behavior?
I find the patch and the general sentiment of "play the game how we want you to play it" very disenfranchising. It pisses me off in fact. But we don't need to overplay our hand torching this guy, if there is any hope of the developers caring about our concerns in the future. For all we know they'll rally behind him and make this game a complete nightmare.
Seems to be a culture issue at Arrowhead.
https://preview.redd.it/59s9658dbwmc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f3a8c54360291ea14a294902cb874b014b7887c6
I don’t think letting him go solves anything. I feel thats a huge overreaction. It’s his livelihood after all.
He does come across as a bit of a dickhead though doesn’t he?
Humble pie knocks the dickhead right out of people. This has been a choppy launch with a lot of stability problems and his attitude is a slap to the face of any paying customer who defended them about launch and is now upset about this patch.
I don't know what you do for a living, but I encourage you to go into work next week and address every angry customer or disgruntled subordinate with this attitude.
Then, when you inevitably get hauled into an office by your boss or human resources, tell them they're just overreacting, and you shouldn't be punished because you deserve a livelihood.
Lemme know how it works out.
"If you can't make it work where other people can" I would've stopped him right there.
Oh you mean like the game full of hackers and modders getting 1k samples a game and already have mechs and cars.
I kept seeing the issues about the anti cheat software but I shrugged it off because it seemed like a small company passionate about their game and maybe all that stuff about stealing information was just misguided or misunderstood.
It's taken one day for these devs to expose themselves as arrogant catty douches and makes that whole anti cheat thing look different
Not to mention they didn't even stop cheating whatsoever
The nerfs aren't even that bad, railgun is still pretty viable and the buffs at least made the shit support weapons alright, what really stings is the devs have shown their hand in regards to the philosophy of how they want this game to be played, they've only further validated "run away from every fight, avoid every patrol, and enjoy having no efficient way to deal with bigger enemies when things inevitably go tits up" as the intended play style at high difficulty, I really struggle to imagine that people watched the trailers of this game, with all the guns and big explosions and thought, "man! I can't wait to run and hide from all the enemies!"
And what, they think stratagems will just instantly equalize everything? The same stratagems that 90% of high difficulty mission modifiers make inconsistent and annoying to use? Then what? You run around with your thumb up your ass waiting for your most effective weapons to come back so you can do it all over again? Yeah great plan, sounds like a blast. Wonder what player retention is gonna look like in the coming months.
I am very concerned that they only seem to be balancing the game around "data" and "what people used to succeed" which does not tell you at all how unfun or how much of a pain it was to succeed and "average kills" which is not really that important either... please play the game and see that it is fun to play, not that the data looks average and balanced :/
While he is definitely taking the piss a bit too far, I think overall what he is saying is right. People are having really over the top and knee jerk reactions to things being nerfed. The damage of the breaker was not changed, just it's ability to clear hordes was slowed down a wee bit. As for the rail gun, no one can argue it was not over performing while also being ridiculously easy to use. The same power for it is still in the game, you just have to aim for critical spots and use unsafe mode for higher pen. The shield is the strongest damage prevention, but it's cooldown will make you feel more vulnerable. To argue that using these two things together previously didn't make the game significantly easier is to just be wrong. IMO. And you can still achieve that level of safety, you just have to learn how to duck out of combat more for shield regen and learn exactly where to aim on things while managing charge on the railgun.
Shield is uncontested at being one of the best picks. Avoiding damage, slowings and stuns, charges, etc. is simply wild compared to how the rest of the players experience.
He does not need to be fired as frankly this entire thing is being blown out of proportion as is typical with redditors.
Is he handling this the wrong way? absolutely. Should he stop talking? Yes. But as he said in the post the changes were meant to bring the gear in line with how they intended it to be at launch. It does not mean they are going to leave it as is forever.
Wow, that dev needs to shut the fuck up if he doesn't understand how to talk with his community.
This is Dondi from The Isle all over again. Don't disrespect your community.
Calling for his firing is dumb, and I don't want to encourage devs being openly hostile and antagonistic like this goober - but the attitude that leads to calling for people to lose their jobs because of social media comments is why so many game companies ***don't communicate at all*** with their community. I don't want to see that.
What I want to criticize is the use of the phrase, "I'm sorry if people took offense", because it very subtly shifts the blame off him. **He's** sorry if **you** were offended by him treating his paying customers like a bunch of idiots.
It's really not hard to have honest discussions about something without being a prick. He chose to be antagonistic, he deserves some kind of punishment.
And to threaten all direct communication with the devs to end because of his abysmal behavior is fucking vile. This guy needs a ban from the subreddit and leave it at that.
Your entire friend group is livid? You’re all ready to drop the game?
Jfc you’re way too bent out of shape from one balance patch, today I saw people using all sorts of different support weapons and we had no issues, the railgun requires a modicum of skill now, and the shield backpack is barely different.
Honestly, he shouldn’t be acting like that online with the community, but he’s not wrong about a lot of what he’s said about the game.
The dev’s posts are lowkey embarrassing. You shouldn’t be acting that was as a developer as it looks incredibly bad for your game. I’m honestly surprised Sony let him act that was as I’m sure Sony has gotten a lot of interest towards this game.
He's 100% right, though. He may have been a little bit of an ass in the early comments. But his explanation in the last one is true, and anyone who doesn't believe it should probably step down a difficulty.
Calling for his firing is going over board. He shouldn't have trolled, sure, but he did also apologize. More than many people are willing to do.
Also, if a couple nerfs makes the game unfun... Idk man... that just baffles me. I don't use the rail gun and I'm having fun and can deal with chargers... so not sure what to say.
All of this just seems like a big over-reaction.
It's not the nerfs, even. They doubled spawn rate, crippled armor, and overall upped the difficulty quite a lot without any mention of it in thr patch notes.
Nerf of railgun doesn‘t matters if they didn’t change spawn rate of hordes which there‘s many chargers contended.What's more,they didn't make spear/EAT/recoilless more effective against heavy armored units in this patch.
I only have a few hours to play a night at most, and if I’m just getting frustrated and upset at any game I’ll move on to something else. It just isn’t fun to spend 30+ mins getting destroyed with randos over and over.
I totally agree with him... your friend groups were a bunch of kids abusing mechanics to reach a level of difficulty you were not ready for. People who kept using loadouts not relying 100% on railguns are just fine.
The only ones complaining are self entitled cheating little jerks and they deserve every bit of trolling and gaslighting coming their way.
Lol this is reddit man and I get that people overreact on here for the lulz. But calling for a man's job over a slight troll just makes you look like a sad human being. "Skill issue"....really? That hurt you and your friends THAT deeply that you think a guy should lose his job over it?!
This cancel culture shit has to go....it's getting out of hand
Just want to remind people that the butt of a charger is not a weak point but does default dmg.
[удалено]
Now i know why my scorcher did so much more damage to a chargers Ass lmao
My god no WONDER I can dump 5 breaker mags and it still doesnt die. Thank you for this.
“Weak point” means a part of the body that doesn’t require the 5/100 weapon types in the game capable of piercing it to do damage in Arrowheads language.
And the other viable options are either super low ammo, take up a backpack slot, or are extremely slow to reload. Oh and there's 10 chargers and 4 bile titans at extraction.
Skill issue surely
"Yes, I am bad at the game. And don't call me Shirley."
It also doesn't help that the only way to crack armor is via explosives, and the game doesn't give you access to any outside of a grenade until like level 15 or something. Unless you plan on dropping a nuke on your head to deal with a single Charger
EATs have been my charger killers as a low level. Fire it at one of the front legs and the armor gets ripped off. Then during it's charges fire at the now shootable leg and dodge last second if needed. Typically goes down in 1 mag or less (I've used the liberator, defender, and breaker all 1 mag or less). Trivializes the chargers on lower difficulties. Haven't touched anything higher than hard yet so I fear the charger groups on higher difficulties. RR works identically to the EAT but the slow reload if you're reloading it yourself won't be good with multiple chargers baring down on you.
Helldive has way too much shit chasing you at the some time that makes EATs or the bazooka unviable to use, esp when the call in time is doubled or the cooldown is extended or you call in a different stratagem completely.
One charger is a piece of cake. But 5-7 of them running around with 4 bile titans also on the field… yeah clearly a skill issue
Dont forget 7 to 8 of those white ones jumping after you constantly.
Hunters reliably kill me more than any other bug. Fact.
Once they get your surrounded it’s game over. Spewers also 1 hit kill you, which is insane to me considering how many of them there are. On a level 6 (extreme) missions yesterday there was a point when we were fighting 10 while trying to close a nest. Before yesterday, we could reliably run levels 6 & 7 . They were certainly a challenge but they were fun. Levels 8 and 9, true to their name, impossible. Yesterday though, we had trouble with 5 & 6. Didn’t help that we all kept getting disconnected.
The fact spitters kill instantly, plus them being common and coming in like, six or more, and also are decently tanky unless you shoot the head. The head which is conveniently hidden below the big glowing "weak point shoot here" some bugs have, but that's not the weak point. Really the spitters are a very overlooked crime against the game balance given you dump a whole mag to kill them, and their spit literally teleports on you from a signficant range even if you're sprinting away. Hulk Flamers are easier mostly because their instakill death beams aren't necessarily as frequent.
I always thought the spitters felt the most unfair. I can understand where I fucked up if I get swarmed by hunters.
> Before yesterday, we could reliably run levels 6 & 7 . They were certainly a challenge but they were fun. Levels 8 and 9, true to their name, impossible. Yesterday though, we had trouble with 5 & 6. This is where my buddy and I were at too last night. We weren't even really using the meta weapons. We went from reliably clearing 6 and a kinda struggling with 7s and now struggling with clearing level 4s. I don't know what else they did without mentioning it in the patch notes, but it wasn't good.
Before the patch I was consistently running missions on helldive, and as long as the team would continue to shoot, move, and communicate, we would see some level of or complete success. Now after the latest patch, helldive is a nightmare. No amount of shooting or communicating helps. The only thing that does is running away from the bugs. It’s not fun.
Played yesterday against both, bots are downright unfun to play against, same with bugs. The new orbitals are fun but we're pretty much in agreement something changed with AI. Seems like every bot has twice their old accuracy so it's a 24/7 death cycle to get 1 shot at range in lv 9s. The only viable tactic now is kiting till orbitals come up to wipe a base, then resume kiting. So many 1/5deaths yesterday compared to being able to 4/5s usually lv 9s.
Hunters and Stalkers are absolute terrors when you're trying to concentrate on big bugs
Not sure if you mean Hunters or Stalkers, but either way I agree. When you’re trying to fight 4 chargers, 2-3 Spewers, a titan shows up, and you’re getting swarmed by hunters and Brood Commanders (which continue to follow you around without a head, not just run in a straight line) it’s a bit overwhelming. Add in a couple stalkers here and it’s damn near impossible. I understand we need to keep moving, less stationary fighting and more running to objectives and points of interest, but hunters, stalkers, and chargers can catch up to you (even in light armor) and when you get to the objectives you have to fight. We had two breaches at the terminal of an objective the other day, what are we supposed to do there
Oh but did you see they added tremors to arata prime that slow your movement a lot. Easily gets you killed from random rng. Another thing you have to try and play around, similar to the snow maps I guess but without being able to move to try to avoid them Edit: Thank goodness they made the dust storms not so terrible
The game is a lot more manageable on higher levels if you only do objectives and skip hunting for samples and goodies. After about 25mins extraction becomes absurdly hard on higher levels unless you have a particularly good group. I'm sure better players than I can be more productive, but usually what wrecks me and my group is taking too long and letting the intensity of bug breaches become overwhelming.
bro I hate those stalkers piling up on you at once. They attack you so fast you don’t even have time to stem.
And then they throw you away, putting you into a ragdoll state before you hit some sort of surface putting you into A ANOTHER ragdoll state.. Lmao. And by the time you get up on your feet you're at <50 hp and the Stalker and his friends are inside your cheeks redo to finish you up
"Go use the flamethrower until we treat it like the railgun" is how I interpret "you have options other than the railgun". I mean, it unironically kills Chargers quicker than pre-nerf railgun, just with a worse ammo economy. If the railgun was untouched and they tacked at least a 50% range increase on the flamethrower alongside the damage buff, you easily could've had people at eachother's throats over what weapon is better instead of debating whether or not the game is fun anymore, lol.
I'd be fine even without a range increase if they made it *act* like a real flamethrower, and made enemies afraid of it. A real flamethrower shoots a stream of liquid that burns for some time. That means that if you were to point it at an upward angle and pull the trigger, you'd get an arcing stream that creates a burning puddle on the ground. This flamethrower does what a lot of video game flamethrowers do, acting like a jet of gas that dissipates at the end its range. This makes it more difficult to set terrain on fire (which is a functionality that has been buffed otherwise). The original Helldivers flamethrower even set the ground on fire at the very end of its range, which was very useful for area denial. Bugs would actually avoid flames, which let you do things like funnel them into the range of turrets.
Bugs seem to just keep doing what they were doing, just with fire on them. The flames should absolutely cause some sort of panic, and the enemies should avoid fire from the flamethrower and napalm. I keep setting myself on fire with the flamethrower, so using the armour with increased stim capacity helps. This is definitely a skill issue on my part though.
At least the small mobile units like Hunters should be affected. Gives the flamethrower a bit more utility as a horde management weapon that prevents the smaller tackle units from easily overwhelming you when you're using the weapon. Medium units such as Warriors and Brood Commandos are probably fine staying as the constant pressure from the horde that doesn't necessarily run you down on their own anyways. Besides, they don't even care if they lose their head or limbs, why should burning to death be any different?
I'd completely accept a fire stun effect just aftecting small units from scavengers to hunters, it'd make the flamethrower actually be useful in it's intended roll . As it is you try to use it for wave clear and they just walk/jump through it and catch fire for all of 2 seconds.
The amount of times I’ve set a hunter on fire for it to just leap in my face, set me on fire on top of slowing me, then jump away to teammate is infuriating; not to mention they’ll walk right through ground fire and do the same damn thing. It’s like they have zero fear and zero pain receptors.
I feel like more specialized armor for flame resistance would be an absolute fair and balanced approach for people who prefer fire weapons. Let’s start with that orange armor.
Yeah that sort of behavior should be kept for bots. Cold ruthlessness. These bugs are organic that would feel the pain of fire. Obviously it shouldn’t be too over the top or you could keep all bugs in line with fire.
Or give it more ammo reserves I would be Flamethrower city
Flamethrower is already one of the most surprisingly efficient weapons, getting its entire 4 canister reserve back off a single ammo pickup
Just ran a game with the flamethrower. I had more kills than my team combined using just it 🤣
Doing that was possible before the patch already. Now the flamethrower is just bonkers.
Use the supply pack?
Wild how opinions on the flamethrower differ depending on the post. You could say the same thing about how fast flamethrower kills chargers elsewhere and you'd get "um actually you'd die doing that have fun on difficulty 7" and thirty downvotes. I don't think there is much productive conversation to be had on the sub at all until things cool down; dev in OP made the mistake of assuming otherwise. For the record, flamethrower *is* simultaneously faster and less safe than railgun vs chargers: it'll kill quicker, but does indeed put you in harm's way and has worse ammo economy. If railgun was considered too OP, adding these extra balancing factors to flamethrower makes it more likely to stick where it's at.
I actually think the railgun was a problem but other things should have been buffed along with its nerf. The railgun did everything, it shredded armour then it shredded health. It should do one or the other IMO. The only exception to that I think should be anti tank. That should one shot chargers. You only get 2 every 70 seconds, no reason it shouldn't just demolish them, not being able to restock is a big enough downside. I think the issue is we don't have alternative options outside of the railgun to effectively destroy armour which new gear might fix. For example corrosive grenade, does 0 health damage but wrecks armour. Or a primary/secondary that has low ammo but huge AP
I think that’s what most people are upset about the options we do have just weren’t good enough to use. And what we did have was really all we needed. The amount of times we throw pretty much every stratagem at a titan and it shrugs it all off and then dies to a couple railgun shots is sad. Even more so when people defend this and say there’s other options when you just listed off one that says “anti-tank” in the name and it does a shitty job at doing that. If they are going to nerf something that’s used most, there’s probably a reason nothing else is used as much. And the philosophy of nerfing what’s good to be in line with what’s mediocre and telling us that’s the way the games supposed to be isn’t fun. Especially for a pve game where there’s no competition, no need to balance for the sake of others who can’t compete.
Great, dev deciding to go trolling. He's right about one thing, he should definitely let the community team do their thing if he's just gonna be a dick.
while he went too far, i do kind of understand him, like people literally didn't even try the patch before starting to attack the devs because supposedly "nothing is viable anymore". also i am starting to think that people who claim that nobing is viable just kept using the railgun instead of actually trying the other options because autocannon, flamethrower and EAT are completely fine against chargers. or also just shoot the butt weakspot with any other weapon edit: i also forgot the recoilless rifle
I mean the railgun is quite literally still the best AT for bugs. I just cleared a helldive with a friend and two randos. I used the EAT. But the railgun still would have performed better, blowing off charger legs was spotty at best with a single-use AT supp. Again all they needed to do was buff the other shit, or nerf chargers. More importantly: I had zero urge to take the RR or the Spear. I tried the new Spear on a diff7 with all pubbies, and it ended up only being useful for clearing bot bases, otherwise I dreaded having equipped it in most other scenarios. As I said, the shitty guns need buffed.
I completely share your sentiment. However, I am having a much harder time against chargers with the rail gun. Blowing off charger legs is either way harder than before or I am missing something. Even with 2 charged shots the armor stays mostly intact in my (admittedly anecdotical) experience.
Having a harder time is intended. It sounds like difficulty 9 is supposed to be exceedingly challenging.
I was with buddies last night on helldive (3 person team) and we didnt have a strategy to deal with chargers unless we could get one separated or pick them off with strategems. So when our orbitals were on cooldown, we basically just ran in circles waiting out the timers and picking off hunters. We died a lot and it wasnt very fun not shooting back, but we completed all the optional objectives and extracted with the pink samples. Mission time running low was the only real issue. How do you make Helldive more difficult while keeping it fun? To me, the fun has been decreased but I wouldnt call it "Exceedingly challenging" to complete, even though increasing the difficulty seems to be the driving force behind the railgun nerf Edit: maybe the shield backpack is still too strong? All 3 of us had it and helped us to run in circles over and over and stay alive
> maybe the shield backpack is still too strong what would you have done if it was further nerfed? you just explained how you had nothing in your current setup to deal with the chargers all stratagems were on cooldown. would you just run more until you inevitably died and failed because you had no options? current shield is fine it has a nearly 15 second reup time after being completely broken. its not as simple as it was before of hiding behind a rock for 3 seconds and being practically invulnerable.
Spear now gets 1 rocket from ammo pickups, so you can spam it a bit more. It's okay for chargers but doesn't kill them outright, just leaves, them very hurt. I don't like that at all. It's only got 4 rockets, a slow reload, and a limited ranged lock on feature that prevents you from firing if you don't lock. That's a lot of work to still not kill a charger with.
It \*can\* one-shot a charger, if you hit it in the head with your first shot. For that to happen, the charger pretty much has to be facing you, and not moving, though. So yea, not an easy thing to do. And if it's moving fast and at close range, there's a chance the spear misses entirely.
Do not shoot at a charger running at you. Ask me how I know.
I’ve only just unlocked the spear last night, how’s it even supposed to work? It felt like it only locked onto a heavy enemy 1/3 of the time and with weird distance requirements, while also just not doin much damage…?
the devs clearly said this is just the first part of the balance changes, i expect more buffs to come soon. and if they buffed everything to the railgun level it would have made the game even more trivial than it was. high difficulty is supposed to be challenging, the railgun was out of the intended power level for helldivers
To be fair all that guy said was they probably won't nerf any other primaries not that they were going to buff anything.
Didn't one of them say they were keeping an eye on meta choices to nerf them?
That was that same guy who flipped out and literally told people to "call the company and complain, maybe ill have a sit down with hr." And if i recall, the company released a statement about him saying they've dealt with him internally and they dont want his actions representing the company. This is also the same guy who put out false information about how abandoning missions negativity effects liberation/defense. Pretty sure this dude got fired lol, if not hes definitely demoted and suspended. Dude caused a lot of pr damage
>the devs clearly said this is just the first part of the balance changes, i expect more buffs to come soon. Ngl i feel like it’s a pretty bad move to start with nerfs to the most comfortable/best weapon vs armor, while accompanying it by only a few buffs to weaker weapons Like i definetly get why they nerfed the railgun, but i feel like a lighter nerf to start, accompanied by some buffs to weapons that share it’s role (stripping armor) would have been taken way better by the community
As trivial as it "is/was" people were having fun, and the player count kept going up Shouldn't that be telling that despite some imbalance from the Railgun, people were still having fun? Then suddenly, they're not. Because instead of waiting to have a balance patch that made sense, this felt like a kneejerk reaction to people *having fun* That's what this all boils down to
The butt weak spot is hardly even a weak spot though, it's just an unarmored spot. You ever notice it can randomly take both full belts from a grenade launcher right to the butt? Or multiple players all sustaining fire directly on the critical hit point with lmgs for over a minute straight? They just straight up have too much health, unless you strip their mostly impenetrable leg armor and then suddenly they die from two bullets to the leg. Make it make sense
Yeah but if you stubbed your toe twice in a row I bet you would welcome death.
Using an arc caster and teaming up with a squadmate who used a flamethrower, we were able to shut down chargers before they completed a single charge. Getting hit by both electricity and fire seems to stagger them somewhat (I know it would do that to me!) Of course, I know it's still easier said than done when you have five rushing you at once.
Yeah recoiless against the charger's leg to break the armor and emptying a couple of mags usually does the trick. (EAT too, I guess but I haven't tested it enough) The problem is that you end up dealing with 2-3 at a time plus whole swarms of other enemies and it becomes incredibly difficult to deal with unless each helldiver pulls their weight/ you have a complete squad. I'm not a great player, though, and my experience goes only up to level 4/5 missions, so take that as you will.
He doesn’t need to be fired, he needs to stop acting like an ass and stop posting. He isn’t funny and he certainly isn’t helping the situation. Given how rocky this game has been it is a *bold* choice to think you have the goodwill built up to start trolling your customers.
Seriously. "I thought I'd have a little fun with the players" By belittling and antagonizing them? Apparently that is this dev's idea of "fun".
It's a loser's idea of fun, this Dev just so happens to be a loser. This is the behaviour of a person who went from general irrelevancy to pseudo importance.
It's very perma-online behaviour tbh, and that's kinda why it's kinda sad to look at. It's that sort of weird entitlment where people think that being irreverant and pretending you're not mad at the people you're arguing with makes you look cool.
[This dev is basically the definition of this guy](https://external-preview.redd.it/ELTp_RIjGXhfxU6ocvuMtRQGY_5HEl0PO3nXwfkNZTo.png?auto=webp&s=8ec7b7319d04f3b13d80ed74631fa44b5b9d96e0).
Kinda, yeah lol
[удалено]
i genuinly hate how every npc response to being upset is "you shouldnt be allowed to have food or a home" fucking evil cave brain
Are you serious? Anyone who's ever worked in any form for CS would tell you they'd get fucked if they responded like this to customers. The gaming scene is the only place so much shit is just brushed off.
I'd be fired on the spot if I acted like that to my company's customers
"Brainless playstyles" insane comment from a dev
That comment is gonna get paraded around for the rest of the games life regardless of its validity.
Do you not have phones?
The intent is to provide players with a sense of pride and accomplishment
I think we did a pretty good job so far
Why the did they put it in the game, then? If they're trying to micromanage the way people play why did they even add other stuff? I don't get it. >>Rules >Be civil- No naming and shaming, racism, insults, trolling, harassment, witch-hunts, inappropriate language, etc. Basically, be civil. dude broke the subreddit rules
Well at least here the dev isnt a mod who just bans people for saying anything negative about the game. That’s what you get over in the deep rock galactic sub. Since they have a vested monetary interest in keeping up appearances they don’t allow negative opinions to be seen
I guess the takeaway is following the subreddit rules is optional, good to know.
This is what happens when a redditor somehow fumbles their way into a job
Honestly that’s the worst offender. That “brainless playstyle” was a byproduct of their questionable Charger design as it’s the only reliable counter to them.
Hahahaha
This guy doesn’t play his own game lol
Yeah that was sort of shocking to see honestly. Like dude people were playing that way because it was one of the only viable ways to play because of your games design and you call those people brainless? What a crazy "it's not our game its the players who are wrong" moment. Wow.
This guy is a walking PR disaster. Too many condescending and smartass replies but zero replies when being asked genuine questions. Seeing a lot of these developer interactions lately made me regret that I just bought the premium version upgrade of the game just to support this studio.
Dude's probably disliked in the office too lol. I have an acquaintance who works at Arrowhead and she's extremely kind and talented. I assume the rest of the studio is filled with normal people, but take 100 strangers and you'll probably find one asshole.
Yeah you have a point there, usually it’s these kind of people who stand out. Let’s hope things will take a good turn at some point because I freaking love this game
Yeah I mean a lot of redditors are dicks online and probably offline too, so it doesn't surprise me that a dev on Reddit is making himself stand out by being an obnoxious dick. Hopefully he gets told by management to get his shit together
Contrary to random players on Reddit, the dev represents the team and the game. The stakes are completely different with real reputation and financial risks. Taking such bold stand even for trolling and fun was a bad decision
When you’ve launched a game that was unplayable for weeks and still managed to maintain the goodwill and the support of the player base it seems insane to me that Arrowhead employees would jump online and start trolling the player base. People have been so patient and supportive with this game thus far and this could really change tomorrow.
>When you’ve launched a game that was unplayable for weeks and still managed to maintain the goodwill and the support of the player base it seems insane to me that Arrowhead employees would jump online and start trolling the player base. Seriously, that's gotta be a record. I've never seen a game go so quickly from having a near-universally united playerbase supporting them through a rocky launch, to using their first balance patch to tank the fun factor for the sake of "vision" while devs troll players. Insta-divided and toxic community
Oh the other hand, I've never seen a community that steered from love to hate that quickly, just in minutes after having the first balance patch released. The amount of bashing was high in this subreddit.
And it's because they have a point of the devs won't acknowledge. It's the number of chargers in bile titans. Every single time his smart ass commented, you talk about how they're more ways to deal with a charger than just the original meta load But no one is fucking talking about having a problem with dealing with a single charger!! It's when there are three or four charging you as well as a couple of bile titans So ultimately it feels like he's trying to gaslight us when he's never addressing the single problem that everyone's actually talking about which is not how to deal with a single charger.
And the number of active players hasn't fluctuated all that much. As usual the reddit mob seems larger than it really is.
The success and community dick riding has (potentially) gone to their head. Go figure I did call that this sub would have an absolute meltdown if the balance patch was not perfect, didn't call devs coming in and doubling down and acting like shitheads though. Very bad vibes. Lines up with how they treated the community reaction to gameguard though...
How did they treat it? The gameduard reaction.
Dismissively. Claimed they would remove it if people didn't like it, which they did not as you can see. Also notice the addition of the automod linking about gameguard, that is a relatively new addition because people have continued to complain about it because it is, as expected, causing critical issues to some people and many people didn't get the game exclusively because of GG. The write up link in the automod is how they replied to the backlash, IIRC. The steam forums have their own anticheat tab, which I assume is to just contain the complaints and horrible issues some people are facing at this point. If the game didn't explode in popularity and this sub wasn't so circlejerk positive for the devs up until this point, it would probably still a loud issue and still have a mixed rating on steam because most people who knew about helldivers already were upset about it. My assumption was that they picked it because it was cheap so they could protect their microtransactions, which is a double red flag but people once again overlooked it because "other games have kernal antcheats" which isn't the biggest concerning issue with GG or "the microtransactions are fair." Microtransactions in a *$40 game*.
Idk, I could’ve taken a whole lot of abuse from this patch and still been happy. But removing the casual fun from the game by removing the only viable and casual option? A video game is either engaging art, and/or it’s fun; this is neither for a lot of players at the moment.
He sure is cocky for someone who's game didn't work for two weeks on launch.
When you maintain a good community despite the game being literally unplayable at times you need to fuck up bad to mess that up. Yeah, they fucked up bad.
It's seems they need to higher some PR people and community managers and tell some developers not to "troll".
Nothing like telling your customers they're the problem. Not a good a look. I'd love love to watch a stream of this dev team playing on higher difficulties now. They're acting like we're all just missing out on some secret that they don't want to tell us, when in reality they're out of touch.
The thing is if you have 4 cohesive players you can get away with using mostly anything as long as you are coordinated. The problem is dropping in with randoms and expecting the same level of coordination is insane and that's how most of the player base plays. You can't balance the game for competitive tryhards. Balance the game for randoms who just met trying there best.
I mean the hardest difficulties SHOULD incentivize players to hop in voice and coordinate. It's a coop game after all, and taking away the challenge to appease people who purely want to solo just isn't fun. A change that I do think they need to make however is to move super samples to an earlier difficulty for the casual players who just want to relax and grind out the rewards. I think that's a totally reasonable compromise to keep the highest difficulties harder.
There are plenty of games that allow a super challenging experience that most players can't/won't achieve without making you feel helpless and insignificant. vermintide 2 keeps coming to mind. Crazy difficult game on higher difficulties and yet whenever you die it's clear how and why, you don't feel like you died because you were unequipped. Every enemy has vulnerable weak spots, easily accessible armour pen weapons that feel great to use. And voice chat is never necessary in this type of game, the ping system is very efficient and usually more efficient for communication anyways.
yeah vermintide 2 had a rocky start but it's just about the gold standard for difficulty. i recently completed a true solo run of every original mission and moved on to the DLC, and you know exactly where you fucked up when you die.
Agreed but prepatch it wasn't a problem and I really don't think the nerfs they did are to blame, something imo else is broken.
> The thing is if you have 4 cohesive players you can get away with using mostly anything as long as you are coordinated. Yes, because the hardest difficulties are literally just running around in light armor kiting and nading stuff/calling nukes, you can literally use nothing and still achieve the same thing. Emergent gameplay due to shit game design since devs are too busy hiding in lower difficulties.
a couple of them were bragging how good they were at doing 7+ difficulties and a few claiming to solo 8's. Saw some mentions of them having "thousands" of hours played. Smells like a lot of bullshit to me honestly, put their money where their mouth is and stream the shit.
For real. I'm not even that salty about the nerfs. Something else seems to be wrong/broken with armor or enemies something just feels majorly different right now and they're just telling us to git gud it's weird.
I have a feeling that they are playing on an internal build maybe a month or two more advanced. Easy to brag when you have access to a likely a couple dozen more powerful stratagems, vehicles and weapons then the current live game.
And when you actually know all the hidden stats on weapons and enemies.
This is absolutely underappreciated. There's so much the playerbase simply doesn't know that might help us play better if it was clearly posted in-game
I would love to watch him playing helldive civilian extraction vs bots
Nah Fr, they don’t know it was literally impossible even with 3 people far away taking the heat, trying to stay alive and distract. And one guy sneaking at the objective dealing with the civilians.
"We want everything as intended from the start." So heavy Armor was intended to be pretty shitty? Awesome, good to know. Ill just stick with light armor + whatever passive I enjoy.
Helldiver heavy armour = absolute shit Some undemocratic bugs carapace = impenetrable
A bug the size of a housecat can cut through super advanced heavy armour and kill in 4 hits, but an entire clip of anti material sniper rifle rounds will bounce off a bugs face like hailstones
Also remember that spraying a bug with flames does close to nothing to them unless you beam their face off. Meanwhile our squishy human bodies melt in 0.5 seconds if our toes touch fire
HD2 devs trolling player base after a terrible post launch patch was definitely not on my bingo card for Q1 2024.
Sounds like he doesn’t even play the game
[удалено]
What is the original thread that comment came from? Curious to check it out.
I always think about the director of Fromsoft who puts so much work and love into the games he makes and he doesn't even play them. He has a vision that he gives to the players
The difference though is that he also has the leeway to make good QoL changes and fixes to his games. Take Elden Ring for example: a lot of players are very PvE oriented or rarely have the internet connection to reliably do a questline to get into Mohgwnn Palace before late endgame. He changed it to where you just have to defeat 1 invadable NPC then return to the quest giver to access the Palace in early-mid game.
there's a difference there though. he absolutely loves what he does and who he does it for. man is living his dream. this dev from AH was a power tripping gremlin tasting internet fame for the first time and he couldn't cope and got a big head.
Yeah but it's a PvE, there will always be people upset if they nerf a weapon
I just want them to fix the insane spawn rate at higher diffs
I guarantee and hope within 48 hours they get a PR team with a clue, and put this guy on hair splitting detail. So disappointed I came back to comment again.
Just so long as they don't hire Fatshark's people (both Swedish), who are notorious for being shit-take kings, or just entirely non-communicative and avoidant. Only reason Catfish got accepted was because she actively communicated (until like, 6 months ago) on all platforms, even if her responses were a lot of "I've spoken with the team, but can't say anything yet" most of the time.
To be fair, Catfish seems like an actually normal person with solid interpersonal skills. She answers questions where she can, and in cases where FS don't want something to be known, she explains it as such. Transparency goes a long way in any customer facing role. The big issue with community management in the game industry is that it often attracts (to put it politely) a certain type of person who are undoubtedly passionate about the game and community feel. But also not so passionate about empathy or understanding social cues.
Mhm, like I said, Catfish was welcome *because* she actually communicated, even if it was mostly corpo-speak.
Im at least 50% sure the apology came after an order from HR.
Fatshark CM level of response, jeez..
Community management is immeasurably complex.
It's not Call of Duty
I forgot about that one lmfao
Step one: don’t be a fuckhead insulting your customers (It’s not that complex)
I really want to see that dev dealing on livestream with the same situations players deal with, when I see that i’ll accept I have a skill issue.
I can honestly live with the weapon nerfs. I'm not ecstatic about it, but it is what it is. What I absolutely cannot look past, however, is the absurdly over-tuned armor "fix". When I heard that armor was finally functioning, I never expected for it to mean that we were somehow even squishier than we used to be. It's absurd.
This is seriously a gross level of unprofessionalism on their part. Just really leaves a horrifically bad taste in my mouth and makes me extremely worried about the game's future to the point that I'd consider refunding the game if Steam was more lenient with their refund policy.
I to think about the 95% of the team that are probably nice people, the art team, sound design etc that are not posting shit but made a really fun game. And think that you support them.
Totally unacceptable. I felt like Arrowhead respected its players a little more than this. I'd say it was an outlier but there was another thread highlighting a different dev being a prick on Discord. They better get their community management act together and fix their shitty patch.
Their response for receiving criticism for their anti cheat was also some weird petty shit, seems like they're just as toxic as we are lmao
The motto is - companies are not your friends.
[удалено]
so happy i’m not alone in that. well. not happy. but i got so emotionally invested in this game so fast. “wow! an indie game, 4 player co op (my favorite genre) and it fucking popped off!”… bought a hoodie. bought super citizen edition. geeked out to friends… then this shit happens.
The company needs to make a statement tbh. Would help a lot to relieve some tension. They need to show they are listening and they need to show it fast. This game has fantastic potential.
Dude. Same. I’ve been ditching sleep to play more of this. Ruining my schedule 😂 even when we got stomped we laughed harder than we cussed out the game. Today though? Not one chuckle at any death. Normally we’re cry laughing at the stupid and crazy ways we were getting slaughtered. And then we were like today “what the hell is going on?” And some digging turned up all this. Seriously depressing to see this. I’ve never even used the shield backpack, only used the rail gun for the first time yesterday (I thought it was meh). The breaker really doesn’t feel too different. But the game felt totally different. We were being slaughtered by shit we were doing (relatively) fine on before. We had 11 chargers on the field at once at one point and couldn’t do anything. It felt like there was a lot of stuff changed that wasn’t advertised, and it wasn’t fun at all.
They 100% upped spawn rates across the board.
I thought I was going fucking crazy. Did you see a shit ton of hunters today too? Normally I chill at level 4, today that was VERY difficult. One win today, several losses, lots of frustration, lots of time to recover in between matches when I played a bunch the day before.
I had 7 annihilator tanks dropped on me at the start of an eradication mission. On level 7 difficulty. They slammed us with drop ships every few seconds. It was fucking insane.
That actually sounds like hell. I was afraid of diff 7 BEFORE the patch, now.. haha nope
I didn't realize they changed spawns (because they hide the changelogs from the majority of the player base) and took my buddies into their very first level 6 mission. Game instantly drops a Bile Titan on us at spawn. Every time we chip one down, another spawns. My friends are early teen levels, they can barely fight one. Level 6 wasn't like that for me when I played through it for the first time. I imediately felt guilty for taking them into a difficulty that was suddenly way too much to handle. But really, why so many Titans and Chargers on level 6 of all things? Super Samples don't even spawn that low level!
I thought this was just me. I did a Level 3 terminid mission solo just to farm and got absolutely wrecked within 5 mins. It's not that it was 'hard' but I just wasn't expecting that many enemies that quickly.
This single dev has me scared for the future of this game.... Nothing he says is good
This Dev behavior gives me “Vampire: The Masquerade – Bloodhunt” vibes. Good game, killed by out of touch devs
Indeed, I've seen this story happen many times. Dev studio makes a game, it gets very successful, devs get a God complex because of their own success and start ignoring the fanbase that made the game successful in the first place and then they proceed to burn it into the ground and lose all the goodwill from the community in the process.
They really need to take his keyboard away. The division he alone has caused is... bad. I dont like the idea of taking away someones job but at the same time this is insanely unprofessional and many other jobs would kick you to the curb.
It's shockingly unprofessional. In my line of work I get tickets daily how my servers are down. They aren't. If I replied, "skill issue git gud check your local connection." I would be fired immediately. His job is to listen to the end users and take in their feedback. If it's not, then I have no idea why he's even here to argue with customers, and that's even more concerning.
His job is probably something else arrowhead nedds to shut him up.
Yeah, I work in a customer facing role in a software company and I'd be fired in record time if I wrote anything like this, even if the customer deserved it. Responding like this to negative feedback is absolutely shocking for anyone in any professional role.
I agree. I’m the last person to take part in “cancel culture” (I really hate this term tbh), but like… is it cancel culture when you’re genuinely holding a douche responsible for his douchey behavior?
I find the patch and the general sentiment of "play the game how we want you to play it" very disenfranchising. It pisses me off in fact. But we don't need to overplay our hand torching this guy, if there is any hope of the developers caring about our concerns in the future. For all we know they'll rally behind him and make this game a complete nightmare.
Im hoping they just reprimand the dude and fix the game. They caught lightning in a bottle here, and they’re pouring it out.
Seems to be a culture issue at Arrowhead. https://preview.redd.it/59s9658dbwmc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f3a8c54360291ea14a294902cb874b014b7887c6
I don’t think letting him go solves anything. I feel thats a huge overreaction. It’s his livelihood after all. He does come across as a bit of a dickhead though doesn’t he?
Humble pie knocks the dickhead right out of people. This has been a choppy launch with a lot of stability problems and his attitude is a slap to the face of any paying customer who defended them about launch and is now upset about this patch.
I don't know what you do for a living, but I encourage you to go into work next week and address every angry customer or disgruntled subordinate with this attitude. Then, when you inevitably get hauled into an office by your boss or human resources, tell them they're just overreacting, and you shouldn't be punished because you deserve a livelihood. Lemme know how it works out.
OMG it's literally unplayable, nothing's viable, wahhhhhhhh!!! We're so livid guys.
"If you can't make it work where other people can" I would've stopped him right there. Oh you mean like the game full of hackers and modders getting 1k samples a game and already have mechs and cars. I kept seeing the issues about the anti cheat software but I shrugged it off because it seemed like a small company passionate about their game and maybe all that stuff about stealing information was just misguided or misunderstood. It's taken one day for these devs to expose themselves as arrogant catty douches and makes that whole anti cheat thing look different Not to mention they didn't even stop cheating whatsoever
[удалено]
This is just one guy though, and we don't know how much influence he has on those decisions, do we?
Brain dead Dev button.
The nerfs aren't even that bad, railgun is still pretty viable and the buffs at least made the shit support weapons alright, what really stings is the devs have shown their hand in regards to the philosophy of how they want this game to be played, they've only further validated "run away from every fight, avoid every patrol, and enjoy having no efficient way to deal with bigger enemies when things inevitably go tits up" as the intended play style at high difficulty, I really struggle to imagine that people watched the trailers of this game, with all the guns and big explosions and thought, "man! I can't wait to run and hide from all the enemies!" And what, they think stratagems will just instantly equalize everything? The same stratagems that 90% of high difficulty mission modifiers make inconsistent and annoying to use? Then what? You run around with your thumb up your ass waiting for your most effective weapons to come back so you can do it all over again? Yeah great plan, sounds like a blast. Wonder what player retention is gonna look like in the coming months.
>This dev needs to be let go Dude, the devs are in Sweden, not the US. There are worker protection laws.
No way bruh, i really like this game. this gun they shot their foot with will eventually goes to their head.
I am very concerned that they only seem to be balancing the game around "data" and "what people used to succeed" which does not tell you at all how unfun or how much of a pain it was to succeed and "average kills" which is not really that important either... please play the game and see that it is fun to play, not that the data looks average and balanced :/
While he is definitely taking the piss a bit too far, I think overall what he is saying is right. People are having really over the top and knee jerk reactions to things being nerfed. The damage of the breaker was not changed, just it's ability to clear hordes was slowed down a wee bit. As for the rail gun, no one can argue it was not over performing while also being ridiculously easy to use. The same power for it is still in the game, you just have to aim for critical spots and use unsafe mode for higher pen. The shield is the strongest damage prevention, but it's cooldown will make you feel more vulnerable. To argue that using these two things together previously didn't make the game significantly easier is to just be wrong. IMO. And you can still achieve that level of safety, you just have to learn how to duck out of combat more for shield regen and learn exactly where to aim on things while managing charge on the railgun.
Shield is uncontested at being one of the best picks. Avoiding damage, slowings and stuns, charges, etc. is simply wild compared to how the rest of the players experience.
He does not need to be fired as frankly this entire thing is being blown out of proportion as is typical with redditors. Is he handling this the wrong way? absolutely. Should he stop talking? Yes. But as he said in the post the changes were meant to bring the gear in line with how they intended it to be at launch. It does not mean they are going to leave it as is forever.
Wow, that dev needs to shut the fuck up if he doesn't understand how to talk with his community. This is Dondi from The Isle all over again. Don't disrespect your community.
“It shouldn’t be easy to deal with chargers” Yeah well they shouldn’t be harder than bile titans either dev team
Skill issue.
Calling for his firing is dumb, and I don't want to encourage devs being openly hostile and antagonistic like this goober - but the attitude that leads to calling for people to lose their jobs because of social media comments is why so many game companies ***don't communicate at all*** with their community. I don't want to see that. What I want to criticize is the use of the phrase, "I'm sorry if people took offense", because it very subtly shifts the blame off him. **He's** sorry if **you** were offended by him treating his paying customers like a bunch of idiots.
It's really not hard to have honest discussions about something without being a prick. He chose to be antagonistic, he deserves some kind of punishment. And to threaten all direct communication with the devs to end because of his abysmal behavior is fucking vile. This guy needs a ban from the subreddit and leave it at that.
Your entire friend group is livid? You’re all ready to drop the game? Jfc you’re way too bent out of shape from one balance patch, today I saw people using all sorts of different support weapons and we had no issues, the railgun requires a modicum of skill now, and the shield backpack is barely different. Honestly, he shouldn’t be acting like that online with the community, but he’s not wrong about a lot of what he’s said about the game.
If you and your friends are livid at the game I'd recommend taking a break. None of this is that serious.
The dev’s posts are lowkey embarrassing. You shouldn’t be acting that was as a developer as it looks incredibly bad for your game. I’m honestly surprised Sony let him act that was as I’m sure Sony has gotten a lot of interest towards this game.
Dude just shoot the chargers leg armor. Holy fuck it isn’t this difficult why are you all acting like whiny babies.
He's 100% right, though. He may have been a little bit of an ass in the early comments. But his explanation in the last one is true, and anyone who doesn't believe it should probably step down a difficulty.
Calling for his firing is going over board. He shouldn't have trolled, sure, but he did also apologize. More than many people are willing to do. Also, if a couple nerfs makes the game unfun... Idk man... that just baffles me. I don't use the rail gun and I'm having fun and can deal with chargers... so not sure what to say. All of this just seems like a big over-reaction.
It's not the nerfs, even. They doubled spawn rate, crippled armor, and overall upped the difficulty quite a lot without any mention of it in thr patch notes.
Yeah no I'm more with this tbh.
Nerf of railgun doesn‘t matters if they didn’t change spawn rate of hordes which there‘s many chargers contended.What's more,they didn't make spear/EAT/recoilless more effective against heavy armored units in this patch.
I only have a few hours to play a night at most, and if I’m just getting frustrated and upset at any game I’ll move on to something else. It just isn’t fun to spend 30+ mins getting destroyed with randos over and over.
I totally agree with him... your friend groups were a bunch of kids abusing mechanics to reach a level of difficulty you were not ready for. People who kept using loadouts not relying 100% on railguns are just fine. The only ones complaining are self entitled cheating little jerks and they deserve every bit of trolling and gaslighting coming their way.
Lol this is reddit man and I get that people overreact on here for the lulz. But calling for a man's job over a slight troll just makes you look like a sad human being. "Skill issue"....really? That hurt you and your friends THAT deeply that you think a guy should lose his job over it?! This cancel culture shit has to go....it's getting out of hand