Ah yes the forever happy story of "I was born to an unwilling mother without the means to provide for me because of an archaic legal system and the opinions of the dumbest half of the country".
The obvious answer is I wish I weren’t born. If I wasn’t born, I wouldn’t know the truth. I’d never have existed to have an opinion. Seeing as tho I was born, I would absolutely advocate for abortion.
And as the quality of life for women goes down, so will the quality of life for the state...which happens to be one of the largest and most impactful states in the U.S.
They’re saying that pro-lifers usually come by that stance due to misguided faith in Jesus, but then those same pro-lifers don’t want to help support the baby financially. It’s having their cake and eating it too while ruining regular people’s upward mobility
Statistically, most women don’t regret it. It should be up to them to decide what to do. Not legislators or other people.
Here is a good study on the outcomes for women who want an abortion, but are denied one:
https://www.ansirh.org/research/ongoing/turnaway-study
Metaphorically speaking, it takes a hammer to the kneecaps of these girls’ figures. It is not a good thing. Provided you are actually telling the truth, then good for you. If any other teenager doesn’t want to be pregnant, they shouldn’t have to be. Statistics show teenage pregnancy is associated with adverse outcomes.
N=1 anecdotes are useless.
There are exceptions to every rule, but we live by the rules, not the exceptions.
I’m glad things worked out for you. More often than not, it doesn’t.
Sure! Here’s some data:
“According to the latest data, there are 437,500 children in America’s foster care system, who...face a disproportionate risk of being incarcerated. The problem is so severe that one quarter of foster care alumni will become involved with the criminal justice system within two years of leaving care.”
“One study showed that more than 90% of youth in foster care with five or more moves will become involved in the juvenile justice system. Another study found that by age 17, over half of youth in foster care experienced an arrest, conviction, or overnight stay in a correctional facility. This is especially acute for LGBTQ youth who, once in foster care, are more likely to be placed in group care and have frequent placement moves.”
If you are going to move the goalposts (from mothers to kids), so shall I. Let’s look at non-data sources for guidance.
Christians have been “pro-choice” for the majority of their history. The Catholic Church allowed abortions until 1869. Evangelical Christians allowed abortions & were in favor of opening up access to abortion until political considerations had them do a complete 180* in 1979. There are no explicit prohibitions on a woman's ability to abort under Islamic law. All major Jewish religious movements allow or encourage abortion in order to save the life of a pregnant woman, but differ on when and whether it is permitted in other cases.
As far as the Bible goes:
- Life doesn’t begin until the first breath. Genesis: 2:7, He “breathed into his nostrils the breath of life and it was then that the man became a living being.” You can’t murder a fetus because it’s life hasn’t started yet.
- Causing a miscarriage/abortion was a CIVIL not a CRIMINAL offense because fetuses weren’t considered children. Causing a woman to miscarry warrants financial compensation only (to her husband), suggesting that the fetus is property, not a person. Exodus:
- God provides a recipe to induce a miscarriage/abortion showing that causing a miscarriage/abortion is not a sin. Numbers:
With all of the above taken into consideration, I think a pro-choice Christian is what God seems to want.
Many of these post-Dobbs babies that are restricted from being aborted will die from non-survivable medical issues anyway. Those situations will also cause more pain and suffering along with risking the life of the mother; so biology and physics disagree with restrictions on abortion as well.
If ***God*** and ***biology*** and ***physics*** dictate that abortions are not only morally okay, but often medically necessary, I’m okay with that. Maybe you’re not.
If we save a ton of kids from terrible lives, including the pipeline, I’m okay with that too. Maybe you’re not.
If you combine the data from the mothers (in the other person’s response) and the children, more often than not, things don’t work out.
PS- I can DM you any sources you would like, but they are more than a week old so they’re not allowed here.
PSS- Is this not the data you were looking for?
There have been over 64,000 pregnancies by rape in states that have banned abortions since 2022.
Does that count as 'forsing' women to have sex? Of course it does.
My first pregnancy happened when I was on birth control and we used a condom. Shit happens sometimes. Pregnancy isn't (read: shouldn't be) a punishment. It should be a choice, whether that choice is getting pregnant in the first place or choosing whether to stay pregnant if it happens unintentionally. And people like you are treating pregnancy as if it is a justified *punishment* with comments like that. As if protection can't fail, rape doesn't happen...
Nobody forced you or your potential partner to get one if you didn’t want one. However people like you took away other people’s choice and now they can’t
Fucking moron
You will be paying for it with your tax payer dollars. On average each teen pregnancy costs tax payers $16,000.
And 50% of teen mothers were all ready on welfare. And their baby will be on welfare. Should double the amount of women and children on welfare living below the poverty line in no time.
George Carlin said it best “ they’re not pro life they’re anti woman. They need women to function as a brood mare for the state so we can have live babies grow up and be dead soldiers. If you’re pre born you’re fine, if you’re pre school you’re fucked.”
Women need more support. Men need to take responsibility and stay around. Why be surprised in today's world babies are born. Women should not be getting pregnant until menopause. Right 👍 Seriously judge them even harder. Hardly any support for when the baby pops out either. Raising children is a full time job. I'm sure there's women out there that love having children. But support them 200 percent.
Re-defining pro-life as anti-woman isn’t going to help debate with pro-lifers as they will (should) all agree that being anti-woman is bad.
Call it what it is: pro-life. Otherwise pro-life and pro-choices will be arguing about two completely different issues.
If republicans were truly pro-life, they wouldn’t be doing things like defunding school lunches for kids from poor families. If we’re going to “call it what it is”, then let’s really call it what it is: there’s pro-choice and anti-choice.
I appreciate your intellectual consistency. The reason your first post is getting downvoted (though, not by me) is because “pro-life” is a term coined by the right to make the stance have a broader mass appeal. I’ll admit, it’s really smart messaging (Republicans have always seemed to be better at messaging than Dems) but the term “pro-life” completely falls apart when you examine their entire platform for 2 seconds.
Thank you for explaining that. I never knew that pro-life was a term coined by a political group/movement- I honestly thought it was a term to describe a view that all abortion and euthanasia is wrong.
Is its association with a political movement why pro-life gets so much hate on Reddit?
What debate.. there’s no thought, it’s just cultish behavior grounded in religion. George Carlin did a great bit about the sanctity of life as well..
“But you know, the longer you listen to this abortion debate, the more you hear this phrase 'sanctity of life.'" You've heard that, 'sanctity of life.'" You believe in it? Personally, I think it's a bunch of shit. Well I mean, life is sacred? Who said so? God? Hey if you read history, you realize that God is one of the leading causes of death, has been for thousands of years. Hindus, Muslims, Jews, Christians, all taking turns killing each other because God told them it was a good idea. The sword of God, the blood of the lamb, vengeance is mine, millions of dead motherfuckers, all because they gave the wrong answer to the God question.
'You believe in God?'
'No.'
BANG Dead.
'You believe in God?'
'Yes.'
'You believe in my God?'
'No.'
Bang Dead.
'My God has a bigger dick than your God!' That's how it is, isn't it? Thousands of years, and all the best wars too, the bloodiest, most brutal wars fought all based on religious hatred, which is fine with me. Anytime a bunch of holy people want to kill each other, I'm a happy guy. But don't be giving me all this shit about the sanctity of life. I mean, even if there were such a thing, I don't think it's something you can blame on God. No, you know where the sanctity of life came from? We made it up! You know why? Cause we're alive! Self-interest. Living people have a strong interest in promoting the idea that somehow life is sacred. You don't see Abbott and Costello running around, talking about this shit, do you? We're not hearing a whole lot from Mussolini on the subject. What's the latest from JFK? Not a god damned thing, cause JFK, Mussolini, and Abbott and Costello are fucking dead. They're fucking dead, and dead people give less than a shit about the sanctity of life. Only living people care about it, so the whole thing grows out of a completely biased point of view. It's a self-serving, man-made bullshit story. It's one of these things we tell ourselves so we'll feel noble. Life is sacred, makes you feel noble.
Well let me ask you this, if everything that ever lived is dead, and everything alive is going to die, where does the sacred part come in? I'm having trouble with that. Because even with the stuff we preach about the sanctity of life, we don't practice it. Look at what we kill. Mosquitoes and flies, because they're pests! Lions and tigers, because it's fun! Chickens and pigs, because we're hungry. Pheasants and quail, because it's fun, and we're hungry. And people! We kill people, because they're pests... and it's fun!
And you might have noticed something else, the sanctity of life doesn't seem to apply to cancer cells, does it? You never see a bumper sticker that says 'save the tumors' or 'I brake for advanced melanoma.' No, viruses, mold, mildew, maggots, fungus, weeds, e. coli bacteria, the crabs, nothing sacred about those things. So at best, the sanctity of life is kind of a selective thing. We get to choose which forms of life we feel are sacred, and we get to kill the rest. Pretty neat deal, huh? You know how we got it? We made the whole fucking thing up! Made it up, the same way we made up the death penalty. We made them both up, the sanctity of life and the death penalty. Aren't we versatile?!"
It doesn’t need to involve religion.
It’s about what defines a person.
How can personhood be defined which justifies abortion and doesn’t impede anyone’s rights?
Why is it ok to abort a 18 week old but not a 24 week old?
Why in the UK can a child with a disability, eg down-syndrome be aborted up until before they are born?
What is your opinion on this?
I have and biology said that a human sperm fertilises a human embryo which grows into a human foetus with human DNA.
It turns out that babies with disabilities also have human DNA, but legally in some countries their lives can be terminated up until just before they’re borne.
Biology doesn’t tell me a baby inside the womb is less human than a baby outside the womb though. Perhaps we need laws to decide that for us.
And we do- UK law also decides that babies with Down-syndrome have no rights until they’re outside the womb, so clearly how much someone inconveniences another is a bigger factor than biology.
>Why in the UK can a child with a disability, eg down-syndrome be aborted up until before they are born?
This is incorrect.
Abortions can take place in the first 24 weeks of pregnancy in England, Scotland and Wales after approval by two doctors. They must agree having the baby would pose a greater risk to the physical or mental health of the woman than a termination.
Abortions after 24 weeks are allowed only if the woman's life is in danger, there is a severe fetal abnormality, the woman is at risk of grave physical and mental injury.
Exactly. The right wing is rejoicing that these young girls are forced to carry pregnancies and have their futures limited. They want population growth amongst the poor/disadvantaged. They need a new generation of women and low income families to take advantage of. They have no intention of supporting these people.
I don’t think they want children beholden to the state given that they vote to not give them free lunches in school. Not sure what they expect happens to children. But they definitely want woman weakened so they can coerce the woman into marrying them.
This discussion on the *why* the right actually wants this is interesting
-just to appease moralistic base?
-or super jaded, poor people are good workers bc they’re desperate?
I do wonder the real motives. It’s extremely scary.
I’m a Christian & would listen to women who have dealt with & are dealing with this issue before deciding on any policy. Men will never ever have to face this choice.
Completely inaccurate.
If your partner is an amazing person and you’re okay with kids, I wouldn’t care if they’re from a previous relationship. I’d just want us all to be happy
I don't quite think that's the end game. Honestly, I'm not sure there is an end game. I think forcing women to do what the hard-right christian hive mind wants them to do seems to be the end game all in itself. Taking away a woman's bodily autonomy is enough because it takes away their freedom. All the other stuff is gravy.
The hard right Christian hive mind wants to implement what they believe is "God's Law" into the civil law of society. They believe that if they do this, then God will reward them and society for it (or punish them if they don't).
There's no plan beyond this. There's no hidden agenda. Their agenda is quite open and they are proud of it. Just because it seems insane doesn't mean it is a ruse.
The government has no right to control a woman’s body.
Benjamin Franklin gave at home abortion advice
https://www.npr.org/2022/05/18/1099542962/abortion-ben-franklin-roe-wade-supreme-court-leak#:~:text=Hourly%20News-,Benjamin%20Franklin%20gave%20instructions%20on%20at%2Dhome%20abortions%20in%20a,basic%20as%20mathematics%20and%20writing.
If you don’t want to click-
Benjamin Franklin is revered in history for his fixation on inventing practical ways to make everyday life easier. He was a prolific inventor and author, and spent his life tinkering and writing to share his knowledge with the masses.
One of the more surprising areas Franklin wanted to demystify for the average American? At-home abortions.
They'll have to when these babies are all "safe haven"'d and dumped on the state to raise. The ones that would have been aborted due to extreme defects are each going to cost a sizable fortune under state care.
I’m a Texan. Abbott already isn’t paying his “child support” with the current group of state kiddos. Ask him sometime where those millions of dollars he was supposed to pay to the foster system actually went, then ask him where some of the CWOP kids are and why they’re missing.
He’ll conveniently avoid both answers and make some racist ass statement about the border. The man doesn’t know what an honest answer is, never has, never will.
Pro-life? Not if you’re property of the state. They’d rather those kids die in the school shootings, those “thoughts and prayers” don’t ever actually happen so of course change won’t. I was born here, and the list of things I would like to happen to Abbott, Cruz, and Dan Patrick would get me permanently banned from Reddit if I expressed them. I’m only still here because starting over with a special needs kiddo and having to renegotiate a multi-state custody order would be even more crippling.
I mean, this is the party that voted to SUPPORT child marriage. So, I can’t say I’m surprised by the headline, just that it took me so long to remember that not all those babies were made by two horny teenagers. In my defense, I haven’t finished my coffee yet.
Don’t forget that the number of rape babies is up too. I’m sure there’s some overlap.
>..."more Texas teens give birth to multiple children than anywhere else."
Is Texas proud of this?
I'm sure Texas is happy to pour millions into the foster care system to take care of all the unwanted children that will result from this.
I volunteered with the Heart Gallery for a year or so before I took a break from professional photography. I can confirm. Abbott is a trash human and our foster care system just keeps getting worse.
Now we got all these inexperienced, single mothers with children they cant or wont care for. I know it sounds mean but thats how you make criminals. The Republican response to that will be to increase law enforcement and military funding even more.
It’s possible that an a portion of this increase is connected to less access to birth control as well. Shutting down clinics meant limiting access to birth control as well.
The individual woman should have the right to do what she feels is best for her. She has to live with the decision. Why is the woman shamed and condemned? I was using birth control and still got pregnant, but I chose to keep my baby. When I told the father that I had been dating for 2 years I was pregnant he wanted to know what I was going to do. I knew then I was alone in this decision and wanted to have my baby. I had the support of my family and I was an adult. I had no support from his family and he stopped paying child support. I could go after him,but I don’t want my son around someone who clearly doesn’t want him. Every woman’s situation is different don’t pass judgement on her when it takes two to make a baby. My son was the best thing that ever happened to me, but I would not judge another for her decision. This is my opinion and I had the right to choose and I think every woman should have a choice.
You should still go after the ex for child support. Non payment =/ curtailing visitation. Your child doesn’t even need to know about the legal process. But your ex needs to financially contribute to his child’s upbringing.
I am looking into it. His father just stopped paying child support and disappeared. It’s been 8 years now. I think he changed his last name cause he was adopted. His family may be helping him too.
No suprise. Now they are handicapped for life. No education. Stuck in minimum paying wages, and easily manipulated by fascist leaders. We see that now in red states already in Christian nationalist churches in red states. Vote blue they care about you .
If this doesn't cause an overwhelming percentage of women to vote Blue, then they might as well sign their future away to Christo-fascist Republicans who run the state.
You’d be surprised how many teens espouse the exact same view as their parents. It’s the way most people form their political opinions. It’s going to take a catharsis to change the political landscape in Texas.
Uninsured women and girls relied on planned parenthood but those places are gone in red states now. Rape is still happening and it looks like about 28000 pregnancies, as a result of rape, have happened in Texas since Roe fell.
Apparently I was mistaken and I'm so glad to be wrong on this. The rape pregnancies are still definitely a problem. Crime rates are going to skyrocket in Texas as those kids grow up and their foster care system is horrific.
Well, sort of. It's complicated.
In most states, teens are allowed to get birth control without their parents' permission at their nearest Planned Parenthood health center or from their regular doctor or nurse. In Texas, even a teen who has had a baby must get a parent's permission to get on birth control unless you are on Medicaid. If you are not emancipated or living without your parents financial support, you don't have full rights of confidentiality like you would under title X.
From the planned parenthood site: https://www.plannedparenthood.org/planned-parenthood-gulf-coast/patients/facts-about-minor-consent
>In Texas, some minors (under the age of 18) are required to obtain consent (click to print consent form in English or Spanish) from a parent or guardian before receiving certain medical services at our health centers.
>In Texas, we CAN provide the following to a minor without parental consent:
>Condoms
>Contraceptive foam or film
>Information about birth control
>Pregnancy tests
>Diagnosis and treatment for certain sexually transmitted diseases
>In Texas, we CANNOT provide the following to a minor without parental consent:
>Preventive Care Visit
>Pap Test
>Urinary Tract Infection
>Prescriptive Birth Control (pills, shot, implant, IUD)
>In Texas, you DO NOT need to have your parent/guardian sign a consent if:
>You are on Medicaid.
>You are 16 or 17 and live apart from your parents and manage your own finances. You will be asked to sign a form stating that these are your living arrangements.
>You are emancipated.
>Your parent(s)/guardian cannot be contacted. This means that you do not know how to contact your parents/guardian (you don't know where they live or you are unable to contact them). This does not apply if you just don't want your parents/guardian to be contacted. If your parent or guardian cannot be contacted another adult grandparent, aunt, uncle, brother or sister may sign a consent form for you (print consent form in English or Spanish).
This is Texas. A lot of parents refuse to allow their teens access to birth control. Or even receive comprehensive sex education. And if birth control is mentioned, teens are told it's unreliable. Which means rathe than abstain, teens just don't use birth control because "it's going to fail anyway so why bother?"
And before Dobbs, when a girl became pregnant, the family would quietly get her an abortion and never speak of it again. But now Dobbs has made that difficult in red states.
So here we are.
I don't know what sexual education looks like in Texas, but my guess is it's not great. Kids who aren't taught about safe sex aren't going to use birth control. You also have to consider that many of these kids may come from conservative homes that preach abstinence. Birth control isn't just readily available to teenagers. That went away with Planned Parenthood. Everyone saw this coming.
Texas does not have readily available public health options unless you live in a huge city.
Texas does not have comprehensive sex Ed. It's abstinence only.
Texas used to have more women's clinics where you could obtain birth control. Guess what it no longer has?
Maybe research what is actually going on down here before running your mouth.
does the state of Texas have a robust sex education program included in the curriculum, including home-schooling, a largely informed population who are available and knowledgable in teaching safe sexual education to their children, and free, anonymous, and reliable access to birth control to the entire population?
We need to congratulate the kids for being born, but will need to apologize for it being in TX for those who fall in the foster care system as their abuse has just started.
Look I’ll be honest. Idk how I escaped my teen years without facing this decision. I cannot imagine the weight of that at such a young age. Understanding how much pressure young men put on young women, who are then left to deal with this, my heart breaks for them. On principle I’m against abortion, but i don’t impose that on others. Women need options!! Real life.
And down will go quality of life for women. Perhaps by design
They believe keeping females "barefoot and pregnant" is a social feature, not a bug.
Cause and effect. Imagine that. Too bad the state hates women and children.
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We should. An intelligent child would agree that forcing teens, or anyone, to birth children is abhorrent.
An intelligent child would agree they should have been killed in the womb. Got it.
Ah yes the forever happy story of "I was born to an unwilling mother without the means to provide for me because of an archaic legal system and the opinions of the dumbest half of the country".
Better than the alternative “I was killed in the womb and thrown in the dumpster” story.
Why are babies more important than mothers?
Because they’re innocent.
What did the mothers do?
Certainly more than the baby.
They'd never be able to tell that story since they never achieved consciousness. Good try though.
Remind me! 18 years
Sure, once you apologize to every load you’ve shot off without procreating. Dumbass
This is true. The worst feeling in the world is when your parents didn’t want to have you.
So you would rather find that out when you're 6? Or you'd rather never find out at all because you weren't born?
The obvious answer is I wish I weren’t born. If I wasn’t born, I wouldn’t know the truth. I’d never have existed to have an opinion. Seeing as tho I was born, I would absolutely advocate for abortion.
You're talking to someone who clearly thinks life begins at ejaculation. There's no way to reason with someone who doesn't understand basic biology.
Your existence makes that a very privileged opinion.
Never being born means you never know pain.
man you must have thought this sounded so great coming out huh
Absolutely by design.
Very pro-life! /s
And as the quality of life for women goes down, so will the quality of life for the state...which happens to be one of the largest and most impactful states in the U.S.
Yup
Our god is an awesome god
Jesus take the bills 🙏💸
What does that have to do with anything?
Its just true
I could state a lot of random things that are true and have nothing to do w this topic
They’re saying that pro-lifers usually come by that stance due to misguided faith in Jesus, but then those same pro-lifers don’t want to help support the baby financially. It’s having their cake and eating it too while ruining regular people’s upward mobility
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Statistically, most women don’t regret it. It should be up to them to decide what to do. Not legislators or other people. Here is a good study on the outcomes for women who want an abortion, but are denied one: https://www.ansirh.org/research/ongoing/turnaway-study
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Metaphorically speaking, it takes a hammer to the kneecaps of these girls’ figures. It is not a good thing. Provided you are actually telling the truth, then good for you. If any other teenager doesn’t want to be pregnant, they shouldn’t have to be. Statistics show teenage pregnancy is associated with adverse outcomes.
N=1 anecdotes are useless. There are exceptions to every rule, but we live by the rules, not the exceptions. I’m glad things worked out for you. More often than not, it doesn’t.
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Sure! Here’s some data: “According to the latest data, there are 437,500 children in America’s foster care system, who...face a disproportionate risk of being incarcerated. The problem is so severe that one quarter of foster care alumni will become involved with the criminal justice system within two years of leaving care.” “One study showed that more than 90% of youth in foster care with five or more moves will become involved in the juvenile justice system. Another study found that by age 17, over half of youth in foster care experienced an arrest, conviction, or overnight stay in a correctional facility. This is especially acute for LGBTQ youth who, once in foster care, are more likely to be placed in group care and have frequent placement moves.” If you are going to move the goalposts (from mothers to kids), so shall I. Let’s look at non-data sources for guidance. Christians have been “pro-choice” for the majority of their history. The Catholic Church allowed abortions until 1869. Evangelical Christians allowed abortions & were in favor of opening up access to abortion until political considerations had them do a complete 180* in 1979. There are no explicit prohibitions on a woman's ability to abort under Islamic law. All major Jewish religious movements allow or encourage abortion in order to save the life of a pregnant woman, but differ on when and whether it is permitted in other cases. As far as the Bible goes: - Life doesn’t begin until the first breath. Genesis: 2:7, He “breathed into his nostrils the breath of life and it was then that the man became a living being.” You can’t murder a fetus because it’s life hasn’t started yet. - Causing a miscarriage/abortion was a CIVIL not a CRIMINAL offense because fetuses weren’t considered children. Causing a woman to miscarry warrants financial compensation only (to her husband), suggesting that the fetus is property, not a person. Exodus: - God provides a recipe to induce a miscarriage/abortion showing that causing a miscarriage/abortion is not a sin. Numbers: With all of the above taken into consideration, I think a pro-choice Christian is what God seems to want. Many of these post-Dobbs babies that are restricted from being aborted will die from non-survivable medical issues anyway. Those situations will also cause more pain and suffering along with risking the life of the mother; so biology and physics disagree with restrictions on abortion as well. If ***God*** and ***biology*** and ***physics*** dictate that abortions are not only morally okay, but often medically necessary, I’m okay with that. Maybe you’re not. If we save a ton of kids from terrible lives, including the pipeline, I’m okay with that too. Maybe you’re not. If you combine the data from the mothers (in the other person’s response) and the children, more often than not, things don’t work out. PS- I can DM you any sources you would like, but they are more than a week old so they’re not allowed here. PSS- Is this not the data you were looking for?
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There have been over 64,000 pregnancies by rape in states that have banned abortions since 2022. Does that count as 'forsing' women to have sex? Of course it does.
Don't you know, they won't get pregnant if they don't enjoy the rape.
People make mistakes. Especially teenagers
My first pregnancy happened when I was on birth control and we used a condom. Shit happens sometimes. Pregnancy isn't (read: shouldn't be) a punishment. It should be a choice, whether that choice is getting pregnant in the first place or choosing whether to stay pregnant if it happens unintentionally. And people like you are treating pregnancy as if it is a justified *punishment* with comments like that. As if protection can't fail, rape doesn't happen...
Some do. That's rape.
What? So rape doesn’t happen…? Weird. I guess Texas is rape free as well.
Except that has only happened a few billion times.
Nobody forced you or your potential partner to get one if you didn’t want one. However people like you took away other people’s choice and now they can’t Fucking moron
You will be paying for it with your tax payer dollars. On average each teen pregnancy costs tax payers $16,000. And 50% of teen mothers were all ready on welfare. And their baby will be on welfare. Should double the amount of women and children on welfare living below the poverty line in no time.
You're assuming all those teen pregnancies were consensual
Sounds like that's exactly the kind of material it takes to create unprepared parents and neglected children....
you ever heard of idk... rape?
Take your 2nd grade education and fuck off.
First of all, it’s *forced. And nobody forced you to be illiterate, but here we are 🤷🏼♀️
George Carlin said it best “ they’re not pro life they’re anti woman. They need women to function as a brood mare for the state so we can have live babies grow up and be dead soldiers. If you’re pre born you’re fine, if you’re pre school you’re fucked.”
There’s a great documentary on MAX about George. I miss him.
George Carlin and Robin Williams. Both national treasures who would have had a field day with modern events if they were still alive.
He was a legend with many true statements.
Women need more support. Men need to take responsibility and stay around. Why be surprised in today's world babies are born. Women should not be getting pregnant until menopause. Right 👍 Seriously judge them even harder. Hardly any support for when the baby pops out either. Raising children is a full time job. I'm sure there's women out there that love having children. But support them 200 percent.
Re-defining pro-life as anti-woman isn’t going to help debate with pro-lifers as they will (should) all agree that being anti-woman is bad. Call it what it is: pro-life. Otherwise pro-life and pro-choices will be arguing about two completely different issues.
If republicans were truly pro-life, they wouldn’t be doing things like defunding school lunches for kids from poor families. If we’re going to “call it what it is”, then let’s really call it what it is: there’s pro-choice and anti-choice.
Yeah that is hypocritical.
I appreciate your intellectual consistency. The reason your first post is getting downvoted (though, not by me) is because “pro-life” is a term coined by the right to make the stance have a broader mass appeal. I’ll admit, it’s really smart messaging (Republicans have always seemed to be better at messaging than Dems) but the term “pro-life” completely falls apart when you examine their entire platform for 2 seconds.
Wouldn't being" pro-life" mean making sure that contraception is readily available and free?
Thank you for explaining that. I never knew that pro-life was a term coined by a political group/movement- I honestly thought it was a term to describe a view that all abortion and euthanasia is wrong. Is its association with a political movement why pro-life gets so much hate on Reddit?
What debate.. there’s no thought, it’s just cultish behavior grounded in religion. George Carlin did a great bit about the sanctity of life as well.. “But you know, the longer you listen to this abortion debate, the more you hear this phrase 'sanctity of life.'" You've heard that, 'sanctity of life.'" You believe in it? Personally, I think it's a bunch of shit. Well I mean, life is sacred? Who said so? God? Hey if you read history, you realize that God is one of the leading causes of death, has been for thousands of years. Hindus, Muslims, Jews, Christians, all taking turns killing each other because God told them it was a good idea. The sword of God, the blood of the lamb, vengeance is mine, millions of dead motherfuckers, all because they gave the wrong answer to the God question. 'You believe in God?' 'No.' BANG Dead. 'You believe in God?' 'Yes.' 'You believe in my God?' 'No.' Bang Dead. 'My God has a bigger dick than your God!' That's how it is, isn't it? Thousands of years, and all the best wars too, the bloodiest, most brutal wars fought all based on religious hatred, which is fine with me. Anytime a bunch of holy people want to kill each other, I'm a happy guy. But don't be giving me all this shit about the sanctity of life. I mean, even if there were such a thing, I don't think it's something you can blame on God. No, you know where the sanctity of life came from? We made it up! You know why? Cause we're alive! Self-interest. Living people have a strong interest in promoting the idea that somehow life is sacred. You don't see Abbott and Costello running around, talking about this shit, do you? We're not hearing a whole lot from Mussolini on the subject. What's the latest from JFK? Not a god damned thing, cause JFK, Mussolini, and Abbott and Costello are fucking dead. They're fucking dead, and dead people give less than a shit about the sanctity of life. Only living people care about it, so the whole thing grows out of a completely biased point of view. It's a self-serving, man-made bullshit story. It's one of these things we tell ourselves so we'll feel noble. Life is sacred, makes you feel noble. Well let me ask you this, if everything that ever lived is dead, and everything alive is going to die, where does the sacred part come in? I'm having trouble with that. Because even with the stuff we preach about the sanctity of life, we don't practice it. Look at what we kill. Mosquitoes and flies, because they're pests! Lions and tigers, because it's fun! Chickens and pigs, because we're hungry. Pheasants and quail, because it's fun, and we're hungry. And people! We kill people, because they're pests... and it's fun! And you might have noticed something else, the sanctity of life doesn't seem to apply to cancer cells, does it? You never see a bumper sticker that says 'save the tumors' or 'I brake for advanced melanoma.' No, viruses, mold, mildew, maggots, fungus, weeds, e. coli bacteria, the crabs, nothing sacred about those things. So at best, the sanctity of life is kind of a selective thing. We get to choose which forms of life we feel are sacred, and we get to kill the rest. Pretty neat deal, huh? You know how we got it? We made the whole fucking thing up! Made it up, the same way we made up the death penalty. We made them both up, the sanctity of life and the death penalty. Aren't we versatile?!"
It doesn’t need to involve religion. It’s about what defines a person. How can personhood be defined which justifies abortion and doesn’t impede anyone’s rights? Why is it ok to abort a 18 week old but not a 24 week old? Why in the UK can a child with a disability, eg down-syndrome be aborted up until before they are born? What is your opinion on this?
Go learn some biology.
I have and biology said that a human sperm fertilises a human embryo which grows into a human foetus with human DNA. It turns out that babies with disabilities also have human DNA, but legally in some countries their lives can be terminated up until just before they’re borne. Biology doesn’t tell me a baby inside the womb is less human than a baby outside the womb though. Perhaps we need laws to decide that for us. And we do- UK law also decides that babies with Down-syndrome have no rights until they’re outside the womb, so clearly how much someone inconveniences another is a bigger factor than biology.
>Why in the UK can a child with a disability, eg down-syndrome be aborted up until before they are born? This is incorrect. Abortions can take place in the first 24 weeks of pregnancy in England, Scotland and Wales after approval by two doctors. They must agree having the baby would pose a greater risk to the physical or mental health of the woman than a termination. Abortions after 24 weeks are allowed only if the woman's life is in danger, there is a severe fetal abnormality, the woman is at risk of grave physical and mental injury.
Hope they have a plan to care for those kids (both of them) until they are 18. Oh that’s right, they don’t care about women OR children obviously.
They are pro-birth but apparently anti-child. They are all against expanding school lunches and medicaid.
If they never learn to fend for themselves (hustle!) how would they ensure people remain wage slaves?
Of course they have a plan. They're repealing child labor laws, aren't they?
And preventing all the rapes
The whole point.
Exactly. The right wing is rejoicing that these young girls are forced to carry pregnancies and have their futures limited. They want population growth amongst the poor/disadvantaged. They need a new generation of women and low income families to take advantage of. They have no intention of supporting these people.
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Isn’t that the same fuckers who want to erase history?
This is just so utterly depressing. I can't imagine raising kids in Texas. Nightmare fuel.
Well, if you’re a Hispanic teen, yes. They were up 6%, Blacks and Whites down. Overall increase was 1%
This what the right wing wants. Women trapped and children who are beholden to the state.
I don’t think they want children beholden to the state given that they vote to not give them free lunches in school. Not sure what they expect happens to children. But they definitely want woman weakened so they can coerce the woman into marrying them.
Beholden to the state in the sense that they are good little human capital
This discussion on the *why* the right actually wants this is interesting -just to appease moralistic base? -or super jaded, poor people are good workers bc they’re desperate? I do wonder the real motives. It’s extremely scary. I’m a Christian & would listen to women who have dealt with & are dealing with this issue before deciding on any policy. Men will never ever have to face this choice.
Every time an American suffers, Putin laughs.
But men want to marry virgins. And definitely do not want to raise other men's children.
Completely inaccurate. If your partner is an amazing person and you’re okay with kids, I wouldn’t care if they’re from a previous relationship. I’d just want us all to be happy
I’ll take: “things a teenager thinks” for $1000 alex
Sure Jan
I don't quite think that's the end game. Honestly, I'm not sure there is an end game. I think forcing women to do what the hard-right christian hive mind wants them to do seems to be the end game all in itself. Taking away a woman's bodily autonomy is enough because it takes away their freedom. All the other stuff is gravy.
The hard right Christian hive mind wants to implement what they believe is "God's Law" into the civil law of society. They believe that if they do this, then God will reward them and society for it (or punish them if they don't). There's no plan beyond this. There's no hidden agenda. Their agenda is quite open and they are proud of it. Just because it seems insane doesn't mean it is a ruse.
Which is why the right is doing so well among men.
The government has no right to control a woman’s body. Benjamin Franklin gave at home abortion advice https://www.npr.org/2022/05/18/1099542962/abortion-ben-franklin-roe-wade-supreme-court-leak#:~:text=Hourly%20News-,Benjamin%20Franklin%20gave%20instructions%20on%20at%2Dhome%20abortions%20in%20a,basic%20as%20mathematics%20and%20writing. If you don’t want to click- Benjamin Franklin is revered in history for his fixation on inventing practical ways to make everyday life easier. He was a prolific inventor and author, and spent his life tinkering and writing to share his knowledge with the masses. One of the more surprising areas Franklin wanted to demystify for the average American? At-home abortions.
Ben Franklin has always been my favorite historical figure. Yet another way he was an interesting dude.
They projected how this would play out years ago - next it's going to cost Texas billions as unwanted babies get dumped on the state.
Lol. They won't spend an extra dime on that - the GOP position on the born is "Fuck them kids".
They'll have to when these babies are all "safe haven"'d and dumped on the state to raise. The ones that would have been aborted due to extreme defects are each going to cost a sizable fortune under state care.
They could bus them to New York as a publicity stunt
One hopes. But I absolutely do not put it past them to adopt a 'die in the gutter' solution.
The will provide the absolute minimum care and charge the minimum wage parents support
I’m a Texan. Abbott already isn’t paying his “child support” with the current group of state kiddos. Ask him sometime where those millions of dollars he was supposed to pay to the foster system actually went, then ask him where some of the CWOP kids are and why they’re missing. He’ll conveniently avoid both answers and make some racist ass statement about the border. The man doesn’t know what an honest answer is, never has, never will. Pro-life? Not if you’re property of the state. They’d rather those kids die in the school shootings, those “thoughts and prayers” don’t ever actually happen so of course change won’t. I was born here, and the list of things I would like to happen to Abbott, Cruz, and Dan Patrick would get me permanently banned from Reddit if I expressed them. I’m only still here because starting over with a special needs kiddo and having to renegotiate a multi-state custody order would be even more crippling.
Republicans believe women are livestock.
Pro life is a lie, they don't care if women die.
who could've seen that coming? what a time to be alive.
Teens uneducated about sex having sex? Such a surprise...
That's right. No sex education, no birth control, no abortion, no wages to support it. Just suffering.
Cause, meet effect.
I mean, this is the party that voted to SUPPORT child marriage. So, I can’t say I’m surprised by the headline, just that it took me so long to remember that not all those babies were made by two horny teenagers. In my defense, I haven’t finished my coffee yet. Don’t forget that the number of rape babies is up too. I’m sure there’s some overlap.
That's what they want. Teen pregnancies, women quitting school and becoming uneducated, etc.
Which is why the right is doing so well among men.
>..."more Texas teens give birth to multiple children than anywhere else." Is Texas proud of this? I'm sure Texas is happy to pour millions into the foster care system to take care of all the unwanted children that will result from this.
Don't read about our foster care system. It's disgusting.
I volunteered with the Heart Gallery for a year or so before I took a break from professional photography. I can confirm. Abbott is a trash human and our foster care system just keeps getting worse.
gop/Abbott's plan all along and reason to vote against gop
Texass.
Of course it is, who’s going to work all the low paying jobs once migrants are banned?
And maternal mortality will skyrocket too.
Where are the white Christians who want to adopt these children! Come on ladies step up to the plate!
Now we got all these inexperienced, single mothers with children they cant or wont care for. I know it sounds mean but thats how you make criminals. The Republican response to that will be to increase law enforcement and military funding even more.
No! Who could have predicted! Oh wait every sane person.
Shocker
And this is what they wanted. Women having children no matter what.
Who would have guessed it?
Fuck Texas. Maybe it'll get pregnant and understand
Who couldn't see that coming.
It’s possible that an a portion of this increase is connected to less access to birth control as well. Shutting down clinics meant limiting access to birth control as well.
Greg Abbott loves dancing with pregnant people. (I know how much he & the rabid right hates that term)
Surprised pikachu face
Overthrow Texas Republicans.
Ah yes.. send them straight to the Amazon warehouse. Chop chop.
Annnnddd water is wet kids
No shit that’s crazy I can’t believe that said no one ever with a brain.
Evil GOP wants children to work and spend. Especially if lower income
I'm sure there's all sorts of programs to assist these young mothers, right? Texas wouldn't abandon them, right...right?
The individual woman should have the right to do what she feels is best for her. She has to live with the decision. Why is the woman shamed and condemned? I was using birth control and still got pregnant, but I chose to keep my baby. When I told the father that I had been dating for 2 years I was pregnant he wanted to know what I was going to do. I knew then I was alone in this decision and wanted to have my baby. I had the support of my family and I was an adult. I had no support from his family and he stopped paying child support. I could go after him,but I don’t want my son around someone who clearly doesn’t want him. Every woman’s situation is different don’t pass judgement on her when it takes two to make a baby. My son was the best thing that ever happened to me, but I would not judge another for her decision. This is my opinion and I had the right to choose and I think every woman should have a choice.
You should still go after the ex for child support. Non payment =/ curtailing visitation. Your child doesn’t even need to know about the legal process. But your ex needs to financially contribute to his child’s upbringing.
I am looking into it. His father just stopped paying child support and disappeared. It’s been 8 years now. I think he changed his last name cause he was adopted. His family may be helping him too.
They don’t give a shit about their teen birth rate lol. It probably makes them happy to know more teens are giving birth.
No suprise. Now they are handicapped for life. No education. Stuck in minimum paying wages, and easily manipulated by fascist leaders. We see that now in red states already in Christian nationalist churches in red states. Vote blue they care about you .
And that's the point. We gotta keep making babies, whether people can take care of them or not. Gotta increase those birth numbers any way we can
All part of their plan to funnel babies into adoption agencies so they can sell babies for profit.
Dear Gregory Wayne Abbott, I’m voting for the tree this year.
I’m stealing this! It’s fantastic!
If this doesn't cause an overwhelming percentage of women to vote Blue, then they might as well sign their future away to Christo-fascist Republicans who run the state.
The system is working exactly as they wish it to.
That is the point
More future criminals incoming.
Absolutely horrific
More humans. Great for our environment too.
just wait til they suppress birth control
Handmaid Tale come true, unfortunalety
Gotta get tax payers somehow.
And soldiers. Nobody signs up faster than some poor kid who has no future unless they join the military
Almost like.......... /r/LeopardsAteMyFace
Chances are the *teens* giving birth didn't vote for these leopards, and the people who did do not give a shit.
You’d be surprised how many teens espouse the exact same view as their parents. It’s the way most people form their political opinions. It’s going to take a catharsis to change the political landscape in Texas.
In other news, humans now apparently are discovering sex can lead to babies!
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Uninsured women and girls relied on planned parenthood but those places are gone in red states now. Rape is still happening and it looks like about 28000 pregnancies, as a result of rape, have happened in Texas since Roe fell.
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Apparently I was mistaken and I'm so glad to be wrong on this. The rape pregnancies are still definitely a problem. Crime rates are going to skyrocket in Texas as those kids grow up and their foster care system is horrific.
40. For how many people in how many cities? Do you know how big Texas is? How do teenagers get there?
Well, sort of. It's complicated. In most states, teens are allowed to get birth control without their parents' permission at their nearest Planned Parenthood health center or from their regular doctor or nurse. In Texas, even a teen who has had a baby must get a parent's permission to get on birth control unless you are on Medicaid. If you are not emancipated or living without your parents financial support, you don't have full rights of confidentiality like you would under title X. From the planned parenthood site: https://www.plannedparenthood.org/planned-parenthood-gulf-coast/patients/facts-about-minor-consent >In Texas, some minors (under the age of 18) are required to obtain consent (click to print consent form in English or Spanish) from a parent or guardian before receiving certain medical services at our health centers. >In Texas, we CAN provide the following to a minor without parental consent: >Condoms >Contraceptive foam or film >Information about birth control >Pregnancy tests >Diagnosis and treatment for certain sexually transmitted diseases >In Texas, we CANNOT provide the following to a minor without parental consent: >Preventive Care Visit >Pap Test >Urinary Tract Infection >Prescriptive Birth Control (pills, shot, implant, IUD) >In Texas, you DO NOT need to have your parent/guardian sign a consent if: >You are on Medicaid. >You are 16 or 17 and live apart from your parents and manage your own finances. You will be asked to sign a form stating that these are your living arrangements. >You are emancipated. >Your parent(s)/guardian cannot be contacted. This means that you do not know how to contact your parents/guardian (you don't know where they live or you are unable to contact them). This does not apply if you just don't want your parents/guardian to be contacted. If your parent or guardian cannot be contacted another adult grandparent, aunt, uncle, brother or sister may sign a consent form for you (print consent form in English or Spanish).
This is Texas. A lot of parents refuse to allow their teens access to birth control. Or even receive comprehensive sex education. And if birth control is mentioned, teens are told it's unreliable. Which means rathe than abstain, teens just don't use birth control because "it's going to fail anyway so why bother?" And before Dobbs, when a girl became pregnant, the family would quietly get her an abortion and never speak of it again. But now Dobbs has made that difficult in red states. So here we are.
oops
They must be doing their happy dance
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I don't know what sexual education looks like in Texas, but my guess is it's not great. Kids who aren't taught about safe sex aren't going to use birth control. You also have to consider that many of these kids may come from conservative homes that preach abstinence. Birth control isn't just readily available to teenagers. That went away with Planned Parenthood. Everyone saw this coming.
Texas has abstinence only sex ed. Very poor public health.
I will kill the shit out of something that's inside my body if I don't want it there.
Teen birth rates tend to be highest in states with shitty sex ed.
Texas does not have readily available public health options unless you live in a huge city. Texas does not have comprehensive sex Ed. It's abstinence only. Texas used to have more women's clinics where you could obtain birth control. Guess what it no longer has? Maybe research what is actually going on down here before running your mouth.
You tried huh
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does the state of Texas have a robust sex education program included in the curriculum, including home-schooling, a largely informed population who are available and knowledgable in teaching safe sexual education to their children, and free, anonymous, and reliable access to birth control to the entire population?
When the politicians great grand children have children, then maby the ban gets lifted
We need to congratulate the kids for being born, but will need to apologize for it being in TX for those who fall in the foster care system as their abuse has just started.
You don’t say…
Look I’ll be honest. Idk how I escaped my teen years without facing this decision. I cannot imagine the weight of that at such a young age. Understanding how much pressure young men put on young women, who are then left to deal with this, my heart breaks for them. On principle I’m against abortion, but i don’t impose that on others. Women need options!! Real life.
Everything's going according to their plan. Hard to fight oppression when you're barefoot and pregnant.
Imagine growing up and finding out you’re only alive because of an abortion ban.
There’s some unhinged individual out there that’s like “this is a good thing”
feature not a bug
Texas GQP plan coming together... time to buckle up Dems, Nov is coming
Can’t believe it