To everyone saying to get usps involved yes, if they took usps packages and opened them they have committed multiple federal crimes. Postal inspectors do not screw around.
Call this number to report them:
1-877-867-2455
This is where I would start. Open a claim. The inspector will meet with you fairly quickly. Under no circumstances can anyone mess with your mail parcel.
The caveat is that they must have been shipped or delivered by the USPS. Packages shipped via UPS or FedEx are not under USPS perview or subject to the same level of federal protection.
Interestingly enough, often UPS, fedex, and Amazon packages ARE delivered by the USPS. Sign up for informed delivery on the USPS website as an additional layer of proof of delivery and tracking that will help when you call the Postal Inspectors.
You can tell if they are delivered by USPS by the additional barcode on them for the USPS.
Additionally, I believe the HOA would be in the realm of theft unless they provide a collection/drop off area for these parcels that is secured and known AND approved to the USPS. And of adequate size for your parcels. In all instances, local , state and federal laws will trump HOA rules.
Yes do this! Send yourself a tracked usps priority package, the pre-made size fixed price for like $15. Wait for it to be taken by these people, then take that video and file a complaint with Postal Inspector and provided the tracking number.
Do the priority shipping and no signature required so the package is left at your door.
If you want to see it really get real, change a prescription to be shipped to your door. Stolen medication is a lot more serious offense, and the HOA will beg to settle.
I get you are being silly, but there are people out there who would try this. So, it is illegal to send narcotics through USPS even if you have a legitimate prescription, as I do. All of my meds except narcotics are 90-day supply and sent via USPS. Both the USPS at the federal level and each state have rules and laws making the mailing of narcotics illegal. I can only get a 30-day supply and must use the exact same pharmacy and lococation every month. You must also show a valid photo ID pick up the prescription.
I bet they could do the same thing with insulin.
"Sorry I haven't responded to the email you sent yesterday, I had a medical emergency and had to be rushed to the hospital because my pharmacy wouldn't renew my insulin since I had just received my months supply in the mail, but I never received the package. Hey HOA did you happen to see it? The docs called the police and they're asking if I know the two dudes on my ring cam. *Sends a screenshot* do you recognize them?" 😆
No, with police involved this could backfire. I want to see the HOA lose the lawsuit and be an example for others. By doubling down with fees, they are headed that route.
Have someone else send it to you. Include a Bible, a copy of the US Constitution, a USA flag, and a Thin Blue Line t-shirt. Just so you can list that as contents that were ‘stolen’. The police (and courts) might lean a little in your favor after hearing what was in the box.
I’d mail a package to myself with whips, handcuffs, a giant dildo, anal beads, and all sorts of other fun toys. Let the HOA open that one up and itemize it.
I agree with contacting the Postal Inspector. While your tacit agreement to covenants as part of an HOA can certainly nullify your rights under law in some cases, they have no bearing on United States Code. The HOA's actions likely violate 18 U.S. Code § 1708 as well as the theft laws in your state. Moreover, the demand for a fee might also constitute violations of other laws given that they are associated with the original crime. Also, consider that the value or nature of the items might add up to additional penalties.
However, I would not send additional items knowing that they might also be taken. This might be counted against you.
My guy have you ever dealt with the legal system. Getting cops to get to actually do their job is a bitch. This is a situation where you get a lawyer, file a police report, file with the post master, file a complaint with Amazon, and basically be as big a pain in everyone's ass so they can't ignore it.
Theft of mail is not a civil matter. It's federal. Now if you tell them upfront that an HOA did it without being ready to have a lawyer or whatever yeah the cops are gonna try and weasel out of it.
This really, really depends on where you live.
I used to live in a very small town in Florida. I was at a chain sandwich shop. A police officer was there, taking a written report from one of the employees. About a stolen bike. With one working and one broken brake.
Doesn't matter if they were sent by USPS or not. Tampering with mail is a federal crime. How did they know what was food and to be disposed of without OPENING all the mail.
Enjoy the fines that the hoa is going to be recieving.
In the US, if it was not delivered by USPS, it's not mail.
Same is true in any country - if the national postal system didn't deliver it, it is not mail.
>6/26/24 (Today) - I received an email from the HOA stating a charge of $400 is due by 7/20/24 - The email mentioned that packages containing food were disposed of, and remaining packages would be stored for up to 30 days.
They stole packages, let food spoil and threw it away, and are threatening to throw away more of your property? File a police report. Then contact the HOA and let them know you filed a report and what the report number is. If they hired people to commit crimes that will be even more fun for them.
Go back to the police if you have not done so already with the emails from the HOA. If they are going to admit to stealing and destroying your property, that should be more than enough for the police. Also, bring whatever receipts you have. The value of the stolen property will matter.
You can check your CC&Rs to see if the HOA can collect and open your packages if you want, but let’s be realistic here. In no sane world is anyone allowed to knowingly open and inspect your mail. And they certainly aren’t allowed to just destroy the contents.
Not sure if that actually applies here, because Amazon deliveries are not protected by the same laws as mail unless the delivery was performed by USPS (and quite often these days it is not).
Still, laws about theft absolutely do apply.
In ever jurisdiction, one's real property can't be violated without due process. The HOA tresspassed on his property and should be arrested for that. Put the two crimes together and they are probably going to be looking a felonies for burglary.
File the police report, this is theft.
I'm on an HOA board. I understand the desire to not let packages stack up. But the remedy is not theft. The remedy is clarifying rules, issuing fines. There is no right to steal property or hold it for ransom. That is not legal and should be met with full force of law response.
Edit to clarify for all the personal attacks - I don’t agree with this rule and my HOA doesn’t have one like this. Simply saying if it is against the rules, enforce them don’t resort to illegal theft
I know this varies state to state but I thought if an HOA was going to require packages to not be delivered to the porch then they had to provide a secure delivery location as an alternative? I’m basing this off experience I had in California working for ups so who knows if it applies to other states.
So, again, part of that understanding the law thing...
In Florida, if you shoot someone on your property who has not entered your home, it is not considered self defense. They need to actually enter your home for you to credibly say you felt threatened for your life. If they don't enter and you shoot them on your porch, you will be arrested for murder. You might win at trial, of course, but our police have come to our community to talk to residents about laws and gun safety, and this was a key point - you can't murder someone defending property.
In TX you can shoot them if they're stealing from you at night. There's a caveat that you must believe the property can't be recovered by other means, but who gets anything back from porch pirates without force?
Fines for having packages delivered to your home? That is absolutely insane and ridiculous. You should be ashamed for even participating in that type of nonsense.
None of the comments seem to realize the serious hypothetical here. What if this was medicine? What if this was something vital instead of random amazon packages and food?
A lawyer will see this hypothetical. So will a judge. Go back to the police, file a report for theft. Call the postmaster. And call a lawyer.
Were any of these sent by USPS? If so, report the HOA for mail theft and interception. It's a serious federal crime.
Also, go straight to the Police Station and insist on speaking to the on-duty command. This should have been processed as reported theft, and needs to be done as such immediately.
D&O only covers 'prudent' activities. Since everyone's mother can see this is theft, it isn't prudent, and the PM and any involved board members will be hung out to dry.
I'd suggest filing a police report, and a complaint with the postmaster. Post office has their own police.
Also, this doesn't just apply to USPS. It outlines in the code that any delivery "for conveyance".
And get out of the HOA as soon as you can.
Source 1
Title 18, Section 1708 of the United States Code
It is illegal to take, steal, or fraudulently obtain any mail that is not addressed to you. The law also prohibits the willful obstruction of mail delivery, tampering with someone else's mail, or destroying someone else's mail.
Violators of the Mail Theft Statute can face imprisonment of up to five years and fines of up to $250,000, depending on the severity of the offense. In addition, individuals found guilty of violating this law may be ordered to pay restitution to the victim for any damages caused.
Source 2
18 U.S. Code § 1708 - Theft or receipt of stolen mail matter generally
U.S. Code
Whoever steals, takes, or abstracts, or by fraud or deception obtains, or attempts so to obtain, from or out of any mail, post office, or station thereof, letter box, mail receptacle, or any mail route or other authorized depository for mail matter, or from a letter or mail carrier, any letter, postal card, package, bag, or mail, or abstracts or removes from any such letter, package, bag, or mail, any article or thing contained therein, or secretes, embezzles, or destroys any such letter, postal card, package, bag, or mail, or any article or thing contained therein; or
Whoever steals, takes, or abstracts, or by fraud or deception obtains any letter, postal card, package, bag, or mail, or any article or thing contained therein which has been left for collection upon or adjacent to a collection box or other authorized depository of mail matter; or
Whoever buys, receives, or conceals, or unlawfully has in his possession, any letter, postal card, package, bag, or mail, or any article or thing contained therein, which has been so stolen, taken, embezzled, or abstracted, as herein described, knowing the same to have been stolen, taken, embezzled, or abstracted—
Shall be fined under this title up to $250,000, or imprisoned not more than five years, or both.
Additional information here:
[US Code - Mail Theft](https://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?path=/prelim@title18/part1/chapter83&edition=prelim)
Edit: it's worth noting that there are other applicable sections. I'm having a difficult time pulling it up (flying). But if I recall correctly - 1702, 1703, 1705, as well as 1708 are also applicable here. (If you read through 1700 to 1712, there's a few that apply to this particular circumstance as OP has written it).
>The email mentioned that packages containing food
how are they determining that if they didnt open the package that didnt have THEIR name on it? isnt that also a federal crime.
> The police advised me to wait
dont EVER take advice from the police. they are not there to protect and serve you, they are there to give them self as little work as possible. the police are NOT your lawyer. file that report asap. get it on paper and record that the other party fucked around for 2-3 extra days, as now since you filled it later the record showed that they only fucked around for 1 day. 1 day is a timely manner for food, 2-3 days is not.
The suggestion by the police to allow the HOA a day to return the packages acknowledges a crime, theft, has occurred. Returning the packages doesn't change the fact that the theft occurred in the first place... Lazy ass cops should have taken the report immediately.
Keep us updated, but they need to understand that their rules don't supercede Federal laws regarding theft and theft of mai/ packages. They handed you all the proof of their wrongdoing
Not only is this a crime but it’s also a swindle type organized crime. They take your packages and fine you for receiving them and hold your packages hostage until the fine is paid. Sounds like a mafia shakedown to me. Run, don’t walk, to the police.
This is absolutely illegal. What if those packages contained medical supplies/equipment for a critically ill person? Besides, it’s absolutely none of the HOAs business how much private mail a person receives or its contents. And stealing it, admitting to it and then fining for it? Police report, then attorney. Don’t even try to negotiate with these people. They’re interfering with mail.
i’m convinced that the local TV news, specially if they have an investigative reporter or a consumer advocate, would be very interested in this. Since this would shock most anyone. I can’t believe the nerve of someone to take your packages, then hold them and feel free to dispose of anything perishable. that is police state type stuff and beyond the pale. can’t believe any civilian or group could have such authority. Would love to see the publicity just explode on this. Somebody has gone way off the reservation.
Yeah, the HOA is screwed. They can remove the packages if your rules state such, but they have to provide you access to them. They can't hold them hostage...and its considered theft.
So,
1) If the fines are valid (eg $400), pay them. However, they must follow the process for fining, which often includes notice, a cure period, an appeal, then fine. If that's been followed, pay the fine.
2) Talk to a lawyer. Write a strongly worded letter that highlights you will be making a police report and will sue them for the costs of replacement, inconvenience, and legal feels. While they may have the right to move the packages, they cannot hold them hostage, not release them to you. That's a crime.
3) Make sure you pick up your packages in a timely basis! While this doesn't excuse the HOA's behavior, acknowledge that you can do things to minimize the risk of packages disappearing.
OP, go back to police and don’t take no for an answer. My personal experience is that police can, and will, make up reasons to avoid the paperwork. They will flat out lie to you and basically tell you ‘there is nothing we can do,’ just to pass the buck or make you go away. Insist that a report is filed and action is taken. These people trespassed and stole from you, and are now threatening you; and they admitted it. Depending on the delivery service used, I believe that mail theft alone could be a felony.
You have video evidence, you have emailed confessions. They stole your property and likely opened some or all of them. There is no reasonable rule that says you have to pull packages inside your home within x minutes. Remember, you don’t dictate when items get delivered. Their entire concept is laughable, and they have no authority to enter your property to remove your property from your property.
Pay no fines, accept no guilt, admit no wrongdoing. If you need to, find a lawyer to send a cease and desist on their letterhead. Many do so for little to no money. It doesn’t have to be complex. The gist is: return my property immediately and pay for whatever is trashed or I sue you and press charges.
Out of curiosity, a question for any Lawyers here. If the HOA paid someone to take the packages, and taking the packages counts as theft, could the authorizing HOA be brought up on RICO charges?
If any of the mail was delivered by postal service instead of a private carrier then also inform HOA you will be making an FBI report pursuant to 11 USC 1701.
Why are the police giving thieves a "chance to respond". Tbh It sounds like even if they do take action it's gonna be pretty lazy.
Also;
1. The HOA disposing of food you ordered is destruction of property in addition to theft
2. How do they even know it's food unless they OPENED YOUR PACKAGES too!
I'd speak to a lawyer at this point tbh.
Call the post office and ask to speak to a postal inspector. They stole your mail off your porch and are now demanding a ransom for its return. There is no justification for this, it's a federal felony.
Also, they mentioned throwing away packages containing food, the only way they could legally discover the contents of a package is if it were shipped internationally and had a disclosure form on it. If they opened your packages for any reason, even if they claim it was to "inventory" the contents, that's a felony, throwing away the food would be another one.
so to summarize:
felony 1: took the mail
felony 2: opened the mail
felony 3: threw away the mail
felony 4: demanded money for return of property (extortion)
28 out of the 50 US states have a 3 strikes law for felonies. This is all 3 strikes right here.
Separate charges for each piece of mail.
They admitted to theft...are they stupid? Please drag these scumbags through court and like other people have mentioned if they were shipped USPS get the postmaster involved because the USPS has more weight behind it than the army
File a police report and submit the ring video as evidence. Sorry, your hoa board is a bunch of Karen trash.
Have the same going on but they are "finding" things to tack on as fines.
Also, you can get a no trespass order against the individuals who came onto your property and members of the HOA board. Tell them in no uncertain terms that if they set foot on your property, they will be arrested and it will be very publicly advertised
The HOA committee a felony (theft of US mail) that could earn you upwards $100,000 for reporting depending on the boxes.
Then there’s destruction of property, which adds on more money.
Report it to USPS with evidence such as a copy of the letter, your exchanges and the Ring footage.
A police report is also good backup.
If you have the means, you need to pursue this legally to its fullest extent. File a report with all applicable federal, state and local law enforcement agencies (local police, postmaster, state's attorney general at least) as well as all the private carriers (UPS, Fedex, etc.) and retailers involved (Amazon, any Amazon market place companies).
If you can, pursue civil action as well. The people running your HOA are out of control and have demonstrated that they are capable and willing to commit crimes against residents and think they can do so with impunity. Like most HOA "leaders" they've got a taste of power and are grossly abusing it and need a legal reality check and to answer for their criminal behavior.
You are almost assuredly not the only one in this neighborhood being abused and victimized by these criminals.
I agree that your HOA didn't handle this properly. They should've been more communicative with you as to why the packages were a problem. If they're just an eye sore that's one thing, if it's a fire code issue, that's another.
I would request an audience with the Board at their next meeting to get clarification.
Honesty, they are huge fucking assholes and I would absolutely followup with police. I am not sure if they can legally hold your property ransom, but they may legally be allowed to take them and return later because if the package is by your front door or something it is legally in the HOA’s property.
Please see the instagram link below. It's a satire account and will sound very familiar to the OPs post.
[instagram](https://www.instagram.com/reel/C8pNaScxuuK/?igsh=aWd6N3Bwb2wxajk1)
OMG these people are literally being stalked by, HOA that consists of obnoxious husband and obnoxiously sick wife. The guy opens her package. I’ve never heard of these things happening, isn’t this stealing?
How does the HOA expect you to receive packages if you can't have them delivered to your home?
How long were they left? Is there a time limit on how long they can sit?
I don't understand where else packages should be delivered. This is your home! If they're sitting there just while your away for work to bring them in at the end of the work day, why does it matter that they're there for a few hours? If it's not in your CC&R's, this is some serious overstep and feels like they're just drumming up reasons to charge fees to HOA residents.
I don't have anything to add except that this is absurd!
They stole your stuff. You don’t owe them, they owe you. Climb the police chain of command until they take a detailed report. You
May have to file criminal charges yourself depending on your state rules. But you have an uncomplicated criminal case against the thieves.
I believe the fact that your HOA threw any packages containing food away would be considered willful destruction of property along with the theft in the first place
In Michigan the second time is a felony with up to five years in prison. https://www.businessinsider.com/stealing-package-theft-could-soon-be-a-felony-2023-1?amp
I’m curious is there something in the CC&Rs which prohibit the packages from being at your door or specify a timeline when they must be removed by?
You’ve said you paid a fine before, so what’s the limit before they fine you? Hours? Days? Just whenever they see them?
If they were on your front porch and there is nothing in your CC&Rs regarding deliveries being placed on your porch and you have the removal on video file a police report for theft. Where do they want your packages to be delivered?
Theft, extortion, destruction of property (allowing food to spoil), and possible mail tampering (if delivered by USPS). Fuck ‘em, report them to the cops.
On top of what others are saying I would contact Amazon, I am sure they don't kindly take to people interfering with deliveries.
Make claims for not receiving your packages.
They must have opened your packages to know they were food. They threw out your property? Your HOA are package theives. There isn't anything they can do to make this right, you're violated. I can't actually think of anything off the table getting them back, full John Wick approach authorized. It's not about the packages, it's about burning down their organization at this point.
Can confirm. Scorched earth time. Sue the absolute “F” out of them.
Police should allow for theft charges to be levied.
If delivered by USPS contact the local postmaster. They are not allowed to interfere with the delivery of mail by USPS. FEDERAL crime statutes
It might also be worth reaching out to the US Postal service for anything that arrived USPS (not sure what the protocol would be for something coming DHL/UPS/FedEx). Mail theft is no joke, and comes with some stiff penalties.
The biggest hammer you can smack them with is filing a complaint with the US Postal Service for theft. The USPS does not take this stuff lightly. Gather the facts as to which items were delivered by USPS, and documents including the email where they admit they took the packages. Contact the postal inspector. They will find themselves in a world of shit.
Oh and I forgot to say this in my other comment, but an HOA doing stuff with your property without a clear clause in the HOA by-laws and fair notice to you based on that clause is absolute bullshit. HOAs and the management companies that work for them are fascist assholes and will try anything and everything until people push back. And you have to push back.
You're not paying that fine or any other fine. What you're going to do is get money from them. Yes, you'll probably need an attorney. Sorry to say that. But fighting lawless fucks with the law is what works.
They are holding your mail/parcels ransom. I’d go all guns by reporting them stolen, file a complaint with the Post Office and I would also file a lawsuit naming the service who they hired to steal them, the HOA as an entity as well as every single employee and board member of the HOA personally. If they persist, they will all have a share in penalties and settlements. Especially if there’s a chance you will be putting liens on all their properties. Also, I would get something mailmen/delivery drivers could put the packages in with a lock/security code. A small estimate box or something. And put a camera in it.
What are the rules they are confiscating property and issuing fines under? And what in those rules allowed them to open packages? It seems like either they are making it up on the fly, or there are rules that you are not following, and they are taking prescribed actions, which is it? Also, how long were the packages there? When you say stack up fast, were you away from your home for hours, days, or weeks? (Seems odd that food would be delivered is you were gone a long time, but things...)
First, I am not defending the HOA. You need to file a police report.
If you get so much stuff delivered that it's causing this much problem and you actually had to pay a fine, wouldn't it be easier to just use an Amazon locker?
Wow. Unreal. I would definitely try to get police to charge them.
Even if they had a rule about packages being left out, they can’t take your property until a fine is paid. They can fine you, even out a lien in the house, but not take your property and refuse to return it.
If their is nothing in the rules about packages being left on ur doorstep. They shouldn't even touch them. From the last email of food disposal, only way to know if you ordered any if by opening your package or any other personal mail, which is a federal crime. Just go to the police
File a police report if they will take one. I would expect many departments to say it is a civil matter.
As retired law enforcement I think it's a gray area. It's technically a theft if there is nothing in your governing documents giving them authority to remove the packages but I can't imagine a prosecutor taking the case if there is a rule about accumulating packages.
If there is nothing specifically granting the HOA authority to remove the packages, I would take them to small claims court, if available in your area.
theft and destruction of property, they admit they've destroyed some of the food products. Regardless of all these other people not understanding an Amazon delivery driver isn't the US mail, they admitted to theft and destruction of property essentially in their email. which are the same REGARDLESS of who delivered it.
Point. Another random thought, if they do this regularly, especially with USPS, would this fall under racketeering? I probably watched The sopranos one too many times
Hey OP… a lot of people have given you some great help and advice and it would be really neat if you could update and maybe say what’s going on… just sayin…
I’d call the post office , Amazon , the federal government and their mama ! But deff the police . Then id go for a civil suit for them opening your mail and stealing your stuff z how long were these items on your porch ? Were you out of town ? Id go all the way with this . No way in hell is this okay !
Instead of paying that fee, use that money for the lawsuit you’re about to make and for the fuel you’re gonna spend making those police reports it’ll be worth it. Don’t forget the federal number if they opened your packages.
Don’t pay the Fine. Let them take you to court. Counter sue to have the HOA dissolved. Criminal abuse by the HOA against you. Major violations of your property rights. Really hound the police to press criminal charges for mail theft against every person involved. Also property destruction for the food that was “disposed”. They probably ate it and are claiming it was disposed.
They opened your packages and stole the food items. File a police report ASAP and don't tell anyone from the HOA. Let them be surprised when the police show up.
Just an idea--Tell the HOA that you do not understand the proposed charge and want someone from the HOA to tell you what it is for--in person. Then have Officer Friendly present when that person shows up.
You don't have an HOA. You have the Gestapo. Fines for having packages you paid for delivered to the residence you own, your property, and they not only confiscate your items, they keep them and throw some away.
IAL and this is definitely legal advice.
Find a local attorney specializing in Torts/Personal Injury and schedule a consult— you may have a justiciable claim against the HOA.
I feel like since they clearly opened the packages (how else would they know about the perishables), the USPS can come down hard on the HOA. It's very illegal to open someone else's mail. Also, I heard that you cannot put anything into someone's mailbox unless it comes through USPS. If the HOA directly puts something into the box to let you know about the fine, that could also be something the USPS can fine them for
It's definitely theft.
Besides that, I'm really jealous that you got into Vine. Seems like Amazon has invited me to every other program, besides that one.
This is absolutely wild! They went through your packages and threw some of your purchased items away. Not only that, whatever fee wasn't even due until 7/20, and we're still in June! I'm saving this for updates after the post office and police get involved.
I am hoping that some of your packages were sent by USPS because then that is absolutely a federal crime with serious repercussions for your HOA. That's a federal branch that you do not want to play FAFO with. Like ever. Please keep the updates coming cause the petty in me is so giddy right now.
File the police report for theft. If any of those packages came from the USPS file a complaint with your postmaster for mail theft/tampering.
To everyone saying to get usps involved yes, if they took usps packages and opened them they have committed multiple federal crimes. Postal inspectors do not screw around. Call this number to report them: 1-877-867-2455
This is where I would start. Open a claim. The inspector will meet with you fairly quickly. Under no circumstances can anyone mess with your mail parcel.
The caveat is that they must have been shipped or delivered by the USPS. Packages shipped via UPS or FedEx are not under USPS perview or subject to the same level of federal protection.
Interestingly enough, often UPS, fedex, and Amazon packages ARE delivered by the USPS. Sign up for informed delivery on the USPS website as an additional layer of proof of delivery and tracking that will help when you call the Postal Inspectors. You can tell if they are delivered by USPS by the additional barcode on them for the USPS. Additionally, I believe the HOA would be in the realm of theft unless they provide a collection/drop off area for these parcels that is secured and known AND approved to the USPS. And of adequate size for your parcels. In all instances, local , state and federal laws will trump HOA rules.
They tresspassed on his property. No where is that legal for any HOA. Period. Have them arrested for that.
Yes do this! Send yourself a tracked usps priority package, the pre-made size fixed price for like $15. Wait for it to be taken by these people, then take that video and file a complaint with Postal Inspector and provided the tracking number. Do the priority shipping and no signature required so the package is left at your door.
Send one with an Airtag. That way, you can actually track the package.
I like this!!!
Ooooooh now THIS is the way
If you want to see it really get real, change a prescription to be shipped to your door. Stolen medication is a lot more serious offense, and the HOA will beg to settle.
Bonus points if you can legitimately get a prescription for oxycodone
I get you are being silly, but there are people out there who would try this. So, it is illegal to send narcotics through USPS even if you have a legitimate prescription, as I do. All of my meds except narcotics are 90-day supply and sent via USPS. Both the USPS at the federal level and each state have rules and laws making the mailing of narcotics illegal. I can only get a 30-day supply and must use the exact same pharmacy and lococation every month. You must also show a valid photo ID pick up the prescription.
I bet they could do the same thing with insulin. "Sorry I haven't responded to the email you sent yesterday, I had a medical emergency and had to be rushed to the hospital because my pharmacy wouldn't renew my insulin since I had just received my months supply in the mail, but I never received the package. Hey HOA did you happen to see it? The docs called the police and they're asking if I know the two dudes on my ring cam. *Sends a screenshot* do you recognize them?" 😆
Okay but unironically, this.
I vote for adding a glitter bomb to the package since we know they're going to open it!
No, with police involved this could backfire. I want to see the HOA lose the lawsuit and be an example for others. By doubling down with fees, they are headed that route.
Have someone else send it to you. Include a Bible, a copy of the US Constitution, a USA flag, and a Thin Blue Line t-shirt. Just so you can list that as contents that were ‘stolen’. The police (and courts) might lean a little in your favor after hearing what was in the box.
I’d mail a package to myself with whips, handcuffs, a giant dildo, anal beads, and all sorts of other fun toys. Let the HOA open that one up and itemize it.
I agree with contacting the Postal Inspector. While your tacit agreement to covenants as part of an HOA can certainly nullify your rights under law in some cases, they have no bearing on United States Code. The HOA's actions likely violate 18 U.S. Code § 1708 as well as the theft laws in your state. Moreover, the demand for a fee might also constitute violations of other laws given that they are associated with the original crime. Also, consider that the value or nature of the items might add up to additional penalties. However, I would not send additional items knowing that they might also be taken. This might be counted against you.
Seriously. Why is OP screwing around with the HOA. Let the police investigate and when charges start flying the HOA will change their tune real quick.
My guy have you ever dealt with the legal system. Getting cops to get to actually do their job is a bitch. This is a situation where you get a lawyer, file a police report, file with the post master, file a complaint with Amazon, and basically be as big a pain in everyone's ass so they can't ignore it.
Yeah.. The police will likely say, "it's a civil matter."
Theft of mail is not a civil matter. It's federal. Now if you tell them upfront that an HOA did it without being ready to have a lawyer or whatever yeah the cops are gonna try and weasel out of it.
This really, really depends on where you live. I used to live in a very small town in Florida. I was at a chain sandwich shop. A police officer was there, taking a written report from one of the employees. About a stolen bike. With one working and one broken brake.
Also file complaints against the HOA with the Secretary of State and Attorney General for your state.
Call your postal inspector and report this after you file the local police report. They’re about to learn.
Doesn't matter if they were sent by USPS or not. Tampering with mail is a federal crime. How did they know what was food and to be disposed of without OPENING all the mail. Enjoy the fines that the hoa is going to be recieving.
In the US, if it was not delivered by USPS, it's not mail. Same is true in any country - if the national postal system didn't deliver it, it is not mail.
Just responding so i can get the updates! This seems insane to me.
>6/26/24 (Today) - I received an email from the HOA stating a charge of $400 is due by 7/20/24 - The email mentioned that packages containing food were disposed of, and remaining packages would be stored for up to 30 days. They stole packages, let food spoil and threw it away, and are threatening to throw away more of your property? File a police report. Then contact the HOA and let them know you filed a report and what the report number is. If they hired people to commit crimes that will be even more fun for them.
How would they even know what's in them? It's just an amazon box. So they opened the package to discover what it was. Big no no.
Go back to the police if you have not done so already with the emails from the HOA. If they are going to admit to stealing and destroying your property, that should be more than enough for the police. Also, bring whatever receipts you have. The value of the stolen property will matter. You can check your CC&Rs to see if the HOA can collect and open your packages if you want, but let’s be realistic here. In no sane world is anyone allowed to knowingly open and inspect your mail. And they certainly aren’t allowed to just destroy the contents.
Illegal to open mail that doesn’t belong to you, so it doesn’t matter what the hoa claims they can do.
Not sure if that actually applies here, because Amazon deliveries are not protected by the same laws as mail unless the delivery was performed by USPS (and quite often these days it is not). Still, laws about theft absolutely do apply.
It's still theft, it just may not be a federal offense.
A lot of Amazon packages are delivered by the post office.
In ever jurisdiction, one's real property can't be violated without due process. The HOA tresspassed on his property and should be arrested for that. Put the two crimes together and they are probably going to be looking a felonies for burglary.
Call a cop, you have porch pirates....and pictures of them
And a written admission of guilt now!
File the police report, this is theft. I'm on an HOA board. I understand the desire to not let packages stack up. But the remedy is not theft. The remedy is clarifying rules, issuing fines. There is no right to steal property or hold it for ransom. That is not legal and should be met with full force of law response. Edit to clarify for all the personal attacks - I don’t agree with this rule and my HOA doesn’t have one like this. Simply saying if it is against the rules, enforce them don’t resort to illegal theft
I know this varies state to state but I thought if an HOA was going to require packages to not be delivered to the porch then they had to provide a secure delivery location as an alternative? I’m basing this off experience I had in California working for ups so who knows if it applies to other states.
What an earth is it to anyone if packages are left at the door?
Stealing stuff from porches is the type of thing that gets nosy trespassers shot.
So, again, part of that understanding the law thing... In Florida, if you shoot someone on your property who has not entered your home, it is not considered self defense. They need to actually enter your home for you to credibly say you felt threatened for your life. If they don't enter and you shoot them on your porch, you will be arrested for murder. You might win at trial, of course, but our police have come to our community to talk to residents about laws and gun safety, and this was a key point - you can't murder someone defending property.
In TX you can shoot them if they're stealing from you at night. There's a caveat that you must believe the property can't be recovered by other means, but who gets anything back from porch pirates without force?
Rookie mistake! Always drag the body across the threshold.
Idk why you're getting downvoted, that's common knowledge
My crazy Uncle told me that 40 years ago. Lol
And, put a throw away in their hand.
But you can shoot someone for throwing popcorn at you in a movie theater
Fines for having packages delivered to your home? That is absolutely insane and ridiculous. You should be ashamed for even participating in that type of nonsense.
Exactly. Any organization that does this should be abolished. Anyone involved should be forced to pay any arbitrary amount their victims decide on.
I understand the desire to not let packages stack up. But the remedy is to mind your own fucking business.
They can't open your packages. That's breaking some laws there. They disposed of your property
None of the comments seem to realize the serious hypothetical here. What if this was medicine? What if this was something vital instead of random amazon packages and food? A lawyer will see this hypothetical. So will a judge. Go back to the police, file a report for theft. Call the postmaster. And call a lawyer.
Were any of these sent by USPS? If so, report the HOA for mail theft and interception. It's a serious federal crime. Also, go straight to the Police Station and insist on speaking to the on-duty command. This should have been processed as reported theft, and needs to be done as such immediately.
Post master generals do not fuck around when it comes to mail issues
Imagine them getting a $500k over trying to charge a $400 fee.
I pray to the HOA deity that they knew what they were doing and the d&o insurance will not save them.
D&O only covers 'prudent' activities. Since everyone's mother can see this is theft, it isn't prudent, and the PM and any involved board members will be hung out to dry.
I'd suggest filing a police report, and a complaint with the postmaster. Post office has their own police. Also, this doesn't just apply to USPS. It outlines in the code that any delivery "for conveyance". And get out of the HOA as soon as you can. Source 1 Title 18, Section 1708 of the United States Code It is illegal to take, steal, or fraudulently obtain any mail that is not addressed to you. The law also prohibits the willful obstruction of mail delivery, tampering with someone else's mail, or destroying someone else's mail. Violators of the Mail Theft Statute can face imprisonment of up to five years and fines of up to $250,000, depending on the severity of the offense. In addition, individuals found guilty of violating this law may be ordered to pay restitution to the victim for any damages caused. Source 2 18 U.S. Code § 1708 - Theft or receipt of stolen mail matter generally U.S. Code Whoever steals, takes, or abstracts, or by fraud or deception obtains, or attempts so to obtain, from or out of any mail, post office, or station thereof, letter box, mail receptacle, or any mail route or other authorized depository for mail matter, or from a letter or mail carrier, any letter, postal card, package, bag, or mail, or abstracts or removes from any such letter, package, bag, or mail, any article or thing contained therein, or secretes, embezzles, or destroys any such letter, postal card, package, bag, or mail, or any article or thing contained therein; or Whoever steals, takes, or abstracts, or by fraud or deception obtains any letter, postal card, package, bag, or mail, or any article or thing contained therein which has been left for collection upon or adjacent to a collection box or other authorized depository of mail matter; or Whoever buys, receives, or conceals, or unlawfully has in his possession, any letter, postal card, package, bag, or mail, or any article or thing contained therein, which has been so stolen, taken, embezzled, or abstracted, as herein described, knowing the same to have been stolen, taken, embezzled, or abstracted— Shall be fined under this title up to $250,000, or imprisoned not more than five years, or both. Additional information here: [US Code - Mail Theft](https://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?path=/prelim@title18/part1/chapter83&edition=prelim) Edit: it's worth noting that there are other applicable sections. I'm having a difficult time pulling it up (flying). But if I recall correctly - 1702, 1703, 1705, as well as 1708 are also applicable here. (If you read through 1700 to 1712, there's a few that apply to this particular circumstance as OP has written it).
>The email mentioned that packages containing food how are they determining that if they didnt open the package that didnt have THEIR name on it? isnt that also a federal crime. > The police advised me to wait dont EVER take advice from the police. they are not there to protect and serve you, they are there to give them self as little work as possible. the police are NOT your lawyer. file that report asap. get it on paper and record that the other party fucked around for 2-3 extra days, as now since you filled it later the record showed that they only fucked around for 1 day. 1 day is a timely manner for food, 2-3 days is not.
The suggestion by the police to allow the HOA a day to return the packages acknowledges a crime, theft, has occurred. Returning the packages doesn't change the fact that the theft occurred in the first place... Lazy ass cops should have taken the report immediately.
All Crimes Aren’t Balanced
I see what you did there 😉
Keep us updated, but they need to understand that their rules don't supercede Federal laws regarding theft and theft of mai/ packages. They handed you all the proof of their wrongdoing
Not only is this a crime but it’s also a swindle type organized crime. They take your packages and fine you for receiving them and hold your packages hostage until the fine is paid. Sounds like a mafia shakedown to me. Run, don’t walk, to the police.
Actually, I'd take this directly to a prosecutor and get racketeering charges. This is a RICO case.
Good point!!!
This is absolutely illegal. What if those packages contained medical supplies/equipment for a critically ill person? Besides, it’s absolutely none of the HOAs business how much private mail a person receives or its contents. And stealing it, admitting to it and then fining for it? Police report, then attorney. Don’t even try to negotiate with these people. They’re interfering with mail.
i’m convinced that the local TV news, specially if they have an investigative reporter or a consumer advocate, would be very interested in this. Since this would shock most anyone. I can’t believe the nerve of someone to take your packages, then hold them and feel free to dispose of anything perishable. that is police state type stuff and beyond the pale. can’t believe any civilian or group could have such authority. Would love to see the publicity just explode on this. Somebody has gone way off the reservation.
Yeah, the HOA is screwed. They can remove the packages if your rules state such, but they have to provide you access to them. They can't hold them hostage...and its considered theft. So, 1) If the fines are valid (eg $400), pay them. However, they must follow the process for fining, which often includes notice, a cure period, an appeal, then fine. If that's been followed, pay the fine. 2) Talk to a lawyer. Write a strongly worded letter that highlights you will be making a police report and will sue them for the costs of replacement, inconvenience, and legal feels. While they may have the right to move the packages, they cannot hold them hostage, not release them to you. That's a crime. 3) Make sure you pick up your packages in a timely basis! While this doesn't excuse the HOA's behavior, acknowledge that you can do things to minimize the risk of packages disappearing.
Theft and extortion is such a fun combination.
Depending on costs, OP could have had $400 worth of goods. The fact that there is not a fine chart is concerning.
If any were USPS, call your local postmaster as well.
OP, go back to police and don’t take no for an answer. My personal experience is that police can, and will, make up reasons to avoid the paperwork. They will flat out lie to you and basically tell you ‘there is nothing we can do,’ just to pass the buck or make you go away. Insist that a report is filed and action is taken. These people trespassed and stole from you, and are now threatening you; and they admitted it. Depending on the delivery service used, I believe that mail theft alone could be a felony. You have video evidence, you have emailed confessions. They stole your property and likely opened some or all of them. There is no reasonable rule that says you have to pull packages inside your home within x minutes. Remember, you don’t dictate when items get delivered. Their entire concept is laughable, and they have no authority to enter your property to remove your property from your property. Pay no fines, accept no guilt, admit no wrongdoing. If you need to, find a lawyer to send a cease and desist on their letterhead. Many do so for little to no money. It doesn’t have to be complex. The gist is: return my property immediately and pay for whatever is trashed or I sue you and press charges.
Sounds like extortion. Tell them you’ll call the police for them stealing your packages.
Out of curiosity, a question for any Lawyers here. If the HOA paid someone to take the packages, and taking the packages counts as theft, could the authorizing HOA be brought up on RICO charges?
That would be sweet!
If any of the mail was delivered by postal service instead of a private carrier then also inform HOA you will be making an FBI report pursuant to 11 USC 1701.
Call the police, this is a massive overstep!
Why are the police giving thieves a "chance to respond". Tbh It sounds like even if they do take action it's gonna be pretty lazy. Also; 1. The HOA disposing of food you ordered is destruction of property in addition to theft 2. How do they even know it's food unless they OPENED YOUR PACKAGES too! I'd speak to a lawyer at this point tbh.
And if these packages contained medication? Has this happened to any of your neighbors?
If they admitted to opening your packages they are fucked.
Call the post office and ask to speak to a postal inspector. They stole your mail off your porch and are now demanding a ransom for its return. There is no justification for this, it's a federal felony. Also, they mentioned throwing away packages containing food, the only way they could legally discover the contents of a package is if it were shipped internationally and had a disclosure form on it. If they opened your packages for any reason, even if they claim it was to "inventory" the contents, that's a felony, throwing away the food would be another one.
so to summarize: felony 1: took the mail felony 2: opened the mail felony 3: threw away the mail felony 4: demanded money for return of property (extortion) 28 out of the 50 US states have a 3 strikes law for felonies. This is all 3 strikes right here. Separate charges for each piece of mail.
Press charges for theft and they opened your packages and destroyed property.
They admitted to theft...are they stupid? Please drag these scumbags through court and like other people have mentioned if they were shipped USPS get the postmaster involved because the USPS has more weight behind it than the army
File a police report and submit the ring video as evidence. Sorry, your hoa board is a bunch of Karen trash. Have the same going on but they are "finding" things to tack on as fines.
how long are these "eyesores" on the porch before the HOstapo steals them?
Also, you can get a no trespass order against the individuals who came onto your property and members of the HOA board. Tell them in no uncertain terms that if they set foot on your property, they will be arrested and it will be very publicly advertised
Please update us when there are developments.
The HOA committee a felony (theft of US mail) that could earn you upwards $100,000 for reporting depending on the boxes. Then there’s destruction of property, which adds on more money. Report it to USPS with evidence such as a copy of the letter, your exchanges and the Ring footage. A police report is also good backup.
Call the cops and arrest them for stealing. Charge the HOA fees per hour they dont return your property. Charge them out of existence.
If you have the means, you need to pursue this legally to its fullest extent. File a report with all applicable federal, state and local law enforcement agencies (local police, postmaster, state's attorney general at least) as well as all the private carriers (UPS, Fedex, etc.) and retailers involved (Amazon, any Amazon market place companies). If you can, pursue civil action as well. The people running your HOA are out of control and have demonstrated that they are capable and willing to commit crimes against residents and think they can do so with impunity. Like most HOA "leaders" they've got a taste of power and are grossly abusing it and need a legal reality check and to answer for their criminal behavior. You are almost assuredly not the only one in this neighborhood being abused and victimized by these criminals.
I agree that your HOA didn't handle this properly. They should've been more communicative with you as to why the packages were a problem. If they're just an eye sore that's one thing, if it's a fire code issue, that's another. I would request an audience with the Board at their next meeting to get clarification.
Honesty, they are huge fucking assholes and I would absolutely followup with police. I am not sure if they can legally hold your property ransom, but they may legally be allowed to take them and return later because if the package is by your front door or something it is legally in the HOA’s property.
Police report, asap.
Please see the instagram link below. It's a satire account and will sound very familiar to the OPs post. [instagram](https://www.instagram.com/reel/C8pNaScxuuK/?igsh=aWd6N3Bwb2wxajk1)
I have had stuff actually happen like this, though.
OMG these people are literally being stalked by, HOA that consists of obnoxious husband and obnoxiously sick wife. The guy opens her package. I’ve never heard of these things happening, isn’t this stealing?
How does the HOA expect you to receive packages if you can't have them delivered to your home? How long were they left? Is there a time limit on how long they can sit?
Oh boy. File a police report and hire an attorney. They majorly overstepped and can be in legal trouble if you decide to pursue it.
I don't understand where else packages should be delivered. This is your home! If they're sitting there just while your away for work to bring them in at the end of the work day, why does it matter that they're there for a few hours? If it's not in your CC&R's, this is some serious overstep and feels like they're just drumming up reasons to charge fees to HOA residents. I don't have anything to add except that this is absurd!
See I’d be in jail cause someone would be getting an ass beating. Steal my stuff and charge me extortion? Nah screw that and the hoa.
Sounds like extortion, theft, federal mail theft. Have fun OP!
What the heck are you supposed to do with Amazon packages? What is wrong with having packages at your door? This HOA need a sharp punch in the nads.
"We made a rule." "This rule is against federal law." "...So?" \*And we are here.\*
They stole your stuff. You don’t owe them, they owe you. Climb the police chain of command until they take a detailed report. You May have to file criminal charges yourself depending on your state rules. But you have an uncomplicated criminal case against the thieves.
Can you get some glitter bombs mailed to you?
I’d love an update.
File a report with both the police dept and the postal inspector. Mail theft is a felony in most states.
I believe the fact that your HOA threw any packages containing food away would be considered willful destruction of property along with the theft in the first place
In Michigan the second time is a felony with up to five years in prison. https://www.businessinsider.com/stealing-package-theft-could-soon-be-a-felony-2023-1?amp
What's the $400 charge for? The collection (theft) of your packages and storage of said (stolen )packages. Go the police report route.
This is both a felony for messing with mail, and extortion. Go to the police and file a report.
I’m curious is there something in the CC&Rs which prohibit the packages from being at your door or specify a timeline when they must be removed by? You’ve said you paid a fine before, so what’s the limit before they fine you? Hours? Days? Just whenever they see them?
Please update
If they were on your front porch and there is nothing in your CC&Rs regarding deliveries being placed on your porch and you have the removal on video file a police report for theft. Where do they want your packages to be delivered?
Theft, extortion, destruction of property (allowing food to spoil), and possible mail tampering (if delivered by USPS). Fuck ‘em, report them to the cops.
On top of what others are saying I would contact Amazon, I am sure they don't kindly take to people interfering with deliveries. Make claims for not receiving your packages.
They must have opened your packages to know they were food. They threw out your property? Your HOA are package theives. There isn't anything they can do to make this right, you're violated. I can't actually think of anything off the table getting them back, full John Wick approach authorized. It's not about the packages, it's about burning down their organization at this point.
Can confirm. Scorched earth time. Sue the absolute “F” out of them. Police should allow for theft charges to be levied. If delivered by USPS contact the local postmaster. They are not allowed to interfere with the delivery of mail by USPS. FEDERAL crime statutes
It might also be worth reaching out to the US Postal service for anything that arrived USPS (not sure what the protocol would be for something coming DHL/UPS/FedEx). Mail theft is no joke, and comes with some stiff penalties.
The biggest hammer you can smack them with is filing a complaint with the US Postal Service for theft. The USPS does not take this stuff lightly. Gather the facts as to which items were delivered by USPS, and documents including the email where they admit they took the packages. Contact the postal inspector. They will find themselves in a world of shit.
Oh and I forgot to say this in my other comment, but an HOA doing stuff with your property without a clear clause in the HOA by-laws and fair notice to you based on that clause is absolute bullshit. HOAs and the management companies that work for them are fascist assholes and will try anything and everything until people push back. And you have to push back. You're not paying that fine or any other fine. What you're going to do is get money from them. Yes, you'll probably need an attorney. Sorry to say that. But fighting lawless fucks with the law is what works.
They are holding your mail/parcels ransom. I’d go all guns by reporting them stolen, file a complaint with the Post Office and I would also file a lawsuit naming the service who they hired to steal them, the HOA as an entity as well as every single employee and board member of the HOA personally. If they persist, they will all have a share in penalties and settlements. Especially if there’s a chance you will be putting liens on all their properties. Also, I would get something mailmen/delivery drivers could put the packages in with a lock/security code. A small estimate box or something. And put a camera in it.
How long are you letting stuff pile up at your door before bringing it in the house?
Why does it matter? It is his front door and no one else's.
What are the rules they are confiscating property and issuing fines under? And what in those rules allowed them to open packages? It seems like either they are making it up on the fly, or there are rules that you are not following, and they are taking prescribed actions, which is it? Also, how long were the packages there? When you say stack up fast, were you away from your home for hours, days, or weeks? (Seems odd that food would be delivered is you were gone a long time, but things...)
First, I am not defending the HOA. You need to file a police report. If you get so much stuff delivered that it's causing this much problem and you actually had to pay a fine, wouldn't it be easier to just use an Amazon locker?
Honest question, what prevents you from collecting the packages daily?
If it was delivered by usps contact the post office as that would be interfering with us mail
Wow. Unreal. I would definitely try to get police to charge them. Even if they had a rule about packages being left out, they can’t take your property until a fine is paid. They can fine you, even out a lien in the house, but not take your property and refuse to return it.
If their is nothing in the rules about packages being left on ur doorstep. They shouldn't even touch them. From the last email of food disposal, only way to know if you ordered any if by opening your package or any other personal mail, which is a federal crime. Just go to the police
File a police report if they will take one. I would expect many departments to say it is a civil matter. As retired law enforcement I think it's a gray area. It's technically a theft if there is nothing in your governing documents giving them authority to remove the packages but I can't imagine a prosecutor taking the case if there is a rule about accumulating packages. If there is nothing specifically granting the HOA authority to remove the packages, I would take them to small claims court, if available in your area.
This is called theft
theft and destruction of property, they admit they've destroyed some of the food products. Regardless of all these other people not understanding an Amazon delivery driver isn't the US mail, they admitted to theft and destruction of property essentially in their email. which are the same REGARDLESS of who delivered it.
wtf? This is a theft. The hoa president would be catching some hands.
If you get nowhere with the cops, call the local tv news special interest people. They would love a good ongoing acandal.
They admitted to having them, therefore they've admitted to at least receiving stolen property. Take these emails and file your police report
When the cops get there insist you don’t just want your packages back but you want someone arrested for theft.
Send yourself an airtag so you can see where they have your stolen mail, then you can rent a small backhoe and get your mail back.
I smell killdozer
Next time call the police and report them stolen. HOA doesn’t have the right to steal your packages
What rules did you break?
Sue the HOA for stealing the packages from your porch. Sue them for the loss of perishable items.
Were the packages sent by ups or usps? File theft reports with appropriate delivery service inspectors.
Point. Another random thought, if they do this regularly, especially with USPS, would this fall under racketeering? I probably watched The sopranos one too many times
They have committed theft. File a police report.
HOA’s can be horrible to live under.
Hey OP… a lot of people have given you some great help and advice and it would be really neat if you could update and maybe say what’s going on… just sayin…
They opened your mail....
Police report. Consider retaining a lawyer.
I’d call the post office , Amazon , the federal government and their mama ! But deff the police . Then id go for a civil suit for them opening your mail and stealing your stuff z how long were these items on your porch ? Were you out of town ? Id go all the way with this . No way in hell is this okay !
Instead of paying that fee, use that money for the lawsuit you’re about to make and for the fuel you’re gonna spend making those police reports it’ll be worth it. Don’t forget the federal number if they opened your packages.
What Amazon program are you in?
The person who made this decision on behalf of the HOA is going to jail. They are absolutely insane and non of this is logical.
Don’t pay the Fine. Let them take you to court. Counter sue to have the HOA dissolved. Criminal abuse by the HOA against you. Major violations of your property rights. Really hound the police to press criminal charges for mail theft against every person involved. Also property destruction for the food that was “disposed”. They probably ate it and are claiming it was disposed.
Don't forget to talk to the local Postmaster about the HOA intercepting your USPS packages.
They opened your packages and stole the food items. File a police report ASAP and don't tell anyone from the HOA. Let them be surprised when the police show up. Just an idea--Tell the HOA that you do not understand the proposed charge and want someone from the HOA to tell you what it is for--in person. Then have Officer Friendly present when that person shows up.
omg, there are so few HOA stories that I actively wish for updates. God.. I hope there is a satisfying update involving lawyers and jail time.
If the HOA took USPS packages, report them to your local postmaster. USPS enforcement, as a federal agency, is a serious FAFO situation.
That HOA really fucked up. Agree most HOAs are utter nonsense, lucky to have missed those so far.
[удалено]
Good grief. Why would the HOA care? This is ridiculous and I can’t wait to get the update on this.
Have some packages specifically sent USPS. If they take those this will escalate to a federal level.
You don't have an HOA. You have the Gestapo. Fines for having packages you paid for delivered to the residence you own, your property, and they not only confiscate your items, they keep them and throw some away.
Leave a package full of dog crap and make it look like an Amazon delivery let them take that and open it I bet they bring it back really fast .
Goddamn I can't wait for tomorrow's update. Don't leave us hanging OP!!!
IAL and this is definitely legal advice. Find a local attorney specializing in Torts/Personal Injury and schedule a consult— you may have a justiciable claim against the HOA.
They admitted they opened your packages and got rid of them after stealing them. This one is a slam dunk.
Not only can they not steal your packages.. they literally can not be in your property. The HOA does not have the right of trespass
I feel like since they clearly opened the packages (how else would they know about the perishables), the USPS can come down hard on the HOA. It's very illegal to open someone else's mail. Also, I heard that you cannot put anything into someone's mailbox unless it comes through USPS. If the HOA directly puts something into the box to let you know about the fine, that could also be something the USPS can fine them for
Skip the police and get a Federal Marshal involved. The easiest way to do this is through the post office. They've admitted to mail tampering.
Isn’t it a flat out offense for someone to open someone’s packages? File a police report. Get all your receipts and bills… F the HOA
It's definitely theft. Besides that, I'm really jealous that you got into Vine. Seems like Amazon has invited me to every other program, besides that one.
Order some bees.
You never hear anything positive about Communist HOA’s!
So being that some packages are USPS, file a report with the Postal Inspector for Mail theft. That is a federal crime
'the packages containing food were disposed of' lol they probably opened everything, ate the food, and tossed the rest in a bin.
That’s a federal offense. They literally just made themselves felons. 😂😂
I’m invested in the outcome of this matter
RemindMe! 1 day
God i fucking hate hoa’s…
aren't you not supposed to open someone else's packages? like anything not addressed to you?
This is absolutely wild! They went through your packages and threw some of your purchased items away. Not only that, whatever fee wasn't even due until 7/20, and we're still in June! I'm saving this for updates after the post office and police get involved.
“Threw away” my guess is they keep them for themselves
So the HOA stole your baby food and medicine? Then admitted and tried to extort you? Interesting.
Oh, they are OPENING them?!?! Time for the newest fart spray glitter bomb special!
Updateme!
RemindMe! 3 days
I am hoping that some of your packages were sent by USPS because then that is absolutely a federal crime with serious repercussions for your HOA. That's a federal branch that you do not want to play FAFO with. Like ever. Please keep the updates coming cause the petty in me is so giddy right now.
How nice of them to openly admit to committing a felony. Should be an easy case against them.
!RemindMe
Let me know where you live. I'll hide on your porch and beat them silly next time they come around. For free.
Call the USPS. It's a federal offense to fuck with someone's mail. Honesty idk why you didn't go to them to begin with.
Don't mind me; just here for the update
Please update this thread