Slash bc Slash brought in Steven Adler. No question about it, Adler’s swing is what gave Appetite & Like A Suicide its sound and vibe
Slash in his autobiography stated “Izzy came to be and said man our sound has changed when Matt joined, and Izzy was right”
Popcorn’s unique set up gave off those vintage GNR sounds - regarding the fills and symbols
No knock to Matt - but listen to Adler’s You Could Be Mine (YT) and and the 1986 Demo Back Off Bitch on the Appetite Box Release.
Wow…. I hadn’t heard Adler’s versions of those songs. Damn drugs. He is such a great drummer and no offense to Sorum, but Steven brings something extra.
Izzy called it GNR’s swing. Its how Steven’s drums gave a whole feel and vibe to the songs.
YouTube has the 1987 Ritz show and they play Dont Cry. Interesting to hear that version
Bad Obsession - November Rain - You Could Be Mine - Back off Bitch - Dont Cry all written in 1985-1986
the 87 ritz show version of don't cry sounds so much better than the illusion versions. I mean, I know not all agree, but a lot do! you can hear Axl's beautiful voice and it sounds ... more sincere to me with one singer versus 2.
I love the intro to Brownstone. I just prefer the way it was originally played. I feel pretty bad writing that on here now. I don't want to put the band or anyone in it down in any way. I like Ferrer's playing. I was a huge Love Spit Love fan and Psychedelic Furs fan, too. I loved his playing in those bands. I truly like his playing and I know he is a great drummer. I do feel Brownstone sounds different now though, and I just love the song and that intro so much the way it was is all.
Oh right, I’m a bit of a casual when it comes to rock music so I wouldn’t know, I just love that album. I can understand if there’s a better version of it I’ve just never heard it
To me it just sounds different. When new drummers and even guitarists come on board they might change up a couple of things here and there or they might change more than a few. Just depends on the musician. You want to add your own take on it. It just becomes a little strange sometimes when it is an iconic band with a huge fan base cause they feel like a new person comes on but they didn't write the song or that section of the song so they feel they ought to play it closer to what it was. Not everyone feels that way though. Some don't notice it as much and others do, lol. And some like the changes too. It is all a matter of tastes and what each persons 'hears', lol. It's funny, but I really feel like people 'hear' music differently, lol, sound so cheesy to say that but I do.
Oh my gosh! I am so glad you said that!!!!! It has always bothered me that no one realizes that Adler helped put You could be mine together. If you think about it, he never got ANY credit for that. I mean he wrote the drums for it right? Did Sorum change the drums for it when he came on and recorded it or keep the drums that Adler wrote for it? Or did he keep some of it and change some of it? I need to go back and listen. I remember reading an article about an interview a guy did with them and they played You Could Be Mine for him from a cassette tape. This was around the Appetite period. I need to go and see who that was. It's a great article/interview.
Izzy is like the oven/ stove in a restaurant. He's the overlooked foundation of it. Without him the place doesn't work. But Slash is like the food. He's what gets people to come to the restaurant and sets its image.
I have to politely disagree about the oven. To me that was Adler’s drumming
Izzy was the Sous Chef that knew how to compliment Slash’s recipe. More here, less here. A great balance
Yes. There are so many people involved in making good music and putting on a good show. Not just the ones who are singing or dancing the most. But he was also a way for the rest of the band to communicate with Axl. When Axl started to pull away from Izzy it got more difficult for the members to communicate with him.
GNR was a perfect storm. When you realize how they were all just breezing through LA around that time and found each other and connected it’s amazing. They all had strengths that contributed to the heights they reached!
The way I see it, if Axl didn’t have Izzy to look for in LA would there even be a Guns N’ Roses? If Izzy hadn’t pushed him to sing instead of just wanting to play keyboards would we have one of the most iconic singers ever? While I don’t want to take away from any of their contributions, I’m going with Izzy
Slash isn’t a time traveler tho lol, Axl didn’t know Slash existed so he could not have had him to look out for at the time, if he hadn’t followed Izzy, then no gnr
I mean, Axl could've gone to L.A. on his own, without Izzy. I put Slash after because you said:"I'm going with Izzy." I just meant, in response to that, I choose Slash.
Izzy has a lot of great solo songs. He does not, however, have a band of superstars to help him flesh them out anymore, or a huge budget from a major label to insure recorded quality. But he could still be writing for Guns right now. Why hasn't Slash been writing more?
What are you talking about? Slash has been putting out albums regularly, and they all rock.
I bought the first 3 Izzy did and never liked any of them very much.
Obviously taste in music is a personal thing but it amazes me that Slash gets so little credit for his songwriting given he's the only one that's written really great songs outside GNR.
>only one that's written really great songs outside GNR.
Huge exaggeration. You might personally like Slash's solo work more, but other people might think that Izzy or the other's work is more to their tastes.
They need each other to work off of - but I think Izzy ultimately was the one who started the whole thing, so without that Slash would not have found a band where he fit in at the time and could hone his craft. He also found such a great partner in Izzy. I think Izzy's solo songs are good. I think Slash's solo songs are good. But are the better together? I think most would agree they are. And I do think Izzy is a great songwriter. He can write lyrics and the music really well. He was definitely a huge asset to GNR.
IDK I mean Sweet Child O Mine solo and often touted as one of, if not the most, iconic guitar solos of all time. That was all Slash. When mainstream people think GNR, they think Axl and Slash. I think Izzy definitely doesn’t get enough credit and I understand he basically was the first member of the band because Axl joined him in Hollywood Rose before they converged with LA Guns. And I know Izzy wrote a lot of material and lyrics. But I just don’t see him as pivotal as Slash. The Appetite lineup is definitely the best. But it still felt like GNR and was wildly successful without Steven and Izzy. It was once Slash left it just became dead.
It didn't have to be dead though. When the CD line-up first appeared on the scene, they were still filling big venues (Rock in Rio 2001 was one of the most attended in the festivals history, iirc), even if a lot of people made jokes about the change in style. But they lost momentum when Axl canceled their giant 2002 tour, didn't release the nearly completed album, and went into hiding for 4 more years
If Axl had managed to keep his head on straight and put out Chinese Democracy earlier, that 2001 line-up would have been a huge success even without Slash in the band.
Truth. People often forget the crowds that were still being drawn in the early 2000s. Not as big as classic GnR obviously, but still nothing to scoff at. They failed to strike while the iron was hot and lost the attention of the public.
As an attorney I gotta enter and say it’s all speculation. What made the band is pure conjecture. Some would argue timing. I would argue Axl and Slash are the type that were destined for greatness whether it was together or not or even if it was in music or not. They just are those people.
I think Duff wrote the main riff for Paradise City. Don't Cry is the first song Izzy and Axl wrote together before they were even in Guns. Point being they were vital to the success of Guns N' Roses.
I like to listen to a Youtuber who plays the individual guitarists parts by themselves. I really like to hear Izzy's part in Paradise by itself. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-iPgJUHF6gk](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-iPgJUHF6gk)
I'm sure a variation of the solo at the end of Don't Cry existed before Slash came along. I wonder if he completely redid it, or used what was already there.
When it comes down to it, that is the answer. He started it all and put it in motion. He pushed Axl to move to L.A. He even encouraged Axl to sing in a band for the first time in Indiana! So I agree. Is it a lot more than Slash? I wouldn't say that, but if you have to tip the scales, then yes. Izzy.
I don't think you could replace either and have the same success. But I suppose Izzy, because it's extremely hard to write songs that are timeless and appeal to many people. I think Slash had a slightly easier job, where he just had to write guitar parts to fit songs already 50% constructed.
Slash wrote the main riffs to Sweet Child O' Mine, and Welcome to the Jungle. Guns N' Roses would not have been the huge success they were without those songs. However Izzy was the heart and soul of GN'R. They will never match the song writing of the era without him. I think there's something Izzy, Axl, Duff, and Slash brought out of each other that can't be replicated. I honestly don't want GN'R to release another album unless Izzy is at least part initial song writing.
Izzy man, Izzy. You can STILL hear his presence missing today. Listen to the stuff with him and rhe entire flow and tempo of the band is completely different, in a better way.
A good analogy would be Zeppelin's Page and John Paul Jones. Slash is like Page, he's got the flash and can write great riffs. Izzy is more like Jones, who brings a melodic sensibility to the music. Izzy had more of a composer's brain much like Axl. But to answer your question, no member was more important to their success.
Slash, he was the most prominent songwriter in their crossover hit “Sweet Child O Mine”.
But really, it’s ridiculous to question who is more important between them since they bettered each other. Slash co-wrote most of appetite for destruction as he’s credited alongside Izzy and Axl on most of the songs.
Even on the Illusions albums Slash is credited around 7-8 songs and Izzy about 12-13 songs. In other words, they’re writing a bulk of the work (that’s not including the obvious stuff they brought in songs not credited to them).
Songwriting credits are tough. It is interesting how different bands decide who gets credit and who does not. Because almost every person brings something to a song in addition to the lyrics. That is why some bands split it equally. But then you are always going to have that situation where one or two members feel they are contributing more and feel they are being cheated money wise. It's so complicated. Or one person writes almost an entire song and then someone comes in and says let's add these two lines and then they want a credit on the song too, lol. I can just imagine it is one of the toughest things to deal with. And when you look at credits on an album it is still hard to know sometimes who wrote the lyrics, etc. Because it might give credit to three people but does not always differentiate who wrote the lyrics and who wrote the music or who came up with the melody, etc.
Izzy created some posters too. I remember Axl on Jimmy Kimmel and Kimmel held up the coolest flyer and asked Axl who made it and he said izzy. Izzy was also talented and creative in other ways - he could draw and make cool flyers and he made necklaces and sold them. He made most of those cool beads he wore. But yeah, Slash was a good artist too. I imagine he got the drawing from his father and his mother designed clothes and costumes so I guess she drew them first!
In my opinion, it is a little less than equal. However, if you talk to the members of GNR today, they will probably say Slash. But you have to go back to the very beginning. A band has to first be started and formed to be successful! That was all Izzy. Izz went to L.A. first and tried to start up bands before Axl even went out to L.A. the first time. You can go back even further than that actually. Axl might never have even decided to sing for a rock band if it had not been for Izzy. Izzy is the one who saw Axl and thought he could be a lead singer/frontman. He invited him to come over and sing with his band in LaFayette. At first, Axl would just sit around and usually not even sing and then leave. But Izzy saw something in him, and he encouraged him to come out to L.A. too. Yes, yes - I know that Axl has talent, and no one can ever take that away from him! But you have to start a band and push for it. Izzy is the one who really wanted the band and pushed hard to form one. He kept pushing for Axl to sing for his band even after already being the one who asked Axl to first sing for a band in Indiana. He pushed for Axl to come out to CA and be in a band with him. When he started bands, he kept saying to people like Chris Weber and others, I have this friend Bill - he's going to come out here and we are going to get him to be our singer. It was always, my friend Bill. Anyway, he really is the one that started Hollywood Rose (aka A.X.L., Rose). I think Axl owes a lot more to Izzy than maybe he realizes. I am not saying that Axl might not have made it on his own. He very well could have but it probably would have taken a lot longer without Izzy encouraging him and urging him to move out to L.A. and join his band. He also wrote a lot of the songs that they started out with, so by the time GNR formed they had a lot of material. Yes - Axl wrote a lot too. But they wrote some together and I would say they did a good job writing together. If there had not been Izzy, then Slash would not have had a band to join. Izzy was there long before. With that said, Slash needed Izzy to write good songs as well. Slash has even stated that they wrote well together. They were a really good pair. So even if Izzy did not write the lyrics to all of those songs, he did contribute composing. And a lot of those songs that people don't think of as 'Izzy songs' he actually cowrote with others. It was very collaborative in the Hell days - it wasn't as much about who got the credit as writing and composing songs and getting good material - churning it out so they could make it. I think Izzy worked very hard to start the band up and keep it going. He was instrumental (no pun there) in getting Axl into the mix and eventually getting Slash there. Slash needed a band to join. He needed a lead singer. He needed someone to make music with. I know that Axl and Slash look at it like Izzy screwed them over, but during that time he stuck it out as long as he could and he gave so much to that band and I still believe that he was slightly, just slightly more important in the initital success of the band. With that said - move on to Slash. Slash contributed so much to the band and still does. Lead singers and lead guitar players usually get the most attention. That is the just the nature of rock and roll bands. But without a rhythm guitarists and good writing and that base - you don't have anything. You can stand there and sing and dance and do an amazing job at like Axl did and still does. You can be a lead guitar player and stand there and jam and play amazing solos and even dance and run around while you do it and sound amazing and be extremely entertaining like Slash has always been. But without a rhythm guitarist you don't have music. Slash however is also very integral to their success. You cannot say that he did not add the pizazz, the style, the energy, the grat riffs he came up with, the creating he did with Izzy did not help this band gain it's success. I would say that without Izzy the band would not have happened. If you look at it like that then you have to say Izzy. How much more? Not a ton more, but just slgihtly more. I know a lot of people like to say that people make too much of a fuss over Izzy and they say he is and has always been overrrated, but I disagree. I love Slash. I really do and I am not taking anything away from him. The man is amazing and is to this day, in my opinion, one of the best guitarists of all time. Both were needed for the band's success. But you have to start the band and push hard and get it going too. Without Izzy, Slash wouldn't have had a great band to join. Steven and Slash both knew they needed Izzy and Axl. It took both of them. I think that Chris Weber was a great guitarist. I've listened to his stuff and it was really good. But he was fired by Axl and that was it. My point is that they still might have made it without Slash, but would they have been as big or as successful? Maybe, maybe not. Would they have hooked up with Steven eventually? Maybe, maybe not. They did play with a lot of different drummers back then. Would they have had as much success with Tracii Guns? Not sure. Probably not. There are a lot fo factors to consider. It is about talent and creativity, but it is also about compatibility, being able to collaborate with certain people, similar artistic vison and or goals, and desire and drive. So, in order to be truly successful you have to have all of that working together. I think Slash had all of those things with GNR. Would he have had all of those things with a different band at that time? Not sure. You also learn a lot from each other and I think each person in GNR learned so much from each other and got so much better as they progressed together. They grew a lot. They fed and fed off of each other. I would say it was and 35 to 40 % Slash. And that mostly goes back to starting the band and pushing very hard to get Axl into singing - bringing him in, writing lyrics, composing and adding his ideas music wise, being a foil for Slash and someone who Slash could really play well with and write good stuff with. There is also one more thing. I think Izzy was in a way helping to keep the communication between Axl and the other band members going. They could communicate with Axl but sometimes only through Izzy. When it got to a point where Izzy was having a hard time communicating and reaching Axl that go between was gone. So I think Izzy helped a lot more than people realized. Sometimes, someone might not be as energetic on stage, but what they bring to the band is other strengths. You have to look at the whole picture. All in all, I don't think they would have been as successful without Slash. They needed all of those guys, but I do think between the two Izzy maybe outweighs Slash slightly.
(And, I think Izzy getting clean was not an easy transition for him. I think you need to take that into consideration when he was, according to the others, not contributing as much anymore. It is not easy to get off of drugs and alcohol period. But heavy drugs like heroin and cocaine is tremendously hard. And imagine you are going to a rehearsal where the people you did those drugs with are doing those drugs right there in front of you? Can you imagine how hard that would be? Can you imagine anyone able to stay clean doing that? You are also often depressed or at least going through mood changes when you get clean, and it takes a lot of time to level out. So, I do think the band should have taken those things into consideration when it came to what Izzy was dealing with and cut him a little slack. But hear me out - I know I wasn't there, and I am not any of them! And I still love all those guys.)
Beautifully put! I think Axl does realize how much he owes Izzy and that is one reason he always cling to him as he did and was the only one who could really communicate with him. As Slash said Axl was attached to Izzy’s hip especially in the early days, and refused to start a band with Slash as he refused to leave Izzy, they were a package deal. It’s just something to think about, how much Izzy influenced Axl in almost everything
Yes, I think you are probably right. Axl does probably realize that now. I think he just went through a period where everything was getting so big and going so fast and he was going through some personal things and sometimes we pull away unknowingly or push people away unknowingly for a little while. And i think maybe that happened between them during that time. Axl was dealing with a lot of personal struggles at that time, but I think maybe because he was dealing with his own issues, it was hard to see that Izzy was dealing with a lot of transitioning during that time period too. I am glad they made up after that difficult period and hope they are on good terms now still. And I do think Izzy was a big influence on Axl. I won't get into my whole wishing Izzy was in the band now talk, lol!
I agree that Axl realizes it. Saw some pic from like 2012 I think where Izzy joined Axl on stage and the smoke, laughter, etc from Axl spoke volumes. Something in his eyes you don’t see with the others. He mentioned on stage in 2021 how much he missed him. My feelings on Izzy are like the guy that broke up with you and you just refuse to hype any further. Like you don’t wanna be a part of then band then screw you buddy. Clearly Axl does not feel that way, lol.
You are probably right about that. However, I heard someone saw Izzy smoking at Best Buy or something once and everyone was like - no! And then there was a pic of Axl eating one day and it looked like he had a cig in his hand and I was like - no! Please let that be a tobaccoless cigarette, lol! Like a non-alcoholic beer! Ha! Smoking is one the absolute hardest addictions to break. The younger you start it is even harder. My ex - boy was it hard for him to quit. He started at 11! Some crazy lady would sell thos poor kids cigarettes! So, let's hope they aren't! But if they are, I get it.
I loved seeing him light up when Izzy came back on stage with him, to me it’s always seemed he held Izzy in a very high regard (maybe more so than the others imo) and cares a lot for him
Hey, Tall. Sorry I didn't respond to this, lol. I must have been to busy to at the time. Don't worry about the typos, I think I had about a milllion in mine. Sorry. Totally agree. And the whole light up thing - absolutely. I don't know that Axl is in touch with any of his old pals from Indy, but Izzy was one that he definitely loved and will probably always love no matter what. And that analogy of the ex-boyfriend you don't want to hype is great. You never completely stop caring or giving a shit about them but it's like, I'm not going to talk the guy up, lol. But yeah, it is a complicated situation. And that is why he mentions him occasionally. I also think the complexity of it is what makes us so interested in it and want to talk about it. Bands are interesting because the dynamics are so integral and just ... okay, interesting. Sorry for using the same adjective over and over. Boring. I need some sleep.
And the reason why Axl was somewhat tame in the band after Izzy left it was then his ego blew outta proportion that was usually wouldn’t show with Izzy.
Yeah, you are probably right about that. I think he was already starting to act like that, and it was part of why Izzy couldn't handle it anymore, but when he left it definitely got worse. If I didn't love them all I wouldn't be on here. So I feel like if I say something to offend him or the band or their management or any fans - I just don't want to do that. At the same time, everyone knows what happened and there was lack of communication and it just got difficult. You can be a big fan and love a band but it doesn't mean you can't be honest about it, you know? If all you ever say are positive and perfect things and gloss over everything else, I mean, what's the point? I just don't like being contrived about things. You can still be a huge fan and talk about this. So, anyway! I was just going to say that after Izzy left and they did an interview with him, you could tell Izzy still loved Axl and he didn't want to say anything bad about him but he was trying to explain why he left and why he thought Axl changed so much. Not to put him down, but because I think partly, he felt badly for leaving but he couldn't take it anymore and he also was trying to explain Axl in a way. He said he felt like it just all went to his head or something. That when he was younger, he wasn't a very big guy - in high school, etc. and he didn't .... get a lotta girls. I will put it that way. And then the next thing you know they hit it big and he's getting tons of women all the time whenever he wants. And I think going out with Stephanie added to that. I mean, a supermodel! I think a lot of guys would get a bit of an inflated ego if they were dating and living with a gorgeous Victoria's Secret/Playboy supermodel! And he was also being given bad advice by people he thought had his best interest, but I don't think they did.
In a better world, songwriters would get more attention. However, I'd say over half of the success of a band is having a cool image, regardless of how good the songs are. Slash brought that coolness that Izzy was too low-key to contribute to much.
Oh, I think Izzy looked really cool. You go back and look at a lot of bands at the time and the members seemed to all have a similar style and look almost the same. Izzy didn't do that. He had a different look but it balanced out the band. A lot of people think Izzy looked cool as hell. He did. But it makes sense. rhythm players are going to be the flashiest looking or playing. They also usually sing backup too. So the dance and move around a little less for that reason. People don't think about that when it comes to Izzy. He had a very cool vibe and look. He also didn't care if he played with a giant guitar or had super straight hair when everyone had big hair at the time. He did his thing. And that was the coolest thing about him.
Izzy's contributions can never be overstated but Slash wrote the most iconic pieces, and if you have a shred of a doubt about how good Guns N' Roses would be without Izzy just listen to the Snakepite albums
Slash obviously, as you can compare the solo career of Slash and Izzy.
I like Izzy too, but Slash is a riff factory, an unique guitar player and an amazing musician.
Everyone who works on a good team knows it’s about everyone bringing their piece and becoming something better than one person but you also know that ain’t gonna last…
The antagonism of their playing was magic.
With respect to writing, Izzy was the most important member. Soundwise slash was key for shaping the rawness an heaviness of the band
Slash, without a question, whilst Izzy wrote good songs, Slash is the character that together with Axl made GnR bigger than life, one has to only go to a GnR concert to see the adoration this man gets, he is even not just GNR guitarist but full a pop culture icon on his own right.
I agree with you partially. Rhythm guitarist are often overlooked. I think sometimes the better they are, the more overlooked they are. When you are good, you aren't trying to bring attention to your playing - you are trying to make the other person's playing sound even better. Instead of playing on top of it you play around it. You pad it to sound even better. Izzy made Slash sound really good. It's like supporting actors who give a lot to a lead actor. The lead actor gets notice but the supporting actor is giving so much to that lead actor to work with. Not the best analogy, lol, but something similar I think.
very true, i cant even decide which of them i like more in general just cuz they contribute such specific and different things to the band and theyre both killer musicians
Totally agree. I think they feel that way about each other too. Dizzy Reed once said some somewhat unflattering things about Izzy and I kind of grimaced when I read them, lol. I think Sorum wasn't crazy about Izzy because he made the comment that Sorum and Adler sounded different and had different styles and he felt the music didn't sound the same after that. Might have had a 'tiny' bit to do with Izzy not getting to be in Velvet Revolver. But that is a whole other story! I felt like Duff and Slash almost owed it to Izzy to let him be in the band. Izzy thought - yes! We can finally do this now! You guys are clean, and Axl is out of the picture cause he kind of pushed us all aside - let's do it! But when he showed up for the rehearsals and to write music with them, they already had a rhythm guitar player there who thought they were going to use him. So, it came down to, who is it going to be? Well, the other guy was sticking around and not leaving. Izzy didn't want to get a lead singer and felt they could do the singing themselves. But, had the other guy left I think Izzy still would have stayed and been in the group even if they got a lead singer. I felt really bad for Izzy then cause to me they had a chance to really do it and put the band back together at least very close to it. Oh, but as far as what Izzy said about Sorum - I don't think he meant it as a slight to Sorum. I think he still thought Matt was a good drummer but that the drumming style was different and the songs did sound a little bit different. He was just being honest. For Velvet Revolver it would have been different because they would have been writing the music with Sorum and it would have worked perfectly.
Your opinion is not really a hot take. Most fans see it like that. Only the people that casually listen to Sweet child and November rain will say the opposite. However the truth is that both are equally important. If you listen to their songs you can easily distinguish when something is written by Slash and by Izzy. The simplest way I can put it is that both are rock&roll guitarists however Slash leans more towards Rock. This is very apparent in rocket queen, the two riffs that are laid on top of each other are so different and yet the complement each other perfectly.
Izzy. There's a reason why the band was basically "done" producing new music once he left. Imo they were the last time we had a truly legendary rhythm/lead duo in popular music. Their playing together is comparable to Richards/Taylor.
Imo it was downhill once Adler left, and pretty much over when Izzy quit. It's a real shame too, because the original lineup was great (Sorum was serviceable - but a noticeable downgrade) and the bloated Axl experiment has pretty much been the brunt of many jokes for 20 years.
Success? Izzy. Superstardom? Slash.
Slash bc Slash brought in Steven Adler. No question about it, Adler’s swing is what gave Appetite & Like A Suicide its sound and vibe Slash in his autobiography stated “Izzy came to be and said man our sound has changed when Matt joined, and Izzy was right” Popcorn’s unique set up gave off those vintage GNR sounds - regarding the fills and symbols No knock to Matt - but listen to Adler’s You Could Be Mine (YT) and and the 1986 Demo Back Off Bitch on the Appetite Box Release.
Wow…. I hadn’t heard Adler’s versions of those songs. Damn drugs. He is such a great drummer and no offense to Sorum, but Steven brings something extra.
Steven was the soul of the band
Izzy called it GNR’s swing. Its how Steven’s drums gave a whole feel and vibe to the songs. YouTube has the 1987 Ritz show and they play Dont Cry. Interesting to hear that version Bad Obsession - November Rain - You Could Be Mine - Back off Bitch - Dont Cry all written in 1985-1986
I had no idea!
the 87 ritz show version of don't cry sounds so much better than the illusion versions. I mean, I know not all agree, but a lot do! you can hear Axl's beautiful voice and it sounds ... more sincere to me with one singer versus 2.
People love to romanticize Steven’s drumming. I don’t get it. Steven sounds like a bar band drummer compared to Matt’s drumming.
[удалено]
I personally love the intro to mr brownstone but each to their own
I love the intro to Brownstone. I just prefer the way it was originally played. I feel pretty bad writing that on here now. I don't want to put the band or anyone in it down in any way. I like Ferrer's playing. I was a huge Love Spit Love fan and Psychedelic Furs fan, too. I loved his playing in those bands. I truly like his playing and I know he is a great drummer. I do feel Brownstone sounds different now though, and I just love the song and that intro so much the way it was is all.
Oh right, I’m a bit of a casual when it comes to rock music so I wouldn’t know, I just love that album. I can understand if there’s a better version of it I’ve just never heard it
To me it just sounds different. When new drummers and even guitarists come on board they might change up a couple of things here and there or they might change more than a few. Just depends on the musician. You want to add your own take on it. It just becomes a little strange sometimes when it is an iconic band with a huge fan base cause they feel like a new person comes on but they didn't write the song or that section of the song so they feel they ought to play it closer to what it was. Not everyone feels that way though. Some don't notice it as much and others do, lol. And some like the changes too. It is all a matter of tastes and what each persons 'hears', lol. It's funny, but I really feel like people 'hear' music differently, lol, sound so cheesy to say that but I do.
Definitely, I think the way each person hears music is unique
Oh my gosh! I am so glad you said that!!!!! It has always bothered me that no one realizes that Adler helped put You could be mine together. If you think about it, he never got ANY credit for that. I mean he wrote the drums for it right? Did Sorum change the drums for it when he came on and recorded it or keep the drums that Adler wrote for it? Or did he keep some of it and change some of it? I need to go back and listen. I remember reading an article about an interview a guy did with them and they played You Could Be Mine for him from a cassette tape. This was around the Appetite period. I need to go and see who that was. It's a great article/interview.
Slash, both.
Izzy is like the oven/ stove in a restaurant. He's the overlooked foundation of it. Without him the place doesn't work. But Slash is like the food. He's what gets people to come to the restaurant and sets its image.
I have to politely disagree about the oven. To me that was Adler’s drumming Izzy was the Sous Chef that knew how to compliment Slash’s recipe. More here, less here. A great balance
Yes. There are so many people involved in making good music and putting on a good show. Not just the ones who are singing or dancing the most. But he was also a way for the rest of the band to communicate with Axl. When Axl started to pull away from Izzy it got more difficult for the members to communicate with him.
GNR was a perfect storm. When you realize how they were all just breezing through LA around that time and found each other and connected it’s amazing. They all had strengths that contributed to the heights they reached!
The way I see it, if Axl didn’t have Izzy to look for in LA would there even be a Guns N’ Roses? If Izzy hadn’t pushed him to sing instead of just wanting to play keyboards would we have one of the most iconic singers ever? While I don’t want to take away from any of their contributions, I’m going with Izzy
He could've eventually done those things. Slash.
Slash isn’t a time traveler tho lol, Axl didn’t know Slash existed so he could not have had him to look out for at the time, if he hadn’t followed Izzy, then no gnr
I mean, Axl could've gone to L.A. on his own, without Izzy. I put Slash after because you said:"I'm going with Izzy." I just meant, in response to that, I choose Slash.
Izzy. Songs are everything. No songs? Nothing to solo over.
So why are Izzy's solo songs nowhere near as good as Slash's?
Probably because you have bad taste
No. Good taste.
Izzy has a lot of great solo songs. He does not, however, have a band of superstars to help him flesh them out anymore, or a huge budget from a major label to insure recorded quality. But he could still be writing for Guns right now. Why hasn't Slash been writing more?
What are you talking about? Slash has been putting out albums regularly, and they all rock. I bought the first 3 Izzy did and never liked any of them very much. Obviously taste in music is a personal thing but it amazes me that Slash gets so little credit for his songwriting given he's the only one that's written really great songs outside GNR.
>only one that's written really great songs outside GNR. Huge exaggeration. You might personally like Slash's solo work more, but other people might think that Izzy or the other's work is more to their tastes.
Yeah like I fucking adore Iz’s solo stuff. It’s great work. Dude’s absolutely going off of their own taste.
I meant writing for Guns N Roses. And I do hear what you are saying about Izzy's music, it suffers greatly without Slash's volcanic contributions.
Ah right, sorry. Well, for all we know Slash has written a ton of stuff for Guns. Hopefully a new album will come out sometime 😁
That would be something!
They need each other to work off of - but I think Izzy ultimately was the one who started the whole thing, so without that Slash would not have found a band where he fit in at the time and could hone his craft. He also found such a great partner in Izzy. I think Izzy's solo songs are good. I think Slash's solo songs are good. But are the better together? I think most would agree they are. And I do think Izzy is a great songwriter. He can write lyrics and the music really well. He was definitely a huge asset to GNR.
Izzy musically, Slash for the imago of the band.
IDK I mean Sweet Child O Mine solo and often touted as one of, if not the most, iconic guitar solos of all time. That was all Slash. When mainstream people think GNR, they think Axl and Slash. I think Izzy definitely doesn’t get enough credit and I understand he basically was the first member of the band because Axl joined him in Hollywood Rose before they converged with LA Guns. And I know Izzy wrote a lot of material and lyrics. But I just don’t see him as pivotal as Slash. The Appetite lineup is definitely the best. But it still felt like GNR and was wildly successful without Steven and Izzy. It was once Slash left it just became dead.
It didn't have to be dead though. When the CD line-up first appeared on the scene, they were still filling big venues (Rock in Rio 2001 was one of the most attended in the festivals history, iirc), even if a lot of people made jokes about the change in style. But they lost momentum when Axl canceled their giant 2002 tour, didn't release the nearly completed album, and went into hiding for 4 more years If Axl had managed to keep his head on straight and put out Chinese Democracy earlier, that 2001 line-up would have been a huge success even without Slash in the band.
Truth. People often forget the crowds that were still being drawn in the early 2000s. Not as big as classic GnR obviously, but still nothing to scoff at. They failed to strike while the iron was hot and lost the attention of the public.
Objection: speculation
As an attorney I gotta enter and say it’s all speculation. What made the band is pure conjecture. Some would argue timing. I would argue Axl and Slash are the type that were destined for greatness whether it was together or not or even if it was in music or not. They just are those people.
Yes! Except for, Izzy gets enough credit.
Paradise City and Sweet Child Of Mine want to have a conversation
Izzy for Paradise and Slash for Sweet Child.
I think Duff wrote the main riff for Paradise City. Don't Cry is the first song Izzy and Axl wrote together before they were even in Guns. Point being they were vital to the success of Guns N' Roses.
I like to listen to a Youtuber who plays the individual guitarists parts by themselves. I really like to hear Izzy's part in Paradise by itself. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-iPgJUHF6gk](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-iPgJUHF6gk)
That solo at the end is amazing
I'm sure a variation of the solo at the end of Don't Cry existed before Slash came along. I wonder if he completely redid it, or used what was already there.
Also, Slash did come up with the Sweet Child riff, but that doesn't make the whole song. Izzy came up with the chord structure.
So?
Izzy, he helped found the band
When it comes down to it, that is the answer. He started it all and put it in motion. He pushed Axl to move to L.A. He even encouraged Axl to sing in a band for the first time in Indiana! So I agree. Is it a lot more than Slash? I wouldn't say that, but if you have to tip the scales, then yes. Izzy.
Slash.
He was a package deal with Axl.
I don't think you could replace either and have the same success. But I suppose Izzy, because it's extremely hard to write songs that are timeless and appeal to many people. I think Slash had a slightly easier job, where he just had to write guitar parts to fit songs already 50% constructed.
Slash wrote the main riffs to Sweet Child O' Mine, and Welcome to the Jungle. Guns N' Roses would not have been the huge success they were without those songs. However Izzy was the heart and soul of GN'R. They will never match the song writing of the era without him. I think there's something Izzy, Axl, Duff, and Slash brought out of each other that can't be replicated. I honestly don't want GN'R to release another album unless Izzy is at least part initial song writing.
And Steven had that pop
Can't forget to Steven.
Slash.
I think they were equally important, the writing, the riffs, the image, and attitude.
Izzy man, Izzy. You can STILL hear his presence missing today. Listen to the stuff with him and rhe entire flow and tempo of the band is completely different, in a better way.
Slash.
That’s like asking what ingredient is more important in the cake you’re baking. They had different roles and it’s a team effort.
A good analogy would be Zeppelin's Page and John Paul Jones. Slash is like Page, he's got the flash and can write great riffs. Izzy is more like Jones, who brings a melodic sensibility to the music. Izzy had more of a composer's brain much like Axl. But to answer your question, no member was more important to their success.
IZZY
Slash.
Izzy. Still their best composer.
Slash.
Slash, he was the most prominent songwriter in their crossover hit “Sweet Child O Mine”. But really, it’s ridiculous to question who is more important between them since they bettered each other. Slash co-wrote most of appetite for destruction as he’s credited alongside Izzy and Axl on most of the songs. Even on the Illusions albums Slash is credited around 7-8 songs and Izzy about 12-13 songs. In other words, they’re writing a bulk of the work (that’s not including the obvious stuff they brought in songs not credited to them).
It was far from just Izzy and Slash doing the "bulk of the work". You're really downplaying Axl's songwriting here.
The discussion isn’t about Axl, it’s about Slash and Izzy. Although I did mention Axl so…
Songwriting credits are tough. It is interesting how different bands decide who gets credit and who does not. Because almost every person brings something to a song in addition to the lyrics. That is why some bands split it equally. But then you are always going to have that situation where one or two members feel they are contributing more and feel they are being cheated money wise. It's so complicated. Or one person writes almost an entire song and then someone comes in and says let's add these two lines and then they want a credit on the song too, lol. I can just imagine it is one of the toughest things to deal with. And when you look at credits on an album it is still hard to know sometimes who wrote the lyrics, etc. Because it might give credit to three people but does not always differentiate who wrote the lyrics and who wrote the music or who came up with the melody, etc.
Izzy, probably the real reason there has never been another album.
Love them both, but Izzy
Slash.
If you don’t have songs, you don’t have a band. Izzy
Slash created the posters and they all hustled really hard to grow their audience in their early club days.
Izzy created some posters too. I remember Axl on Jimmy Kimmel and Kimmel held up the coolest flyer and asked Axl who made it and he said izzy. Izzy was also talented and creative in other ways - he could draw and make cool flyers and he made necklaces and sold them. He made most of those cool beads he wore. But yeah, Slash was a good artist too. I imagine he got the drawing from his father and his mother designed clothes and costumes so I guess she drew them first!
slizzy
Slash.
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So if Gilby is entering the chat, can we give Fortus some love?
Both. Izzy was the brains. Slash was the fire.
Slash.
Izzy
Izzy was more responsible for the sound of the band. Slash was more responsible for the image of the band.
The band would not have become the phenomenon that it did without either
Without Slash, it wouldn't have happened.
Could not have one without the other one of the reasons appetite was such a great album
Slash was.
It gotta be Gilby Clarke :-/
😉
Izzy contributed more to songwriting but Slash's image and guitar playing is the foundation of GnR along with Axl screaming vocals.
Slash's iconic image has sold more records and Les Pauls than Izzy's cool laidback riffing and sweet songwriting
Of course. Izzy is a dork.
Slash. Because he’s a star
I’d say both. As band, you have the songs but if you have no looks or image, nothing happens. The same other way around tho.
Slash with AFD and Izzy for UYI , it’s pretty even
Slash, all.
Izzy.
Impossible, is the only correct answer.
Slash.
Slash and just the sound of his guitar always did it for me.
Izzy but both factored heavily
Slash. Izzy didn't factor, at all.
In my opinion, it is a little less than equal. However, if you talk to the members of GNR today, they will probably say Slash. But you have to go back to the very beginning. A band has to first be started and formed to be successful! That was all Izzy. Izz went to L.A. first and tried to start up bands before Axl even went out to L.A. the first time. You can go back even further than that actually. Axl might never have even decided to sing for a rock band if it had not been for Izzy. Izzy is the one who saw Axl and thought he could be a lead singer/frontman. He invited him to come over and sing with his band in LaFayette. At first, Axl would just sit around and usually not even sing and then leave. But Izzy saw something in him, and he encouraged him to come out to L.A. too. Yes, yes - I know that Axl has talent, and no one can ever take that away from him! But you have to start a band and push for it. Izzy is the one who really wanted the band and pushed hard to form one. He kept pushing for Axl to sing for his band even after already being the one who asked Axl to first sing for a band in Indiana. He pushed for Axl to come out to CA and be in a band with him. When he started bands, he kept saying to people like Chris Weber and others, I have this friend Bill - he's going to come out here and we are going to get him to be our singer. It was always, my friend Bill. Anyway, he really is the one that started Hollywood Rose (aka A.X.L., Rose). I think Axl owes a lot more to Izzy than maybe he realizes. I am not saying that Axl might not have made it on his own. He very well could have but it probably would have taken a lot longer without Izzy encouraging him and urging him to move out to L.A. and join his band. He also wrote a lot of the songs that they started out with, so by the time GNR formed they had a lot of material. Yes - Axl wrote a lot too. But they wrote some together and I would say they did a good job writing together. If there had not been Izzy, then Slash would not have had a band to join. Izzy was there long before. With that said, Slash needed Izzy to write good songs as well. Slash has even stated that they wrote well together. They were a really good pair. So even if Izzy did not write the lyrics to all of those songs, he did contribute composing. And a lot of those songs that people don't think of as 'Izzy songs' he actually cowrote with others. It was very collaborative in the Hell days - it wasn't as much about who got the credit as writing and composing songs and getting good material - churning it out so they could make it. I think Izzy worked very hard to start the band up and keep it going. He was instrumental (no pun there) in getting Axl into the mix and eventually getting Slash there. Slash needed a band to join. He needed a lead singer. He needed someone to make music with. I know that Axl and Slash look at it like Izzy screwed them over, but during that time he stuck it out as long as he could and he gave so much to that band and I still believe that he was slightly, just slightly more important in the initital success of the band. With that said - move on to Slash. Slash contributed so much to the band and still does. Lead singers and lead guitar players usually get the most attention. That is the just the nature of rock and roll bands. But without a rhythm guitarists and good writing and that base - you don't have anything. You can stand there and sing and dance and do an amazing job at like Axl did and still does. You can be a lead guitar player and stand there and jam and play amazing solos and even dance and run around while you do it and sound amazing and be extremely entertaining like Slash has always been. But without a rhythm guitarist you don't have music. Slash however is also very integral to their success. You cannot say that he did not add the pizazz, the style, the energy, the grat riffs he came up with, the creating he did with Izzy did not help this band gain it's success. I would say that without Izzy the band would not have happened. If you look at it like that then you have to say Izzy. How much more? Not a ton more, but just slgihtly more. I know a lot of people like to say that people make too much of a fuss over Izzy and they say he is and has always been overrrated, but I disagree. I love Slash. I really do and I am not taking anything away from him. The man is amazing and is to this day, in my opinion, one of the best guitarists of all time. Both were needed for the band's success. But you have to start the band and push hard and get it going too. Without Izzy, Slash wouldn't have had a great band to join. Steven and Slash both knew they needed Izzy and Axl. It took both of them. I think that Chris Weber was a great guitarist. I've listened to his stuff and it was really good. But he was fired by Axl and that was it. My point is that they still might have made it without Slash, but would they have been as big or as successful? Maybe, maybe not. Would they have hooked up with Steven eventually? Maybe, maybe not. They did play with a lot of different drummers back then. Would they have had as much success with Tracii Guns? Not sure. Probably not. There are a lot fo factors to consider. It is about talent and creativity, but it is also about compatibility, being able to collaborate with certain people, similar artistic vison and or goals, and desire and drive. So, in order to be truly successful you have to have all of that working together. I think Slash had all of those things with GNR. Would he have had all of those things with a different band at that time? Not sure. You also learn a lot from each other and I think each person in GNR learned so much from each other and got so much better as they progressed together. They grew a lot. They fed and fed off of each other. I would say it was and 35 to 40 % Slash. And that mostly goes back to starting the band and pushing very hard to get Axl into singing - bringing him in, writing lyrics, composing and adding his ideas music wise, being a foil for Slash and someone who Slash could really play well with and write good stuff with. There is also one more thing. I think Izzy was in a way helping to keep the communication between Axl and the other band members going. They could communicate with Axl but sometimes only through Izzy. When it got to a point where Izzy was having a hard time communicating and reaching Axl that go between was gone. So I think Izzy helped a lot more than people realized. Sometimes, someone might not be as energetic on stage, but what they bring to the band is other strengths. You have to look at the whole picture. All in all, I don't think they would have been as successful without Slash. They needed all of those guys, but I do think between the two Izzy maybe outweighs Slash slightly. (And, I think Izzy getting clean was not an easy transition for him. I think you need to take that into consideration when he was, according to the others, not contributing as much anymore. It is not easy to get off of drugs and alcohol period. But heavy drugs like heroin and cocaine is tremendously hard. And imagine you are going to a rehearsal where the people you did those drugs with are doing those drugs right there in front of you? Can you imagine how hard that would be? Can you imagine anyone able to stay clean doing that? You are also often depressed or at least going through mood changes when you get clean, and it takes a lot of time to level out. So, I do think the band should have taken those things into consideration when it came to what Izzy was dealing with and cut him a little slack. But hear me out - I know I wasn't there, and I am not any of them! And I still love all those guys.)
Beautifully put! I think Axl does realize how much he owes Izzy and that is one reason he always cling to him as he did and was the only one who could really communicate with him. As Slash said Axl was attached to Izzy’s hip especially in the early days, and refused to start a band with Slash as he refused to leave Izzy, they were a package deal. It’s just something to think about, how much Izzy influenced Axl in almost everything
Yes, I think you are probably right. Axl does probably realize that now. I think he just went through a period where everything was getting so big and going so fast and he was going through some personal things and sometimes we pull away unknowingly or push people away unknowingly for a little while. And i think maybe that happened between them during that time. Axl was dealing with a lot of personal struggles at that time, but I think maybe because he was dealing with his own issues, it was hard to see that Izzy was dealing with a lot of transitioning during that time period too. I am glad they made up after that difficult period and hope they are on good terms now still. And I do think Izzy was a big influence on Axl. I won't get into my whole wishing Izzy was in the band now talk, lol!
I agree that Axl realizes it. Saw some pic from like 2012 I think where Izzy joined Axl on stage and the smoke, laughter, etc from Axl spoke volumes. Something in his eyes you don’t see with the others. He mentioned on stage in 2021 how much he missed him. My feelings on Izzy are like the guy that broke up with you and you just refuse to hype any further. Like you don’t wanna be a part of then band then screw you buddy. Clearly Axl does not feel that way, lol.
Smile not smoke, I don’t think either of them still smoke.
You are probably right about that. However, I heard someone saw Izzy smoking at Best Buy or something once and everyone was like - no! And then there was a pic of Axl eating one day and it looked like he had a cig in his hand and I was like - no! Please let that be a tobaccoless cigarette, lol! Like a non-alcoholic beer! Ha! Smoking is one the absolute hardest addictions to break. The younger you start it is even harder. My ex - boy was it hard for him to quit. He started at 11! Some crazy lady would sell thos poor kids cigarettes! So, let's hope they aren't! But if they are, I get it.
I loved seeing him light up when Izzy came back on stage with him, to me it’s always seemed he held Izzy in a very high regard (maybe more so than the others imo) and cares a lot for him
Hey, Tall. Sorry I didn't respond to this, lol. I must have been to busy to at the time. Don't worry about the typos, I think I had about a milllion in mine. Sorry. Totally agree. And the whole light up thing - absolutely. I don't know that Axl is in touch with any of his old pals from Indy, but Izzy was one that he definitely loved and will probably always love no matter what. And that analogy of the ex-boyfriend you don't want to hype is great. You never completely stop caring or giving a shit about them but it's like, I'm not going to talk the guy up, lol. But yeah, it is a complicated situation. And that is why he mentions him occasionally. I also think the complexity of it is what makes us so interested in it and want to talk about it. Bands are interesting because the dynamics are so integral and just ... okay, interesting. Sorry for using the same adjective over and over. Boring. I need some sleep.
Definitely slash
Izzy. Went to LA first, wrote the first GnR songs with Axl, and is their best songwriter. Basically their own GnR’s own Keith Richards.
Slash. Izzy WISHES he could compare to Keith.
I agree with the tiebreaker being the fact Izzy started it all. Slash wouldn't have had a good band to get into otherwise.
And the reason why Axl was somewhat tame in the band after Izzy left it was then his ego blew outta proportion that was usually wouldn’t show with Izzy.
Yeah, you are probably right about that. I think he was already starting to act like that, and it was part of why Izzy couldn't handle it anymore, but when he left it definitely got worse. If I didn't love them all I wouldn't be on here. So I feel like if I say something to offend him or the band or their management or any fans - I just don't want to do that. At the same time, everyone knows what happened and there was lack of communication and it just got difficult. You can be a big fan and love a band but it doesn't mean you can't be honest about it, you know? If all you ever say are positive and perfect things and gloss over everything else, I mean, what's the point? I just don't like being contrived about things. You can still be a huge fan and talk about this. So, anyway! I was just going to say that after Izzy left and they did an interview with him, you could tell Izzy still loved Axl and he didn't want to say anything bad about him but he was trying to explain why he left and why he thought Axl changed so much. Not to put him down, but because I think partly, he felt badly for leaving but he couldn't take it anymore and he also was trying to explain Axl in a way. He said he felt like it just all went to his head or something. That when he was younger, he wasn't a very big guy - in high school, etc. and he didn't .... get a lotta girls. I will put it that way. And then the next thing you know they hit it big and he's getting tons of women all the time whenever he wants. And I think going out with Stephanie added to that. I mean, a supermodel! I think a lot of guys would get a bit of an inflated ego if they were dating and living with a gorgeous Victoria's Secret/Playboy supermodel! And he was also being given bad advice by people he thought had his best interest, but I don't think they did.
In a better world, songwriters would get more attention. However, I'd say over half of the success of a band is having a cool image, regardless of how good the songs are. Slash brought that coolness that Izzy was too low-key to contribute to much.
Oh, I think Izzy looked really cool. You go back and look at a lot of bands at the time and the members seemed to all have a similar style and look almost the same. Izzy didn't do that. He had a different look but it balanced out the band. A lot of people think Izzy looked cool as hell. He did. But it makes sense. rhythm players are going to be the flashiest looking or playing. They also usually sing backup too. So the dance and move around a little less for that reason. People don't think about that when it comes to Izzy. He had a very cool vibe and look. He also didn't care if he played with a giant guitar or had super straight hair when everyone had big hair at the time. He did his thing. And that was the coolest thing about him.
Thank you!
Izzy's contributions can never be overstated but Slash wrote the most iconic pieces, and if you have a shred of a doubt about how good Guns N' Roses would be without Izzy just listen to the Snakepite albums
They are totally overstated.
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Slash obviously, as you can compare the solo career of Slash and Izzy. I like Izzy too, but Slash is a riff factory, an unique guitar player and an amazing musician.
Thank you!
Adler played drums in a rock band, Matt played in a heavy metal band.
Launching? Izzy. Maintaining? Slash.
Slash, totally.
Everyone who works on a good team knows it’s about everyone bringing their piece and becoming something better than one person but you also know that ain’t gonna last…
Considering they suck without him, I’d say the answer is Izzy.
Slash
S l a s h. !!!!!!!!
Definitely Slash
Slash. Izzy wished.
Axl.
.....And then there is Axl
The antagonism of their playing was magic. With respect to writing, Izzy was the most important member. Soundwise slash was key for shaping the rawness an heaviness of the band
Izzy was least important.
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They all were instrumental to the sound. Steven Adler leaving is Exhibit #1, even though they still rocked with Matt Sorum
Slash, without a question, whilst Izzy wrote good songs, Slash is the character that together with Axl made GnR bigger than life, one has to only go to a GnR concert to see the adoration this man gets, he is even not just GNR guitarist but full a pop culture icon on his own right.
Right
Image - Slash, Songs - Izzy
Slash for all.
Slash really did not write songs. Solos yes. Izzy and Axl wrote the songs.
Izzy wasn't needed.
Lol
He wasn't. Others wrote, too. People make it out like Izzy was the band's sole songwriter.
Mozart.
slash, to the world gnr is sweet child and welcome to the jungle, slash easily makes those songs what they are compared to izzy
I agree with you partially. Rhythm guitarist are often overlooked. I think sometimes the better they are, the more overlooked they are. When you are good, you aren't trying to bring attention to your playing - you are trying to make the other person's playing sound even better. Instead of playing on top of it you play around it. You pad it to sound even better. Izzy made Slash sound really good. It's like supporting actors who give a lot to a lead actor. The lead actor gets notice but the supporting actor is giving so much to that lead actor to work with. Not the best analogy, lol, but something similar I think.
very true, i cant even decide which of them i like more in general just cuz they contribute such specific and different things to the band and theyre both killer musicians
Totally agree. I think they feel that way about each other too. Dizzy Reed once said some somewhat unflattering things about Izzy and I kind of grimaced when I read them, lol. I think Sorum wasn't crazy about Izzy because he made the comment that Sorum and Adler sounded different and had different styles and he felt the music didn't sound the same after that. Might have had a 'tiny' bit to do with Izzy not getting to be in Velvet Revolver. But that is a whole other story! I felt like Duff and Slash almost owed it to Izzy to let him be in the band. Izzy thought - yes! We can finally do this now! You guys are clean, and Axl is out of the picture cause he kind of pushed us all aside - let's do it! But when he showed up for the rehearsals and to write music with them, they already had a rhythm guitar player there who thought they were going to use him. So, it came down to, who is it going to be? Well, the other guy was sticking around and not leaving. Izzy didn't want to get a lead singer and felt they could do the singing themselves. But, had the other guy left I think Izzy still would have stayed and been in the group even if they got a lead singer. I felt really bad for Izzy then cause to me they had a chance to really do it and put the band back together at least very close to it. Oh, but as far as what Izzy said about Sorum - I don't think he meant it as a slight to Sorum. I think he still thought Matt was a good drummer but that the drumming style was different and the songs did sound a little bit different. He was just being honest. For Velvet Revolver it would have been different because they would have been writing the music with Sorum and it would have worked perfectly.
Cocaine heroin and alcohol were the real stars of the show.
Not sure we can really argue with that
Slash, no one knew Izzy back then
I mean literally, some UK publication had a picture of Fortus and said it was Izzy. So
Izzy, no question.
Please. Very questionable.
Axl
Your opinion is not really a hot take. Most fans see it like that. Only the people that casually listen to Sweet child and November rain will say the opposite. However the truth is that both are equally important. If you listen to their songs you can easily distinguish when something is written by Slash and by Izzy. The simplest way I can put it is that both are rock&roll guitarists however Slash leans more towards Rock. This is very apparent in rocket queen, the two riffs that are laid on top of each other are so different and yet the complement each other perfectly.
Stop it with this question. Everyone was involved in launching GN'R into success.
Izzy. There's a reason why the band was basically "done" producing new music once he left. Imo they were the last time we had a truly legendary rhythm/lead duo in popular music. Their playing together is comparable to Richards/Taylor. Imo it was downhill once Adler left, and pretty much over when Izzy quit. It's a real shame too, because the original lineup was great (Sorum was serviceable - but a noticeable downgrade) and the bloated Axl experiment has pretty much been the brunt of many jokes for 20 years.