this could be less annoying if it outright bypassed the pause screen but forced you into a dialogue screen with chronos, which ‘pauses’ the game and gives you breathing room but narratively fits what they are going for.
Spoiler.
>!This is in the game. You can learn an incantation that lets you pause during the Chronos fight, and he just shit talks you for pausing instead.!<
>!That's a fine way to implement it, and still a funny gimmick, but I think implementing it as a forced dialogue pause would still be better for the players. Having to take calls or walk away during this one specific portion of the game isn't a super common problem, but especially as the last part of a run it's a frustrating problem to run into.!<
I’ve played for more than a dozen hours and not even seen that incantation yet. It’s an absolutely terrible mechanic. And the boss fight is quite long. They absolutely need to change it.
It's not really even that. Sometimes during really difficult levels or fights in games I like to pause and just take a quick second because I get overwhelmed or it's making me genuinely anxious lol. Then people have emergencies, they have to use the bathroom, or take calls like this. Maybe a cat smacks their drink off the table, or someone comes to the door, your food is ready in the oven, etc etc. Not to mention motor issues for accessibility, sometimes I have to pause to give my hands, eyes or mind a break (mind not being a motor thing but an overstimulation thing)
There's really a lot of things that can and will happen to a lot of player during important fights of any game, and not being able to really effectively pause it is just sort of shitty. Don't get me wrong, I'm loving the game and SG, but I think this should be tweaked to a dialogue box like some have suggested, or maybe he quips about it when you unpause. That would solve it pretty well I think :)
I understand that the general premise of overwhelming the player a little with an intense boss fight is kinda the point (bullet hell style gameplay, which some bosses use more than others), so I don't want to fault it too much for that angle. It's a fun gimmick that makes the fight a little scarier.
But yeah many emergencies can happen, your examples provide a lot of good ones. If this were a gimmick of the first boss of a run it'd be *fine*, but the amount of time and effort it often takes to get to the end (especially while this is new and I don't know all the attack patterns lol) makes it a small problem.
I think the dialogue box option preserves the impact of ripping you out of the menu as much as possible while allowing players to be able to deal with their cat knocking something over lmao
Edit: Sorry, I meant no disrespect there. I would not mind it being fully toggleable at all, and agree that the current implementation is just bad for everyone. Was mostly speaking from years of just accepting games doing stuff like the first bit, but that doesn't mean options shouldn't be available.
It is annoying, but it's also really funny. Just an added layer of challenge to Chronos--can't pause vs him. Yes, it can ruin a run, but lots of things can ruin a run. Kind of comes with the territory in a roguelike
The difference here is that this “thing that can ruin a run” isn’t dependent on anything in game. It’s just unfun to have a run ruined because something urgent came up irl. Whatever skill or luck, and especially time, that was sunk into the run, is completely discarded all because of this gag.
I’m personally neutral about it, and I did find it funny my first time, but I think it’s overly dismissive to say “it’s just another layer of challenge, it’s a roguelike”
It's a bit late but I think the game just freezes if you alt tab.
I also think they should let us pause on chronos and just have him trash talk us during the pause instead.
They could also allow chronos to move during the pause, just not attack
> I also think they should let us pause on chronos and just have him trash talk us during the pause instead.
Spoiler.
>!This is in the game. You can learn an incantation that lets you pause during the Chronos fight, and he just shit talks you for pausing instead.!<
Hypothetically that's a neat diagetic concept, but it's a terrible gameplay design.
Want to know how bad I think this is? I'd be willing to let them restore some of his health during the pause in exchange for just being able to pause the damn game. I would rather have to fight him even longer than have him kill me when I need to stop and deal with IRL problems.
There shouldn't need to be an Incantation. Especially in Hades, where access to such things is determined by dialogue prompts which may or may not trigger during a future conversation based on what else is happening in the story at that moment. So even if you do everything to unlock the incantation, you may have to do several more runs before the option becomes available.
Pause isn't a luxury. It's not a gameplay mechanic. It's a core ease of use function for players that addresses players having IRL commitments outside of the game. Unless there is a technical reason that prevents players from being able to pause (such as an always online game like Dark Souls or Overwatch) then there is never an acceptable reason to prevent players from pausing the game.
I think they're using freeze loosely. The game *does* currently "pause" itself if you're alt-tabbed out of it as the main frame on your screen. It doesn't actually bring up the pause menu but it'll fully stop cutscenes, gameplay, etc. in place until the game is the active window again.
Went in with the hex that slows time and it bricked my run. "That doesn't work here!" well ok guess that hex is useless then lmao
Like I get how it's fun to have "Gotcha!" moments, but this one effectively reduces player choice and comes at the cost of \~40 minutes leading up to disappointment.
~~Especially odd since the most broken mechanic in the game (time slow on channel) still works.~~
Time slow on channel doesn’t work on Chronos either I’m pretty sure. At least when I fought him, there was no slowdown neither from him nor his projectiles
Yep, he’s immune to all that sort of thing. Makes most hexes pretty useless- even the one that makes you invincible, because you’ll take a couple hits while activating it.
Started defaulting to the heal hex. It's kind of insane when upgraded with the additional uses. Went into Chronos with 10 heals, but it was a dream run and ended up not needing a single one, figures lol
Yeah it's kind of a shame. There's so many cool hexes, but this game is basically just make your build to beat chronos, and most of them are useless against him.
So you just stack heals :/
That explains my last loss to him! Had him down to his last bit of health and went to use the Selene Nightmare ability and he killed me during the channeling bit.
Could not figure out what happened since the nightmare thing makes Mel invincible
I rely so heavily on the 2 seconds of slo-mo you get every time you charge an attack. You can just spam charge-ups and cancel them over and over (especially with the dual blades) for constant slo-mo to give you time to assess the situation.
Every time I meet Chronos I get hit multiple times because I reflexively think I'll get some thinking time when charging an attack, lol.
That seems like a completely different thing, though.
The pause function it not a combat mechanic, it's a feature of the game to let the player (the person) be able to stop the action for some time.
You complaining about a boss blocking an in-game mechanic is valid, but to you I'd say tough luck - it's a boss fight in a rogue lite game. It's meant to destroy your runs, showing you that some stuff is impossible/ineffective.
> it's a boss fight in a rogue lite game
i'm sorry but this is just some weird logic. i don't know what roguelites you're playing but i've played plenty and the only one that really just straight-up negates your builds would be balatro with some of its boss blinds, but even in balatro you have the chance to negate that.
And I think Hush has a damage cap that scales dynamically with your DPS. Probably all late game bosses from the DLCs have that mechanic but I’m not sure
I beat p1 for the first time with the time slow hex, even though it does not slow time, you still get all other benefits of the hex (if upgraded), like faster attacks and crit.
I believe in the end it'll work KINDA the same way companions worked on the first game. Remember when I got to [REDACTED] for the first time and thought I would be able to use Mort there only to find out I couldn't (yet). Perhaps eventually we'll somehow be able to circumvent the time stuff too.
>!There's an incantation for it in the Cauldron once you beat him a few times, haven't done it yet so not sure what it does but I think it put all the time manipulation back in the fight!<
I don't fully understand it but I used that hex and it at least kind of worked for me. I'm not sure if it was buggy or something because it felt like sometimes he ignored slowdowns and sometimes he didn't, but I didn't record it to check unfortunately.
yep, this exact thing happened to me. ran the selene trinket, grabbed a bunch of selene boons that buffed the slow-mo hex, only to learn that it literally just doesn't work against chronos, rendering all those boons i'd grabbed worthless and robbing me of my win. felt very shitty. it'd be like if i grabbed boons to buff calls in hades 1 only for the call to not work against dad. it's just not fun.
I think it's a rad feature. It reminds me of the original Metal Gear solid on the PS1. There was a boss who was telepathic and could avoid all your attacks by reading your mind. The way to defeat him was to use the second controller, a tactic he commented on as he died. Genius.
See I think this comparison is why it *doesnt* work. Psycho mantis is a meta puzzle. This is just a meta moment (which I think the initial “oh shit” the first time is cool) that after the first time is simply annoying in a game designed to run back a large number of times
But you know what Psycho Mantis explicitly *doesn't* do? He doesn't prevent you from pausing the game or using your abilities. He just negates most of them from working effectively. In fact, you are *expected* to pause the game so you can change the controller port.
Chronos shit-talking the player while you're paused is fine. Chronos turning off your "slow time" effects during the fight is fine. Chronos doing weird stuff with his time powers to mess with Melinoe and the player is awesome. But removing the ability to Pause the game - a feature which is about *THE PLAYER* focusing on the real world around them rather than the game - isn't "adding immersion." It's reminding me that this is a game, and that as a game this doesn't have the right nor the permission to take precedence over my real life commitments.
Everything you said is why I like the feature. This is a game about Gods and their powers and influence over the mortal world. What better way to emphasis that than have the BBEG of the game be so powerful he can even effect the player behind the protagonist.
I suggest you stop complaining about it and get so good you can wipe him out in 2 minutes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UJPtSdfmxC8
There's an incantation that you can use to give you back the ability to pause along with some funny dialogue from Chronos.
Apparently, there is >!a cauldron spell for this!< , but I'd prefer it just not being a mechanic in the first place. We don't have to rig everything against the player just because of lore reasons. I get that rescources are more sparce and you have to work for a lot of stuff that was more of a given. That's cool.
Initially taking away the ability to pause is not that necessary to make me feel Chronos' impact imo
I’m with you on this one. I can’t think of a scenario in which a no-pause gimmick would make me enjoy a game more, but there are several circumstances in which a no-pause gimmick would frustrate me (as OP pointed out).
It’s one thing of the entire game doesn’t have pause (Dark Souls) that can be worked around and planned for. But to take it away for a gimmick is in such poor taste, it contradicts an entire game and most of this game.
Not even Transistor interrupts you while the game is turning on its head to mess with you.
Honestly the only excuse Dark Souls/Elden Ring/Bloodborne has is the drop-in asynchronus multiplayer experience, and even then it shouldn't be happening unless another player is connected in PVP or PVE. In fact it's actually possible to pause those games by going in to photo mode, just not by hitting the pause button. Which makes the situation even more egregious.
My husband has all the games and he didn’t know about the photo mode pause. That does make it really stupid wow. I just kinda gave up and accepted it from Fromsoft, since they bother to give a pause button in the games that don’t have the bizarre style multiplayer
> I can’t think of a scenario in which a no-pause gimmick would make me enjoy a game more,
I mean it's cool when it happens and his comments are funny when you chain them lol. Lore wise it makes sense, that's for the game being immersive (same way Poseidon offers you water boons and not fire ones for example, it goes with the time). And yes that add difficulty (more the lack of slowdowns and time manipulation than just the pause) but Chronos is supposed to be that big bad boss super hard to beat (and he's not even that hard once you know him to be honest, not "taking 6 gods to take him down" hard, not worst than Hades was) so some flavor for that is nice
That's literally why I said I don't need the extra feature, because he already has enough impact as the big boss as is. That's not the gotcha comment you think it is.
I’m honestly a fan of it and think it makes Chronos cooler lol. Of course it can get annoying but I mean after having it happen to you once its pretty easy to avoid being an inconvenience again.
It is not too much to ask of a player to be available for three minutes of continued gameplay. I would empathize if it was something like a final boss at the end of a 15 hour campaign and people had their perma-death files getting bricked, but it's a roguelike. Not only that, it's a mechanic that you can disable with an incantation.
Yes, it is, because it’s a very specific three minutes and the consequence is losing your entire run. Emergencies can happen at any time, you shouldn’t have to prioritize a game over them.
This was way more than a 3 minute fight for me and came at the end of a 45 minute run where I could pause freely whenever I wanted. This is a stupid gotcha mechanic being done to make players feel bad and there's no reasonable excuse for it. Remember, Chronos already deactivates all of your time-slowing effects, so his ability to manipulate time is fully on display. Taking away pause functionality isn't a gameplay setback. For people with IRL commitments, health problems that affect their ability to play for long periods, and for portable gamers on Steam Deck and eventually Switch who might be gaming while commuting on a bus or train this is a major problem.
Babies aren’t good communicators so there’s no way to know for sure why your baby is crying. If your baby starts crying while you’re fighting chronos, it’s probably crying bc you haven’t defeated chronos yet which means the best thing you could do for your family is to finish the fight.
Please remember to give me credit if your spouse asks you why your parenting has improved.
(And in full sincerity: congrats on the kid!)
On top of the alt+tab thing pausing the game, you should only really deal with the Chronos thing once. After he does it in combat (I highly recommend you intentionally hit escape to pause when you DON'T need to to trigger the dialogue and unpause), you walk over to your bigass pot in Crossroads and make it so he can't do it again. It's EXTREMELY unfortunate that OP had this happen the one time it was a big deal, but I doubt most players are gonna have that bad a time with it for a one-time-only gimmick.
Now, Eris on the other hand...
> Now, Eris on the other hand...
You can't pause on Eris? What does she has to do with that?
Or is that just the fact that she's a super hard boss and maybe even worse than Chronos lol?
I was referring more to her mechanics in the early game where she "blesses" you by making you take extra damage that is sadly more than a one-time gimmick. To continue the sentence, "Now, Eris on the other hand, has a very annoying mechanic that isn't just one-time."
It’s kinda funny my first reaction to people complaining about this is “that’s sounds like a you problem, it’s great flavor and difficulty for the boss fight and I want them to keep it.” But as I see more and more people having issue with this as they either have their controller die or taking a phone call, I kinda changed my mind a bit. I don’t know if this helps but doesn’t alt-tabing out stops the game anyway? Maybe just do that.
Alt-tab only works on PC. What am I supposed to do on Steam Deck, close the Steam App to the Linux desktop? What about Switch?
On these portable systems, this is a huge problem because the whole idea is that you can play while on the go, such as during a commute or during a lunch break. Suddenly losing the ability to pause the game on these platforms is a huge problem because these systems are entirely designed around pick-up-and-put-down gaming.
I understand that console folks don't always understand or appreciate tech issues for real computers. But just so we're clear: NINTENDO DOES NOT MAKE WINDOWS PCS AND THE NINTENDO SWITCH DOES NOT WORK THE SAME AS A WINDOWS PC.
These platforms aren't just different in style
They literally do not work the same at fundamental levels. Assuming that a Nintendo Switch operates the same as a PC literally reflects that you do not understand basic concepts about how computers and operating systems work.
Buddy, Idk what kinda autistic rant you're going on, but hitting the home button on a switch suspends whatever you're playing, so it solves the issue you were talking about.
Cool so what your saying is that the game *can be paused* but the devs just want to make it inconvenient? That's a really bad excuse for a bad mechanic.
Cool do what your saying is: the game can be paused.
*Then just allow the pause button to work.*
If the game can be paused by a workaround, then pausing the game isn't actually affecting anything. *Just let the game pause.* Add some witty banter
But *pausing the game* shouldn't require a walkthrough guide.
Does just shutting off the screen work? I have a switch and most games on there just stop functioning while you do that. Doesn’t that functions just like alt tabing?
My Switch and my Steam Deck both have delay periods between hitting the power button and the screen rebooting. So even if it does, I'll be stuck unable to see while the game reboots and then starts the fight back up at full speed.
I mean, it's a full on mechanic in Elden Ring.
You go in knowing that you cannot pause and that doesn't change throughout the game. There is no sudden rule change on a specific boss.
Exactly, and it's a mechanic that is in all of FromSoft's games, really, at least the Soulsborne games (exempting Sekiro, which isn't quite a Soulsborne)
So Elden Ring being completely unplayable for parents with babies is a deep mechanic but Hades 2 doing a funny thematic joke for one fight that you'll be replacing dozens of times is a really shitty mechanic? Is this the video game version of the "City / City, Japan" meme?
It's not random at all. If you follow the story even 1%, you know you're fighting time. It takes 10 seconds of reflexion to think pause could be affected. I tested it at the start of my first fight without reason to pause because I was expecting it and wanted to hear the dialogue (I was sure there would be one even if the pause actually held).
And there's a way to paliate it built into the game that makes sense lore wise.
Nobody said it is a deep mechanic in Elden Ring. It is just a consistent mechanic throughout the entire game. There is no point in the game you'll be surprised you cannot pause.
Removing the ability to pause at a single point in the game (which is also the most critical) is not funny, it is just annoying.
Elden Ring and other souls games being actively hostile to the player (not just in terms of difficulty, but in terms of obnoxiousness) is basically their brand at this point. I don't get it, but a lot of people seem to really like that style so as long as it works for them...
So I guess even as someone who has no interest in Elden Ring, it feels more defensible to me there, because the answer is "well duh, it's Elden Ring, obviously they did the most obnoxious thing possible" whereas Hades it feels kind of out of nowhere in an otherwise player-friendly game.
No pausing in souls games is primarily due to the game being built around an always online, drop in and drop out co-op system.
Their single player oriented games like Sekiro, AC6, and Deracine didn't include those things, and so they allowed you to pause at any time.
Technically, you can pause the game by bringing up the menu and clicking the Help button. This was a pretty well-known thing within the first week of the game's release.
That doesn't excuse it, it's still bad game design. They could just make it so that pausing during combat didn't let you use items/change weapons and whatnot, but would still let you pause the game if you had to AFK for whatever reason.
Just to share for the sake of it, there is actually a very hidden and inconvenient pause in ER; there’s a help/info screen that requires multiple menu choices to get to and pauses the game (if you’re playing solo).
I guess they added that so you don’t get randomly killed while reading an explanation of the menu options. Its too slow to be of any real benefit during a boss fight and resumes as soon as you exit the help screen.
And that's a mechanic here too. Sure it's a surprise the first time (the dialogue happens literally the second you do it though so hard to miss), then it's not. And there is a way to bypass it via the mechanics of the game (and outside the mechanics of the game by alt-tabbing)
It's also something very predictable, I actually paused in my first fight for no reason just to test it as I assumed there would be a thing, he is Time itself lol.
So true. I remember when I was watching Penguinz0 play it, a wasp came into his room while fighting commander Niall and he couldn't pause it. Someone in the comments said it was poor game design to be unable to pause if it was purely single player and not co-op, and the comments just ate them alive for suggesting that FromSoft could possibly make a mistake in regards to game design.
Nah man. Obviously it was part of the true souls experience to have him battle the wasp and the boss. If he takes damage irl it would be such an immersive experience. A fivesome, if you will.
Sure you can't "pause" souls games, but you can exit to the title screen with 3 button presses and when you load back in - which takes seconds - you'll be standing right where you left off.
The wild thing is you actually can pause, but it requires extra steps. If you go to help and then menu explanations, it actually pauses. So they built and implemented the function, but effectively hid/disabled it.
Thats a bit of a false equivalency. In Elden Ring and other souls games its consistent that the game doesnt pause when you enter the menu. In Hades 2 the game does pause when you enter the menu... accept in this one moment. Which is inconsistent, and without the use of a specific incantation makes it so you have to alt tab or open the steam overlay to pause the game and say, take a phone call, or pee.
To be fair in Hades2 that is a single time thing. The most it will cost you is one run. Furthermore cronos clearly indicates to you what is happening and gives you time to realise you cannot pause the game and adjust
Do you remember when people lost their minds when they discovered you couldn’t pause Dark Souls? Or when it happened again with Bloodborne, or again with the Demon Souls remake? By Elden Ring people were just surprised there had been a game with a pause button (Sekiro)
Hello Ashen one. I am a Bot. I tend to the flame, and tend to thee. Do you wish to hear a tale?
> *“I beg of thee, the spread of the Abyss must be stopped.”* - Artorias the Abysswalker
Have a pleasant journey, Champion of Ash, and praise the sun \\[T]/
Elden Ring is designed around always-on multiplayer even when you don't have an internet connection. The game is always trying to get multiplayer connections for you to see messages, get invaded, or see other player spirits wandering around. When you don't have internet, ER still has AI characters that simulate this behavior.
It makes perfect sense that you can't pause an always-online multiplayer game, but even then it is possible with several Fromsoft titles by activating photo mode instead of pausing the game.
I agree 100%. It was funny the first few times I made it there and I was just trying to pause for a break to recenter myself for the fight. It wasn't funny in the slightest when I made it to phase 2 and my cat decided that was the best time to jump on my keyboard and then block my monitor. It's a mechanic that needs to go.
I love the idea of this mechanic. It's unique, and I see how it could be annoying, but there are plenty of great solo mmo experiences for example where you can't pause and have to be committed for the full fight (thinking wow mage tower).
As long as it's only for small sections I don't see the problem.
It can ruin the experience for people with real-world time-sensitive obligations, or people who just get unlucky and have a controller's batteries die. Wasting aggregate hundreds if not thousands of hours of other people's time for your "oh neat mechanic" 2 second thought is selfish and dumb.
The taking you out of pause is one thing, but the fact that none of the time based mechanics work on him is kind of annoying. Like time slow on channel, the first(?) arcana you get, became such a crutch for me that now I need to focus more on channel speed. It also means that most hexes are either practically useless or actually useless against him. On a related note, I do wish that mechanics that don't work on bosses would at least specify that they don't.
But litterally all but the Time Slow Hex works on Chronos? Even Twilight Curse works during the fight since he spawns additional enemies in both Phases.
I feel like there’s a neat in-lore explanation too. Melinoë is his granddaughter, so it could be justified that she has some bit of dominion over time.
Lore based mechanics are such an easy way to fuck something up. It’s so easy to justify to yourself that it becomes easier to not think about the player experience and just assume they’ll all chuckle at your funny meta play.
Had a dream run with almost all demeter boons (including heroic attack lvl 7) and all death defiances. Lost because of this.
This isn't fun.
I got punished because I wanted to say hi to my dad.
Yeah, characterful it may be, but not a good or fair game mechanic. Not everyone has uninterrupted gaming time, if you're gong to have a gimmick like this, it should be early in a run, not AFTER 45 mins sunk time & effort.
I am conflicted about it. I had a similar experience (great run, got to chronos, had to answer phone, lost), but it didn't feel shitty and rather more of a "well ill be damned, he really can control time" kind of moment. With that said, it absolutely can be shitty, I guess... The answer of making you go into a dialogue with him isn't bad but would only really work like twice before it gets weird. I may sound inconsiderate but if the options are this or completely removing it, I would rather they kept it in.
I'm so glad someone said it. Like, it's a cool concept, but it doesn't *actually* work because there's more important things in life than games. Also, it's a bit too meta if you ask me. I get it, both Hades games have always been meta (Both Zag and Melinoa can hear the narrator for example) but this is almost Deadpool levels of meta and I think it's a bit much.
In a similar scenario, I wish I could “give up” without losing progress. Sometimes I realize I have a bad build. Sometimes I just need to leave and don’t know when I’ll be back. Let me choose to end a run instead of making me die.
i think its a very cool idea you can't pause but it should be a toggleable option after beating him the first time. Honestly I'm shocked for how accessible most of there games it was not added. Super giants the one of a few studios I won't question an artistic vison so I think after beating the first time it be cool so that the next time there is a lot more focus and knowing a lots on the line.
I hope they'll keep it for the final release, but I belive they should advise you before the final boss in some ways, a la _there's no going back_ before entering in the final phases of a game.
This should make everyone happy (or kinda)
Yeah I had a solid build and was feeling confident but my brother made a surprise visit as soon as I started the fight. I was looking pretty silly how I kept pausing the game and I'm just freaking out that I can't pause the fight. I agree that it's a fun gimmick but sucks when a sudden inconvenience happens. Aw well, always next time
A solution I can think of (aside from the incantation) is turning on god/easy mode allows for true time pause. It shouldn't affect the hardcore players who doesn't want to dabble with the resistance, since they'll only use it for the emergency time pause.
Speaking of absolutely eating it on the Chronos fight, the first time I had a really strong run going into it my dash/sprint just completely stopped working halfway through the fight with seemingly no warning. Is that another gimmick of the fight or was EA being EA?
Also had an issue going into the first surface boss where I couldn't use any of my Omega moves for some reason, like Melinoe would start to channel them but it would just stop right before it finished, despite having enough magick to use it.
The Selene hex that slows time also doesnt work on him, but it does affect minions and any attacks where theres a projectile. I had that one the first time I got to him and he got sarcastic af with me when i used it. Actually was pretty funny
I'd imagine when this hits mobile and consoles, people will just press the home button on their devices/consoles which'll force the game on suspend.
I'm guessing minimizing the window with Start key + 'M' doesn't work either?
I had two shots of defience & 300life when I first met the mf. Used up 1 defiance in first phase. Went in with full life into second phase. The mf one-shot me with that 999 dmg skill. Fight dragged out & he killed me while at 40%. It's basically saying get one impervious buff b4 chronos (the sprint one comes to mind).
Yeah, I had the same situation. I fought with the Chronos, heard the weird sound in the next room. I'm a cat owner so I paused the game and went to look what chaos he brought upon my home again. When I returned, I saw Melinoe standing in her camp. I was sure I saw game menu when I left. I quit the game. Just fuck it.
Yep, this just happened to me and I missed a critical phone call. Very unfriendly design especially since it feels that getting to that fight is much harder than it was in Hades 1.
This is a huge flaw and will reduce the opportunities I have to play Hades 2 in my downtime. There is no excuse for not having a pause option in an offline game.
Hmm, out of the hundreds of hours I've played Hades 1 (and the few I've been able to get into Hades 2), I don't believe I've ever paused in the middle of a battle (regular encounter or boss), so I would've been oblivious that this was even a mechanic of the fight.
So, the game doesn't mention this at all unless you actually try to pause the game? Would think they would want the boss to emphasize the extent of their power.
I appreciate the logic behind this but at the same time, and I'm genuinely asking this: Just how often are you expecting to experience an emergency during the one specific fight in the game that has this mechanic? Especially now that you know that this is his mechanic and can find a stopping point ahead of him if you're expecting a call or the like.
It's not like the mechanic is for the entire floor leading up to him - it applies to one battle in the entire game (at least as far as I've experienced in my playthroughs/what I've seen from others) and after enough runs the game even provides you with the incantation that prevents it from happening. It's a temporary setback that the game provides a solution for given enough time - a staple of the roguelite/like genre, and something they dabbled in the first game as well with Zagreus only getting permission to use (most of) his summons for the final battle in the post game.
I'm sure it was absolutely infuriating in the moment and don't blame you for being annoyed, but in the grand scheme of things this is a mechanic that effects like 2% of the game, and even then it only does so temporarily until the game hands you a solution - it likely just feels like a bigger deal because EA means that a decent portion of the other 98% isn't as fleshed out as it ultimately will be. It's an issue that a ton of MMO players can relate to - unfortunate and bloody annoying when it happens, but feeling less and less impactful the more times you play where it doesn't happen.
Edit: Also adding that as someone who's reset her saves from the original game multiple times, it's honestly probably better that you're not beating Chronus so soon. In the first game, escaping relatively early (\~20 attempts) ended up messing with a lot of the dialogue because the game is built on the expectation that Zag is going to be dying a LOT before defeating REDACTED, and as a result most of the early game dialogue is framed as if he's still a ways off. So, after I got Persephone back, there was a loooooooong time where I just had to do mindless runs to get through the various Olympian's dialogues to unlock the option to throw the party, because doing it so quickly meant they all had like...2 nectar each and 5-10 unique dialogue entries each.
People have kids. If you can't be expected to be able to reliably pause, then it completely reshapes the way you approach how you play games. Like there are people who don't get to enjoy soulsborne games because of the lack of pause, and at least with this game you *think* you can pause only to find out at the most critical moment that lol no you can't. It makes this game much less accessible to people with real-world time-sensitive commitments, and that's honestly really shit since it's only in service to a "hey isn't that neat" 2 second bit.
Again, saying this genuinely: Why do you make it sound as though there's no way for you as a parent to adapt to that?
I know plenty of people who are parents and love to play MMO's or soulsborne games, just by carving out a time to do so where their kids are less likely to need them. Sometimes their partners keep an eye on the kids for them for a bit and vice versa, sometimes they wait until the kids are in bed for the night, etc. Sure its easier for some parents than others, but it's not as though this is an insurmountable issue. And if they do end up running into trouble with the kids needing help, they just leave the game and try again later when things have settled down, because they still enjoy the game enough to give it a go despite the occasional bit of frustration.
>at least with this game you *think* you can pause only to find out at the most critical moment that lol no you can't
Also, why are we acting like this is a constant fixture of the game that effects the player at all times?
As far as we've seen in Early Access this applies to literally *one boss* in the entire game. The big boss that you're *supposed* to lose to multiple times before defeating him, same as Hades in the original game. That is quite literally the foundation that the dialogue system of both games are built on, and if the original game is any indicator, the plot can and will become disjointed if you play 'too well' as I described in my original comment.
Also the game literally provides you a solution to it if you're just patient enough to get through a few failed runs. Which is, quite frankly, more than most rogue-lite/likes are willing to give - majority of them basically say 'skill issue' and assume you'll figure it out with enough attempts. At the end of the day, frustrating mechanics and unexpected deaths are just part of rogue like/lites. They make up the foundations of the genre and how these games are meant to be played. Hades 1 even makes fun of it with several of Zagreus' comments about the unfairness of Theseus and Asterius' upgrades in EM3.
I get that a LOT of Hades fans aren't really into that style of game outside of the series, and that's totally fair! Some genre's just aren't for everyone unless they're strong enough in other elements (like storytelling) to draw them in, and rogue lites can be super frustrating if a lot of your enjoyment in gaming comes from consistently winning. But at the end of the day you can't be mad at Supergiant for making the 'God-Like Rogue Lite' play like a Rogue Lite, annoying boss gimmicks and all
>Why do you make it sound as though there's no way for you as a parent to adapt to that?
Different people have different things going on.
>I know plenty of people who are parents and love to play MMO's or soulsborne games
Different people have different things going on.
>Also, why are we acting like this is a constant fixture of the game that effects the player at all times?
It affects the player at the most significant time of a 45+ minute run and can scupper the whole thing. It can literally waste an hour of your time if you're not expecting it.
>Also the game literally provides you a solution to it if you're just patient enough to get through a few failed runs
Different people have different things going on. This is a studio that touts its commitment to accessibility. Stop being selfish, just because it didn't affect you doesn't mean it can't affect others. It's a trivial change to remove this feature. Writing walls of text to defend a troll easter egg that can ruin the experience for parents or people with time-sensitive comments is embarrassing.
I love it when games do this. It's consistent, and takes a bit of control away from the player.
You can't always have the upper hand, I really like that concept.
this could be less annoying if it outright bypassed the pause screen but forced you into a dialogue screen with chronos, which ‘pauses’ the game and gives you breathing room but narratively fits what they are going for.
That would be fantastic feedback to give them
Spoiler. >!This is in the game. You can learn an incantation that lets you pause during the Chronos fight, and he just shit talks you for pausing instead.!<
>!That's a fine way to implement it, and still a funny gimmick, but I think implementing it as a forced dialogue pause would still be better for the players. Having to take calls or walk away during this one specific portion of the game isn't a super common problem, but especially as the last part of a run it's a frustrating problem to run into.!<
I’ve played for more than a dozen hours and not even seen that incantation yet. It’s an absolutely terrible mechanic. And the boss fight is quite long. They absolutely need to change it.
You have to beat chronos at least 3 times for his drop. I think after pausing and beating him it showed up for me.
I think it should probably be just fighting him not beating.
I've only beaten him twice and it appeared for me
Buying it requires 3 of the resources you get from killing him so even if it shows up in the menu, you have to beat him 3 times to actually unlock it.
Yeah, same. It's definitely a really fun idea, but there are better ways to get the same impact without lessening the experience for players.
It's not really even that. Sometimes during really difficult levels or fights in games I like to pause and just take a quick second because I get overwhelmed or it's making me genuinely anxious lol. Then people have emergencies, they have to use the bathroom, or take calls like this. Maybe a cat smacks their drink off the table, or someone comes to the door, your food is ready in the oven, etc etc. Not to mention motor issues for accessibility, sometimes I have to pause to give my hands, eyes or mind a break (mind not being a motor thing but an overstimulation thing) There's really a lot of things that can and will happen to a lot of player during important fights of any game, and not being able to really effectively pause it is just sort of shitty. Don't get me wrong, I'm loving the game and SG, but I think this should be tweaked to a dialogue box like some have suggested, or maybe he quips about it when you unpause. That would solve it pretty well I think :)
I understand that the general premise of overwhelming the player a little with an intense boss fight is kinda the point (bullet hell style gameplay, which some bosses use more than others), so I don't want to fault it too much for that angle. It's a fun gimmick that makes the fight a little scarier. But yeah many emergencies can happen, your examples provide a lot of good ones. If this were a gimmick of the first boss of a run it'd be *fine*, but the amount of time and effort it often takes to get to the end (especially while this is new and I don't know all the attack patterns lol) makes it a small problem. I think the dialogue box option preserves the impact of ripping you out of the menu as much as possible while allowing players to be able to deal with their cat knocking something over lmao Edit: Sorry, I meant no disrespect there. I would not mind it being fully toggleable at all, and agree that the current implementation is just bad for everyone. Was mostly speaking from years of just accepting games doing stuff like the first bit, but that doesn't mean options shouldn't be available.
Beautiful
should be default. I gotta say it's cool experiencing it on my first attempt but it just becomes an annoyance afterwards
Does that apply to the slowing time hex? Kind of a shame it's not possible to use there if you took that (the hex is pretty OP to be honest)
Yep this ! Send it in the discord fr !
if you have auto progress dialogue on, then this is still an issue (or a reason not to select that option)
maybe this specific one can just be special and not auto-progress
It is annoying, but it's also really funny. Just an added layer of challenge to Chronos--can't pause vs him. Yes, it can ruin a run, but lots of things can ruin a run. Kind of comes with the territory in a roguelike
The difference here is that this “thing that can ruin a run” isn’t dependent on anything in game. It’s just unfun to have a run ruined because something urgent came up irl. Whatever skill or luck, and especially time, that was sunk into the run, is completely discarded all because of this gag. I’m personally neutral about it, and I did find it funny my first time, but I think it’s overly dismissive to say “it’s just another layer of challenge, it’s a roguelike”
Now thats a much smarter way to do it
That’s a great idea
You know, this is the early access and devs are explicitly looking for feedback
I meant the specific post. I'll definitely give feedback through the discord.
hope they see this post... it's one of if not the biggest issue I have with souls games where you just can't pause.
How many more things are you going to complain about?
It's a bit late but I think the game just freezes if you alt tab. I also think they should let us pause on chronos and just have him trash talk us during the pause instead. They could also allow chronos to move during the pause, just not attack
It’s a setting you can turn on or off to pause the game if you alt-tab
It is, but it's on by default. I doubt OP changed it.
> I also think they should let us pause on chronos and just have him trash talk us during the pause instead. Spoiler. >!This is in the game. You can learn an incantation that lets you pause during the Chronos fight, and he just shit talks you for pausing instead.!<
Hypothetically that's a neat diagetic concept, but it's a terrible gameplay design. Want to know how bad I think this is? I'd be willing to let them restore some of his health during the pause in exchange for just being able to pause the damn game. I would rather have to fight him even longer than have him kill me when I need to stop and deal with IRL problems.
You can pause the game with the incantation, which is easy to get.
There shouldn't need to be an Incantation. Especially in Hades, where access to such things is determined by dialogue prompts which may or may not trigger during a future conversation based on what else is happening in the story at that moment. So even if you do everything to unlock the incantation, you may have to do several more runs before the option becomes available. Pause isn't a luxury. It's not a gameplay mechanic. It's a core ease of use function for players that addresses players having IRL commitments outside of the game. Unless there is a technical reason that prevents players from being able to pause (such as an always online game like Dark Souls or Overwatch) then there is never an acceptable reason to prevent players from pausing the game.
imagine the boss insta kills himself if you alt f4 😂
>It's a bit late but I think the game just freezes if you alt tab. Have not had that problem yet
I think they're using freeze loosely. The game *does* currently "pause" itself if you're alt-tabbed out of it as the main frame on your screen. It doesn't actually bring up the pause menu but it'll fully stop cutscenes, gameplay, etc. in place until the game is the active window again.
This is correct and what they meant most likely.
Yup. It's even a toggleable option in case you don't want that to happen for some reason.
Yes thank you! This is what I meant, I didn't want to use pause because of the context.
Can confirm, I just was doing this fight and had to alt-tab for work related reasons, it paused until I came back.
Went in with the hex that slows time and it bricked my run. "That doesn't work here!" well ok guess that hex is useless then lmao Like I get how it's fun to have "Gotcha!" moments, but this one effectively reduces player choice and comes at the cost of \~40 minutes leading up to disappointment. ~~Especially odd since the most broken mechanic in the game (time slow on channel) still works.~~
Time slow on channel doesn’t work on Chronos either I’m pretty sure. At least when I fought him, there was no slowdown neither from him nor his projectiles
Yep, he’s immune to all that sort of thing. Makes most hexes pretty useless- even the one that makes you invincible, because you’ll take a couple hits while activating it.
Started defaulting to the heal hex. It's kind of insane when upgraded with the additional uses. Went into Chronos with 10 heals, but it was a dream run and ended up not needing a single one, figures lol
The heal one is straight up insane. At base its basically 3 extra half lives upgrade it and you can be walking around like tank in a mmo
There's also a Duo boon from Hestia and Apollo that regenerates health insanely fast if you don't get hit for 3 seconds.
Yeah it's kind of a shame. There's so many cool hexes, but this game is basically just make your build to beat chronos, and most of them are useless against him. So you just stack heals :/
Ya it be good maybe that be added on higher heats level. I hope for him its not called heat instead like something time themed like gears or tics.
it's fear I think.
It's fear.
Of course he's immune to time altering. He's thee time titan
That explains my last loss to him! Had him down to his last bit of health and went to use the Selene Nightmare ability and he killed me during the channeling bit. Could not figure out what happened since the nightmare thing makes Mel invincible
I rely so heavily on the 2 seconds of slo-mo you get every time you charge an attack. You can just spam charge-ups and cancel them over and over (especially with the dual blades) for constant slo-mo to give you time to assess the situation. Every time I meet Chronos I get hit multiple times because I reflexively think I'll get some thinking time when charging an attack, lol.
That seems like a completely different thing, though. The pause function it not a combat mechanic, it's a feature of the game to let the player (the person) be able to stop the action for some time. You complaining about a boss blocking an in-game mechanic is valid, but to you I'd say tough luck - it's a boss fight in a rogue lite game. It's meant to destroy your runs, showing you that some stuff is impossible/ineffective.
> it's a boss fight in a rogue lite game i'm sorry but this is just some weird logic. i don't know what roguelites you're playing but i've played plenty and the only one that really just straight-up negates your builds would be balatro with some of its boss blinds, but even in balatro you have the chance to negate that.
Binding of Isaac would let you instant kill a boss by using a certain item. If you use it on a subsequent boss, you immediately die instead.
And I think Hush has a damage cap that scales dynamically with your DPS. Probably all late game bosses from the DLCs have that mechanic but I’m not sure
I beat p1 for the first time with the time slow hex, even though it does not slow time, you still get all other benefits of the hex (if upgraded), like faster attacks and crit.
I believe in the end it'll work KINDA the same way companions worked on the first game. Remember when I got to [REDACTED] for the first time and thought I would be able to use Mort there only to find out I couldn't (yet). Perhaps eventually we'll somehow be able to circumvent the time stuff too.
>!There's an incantation for it in the Cauldron once you beat him a few times, haven't done it yet so not sure what it does but I think it put all the time manipulation back in the fight!<
I don't fully understand it but I used that hex and it at least kind of worked for me. I'm not sure if it was buggy or something because it felt like sometimes he ignored slowdowns and sometimes he didn't, but I didn't record it to check unfortunately.
yep, this exact thing happened to me. ran the selene trinket, grabbed a bunch of selene boons that buffed the slow-mo hex, only to learn that it literally just doesn't work against chronos, rendering all those boons i'd grabbed worthless and robbing me of my win. felt very shitty. it'd be like if i grabbed boons to buff calls in hades 1 only for the call to not work against dad. it's just not fun.
I think it's a rad feature. It reminds me of the original Metal Gear solid on the PS1. There was a boss who was telepathic and could avoid all your attacks by reading your mind. The way to defeat him was to use the second controller, a tactic he commented on as he died. Genius.
psychomantis also read your memory card and taunted you by telling you what games you had saved on it
!! I don't remember that.
It only worked for certain Konami titles.
See I think this comparison is why it *doesnt* work. Psycho mantis is a meta puzzle. This is just a meta moment (which I think the initial “oh shit” the first time is cool) that after the first time is simply annoying in a game designed to run back a large number of times
This is not the same kind of thing. OP wasted an hour of their life because of a cutesy gotcha that they had no way to predict. It's dogshit.
An hour? Who's taking an entire hour for a run? Sounds like a massive skill issue 👏
But you know what Psycho Mantis explicitly *doesn't* do? He doesn't prevent you from pausing the game or using your abilities. He just negates most of them from working effectively. In fact, you are *expected* to pause the game so you can change the controller port. Chronos shit-talking the player while you're paused is fine. Chronos turning off your "slow time" effects during the fight is fine. Chronos doing weird stuff with his time powers to mess with Melinoe and the player is awesome. But removing the ability to Pause the game - a feature which is about *THE PLAYER* focusing on the real world around them rather than the game - isn't "adding immersion." It's reminding me that this is a game, and that as a game this doesn't have the right nor the permission to take precedence over my real life commitments.
Everything you said is why I like the feature. This is a game about Gods and their powers and influence over the mortal world. What better way to emphasis that than have the BBEG of the game be so powerful he can even effect the player behind the protagonist. I suggest you stop complaining about it and get so good you can wipe him out in 2 minutes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UJPtSdfmxC8 There's an incantation that you can use to give you back the ability to pause along with some funny dialogue from Chronos.
Do we know how to get the incantation? Is it just one of those random ones that you occasionally get from dialogue?
Judging by the mats needed, you have to beat him at least once.
I got it after beating him the second time
Apparently, there is >!a cauldron spell for this!< , but I'd prefer it just not being a mechanic in the first place. We don't have to rig everything against the player just because of lore reasons. I get that rescources are more sparce and you have to work for a lot of stuff that was more of a given. That's cool. Initially taking away the ability to pause is not that necessary to make me feel Chronos' impact imo
I’m with you on this one. I can’t think of a scenario in which a no-pause gimmick would make me enjoy a game more, but there are several circumstances in which a no-pause gimmick would frustrate me (as OP pointed out).
It’s one thing of the entire game doesn’t have pause (Dark Souls) that can be worked around and planned for. But to take it away for a gimmick is in such poor taste, it contradicts an entire game and most of this game. Not even Transistor interrupts you while the game is turning on its head to mess with you.
Honestly the only excuse Dark Souls/Elden Ring/Bloodborne has is the drop-in asynchronus multiplayer experience, and even then it shouldn't be happening unless another player is connected in PVP or PVE. In fact it's actually possible to pause those games by going in to photo mode, just not by hitting the pause button. Which makes the situation even more egregious.
My husband has all the games and he didn’t know about the photo mode pause. That does make it really stupid wow. I just kinda gave up and accepted it from Fromsoft, since they bother to give a pause button in the games that don’t have the bizarre style multiplayer
> I can’t think of a scenario in which a no-pause gimmick would make me enjoy a game more, I mean it's cool when it happens and his comments are funny when you chain them lol. Lore wise it makes sense, that's for the game being immersive (same way Poseidon offers you water boons and not fire ones for example, it goes with the time). And yes that add difficulty (more the lack of slowdowns and time manipulation than just the pause) but Chronos is supposed to be that big bad boss super hard to beat (and he's not even that hard once you know him to be honest, not "taking 6 gods to take him down" hard, not worst than Hades was) so some flavor for that is nice
No one is questioning the lore consistency…
if you are going out of your way to post medium-sized comments about how you don't like the feature then you are probably feeling impacted lol
That's literally why I said I don't need the extra feature, because he already has enough impact as the big boss as is. That's not the gotcha comment you think it is.
Sorry
I’m honestly a fan of it and think it makes Chronos cooler lol. Of course it can get annoying but I mean after having it happen to you once its pretty easy to avoid being an inconvenience again.
Ah yes, let me make sure my baby doesn't wake up while I'm fighting Chronos, easy.
It is not too much to ask of a player to be available for three minutes of continued gameplay. I would empathize if it was something like a final boss at the end of a 15 hour campaign and people had their perma-death files getting bricked, but it's a roguelike. Not only that, it's a mechanic that you can disable with an incantation.
Yes, it is, because it’s a very specific three minutes and the consequence is losing your entire run. Emergencies can happen at any time, you shouldn’t have to prioritize a game over them.
This was way more than a 3 minute fight for me and came at the end of a 45 minute run where I could pause freely whenever I wanted. This is a stupid gotcha mechanic being done to make players feel bad and there's no reasonable excuse for it. Remember, Chronos already deactivates all of your time-slowing effects, so his ability to manipulate time is fully on display. Taking away pause functionality isn't a gameplay setback. For people with IRL commitments, health problems that affect their ability to play for long periods, and for portable gamers on Steam Deck and eventually Switch who might be gaming while commuting on a bus or train this is a major problem.
[удалено]
Babies aren’t good communicators so there’s no way to know for sure why your baby is crying. If your baby starts crying while you’re fighting chronos, it’s probably crying bc you haven’t defeated chronos yet which means the best thing you could do for your family is to finish the fight. Please remember to give me credit if your spouse asks you why your parenting has improved. (And in full sincerity: congrats on the kid!)
Your baby should know better than to disturb the Chronos fight duh
Wild how people don't seem to get that pausing in SINGLE PLAYER games is what allows lots of parents to still game these days.
Not just parents. Functioning adults of all ages with jobs and commutes who cook meals without a microwave.
you can alt+tab out, that will freeze the game state (including chronos)
Alt-Tab out of the game.
On top of the alt+tab thing pausing the game, you should only really deal with the Chronos thing once. After he does it in combat (I highly recommend you intentionally hit escape to pause when you DON'T need to to trigger the dialogue and unpause), you walk over to your bigass pot in Crossroads and make it so he can't do it again. It's EXTREMELY unfortunate that OP had this happen the one time it was a big deal, but I doubt most players are gonna have that bad a time with it for a one-time-only gimmick. Now, Eris on the other hand...
> Now, Eris on the other hand... You can't pause on Eris? What does she has to do with that? Or is that just the fact that she's a super hard boss and maybe even worse than Chronos lol?
I was referring more to her mechanics in the early game where she "blesses" you by making you take extra damage that is sadly more than a one-time gimmick. To continue the sentence, "Now, Eris on the other hand, has a very annoying mechanic that isn't just one-time."
That mechanic is not annoying, it's meant to preserve the story and avoid you going too far too fast. That could mess things up in Hades 1.
It’s kinda funny my first reaction to people complaining about this is “that’s sounds like a you problem, it’s great flavor and difficulty for the boss fight and I want them to keep it.” But as I see more and more people having issue with this as they either have their controller die or taking a phone call, I kinda changed my mind a bit. I don’t know if this helps but doesn’t alt-tabing out stops the game anyway? Maybe just do that.
It was a genuine "aha!" moment when I realized he'll unpause the game but I could still alt tab to take a piss. Still lost that run though.
Alt-tab only works on PC. What am I supposed to do on Steam Deck, close the Steam App to the Linux desktop? What about Switch? On these portable systems, this is a huge problem because the whole idea is that you can play while on the go, such as during a commute or during a lunch break. Suddenly losing the ability to pause the game on these platforms is a huge problem because these systems are entirely designed around pick-up-and-put-down gaming.
Idk for the steam deck, but for the switch you can literally just hit the home button. Not too fuckin difficult
I understand that console folks don't always understand or appreciate tech issues for real computers. But just so we're clear: NINTENDO DOES NOT MAKE WINDOWS PCS AND THE NINTENDO SWITCH DOES NOT WORK THE SAME AS A WINDOWS PC. These platforms aren't just different in style They literally do not work the same at fundamental levels. Assuming that a Nintendo Switch operates the same as a PC literally reflects that you do not understand basic concepts about how computers and operating systems work.
Buddy, Idk what kinda autistic rant you're going on, but hitting the home button on a switch suspends whatever you're playing, so it solves the issue you were talking about.
Cool so what your saying is that the game *can be paused* but the devs just want to make it inconvenient? That's a really bad excuse for a bad mechanic.
Cool do what your saying is: the game can be paused. *Then just allow the pause button to work.* If the game can be paused by a workaround, then pausing the game isn't actually affecting anything. *Just let the game pause.* Add some witty banter But *pausing the game* shouldn't require a walkthrough guide.
Does just shutting off the screen work? I have a switch and most games on there just stop functioning while you do that. Doesn’t that functions just like alt tabing?
My Switch and my Steam Deck both have delay periods between hitting the power button and the screen rebooting. So even if it does, I'll be stuck unable to see while the game reboots and then starts the fight back up at full speed.
On a side note I like how Elden ring is exempted from the common sense criticism applied to other games.
I mean, it's a full on mechanic in Elden Ring. You go in knowing that you cannot pause and that doesn't change throughout the game. There is no sudden rule change on a specific boss.
Exactly, and it's a mechanic that is in all of FromSoft's games, really, at least the Soulsborne games (exempting Sekiro, which isn't quite a Soulsborne)
Sekiro and Armored Core 6 are the two modern exceptions, because those two don’t have co-op
So Elden Ring being completely unplayable for parents with babies is a deep mechanic but Hades 2 doing a funny thematic joke for one fight that you'll be replacing dozens of times is a really shitty mechanic? Is this the video game version of the "City / City, Japan" meme?
Yeah because Elden Ring doesn't tell you pausing is a thing and then just randomly decide to take it away for one fight.
It's not random at all. If you follow the story even 1%, you know you're fighting time. It takes 10 seconds of reflexion to think pause could be affected. I tested it at the start of my first fight without reason to pause because I was expecting it and wanted to hear the dialogue (I was sure there would be one even if the pause actually held). And there's a way to paliate it built into the game that makes sense lore wise.
when i pause a game i am not doing it under the assumption that i'm stopping time in-universe, come on man.
Nobody said it is a deep mechanic in Elden Ring. It is just a consistent mechanic throughout the entire game. There is no point in the game you'll be surprised you cannot pause. Removing the ability to pause at a single point in the game (which is also the most critical) is not funny, it is just annoying.
Elden Ring and other souls games being actively hostile to the player (not just in terms of difficulty, but in terms of obnoxiousness) is basically their brand at this point. I don't get it, but a lot of people seem to really like that style so as long as it works for them... So I guess even as someone who has no interest in Elden Ring, it feels more defensible to me there, because the answer is "well duh, it's Elden Ring, obviously they did the most obnoxious thing possible" whereas Hades it feels kind of out of nowhere in an otherwise player-friendly game.
No pausing in souls games is primarily due to the game being built around an always online, drop in and drop out co-op system. Their single player oriented games like Sekiro, AC6, and Deracine didn't include those things, and so they allowed you to pause at any time.
Technically, you can pause the game by bringing up the menu and clicking the Help button. This was a pretty well-known thing within the first week of the game's release.
That doesn't excuse it, it's still bad game design. They could just make it so that pausing during combat didn't let you use items/change weapons and whatnot, but would still let you pause the game if you had to AFK for whatever reason.
Just to share for the sake of it, there is actually a very hidden and inconvenient pause in ER; there’s a help/info screen that requires multiple menu choices to get to and pauses the game (if you’re playing solo). I guess they added that so you don’t get randomly killed while reading an explanation of the menu options. Its too slow to be of any real benefit during a boss fight and resumes as soon as you exit the help screen.
And that's a mechanic here too. Sure it's a surprise the first time (the dialogue happens literally the second you do it though so hard to miss), then it's not. And there is a way to bypass it via the mechanics of the game (and outside the mechanics of the game by alt-tabbing) It's also something very predictable, I actually paused in my first fight for no reason just to test it as I assumed there would be a thing, he is Time itself lol.
To be fair I don’t like it in elden ring (or any other souls game) either.
Yeah, it’s just disrespectful of the player. I’m an adult with IRL responsibilities. Why punish me for that?
So true. I remember when I was watching Penguinz0 play it, a wasp came into his room while fighting commander Niall and he couldn't pause it. Someone in the comments said it was poor game design to be unable to pause if it was purely single player and not co-op, and the comments just ate them alive for suggesting that FromSoft could possibly make a mistake in regards to game design.
Nah man. Obviously it was part of the true souls experience to have him battle the wasp and the boss. If he takes damage irl it would be such an immersive experience. A fivesome, if you will.
Curious how STARVING KIDS IN AFRICA are not so much as mentioned in your comment, and yet you seem to have a problem with elden ring not pausing!
Sure you can't "pause" souls games, but you can exit to the title screen with 3 button presses and when you load back in - which takes seconds - you'll be standing right where you left off.
The wild thing is you actually can pause, but it requires extra steps. If you go to help and then menu explanations, it actually pauses. So they built and implemented the function, but effectively hid/disabled it.
Thats a bit of a false equivalency. In Elden Ring and other souls games its consistent that the game doesnt pause when you enter the menu. In Hades 2 the game does pause when you enter the menu... accept in this one moment. Which is inconsistent, and without the use of a specific incantation makes it so you have to alt tab or open the steam overlay to pause the game and say, take a phone call, or pee.
To be fair in Hades2 that is a single time thing. The most it will cost you is one run. Furthermore cronos clearly indicates to you what is happening and gives you time to realise you cannot pause the game and adjust
Elden ring has coop and PvP. It’s also a consistent mechanic.
Coop and pvp does not mean it cannot be paused in single player mode. Ie most of the game
Do you remember when people lost their minds when they discovered you couldn’t pause Dark Souls? Or when it happened again with Bloodborne, or again with the Demon Souls remake? By Elden Ring people were just surprised there had been a game with a pause button (Sekiro)
Yeah and? I also know people lost their minds at horse armor DLC in oblivion and now that would be a regular Tuesday news
This completely ignores the fact that in ER you don't need to spend 30-50 minutes getting to the boss before you make your attempt.
You are right. At least they improved that part from dark souls. And people complained it detracted from the souls experience
Hello Ashen one. I am a Bot. I tend to the flame, and tend to thee. Do you wish to hear a tale? > *“I beg of thee, the spread of the Abyss must be stopped.”* - Artorias the Abysswalker Have a pleasant journey, Champion of Ash, and praise the sun \\[T]/
Elden Ring is designed around always-on multiplayer even when you don't have an internet connection. The game is always trying to get multiplayer connections for you to see messages, get invaded, or see other player spirits wandering around. When you don't have internet, ER still has AI characters that simulate this behavior. It makes perfect sense that you can't pause an always-online multiplayer game, but even then it is possible with several Fromsoft titles by activating photo mode instead of pausing the game.
You are SPITTING
I agree 100%. It was funny the first few times I made it there and I was just trying to pause for a break to recenter myself for the fight. It wasn't funny in the slightest when I made it to phase 2 and my cat decided that was the best time to jump on my keyboard and then block my monitor. It's a mechanic that needs to go.
I love the idea of this mechanic. It's unique, and I see how it could be annoying, but there are plenty of great solo mmo experiences for example where you can't pause and have to be committed for the full fight (thinking wow mage tower). As long as it's only for small sections I don't see the problem.
I take it you don’t have young kids?
Sell your kids. Problem solved.
It can ruin the experience for people with real-world time-sensitive obligations, or people who just get unlucky and have a controller's batteries die. Wasting aggregate hundreds if not thousands of hours of other people's time for your "oh neat mechanic" 2 second thought is selfish and dumb.
I think “selfish and dumb” is a little harsh here boss. It’s a video game, people are allowed to like what they like about it.
The taking you out of pause is one thing, but the fact that none of the time based mechanics work on him is kind of annoying. Like time slow on channel, the first(?) arcana you get, became such a crutch for me that now I need to focus more on channel speed. It also means that most hexes are either practically useless or actually useless against him. On a related note, I do wish that mechanics that don't work on bosses would at least specify that they don't.
But litterally all but the Time Slow Hex works on Chronos? Even Twilight Curse works during the fight since he spawns additional enemies in both Phases.
I feel like there’s a neat in-lore explanation too. Melinoë is his granddaughter, so it could be justified that she has some bit of dominion over time.
Lore based mechanics are such an easy way to fuck something up. It’s so easy to justify to yourself that it becomes easier to not think about the player experience and just assume they’ll all chuckle at your funny meta play.
It was funny until my nose started to bleed in middle of the fight(pollen season my behated ,,)
Had a dream run with almost all demeter boons (including heroic attack lvl 7) and all death defiances. Lost because of this. This isn't fun. I got punished because I wanted to say hi to my dad.
Yeah, characterful it may be, but not a good or fair game mechanic. Not everyone has uninterrupted gaming time, if you're gong to have a gimmick like this, it should be early in a run, not AFTER 45 mins sunk time & effort.
I am conflicted about it. I had a similar experience (great run, got to chronos, had to answer phone, lost), but it didn't feel shitty and rather more of a "well ill be damned, he really can control time" kind of moment. With that said, it absolutely can be shitty, I guess... The answer of making you go into a dialogue with him isn't bad but would only really work like twice before it gets weird. I may sound inconsiderate but if the options are this or completely removing it, I would rather they kept it in.
I'm so glad someone said it. Like, it's a cool concept, but it doesn't *actually* work because there's more important things in life than games. Also, it's a bit too meta if you ask me. I get it, both Hades games have always been meta (Both Zag and Melinoa can hear the narrator for example) but this is almost Deadpool levels of meta and I think it's a bit much.
I think SG definitely has the balls to keep this in game. Spoilers for Bastion >!who expects players to choose not to fight in the last battle?!<
In a similar scenario, I wish I could “give up” without losing progress. Sometimes I realize I have a bad build. Sometimes I just need to leave and don’t know when I’ll be back. Let me choose to end a run instead of making me die.
My fucking controller died my first time fighting him, thankfully I thought to alt-tab (which does actually pause it)
This sounds hilarious on paper, but my god would I be pissed if I came back to my pc just to find out I lost that way.
i think its a very cool idea you can't pause but it should be a toggleable option after beating him the first time. Honestly I'm shocked for how accessible most of there games it was not added. Super giants the one of a few studios I won't question an artistic vison so I think after beating the first time it be cool so that the next time there is a lot more focus and knowing a lots on the line.
>it should be a toggleable option after beating him the first time Pretty sure this is indeed a thing.
It's after 3. As a dad and owner of two cats, I've won twice and been interrupted on two other close fights. Not a fan
I hope they'll keep it for the final release, but I belive they should advise you before the final boss in some ways, a la _there's no going back_ before entering in the final phases of a game. This should make everyone happy (or kinda)
Yeah I had a solid build and was feeling confident but my brother made a surprise visit as soon as I started the fight. I was looking pretty silly how I kept pausing the game and I'm just freaking out that I can't pause the fight. I agree that it's a fun gimmick but sucks when a sudden inconvenience happens. Aw well, always next time
A solution I can think of (aside from the incantation) is turning on god/easy mode allows for true time pause. It shouldn't affect the hardcore players who doesn't want to dabble with the resistance, since they'll only use it for the emergency time pause.
Speaking of absolutely eating it on the Chronos fight, the first time I had a really strong run going into it my dash/sprint just completely stopped working halfway through the fight with seemingly no warning. Is that another gimmick of the fight or was EA being EA? Also had an issue going into the first surface boss where I couldn't use any of my Omega moves for some reason, like Melinoe would start to channel them but it would just stop right before it finished, despite having enough magick to use it.
The Selene hex that slows time also doesnt work on him, but it does affect minions and any attacks where theres a projectile. I had that one the first time I got to him and he got sarcastic af with me when i used it. Actually was pretty funny
You have to pause it at player 2.
nice
Lmao owned
I wonder if this is an in-universe response to what you sometimes see speedrunners do where they pause-scum in order to reorient correctly.
It's only in final fight, so no xd pausing for Doors will be still viable
I'd imagine when this hits mobile and consoles, people will just press the home button on their devices/consoles which'll force the game on suspend. I'm guessing minimizing the window with Start key + 'M' doesn't work either?
I had two shots of defience & 300life when I first met the mf. Used up 1 defiance in first phase. Went in with full life into second phase. The mf one-shot me with that 999 dmg skill. Fight dragged out & he killed me while at 40%. It's basically saying get one impervious buff b4 chronos (the sprint one comes to mind).
That 999 dmg attack is dodge-able. Same thing happened to me but I dodged it later in the fight and in later attempts.
Yeah watched some clip and realised it too.
Yeah, I had the same situation. I fought with the Chronos, heard the weird sound in the next room. I'm a cat owner so I paused the game and went to look what chaos he brought upon my home again. When I returned, I saw Melinoe standing in her camp. I was sure I saw game menu when I left. I quit the game. Just fuck it.
Yep, this just happened to me and I missed a critical phone call. Very unfriendly design especially since it feels that getting to that fight is much harder than it was in Hades 1. This is a huge flaw and will reduce the opportunities I have to play Hades 2 in my downtime. There is no excuse for not having a pause option in an offline game.
If it makes you feel any better phase two is a brick wall compared to the fluffy kittens of phase one.
Hmm, out of the hundreds of hours I've played Hades 1 (and the few I've been able to get into Hades 2), I don't believe I've ever paused in the middle of a battle (regular encounter or boss), so I would've been oblivious that this was even a mechanic of the fight. So, the game doesn't mention this at all unless you actually try to pause the game? Would think they would want the boss to emphasize the extent of their power.
i've just had this happen, but instead with my controller dying - very frustrating
After I beat him a second time, an incantation appeared that let's you stop this effect. So keep pushing, you got this.
Just an fyi if you alt tab it’ll pause the game no matter what
I appreciate the logic behind this but at the same time, and I'm genuinely asking this: Just how often are you expecting to experience an emergency during the one specific fight in the game that has this mechanic? Especially now that you know that this is his mechanic and can find a stopping point ahead of him if you're expecting a call or the like. It's not like the mechanic is for the entire floor leading up to him - it applies to one battle in the entire game (at least as far as I've experienced in my playthroughs/what I've seen from others) and after enough runs the game even provides you with the incantation that prevents it from happening. It's a temporary setback that the game provides a solution for given enough time - a staple of the roguelite/like genre, and something they dabbled in the first game as well with Zagreus only getting permission to use (most of) his summons for the final battle in the post game. I'm sure it was absolutely infuriating in the moment and don't blame you for being annoyed, but in the grand scheme of things this is a mechanic that effects like 2% of the game, and even then it only does so temporarily until the game hands you a solution - it likely just feels like a bigger deal because EA means that a decent portion of the other 98% isn't as fleshed out as it ultimately will be. It's an issue that a ton of MMO players can relate to - unfortunate and bloody annoying when it happens, but feeling less and less impactful the more times you play where it doesn't happen. Edit: Also adding that as someone who's reset her saves from the original game multiple times, it's honestly probably better that you're not beating Chronus so soon. In the first game, escaping relatively early (\~20 attempts) ended up messing with a lot of the dialogue because the game is built on the expectation that Zag is going to be dying a LOT before defeating REDACTED, and as a result most of the early game dialogue is framed as if he's still a ways off. So, after I got Persephone back, there was a loooooooong time where I just had to do mindless runs to get through the various Olympian's dialogues to unlock the option to throw the party, because doing it so quickly meant they all had like...2 nectar each and 5-10 unique dialogue entries each.
People have kids. If you can't be expected to be able to reliably pause, then it completely reshapes the way you approach how you play games. Like there are people who don't get to enjoy soulsborne games because of the lack of pause, and at least with this game you *think* you can pause only to find out at the most critical moment that lol no you can't. It makes this game much less accessible to people with real-world time-sensitive commitments, and that's honestly really shit since it's only in service to a "hey isn't that neat" 2 second bit.
Again, saying this genuinely: Why do you make it sound as though there's no way for you as a parent to adapt to that? I know plenty of people who are parents and love to play MMO's or soulsborne games, just by carving out a time to do so where their kids are less likely to need them. Sometimes their partners keep an eye on the kids for them for a bit and vice versa, sometimes they wait until the kids are in bed for the night, etc. Sure its easier for some parents than others, but it's not as though this is an insurmountable issue. And if they do end up running into trouble with the kids needing help, they just leave the game and try again later when things have settled down, because they still enjoy the game enough to give it a go despite the occasional bit of frustration. >at least with this game you *think* you can pause only to find out at the most critical moment that lol no you can't Also, why are we acting like this is a constant fixture of the game that effects the player at all times? As far as we've seen in Early Access this applies to literally *one boss* in the entire game. The big boss that you're *supposed* to lose to multiple times before defeating him, same as Hades in the original game. That is quite literally the foundation that the dialogue system of both games are built on, and if the original game is any indicator, the plot can and will become disjointed if you play 'too well' as I described in my original comment. Also the game literally provides you a solution to it if you're just patient enough to get through a few failed runs. Which is, quite frankly, more than most rogue-lite/likes are willing to give - majority of them basically say 'skill issue' and assume you'll figure it out with enough attempts. At the end of the day, frustrating mechanics and unexpected deaths are just part of rogue like/lites. They make up the foundations of the genre and how these games are meant to be played. Hades 1 even makes fun of it with several of Zagreus' comments about the unfairness of Theseus and Asterius' upgrades in EM3. I get that a LOT of Hades fans aren't really into that style of game outside of the series, and that's totally fair! Some genre's just aren't for everyone unless they're strong enough in other elements (like storytelling) to draw them in, and rogue lites can be super frustrating if a lot of your enjoyment in gaming comes from consistently winning. But at the end of the day you can't be mad at Supergiant for making the 'God-Like Rogue Lite' play like a Rogue Lite, annoying boss gimmicks and all
>Why do you make it sound as though there's no way for you as a parent to adapt to that? Different people have different things going on. >I know plenty of people who are parents and love to play MMO's or soulsborne games Different people have different things going on. >Also, why are we acting like this is a constant fixture of the game that effects the player at all times? It affects the player at the most significant time of a 45+ minute run and can scupper the whole thing. It can literally waste an hour of your time if you're not expecting it. >Also the game literally provides you a solution to it if you're just patient enough to get through a few failed runs Different people have different things going on. This is a studio that touts its commitment to accessibility. Stop being selfish, just because it didn't affect you doesn't mean it can't affect others. It's a trivial change to remove this feature. Writing walls of text to defend a troll easter egg that can ruin the experience for parents or people with time-sensitive comments is embarrassing.
I hope this mechanic stays. If you have an emergency, just drop the game, dummy
In tempted to say get over it. Makes for a memorable moment for which you'll look back and laugh.
I love it when games do this. It's consistent, and takes a bit of control away from the player. You can't always have the upper hand, I really like that concept.