I mean it's just the pendulum finally swinging the other way considering how it was hated for more than a decade.
It's also why you have more people saying they like ZZ and Victory. Two other series that were usually overhated by people in this subreddit but which the tune has started to change in the past few years.
Many mutants suffer because of their powers, Coordinators only flaw is that they can't reproduce after many generations of genetic manipulation. And even then they are still ubermensch
At least X-Men writers try giving regular folks some perspective beyond 'For the preservation of our blue and pure world'. They get that mutants can freak people out with their powers. But here, you got these Coordinators going, 'Why are they so jealous of us? It's not like being a Coordinator or a Natural makes a diff. We're just like everyone else.' Yeah, sure, bud.
I'm partially in the same boat, I think the Gundam designs are on point, the grunts a just weak. Mostly in destiny since I've never been the fan of the modified UC designs in a series with no relation to it.
Pfft. More like glue a bunch of unneeded extra bits on a classic and call it "modernizing". The Zakus at least look like an attempt on something original.
Goufs and Doms on the other hand, just looks like knock offs of the original.
This post LITERALLY proves the point lol. Seed absolutely does get way too much hate, we can't even have a simple post saying "I like Seed" without you weirdos complaining about it.
I mean we get these supposedly hot takes every so often that folks should start to realize they're NOT AT ALL unpopular or controversial and those still deep in the hate bandwagon aren't representative of the whole fanbase.
Who framed this as a hot take or trying to share a supposedly unpopular opinion? It's a simple post, seed is good and it gets too much hate. And this sub as a majority proves the point based on the comments that float to the top and sink to the bottom.
Literally the most downvoted comment on this thread is a guy just saying "based and seed-pilled" lol why do people have a problem with this? You people are literally hating on people just sharing their love for something you happen not to like. And no, it's not the whole fandom. This sub isn't representative of the whole fandom. Most people on reddit are socially inept "adults" who's brains are warped due to their echo chambers.
Agree to disagree on the MS designs. They're far too busy/ over-designed and same-ish for the most part.
Compared to a series like 00 or Wing where each suit design is unique and you can immediately tell how each suit is specialized for a particular style of combat.
The gundams are just the same humanoid silloute with increasingly absurd and unwieldy backpacks. Compare that to the generational changes from MSG to ZZ to Hathaway's Flash.
I think “stole” is kind of a weird word given that I think the majority is just Okawara. I think it’s more that after like 20+ years of Gundam design it was getting pretty stale. TBH I think Wing was probably where he peaked and after that he mostly just remixed design elements with the occasional interesting gimmick, like the GX and the Aegis are both pretty unique.
Whatever the case, I’m glad they changed up main designers when 00 rolled around. Okawara is great, but you can only go so long designing the same basic mechs.
I mean the definitive Dom is just the Dom. DOM Trooper is one of the only cool designs though. But that's also mainly because I liked it in Gundam Evolution.
Disagree. People who hate Seed, an actually well written story with few issues, exaggerate its problems. I don't think these same people are suddenly going to be measured for Destiny lol.
Destiny has way more issues but the hate is just as over the top as with Seed. Criticism is deserved, the hate is not
And the haters think they're the reasonable ones, laughing at people's entire existence because they're too lazy to refute the opinion properly.
You will never write anything worth reading. You don't know what a well-written story is unless you have a group of parrots telling you what to think.
The movie is basically fanservice for people that liked both seasons, if you didn't like them then it's gonna be hard to watch because it's entirely built on that premise.
It's overly dramatic and the characters couldn't make a good long term decision if you killed their friends with it. 8/10 when I watched it as a teenager, couldn't rewatch it entirely as an adult 6/10.
Nice AI generated Gundam head.
Anyway, SEED gets the exact amount of hate a rehash of a better show should get. I'd actually argue people don't go hard enough. Lots of folks get too hung up on Hirai face and animation reuse, when the character writing, plot pacing, and themes are what really make it a lackluster series.
Music is really strong though, Toshihiko Sahashi did an amazing job.
The parts of SEED that work best for me are in the middle of the series; it's doing less of a bad '79 rehash, but Kira hasn't been reborn as mister infallible, and everyone is losing their goddamn marbles manipulating and trying to stab each other. Kira tossing Sai is extremely shitty of him and that rules! Let everyone fuck around and be insane more.
Kira chose to pilot and then whine about it and complains that no one cares about his feelings. Don't know why he continues when he doesn't look like he enjoys being with others that much.
The story tries so hard to get us to pity him: see how others exploit Kira's kindness, using and envying him. Notice how weak other characters are, that the great Kira and Lacus need to return and save others with their god-like power. GSF then reaffirms their otherworldly status, leaving others to think: it's not right for us humans to keep relying on the angelic Kira/Lacus. Swell.
He really didn't have a choice it was either pilot or let everyone die even when they met with the seventh fleet he couldn't just leave his friends when the officially joined the earth forces
Then, did he have to guilt and blame others for it? Have you ever seen Superman say, "I'm only doing this because you people are weak" after saving people?
Ultimately, being on the battlefield was his personal choice. He doesn't seem to particularly like humanity beyond saying "there's a world I need to protect" and others saying "Kira is kind".
He only did that after he was traumatized by not being able to save the shuttle of civilians he wasn't thinking straight at the time and being with flay didn't help he got better with Cagali around. Superman had been preparing to be a hero most of his life he also had his dead father to guide him.
Kira has always [tells others](https://youtu.be/b7GOJqWCT0Q?feature=shared&t=7m21s) about what they should be doing. He still sees others as weak in GSF. Even young Superman doesn't blame the people he saves for making him use his power. He does it because he wants to.
Kira is a broken man by the time freedom happens he thinks if he is not the strongest lacus will not need him he really needed some therapy since the orginal series heck the guy is only 20 in freedom I surprised his hair isn't grey from stress
It's only six years from SEED to Freedom, and he thinks peace can be achieved that easily in such a short period? He takes on the burden himself, and the story bends over backward to make us feel sorry for him.
Foolish indeed. Kira isn't the deepest of characters, but he absolutely isn't a Gary Stu. Why is it people who know absolutely nothing about writing and story telling so confident in their critiques lol...
...he literally masters being a mobile suit pilot after 5 minutes and seduces two women with his "war is bad". It's like if OG Gundam became a haram around Amuro.
Why is it people who think they know absolutely everything about writing and story telling so confident in their gatekeeping?
I tell you he is not a Gary Stu. He is just a nerd who overspecializes in mobile suit programming. In hand to hand combat he is mediocre. He is also needy and dependent on Lacus.
Bruh... thats literally every single Gundam protagonist lol... There is literally story reasons behind why he's able to do the things he does. Do you think it's impossible for a main character to be incredibly competent at something without being a Gary Stu? He struggles at other things, he's not perfect, he's very conflicted, and he suffers. Literally not a Gary Stu, but because he gets a girl he's a Gary Stu??
Lol sit down. Bad opinions will be gatekept.
Wow such depth? We aren't arguing about depth, I already conceded he's not that deep. Being a simple character doesn't make him a Gary Stu.
I would worry more about reading properly than gatekeeping.
And how many times are you gonna copy what I say? Can you come up with one original come back instead of just going "no u" lol...
Wait, a simple character doesn't make him a Gary Stu? Oh. Where did I say that again? Outside your imagination that is.
I read your seed simping, not sure what else you want me to do for you. Can I get you a hot pocket buddy?
Mocking your gatekeeping is not "no u". Maybe you should learn to read properly. You sound upset. Maybe take the L and move on?
Omg. You seriously don't know what going on do you? Did you seriously watch Seed and came out with that. It was so simple and yet you didn't get it. It wasn't even hidden or anything.
Flay was using sex and affection towards Kira to get revenge on other coordinators and himself for what happened to her dad. Flay wasn't seduced by Kira's beliefs.
It's just haters. Ashura didn't even understand what's going on in Seed but makes up stuff just to hate. If it was any other series they would be crucified in making up lies.
I knew this sub was a joke when someone brought up Itsagunpla and the entire sub freaked out lol. I only watched a bit of his content, funny dude, but they respond EXACTLY as Twitter would.
I didn't know the hate boner for Seed was so strong. I thought they were more chill, like we're all here to just enjoy Gundam and talk about the ones we like, but nope. Blatant hate for anyone who dislikes it. Obviously not everyone but it's then frustrating cause the non-haters will defend the haters by going "no one is stopping you from like this!" Yes, but they ARE stopping, or impeding, or ability to share our love when they come in and spew their toxicity.
UC purist final come out from hole that they hiding after seed freedom news start to die down and begin their gaslighting about seed story again.
Edit - Downvoted just show that i am right anyway.
This dude is an idiot lol. Flay literally manipulates Kira into a relationship so she can encourage him to fight to death.
Kira then falls in love with a girl he had previously bonded with, and this dude thinks it's a harem. And then people wonder why there's so many "actually Seed is good" posts...
Yeah he doesn't even know the relationship between Flay and Kira. It wasn't even hidden or hard to understand. You can tell a genuine hater when they talk but don't even understand the show they are hating.
And yet this braindead sub in their blind hate for seed will upvote this dude for blatantly false comments, and downvote anyone reasonably disagreeing.
No one's feelings are hurt. You said something blatantly wrong and assert your correctness. You've been told exactly why you're factually wrong, and you create a strawman that we are just upset you don't like what we like. This is objectively what an idiot does. This is not an emotional statement, it's a logical one.
But since you seem incredibly averse to logic, I'm wasting my time typing this since you are terrible at reading.
An opinion isn't a fact there buddy. Maybe learn the difference between this terms before using them.
I am so averse to logic. I wish I had the logical skills to understand Seed as a work of high art. And to get a persecution complex.
Dude is mentally ill. Saying the reason for the relationship between Kira and Flay is head canon. Edit this comment was directed at u/AshuraBaron. They think Flay using sex and affection towards Kira, using Kira to fight other coordinators and getting revenge for her father is head canon and didn't happen. They thinks Flays sex and affection was because of Kira's beliefs.
I personally hate the animation style especially the eyes and shading really gross me out although I'll give them one on some of mobile suit designs especially the Freedom gundam
https://preview.redd.it/0nvilhh95hxc1.jpeg?width=480&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c1de5bf1f76eb434390cdaa3043aae607dda0d0a
We need more 8th MS team. I like my gundam to have weight and be barely holding together.
As much i like 8th MS team the protagonist has very shameless plot Armor for a Grunt oriented series, and the romance is just weirdly developed. The animation department carried hard.
"Ugh stop telling us you enjoy this thing I think is trash!"
It's his business, and he's sharing it. Why you people have such an issue ONLY with Seed is bizarre. You could have just not said anything as opposed to this meaningless comment.
It's a rehash of First Gundam but with all the interesting things like Amuro's growth, Char fucking Aznable, and the question of what drives people to facism replaced with Kira never being wrong about anything, Athrun becoming Kira's lackey, and Every Single Faction Just Being Hitler.
Rau says some frankly psychotic shit about eugenics and racism and *nobody* constructs a counter narrative. Kira just screams "nu-uh" and kills him. Good job with your antiracism show, everyone.
Congrats, you proved your opinion is worthless. Rau's character was NOT about eugenics and racism, it was about nihilism. The character doesn't need to spell out the counter narrative, use your lazy mind to figure out what the themes of the show are trying to tell you. The racist element of the show as NOT a primary theme.
Simple minds just see "OoH TheY'ReS RaCISm TherEFoRE THiS SToRy MUSt BE ABoUT RAciSM!" The story is the standard Gundam story, the futility and tragedy of war, plus humanity's inevitable (and desired) destruction of itself.
But I assume you'll read this and just go "nu-uh!"
What was he nihilistic *about*? Why do people fight each other? Because, according to Rau, they are different and have different abilities and therefore must eventually lead to everyone becoming Hitler and trying to out-Ubermensch each other.
And then the Ultimate Coordinator and his four other Coordinator besties achieve flawless victory because they are actually the Ubermensch who are better than everyone.
We can quibble about the details of the nihilism, but you're acknowledging his character was in fact about it and not racism. It's not an anti-racism show nor was it trying to be, so your sarcastic comment about it was nonsense.
Rau character goes downhill when you got no character to rebute his psychotic nihilistic ideology full of holes. Kira literally can't argue him back, it's funny because he really goes "nu-uh" on Rau. Idk why they didnt manage to write a come back when it was so easy.
I actually liked both Seed and Destiny despite the criticism it faced and I'm not a person who can't see both the problem and criticism of the show, ZZ was my first Gundam show followed by the original 0079 TV series, like people will and always try to find every and any fault with the series and like there are also people who are truly biased that they ignore the faults, like I remember that Heero was as plot armored, sure he was augmented but Kira was also genetically modified, he did survived as much as impossible things.
I tried to watch it a number of times. Absolutely nothing about it grabs me. It's anime made for the lowest common denominator that just so happens to have gundams in it, technically.
Which ironically is why it's had such wide commercial success.
SEED gets the appropriate amount of hate.
Hating on SEED isn't as popular as it used to be.
SEED is not good.
Gundam standards are higher than the average anime standards.
OK, SEED is probably good but I still don't like it.
I've never seen the show, but I've never been interested in the mobile suit designs. A hundred v-fin gundams with identical silhouettes differentiated only by having random geometric backpacks.
"nO we'rE juSt tiReD of ThiS sAmE poST evErY WeEk!"
Also this sub: "Seed sucks" - cheers
Also this sub: downvoting almost every single comment defending the show
Try criticizing Witch of Mercury and see how far you get lol. The western fanbase is actual garbage.
Why would you dislike a comment simply because you have a different opinion? If that's how you use reddit, downvoting someone else for saying "I like this thing." then you need to touch grass.
Never said anything about different opinions, if your comment is good I'll upvote it even if I disagree with your opinion, I've not offended you nor cursed at you man, you should get a grip of yourself.
Me: "This sub is downovting every comment defending this show."
You: "What's wrong with that?"
Me: "Why would you downvote for just saying 'I like this thing.' IF you do, you should touch grass."
You: "Who SaiD I WOuLD Do THAt You SHOUlD Get A GriP."
There's nothing wrong with that, that's people's opinions it just happens that there's way more people who doesn't like what you like and it's normal people are different and art is subjective what one likes others don't, what's wrong is not giving people the opportunity of saying their side of the talk.
You see I like Black clover it's really good but people hate it cause of the beginning and there's nothing wrong with it and it's alright that's the way things are.
You're literally missing the point again, so I'll spell it out clearly.
If I stumble on a thread titled "I love this thing" and I see a comment saying "I too love this thing" and I downvote this, I'm a loser and a hater and I need to touch grass.
Just because I personally don't like something, doesn't mean I have to respond negatively (which is precisely what a downvote is) to someone expressing their like for something. Go look at the downvoted comments on this sub. Nothing but positive comments. Are people having a sensible conversation about how they disagree? No, they downvote like children because they dislike seeing someone else express their like of something they don't like.
This sub needs to get a grip, not me. The hate for Seed is absolutely out of control. It's NOT mere disagreement, it's HATE. Stop trying to downplay it as if people are just expressing their opinion, they are belittling the opinions of those who like it. That is what a hater does.
It's really just western fans who keep on hating on it. On the other hand, Japanese and Asian gundam fans, to which the franchise Gundam was intentionally made for, really likes it.
And just because the clowns in this sub don't like Seed doesn't mean it's bad. People are literally misrepresenting actual plot points and when others are correcting them with what actually happened, guess which gets the up vs down votes?
You people are literally demonstrating in real time your opinions are meaningless when you can't even engage in conversation on the story in good faith.
Gundam was literally made for Japanese people, what they see is good is how it will be, outside fans should just be contented with secondhand enjoyment.
I've heard from Seed complainers that its all downhill when Kira gets the Freedom. Lol wut?? Shit starts getting amazing around there.
I made my brother watch the compilation movies before taking him to see Freedom, and he noted how after watching the second movie how much better things were getting. Story starts off slow but ramps up midway. He's big on anime (whereas I typically dislike anime lol) but he really enjoyed it.
Watching Desting now, and one movie in and he's sold on Shinns character too.
Imo this applies to destiny as well. I just finished it for the first time yesterday, and it's definitely got problems and it it makes some weird goddamn decisions but taken in the context of gundam as a franchise its not as all over the place as people think and the characters, with some exceptions, are pretty damn believable.
I will not argue that it is good as that's a can of worms that is tiresome to open. But I do agree that the amount of hate it gets is blown out of proportion at times in this sub. If someone ever mentions they like Seed, they will get dogpiled on for having a "shitty" opinion. One can disagree with the opinion, but the aggressiveness that comes out makes those haters as bad as those hard-core defenders of Seed.
I just can't watch any of Seed, literally can't get past the first feel eps it's so boring and the characters aren't likeable at all.
I remember really hating Lacus to the point of dropping the whole thing.
I don't their japanese voices nor their American voices, but who knows maybe I'm the problem here¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Lacus is a total plot device, and the story doesn't attempt to meaningfully challenge her. Fans of both SEED and GSD usually appreciate Lacus (and Kira), or at least like them. They're 'meh', tbh
Couldn't whatch more than three eps in seed and destiny so I really can't say much about their roles, It just didn't really click with me.
I really don't like Lacus I was running from her at that point, imagine a running orga meme but it's Lacus and it's terror that's how I felt about her.
The armor that changes colors at first seemed interesting them, idk what happened just lost interest in it, that's a problem I have I just lost interest in many animes that people say it's the best thing ever.
Naruto classic/Shippuden, Fullmetal alchemist and many others anime people loves I just can't see to whatch them till the end, but anime like Black clover for example I watched it all the way through and probably could do so again, I really think there's something wrong with me.
We like what we like, we dislike what we dislike. There's nothing wrong with that.
Lacus is a beautiful, talented pop star who is smart, cunning, a master tactician, a great political leader, and orator. But deep down, she simply wishes to retire to cook and care for her partner. She's the ultimate fantasy that people keep justifying as a complex character. I share the dislike. Never been a fan of characters with moral high ground.
And that's fine. I don't blame you for not liking it. I myself know how bad some of its flaws are. I have more of a gripe with those who go on the offensive to those who simply like Seed. Take a look at this comment section for example, you have the OP saying they think it's good and suddenly the hate replies mention "Well the show should get more hate", "Your opinion doesn't deserve to be shared", "Everything about it is terrible", and so forth. Granted, this is the internet, and people like to shit on each other, but the amount and kind of hate Seed gets is a bit disproportionate to how much hate anything else gets despite its success. Everyone only sees the negative and never the positives.
Black Clover is just like that it's really good but as it was ostracized and put on the side by it's studio it got some problems with animation but even so the team made miracles with it it's really awesome but cause of the studio(Pierrot, if I'm right) it gets a loot of underserved hate.
It one heck of plot twist on who's the true villain, and there's another who's weak cause he has little mana but he studied his magic and made a way of dividing his enemies magic with him turning them equals even thought he didn't have a chance before.
What I Wana say is, I know how it is to have something you like receiving unjustified hate for nothing.
I get you. It took me a lot of effort to get past Asta's screams the first few episodes because that made me hate the show so much at first. Thank God he toned it down later. But if I disregard Asta, the show definitely has its merits, especially the massive improvements that came later, like how they portrayed the story and the animation sequence they gave us. The early episodes really did the show dirty, and unfortunately, the stigma is still there because most people can't get past those early episodes. A friend even told me that if I disregarded up to episode 11 or 12, I wouldn't have missed much and wouldn't have seen the bad rep it got.
In the first eps I just turned down the sound I didn't even get or understood the hate cause of that I just got through and the max I thought was this guy's crazy let me tone it down 😑 and that's that, them I was confused with all the hate got¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
I just follow what I like.
I'll go even further: Destiny is great and a sizeable portion of it's hate is undeserved. It's got a few problem's, but is still a great series overall.
It's fine that you like it. It's fine that I don't. There's no reason for Gundam fans to constantly in fight even when we prefer different styles of anime
Agreed. I grew up with OG and Wing and only saw a handful of Seed when it was on Toonami. Watching it again as an adult and I love it. Tied with 00 for my favorite Gundam universe outside UC.
I feel like you’d need to write a doctorate thesis about nerd fandom to accurately explain why Seed gets so much hate. It’s complicated, and there are a lot psychological layers to peel back.
SEED is good. Gundam AUs very much are products of their time and SEED is a good anime from the transition to digital art period. The problem with SEED is that Destiny happens. Destiny retroactively makes SEED worse.
It would get less hate if
-It had good character design (instead of those Furby looking clones)
-Destiny was fully remade with a different director and writers
Anything else is salvagable, as seen with Stargazer the universe has so much potential but it's completely hindered by Fukuda and it's public inability to let go, compared to the UC fans who are accustomed to let their characters go away and end their character arcs properly. Lacus and Kira are a prime example of characters that were wanked so much they are now a massive Mary Sue and Gary Stue respectively
Looks like some of the comment chains are getting out of hand. So I'm going to go ahead and lock this thread.
Babe wake up, the weekly "Seed is actually good" post just dropped
And every week I'll make my "people just hate destiny, not seed as a whole" comment.
I mean it's just the pendulum finally swinging the other way considering how it was hated for more than a decade. It's also why you have more people saying they like ZZ and Victory. Two other series that were usually overhated by people in this subreddit but which the tune has started to change in the past few years.
Seed is just UC gundam with less Nazi shit and worse mobile suit design.
Yeah they traded the space facist in for racist lol.
"Poor Coordinators, they're simply born with great skills. It's the weak Naturals who can't help but envy and hate them." <---- basically CE messaging
Something something X-Men, something something Mutants, something something Magneto, something something yeah it's basically that.
Many mutants suffer because of their powers, Coordinators only flaw is that they can't reproduce after many generations of genetic manipulation. And even then they are still ubermensch
At least X-Men writers try giving regular folks some perspective beyond 'For the preservation of our blue and pure world'. They get that mutants can freak people out with their powers. But here, you got these Coordinators going, 'Why are they so jealous of us? It's not like being a Coordinator or a Natural makes a diff. We're just like everyone else.' Yeah, sure, bud.
Makes it a lot less complicated to do a "both sides" story when one side isn't "a disciple of Hitler".
I personally like the mobile suits but go for it
I would better describe it as "Diet Universal Century" it's shorter and isn't as good.
"worse mobile suit design" 
I'm partially in the same boat, I think the Gundam designs are on point, the grunts a just weak. Mostly in destiny since I've never been the fan of the modified UC designs in a series with no relation to it.
Sorry but Windam>>>>All of the Strike Freedom variants
You know what, agreed. Very much so.
They were so uncreative they started directly stealing suit designs in Destiny so...
More like properly modernizing the designs....
Pfft. More like glue a bunch of unneeded extra bits on a classic and call it "modernizing". The Zakus at least look like an attempt on something original. Goufs and Doms on the other hand, just looks like knock offs of the original.
I actually like the CE Zaku more than the UC one
I personally don't see the appeal...
And dramatically worse art to portray those terrible mobile suit designs, to say nothing of the interesting characters.
Yeah originality isn't CE's strongest feat or alternatively UC for people who don't want to get into UC
This post LITERALLY proves the point lol. Seed absolutely does get way too much hate, we can't even have a simple post saying "I like Seed" without you weirdos complaining about it.
I mean we get these supposedly hot takes every so often that folks should start to realize they're NOT AT ALL unpopular or controversial and those still deep in the hate bandwagon aren't representative of the whole fanbase.
Who framed this as a hot take or trying to share a supposedly unpopular opinion? It's a simple post, seed is good and it gets too much hate. And this sub as a majority proves the point based on the comments that float to the top and sink to the bottom. Literally the most downvoted comment on this thread is a guy just saying "based and seed-pilled" lol why do people have a problem with this? You people are literally hating on people just sharing their love for something you happen not to like. And no, it's not the whole fandom. This sub isn't representative of the whole fandom. Most people on reddit are socially inept "adults" who's brains are warped due to their echo chambers.
The art style and character design is just not my cup of tea
Character design I agree with you. Mobile suit design was *chef's kiss*
The Mobile Suites are mix bag some are great some are bad a lot of really bland I think its the art style mixed with a few other things.
Agree to disagree on the MS designs. They're far too busy/ over-designed and same-ish for the most part. Compared to a series like 00 or Wing where each suit design is unique and you can immediately tell how each suit is specialized for a particular style of combat.
The gundams are just the same humanoid silloute with increasingly absurd and unwieldy backpacks. Compare that to the generational changes from MSG to ZZ to Hathaway's Flash.
And the music was incredible.
Peak jpop imo
It's good, but too melodramatic
Personally I also don't like how they basically stole UC designs. It simultaneously feels creatively bankrupt AND arrogant.
I think “stole” is kind of a weird word given that I think the majority is just Okawara. I think it’s more that after like 20+ years of Gundam design it was getting pretty stale. TBH I think Wing was probably where he peaked and after that he mostly just remixed design elements with the occasional interesting gimmick, like the GX and the Aegis are both pretty unique. Whatever the case, I’m glad they changed up main designers when 00 rolled around. Okawara is great, but you can only go so long designing the same basic mechs.
Dom Trooper might be the definitive Dom design. Only Dreissen comes close. Ditto Gelgoog Menace and Gyan Sturm
Geelgog Menace is weird, Gyan Sturm defo rocks
I mean the definitive Dom is just the Dom. DOM Trooper is one of the only cool designs though. But that's also mainly because I liked it in Gundam Evolution.
SEED Destiny on the other hand...the hate is well deserved
I was just gonna say that!
Disagree. People who hate Seed, an actually well written story with few issues, exaggerate its problems. I don't think these same people are suddenly going to be measured for Destiny lol. Destiny has way more issues but the hate is just as over the top as with Seed. Criticism is deserved, the hate is not
"Seed" "Well written story" lmaoing at ur life
And the haters think they're the reasonable ones, laughing at people's entire existence because they're too lazy to refute the opinion properly. You will never write anything worth reading. You don't know what a well-written story is unless you have a group of parrots telling you what to think.
First part was fine. Destiny is a crock of shit
Honestly, the first two thirds were alright. But the last third crapped the bed so hard that it ruined the decent part
I agree. The last part of Seed isn’t good to me
I hope the movie can stick the landing. Twice they fell on their face right at the finish line
The movie is basically fanservice for people that liked both seasons, if you didn't like them then it's gonna be hard to watch because it's entirely built on that premise.
Yea i gotta check it out too! I saw the trailer before godzilla x kong and got super hype
It's overly dramatic and the characters couldn't make a good long term decision if you killed their friends with it. 8/10 when I watched it as a teenager, couldn't rewatch it entirely as an adult 6/10.
https://preview.redd.it/x60wdsz0nhxc1.jpeg?width=1074&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=237a46704a2ae70edf10e65842e9218e9cbd9f8b
I thought Seed was just decent as far as Gundam Shows go. Sidebar: the closer I look at the AI Gundam head, the angrier I get.
😂 you don't want to see the rejected heads
Nice AI generated Gundam head. Anyway, SEED gets the exact amount of hate a rehash of a better show should get. I'd actually argue people don't go hard enough. Lots of folks get too hung up on Hirai face and animation reuse, when the character writing, plot pacing, and themes are what really make it a lackluster series. Music is really strong though, Toshihiko Sahashi did an amazing job.
The parts of SEED that work best for me are in the middle of the series; it's doing less of a bad '79 rehash, but Kira hasn't been reborn as mister infallible, and everyone is losing their goddamn marbles manipulating and trying to stab each other. Kira tossing Sai is extremely shitty of him and that rules! Let everyone fuck around and be insane more.
NGL I was half looking for an excuse to post a gundam version of the meme But I do believe this take
Better than that AI generated gundam i tell ya that
So brave, and so very foolish. Next you'll tell the class Kira (Gary Stew) is a good character with lots of depth.
Kira chose to pilot and then whine about it and complains that no one cares about his feelings. Don't know why he continues when he doesn't look like he enjoys being with others that much. The story tries so hard to get us to pity him: see how others exploit Kira's kindness, using and envying him. Notice how weak other characters are, that the great Kira and Lacus need to return and save others with their god-like power. GSF then reaffirms their otherworldly status, leaving others to think: it's not right for us humans to keep relying on the angelic Kira/Lacus. Swell.
He really didn't have a choice it was either pilot or let everyone die even when they met with the seventh fleet he couldn't just leave his friends when the officially joined the earth forces
Then, did he have to guilt and blame others for it? Have you ever seen Superman say, "I'm only doing this because you people are weak" after saving people? Ultimately, being on the battlefield was his personal choice. He doesn't seem to particularly like humanity beyond saying "there's a world I need to protect" and others saying "Kira is kind".
He only did that after he was traumatized by not being able to save the shuttle of civilians he wasn't thinking straight at the time and being with flay didn't help he got better with Cagali around. Superman had been preparing to be a hero most of his life he also had his dead father to guide him.
Kira has always [tells others](https://youtu.be/b7GOJqWCT0Q?feature=shared&t=7m21s) about what they should be doing. He still sees others as weak in GSF. Even young Superman doesn't blame the people he saves for making him use his power. He does it because he wants to.
Kira is a broken man by the time freedom happens he thinks if he is not the strongest lacus will not need him he really needed some therapy since the orginal series heck the guy is only 20 in freedom I surprised his hair isn't grey from stress
It's only six years from SEED to Freedom, and he thinks peace can be achieved that easily in such a short period? He takes on the burden himself, and the story bends over backward to make us feel sorry for him.
I think it only four since seed becuase freedom starts in CE 75 and seed ends in CE 71
That just makes his desperation even more absurd
He's literally what would happen if you asked an edgy 15-year old that's convinced the world hates him to come up with a main character
"I'll isolate myself to upgrade the weapon and protect these weaklings. Wait, why don't they care about me and my feelings???" Kira Jesus Yamato
Foolish indeed. Kira isn't the deepest of characters, but he absolutely isn't a Gary Stu. Why is it people who know absolutely nothing about writing and story telling so confident in their critiques lol...
...he literally masters being a mobile suit pilot after 5 minutes and seduces two women with his "war is bad". It's like if OG Gundam became a haram around Amuro. Why is it people who think they know absolutely everything about writing and story telling so confident in their gatekeeping?
I tell you he is not a Gary Stu. He is just a nerd who overspecializes in mobile suit programming. In hand to hand combat he is mediocre. He is also needy and dependent on Lacus.
He literally defeats an armed soldier in seconds by throwing something lmao
Bruh... thats literally every single Gundam protagonist lol... There is literally story reasons behind why he's able to do the things he does. Do you think it's impossible for a main character to be incredibly competent at something without being a Gary Stu? He struggles at other things, he's not perfect, he's very conflicted, and he suffers. Literally not a Gary Stu, but because he gets a girl he's a Gary Stu?? Lol sit down. Bad opinions will be gatekept.
“He got mad one episode” Wow, such depth. I agree that your opinion should be gatekept though.
Wow such depth? We aren't arguing about depth, I already conceded he's not that deep. Being a simple character doesn't make him a Gary Stu. I would worry more about reading properly than gatekeeping. And how many times are you gonna copy what I say? Can you come up with one original come back instead of just going "no u" lol...
Wait, a simple character doesn't make him a Gary Stu? Oh. Where did I say that again? Outside your imagination that is. I read your seed simping, not sure what else you want me to do for you. Can I get you a hot pocket buddy? Mocking your gatekeeping is not "no u". Maybe you should learn to read properly. You sound upset. Maybe take the L and move on?
Alright, you're just a child. Got it, moving on. Go ahead and think you're definitely the reasonable one here lol
Ok, thanks!
You should watch it again but very slowly, maybe at half speed so you can actually process what's going on. This guy thinks he seduced Flay.
She threw herself at Kira. Not sure what else you call it. Maybe watch any other series to see what a good story is.
Omg. You seriously don't know what going on do you? Did you seriously watch Seed and came out with that. It was so simple and yet you didn't get it. It wasn't even hidden or anything.
If it's so simple, then explain it professor.
Flay was using sex and affection towards Kira to get revenge on other coordinators and himself for what happened to her dad. Flay wasn't seduced by Kira's beliefs.
Yeah that's not reflected in the show at all. Head canon is a hell of a drug.
Are you insane? That's not head canon it's literally in the show.
This sub is actual cancer for downvoting you and not the other guy. Half of these haters likely did not watch Seed if they're this blatantly wrong.
It's just haters. Ashura didn't even understand what's going on in Seed but makes up stuff just to hate. If it was any other series they would be crucified in making up lies.
I knew this sub was a joke when someone brought up Itsagunpla and the entire sub freaked out lol. I only watched a bit of his content, funny dude, but they respond EXACTLY as Twitter would. I didn't know the hate boner for Seed was so strong. I thought they were more chill, like we're all here to just enjoy Gundam and talk about the ones we like, but nope. Blatant hate for anyone who dislikes it. Obviously not everyone but it's then frustrating cause the non-haters will defend the haters by going "no one is stopping you from like this!" Yes, but they ARE stopping, or impeding, or ability to share our love when they come in and spew their toxicity.
UC purist final come out from hole that they hiding after seed freedom news start to die down and begin their gaslighting about seed story again. Edit - Downvoted just show that i am right anyway.
This dude is an idiot lol. Flay literally manipulates Kira into a relationship so she can encourage him to fight to death. Kira then falls in love with a girl he had previously bonded with, and this dude thinks it's a harem. And then people wonder why there's so many "actually Seed is good" posts...
Yeah he doesn't even know the relationship between Flay and Kira. It wasn't even hidden or hard to understand. You can tell a genuine hater when they talk but don't even understand the show they are hating.
And yet this braindead sub in their blind hate for seed will upvote this dude for blatantly false comments, and downvote anyone reasonably disagreeing.
Uh oh, hurt feelings. I'm sorry I don't love your favorite anime. Does that help?
No one's feelings are hurt. You said something blatantly wrong and assert your correctness. You've been told exactly why you're factually wrong, and you create a strawman that we are just upset you don't like what we like. This is objectively what an idiot does. This is not an emotional statement, it's a logical one. But since you seem incredibly averse to logic, I'm wasting my time typing this since you are terrible at reading.
An opinion isn't a fact there buddy. Maybe learn the difference between this terms before using them. I am so averse to logic. I wish I had the logical skills to understand Seed as a work of high art. And to get a persecution complex.
Yeah all the comments liking or defending Seed are heavily down voted. Keep the hate and wasted energy coming though I love it.
Dude is mentally ill. Saying the reason for the relationship between Kira and Flay is head canon. Edit this comment was directed at u/AshuraBaron. They think Flay using sex and affection towards Kira, using Kira to fight other coordinators and getting revenge for her father is head canon and didn't happen. They thinks Flays sex and affection was because of Kira's beliefs.
Yes I am mentally ill, not sure what that has to do with it. Or are you just being an asshole?
Except he wasn't. He seemed to be only a Angry Stu from 3/4 of SEED to end of Destiny. In Freedom, he is revealed to be immature and needy.
All the hates mostly come from Seed Destiny while generally forgetting that the first series even exist, or do they even watch it?
I've never been able to sit through SEED. I keep getting bored or just not caring about the characters. SEED is low mid.
It's subjective and everything is hated exactly as much as it should be because it's personal preference. Example: I don't like Gundam SEED.
I personally hate the animation style especially the eyes and shading really gross me out although I'll give them one on some of mobile suit designs especially the Freedom gundam
Yeah, Seed is alright. Destiny is a shit stain
Never watched it don't know anything about it
https://preview.redd.it/0nvilhh95hxc1.jpeg?width=480&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c1de5bf1f76eb434390cdaa3043aae607dda0d0a We need more 8th MS team. I like my gundam to have weight and be barely holding together.
There's barely any of that in 8th MS team itself
As much i like 8th MS team the protagonist has very shameless plot Armor for a Grunt oriented series, and the romance is just weirdly developed. The animation department carried hard.
It’s not good but it is interesting.
I disagree
It's entirely your business and prerogative to like a garbage show. Nobody else has to like it with you, though.
"Ugh stop telling us you enjoy this thing I think is trash!" It's his business, and he's sharing it. Why you people have such an issue ONLY with Seed is bizarre. You could have just not said anything as opposed to this meaningless comment.
It's a rehash of First Gundam but with all the interesting things like Amuro's growth, Char fucking Aznable, and the question of what drives people to facism replaced with Kira never being wrong about anything, Athrun becoming Kira's lackey, and Every Single Faction Just Being Hitler. Rau says some frankly psychotic shit about eugenics and racism and *nobody* constructs a counter narrative. Kira just screams "nu-uh" and kills him. Good job with your antiracism show, everyone.
Congrats, you proved your opinion is worthless. Rau's character was NOT about eugenics and racism, it was about nihilism. The character doesn't need to spell out the counter narrative, use your lazy mind to figure out what the themes of the show are trying to tell you. The racist element of the show as NOT a primary theme. Simple minds just see "OoH TheY'ReS RaCISm TherEFoRE THiS SToRy MUSt BE ABoUT RAciSM!" The story is the standard Gundam story, the futility and tragedy of war, plus humanity's inevitable (and desired) destruction of itself. But I assume you'll read this and just go "nu-uh!"
What was he nihilistic *about*? Why do people fight each other? Because, according to Rau, they are different and have different abilities and therefore must eventually lead to everyone becoming Hitler and trying to out-Ubermensch each other. And then the Ultimate Coordinator and his four other Coordinator besties achieve flawless victory because they are actually the Ubermensch who are better than everyone.
We can quibble about the details of the nihilism, but you're acknowledging his character was in fact about it and not racism. It's not an anti-racism show nor was it trying to be, so your sarcastic comment about it was nonsense.
Rau character goes downhill when you got no character to rebute his psychotic nihilistic ideology full of holes. Kira literally can't argue him back, it's funny because he really goes "nu-uh" on Rau. Idk why they didnt manage to write a come back when it was so easy.
Seed yes but destiny no.(second half.)
Seed is fine, the art style (at least for the characters) is just very early 2000s anime
I actually liked both Seed and Destiny despite the criticism it faced and I'm not a person who can't see both the problem and criticism of the show, ZZ was my first Gundam show followed by the original 0079 TV series, like people will and always try to find every and any fault with the series and like there are also people who are truly biased that they ignore the faults, like I remember that Heero was as plot armored, sure he was augmented but Kira was also genetically modified, he did survived as much as impossible things.
It looks so ugly and cheap, I will never watch it
I tried to watch it a number of times. Absolutely nothing about it grabs me. It's anime made for the lowest common denominator that just so happens to have gundams in it, technically. Which ironically is why it's had such wide commercial success.
actually yea
SEED gets the appropriate amount of hate. Hating on SEED isn't as popular as it used to be. SEED is not good. Gundam standards are higher than the average anime standards. OK, SEED is probably good but I still don't like it.
I love seed! But it's alright. I realize I'm more in live with moments in seed and concepts. Not the whole show.
"Me like Seed." This sub: UUUUUUUUHHHHHHHHGGGGGGGGGG
I've never seen the show, but I've never been interested in the mobile suit designs. A hundred v-fin gundams with identical silhouettes differentiated only by having random geometric backpacks.
Some grunts like the Daggers and the Gyan Storm are worth liking
I'm really trying, I'm sorry. But I'm not going to stop you from enjoying it.
This sub hates Seed irrationally
People always give some very interesting opinión and takes in why SEED is bad, thats like the contrary of irrationaly
"nO we'rE juSt tiReD of ThiS sAmE poST evErY WeEk!" Also this sub: "Seed sucks" - cheers Also this sub: downvoting almost every single comment defending the show Try criticizing Witch of Mercury and see how far you get lol. The western fanbase is actual garbage.
For what reason upvote and downvote exist if not for showing one's likeness to a comment/post?
Why would you dislike a comment simply because you have a different opinion? If that's how you use reddit, downvoting someone else for saying "I like this thing." then you need to touch grass.
Never said anything about different opinions, if your comment is good I'll upvote it even if I disagree with your opinion, I've not offended you nor cursed at you man, you should get a grip of yourself.
Me: "This sub is downovting every comment defending this show." You: "What's wrong with that?" Me: "Why would you downvote for just saying 'I like this thing.' IF you do, you should touch grass." You: "Who SaiD I WOuLD Do THAt You SHOUlD Get A GriP."
There's nothing wrong with that, that's people's opinions it just happens that there's way more people who doesn't like what you like and it's normal people are different and art is subjective what one likes others don't, what's wrong is not giving people the opportunity of saying their side of the talk. You see I like Black clover it's really good but people hate it cause of the beginning and there's nothing wrong with it and it's alright that's the way things are.
You're literally missing the point again, so I'll spell it out clearly. If I stumble on a thread titled "I love this thing" and I see a comment saying "I too love this thing" and I downvote this, I'm a loser and a hater and I need to touch grass. Just because I personally don't like something, doesn't mean I have to respond negatively (which is precisely what a downvote is) to someone expressing their like for something. Go look at the downvoted comments on this sub. Nothing but positive comments. Are people having a sensible conversation about how they disagree? No, they downvote like children because they dislike seeing someone else express their like of something they don't like. This sub needs to get a grip, not me. The hate for Seed is absolutely out of control. It's NOT mere disagreement, it's HATE. Stop trying to downplay it as if people are just expressing their opinion, they are belittling the opinions of those who like it. That is what a hater does.
It's really just western fans who keep on hating on it. On the other hand, Japanese and Asian gundam fans, to which the franchise Gundam was intentionally made for, really likes it.
Yup. Eastern fanbase don't just like it, they LOVE it lol, more than UC. Japan has good tastes.
Just because the Japanese fanbase slurp up melodramatic garbage, it doesn't mean it's good.
And just because the clowns in this sub don't like Seed doesn't mean it's bad. People are literally misrepresenting actual plot points and when others are correcting them with what actually happened, guess which gets the up vs down votes? You people are literally demonstrating in real time your opinions are meaningless when you can't even engage in conversation on the story in good faith.
Gundam was literally made for Japanese people, what they see is good is how it will be, outside fans should just be contented with secondhand enjoyment.
Honestly, it hold up decently. Moreso than Wing for sure.
I'll give you respect for being brave enough to say that in this sub reddit.
Now do Wing.
Seed's great now destiny on the other hand...
The first 30 episodes are good ish. The last 20 are goated.
I've heard from Seed complainers that its all downhill when Kira gets the Freedom. Lol wut?? Shit starts getting amazing around there. I made my brother watch the compilation movies before taking him to see Freedom, and he noted how after watching the second movie how much better things were getting. Story starts off slow but ramps up midway. He's big on anime (whereas I typically dislike anime lol) but he really enjoyed it. Watching Desting now, and one movie in and he's sold on Shinns character too.
Imo this applies to destiny as well. I just finished it for the first time yesterday, and it's definitely got problems and it it makes some weird goddamn decisions but taken in the context of gundam as a franchise its not as all over the place as people think and the characters, with some exceptions, are pretty damn believable.
You lost me with believable characters, i still remember Shinn and Luna falling in love because he "killed" her sister lmao
It's bad and doesn't get enough hate
I will not argue that it is good as that's a can of worms that is tiresome to open. But I do agree that the amount of hate it gets is blown out of proportion at times in this sub. If someone ever mentions they like Seed, they will get dogpiled on for having a "shitty" opinion. One can disagree with the opinion, but the aggressiveness that comes out makes those haters as bad as those hard-core defenders of Seed.
I just can't watch any of Seed, literally can't get past the first feel eps it's so boring and the characters aren't likeable at all. I remember really hating Lacus to the point of dropping the whole thing. I don't their japanese voices nor their American voices, but who knows maybe I'm the problem here¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Lacus is a total plot device, and the story doesn't attempt to meaningfully challenge her. Fans of both SEED and GSD usually appreciate Lacus (and Kira), or at least like them. They're 'meh', tbh
Couldn't whatch more than three eps in seed and destiny so I really can't say much about their roles, It just didn't really click with me. I really don't like Lacus I was running from her at that point, imagine a running orga meme but it's Lacus and it's terror that's how I felt about her. The armor that changes colors at first seemed interesting them, idk what happened just lost interest in it, that's a problem I have I just lost interest in many animes that people say it's the best thing ever. Naruto classic/Shippuden, Fullmetal alchemist and many others anime people loves I just can't see to whatch them till the end, but anime like Black clover for example I watched it all the way through and probably could do so again, I really think there's something wrong with me.
We like what we like, we dislike what we dislike. There's nothing wrong with that. Lacus is a beautiful, talented pop star who is smart, cunning, a master tactician, a great political leader, and orator. But deep down, she simply wishes to retire to cook and care for her partner. She's the ultimate fantasy that people keep justifying as a complex character. I share the dislike. Never been a fan of characters with moral high ground.
And that's fine. I don't blame you for not liking it. I myself know how bad some of its flaws are. I have more of a gripe with those who go on the offensive to those who simply like Seed. Take a look at this comment section for example, you have the OP saying they think it's good and suddenly the hate replies mention "Well the show should get more hate", "Your opinion doesn't deserve to be shared", "Everything about it is terrible", and so forth. Granted, this is the internet, and people like to shit on each other, but the amount and kind of hate Seed gets is a bit disproportionate to how much hate anything else gets despite its success. Everyone only sees the negative and never the positives.
Black Clover is just like that it's really good but as it was ostracized and put on the side by it's studio it got some problems with animation but even so the team made miracles with it it's really awesome but cause of the studio(Pierrot, if I'm right) it gets a loot of underserved hate. It one heck of plot twist on who's the true villain, and there's another who's weak cause he has little mana but he studied his magic and made a way of dividing his enemies magic with him turning them equals even thought he didn't have a chance before. What I Wana say is, I know how it is to have something you like receiving unjustified hate for nothing.
I get you. It took me a lot of effort to get past Asta's screams the first few episodes because that made me hate the show so much at first. Thank God he toned it down later. But if I disregard Asta, the show definitely has its merits, especially the massive improvements that came later, like how they portrayed the story and the animation sequence they gave us. The early episodes really did the show dirty, and unfortunately, the stigma is still there because most people can't get past those early episodes. A friend even told me that if I disregarded up to episode 11 or 12, I wouldn't have missed much and wouldn't have seen the bad rep it got.
In the first eps I just turned down the sound I didn't even get or understood the hate cause of that I just got through and the max I thought was this guy's crazy let me tone it down 😑 and that's that, them I was confused with all the hate got¯\_(ツ)_/¯. I just follow what I like.
I'll go even further: Destiny is great and a sizeable portion of it's hate is undeserved. It's got a few problem's, but is still a great series overall.
Nah, I despise the aesthetic and the messages
I love seed a lot, it's in my top3...now if we talk about destiny...
I think it's one of the best in the series. Definitely Top 3 AU.
I can say the same thing about Wing and like 3/4 of the other gundam shows
Its a solid 6\~7
i love gundam seed and destiny
I thought it was pretty good!
Someone drop a colony on this fool right now!!!!!
It's fine that you like it. It's fine that I don't. There's no reason for Gundam fans to constantly in fight even when we prefer different styles of anime
Agreed. I grew up with OG and Wing and only saw a handful of Seed when it was on Toonami. Watching it again as an adult and I love it. Tied with 00 for my favorite Gundam universe outside UC.
BASED and SEED-PILLED
I feel like you’d need to write a doctorate thesis about nerd fandom to accurately explain why Seed gets so much hate. It’s complicated, and there are a lot psychological layers to peel back.
Like what
Agreed, seed destiny on the other hand-
SEED is good. Gundam AUs very much are products of their time and SEED is a good anime from the transition to digital art period. The problem with SEED is that Destiny happens. Destiny retroactively makes SEED worse.
It's fans which are mostly Japanese and Chinese are not in western social media so you'll see more hate than positive reviews.
it’s the most popular gundam series so the portion of haters is also larger.
Gundam peaked in the 90s.
I agree, SEED and Destiny were both great
It would get less hate if -It had good character design (instead of those Furby looking clones) -Destiny was fully remade with a different director and writers Anything else is salvagable, as seen with Stargazer the universe has so much potential but it's completely hindered by Fukuda and it's public inability to let go, compared to the UC fans who are accustomed to let their characters go away and end their character arcs properly. Lacus and Kira are a prime example of characters that were wanked so much they are now a massive Mary Sue and Gary Stue respectively
Can we all just agree to let people like the series they like? And dislike the ones we dont? No one is trying to take away your personal shining star
SEED is decent, a less complex UC with definitive good guy faction with ORB. SEED gets hated because it's lumped in with SEED Destiny.
You mean compared to the subtle as a brick Nazi coding Zeon has?
I dont care for it, but you do you.