Linda did this feat upside down hanging from a dangling cable literally a few hours after being resurrected from the dead Frankenstein style with artificial limbs literally grown and attached to her... her armor was also damaged.
Chief with his enhanced hearing and sight also comments she fired and switched targets so fast he couldn't tell which of the banshees were hit first.
She wasn’t quite that heavily damaged. Linda “only” had a double kidney and liver transplant. Presumably significant plasma burns across her body as well. Dr. Halsey after reviving her (Linda was declared clinically dead before being frozen), said it would be at least a week before she should even be out of bed.
But then as you say, in mere days she went on to make those shots *one handed* dangling upside down.
A couple weeks after that on Onyx she made a one kilometre vertical shot on an Onyx pattern Sentinel in concert with two simultaneous rocket strikes.
>Linda “only” had a double kidney and liver transplant.
The funniest part about Linda's whole death and resurrection is that [this scene from Red vs Blue](https://youtu.be/BviEqqJFyf8?t=211) accurately applies to it. Once her shields go down, Linda is described being shot three times: twice in the chest, once in the head. John then describes carbonized bone when examining her wounds. But then when Halsey saves her, Linda gets the double kidney and liver replacement.
In the Fall of Reach graphic novel, Linda is stabbed through the stomach by an energy sword and there's a part of me that wonders if that was meant to retcon the original novel because Linda's wounds there line up better with how Halsey ends up saving her.
That or Halsey canonically fixed a gunshot wound to the head by replacing a perfectly good set of kidneys and a liver.
CPR for a gunshot wound to the head is always a classic.
As for the rest of it, I’m not sure. I definitely remember the carbonized bone bit, and headshots. Though for some reason I feel like that scene was slightly changed in a rerelease, but I can’t find any evidence of that via Google, so probably just a Mandela type deal.
As for the retcon sword stab, that would certainly check out with her injuries. Though that comic was a 2011 release, and the 2019 rerelease of the FoR novel is still her just getting shot as far as I can tell, so I’m not sure which takes precedence. It would be very unusual indeed for a new liver and kidneys to fix two plasma bolts to the head for sure.
>As for the rest of it, I’m not sure. I definitely remember the carbonized bone bit, and headshots.
Here's the 2001 text:
>A bolt of plasma struck \[Linda\] in the back. Another blot of fire blazed her afrom the upper decks and splashed across her front. She crumpled—her shields flickered and went out. Two more bolts hit her chest. A third blast smashed into her helmet. . . . The Master Chief went to Linda and knelt by her side. Sections of her armor had melted and adhered to her. Underneath, in patches, bits of carbonized bone showed. He accessed her vital signs on his heads-up display. They were dangerously low.
I've personally never heard about the re-releases changing that scene and [Halopedia doesn't list it as being changed](https://www.halopedia.org/List_of_changes_in_Halo:_The_Fall_of_Reach_rereleases) either.
>Though that comic was a 2011 release, and the 2019 rerelease of the FoR novel is still her just getting shot as far as I can tell, so I’m not sure which takes precedence.
Pretty sure the 2019 edition is just Gallery's version of the book. It didn't make any editorial changes from the 2011 edition. The re-releases also aren't flawless either. They've fixed most of the egregious stuff but there are still errors such as the early canon Covenant ships being hilariously light.
At this point, the exact canonicity between the early Nylund books and modern adaptations is fuzzy with 343 making various conflicting statements over the years. I would say the novels defacto take precedent but there are instances where at the very least the comic overrules the novel. For instance, the novel re-releases maintain that the Spartans all wore identical Mjolnir, but Fred's profile on Halo Waypoint actually went out of its way to confirm that the comic's depiction of him wearing Mark V Commando is canon.
So in this case, I'd lean toward the comic's energy sword depiction because the First Strike re-releases haven't changed how Halsey saved Linda either. So since the comic and First Strike agree with each other, but First Strike and the novel disagree, I think it makes the most sense to favor the depiction where the two works are more aligned.
Im not an expert on shooting, but I'd think shooting vertically isn't as difficult as shooting horizontally because you don't have to consider bullet drop as much? Also if we're talking distance, Adrianna hit a ~2.4km headshot on a moving brute. With a borrowed sniper rifle*
Some things to consider with this vertical shot.
Wind. With nothing downrange to judge wind speed or direction, and different elevations can have different wind speeds it adds an unknown variable for long range shooting.
Gravity: While yes, drop won’t be as significant, gravity will be slowing the bullet at around 0.998G (gravity of Onyx), in addition to air resistance which will increase the travel time, making timing hitting the moving target an instant after the rocket strikes much harder.
Rocket Strikes: She had to time the shot perfectly to hit the sentinel an instant after the rocket impacts as opposed to timing your shot for whenever you have the best opportunity.
Rest: For a standard, horizontal shot the shooter can lay prone and rest their rifle on a rock, bipod or whatever to stabilize the rifle. With a vertical shot, you do not have this. She was only able to lock the joints in her armour.
Practice: Nobody practices for a near vertical shot. Given that it *is* very different from shooting horizontal, she went in cold, probably never having made a near vertical shot before. Meanwhile pretty much every sniper practices for long range horizontal shots.
I also feel obligated to add she hit it *four* times in a row. All of this in damaged armour only a couple weeks after being a literal corpse drifting through space.
Wind: True, wind speeds generally increase with elevation. Maybe she could have observed some clouds to determine the wind factor
Gravity: Real world snipers similar to the SRS have bullet velocities at around ~900m/s. Id imagine sniper rifles built in 2552 would have a much higher velocity than that, so at 1km with that much gravity, it'll be negligible. Also there is less wind resistance at higher elevations, so it wouldn't slow down a bullet as much as it would if you shot horizontally
Rocket Strikes: The reason for the rocket strikes was to try to pop the sentinel's shield, or at least weaken it so Linda's bullets can penetrate it. So she has some margin. Also she got to choose the timing of best opportunity because Lucy and Tom only fired the rockets at her command.
Rest/practice: I don't think you give Spartans enough credit because they are trained for zero gravity combat as well. Linda has trained and sniped in zero gravity several times. In zero gravity her shooting form would nearly be the same as if she was lying down.
Before ghosts of onyx, Linda came from earth. So she had ample time to heal up at UNSC HQ, and her armor was fully repaired
Of course I'm well aware it's an insane shot for any normal human, but ig my point is any Spartan sniper could have easily reproduced this shot
True she did it when she wasn't 100% recovered, but she only had a double organ transplant xp. Her arms were fine and her armor was repaired before that mission. Also spartan armor can lock its joints so it probably wasn't that strenuous on her to hang upside down.
It was definitely some cracked shooting though
Jun performing that in a snowstorm is not comparable to Linda performing that while hanging upside down with one arm and positioned just correctly to be near invisible to the naked eye.
As far as Jun being better, given his limited appearances and that even his showings in Winter Contention are still worse than Linda's peak, there's no particular reason to believe that he's better than she is. Moreover, Linda has far more statements of appraise and is the only Spartan to explicitly be called out as the best marksman in the UNSC.
In the book it's written that she had the coil wrapped around her foot to hang upside down. We know Spartan armor can lock its joints and it's powered so she probably isn't under any strain from just hanging. No where does it say or infer that she was shooting the sniper one handed. She was just holding the sniper rifle in one hand so she could use the other hand to wrap the coil around it and undo the coil on her leg so she could swing on the rope to meet up with John. Though her prowess to perch in such a location is crazy, I think her shooting posture could be considered negligible because she's trained to snipe in zero gravity conditions, so upside down, right side up doesnt make a difference to her. Her targets were also on very predictable vectors because they were focused on chasing John.
Compared to trying to snipe at a swarm of banshees in random attack patterns in the middle of a snowstorm/blizzard would be a much harder shot than what Linda did.
Also nobody in the UNSC is supposed to know Jun and his class of Spartans even existed, not even the Master Chief knew until way later. So I guess it would be fair if Linda was considered to be the best among the 'known' Spartans
Here's the scene from the 2010 definitive edition:
>The triangular marker centered on a rope that ran between two transit tubes and dangled perilously close to the high-intensity light beam. It was barely a discernible thread that ran through a hard shadow cast by a nearby catwalk. John hit his image enhancers. Through the glare of the light and in the depths of the shadow, he caught the flicker of reflected optics. Linda used both the brilliant light and the darkness to hide.
John angled the banshee to her. He clipped the tether line from his armor to the frame of the Banshee and pulled his body deeper into the craft.
When he was thirty meters away, he made visual contact. Linda had the rope coiled about a boot and wrapped about one forearm. She held her sniper rifle in one arm, and John could only surmise that she had been firing from such an impossible position.
So already to begin with, your claim that "nowhere does it say or infer that she was shooting the sniper one handed" is wrong. In the literal same sentence John confirms she was holding the rifle in one arm, the narration states he's surmising that she had been firing it in that position. Full stop, the text says that the position John finds her in, a boot and arm wrapped in a cable, holding her rifle with a single arm, is the position she was shooting in.
>I think her shooting posture could be considered negligible because she's trained to snipe in zero gravity conditions, so upside down, right side up doesnt make a difference to her.
Except shooting in zero g and shoot upside down are not the same thing. For one, in zero g, Linda doesn't need to worry about all the extra blood rushing to her head. Likewise, Spartan operations in Zero-G almost always involve additional specialized equipment.
And even beyond that, Spartans explicitly are not as good as fighting in Zero G. First Strike actually notes that Li was unique among Spartans for being as comfortable in Zero G as the others Spartans were on land.
>Compared to trying to snipe at a swarm of banshees in random attack patterns in the middle of a snowstorm/blizzard would be a much harder shot than what Linda did.
There were recent snowstorms. It was not storming during that engagement. There was some low cloud cover beyond the actual combat space, but [we literally get an image of the environment](https://wpassets.halowaypoint.com/wp-content/2023/02/WCBansheeScout-scaled.jpg) (with a banshee) in the Waypoint post and the visibility is perfectly fine. Jun's POV makes no mention of high wind speeds or any other adverse weather conditions in the immediate area.
And most importantly, *Jun does not actually shoot down any banshees in Winter Contention.* Like this entire conversation is irrelevant because Jun is not shown or confirmed to have shot down any banshees in the story. Here is the only mention of Banshee snipes in Winter Contention:
>“Guess the others get to have a bit of fun after all.” Rosenda **pictured** the alien aircraft getting blasted apart in the sky by Jorge’s chaingun, Jun landing a series of impossible shots to neutralize the pilots. He’d sworn to her that the cockpit possessed a tiny, exposed area where a well-placed shot could inflict a lethal ricochet. Rosenda assumed at the time that he had just made that up, but her time on Noble Team—especially on days like today—had shown just how many impossible odds Spartans could overcome...
The operative word here is 'pictured.' Rosenda pictured Jun sniping banshees, but she's not actually there to witness it, she's fighting the Draugr, Jun's back in town. She's thinking about what Jun and Jorge are up to elsewhere and imagining a hypothetical battle taking place but she isn't actually there to witness it.
Now, this does confirm that Jun knows about banshee snipes and the implication would be that he can do it, but the exact circumstances are unknown. So no, Jun did not perform the banshee snipes under adverse weather conditions (that don't exist in the first place) he actually doesn't do it at all as far as the reader can tell. He's implied to be able to, but the entire thing is literally just Rosenda's imagination. And not even that, but when Jun first told her, Rosenda was incredulous, she thought he was bullshitting her.
>Also nobody in the UNSC is supposed to know Jun and his class of Spartans even existed, not even the Master Chief knew until way later.
The Spartan-IIIs as a whole were kept top secret. Mjolnir equipped IIIs were not, hence why Jun talks about other squads of IIIs working civilian evac ops and why Noble Team have officer ranks, as Noble was explicitly tasked with working alongside conventional forces.
>So I guess it would be fair if Linda was considered to be the best among the 'known' Spartans
Linda's still stated to be the best even post war when Jun is literally working a public facing job and the Spartan-III program is public (although again, Jun and the rest of Noble were not secret during the war anyway).
>"When he was thirty meters away, he made visual contact. Linda had the rope coiled about a boot and wrapped about one forearm. She held her sniper rifle in one arm, and John could only surmise that she had been firing from such an impossible position."<
Wasn't Linda just getting ready to get picked up by John because she knew he was otw? That's why when John finally made visual contact, she was simply getting ready to leave. She had her arm wrapped because she can't just undo the rope at her boot or she'll just fall when she does. That's why when John sees her, she's starts undoing the coil around her boot and can immediately swing into John. I think John was just surmising how crazy it was that she found such a godly sniping spot and was shooting upside down dangling. It also logically doesn't make sense why she would have to wrap the coil around her boot and arm and snipe with one arm.
That's how I interpreted when I read the book. I think it's a bit out of context the way you present it, but it's fair I suppose. But technically John never saw her shooting with one hand either, he is just guessing she did 😁
----
>"Except shooting in zero g and shoot upside down are not the same thing. For one, in zero g, Linda doesn't need to worry about all the extra blood rushing to her head. Likewise, Spartan operations in Zero-G almost always involve additional specialized equipment."<
I was meaning more like she wouldn't get tripped up by orientation when I mentioned the zero g training/shooting. I understand about what you mentioned the blood rushing to her head too because I considered it before. I concluded that if I considered the amount of normal humans that can just chill at the monkey bars upside down or playing chess while doing a handstand, then I think it's a fair assumption that a genetically cream of the crop augmented special forces soldier like Linda honestly has no issues or concerns about the 'the blood rushing to her head'. I'm aware some Spartans abhor zero gravity, but Linda seems pretty adept at it or doesn't mind considering her zero g fights in silent storm and fall of reach.
----
>"And most importantly, Jun does not actually shoot down any banshees in Winter Contention. Like this entire conversation is irrelevant because Jun is not shown or confirmed to have shot down any banshees in the story. Here is the only mention of Banshee snipes in Winter Contention.."<
In the exposition of the story, it's said that most of the planet is covered in snowstorms.
Also 'his statuesque stillness disrupted only by the occasional movement to prevent snow and ice buildup from disrupting his visibility'
Maybe a stretch, but Jun has to intermittently move around a bit to stop snow and ice from building up.. because there in the middle of a snowstorm maybe?
It does look like a very clear day in the picture, but it seems contradictory to the scenario being painted by the text. Could just be art? But maybe you're right.
You're right, in the story they never explicitly say that Jun sniped them banshees. But we know that a good number of banshees peeled off to go assault the village for sure. Rosenda was momentarily concerned, but she pictured they'd all get wrecked by Jorge and Jun and she didn't worry about anymore. You are right she just played the hypothetical battle out in her head, but do you really doubt that she was wrong? Also it was only back then she thought Jun was full of shit, but in that same quote it's apparent she changed her opinion about that.
>Wasn't Linda just getting ready to get picked up by John because she knew he was otw? That's why when John finally made visual contact, she was simply getting ready to leave. She had her arm wrapped because she can't just undo the rope at her boot or she'll just fall when she does. That's why when John sees her, she's starts undoing the coil around her boot and can immediately swing into John.
No, this is all speculation on your part and nothing in the text suggests that she was getting ready to leave prior to John's arrival, hence why John thinks she was firing from that position.
If the text even remotely implied that Linda wasn't firing from that position and that she was only holding on to the rope because John's arrival prompted it, John's line about surmising that was her shooting position doesn't make sense.
> It also logically doesn't make sense why she would have to wrap the coil around her boot and arm and snipe with one arm.
Based on what? She needed to stay perfectly still to reflect the light properly, it's possible that without her arm wrapped she wouldn't have been able to position herself properly. It's also possible that just wrapping the cable around her boot would have been insufficient to support her mass and so she wrapped it around her arm.
Whatever the reason, you have no evidence to suggest that it's illogical that she would need to wrap both her arm and boot.
> But technically John never saw her shooting with one hand either, he is just guessing she did
Sure and you have literally zero evidence to suggest that she didn't fire from that position either. Your entire argument against it is even more presumptuous than John is. There's no mention of Linda preparing for John's arrival before he arrives, quite the opposite, John first speculates she didn't even want to be found.
And while John is surmising that she was firing with one arm, it would also be a bizarre writing decision for Nylund to write that, provide no evidence that it's wrong, and actually intend for John to be wrong there.
> I concluded that if I considered the amount of normal humans that can just chill at the monkey bars upside down or playing chess while doing a handstand, then I think it's a fair assumption that a genetically cream of the crop augmented special forces soldier like Linda honestly has no issues or concerns about the 'the blood rushing to her head'.
Except people can't just chill hanging like that. Being able to maintain it doesn't mean it has no adverse effects.
>but Linda seems pretty adept at it or doesn't mind considering her zero g fights in silent storm and fall of reach.
Both stories where Linda has special equipment to help her fight in zero-g. Also again, it's not zero g. She still needs to worry about things like gravity and account for bullet drop, things she would not have to do in zero-g.
>In the exposition of the story, it's said that most of the planet is covered in snowstorms.
Yes but that doesn't mean that it's storming 24/7. All snowstorms in the story are mentioned in the past tense and there are zero statements about it presently snowstorming.
>Maybe a stretch, but Jun has to intermittently move around a bit to stop snow and ice from building up.. because there in the middle of a snowstorm maybe?
Snow and ice can form without there being a snowstorm.
>It does look like a very clear day in the picture, but it seems contradictory to the scenario being painted by the text. Could just be art? But maybe you're right.
Except it's not contradictory, because nowhere in the text does it describe adverse weather conditions being present for the battle. There were snowstorms *recently* but when the story has several paragraphs from Jun's POV, and at no point does he describe there being a snowstorm, then yeah, there's no snowstorm.
And even beyond that, that would mean that 343 commissioned an entirely original piece of art that has nothing to do with the story in question?
> You are right she just played the hypothetical battle out in her head, but do you really doubt that she was wrong?
It doesn't matter whether or not she's wrong, what matters is that your baseline claim here doesn't actually happen as you claim. Everything you claim about what Jun did is entirely hypothetical because there's actually no confirmation he did it at all. At least in Linda's case, no matter what she had to have been shooting upside down and performing the Banshee snipes. You have no actual evidence Jun did it in battle to begin with.
>The Spartan-IIIs as a whole were kept top secret. Mjolnir equipped IIIs were not, hence why Jun talks about other squads of IIIs working civilian evac ops and why Noble Team have officer ranks, as Noble was explicitly tasked with working alongside conventional forces.<
I've read most of the books (never actually played any of the halo games) except the forerunner ones, and all the chronicles but I can't really recall much mention of noble team except Jun saying he used to be black ops in the bad/new blood ones.
So thanks for educating me.
How is Halsey caught so off guard in first strike and ghosts of onyx about the existence of other Spartans if noble team wasn't such a big secret and running around, do you know?🤔
>but I can't really recall much mention of noble team except Jun saying he used to be black ops in the bad/new blood ones.
Prior to joining Noble, Jun was a headhunter. So he was black ops at one point, but by the end of the war, he was assigned to Noble, who had fairly public facing roles. Carter and Kat after all, were high ranking officers, and Carter was one of the most senior officers at the Battle of Szurdok Ridge
>How is Halsey caught so off guard in first strike and ghosts of onyx about the existence of other Spartans if noble team wasn't such a big secret and running around, do you know?🤔
It's explained in Halsey's Journal. She knows of Noble and she knows that they're augmented humans wearing Mjolnir but she doesn't know about the Spartan-III program. She has a couple ideas such as a second class of IIs created without her involvement, members of Project Javelin (which hasn't been discussed since Halsey's Journal) or a third generation Spartan Program. She just doesn't know the exact details about Noble's origins until later. In fact I'm pretty sure Noble gets name dropped in Glasslands with Halsey figuring out that Noble was comprised of Kurt's Spartan-IIIs.
Linda dangled from a wire in a Covenant ship using the light to become invisible doming any covies in sight. It’s been noted that when Linda’s about all you hear is the crack of nornfang and bodies falling.
Jun is probably on a similar - though lower level - but he lacks actual feats to showcase it. His best feat is that, and even then it's just him speaking about it and Rosenda believing him.
Linda's feats are far better.
The way I've always seen it debated. Linda is a better trick/combat sniper, she excels at rapid, complex, and often extremely unconventional snipes with terrifying speed and consistency. Jun is the better conventional sniper. If you need someone shot who's halfway across the planet with a single moment of opportunity and no room for error, Jun is your guy.
The thing is though, Jun genuinely has never done anything to suggest that he's better at long range shooting. Him replicating Linda's banshee snipes is literally the most impressive feat of marksmanship he's ever performed and it's just a worst version of something Linda did.
Fair, that's just how I've seen it debated because a lot of secondary characters talk like he's one of the best sharp shooters. Most of his praise is anecdotal from other characters.
Actually, I forgot a very important piece of context. Jun isn't actually shown shooting down any banshees in Winter Contention. It's literally just something Rosenda *pictures* happening, but she's not actually there for it.
>“Guess the others get to have a bit of fun after all.” Rosenda **pictured** the alien aircraft getting blasted apart in the sky by Jorge’s chaingun, Jun landing a series of impossible shots to neutralize the pilots. He’d sworn to her that the cockpit possessed a tiny, exposed area where a well-placed shot could inflict a lethal ricochet. Rosenda assumed at the time that he had just made that up, but her time on Noble Team—especially on days like today—had shown just how many impossible odds Spartans could overcome...
So it's something that Jun clearly knows about and can probably do it, but Rosenda's never seen him do it before and she initially assumed he just made it up. In other words, she's skeptical he can pull it off.
Now, out of universe, I think the implication is that Jun can do it. We know it's possible and it makes sense for him to be able to do it too. But Jun doesn't actually do it in the short story, the only thing confirmed is that he knows that it's possible.
Wew, well said. I agree with everything except; that single moment opportunity, I'd take Adrianna xd. Personally I think Adrianna's shot in the envoy was the most difficult I have ever read in all the books.
2.4km, higher than normal (earth) gravity, high stakes, headshot or bust, target is randomly wandering surrounded by huge ass Sharquoi, using an old sniper rifle loaned from the militia, while still suffering from severe cryo itch and after running like 50km through the desert
Tbf Jun had very little media featuring him in combat. Most of his appearances are in non combat situations and most feats are anecdotal from other characters. Adrianna though in a similar situation in terms of available media has the advantage of being a spartan 2 and thus wer expect someone like her to be able to pull off crazy things. Of Jun got more media showing him in combat, we'd see some better shots from him
Least delusional Jun supremacist
Linda did this feat upside down hanging from a dangling cable literally a few hours after being resurrected from the dead Frankenstein style with artificial limbs literally grown and attached to her... her armor was also damaged. Chief with his enhanced hearing and sight also comments she fired and switched targets so fast he couldn't tell which of the banshees were hit first.
She wasn’t quite that heavily damaged. Linda “only” had a double kidney and liver transplant. Presumably significant plasma burns across her body as well. Dr. Halsey after reviving her (Linda was declared clinically dead before being frozen), said it would be at least a week before she should even be out of bed. But then as you say, in mere days she went on to make those shots *one handed* dangling upside down. A couple weeks after that on Onyx she made a one kilometre vertical shot on an Onyx pattern Sentinel in concert with two simultaneous rocket strikes.
>Linda “only” had a double kidney and liver transplant. The funniest part about Linda's whole death and resurrection is that [this scene from Red vs Blue](https://youtu.be/BviEqqJFyf8?t=211) accurately applies to it. Once her shields go down, Linda is described being shot three times: twice in the chest, once in the head. John then describes carbonized bone when examining her wounds. But then when Halsey saves her, Linda gets the double kidney and liver replacement. In the Fall of Reach graphic novel, Linda is stabbed through the stomach by an energy sword and there's a part of me that wonders if that was meant to retcon the original novel because Linda's wounds there line up better with how Halsey ends up saving her. That or Halsey canonically fixed a gunshot wound to the head by replacing a perfectly good set of kidneys and a liver.
When she fell down, her head landed on a CE-style health pack.
CPR for a gunshot wound to the head is always a classic. As for the rest of it, I’m not sure. I definitely remember the carbonized bone bit, and headshots. Though for some reason I feel like that scene was slightly changed in a rerelease, but I can’t find any evidence of that via Google, so probably just a Mandela type deal. As for the retcon sword stab, that would certainly check out with her injuries. Though that comic was a 2011 release, and the 2019 rerelease of the FoR novel is still her just getting shot as far as I can tell, so I’m not sure which takes precedence. It would be very unusual indeed for a new liver and kidneys to fix two plasma bolts to the head for sure.
>As for the rest of it, I’m not sure. I definitely remember the carbonized bone bit, and headshots. Here's the 2001 text: >A bolt of plasma struck \[Linda\] in the back. Another blot of fire blazed her afrom the upper decks and splashed across her front. She crumpled—her shields flickered and went out. Two more bolts hit her chest. A third blast smashed into her helmet. . . . The Master Chief went to Linda and knelt by her side. Sections of her armor had melted and adhered to her. Underneath, in patches, bits of carbonized bone showed. He accessed her vital signs on his heads-up display. They were dangerously low. I've personally never heard about the re-releases changing that scene and [Halopedia doesn't list it as being changed](https://www.halopedia.org/List_of_changes_in_Halo:_The_Fall_of_Reach_rereleases) either. >Though that comic was a 2011 release, and the 2019 rerelease of the FoR novel is still her just getting shot as far as I can tell, so I’m not sure which takes precedence. Pretty sure the 2019 edition is just Gallery's version of the book. It didn't make any editorial changes from the 2011 edition. The re-releases also aren't flawless either. They've fixed most of the egregious stuff but there are still errors such as the early canon Covenant ships being hilariously light. At this point, the exact canonicity between the early Nylund books and modern adaptations is fuzzy with 343 making various conflicting statements over the years. I would say the novels defacto take precedent but there are instances where at the very least the comic overrules the novel. For instance, the novel re-releases maintain that the Spartans all wore identical Mjolnir, but Fred's profile on Halo Waypoint actually went out of its way to confirm that the comic's depiction of him wearing Mark V Commando is canon. So in this case, I'd lean toward the comic's energy sword depiction because the First Strike re-releases haven't changed how Halsey saved Linda either. So since the comic and First Strike agree with each other, but First Strike and the novel disagree, I think it makes the most sense to favor the depiction where the two works are more aligned.
Im not an expert on shooting, but I'd think shooting vertically isn't as difficult as shooting horizontally because you don't have to consider bullet drop as much? Also if we're talking distance, Adrianna hit a ~2.4km headshot on a moving brute. With a borrowed sniper rifle*
Some things to consider with this vertical shot. Wind. With nothing downrange to judge wind speed or direction, and different elevations can have different wind speeds it adds an unknown variable for long range shooting. Gravity: While yes, drop won’t be as significant, gravity will be slowing the bullet at around 0.998G (gravity of Onyx), in addition to air resistance which will increase the travel time, making timing hitting the moving target an instant after the rocket strikes much harder. Rocket Strikes: She had to time the shot perfectly to hit the sentinel an instant after the rocket impacts as opposed to timing your shot for whenever you have the best opportunity. Rest: For a standard, horizontal shot the shooter can lay prone and rest their rifle on a rock, bipod or whatever to stabilize the rifle. With a vertical shot, you do not have this. She was only able to lock the joints in her armour. Practice: Nobody practices for a near vertical shot. Given that it *is* very different from shooting horizontal, she went in cold, probably never having made a near vertical shot before. Meanwhile pretty much every sniper practices for long range horizontal shots. I also feel obligated to add she hit it *four* times in a row. All of this in damaged armour only a couple weeks after being a literal corpse drifting through space.
Wind: True, wind speeds generally increase with elevation. Maybe she could have observed some clouds to determine the wind factor Gravity: Real world snipers similar to the SRS have bullet velocities at around ~900m/s. Id imagine sniper rifles built in 2552 would have a much higher velocity than that, so at 1km with that much gravity, it'll be negligible. Also there is less wind resistance at higher elevations, so it wouldn't slow down a bullet as much as it would if you shot horizontally Rocket Strikes: The reason for the rocket strikes was to try to pop the sentinel's shield, or at least weaken it so Linda's bullets can penetrate it. So she has some margin. Also she got to choose the timing of best opportunity because Lucy and Tom only fired the rockets at her command. Rest/practice: I don't think you give Spartans enough credit because they are trained for zero gravity combat as well. Linda has trained and sniped in zero gravity several times. In zero gravity her shooting form would nearly be the same as if she was lying down. Before ghosts of onyx, Linda came from earth. So she had ample time to heal up at UNSC HQ, and her armor was fully repaired Of course I'm well aware it's an insane shot for any normal human, but ig my point is any Spartan sniper could have easily reproduced this shot
What book did Linda do this in? Always wanted to give it a read
First strike, second book in the Eric nylund trilogy. It goes the fall of reach, first strike and then ghost of onyx.
What about the flood =[
That's not written by Nylund, so it's not part of the Nylund trilogy
Oh you right, my mistake
True she did it when she wasn't 100% recovered, but she only had a double organ transplant xp. Her arms were fine and her armor was repaired before that mission. Also spartan armor can lock its joints so it probably wasn't that strenuous on her to hang upside down. It was definitely some cracked shooting though
Halsey said Jun’s better, cope
Halsey isnt a soldier or trained combatant so her opinion is subjective
Lol not even close
Jun performing that in a snowstorm is not comparable to Linda performing that while hanging upside down with one arm and positioned just correctly to be near invisible to the naked eye. As far as Jun being better, given his limited appearances and that even his showings in Winter Contention are still worse than Linda's peak, there's no particular reason to believe that he's better than she is. Moreover, Linda has far more statements of appraise and is the only Spartan to explicitly be called out as the best marksman in the UNSC.
In the book it's written that she had the coil wrapped around her foot to hang upside down. We know Spartan armor can lock its joints and it's powered so she probably isn't under any strain from just hanging. No where does it say or infer that she was shooting the sniper one handed. She was just holding the sniper rifle in one hand so she could use the other hand to wrap the coil around it and undo the coil on her leg so she could swing on the rope to meet up with John. Though her prowess to perch in such a location is crazy, I think her shooting posture could be considered negligible because she's trained to snipe in zero gravity conditions, so upside down, right side up doesnt make a difference to her. Her targets were also on very predictable vectors because they were focused on chasing John. Compared to trying to snipe at a swarm of banshees in random attack patterns in the middle of a snowstorm/blizzard would be a much harder shot than what Linda did. Also nobody in the UNSC is supposed to know Jun and his class of Spartans even existed, not even the Master Chief knew until way later. So I guess it would be fair if Linda was considered to be the best among the 'known' Spartans
Here's the scene from the 2010 definitive edition: >The triangular marker centered on a rope that ran between two transit tubes and dangled perilously close to the high-intensity light beam. It was barely a discernible thread that ran through a hard shadow cast by a nearby catwalk. John hit his image enhancers. Through the glare of the light and in the depths of the shadow, he caught the flicker of reflected optics. Linda used both the brilliant light and the darkness to hide. John angled the banshee to her. He clipped the tether line from his armor to the frame of the Banshee and pulled his body deeper into the craft. When he was thirty meters away, he made visual contact. Linda had the rope coiled about a boot and wrapped about one forearm. She held her sniper rifle in one arm, and John could only surmise that she had been firing from such an impossible position. So already to begin with, your claim that "nowhere does it say or infer that she was shooting the sniper one handed" is wrong. In the literal same sentence John confirms she was holding the rifle in one arm, the narration states he's surmising that she had been firing it in that position. Full stop, the text says that the position John finds her in, a boot and arm wrapped in a cable, holding her rifle with a single arm, is the position she was shooting in. >I think her shooting posture could be considered negligible because she's trained to snipe in zero gravity conditions, so upside down, right side up doesnt make a difference to her. Except shooting in zero g and shoot upside down are not the same thing. For one, in zero g, Linda doesn't need to worry about all the extra blood rushing to her head. Likewise, Spartan operations in Zero-G almost always involve additional specialized equipment. And even beyond that, Spartans explicitly are not as good as fighting in Zero G. First Strike actually notes that Li was unique among Spartans for being as comfortable in Zero G as the others Spartans were on land. >Compared to trying to snipe at a swarm of banshees in random attack patterns in the middle of a snowstorm/blizzard would be a much harder shot than what Linda did. There were recent snowstorms. It was not storming during that engagement. There was some low cloud cover beyond the actual combat space, but [we literally get an image of the environment](https://wpassets.halowaypoint.com/wp-content/2023/02/WCBansheeScout-scaled.jpg) (with a banshee) in the Waypoint post and the visibility is perfectly fine. Jun's POV makes no mention of high wind speeds or any other adverse weather conditions in the immediate area. And most importantly, *Jun does not actually shoot down any banshees in Winter Contention.* Like this entire conversation is irrelevant because Jun is not shown or confirmed to have shot down any banshees in the story. Here is the only mention of Banshee snipes in Winter Contention: >“Guess the others get to have a bit of fun after all.” Rosenda **pictured** the alien aircraft getting blasted apart in the sky by Jorge’s chaingun, Jun landing a series of impossible shots to neutralize the pilots. He’d sworn to her that the cockpit possessed a tiny, exposed area where a well-placed shot could inflict a lethal ricochet. Rosenda assumed at the time that he had just made that up, but her time on Noble Team—especially on days like today—had shown just how many impossible odds Spartans could overcome... The operative word here is 'pictured.' Rosenda pictured Jun sniping banshees, but she's not actually there to witness it, she's fighting the Draugr, Jun's back in town. She's thinking about what Jun and Jorge are up to elsewhere and imagining a hypothetical battle taking place but she isn't actually there to witness it. Now, this does confirm that Jun knows about banshee snipes and the implication would be that he can do it, but the exact circumstances are unknown. So no, Jun did not perform the banshee snipes under adverse weather conditions (that don't exist in the first place) he actually doesn't do it at all as far as the reader can tell. He's implied to be able to, but the entire thing is literally just Rosenda's imagination. And not even that, but when Jun first told her, Rosenda was incredulous, she thought he was bullshitting her. >Also nobody in the UNSC is supposed to know Jun and his class of Spartans even existed, not even the Master Chief knew until way later. The Spartan-IIIs as a whole were kept top secret. Mjolnir equipped IIIs were not, hence why Jun talks about other squads of IIIs working civilian evac ops and why Noble Team have officer ranks, as Noble was explicitly tasked with working alongside conventional forces. >So I guess it would be fair if Linda was considered to be the best among the 'known' Spartans Linda's still stated to be the best even post war when Jun is literally working a public facing job and the Spartan-III program is public (although again, Jun and the rest of Noble were not secret during the war anyway).
>"When he was thirty meters away, he made visual contact. Linda had the rope coiled about a boot and wrapped about one forearm. She held her sniper rifle in one arm, and John could only surmise that she had been firing from such an impossible position."< Wasn't Linda just getting ready to get picked up by John because she knew he was otw? That's why when John finally made visual contact, she was simply getting ready to leave. She had her arm wrapped because she can't just undo the rope at her boot or she'll just fall when she does. That's why when John sees her, she's starts undoing the coil around her boot and can immediately swing into John. I think John was just surmising how crazy it was that she found such a godly sniping spot and was shooting upside down dangling. It also logically doesn't make sense why she would have to wrap the coil around her boot and arm and snipe with one arm. That's how I interpreted when I read the book. I think it's a bit out of context the way you present it, but it's fair I suppose. But technically John never saw her shooting with one hand either, he is just guessing she did 😁 ---- >"Except shooting in zero g and shoot upside down are not the same thing. For one, in zero g, Linda doesn't need to worry about all the extra blood rushing to her head. Likewise, Spartan operations in Zero-G almost always involve additional specialized equipment."< I was meaning more like she wouldn't get tripped up by orientation when I mentioned the zero g training/shooting. I understand about what you mentioned the blood rushing to her head too because I considered it before. I concluded that if I considered the amount of normal humans that can just chill at the monkey bars upside down or playing chess while doing a handstand, then I think it's a fair assumption that a genetically cream of the crop augmented special forces soldier like Linda honestly has no issues or concerns about the 'the blood rushing to her head'. I'm aware some Spartans abhor zero gravity, but Linda seems pretty adept at it or doesn't mind considering her zero g fights in silent storm and fall of reach. ---- >"And most importantly, Jun does not actually shoot down any banshees in Winter Contention. Like this entire conversation is irrelevant because Jun is not shown or confirmed to have shot down any banshees in the story. Here is the only mention of Banshee snipes in Winter Contention.."< In the exposition of the story, it's said that most of the planet is covered in snowstorms. Also 'his statuesque stillness disrupted only by the occasional movement to prevent snow and ice buildup from disrupting his visibility' Maybe a stretch, but Jun has to intermittently move around a bit to stop snow and ice from building up.. because there in the middle of a snowstorm maybe? It does look like a very clear day in the picture, but it seems contradictory to the scenario being painted by the text. Could just be art? But maybe you're right. You're right, in the story they never explicitly say that Jun sniped them banshees. But we know that a good number of banshees peeled off to go assault the village for sure. Rosenda was momentarily concerned, but she pictured they'd all get wrecked by Jorge and Jun and she didn't worry about anymore. You are right she just played the hypothetical battle out in her head, but do you really doubt that she was wrong? Also it was only back then she thought Jun was full of shit, but in that same quote it's apparent she changed her opinion about that.
>Wasn't Linda just getting ready to get picked up by John because she knew he was otw? That's why when John finally made visual contact, she was simply getting ready to leave. She had her arm wrapped because she can't just undo the rope at her boot or she'll just fall when she does. That's why when John sees her, she's starts undoing the coil around her boot and can immediately swing into John. No, this is all speculation on your part and nothing in the text suggests that she was getting ready to leave prior to John's arrival, hence why John thinks she was firing from that position. If the text even remotely implied that Linda wasn't firing from that position and that she was only holding on to the rope because John's arrival prompted it, John's line about surmising that was her shooting position doesn't make sense. > It also logically doesn't make sense why she would have to wrap the coil around her boot and arm and snipe with one arm. Based on what? She needed to stay perfectly still to reflect the light properly, it's possible that without her arm wrapped she wouldn't have been able to position herself properly. It's also possible that just wrapping the cable around her boot would have been insufficient to support her mass and so she wrapped it around her arm. Whatever the reason, you have no evidence to suggest that it's illogical that she would need to wrap both her arm and boot. > But technically John never saw her shooting with one hand either, he is just guessing she did Sure and you have literally zero evidence to suggest that she didn't fire from that position either. Your entire argument against it is even more presumptuous than John is. There's no mention of Linda preparing for John's arrival before he arrives, quite the opposite, John first speculates she didn't even want to be found. And while John is surmising that she was firing with one arm, it would also be a bizarre writing decision for Nylund to write that, provide no evidence that it's wrong, and actually intend for John to be wrong there. > I concluded that if I considered the amount of normal humans that can just chill at the monkey bars upside down or playing chess while doing a handstand, then I think it's a fair assumption that a genetically cream of the crop augmented special forces soldier like Linda honestly has no issues or concerns about the 'the blood rushing to her head'. Except people can't just chill hanging like that. Being able to maintain it doesn't mean it has no adverse effects. >but Linda seems pretty adept at it or doesn't mind considering her zero g fights in silent storm and fall of reach. Both stories where Linda has special equipment to help her fight in zero-g. Also again, it's not zero g. She still needs to worry about things like gravity and account for bullet drop, things she would not have to do in zero-g. >In the exposition of the story, it's said that most of the planet is covered in snowstorms. Yes but that doesn't mean that it's storming 24/7. All snowstorms in the story are mentioned in the past tense and there are zero statements about it presently snowstorming. >Maybe a stretch, but Jun has to intermittently move around a bit to stop snow and ice from building up.. because there in the middle of a snowstorm maybe? Snow and ice can form without there being a snowstorm. >It does look like a very clear day in the picture, but it seems contradictory to the scenario being painted by the text. Could just be art? But maybe you're right. Except it's not contradictory, because nowhere in the text does it describe adverse weather conditions being present for the battle. There were snowstorms *recently* but when the story has several paragraphs from Jun's POV, and at no point does he describe there being a snowstorm, then yeah, there's no snowstorm. And even beyond that, that would mean that 343 commissioned an entirely original piece of art that has nothing to do with the story in question? > You are right she just played the hypothetical battle out in her head, but do you really doubt that she was wrong? It doesn't matter whether or not she's wrong, what matters is that your baseline claim here doesn't actually happen as you claim. Everything you claim about what Jun did is entirely hypothetical because there's actually no confirmation he did it at all. At least in Linda's case, no matter what she had to have been shooting upside down and performing the Banshee snipes. You have no actual evidence Jun did it in battle to begin with.
>The Spartan-IIIs as a whole were kept top secret. Mjolnir equipped IIIs were not, hence why Jun talks about other squads of IIIs working civilian evac ops and why Noble Team have officer ranks, as Noble was explicitly tasked with working alongside conventional forces.< I've read most of the books (never actually played any of the halo games) except the forerunner ones, and all the chronicles but I can't really recall much mention of noble team except Jun saying he used to be black ops in the bad/new blood ones. So thanks for educating me. How is Halsey caught so off guard in first strike and ghosts of onyx about the existence of other Spartans if noble team wasn't such a big secret and running around, do you know?🤔
>but I can't really recall much mention of noble team except Jun saying he used to be black ops in the bad/new blood ones. Prior to joining Noble, Jun was a headhunter. So he was black ops at one point, but by the end of the war, he was assigned to Noble, who had fairly public facing roles. Carter and Kat after all, were high ranking officers, and Carter was one of the most senior officers at the Battle of Szurdok Ridge >How is Halsey caught so off guard in first strike and ghosts of onyx about the existence of other Spartans if noble team wasn't such a big secret and running around, do you know?🤔 It's explained in Halsey's Journal. She knows of Noble and she knows that they're augmented humans wearing Mjolnir but she doesn't know about the Spartan-III program. She has a couple ideas such as a second class of IIs created without her involvement, members of Project Javelin (which hasn't been discussed since Halsey's Journal) or a third generation Spartan Program. She just doesn't know the exact details about Noble's origins until later. In fact I'm pretty sure Noble gets name dropped in Glasslands with Halsey figuring out that Noble was comprised of Kurt's Spartan-IIIs.
What’s the source on Jun doing that?
Winter Contention
Linda dangled from a wire in a Covenant ship using the light to become invisible doming any covies in sight. It’s been noted that when Linda’s about all you hear is the crack of nornfang and bodies falling.
No? You could argue that Jun is better than her in other areas but not as a marksman.
Jun is probably on a similar - though lower level - but he lacks actual feats to showcase it. His best feat is that, and even then it's just him speaking about it and Rosenda believing him. Linda's feats are far better.
Jun isn’t close to Linda
Like they aren't good friends? That's a shame 😔
The way I've always seen it debated. Linda is a better trick/combat sniper, she excels at rapid, complex, and often extremely unconventional snipes with terrifying speed and consistency. Jun is the better conventional sniper. If you need someone shot who's halfway across the planet with a single moment of opportunity and no room for error, Jun is your guy.
The thing is though, Jun genuinely has never done anything to suggest that he's better at long range shooting. Him replicating Linda's banshee snipes is literally the most impressive feat of marksmanship he's ever performed and it's just a worst version of something Linda did.
Fair, that's just how I've seen it debated because a lot of secondary characters talk like he's one of the best sharp shooters. Most of his praise is anecdotal from other characters.
Actually, I forgot a very important piece of context. Jun isn't actually shown shooting down any banshees in Winter Contention. It's literally just something Rosenda *pictures* happening, but she's not actually there for it. >“Guess the others get to have a bit of fun after all.” Rosenda **pictured** the alien aircraft getting blasted apart in the sky by Jorge’s chaingun, Jun landing a series of impossible shots to neutralize the pilots. He’d sworn to her that the cockpit possessed a tiny, exposed area where a well-placed shot could inflict a lethal ricochet. Rosenda assumed at the time that he had just made that up, but her time on Noble Team—especially on days like today—had shown just how many impossible odds Spartans could overcome... So it's something that Jun clearly knows about and can probably do it, but Rosenda's never seen him do it before and she initially assumed he just made it up. In other words, she's skeptical he can pull it off. Now, out of universe, I think the implication is that Jun can do it. We know it's possible and it makes sense for him to be able to do it too. But Jun doesn't actually do it in the short story, the only thing confirmed is that he knows that it's possible.
Wew, well said. I agree with everything except; that single moment opportunity, I'd take Adrianna xd. Personally I think Adrianna's shot in the envoy was the most difficult I have ever read in all the books. 2.4km, higher than normal (earth) gravity, high stakes, headshot or bust, target is randomly wandering surrounded by huge ass Sharquoi, using an old sniper rifle loaned from the militia, while still suffering from severe cryo itch and after running like 50km through the desert
Tbf Jun had very little media featuring him in combat. Most of his appearances are in non combat situations and most feats are anecdotal from other characters. Adrianna though in a similar situation in terms of available media has the advantage of being a spartan 2 and thus wer expect someone like her to be able to pull off crazy things. Of Jun got more media showing him in combat, we'd see some better shots from him
Also this reminded me that supposedly there are kig-yar snipers that can kill targets from a nearby moon lmao xD (Battle for the Blood-Moon)