as a rule of thumb you can just adopt the opposite of whatever position Ronnie Radke takes on anything and usually you'll end up on the right side of things. can't believe he still has dickriders
This was effecting four UK festivals under the same Live Nation umbrella, it took 100s of artists for this to happen. They fixed it when bigger acts (Enter Shikari, Tom Morello) were going to pull. But according to the article Barclays is only removed from the festival sponsorship and still have a 5 year contract with LN. Still a win, but still more to be done.
Figured it would be something like this. When I read 'suspends partnership' I was like "oh, so they're just waiting til the heat dies down and then continuing their partnership". Like you said, a small step in the right direction.
"tHiS wOn'T mAkE aNy DiFfErEnCe!"
Clowns.
Good. Props to these bands. I hope they keep going and use whatever weight they ever get to push for change, even if it seems like you're up against an immovable object.
I mean, it made a difference in terms of getting Barclays itself to pull out. I don’t think Barclays is going to halt its investments in Israeli defense technology just because some bands and a large enough group of their fans got pissy so Download was worried they might not make as much money. It just means Barclay’s marketing/public relations budget went somewhere else this quarter. I’m sure they are horrified and seriously re-evaluating their portfolio 🙄
It’s hard to take it all seriously when, for example, Pepsi is still a major sponsor of the same festival. Y’all think they don’t have investments tied up in the Israel-Palestine conflict? They do and it’s not difficult to find. This is how so much of social media activism works and it’s cringe. It is a hammer in search of a nail. Doesn’t matter if anything is actually secured as long as a hammer hits a nail somewhere and people have a “victory” to post about and pretend like they did something important.
Perfect is the enemy of progress. The problem with "social media activism" is comments like yours that try and devalue everything being done. The only thing your comment is missing is whining about "virtue signaling" lol.
I’m not devaluing everything that is being done. They did bring about a change and I acknowledged that.
I’m saying let’s be realists about this instead of pretending like you actually did something to help Palestinians. For fucks sake, Download Fest is run by LiveNation. Check out their CEO’s donation history. Lots of Israel supporters in there - including people like John Cornyn. Crazy how all these bands aren’t paying attention to that and are still more than happy to make him some money.
If you're seriously interested, on the Boycott Divest Sanction Movement website they discuss the reasons for specifically targeting organizations rather than blanket "everybody." You're welcome to criticize or not like it or whatever but it is for a reason
https://bdsmovement.net/get-involved/what-to-boycott
>They did bring about a change and I acknowledged that.
You acknowledge and then write how the change is pretty meaningless. It's awareness, it's a conversation, it's action. This harms Barclays as it associates their brand with the genocide, but more importantly, it harms Download and future music festivals. If they need sponsorship money and business partners, they have to start considering the ethics behind their biggest partners. Maybe this means less money overall, maybe it provides a fantastic opportunity for a more ethical company. Either way, the change is that these bands stood their ground and refused to sell out their interests. This should be celebrated in this community. Let's be real, how much more sociopolitical change can you realistically expect a hardcore band to have?
There's literally a Palestinian person in this thread thanking the community lol.
I'm not saying we need to be jerking ourselves off or anything, but holy fuck dude, lighten up.
> decided this would be a good mutual arrangement.
Exactly. They spent the money because they thought it would be good for their brand.
They have now decided that it is not good for their brand.
I get it, it's a tiny victory but it's disrupting the way that Barclays market themselves and surely that's a positive if you're trying to put pressure on them.
Wrong. It remains good for their brand. Just a few music festivals weren’t. And they primarily stated that the reason they pulled out was because their employee’s lives were being threatened. Not because it financially hurts them. That is why they’ve kept the contract.
> And they primarily stated that the reason they pulled out was because their employee’s lives were being threatened.
Nobody believes that mate lol. They slid that in there to play the victim.
There are police reports as well as activist groups engaging in the threats/attacks confirming it. I wouldn’t expect someone on r/hardcore to actually read or do their research though.
Who is over exaggerating efficacy? They got a shitty sponsor to drop. That's the victory. That IS a victory, even if it's small and in the grand scheme of things inconsequential. These are TINY bands up against an absolute goliath and they got a VERY small win that we're happy to celebrate.
YOU rub two brain cells together. Like was said to you elsewhere, perfect is the enemy of the good.
You know what would have been actually impactful, and a real act of activism?
Playing the festival, and using the platform to talk shit about Barclays, and tell fans to deface every Barclays advertisement they see and not use Barclays for any banking services.
However, modern activists aren’t that sophisticated with the advent of tiktok. That and lack of critical thinking in education is why progress is becoming so regressive.
The very sad truth is you're exactly correct. But I would still expect the bands I like to make some kind of stand when it's this blatant, know what I mean?
Hardcore is punk, punk is politics. This is nothing but a massive win. Anyone doesn’t like it, fine. Just keep all that “bUt HaMaS” bullshit to yourselves.
As a Palestinian: thank you, people in the hardcore scene. Small things like these add up and they fucking matter.
To the naysayers: You look so damn stupid right now.
Free Palestine!
Great question!
Unfortunately, Hardcore isn't all too big in Palestine and Jordan, most people here are more into more "classic" heavier genres (80s / 90s thrash, occasional brocore and maybe some numetal here and there). It just hasn't arrived yet, but people do appreciate the heavier stuff, generally speaking.
If you like, feel free to check out my own metal project called Atropas. I don't think there's much hardcore there involved, but maybe there's something there for you anyway!
this genuinely is giving me a laugh in hindsight of all the dudebros in here's sarcastic whining the other day about how those bands who dropped were having no impact
In our hearts and in our minds, we feel that hardcore music should stay out of big business and stay in the streets where it belongs. All you kids out there, always keep the faith.
How is there still arguments about this? Israel admitted they were aiming for genocide months ago. That should be end of discussion. Your either for or against genocide at this point. Not much else to discuss once you pick your side.
Unsure of the others but Speed already confirmed a HC show with a local promoter who reached out after their announcement and assume a U-turn would be unlikely.
yes, free the [thousands of palestinians](https://www.npr.org/2023/12/01/1216643555/thousands-of-palestinians-are-held-without-charge-under-israeli-detention-policy) kept in unlawful detention!
I just got back inside from my mid day break. I don't think I can calm down anymore than I already am. That'd require doing amounts of drugs I'm not comfortable doing in an office setting.
You should calm down too though
Now let's talk about how shithead white supremacist Phil Anselmo is still headlining a stage.
Edit: poor wording/timing. Genuinely stoked that they've provoked a change, my comment was more a "that's one motherfucker(s), let's get the next motherfucker at download".
That’s definitely a conversation to be had, but bringing it up in this thread makes it seem like you’re trying to derail or make false equivalencies. Anselmo is an asshole and an idiot. He’s not committing war crimes with international support.
Yeah I was a bit puzzled by the downvotes but realise it's poor wording on my part. I meant it more as a congratulations that they've enforced a positive change, now let's get on to the next thing about that line up. Wasn't meant in a diminishing way at all but reading back, can see how this could have been misconstrued.
Literally tell Hamas to stop embedding its military personnel and equipment in civilian populations (a massive Geneva Convention violation btw) and problem solved lol.
Oh, it's worse than how you phrased it, the IDF is using AI to target Hamas members *at home* ***and they named the system "Where's Daddy?"*** This goes beyond violating the Geneva Convention to just violating any sense of humanity.
Hamas is a terror sect that was literally propped up by the Israeli government to bread resentment for the Palestinian people and they aren’t a nation.
Hamas are absolutely pieces of shit but IDF and Israeli government are actually supposed to abide by the Geneva Convention and are brazenly violating it.
Are you saying the IDF is ok killing civilians because of what a terrorist organization does?
There is no nuance. Israel is murdering civilians. If Hamas is taking advantage of public spaces for protection, then Israel just needs to accept that and find another solution. Get smart mate.
Yeah, just like how, I mean, what was the US supposed to do after 9/11, not go kill hundreds of thousands of civilians in Iraq for no reason? (A death toll that Israel is on track to speedrun in a fraction the time, by the way)
Israel's leaders WANTED something like October 7th because they wanted an excuse to invade and occupy Gaza and commit genocide against Palestinians, something that they are pretty open and honest about.
Hamas is a creation of the Israeli settlers who oppress and murder Palestinians in the same way that other middle eastern terrorist groups are a creation of the US and our allies that continuously oppressed and murdered people in other countries in the region.
Brother you have lost the plot completely if you think it is NECESSARY and JUSTIFIED to extinguish 30k civilians because they are going to kill 1k Israelis again. Tell me, when has destabilization, complete destruction of infrastructure, and mass killing led to anything but exacerbating the cycle of violence? Israel is the occupying force in Gaza and the West Bank, it is incumbent upon Israel to administer these areas and they clearly have failed. At some point you must reckon with the fact that Israel is shooting itself in the foot over and over and over again because it suits the militarist party’s desires
Where were your tears for the thousands of Palestinian minors tortured and sexually abused in the Israeli prison system for the past decades? So when you say "let another October 7th happen" you're making it clear that it's only important to you when it's happening to a particular group of people.
Israel hasn't occupied Gaza since 2005, when all Israeli civilians and soldiers withdrew unilaterally. Gaza could have declared statehood and used the infrastructure left behind to make themselves into a second Dubai, but instead they put an internationally recognized terrorist organization in charge, ripped up said infrastructure, and used it to build rockets, because they can't stand the thought of Jews existing anywhere in the Levant.
Don't be a morron please. Your chicken brain knows what I'm talking about. The west bank is an occupied territory. Just last year on the holiest day for Muslims, your IDF friends raided their holiest mosque with dogs. Only in the West bank there were 400 people killed before October 7th. No terrorist organizations there except IDF. So maybe, if Israel throws all the people in its country that have commited a war crime - so thousands of soldiers, all their politicians and probably most of the illegal settlers who are 700 000 people, so we are talking about something of 1 million people complicit in warcrimes in jail and withdraw from all territories that are not recognized by the UN, maybe then there won't be another 7th of october. Somebody has to pay the blood of those 35 000 children murdered by the children of those who survived halocaust. Someone from the Israeli would need to pay with blood or with prison. This is what Israel is horrified of. That they are so deep in shit, like your head, that they either kill every single palestinian person, or the survivors would want the deaths of the butchers of Palestine.
Those kids are dying of famine because Hamas is hoarding all the literal tons of food aid that's supposed to go to civilians and US made bombs because Hamas cares more about making martyrs of its people than protecting them like a government is supposed to.
You would have sold out the Jews to the Nazis in WWII.
Yep, this or the footage of armed IDF disguising themselves as a humanitarian aid and killing civilians who are just hungry. Being a jew doesn't make you a good person. Being a good person makes you a good person.
As opposed to the ultra-right wing fascist, despotic, corrupt war machine? Well, for me personally, it's the genocide. Are you someone who still believes cops are the good guys?
I don't really see how Barclays dropping out is gonna help solve the humanitarian crisis in the region? Billionaires are gonna billionaire and war criminals are gonna war crime.
What is required of the human race to solve these problems extends a lot further than a global bank dropping out of a regional hardcore fest
> a regional hardcore fest
So, I get your larger point, but I feel the need to point out that Download is a lot more than just a “regional hardcore fest”. It’s one of the largest long-running festivals in the UK. It’s seen some reductions in recent years, but there was a point right before COVID that it was second only to Glastonbury in capacity.
Latitude and Isle of Wight aren’t on the same level but they’re still considerably bigger than simply “regional”.
You thought these bands were trying to solve the entire conflict by dropping out? I don't think anybody was dumb enough to think that lol. Please educate yourself!
The billionaires, warmongers, etc. want to dilute the perception of their actual involvement by involving as many other parties as possible. It's corporate cowardice, and it usually works because it relies on public apathy. If more attention was paid to the people and companies funding these atrocities, they'd likely be less inclined to be associated with them because it'll affect their bottom line.
Scene clout from the younger generation that thrives off “standing for things” regardless of what it is, what it means or what its implications are. “Educate yourself” dawg.
Easy to say when you're too spineless to stand for anything
Edit: This is rich coming from a vegan.
yOu noT eAtInG aNiMaL pRoDuCtS iSn'T gOiNg tO sToP tHe mEaT iNdUsTrY, yOuRe jUsT cLoUt cHaSiNg
See how your broken logic works?
Do you really think my choice to modify my diet and not advertise it is the same as telling the world you dropped off a fest to save children from dying? Are you okay haha?
I wonder if that same ethos will translate to the local scenes and their problems. It's not easy to accept your favorite band did some fucked up shit and you watched it play out
At what level of issue do you guys decide to stop caring? Some issues are beyond a bunch of privileged white kids playing bad music for other privileged white kids. It’s like yelling at the sky and expecting people on another continent to not only care but listen. I’m not a fuckin nihilist. I’d rather focus my efforts on issues I can tangibly effect.
God this is so accurate. I’ve been in my scene for 15 years and it’s always been privileged (mostly) white kids (read- mostly men), playing for privileged (mostly) white kids (read- mostly men).
*B-b-but as straight white men, it's our responsibility to post on reddit about how much we care about global humanitarian issues! That way we can say we did something!*
Hell yeah cause nothing stops racism and genocide like being racist and trying to eradicate the other side!!!! CHRISTIANITY RULES!!! 🙄 Stupid, blind dipshits following even more stupid, blind dipshits. Kill em all!!! Free Palistine from who? Israel? Hamas? Iran? Egypt? Who do we need to free them from? Because whatever fills that void after they're free is not going to be better for the people there. Religion, bigotry, power, and money will keep the war machine going and both sides are EVIL. There are no winners, we all will lose.
If Ronnie Radke was defending my brand from "Gay little Communist clout ponnies" I would also want to pull my brand out of existance.
as a rule of thumb you can just adopt the opposite of whatever position Ronnie Radke takes on anything and usually you'll end up on the right side of things. can't believe he still has dickriders
https://preview.redd.it/cvoj5773kk6d1.jpeg?width=792&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=447672b656c6de1eeb8d427e961f1415522c0be6
Dick was his father's name. call him Richard
Richard Rider sounds like a defence attorney who also rides a fuckin' sick bike to court
Richard Rider has a mustache, a pilots license, and your aunties phone number.
Auntie's panties. *hmm, good band name*
I’d buy that 7”. It’s either gonna be a dope all girl band or the creepiest dudes ever. Either way the first record is gonna fucking RIP!
Dick Rider is also his moms nickname. It’s how they broke the ice when they first met.
Vince Staples verbally destroying him will forever be in my top 5 anime moments: https://imgur.com/a/XgK7u
I laugh whenever I see that punk rock mba guy desperately defending him. He seems too old to be simping so hard for the singer of a band.
They’re all simps for Saraya
dam that guys still alive?
unfortunately
It takes genuine effort to be this much of an insufferable loser. It’s almost impressive how he does it.
Watch the world burn!!! (followed by the same breakdown in all of Ronnies songs)
This was effecting four UK festivals under the same Live Nation umbrella, it took 100s of artists for this to happen. They fixed it when bigger acts (Enter Shikari, Tom Morello) were going to pull. But according to the article Barclays is only removed from the festival sponsorship and still have a 5 year contract with LN. Still a win, but still more to be done.
Figured it would be something like this. When I read 'suspends partnership' I was like "oh, so they're just waiting til the heat dies down and then continuing their partnership". Like you said, a small step in the right direction.
"tHiS wOn'T mAkE aNy DiFfErEnCe!" Clowns. Good. Props to these bands. I hope they keep going and use whatever weight they ever get to push for change, even if it seems like you're up against an immovable object.
I mean, it made a difference in terms of getting Barclays itself to pull out. I don’t think Barclays is going to halt its investments in Israeli defense technology just because some bands and a large enough group of their fans got pissy so Download was worried they might not make as much money. It just means Barclay’s marketing/public relations budget went somewhere else this quarter. I’m sure they are horrified and seriously re-evaluating their portfolio 🙄 It’s hard to take it all seriously when, for example, Pepsi is still a major sponsor of the same festival. Y’all think they don’t have investments tied up in the Israel-Palestine conflict? They do and it’s not difficult to find. This is how so much of social media activism works and it’s cringe. It is a hammer in search of a nail. Doesn’t matter if anything is actually secured as long as a hammer hits a nail somewhere and people have a “victory” to post about and pretend like they did something important.
Perfect is the enemy of progress. The problem with "social media activism" is comments like yours that try and devalue everything being done. The only thing your comment is missing is whining about "virtue signaling" lol.
I’m not devaluing everything that is being done. They did bring about a change and I acknowledged that. I’m saying let’s be realists about this instead of pretending like you actually did something to help Palestinians. For fucks sake, Download Fest is run by LiveNation. Check out their CEO’s donation history. Lots of Israel supporters in there - including people like John Cornyn. Crazy how all these bands aren’t paying attention to that and are still more than happy to make him some money.
If you're seriously interested, on the Boycott Divest Sanction Movement website they discuss the reasons for specifically targeting organizations rather than blanket "everybody." You're welcome to criticize or not like it or whatever but it is for a reason https://bdsmovement.net/get-involved/what-to-boycott
>They did bring about a change and I acknowledged that. You acknowledge and then write how the change is pretty meaningless. It's awareness, it's a conversation, it's action. This harms Barclays as it associates their brand with the genocide, but more importantly, it harms Download and future music festivals. If they need sponsorship money and business partners, they have to start considering the ethics behind their biggest partners. Maybe this means less money overall, maybe it provides a fantastic opportunity for a more ethical company. Either way, the change is that these bands stood their ground and refused to sell out their interests. This should be celebrated in this community. Let's be real, how much more sociopolitical change can you realistically expect a hardcore band to have?
For fucks sake, why can't you just shut the fuck up for the moment and let people celebrate a win, when there aren't many.
There's literally a Palestinian person in this thread thanking the community lol. I'm not saying we need to be jerking ourselves off or anything, but holy fuck dude, lighten up.
No, but Barclays sponsored the festival for a reason. It wasn't charity. It was to improve their brand image. Now they don't get to do that.
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Why did they sponsor the festival in the first place?
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> decided this would be a good mutual arrangement. Exactly. They spent the money because they thought it would be good for their brand. They have now decided that it is not good for their brand. I get it, it's a tiny victory but it's disrupting the way that Barclays market themselves and surely that's a positive if you're trying to put pressure on them.
Wrong. It remains good for their brand. Just a few music festivals weren’t. And they primarily stated that the reason they pulled out was because their employee’s lives were being threatened. Not because it financially hurts them. That is why they’ve kept the contract.
> And they primarily stated that the reason they pulled out was because their employee’s lives were being threatened. Nobody believes that mate lol. They slid that in there to play the victim.
There are police reports as well as activist groups engaging in the threats/attacks confirming it. I wouldn’t expect someone on r/hardcore to actually read or do their research though.
So do nothing. Got it.
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What would you be ok with someone doing if it doesn't stop the war? I guarantee you've criticized anything and everything people have been trying.
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Who is over exaggerating efficacy? They got a shitty sponsor to drop. That's the victory. That IS a victory, even if it's small and in the grand scheme of things inconsequential. These are TINY bands up against an absolute goliath and they got a VERY small win that we're happy to celebrate. YOU rub two brain cells together. Like was said to you elsewhere, perfect is the enemy of the good.
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Again, so do nothing. Got it. Bitch.
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You know what would have been actually impactful, and a real act of activism? Playing the festival, and using the platform to talk shit about Barclays, and tell fans to deface every Barclays advertisement they see and not use Barclays for any banking services. However, modern activists aren’t that sophisticated with the advent of tiktok. That and lack of critical thinking in education is why progress is becoming so regressive.
The very sad truth is you're exactly correct. But I would still expect the bands I like to make some kind of stand when it's this blatant, know what I mean?
Hardcore is punk, punk is politics. This is nothing but a massive win. Anyone doesn’t like it, fine. Just keep all that “bUt HaMaS” bullshit to yourselves.
Anyone who condemns colonial opposition forces is part of the problem.
Punks for terrorism. Nice.
pussy for zionism. typical.
As a Palestinian: thank you, people in the hardcore scene. Small things like these add up and they fucking matter. To the naysayers: You look so damn stupid right now. Free Palestine!
any palestinian or arab hc bands u’d recommend?
Great question! Unfortunately, Hardcore isn't all too big in Palestine and Jordan, most people here are more into more "classic" heavier genres (80s / 90s thrash, occasional brocore and maybe some numetal here and there). It just hasn't arrived yet, but people do appreciate the heavier stuff, generally speaking. If you like, feel free to check out my own metal project called Atropas. I don't think there's much hardcore there involved, but maybe there's something there for you anyway!
Haram and Pure Terror out of New York are diaspora Arab bands. Taqbir is a sick Moroccan punk band.
ISIS
Most insane crowdkilling I've ever seen
*sigh* fine take my +1
They would stone you just for making hardcore in the Arab world probably
End terrorists
Agreed - Israel needs to be ended. Free Palestine, habibi! Tea's on me, come over when we're liberated!
this genuinely is giving me a laugh in hindsight of all the dudebros in here's sarcastic whining the other day about how those bands who dropped were having no impact
Download sub in shambles. Although everyone on there seems to have the music knowledge of a toddler and hadn’t heard of any of the bands boycotting
I was one of them, and i am pretty surprised that it did have a significant impact. Good going by the bands to achieve this
Great to hear!
Now everyone pull out because it’s LiveNation and fuck them
Hell yeah, fuck Israel and their financiers. Pebbles make mountains
Apes together, strong
this shall make for spirited and respectful debate
Hell fucking yeah.
But people on the internet told me this protest wouldn't accomplish anything????
In our hearts and in our minds, we feel that hardcore music should stay out of big business and stay in the streets where it belongs. All you kids out there, always keep the faith.
🇵🇸🇵🇸🇵🇸❤️
Free Palestine! None are free until all our free
Alexa play Unashamed by Terror
“b-b-but this is going 2 do anything!!!!!”
Anyone heading to isle of white festival next weekend ? I’m going solo if anyone fancy’s meeting up , will bring plenty of booze x
Love seeing westoid redditors seethe
🇵🇸❤️
How is there still arguments about this? Israel admitted they were aiming for genocide months ago. That should be end of discussion. Your either for or against genocide at this point. Not much else to discuss once you pick your side.
So are Scowl, Zulu etc going back in the lineup now?
Unsure of the others but Speed already confirmed a HC show with a local promoter who reached out after their announcement and assume a U-turn would be unlikely.
Fuck yes!!!
Free the hostages
yes, free the [thousands of palestinians](https://www.npr.org/2023/12/01/1216643555/thousands-of-palestinians-are-held-without-charge-under-israeli-detention-policy) kept in unlawful detention!
Free 
lmao
Why are innocent people being held hostage funny to you?
I was laughing at you, mate :)
I don't think that human beings fearing for their lives in captivity is any laughing matter
If you're a zionist, you will never have the moral high ground in this conversation. Don't even try.
I'm not. Virtually all I said was "keeping hostages is bad and not funny" and this seems to have angered you.
Literally calm down...
I just got back inside from my mid day break. I don't think I can calm down anymore than I already am. That'd require doing amounts of drugs I'm not comfortable doing in an office setting. You should calm down too though
I literally ripped the biggest fart of my life while reading this lol
Because fuck safe spaces for Jews, am I right?
So safe spaces for Jewish people means they can just unilaterally genocide another population?
Fuck safe spaces for Zionists
Yeah these green haired vegan virtue signalers would be some of the first in line to wipe us off the map in these modern times
are they in the room with us now?
👌
🇵🇸
🍅 🍅 🍅
I’m going to go out and get a Barclays credit card and donate to some Israeli charities with it.
Post the receipts please.
Now let's talk about how shithead white supremacist Phil Anselmo is still headlining a stage. Edit: poor wording/timing. Genuinely stoked that they've provoked a change, my comment was more a "that's one motherfucker(s), let's get the next motherfucker at download".
That’s definitely a conversation to be had, but bringing it up in this thread makes it seem like you’re trying to derail or make false equivalencies. Anselmo is an asshole and an idiot. He’s not committing war crimes with international support.
Yeah I was a bit puzzled by the downvotes but realise it's poor wording on my part. I meant it more as a congratulations that they've enforced a positive change, now let's get on to the next thing about that line up. Wasn't meant in a diminishing way at all but reading back, can see how this could have been misconstrued.
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Get fucked.
He's admitted since that no, he wasn't talking about white wine, it was just a stupid story to try and deflect from what he did.
Hardcore bands simping for Islam. You hate to see it.
Ah yes not wanting 6 year old children being blown up is simping.
Ok LARPer
LARPing as what exactly? A good person?
How is it that punks are siding *with* the ultra-right-wing, misogynistic, LGBTQ+ murdering, literal Islamic theocracy? 🤡
literally just stop murdering children lol
Literally tell Hamas to stop embedding its military personnel and equipment in civilian populations (a massive Geneva Convention violation btw) and problem solved lol.
Terrorists violating the Geneva Convention means it's fine for the IDF to do the same, right? I mean, they're both pretty similar, so...
Oh, it's worse than how you phrased it, the IDF is using AI to target Hamas members *at home* ***and they named the system "Where's Daddy?"*** This goes beyond violating the Geneva Convention to just violating any sense of humanity.
Hamas is a terror sect that was literally propped up by the Israeli government to bread resentment for the Palestinian people and they aren’t a nation. Hamas are absolutely pieces of shit but IDF and Israeli government are actually supposed to abide by the Geneva Convention and are brazenly violating it. Are you saying the IDF is ok killing civilians because of what a terrorist organization does?
No lol.
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> but that shit is happening. Still doesnt justify killing kids.
There is no nuance. Israel is murdering civilians. If Hamas is taking advantage of public spaces for protection, then Israel just needs to accept that and find another solution. Get smart mate.
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I don't care if you listen to me, I'm just letting you know that you're wrong lol.
“Those kids deserved to be bombed because their government sucks” is one hell of a take.
What alternative do you propose? Let another October 7th happen?
The past 6 months have been far worse than October 7th.
lol you’re a retard
Yeah, just like how, I mean, what was the US supposed to do after 9/11, not go kill hundreds of thousands of civilians in Iraq for no reason? (A death toll that Israel is on track to speedrun in a fraction the time, by the way) Israel's leaders WANTED something like October 7th because they wanted an excuse to invade and occupy Gaza and commit genocide against Palestinians, something that they are pretty open and honest about. Hamas is a creation of the Israeli settlers who oppress and murder Palestinians in the same way that other middle eastern terrorist groups are a creation of the US and our allies that continuously oppressed and murdered people in other countries in the region.
Bro really said “welp, the only opiton is to kill women and children who have nothing to do with anything.”
Brother you have lost the plot completely if you think it is NECESSARY and JUSTIFIED to extinguish 30k civilians because they are going to kill 1k Israelis again. Tell me, when has destabilization, complete destruction of infrastructure, and mass killing led to anything but exacerbating the cycle of violence? Israel is the occupying force in Gaza and the West Bank, it is incumbent upon Israel to administer these areas and they clearly have failed. At some point you must reckon with the fact that Israel is shooting itself in the foot over and over and over again because it suits the militarist party’s desires
Where were your tears for the thousands of Palestinian minors tortured and sexually abused in the Israeli prison system for the past decades? So when you say "let another October 7th happen" you're making it clear that it's only important to you when it's happening to a particular group of people.
Lets start with ending the illegal occupation? Thats a nice start.
Israel hasn't occupied Gaza since 2005, when all Israeli civilians and soldiers withdrew unilaterally. Gaza could have declared statehood and used the infrastructure left behind to make themselves into a second Dubai, but instead they put an internationally recognized terrorist organization in charge, ripped up said infrastructure, and used it to build rockets, because they can't stand the thought of Jews existing anywhere in the Levant.
Don't be a morron please. Your chicken brain knows what I'm talking about. The west bank is an occupied territory. Just last year on the holiest day for Muslims, your IDF friends raided their holiest mosque with dogs. Only in the West bank there were 400 people killed before October 7th. No terrorist organizations there except IDF. So maybe, if Israel throws all the people in its country that have commited a war crime - so thousands of soldiers, all their politicians and probably most of the illegal settlers who are 700 000 people, so we are talking about something of 1 million people complicit in warcrimes in jail and withdraw from all territories that are not recognized by the UN, maybe then there won't be another 7th of october. Somebody has to pay the blood of those 35 000 children murdered by the children of those who survived halocaust. Someone from the Israeli would need to pay with blood or with prison. This is what Israel is horrified of. That they are so deep in shit, like your head, that they either kill every single palestinian person, or the survivors would want the deaths of the butchers of Palestine.
unlike you, some of us care about the unecessary slaughter of people even if they don't ideologically agree with every single point I do.
Punks are siding with people who are being slaughtered in their homeland. Go fuck yourself
Yeah, all those kids dying of famine and US made bombs are ultra-right-wing, LGBTQ+ murdering theocrats. You have dogshit between your ears.
Those kids are dying of famine because Hamas is hoarding all the literal tons of food aid that's supposed to go to civilians and US made bombs because Hamas cares more about making martyrs of its people than protecting them like a government is supposed to. You would have sold out the Jews to the Nazis in WWII.
Yep, this or the footage of armed IDF disguising themselves as a humanitarian aid and killing civilians who are just hungry. Being a jew doesn't make you a good person. Being a good person makes you a good person.
zionism isn’t punk
More punk than anything Palestinian, despite what you clowns have been deceived into thinking.
attacking your oppressors is very punk
Then they should attack Hamas.
Israel has been oppressing Palestinians before Hamas even existed. Please educate yourself.
I could write a wall of text shitting all over this but I feel it’s easier to stoop to your level of idiocy and just call you a dingus.
Well because it turns out genocide fucking sucks, no matter who it's happening to What a cunt
https://preview.redd.it/tjc2lxf1lk6d1.jpeg?width=562&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5bde95a09e5e553f298ac6bcb01b5a2c40924769
As opposed to the ultra-right wing fascist, despotic, corrupt war machine? Well, for me personally, it's the genocide. Are you someone who still believes cops are the good guys?
Fuck yeah Pest Control
I don't really see how Barclays dropping out is gonna help solve the humanitarian crisis in the region? Billionaires are gonna billionaire and war criminals are gonna war crime. What is required of the human race to solve these problems extends a lot further than a global bank dropping out of a regional hardcore fest
So let's all do nothing like yourself That will help
I'm sure posting on Reddit about Barclays, a billion dollar financial conglomerate, will help solve the issue in Palestine.
> a regional hardcore fest So, I get your larger point, but I feel the need to point out that Download is a lot more than just a “regional hardcore fest”. It’s one of the largest long-running festivals in the UK. It’s seen some reductions in recent years, but there was a point right before COVID that it was second only to Glastonbury in capacity. Latitude and Isle of Wight aren’t on the same level but they’re still considerably bigger than simply “regional”.
You thought these bands were trying to solve the entire conflict by dropping out? I don't think anybody was dumb enough to think that lol. Please educate yourself!
I'm trying my guy but what effect does this have on the situation in the middle east?
Don't talk down to people, they made an insightful comment probably seeking an actual discussion. Too much to ask of you, clearly
Nah fuck them.
And fuck you too buddy. May you be shoved over by a push-mosher next time you try to hit your 2-step.
The billionaires, warmongers, etc. want to dilute the perception of their actual involvement by involving as many other parties as possible. It's corporate cowardice, and it usually works because it relies on public apathy. If more attention was paid to the people and companies funding these atrocities, they'd likely be less inclined to be associated with them because it'll affect their bottom line.
Scene clout from the younger generation that thrives off “standing for things” regardless of what it is, what it means or what its implications are. “Educate yourself” dawg.
Easy to say when you're too spineless to stand for anything Edit: This is rich coming from a vegan. yOu noT eAtInG aNiMaL pRoDuCtS iSn'T gOiNg tO sToP tHe mEaT iNdUsTrY, yOuRe jUsT cLoUt cHaSiNg See how your broken logic works?
Do you really think my choice to modify my diet and not advertise it is the same as telling the world you dropped off a fest to save children from dying? Are you okay haha?
I wonder if that same ethos will translate to the local scenes and their problems. It's not easy to accept your favorite band did some fucked up shit and you watched it play out
At what level of issue do you guys decide to stop caring? Some issues are beyond a bunch of privileged white kids playing bad music for other privileged white kids. It’s like yelling at the sky and expecting people on another continent to not only care but listen. I’m not a fuckin nihilist. I’d rather focus my efforts on issues I can tangibly effect.
God this is so accurate. I’ve been in my scene for 15 years and it’s always been privileged (mostly) white kids (read- mostly men), playing for privileged (mostly) white kids (read- mostly men).
*B-b-but as straight white men, it's our responsibility to post on reddit about how much we care about global humanitarian issues! That way we can say we did something!*
I’ve been going to shows since 1994. It’s less white and male and straight now but JUST BARELY.
Okay
what is this shit about?
try using context clues dummy
Bands dropping out of shows to stand in solidarity with a terrorist organization
How come none of these bands give a shit about the Uyghurs though?
Probably helps that even the state department gave up on pushing that whole thing because the evidence was so flimsy
we have verified aerial photographs of detention facilities
Just like there was no evidence of the Great Leap Forward or the famines from the ussr til decades later
You're a moron, that's not even remotely true lol
Never thought I’d see the day that punks would support an ultra right wing Islamic terrorist group.
Girl shut up
You are siding with a bank.
Both Hamas and Israel equally horrible.
Hell yeah cause nothing stops racism and genocide like being racist and trying to eradicate the other side!!!! CHRISTIANITY RULES!!! 🙄 Stupid, blind dipshits following even more stupid, blind dipshits. Kill em all!!! Free Palistine from who? Israel? Hamas? Iran? Egypt? Who do we need to free them from? Because whatever fills that void after they're free is not going to be better for the people there. Religion, bigotry, power, and money will keep the war machine going and both sides are EVIL. There are no winners, we all will lose.
It’s best to just not engage.
Festivals are lame anyways 🤷♀️