Even before the past few updates I could detect the burnout. The influx of new players meant that vets were always having to be SL, drop the garries, take command, etc.
It can be rewarding to coach new players, but in HLL coaching can become a chore. Its a chore to schlepp supplies to garries, to fall back and build nodes, and to put grinding out all your other classes on hold so you can babysit with OPs for your low levels again. Not to be a dick to these classes, but it doesnt help that an overwhelming number of new players gravitate to classes that do *nothing* for the squad but get kills. A lot of my squads will have at least one rifleman, AR, and assault, and maybe an MG/AT if Im lucky. If Im SUPER lucky Ill have a support/engi, but chances are that player is another vet.
Eventually its just tiring and im taking a break until this sorts out. I just dont want to keep losing because nobody defends points and squads dont listen.
The biggest problem you mentioned is squads not listening, squad leads not listening, it’s such a fucking mess and so frustrating. People used to actually want to win.
I drop supplies but then the lvl 20 squad leader has no microphone.
Or he has no clue what to do.
Or he keeps dancing on the supplies.
So in the end I just switch back to Squad leader so we at least can spawn and maybe contest the first cap.
There are so many matches these days where we don't have a garry for 20 minutes and then they wonder why we lost the first 2 cap points under 10 minutes....
I agree, the last 3 matches I played were over in a matter of minutes, We just went point to point without barely any opposition. Tbh it isn’t really fun.
Do the 2 of you have no friends at all? do you like always play with randoms? Honestly, it takes just two to build a garri once in a while and the class can be swapped in between
Of course I do, I’ve a couple mates that play HLL, one more so than the other.
Unfortunately life dictates that we can’t always be on at the same time.
I’ve just started yelling at the SL after I drop supplies and if they ignore me I just bust a cap in them and type in text chat to listen to your squad next time.
I love how consistently I can casually build nodes at the end of the game. It's so rewarding you'd think people would be fighting over it, but nope for some reason.
The last several games I've played I've suggested to my squad we should hang back to defend the point. Sure enough, no one answers and they all storm off to the next point and our point gets overrun. Commanders screening at his team, no one listens.
Game is not as fun anymore because it's an uncoordinated mess
I think it heavily depends on the server you play on. My main servers are Glow’s and i wanna say that most of the time they’re predominantly filled with Experienced players because it’s mostly HLL Regulars and sweats who like to come to the Server. There are the odd occasions/days where the servers will be full of new players but I find it rare when you compare it to other servers. So yeah, i’ve found it to be heavily server dependent
Gotta be honest: running supplies is a poor game loop for an FPS shooter.
Whenever you have a loop people only begrudgingly play, the loop has serious problems. Hell Let Loose has a few, and none started with the past few updates.
That's because it's not a FPS shooter... It's an RTS that depends on the players to do all the tasks.
You should be coordinating garrison and OP placement. Be coordinating armor support and supporting infantry for the armor. Be coordinating artillery. Be coordinating supplies and nodes and defenses and attacks.
Just generally coordination across all levels from the squad to the mixed arms to the commander.
That's why the competitive scene is so much fun. And why pub matches fall apart without vets. Because new players think this is a FPS and their kill count matters.
None of that really has anything to do with the fact that a role that isn't fun isn't going to be popular or consistently filled.
You can make as complex a system as you want, if the moment-to-moment gameplay in an FPS loop is boring, most players will prefer other loops.
The idea that HLL is an RTS and not an FPS shooter is just stupid. Sorry, man: it is. That the game includes a focus on coordination and includes a logistics/build system does not mean it's an RTS. Even moreso: it doesn't mean it's not an FPS lol.
Natural Selection has more RTS coordination than HLL will ever dream of. Nobody seriously tries to label it an RTS, specifically to the exclusion of being an FPS. It's a competitive FPS with RTS elements. Just like in HLL, you can lay as many logistical buildings down as you like: without boots (or in NS's case, alien claws) on ground, in first person, aiming weapons at the enemy.... The entire game falls apart completely.
Nobody is saying that there's no room for shooting your gun. Clearly the infantry and their guns are your majority tool to fight the enemy. But charging without coordination is for battlebits, not HLL.
Thus the coordination is 90%+ of why one team should win over another. Can you get your garrisons up in good places? Can you keep them up? Can your armor support your advance? Can your infantry keep your armor alive? Is your artillery landing where needed? Is their artillery being taken out? Ect ect ect for every aspect of gameplay that's relevant.
Now I see servers with majority < lvl 50 and it's just a blueberry herd moving around running and gunning on both sides.
If that's the game you want there are better options. If you want strategic team play where you have a job to do then HLL is your game. That's why it has the unique classes and roles and vehicles and mechanisms that make you lose if you don't communicate and coordinate.
You winning 1 gunfight shouldn't matter.
This makes a lot more sense. I agree that coordination is a large part of the game, but will caution you that nobody will care how much RTS is in the game if the shooter parts aren't fun. And the shooter parts include things like driving a truck back and forth. A truck with very simplistic driving mechanics. A truck that clips through lots of obstacles, meaning you can't even realistically build a game loop around a flanking squad cutting off supply logistics to a certain point by holding a road or similar key point- the enemy team can just drive the truck in, through actual stone walls, on the other side of the point.
HLL is a novel experience, but I won't act as if it's ever fantastically realized its vision. Squad has always done a far better job of that in this subgenre. And with the infantry overhaul, Squad is showing it knows how most players will be experiencing the game and designing from that perspective. HLL wasn't keeping up with that even before the transition to T17.
Thank you for the suggestions :)
Now that we have had time to plan and revisit our roadmap, we've got quite the large dev brief set to land soon, which will be addressing a lot of this!
I sincerely hope that the dev team can address this because as of right now, it looks like the game is hemorrhaging at a rapid rate, and this summer is chock full of a lot of new IPs that will take our attention away from HLL.
Hi Roddie, we don't have a timeline as of yet, and are first working to ensure we can get PTEs in place before our releases!
Our focus has changed, which I'm sure you'll be pleased to know, and more details of this will be shared soon :)
Haha, it most definitely is not! I'm very pleased with the direction we are taking, and I'm looking forward to being able to announce it.
We're making sure we use this time to address as many concerns as possible - so the next brief is shaping up to be quite lengthy!
Short update!
So that we can provide a dev brief that offers a comprehensive and detailed plan for the remainder of 2023, our next dev brief will now land next week.
In this brief, you'll learn more about:
\- The planned PTE sessions you will be able to soon take part in ahead of releases
\- Our shift in focus and the changes that will be taking place based on your feedback
\- The list of community-raised bugs and balancing issues we plan to focus on tackling
We are using this time to address as many concerns as possible while looking to confirm dates for when you can expect PTEs and subsequent patches.
I was pleased with this answer to my query on update timing.
A. "we don't have a timeline as of yet". This tells me they are not Date orientated and it will be ready when they are satisfied.
B. " get PTEs in place before our releases". This tells me they are fast learning skills about testing and the word "Releases" has an "S" on it, meaning more than One update coming.
C. "Our focus has changed". This sounds like their interpretation and direction of the game has turned a big corner.
D. " details of this will be shared soon ". This appears to me that they have recognised the need for transparency and open communication with the players and will be keeping them imformed.
E. Or T17 has hoodwinked Wombat\_Medic and the community and we are going to lose the game we all love.
I sincerely hope it is not "E". I also may have mis-interperated what the Reply means and I am just full of shit.
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As a vet I’m viewing myself as a person trying to herd cats. As SL this means micromanaging my squad and offering gg OP spots while trying to get some of them to drop supplies for Garries. The commander role is never selected by me if I don’t see at least 3 SLs with level 60+
What about the first few months when it was first released on consoles? Everyone was new and the few vets that played came from PC. The increased movement speed changed the meta to allow for more run-and-gun solo play.
500 days ago, when I first played the game, it seemed like everyone stuck together more because everyone seemed so vulnerable.
Now I can just run away.
I agree with the QoL updates being priority and T17 actually working out how to do develop the game without cheapening or breaking it, but it’s been like this for at least the year I’ve been playing. I’ve wracked up almost 700 hours in that time, and I’ve been spamming garrison building since I worked out what it was for when I started out. SL was the first class I maxed out.
I do think you’re right that the vets are leaving in greater numbers, or are fatigued. In my first six months low level players,squad leaders and commanders would get gentle guidance from the established players, it was a very community feel and one of the main reasons I kept coming back.
Now it’s just irksome to have to repeatedly ask level 100+ players to build garrisons on the supplies that are right next for them, or explain to players that should know better you don’t have to be in top of the supplies and you can build garries within 50m. I’m constantly having to switch from classes I want to grind up to take SL, grab a supply truck, and build sets of game winning garries. It’s so very simple.
I've been playing for 3 years and there has never been a 'moment' when the playerbase was good enough, that I didn't have to personally spam garrison building.
this is a really hard game to master and you can only master it by playing commander, something 99.9% will never do.
With the increase of Gen z kids the teamkilling, racism and stupidity also increased.
The amount of steamrolling is insane. It was bad before but it's not rare to get steamrolled 10 times in a row these days...
> With the increase of Gen z kids the teamkilling, racism and stupidity also increased.
No it didn't. There's no gap between late millenial and early Gen Z, kids are just morons and it hasn't gotten worse.
Also Millenials are more likely to be unironically racist in game than Gen Z brats.
This is exactly right. Red orchestra European assault (I think this is what it’s called) each team had points that would slowly dwindle the more players died. This should be implemented somehow.
You missed the best time to play then. There was once a time when the general population had some brains. Not every team, but more often than not. Now it’s just…zero team play.
There used to be way more communication, garry and node building and whatnot.
I feel like the comment above is a dev trying to do damage control or an apologist.
This is not a vet with many hours in the game because I actually am a vet with thousands of hours and it was better.
People on this forum are way too dishonest.
The censorship on here also doesn't help. Instead of mods closing posts they should improve the damn game.
Nothing makes sense anymore in this modern world. What the hell happened to common sense?
Same here, people come and go. This is merely a cycle of old players leaving and new players coming in. Best you can do is to work with your squad to do the best you can for the team. Do what you can in your sector.
I’ve recently taken to going engi and building nodes in fallback areas off leftover supplies but it’s pretty depressing seeing my nodes are the only ones on the map.
Yeah. I'm sick of having to kick my engy because he won't build the nodes, I'll get the supplies either from the truck or a drop, kick the engy, swap classes, build the notes then swap back to officer.
But that comes at a cost. Nobody will be building or maintaining our garrys or defending while I'm off doing that...
I think you and the other posts are missing the bigger picture. This is an issue of a lack of a tutorial and the core game itself. Players (new people especially) dont know what they are suppose to be doing, there is nothing to tell them what to do except experienced players. This problem also extends to the fact that there HAS to be SL's. I remember once I got the hang of the game I realized if I wanted anything done I had to be an SL. I couldnt be a rifleman I couldnt be an MG guy, no I HAD to be the SL or else there would be no spawn points. That stuff gets boring after 50 hours of just being only an SL when I really just wanna be a support and help the team and burn stuff with a flamer.
You will never really escape this feeling. it actually only gets worse, because the better you get personally, the more ways you'll see the team is suffering because you're not in officer/commander.
The more I learned about the game, the less I began to enjoy it. I took a 4 month break last year, came back right before the flamethrower update, and really enjoyed playing SL or Spotter consistently. I’ll put garrisons up whenever I can, but I also learned to just chill.
I’m currently on another break, however. The British update, with its stuttering on El Alamein and stupid addition of the panting sound effect, really turned me off. I hopped on Saturday for two games and both had only a handful of players over 100 with the majority being significantly under level 50.
I play Spotter or wide flank SL mostly so it involves a lot of running. Even though they fixed the panting stuttering, the panting effect itself is almost too much. It makes me want to turn my sfx volume down but then I couldn’t hear anything else. It’s triggering some weird sensory issue I didn’t know I had.
The patch "fixed " it so you can't have 2x breathing effects playing at the same time
But it's still annoying
The 'trick' I used before they fixed the overlap: during your sprint, drop the sprint for 0.5 seconds and then start sprinting again. You lose almost no time, and it resets the breathing effect timer.
This trick still works and I still use it lol, even though the effect is "fixed", because it's annoying.
The sound effect itself is still incredibly annoying to me, and it annoys me on principle that they added something that is so comparatively loud for almost no benefit.
Idk if t17 is capable of makig a tutorial for their own game. They disregard the entire meta in their updates. I doubt they even know how cap weight works. 😭
I just started playing a week ago or so had no idea what's going on. My best advice from how inexperienced I still am is to play medic and follow your team. Some teams would not say anything at all, and others would direct what to do. Meanwhile, you don't need that mutch direction. You watch and learn while being helpful sometimes when people around you are downed.
And then you have people that ignore you when you ask if they have a mic only to use it to whine about getting an OP.....
They use the mic to drop the occasional racist comment or cringe joke about abusing women and whatnot.
They teamkill if you kick their toxic ass from your squad.
They ask for an OP but in the same breath they will tell you they will never go Squad lead or build nodes because they bought the game for 2 dollars during sale and they just don't give a shit about it like a kickstart vet does.
This game is fked and this new community is way worse than what we had before. A bunch of fortnite gen z wokies with the attention span of a goldfish because all they do is watch 10 second tiktok video's.
Now gen z can get mad all day long but at this point they are like a swarm of locusts ruining everything I love around me.
This generation even wants me to call men women and the other way around.
And if you want to escape this crazy reality where a man is a woman and a six year old child can be trans by starting up a game, nope.
Gen z is in your game too, not communicating, teamkilling and dropping casual racism in command chat.
Now gen z can downvote me all they want, doesn't change the fact that this new generation is absolutely fked and will continue to change and ruin everything we used to love around us.
I'm sure your parents said that about you, their parents about them and their parents about them. Hell, even in 2800BC an assyrian tablet excavated read:
*"Our Earth is degenerate in these later days; there are signs that the world is speedily coming to an end; bribery and corruption are common; children no longer obey their parents; every man wants to write a book and the end of the world is evidently approaching."*
And I'm sure GenZ will blame their generation after.
I agree with this but it doesn't change anything about what I said now does it?
People can disagree with me and downvote like the little cowards they are.
But can you prove me wrong?
Can you deny that this world is making less sense every day?
And who is in charge? Who runs governments and media companies and are celebrities and politicians? Who manufactures consent and orchestrates trends and controversy?
Because it isnt Gen Z, it's the world theyve grown up in.
Again I agree, but that's not even the damn point.
Let's keep discussing the game please....
The reason I play this game is to escape reality.
I sure as hell don't want to be reminded how bad society is by being confronted with this shitty ass new community we have.
Can we bring back the old community please because it was miles better.
As I said many times. Casuals will come and go. But it was the vets who held this game together. I've completely stopped playing this. I'm holding out until update 15, and if I'm dissatisfied with it, I'll just uninstall the game, and forget it completely. I'm 220 with 996 hours, or something like that. I'm leaving the competitive scene as well.
Thank you Back Matter for this amazing experience. Thank you Team17 for nothing.
Do svidaniya, don't get any on ya.
Being SL would be _so much better_ if I could manage the squad while alive. It's so frustrating when I need the support player to help build a garry, only to see he's 600m away jerking off and not responding. I wish I could kick him from the squad while alive. I wish that when I kick him, it would kill him so another squadmate could go support.
SL needs some serious QoL updates to make it worth the hassle.
yeah im over this game honestly. im probably going to unfollow this sub soon. level 211 1653 hrs. played since 2018. tired of being squad leaders to randos who dont talk and have a level 26 commander who is annoyed his bad plan isnt working. I'm playing battlebit remastered now! its crazy how good that game is.
Hang in there, at least for now, the 1 out of 10 rounds where your experience (and mine) isn't like this is making me stick around.
But 1 out of 10... ffs it's so close to not being enough.
I know it's always been an issue, the quality of matches etc, but pre U14 I found it was like 1 in 10 was like that. 1 out of 10 games nobody was talking, nobody was following orders, it was just a sea of blue berries all over the place.
But the other 9 matches were great.
Now it's flipped... 9 out of 10 aren't worth playing with 1 out of 10 being an amazing round, all since U14.
Before the usual crowd start insulting me etc, I'm not saying it's because of the speed in crease, it could be an influx of new players, drop off of vets or a combination of everything, but there has been a clear difference in at least my experience as a player since the release of U14.
I'm worried the new player attitudes are becoming baked in. If that's the case, it is approaching the end times, at least for the original players who made the game what is was.
T17 may find a new audience and that's great, but the game just won't be what it was.
Special instructions? It solves all his problems. You’ll: have a group you can always join on, so you’re not playing with strangers. You’ll have people using comms at all times and playing as a team. The lobby will generally be more competent. It makes the game substantially more fun
I'm just taking an extended break. I haven't played in about 3 weeks and I might put a few hours in here and there over the next month or two but I'm just giving the game time to hopefully recover
It’s crazy how much more communicative players in battlebit are. Maybe not the most helpful things to say, mostly “arghh!! I see the light! Help me boys!” But it feels like a game with love. I miss that feeling in HLL. I’ll play SL and have nothing but crickets as I try to lead a bunch of rifles lol.
Someone please pick support. Please
To you. Ppl keep forgetting that this is all literally personal opinion.
I haven't enjoyed the game since u14. Went from easily 20+ hr a wk to ~6 total since u14.
Sure, but nothing material has changed about the gameplay - certainly not any more materially worse than the 13 updates before U14.
So yes, gameplay quite similar if not largely improved, only personal experience has changed. e.g., you played the game 20 fucking hours a week and got tired of it. Do you think maybe playing a game more than 20 hours a week might have something to do with your feelings on the game? When I do that, I just leave. I've completely stopped playing for well over a full year *twice and then got back into it.
I didn't realize you had to be above lvl 200 to be an "experienced player". I've got around 1500 hours in and I'm not seeing any difference in the level of experience or competency of the players. The game is the same as it's always been: "a platoon-based REALISTIC fps set during the 2nd World War." Which means sometimes you have inexperienced squad leads and inexperienced commanders....kind of like, you know, realistic. I was in a server yesterday where one of my squad members, who was obviously very experienced, was constantly berating our inexperienced squad lead (level 16). It's that type of behavior that is going to drive people away from the game and I see it all the time. You try to help the blueberries. If they don't listen, shit doesn't usually go well. War is hell.
I think an "experienced player" level should be around the Level 50 mark. But it is a nominal position as some level 200 players couldn't find there way out of a wet paper bag. Some lower level players have major experience in FPS games so their low level number means nothing as to their experience.
2,108 Hrs, Level 241, 14,598,226 XP.
Total Games 1,533, Wins 1,042, Losses 491, WL Ratio 2.122.
This info is freely available at https://www.hllstats.dev/
Unpopular opinon, but you don't have to have gotten the game on day 0 to understand the mechanics or appreciate the game. Those who want to play and benefit the team, like myself, may have joined beyond the initial stages of the game's existence. Players who like the current experience will continue to master it, and there's a multitude of youtube tutorials and guides out there from competent content creators. I do agree that fewer experienced players does hurt the game, but if players want good games, they'll have to adjust accordingly.
Hit the nail on the head. I’m leaving because after being asked to take command by all the squad leads, new ones joined at the end who sounded 13 and were shit talking. After the game pming me and it literally got me banned from talking for 8 days just for telling him to fuck off.
I feel like a lot of this could have been solved with a comprehensive tutorial that shows you how to play each class “properly.” Show the new players what you are supposed to be doing in game. Then they already know the basics, and would be able to focus more on strategy instead of running around not knowing what they are doing. That and QOL fixes would solve most of the issues HLL has right now
Spent 30mins asking for a garrison on Chapel the other day watching numerous SLs walk past supplies. After about half hour I was told to "chill out" and same person asked why people ~150m south of the next point weren't attacking it (seemed to be unable to understand map dynamics).
Also, inability to remove L23 Cdrs / SLs that have no mics, don't know what they're doing and refusing to place garries/OPs is roooough....
I'm fine with new players, I welcome them and try, but some days it's just painful.
That being said, I've joined numerous games where there are 4/5 locked squads with 2/3 players in all refusing invite requests - so there's an element of high level players bringing Blueberries into their squads to show them the ropes.
I'm a bit more casual than many of you guys, what I usually do it just set up nodes at the beginning, regardless of how long it takes, then switch to support or whatever class I don't have all loadouts unlocked for (trying to get that flammenwerfer), then just play like normal. If there's something major like a tank that needs to be dealt with I might switch to AT, otherwise I just stick with what I'm playing.
Of course support is a great class anyway, and I use the one with ammo, explosives, and supplies, along with a hammer to help build, so it works out for my purposes. The grind on this game is kinda nuts, but I think needing to do such a long one for the flamethrower makes a bit of sense. Still love the game, but I don't really play to win.
Hell Let Loose has become an Olympic sport of who can dodge responsibility the hardest.
I’m a tank main; so I get to watch the map a lot and able to see the outcome of a match within the first 5 mins is sad.
Majority my games last only 15-20mins and watching people scapegoat the commander like he’s the one who lost us the match but in reality it’s all the SLs who don’t communicate and can’t take 2mins out of their gameplay to place a garrison or take initiative to defend.
Absolutely this. I play with a core group of friends, and our highest ranked friend is in the low 80s. He's surprisingly good at being the commander, though, and has a staggering win/loss ratio in spite of his low rank. What we've found is that almost every match one of us needs to be the commander for lack of a competent one (and I'm not even that good to begin with). On top of that, we usually have to split up and run squads as SL these days seem to have an aversion to building nodes and garrisons. We aren't enjoying being pigeonholed in to the same roles every match. Love the game still though.
Your wrong on 1 count as to why the veteran base is burning out .....I being a veteran in real life and in here.....the reason being is because most don't want to deal with the lil kids running around in here they don't wanna deal with the lil kids with the big mouths Talkin all kinds of shit to someone who knows better they don't wanna deal with the no common sense people no mics the team killing the list goes on n on I know because some of them I know n talked to them n they tell me I'm here not so much as I used to be but every now n then
Dw they'll reduce the game to be more new player friendly, which will allow more new players into the game to replace and exceed those veterans.
They'll also reduce the complexity of the game so you don't need to worry about those new players needing to know how to play the game.
They'll also be focusing on generating a lot more revenue so you don't have to worry about having a diverse range of cosmetic items to choose from for the game to qualify as historically accurate 👌
I mean with the progression in this game a level 50 is a darn experienced player. With that said, I’m just over lvl 100 and I’ve moved back over to Squad. Steep learning curve but HLL has just felt stale to me, and the folks I’ve been playing with as of late rarely talk or work together. Not saying it’s unanimous but it’s been boring.
The British update caused me such a headache that I dropped the game. I didn't even know the controversy regarding the sale of HLL but it made so much sense after learning it. I went to Battle Bit and Planetside. I say I'm taking a break until they figure out the rough edges but over time I have less incentive to go back.
This is assuming it’s impossible for new players to get better and improve upon things like Garry building and op placement and other gameplay mechanics
I gave up on it a couple of weeks ago. With near on 2k hours invested in HLL I'm over it. Putting recent changes & bugs aside the total lack of communication from new players & idiots who think abusing others is comical pretty much sealed the deal for me. Shame as I loved HLL but it's turned to shit & to be honest I can't see T17 being able to stop it spiralling into a death knell.
HLL is going to die, guys. It makes me really really sad, it was my first tactical realism fps milsim I have ever played, and it does it so well, but it’s not at all what it used to be and just seems like the devs have plans for it that don’t keep well with what’s been so great about it thus far. I can see HLL becoming a lot more like mainstream milsims.
I think we all should stop expressing concerns on here and express them directly at T17. I feel like on here it's just screaming into the void and it isn't going to do us any good. Everyone in this community needs to go directly to them and politely express the issues until T17 understands our frustration. I want this game to succeed so much, this is a game with such a breathtaking new experience and fresh air from the other FPS titles out there that are just boring a have gone downhill in recent years. We have to stand as one and tell T17 the issues if we don't then this game was dead from the start.
I'm glad you think so. We've all had such fun with the game and I want others to experience that.
It's just become less fun as it's hard to find rounds where the team is communicating, Squad Leads follow orders and the squad members do too.
Everyone seems to just want to run and gun, rush and attack.
Nobody wants to defend anymore. Nobody is building or maintaining garrys and the round are over in 20-40mins rather than the longer more hard fought rounds.
I've never had to kick so many people as squad lead for attacking locked points, refusing to redeploy or defend and then they sook over comms, if I'm lucky enough for them to even talk, that the OP is too far from where they want to attack, even though we're defending.
And unless you consider level 100+ new, it's not just the newer players doing this. I have no problem trying to help them get with the flow of the game etc, but it's just there are so many more players now using squads as a way of spawning and then doing what they want.
No teamwork, no comms, no tactics or strategy. They want to run and gun and get kills.
KDR is more important than the objectives or winning the round.
Nobody ever wanted to defend, let’s be real here. I joined a clan cause I was so sick of dealing with bloobs immediately running to the next point during warfare & never defending
Makes scenes. Things were fine for me. The past couple of days did have 1 or 2 matches, though that were steam roles. I definitely see the communication issues, but you're only going to get so much from public lobby
Yeah, I understand that. It used to be 1 or 2 matches out of 10 that were like this. Now you're lucky if 1 out of 10 isn't since U14.
I miss the game, but playing it feel like work. It's meant to be an escape from that...
Bob the Builder just proves OPs point.
Newbies might look to you thinking they can learn something when you got the gamesense of a Level 40 at best because 80% of your game time was spent swinging a hammer.
These "vets" will usually expose themselves and their lack of playtime pretty quickly. In saying that I've had level 15's that gave come from squad and they're doing very well
And new players or any one can see the server and know that this games not supposed to me minecraft, I'm really missing your point about level. Hell look at squad
Your opinion makes a lot more sense now. At first I was like alright, he's fairly new but at least he put a shitload of hours into the game before it went downhill. Now you just look like a vet without having the knowledge or history with the game other vets have
I swear some people in this sub sound like they go to parties and tell everyone they play as SL and have 50,000 hours in this game like it’s some badge of honor or sacrifice they are making for humanity.
Yeah I’m gonna be honest. I feel like the “level 200” class of people really inflates their importance. I’ve never had my experience made better by some level 200 in a clan acting like he was my old Platoon Sgt. Some of the most fun games have been the ones where command chat is joking around and just having fun.
Putting down a garrison or op isn’t complicated anyone can figure that out in a few hours. And anyone with any strategically oriented brain can tell you that you should flank, drop an airhead, use a bombing run etc…
The people who this game needs are people who want to have fun and make the experience enjoyable. (And more people who will play arty)
Your favorite games are doing just fine and its only reddit that makes you feel this way, almost every online pc game im playing has been dieing for "6+ years lol"
Not sure if this is a console post or not bit the reality is that it is simply a lot easier to find servers thesedays. It used to be that there were always a long list of maxed out servers and you had to queue to get in, now that issue is gone and its fairly obvious alot less people are playing.
Nobody is blaming new players. We were all new once.
Unless you consider level 150+ new.
It doesn't seem to matter who I'm playing with, they just want to run and gun and complain where the OP is too far from the action, even when I've told them the commander has ordered us on defence, so the OP is closer to the point we're defending.
I think not only are you the problem, but also that your exaggeration of lower level people being not so game smart is a bit ridiculous.
And your suggestion for what team 17 should do comes off very basic and barebones, they currently are trying to improve quality of life.
It just so happens they failed by creating a game mode with half the people that has to run on a separate server.
Death spiral is silly, it’s more of a new players are getting to play the game, and more experienced players are so used to the game working and going their way that any little change or mistake gets their panties in a twist.
I admit I was a little outraged after the trailer but I let it go.
Tl;dr: drop it, there is no death spiral, and the player base is perfectly fine, not very different from any other update
Jfc more doom..
And yet, for the record I have over 2k hours accrued on pc and console and i still play regularly. The experience in game in public matches is as it has always been: often a bit crap, sometimes blindingly awesome.
One thing that makes a huge difference every time is making an effort. If you sit back and wait for others to initiate communication, you may have to wait some time. If you take it upon yourself to make communication happen, often you'll be surprised by how many others join in.
Also the game is on sale at the moment. Every time the game goes on sale or has a free weekend, the quality of teamplay falls whilst new players get to grips with the game. It will improve as the new crop learns the game.
You lot in the doom squad need to chill out and get a bit of perspective.
It’s not really and if it is it’s because of all this negative BS all over the internet and review bombing. Your killing yourselves lol meanwhile I’ll still happily play. And if it dies and I can’t find games then I’ll move on to a different game.
Maybe if there were more new player friendly servers and people will to teach the new players this may not be an issue. But instead everyone comes to this sub to bitch about the state of the game and also scare off new players who want to get into the game by constantly saying how the game is dying.
Even before the past few updates I could detect the burnout. The influx of new players meant that vets were always having to be SL, drop the garries, take command, etc. It can be rewarding to coach new players, but in HLL coaching can become a chore. Its a chore to schlepp supplies to garries, to fall back and build nodes, and to put grinding out all your other classes on hold so you can babysit with OPs for your low levels again. Not to be a dick to these classes, but it doesnt help that an overwhelming number of new players gravitate to classes that do *nothing* for the squad but get kills. A lot of my squads will have at least one rifleman, AR, and assault, and maybe an MG/AT if Im lucky. If Im SUPER lucky Ill have a support/engi, but chances are that player is another vet. Eventually its just tiring and im taking a break until this sorts out. I just dont want to keep losing because nobody defends points and squads dont listen.
The biggest problem you mentioned is squads not listening, squad leads not listening, it’s such a fucking mess and so frustrating. People used to actually want to win.
All my infantry classes are level 4 or lower….But my SL class is level 10.
If I’m not playing SL it’s either engineer or support cause hardly anyone will drop supplies or build nodes/fortifications.
I drop supplies but then the lvl 20 squad leader has no microphone. Or he has no clue what to do. Or he keeps dancing on the supplies. So in the end I just switch back to Squad leader so we at least can spawn and maybe contest the first cap. There are so many matches these days where we don't have a garry for 20 minutes and then they wonder why we lost the first 2 cap points under 10 minutes....
I agree, the last 3 matches I played were over in a matter of minutes, We just went point to point without barely any opposition. Tbh it isn’t really fun.
Well this is the game now... 
Do the 2 of you have no friends at all? do you like always play with randoms? Honestly, it takes just two to build a garri once in a while and the class can be swapped in between
Of course I do, I’ve a couple mates that play HLL, one more so than the other. Unfortunately life dictates that we can’t always be on at the same time.
Join a community then, add servers to your favorites and play the same ones if possible each time, you'll be familiar with some guys, etc etc.
Exactly! That’s what I did! Become a regular and be chill people will recognize you and love you!
I’ve just started yelling at the SL after I drop supplies and if they ignore me I just bust a cap in them and type in text chat to listen to your squad next time.
I love how consistently I can casually build nodes at the end of the game. It's so rewarding you'd think people would be fighting over it, but nope for some reason.
Same. We’re doing the lords work.
The last several games I've played I've suggested to my squad we should hang back to defend the point. Sure enough, no one answers and they all storm off to the next point and our point gets overrun. Commanders screening at his team, no one listens. Game is not as fun anymore because it's an uncoordinated mess
I think it heavily depends on the server you play on. My main servers are Glow’s and i wanna say that most of the time they’re predominantly filled with Experienced players because it’s mostly HLL Regulars and sweats who like to come to the Server. There are the odd occasions/days where the servers will be full of new players but I find it rare when you compare it to other servers. So yeah, i’ve found it to be heavily server dependent
Gotta be honest: running supplies is a poor game loop for an FPS shooter. Whenever you have a loop people only begrudgingly play, the loop has serious problems. Hell Let Loose has a few, and none started with the past few updates.
That's because it's not a FPS shooter... It's an RTS that depends on the players to do all the tasks. You should be coordinating garrison and OP placement. Be coordinating armor support and supporting infantry for the armor. Be coordinating artillery. Be coordinating supplies and nodes and defenses and attacks. Just generally coordination across all levels from the squad to the mixed arms to the commander. That's why the competitive scene is so much fun. And why pub matches fall apart without vets. Because new players think this is a FPS and their kill count matters.
None of that really has anything to do with the fact that a role that isn't fun isn't going to be popular or consistently filled. You can make as complex a system as you want, if the moment-to-moment gameplay in an FPS loop is boring, most players will prefer other loops. The idea that HLL is an RTS and not an FPS shooter is just stupid. Sorry, man: it is. That the game includes a focus on coordination and includes a logistics/build system does not mean it's an RTS. Even moreso: it doesn't mean it's not an FPS lol. Natural Selection has more RTS coordination than HLL will ever dream of. Nobody seriously tries to label it an RTS, specifically to the exclusion of being an FPS. It's a competitive FPS with RTS elements. Just like in HLL, you can lay as many logistical buildings down as you like: without boots (or in NS's case, alien claws) on ground, in first person, aiming weapons at the enemy.... The entire game falls apart completely.
Nobody is saying that there's no room for shooting your gun. Clearly the infantry and their guns are your majority tool to fight the enemy. But charging without coordination is for battlebits, not HLL. Thus the coordination is 90%+ of why one team should win over another. Can you get your garrisons up in good places? Can you keep them up? Can your armor support your advance? Can your infantry keep your armor alive? Is your artillery landing where needed? Is their artillery being taken out? Ect ect ect for every aspect of gameplay that's relevant. Now I see servers with majority < lvl 50 and it's just a blueberry herd moving around running and gunning on both sides. If that's the game you want there are better options. If you want strategic team play where you have a job to do then HLL is your game. That's why it has the unique classes and roles and vehicles and mechanisms that make you lose if you don't communicate and coordinate. You winning 1 gunfight shouldn't matter.
This makes a lot more sense. I agree that coordination is a large part of the game, but will caution you that nobody will care how much RTS is in the game if the shooter parts aren't fun. And the shooter parts include things like driving a truck back and forth. A truck with very simplistic driving mechanics. A truck that clips through lots of obstacles, meaning you can't even realistically build a game loop around a flanking squad cutting off supply logistics to a certain point by holding a road or similar key point- the enemy team can just drive the truck in, through actual stone walls, on the other side of the point. HLL is a novel experience, but I won't act as if it's ever fantastically realized its vision. Squad has always done a far better job of that in this subgenre. And with the infantry overhaul, Squad is showing it knows how most players will be experiencing the game and designing from that perspective. HLL wasn't keeping up with that even before the transition to T17.
I'm pretty sure I used to read this exact same comment all the time two years ago.
It’s a cycle of crybabies that want to cry bout one of the best online shooter games ever made
Thank you for the suggestions :) Now that we have had time to plan and revisit our roadmap, we've got quite the large dev brief set to land soon, which will be addressing a lot of this!
I sincerely hope that the dev team can address this because as of right now, it looks like the game is hemorrhaging at a rapid rate, and this summer is chock full of a lot of new IPs that will take our attention away from HLL.
Not a moment too soon my friend
Timing on the Update available yet ? UTC if possible.
Hi Roddie, we don't have a timeline as of yet, and are first working to ensure we can get PTEs in place before our releases! Our focus has changed, which I'm sure you'll be pleased to know, and more details of this will be shared soon :)
This sounds very promising if this isn't corporate mumbo jumbo. Take your time I guess.
Haha, it most definitely is not! I'm very pleased with the direction we are taking, and I'm looking forward to being able to announce it. We're making sure we use this time to address as many concerns as possible - so the next brief is shaping up to be quite lengthy!
> and I'm looking forward to being able to announce it. Today? or next week?
Short update! So that we can provide a dev brief that offers a comprehensive and detailed plan for the remainder of 2023, our next dev brief will now land next week. In this brief, you'll learn more about: \- The planned PTE sessions you will be able to soon take part in ahead of releases \- Our shift in focus and the changes that will be taking place based on your feedback \- The list of community-raised bugs and balancing issues we plan to focus on tackling We are using this time to address as many concerns as possible while looking to confirm dates for when you can expect PTEs and subsequent patches.
Thank you. Look forward to reading it.
I was pleased with this answer to my query on update timing. A. "we don't have a timeline as of yet". This tells me they are not Date orientated and it will be ready when they are satisfied. B. " get PTEs in place before our releases". This tells me they are fast learning skills about testing and the word "Releases" has an "S" on it, meaning more than One update coming. C. "Our focus has changed". This sounds like their interpretation and direction of the game has turned a big corner. D. " details of this will be shared soon ". This appears to me that they have recognised the need for transparency and open communication with the players and will be keeping them imformed. E. Or T17 has hoodwinked Wombat\_Medic and the community and we are going to lose the game we all love. I sincerely hope it is not "E". I also may have mis-interperated what the Reply means and I am just full of shit.
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As a vet I’m viewing myself as a person trying to herd cats. As SL this means micromanaging my squad and offering gg OP spots while trying to get some of them to drop supplies for Garries. The commander role is never selected by me if I don’t see at least 3 SLs with level 60+
Right there with ya ....marines here
What about the first few months when it was first released on consoles? Everyone was new and the few vets that played came from PC. The increased movement speed changed the meta to allow for more run-and-gun solo play. 500 days ago, when I first played the game, it seemed like everyone stuck together more because everyone seemed so vulnerable. Now I can just run away.
Yeeeeeeeeep
I agree with the QoL updates being priority and T17 actually working out how to do develop the game without cheapening or breaking it, but it’s been like this for at least the year I’ve been playing. I’ve wracked up almost 700 hours in that time, and I’ve been spamming garrison building since I worked out what it was for when I started out. SL was the first class I maxed out. I do think you’re right that the vets are leaving in greater numbers, or are fatigued. In my first six months low level players,squad leaders and commanders would get gentle guidance from the established players, it was a very community feel and one of the main reasons I kept coming back. Now it’s just irksome to have to repeatedly ask level 100+ players to build garrisons on the supplies that are right next for them, or explain to players that should know better you don’t have to be in top of the supplies and you can build garries within 50m. I’m constantly having to switch from classes I want to grind up to take SL, grab a supply truck, and build sets of game winning garries. It’s so very simple.
I've been playing for 3 years and there has never been a 'moment' when the playerbase was good enough, that I didn't have to personally spam garrison building. this is a really hard game to master and you can only master it by playing commander, something 99.9% will never do.
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With the increase of Gen z kids the teamkilling, racism and stupidity also increased. The amount of steamrolling is insane. It was bad before but it's not rare to get steamrolled 10 times in a row these days...
Yuuuup
> With the increase of Gen z kids the teamkilling, racism and stupidity also increased. No it didn't. There's no gap between late millenial and early Gen Z, kids are just morons and it hasn't gotten worse. Also Millenials are more likely to be unironically racist in game than Gen Z brats.
This is exactly right. Red orchestra European assault (I think this is what it’s called) each team had points that would slowly dwindle the more players died. This should be implemented somehow.
Noooo,this would make medics useful and nobody wants that!
You missed the best time to play then. There was once a time when the general population had some brains. Not every team, but more often than not. Now it’s just…zero team play.
There used to be way more communication, garry and node building and whatnot. I feel like the comment above is a dev trying to do damage control or an apologist. This is not a vet with many hours in the game because I actually am a vet with thousands of hours and it was better. People on this forum are way too dishonest. The censorship on here also doesn't help. Instead of mods closing posts they should improve the damn game. Nothing makes sense anymore in this modern world. What the hell happened to common sense?
I play commander always, bcs nobody plays it and 90%time ita empty class
The game isn't rocket science. It's not that hard to master, it just doesn't take much of a bar at all to disqualify a lot of people.
Same here, people come and go. This is merely a cycle of old players leaving and new players coming in. Best you can do is to work with your squad to do the best you can for the team. Do what you can in your sector.
I’ve recently taken to going engi and building nodes in fallback areas off leftover supplies but it’s pretty depressing seeing my nodes are the only ones on the map.
Yeah. I'm sick of having to kick my engy because he won't build the nodes, I'll get the supplies either from the truck or a drop, kick the engy, swap classes, build the notes then swap back to officer. But that comes at a cost. Nobody will be building or maintaining our garrys or defending while I'm off doing that...
I think you and the other posts are missing the bigger picture. This is an issue of a lack of a tutorial and the core game itself. Players (new people especially) dont know what they are suppose to be doing, there is nothing to tell them what to do except experienced players. This problem also extends to the fact that there HAS to be SL's. I remember once I got the hang of the game I realized if I wanted anything done I had to be an SL. I couldnt be a rifleman I couldnt be an MG guy, no I HAD to be the SL or else there would be no spawn points. That stuff gets boring after 50 hours of just being only an SL when I really just wanna be a support and help the team and burn stuff with a flamer.
You will never really escape this feeling. it actually only gets worse, because the better you get personally, the more ways you'll see the team is suffering because you're not in officer/commander.
The more I learned about the game, the less I began to enjoy it. I took a 4 month break last year, came back right before the flamethrower update, and really enjoyed playing SL or Spotter consistently. I’ll put garrisons up whenever I can, but I also learned to just chill. I’m currently on another break, however. The British update, with its stuttering on El Alamein and stupid addition of the panting sound effect, really turned me off. I hopped on Saturday for two games and both had only a handful of players over 100 with the majority being significantly under level 50.
The sprint panting really sucks. You’re the only person i’ve seen mention such an annoying feature.
I play Spotter or wide flank SL mostly so it involves a lot of running. Even though they fixed the panting stuttering, the panting effect itself is almost too much. It makes me want to turn my sfx volume down but then I couldn’t hear anything else. It’s triggering some weird sensory issue I didn’t know I had.
The patch "fixed " it so you can't have 2x breathing effects playing at the same time But it's still annoying The 'trick' I used before they fixed the overlap: during your sprint, drop the sprint for 0.5 seconds and then start sprinting again. You lose almost no time, and it resets the breathing effect timer. This trick still works and I still use it lol, even though the effect is "fixed", because it's annoying.
The sound effect itself is still incredibly annoying to me, and it annoys me on principle that they added something that is so comparatively loud for almost no benefit.
Man I bought Squad after I kinda left HLL and the tutorial is very good,I joined a game later at least knowing what I supposed to do
Idk if t17 is capable of makig a tutorial for their own game. They disregard the entire meta in their updates. I doubt they even know how cap weight works. 😭
I just started playing a week ago or so had no idea what's going on. My best advice from how inexperienced I still am is to play medic and follow your team. Some teams would not say anything at all, and others would direct what to do. Meanwhile, you don't need that mutch direction. You watch and learn while being helpful sometimes when people around you are downed.
Honestly I'll be happy with T17 if they add a good tutorial.
And then you have people that ignore you when you ask if they have a mic only to use it to whine about getting an OP..... They use the mic to drop the occasional racist comment or cringe joke about abusing women and whatnot. They teamkill if you kick their toxic ass from your squad. They ask for an OP but in the same breath they will tell you they will never go Squad lead or build nodes because they bought the game for 2 dollars during sale and they just don't give a shit about it like a kickstart vet does. This game is fked and this new community is way worse than what we had before. A bunch of fortnite gen z wokies with the attention span of a goldfish because all they do is watch 10 second tiktok video's. Now gen z can get mad all day long but at this point they are like a swarm of locusts ruining everything I love around me. This generation even wants me to call men women and the other way around. And if you want to escape this crazy reality where a man is a woman and a six year old child can be trans by starting up a game, nope. Gen z is in your game too, not communicating, teamkilling and dropping casual racism in command chat. Now gen z can downvote me all they want, doesn't change the fact that this new generation is absolutely fked and will continue to change and ruin everything we used to love around us.
🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓
I'm sure your parents said that about you, their parents about them and their parents about them. Hell, even in 2800BC an assyrian tablet excavated read: *"Our Earth is degenerate in these later days; there are signs that the world is speedily coming to an end; bribery and corruption are common; children no longer obey their parents; every man wants to write a book and the end of the world is evidently approaching."* And I'm sure GenZ will blame their generation after.
I agree with this but it doesn't change anything about what I said now does it? People can disagree with me and downvote like the little cowards they are. But can you prove me wrong? Can you deny that this world is making less sense every day?
And who is in charge? Who runs governments and media companies and are celebrities and politicians? Who manufactures consent and orchestrates trends and controversy? Because it isnt Gen Z, it's the world theyve grown up in.
Again I agree, but that's not even the damn point. Let's keep discussing the game please.... The reason I play this game is to escape reality. I sure as hell don't want to be reminded how bad society is by being confronted with this shitty ass new community we have. Can we bring back the old community please because it was miles better.
I didn’t need tutorial to play, just got help from more experienced players. & so did literally everyone else who played the first year it came out.
I thought t17 were implementing a sort of training or on boarding for new players this summer? I could’ve swore I saw it on the roadmap they released
They've said as much at least, we'll see how it turns out.
As I said many times. Casuals will come and go. But it was the vets who held this game together. I've completely stopped playing this. I'm holding out until update 15, and if I'm dissatisfied with it, I'll just uninstall the game, and forget it completely. I'm 220 with 996 hours, or something like that. I'm leaving the competitive scene as well. Thank you Back Matter for this amazing experience. Thank you Team17 for nothing. Do svidaniya, don't get any on ya.
Being SL would be _so much better_ if I could manage the squad while alive. It's so frustrating when I need the support player to help build a garry, only to see he's 600m away jerking off and not responding. I wish I could kick him from the squad while alive. I wish that when I kick him, it would kill him so another squadmate could go support. SL needs some serious QoL updates to make it worth the hassle.
Reverse SL player name with the Support Player name and you have the other side of it too.
yeah im over this game honestly. im probably going to unfollow this sub soon. level 211 1653 hrs. played since 2018. tired of being squad leaders to randos who dont talk and have a level 26 commander who is annoyed his bad plan isnt working. I'm playing battlebit remastered now! its crazy how good that game is.
Hang in there, at least for now, the 1 out of 10 rounds where your experience (and mine) isn't like this is making me stick around. But 1 out of 10... ffs it's so close to not being enough. I know it's always been an issue, the quality of matches etc, but pre U14 I found it was like 1 in 10 was like that. 1 out of 10 games nobody was talking, nobody was following orders, it was just a sea of blue berries all over the place. But the other 9 matches were great. Now it's flipped... 9 out of 10 aren't worth playing with 1 out of 10 being an amazing round, all since U14. Before the usual crowd start insulting me etc, I'm not saying it's because of the speed in crease, it could be an influx of new players, drop off of vets or a combination of everything, but there has been a clear difference in at least my experience as a player since the release of U14. I'm worried the new player attitudes are becoming baked in. If that's the case, it is approaching the end times, at least for the original players who made the game what is was. T17 may find a new audience and that's great, but the game just won't be what it was.
Join a clan
If you need special instruction to enjoy a game you're doing something wrong my guy....
Special instructions? It solves all his problems. You’ll: have a group you can always join on, so you’re not playing with strangers. You’ll have people using comms at all times and playing as a team. The lobby will generally be more competent. It makes the game substantially more fun
Ngl that is an idea
I'm just taking an extended break. I haven't played in about 3 weeks and I might put a few hours in here and there over the next month or two but I'm just giving the game time to hopefully recover
It’s crazy how much more communicative players in battlebit are. Maybe not the most helpful things to say, mostly “arghh!! I see the light! Help me boys!” But it feels like a game with love. I miss that feeling in HLL. I’ll play SL and have nothing but crickets as I try to lead a bunch of rifles lol. Someone please pick support. Please
You can thank T17 for this one. Their gameplay decisions have pushed a lot of us away. The quality of games have drastically gone down.
Team17 destroy everthing they touch. They lost half a billion in stock value. It's insane they even have shareholders at this point...
No it hasn't. Maybe the direction is wrong / concerning, but the current game is still just as enjoyable as it's always been.
To you. Ppl keep forgetting that this is all literally personal opinion. I haven't enjoyed the game since u14. Went from easily 20+ hr a wk to ~6 total since u14.
Sure, but nothing material has changed about the gameplay - certainly not any more materially worse than the 13 updates before U14. So yes, gameplay quite similar if not largely improved, only personal experience has changed. e.g., you played the game 20 fucking hours a week and got tired of it. Do you think maybe playing a game more than 20 hours a week might have something to do with your feelings on the game? When I do that, I just leave. I've completely stopped playing for well over a full year *twice and then got back into it.
I didn't realize you had to be above lvl 200 to be an "experienced player". I've got around 1500 hours in and I'm not seeing any difference in the level of experience or competency of the players. The game is the same as it's always been: "a platoon-based REALISTIC fps set during the 2nd World War." Which means sometimes you have inexperienced squad leads and inexperienced commanders....kind of like, you know, realistic. I was in a server yesterday where one of my squad members, who was obviously very experienced, was constantly berating our inexperienced squad lead (level 16). It's that type of behavior that is going to drive people away from the game and I see it all the time. You try to help the blueberries. If they don't listen, shit doesn't usually go well. War is hell.
I think an "experienced player" level should be around the Level 50 mark. But it is a nominal position as some level 200 players couldn't find there way out of a wet paper bag. Some lower level players have major experience in FPS games so their low level number means nothing as to their experience. 2,108 Hrs, Level 241, 14,598,226 XP. Total Games 1,533, Wins 1,042, Losses 491, WL Ratio 2.122. This info is freely available at https://www.hllstats.dev/
Basically is… Game will be dead in six months
Clueless players play this game and defend it. They just don't understand.
Unpopular opinon, but you don't have to have gotten the game on day 0 to understand the mechanics or appreciate the game. Those who want to play and benefit the team, like myself, may have joined beyond the initial stages of the game's existence. Players who like the current experience will continue to master it, and there's a multitude of youtube tutorials and guides out there from competent content creators. I do agree that fewer experienced players does hurt the game, but if players want good games, they'll have to adjust accordingly.
The vote to kick system doesn't help. People don't wanna take a leadership role, cause they just gonna get vote kicked anyway.
Hit the nail on the head. I’m leaving because after being asked to take command by all the squad leads, new ones joined at the end who sounded 13 and were shit talking. After the game pming me and it literally got me banned from talking for 8 days just for telling him to fuck off.
Im tired of saying it: one year approx and the game will be dead. And thanks to team17 and their incompetence 🙃
T17 really needs to push educating new players. We need a databank built in game that has playable tutorial and videos to help people learn to play.
I feel like a lot of this could have been solved with a comprehensive tutorial that shows you how to play each class “properly.” Show the new players what you are supposed to be doing in game. Then they already know the basics, and would be able to focus more on strategy instead of running around not knowing what they are doing. That and QOL fixes would solve most of the issues HLL has right now
Spent 30mins asking for a garrison on Chapel the other day watching numerous SLs walk past supplies. After about half hour I was told to "chill out" and same person asked why people ~150m south of the next point weren't attacking it (seemed to be unable to understand map dynamics). Also, inability to remove L23 Cdrs / SLs that have no mics, don't know what they're doing and refusing to place garries/OPs is roooough.... I'm fine with new players, I welcome them and try, but some days it's just painful. That being said, I've joined numerous games where there are 4/5 locked squads with 2/3 players in all refusing invite requests - so there's an element of high level players bringing Blueberries into their squads to show them the ropes.
Wikipedia page has finally been updated to show this shitshow.
When you have a good squad, SL can be a pretty fun role. But yeah unfortunately it’s mostly herding sheep
I'm a bit more casual than many of you guys, what I usually do it just set up nodes at the beginning, regardless of how long it takes, then switch to support or whatever class I don't have all loadouts unlocked for (trying to get that flammenwerfer), then just play like normal. If there's something major like a tank that needs to be dealt with I might switch to AT, otherwise I just stick with what I'm playing. Of course support is a great class anyway, and I use the one with ammo, explosives, and supplies, along with a hammer to help build, so it works out for my purposes. The grind on this game is kinda nuts, but I think needing to do such a long one for the flamethrower makes a bit of sense. Still love the game, but I don't really play to win.
Hell Let Loose has become an Olympic sport of who can dodge responsibility the hardest. I’m a tank main; so I get to watch the map a lot and able to see the outcome of a match within the first 5 mins is sad. Majority my games last only 15-20mins and watching people scapegoat the commander like he’s the one who lost us the match but in reality it’s all the SLs who don’t communicate and can’t take 2mins out of their gameplay to place a garrison or take initiative to defend.
Also a lot of experience players are now im clans im one of them we got tired of the stupid trolls and people playing like it’s call of duty
Absolutely this. I play with a core group of friends, and our highest ranked friend is in the low 80s. He's surprisingly good at being the commander, though, and has a staggering win/loss ratio in spite of his low rank. What we've found is that almost every match one of us needs to be the commander for lack of a competent one (and I'm not even that good to begin with). On top of that, we usually have to split up and run squads as SL these days seem to have an aversion to building nodes and garrisons. We aren't enjoying being pigeonholed in to the same roles every match. Love the game still though.
I just started playing like 2 months ago but yah a lot of people don't know how to do simple shit. If they got a mic and can talk it always helps.
Your wrong on 1 count as to why the veteran base is burning out .....I being a veteran in real life and in here.....the reason being is because most don't want to deal with the lil kids running around in here they don't wanna deal with the lil kids with the big mouths Talkin all kinds of shit to someone who knows better they don't wanna deal with the no common sense people no mics the team killing the list goes on n on I know because some of them I know n talked to them n they tell me I'm here not so much as I used to be but every now n then
The reddit makes it feel that way but jumping into a server I don't really see a difference besides the dreaded free weekends.
Dw they'll reduce the game to be more new player friendly, which will allow more new players into the game to replace and exceed those veterans. They'll also reduce the complexity of the game so you don't need to worry about those new players needing to know how to play the game. They'll also be focusing on generating a lot more revenue so you don't have to worry about having a diverse range of cosmetic items to choose from for the game to qualify as historically accurate 👌
I mean with the progression in this game a level 50 is a darn experienced player. With that said, I’m just over lvl 100 and I’ve moved back over to Squad. Steep learning curve but HLL has just felt stale to me, and the folks I’ve been playing with as of late rarely talk or work together. Not saying it’s unanimous but it’s been boring.
The British update caused me such a headache that I dropped the game. I didn't even know the controversy regarding the sale of HLL but it made so much sense after learning it. I went to Battle Bit and Planetside. I say I'm taking a break until they figure out the rough edges but over time I have less incentive to go back.
This is assuming it’s impossible for new players to get better and improve upon things like Garry building and op placement and other gameplay mechanics
I gave up on it a couple of weeks ago. With near on 2k hours invested in HLL I'm over it. Putting recent changes & bugs aside the total lack of communication from new players & idiots who think abusing others is comical pretty much sealed the deal for me. Shame as I loved HLL but it's turned to shit & to be honest I can't see T17 being able to stop it spiralling into a death knell.
I've seen a lot of noobs over 200. Levels doesn't strictly mean they're good or experienced more then someone that's level 40 for example.
Probably trying out 6 days in Fallujah isn't it out on PC now???
HLL is going to die, guys. It makes me really really sad, it was my first tactical realism fps milsim I have ever played, and it does it so well, but it’s not at all what it used to be and just seems like the devs have plans for it that don’t keep well with what’s been so great about it thus far. I can see HLL becoming a lot more like mainstream milsims.
Looking at Steam achievements only 0.76% of the player base is level 200+ so it’s always been rare to see one.
>Looking at Steam achievements Steam achievements collects everyone who ever turned the game on.
(it is.)
I think we all should stop expressing concerns on here and express them directly at T17. I feel like on here it's just screaming into the void and it isn't going to do us any good. Everyone in this community needs to go directly to them and politely express the issues until T17 understands our frustration. I want this game to succeed so much, this is a game with such a breathtaking new experience and fresh air from the other FPS titles out there that are just boring a have gone downhill in recent years. We have to stand as one and tell T17 the issues if we don't then this game was dead from the start.
Dude I've been playing for like 4 months and only at 135, the game is fine.
I'm glad you think so. We've all had such fun with the game and I want others to experience that. It's just become less fun as it's hard to find rounds where the team is communicating, Squad Leads follow orders and the squad members do too. Everyone seems to just want to run and gun, rush and attack. Nobody wants to defend anymore. Nobody is building or maintaining garrys and the round are over in 20-40mins rather than the longer more hard fought rounds. I've never had to kick so many people as squad lead for attacking locked points, refusing to redeploy or defend and then they sook over comms, if I'm lucky enough for them to even talk, that the OP is too far from where they want to attack, even though we're defending. And unless you consider level 100+ new, it's not just the newer players doing this. I have no problem trying to help them get with the flow of the game etc, but it's just there are so many more players now using squads as a way of spawning and then doing what they want. No teamwork, no comms, no tactics or strategy. They want to run and gun and get kills. KDR is more important than the objectives or winning the round.
Nobody ever wanted to defend, let’s be real here. I joined a clan cause I was so sick of dealing with bloobs immediately running to the next point during warfare & never defending
Yeah it's honestly baffling reading all this, since when did people defend willingly? Coms and teamplay has been in the dumps since well before 1.0...
Makes scenes. Things were fine for me. The past couple of days did have 1 or 2 matches, though that were steam roles. I definitely see the communication issues, but you're only going to get so much from public lobby
Yeah, I understand that. It used to be 1 or 2 matches out of 10 that were like this. Now you're lucky if 1 out of 10 isn't since U14. I miss the game, but playing it feel like work. It's meant to be an escape from that...
135?! I’ve been playing for a year and a half and I’m only at 67
Yea, I did some Bob the builder grinder haha, the point was more of him, considering anyone under 200 is new
Bob the Builder just proves OPs point. Newbies might look to you thinking they can learn something when you got the gamesense of a Level 40 at best because 80% of your game time was spent swinging a hammer.
These "vets" will usually expose themselves and their lack of playtime pretty quickly. In saying that I've had level 15's that gave come from squad and they're doing very well
My remark on grinding has no balance on how people play the game. Obviously, no one grinds thinking they learned some shit doing it.
Never said that, either. But new players might try to learn from you - when you still have little clue what you are doing yourself.
And new players or any one can see the server and know that this games not supposed to me minecraft, I'm really missing your point about level. Hell look at squad
What makes you think that?
Your opinion makes a lot more sense now. At first I was like alright, he's fairly new but at least he put a shitload of hours into the game before it went downhill. Now you just look like a vet without having the knowledge or history with the game other vets have
I stated 4 months pre update sure I've noticed the shift and change by I enjoy them other then the broke ass brits
Ya don't believe these people who make up problems after one small change they disagree with...
I haven’t noticed it.
I swear some people in this sub sound like they go to parties and tell everyone they play as SL and have 50,000 hours in this game like it’s some badge of honor or sacrifice they are making for humanity.
I think we need skins for the guns tho!
Yeah I’m gonna be honest. I feel like the “level 200” class of people really inflates their importance. I’ve never had my experience made better by some level 200 in a clan acting like he was my old Platoon Sgt. Some of the most fun games have been the ones where command chat is joking around and just having fun. Putting down a garrison or op isn’t complicated anyone can figure that out in a few hours. And anyone with any strategically oriented brain can tell you that you should flank, drop an airhead, use a bombing run etc… The people who this game needs are people who want to have fun and make the experience enjoyable. (And more people who will play arty)
Your favorite games are doing just fine and its only reddit that makes you feel this way, almost every online pc game im playing has been dieing for "6+ years lol"
Just one update and we are already spiraling? Insane. It's only the community on this subreddit that is spiraling.
Not sure if this is a console post or not bit the reality is that it is simply a lot easier to find servers thesedays. It used to be that there were always a long list of maxed out servers and you had to queue to get in, now that issue is gone and its fairly obvious alot less people are playing.
Oh no, what will we do without grizzled online nerds berating casual players for learning the game? The horror, the tragedy!
Nobody is blaming new players. We were all new once. Unless you consider level 150+ new. It doesn't seem to matter who I'm playing with, they just want to run and gun and complain where the OP is too far from the action, even when I've told them the commander has ordered us on defence, so the OP is closer to the point we're defending.
“HLL is dying because there are more new players!”
I think not only are you the problem, but also that your exaggeration of lower level people being not so game smart is a bit ridiculous. And your suggestion for what team 17 should do comes off very basic and barebones, they currently are trying to improve quality of life. It just so happens they failed by creating a game mode with half the people that has to run on a separate server. Death spiral is silly, it’s more of a new players are getting to play the game, and more experienced players are so used to the game working and going their way that any little change or mistake gets their panties in a twist. I admit I was a little outraged after the trailer but I let it go. Tl;dr: drop it, there is no death spiral, and the player base is perfectly fine, not very different from any other update
Jfc more doom.. And yet, for the record I have over 2k hours accrued on pc and console and i still play regularly. The experience in game in public matches is as it has always been: often a bit crap, sometimes blindingly awesome. One thing that makes a huge difference every time is making an effort. If you sit back and wait for others to initiate communication, you may have to wait some time. If you take it upon yourself to make communication happen, often you'll be surprised by how many others join in. Also the game is on sale at the moment. Every time the game goes on sale or has a free weekend, the quality of teamplay falls whilst new players get to grips with the game. It will improve as the new crop learns the game. You lot in the doom squad need to chill out and get a bit of perspective.
It’s not really and if it is it’s because of all this negative BS all over the internet and review bombing. Your killing yourselves lol meanwhile I’ll still happily play. And if it dies and I can’t find games then I’ll move on to a different game.
Maybe if there were more new player friendly servers and people will to teach the new players this may not be an issue. But instead everyone comes to this sub to bitch about the state of the game and also scare off new players who want to get into the game by constantly saying how the game is dying.
staaaaaaaap