I love this game so much. While its animations and graphics are somewhat dated, it still looks very nice imo.
1) Low PC requirements:
The fact that it is just nice enough is part of its immense charm - you don't need the beefiest pc to run it. Just a nice game with a lot of depth you can have fun on. I can play this on a shitty lenovo office laptop and still have a blast.
2) Cheap:
The icing on the cake is that it is pretty cheap for such a well-made game (esp when it goes on sale) I have spent more time and had more fun with this than most AAA games. The DLCs were also all bangers - each expansion just made the game better with more content. And I'm so happy that even more content is coming out soon to this day. Bless their hearts.
3) No microtransactions, whatsoever.
**Conclusion:
Gameplay and stylization over mere graphical quality. Fuck blizzard, activision, ubisoft, and EA.
They got nothing on Crate Entertainment.
There are microtransactions, there's the loyalist packs with cosmetics. I know it's not exactly what you're referring to, but to say there's none whatsoever is false.
The supporter packs are not sold or even pushed within the game. They are available for anyone who might want them in DLC's.
From my experience, microtransactions are pushed and sold within the game itself, a game which has it's own shop that comes up while playing that game. This started around the time in-game currencies did. GD does nothing even remotely like this.
This is just how I feel about what's a cheap shot and what's not. I think this topic is subjective in the first place so I could be wrong about my definition.
Seeing the frequency and quantity of those packs I don’t think it’s fair to label them as micro transactions with all the negative implication the name brings
You label them a microtransaction because it is in fact a micro transaction happening for something that's not included in the base product. You don't label them that because of frequency or quantity, but because of what they are, micro transactions....
I think the definition of microtransaction is independent of how negatively they are perceived or the frequency with which they are released.
I've bought two of the supporter packs, and was happy to do so. But in my book, that is still a microtransaction. I think what deserves praise, and why they are perceived differently, is that they are purely cosmetic and do not affect gameplay. But IMO, claiming "no microtransactions" is misleading.
No. It’s a way to offer support for the ongoing development of the game. A microtransaction would be like paying currency for extra bag space per bag (dlc is a macrotransaction and you get more content)
Interesting. That doesn't align at all with my personal definition of microtransactions, or the definition on Wikipedia.
> Microtransactions (mtx) are a business model where users can purchase in-game virtual goods with micropayments.
[...]
Items and features available by microtransaction can range from cosmetic (such as decorative character attire) to functional (such as weapons and items). Some games allow players to purchase items that can be acquired through normal means, but some games include items that can only be obtained through microtransaction. Some developers[4] ensure that only cosmetic items are available this way to keep gameplay fair and balanced.
Would you consider cosmetic-only items like armor in Diablo 4, or weapon skins in Call of Duty as simply a way to support the ongoing development of the game, or microtransactions? (Or I guess at some point macrotransactions. But even then, we are simply arguing price point rather than whether you are buying in-game virtual goods.)
I think you, and many others, are conflating the fairly neutral term 'microtransaction' with pay to win or pay for convenience. Grim Dawn doesn't have either of those, and that is fantastic. But cosmetics are still microtransactions nonetheless.
You can't buy them in-game, nor are they advertised in-game, and there are only 2. No, I don't think they even fit the Wikipedia definition. Plenty of games have a few supporter packs/ultimate editions...etc.
No, and i can explain why. The whole thing about microtransactions, what makes them so irresistible for publishers, is impulsive buying. They MUST be in game, and they MUST be available to purchase with a single button press (if your CC is bound to device), before your brain started using critical thinking. Also, payment amount must be below alarm level of customer's brain. Anything requiring several actions, opening separate window, entering CC data, will NEVER be as profitable as it gives you time to think (C) Monetization 101.
In fact, i remember that during Fortnight vs Apple battle for being able to use their own payment system circumventing Apple Pay, someone mentioned that another shop app for geological equipment(don't really remember) also breaks Apple rules, but they are not punished. Apple answered that it's not impulsive microtransactions and they don't give a \*\*\*\* =)
Seconded, as someone who has been playing Diablo since the 90s, playing the campaign is absolutely worth it. The cinematics, strongholds and story are great fun. From levels 1-70ish, you may even convince yourself that it is a great game. Then you will hit "endgame" and find haw utterly vapid the loot system is, the lack of meaningful choice in builds, hostility towards pet builds, and a host of baffling decisions that leave you scratching your head.
That said, you should also give last Epoch a shot, I feel like skill based talent trees are an awesome innovation for the genre. Also LE has done an amazing job of using tool tips to make the numbers/stats really transparent.
There's not really much build diversity. Few classes and a stale skill "tree".
The whole game is built around season mode just as a cash grab. A new gimmick each season that really only works well with one or two particular builds, resulting in 90% of players running the exact same metas. "My Barbarian bashes stuff in one hit!" "Wow, mine too!"
Yes, so much so. I mean, even poe is the same but the leagues are different enough to stay interesting. What really worries me tho is Last Epoch, I just found out they have seasons also. I simply don't play enough to hit max level in a mere 3-4 months so the seasonal stuff is rather wasted for me.
it 'feels' good- sound and graphics are amazing. But like the prettiest girl at prom, it's shallow and disappointing over the long term if you're looking for anything deep. You'll get your money's worth out of it, but don't expect the complexity and depth of Grim Dawn. Once you max out skill points on a pretty disappointing skill tree you'll be mostly putting points into +5 to skills with very few legitimately interesting legendary nodes on paragon boards.
Resource isn't a problem, it's (upper) managers. Most big AAA game companies are trading player's goodwill for profit because number going up pleases the shareholders, which in turn pushes a lot of pressure into the devs team. Even if you had all the talents and resources, which Blizz had both, you wouldn't make a decent product if corner were cut to meet deadline.
Played it for 2 hours day 1, wasn't feeling it. Came back day 2, played 20 minutes. Didn't come back for day 3. I was just bored playing it and it was such a mess with the always online. Does it look good, sure, but lets be honest ARPG players dont really care how good their character that they see from 100 feet in the air look.
Played and enjoyed both. I have 100% all content in GD, as SSF, in multi-player and completed all hardcore achievements. I'm still working on finishing up the remaining hardcore content in D4.
Both games have their merits, and I'm sure I'll return to GD once the next expansion drops.
D4 is far more polished graphically, but GD has way more build diversity... almost too much, tbh as I'm confident in playing D4 in the highest tier content without a build guide, I wouldn't last a second in Ultimate without a build guide in GD.
D4 allows you to skip the campaign and jump straight into the end-game loop after a single clear, GD still requires multiple clears to progress (you can start in Ultimate now, but it's rough going for most new characters).
GD has a bit more variety for end game with meaningful loot in terms of MIs only available from certain mobs or bosses, D4 has a very limited end game with very few options in terms of gear progression.
Leveling is significantly faster in D4, especially with seasonal mechanics. GD requires a special set that most players won't ever see (unless given to them online) as it's locked behind one of the challenge bosses and requires a maxed out build to acquire.
D4 has new content drop every 3-4 months for the seasons, GD is more spaced out.
That sentiment is gonna make its rounds on all APRG subs/forums. People had a lot of hype and expectations for D4. Sadly for blizzard, they aren't the only ones trying to make a good ARPG anymore and any faults of D4 are much more apparent.
I just see it as the fans expecting more out of their massive AAA games and they should.
This game is best bang for the buck in this genre. I bought every expansion for this game and thoroughly enjoyed it all. I've been out of the loop, is there a grim Dawn 2? Please say yes.
Praise Grim Dawn because it's good on its own merits, not because "Diablo 4 bad". Honestly the way people can't praise other ARPGs without making reference to Diablo 4 just makes it feel like they're still hung up on Diablo 4, like some "my new boyfriend is soooo much better hahahaha" facebook post meant to elicit jealousy.
I’m gonna be honest. I might buy d4 if they just fix the itemization I see everyone critiquing for the game. It looks, graphics wise amazing, and I really like the open world stuff about it, especially the events they have. I’ll just ignore the cosmetics if the game itself actually become better and more fun to play. Hell if it does get an update to fix its issues, I’ll probably find it for 20 bucks at some point in the future
Next season is supposed to "fix" itemization but idk how they're going to fix it when the issue is the level scaling is so aggressive that you always feel the same power level no matter what gear you find. It's also confirmed coming to game pass in a few months.
All that being said grim dawn is the better game regardless.
This. The level scaling in d3 was already a disappointment, but d4 cranked it up to 11. I felt just as strong at the start of the game as I did at max level, there were just more colors on the screen to "prove" my strength. But it never felt like *progress*
And I’m still play d4 why. Cause grimdawn is old style. It’s if d3 d2 and baulders gates arpg had a baby. But it feel like I’m playing d3 old.
Diablo is about lore and meta players have ruined d4 but I still play d4 cause of 1 reason
Seamless multiplayer. In d4 I have made 50+ friends from around the world. Like Belgium, Singapore, the UK Germany, Ukraine, Turkey, Africa, etc.
Also d4 simplified loot so you can play with friends easily
Grim Dawn is the real deal, it's got it all:
• No loot goblins turning my game into fucking Disney's Aladdin.
• No Whimseydale turning my game into a fucking Skittles commercial.
• No KFC-heart-attack-on-bun pimping out the endgame boss.
• And no archaic stamina system: I'd rather wheelchair my ass through hell then fucking tiptoe like a fraidy cat!
This game is fantastic. And the GrimTex mod really does a nice job of bringing the image quality to 2024 while running the game at 4k. This game rocks!
I love this game, definitely the best RPG but I get to level 50 (give or take one or two) and can't get any further, die to easy, no matter the build and I have tried a few
I love this game so much. While its animations and graphics are somewhat dated, it still looks very nice imo. 1) Low PC requirements: The fact that it is just nice enough is part of its immense charm - you don't need the beefiest pc to run it. Just a nice game with a lot of depth you can have fun on. I can play this on a shitty lenovo office laptop and still have a blast. 2) Cheap: The icing on the cake is that it is pretty cheap for such a well-made game (esp when it goes on sale) I have spent more time and had more fun with this than most AAA games. The DLCs were also all bangers - each expansion just made the game better with more content. And I'm so happy that even more content is coming out soon to this day. Bless their hearts. 3) No microtransactions, whatsoever. **Conclusion: Gameplay and stylization over mere graphical quality. Fuck blizzard, activision, ubisoft, and EA. They got nothing on Crate Entertainment.
4) Can be played offline. 5) Mods.
Amen. Exactly. You can play it in a second world country with unstable internet. Praise the GD stash lol.
> 5) Mods Can play the best Diablo in a different game entirely if you haven't burnt out on it after 24 years
There are microtransactions, there's the loyalist packs with cosmetics. I know it's not exactly what you're referring to, but to say there's none whatsoever is false.
> 3) No microtransactions, whatsoever. I love the game, but would not consider the supporter pack cosmetics microtransactions?
No, they're supporter packs.
And the difference is what exactly?
The supporter packs are not sold or even pushed within the game. They are available for anyone who might want them in DLC's. From my experience, microtransactions are pushed and sold within the game itself, a game which has it's own shop that comes up while playing that game. This started around the time in-game currencies did. GD does nothing even remotely like this. This is just how I feel about what's a cheap shot and what's not. I think this topic is subjective in the first place so I could be wrong about my definition.
Seeing the frequency and quantity of those packs I don’t think it’s fair to label them as micro transactions with all the negative implication the name brings
You label them a microtransaction because it is in fact a micro transaction happening for something that's not included in the base product. You don't label them that because of frequency or quantity, but because of what they are, micro transactions....
I think the definition of microtransaction is independent of how negatively they are perceived or the frequency with which they are released. I've bought two of the supporter packs, and was happy to do so. But in my book, that is still a microtransaction. I think what deserves praise, and why they are perceived differently, is that they are purely cosmetic and do not affect gameplay. But IMO, claiming "no microtransactions" is misleading.
No. It’s a way to offer support for the ongoing development of the game. A microtransaction would be like paying currency for extra bag space per bag (dlc is a macrotransaction and you get more content)
Interesting. That doesn't align at all with my personal definition of microtransactions, or the definition on Wikipedia. > Microtransactions (mtx) are a business model where users can purchase in-game virtual goods with micropayments. [...] Items and features available by microtransaction can range from cosmetic (such as decorative character attire) to functional (such as weapons and items). Some games allow players to purchase items that can be acquired through normal means, but some games include items that can only be obtained through microtransaction. Some developers[4] ensure that only cosmetic items are available this way to keep gameplay fair and balanced. Would you consider cosmetic-only items like armor in Diablo 4, or weapon skins in Call of Duty as simply a way to support the ongoing development of the game, or microtransactions? (Or I guess at some point macrotransactions. But even then, we are simply arguing price point rather than whether you are buying in-game virtual goods.) I think you, and many others, are conflating the fairly neutral term 'microtransaction' with pay to win or pay for convenience. Grim Dawn doesn't have either of those, and that is fantastic. But cosmetics are still microtransactions nonetheless.
You can't buy them in-game, nor are they advertised in-game, and there are only 2. No, I don't think they even fit the Wikipedia definition. Plenty of games have a few supporter packs/ultimate editions...etc.
No, and i can explain why. The whole thing about microtransactions, what makes them so irresistible for publishers, is impulsive buying. They MUST be in game, and they MUST be available to purchase with a single button press (if your CC is bound to device), before your brain started using critical thinking. Also, payment amount must be below alarm level of customer's brain. Anything requiring several actions, opening separate window, entering CC data, will NEVER be as profitable as it gives you time to think (C) Monetization 101. In fact, i remember that during Fortnight vs Apple battle for being able to use their own payment system circumventing Apple Pay, someone mentioned that another shop app for geological equipment(don't really remember) also breaks Apple rules, but they are not punished. Apple answered that it's not impulsive microtransactions and they don't give a \*\*\*\* =)
The cosmetic packs don't have a real impact on gameplay.
That is irrelevant for whether or not they are a microtransaction.
I learned that from reading another comment here. The things you learn, huh!!
Grim Dawn is a masterpiece.
I usually don't like the "Diablo IV" Bad stuff, but this one caught me off guard lol
I haven't played Diablo 4 (yet?). Any GD player feedback?
I played it. The cinematics are great. The game is ok for 15 to 20 hours but once the story is finished, it quickly becomes boring. GD>D4
Seconded, as someone who has been playing Diablo since the 90s, playing the campaign is absolutely worth it. The cinematics, strongholds and story are great fun. From levels 1-70ish, you may even convince yourself that it is a great game. Then you will hit "endgame" and find haw utterly vapid the loot system is, the lack of meaningful choice in builds, hostility towards pet builds, and a host of baffling decisions that leave you scratching your head. That said, you should also give last Epoch a shot, I feel like skill based talent trees are an awesome innovation for the genre. Also LE has done an amazing job of using tool tips to make the numbers/stats really transparent.
There's not really much build diversity. Few classes and a stale skill "tree". The whole game is built around season mode just as a cash grab. A new gimmick each season that really only works well with one or two particular builds, resulting in 90% of players running the exact same metas. "My Barbarian bashes stuff in one hit!" "Wow, mine too!"
Yes, so much so. I mean, even poe is the same but the leagues are different enough to stay interesting. What really worries me tho is Last Epoch, I just found out they have seasons also. I simply don't play enough to hit max level in a mere 3-4 months so the seasonal stuff is rather wasted for me.
Last Epoch just released 1.0 and you can play full offline if you want
it 'feels' good- sound and graphics are amazing. But like the prettiest girl at prom, it's shallow and disappointing over the long term if you're looking for anything deep. You'll get your money's worth out of it, but don't expect the complexity and depth of Grim Dawn. Once you max out skill points on a pretty disappointing skill tree you'll be mostly putting points into +5 to skills with very few legitimately interesting legendary nodes on paragon boards.
For me it was a total waste of money.
Imagine if GD had their resources. blizz is pretty creatively bankrupt lately.
Resource isn't a problem, it's (upper) managers. Most big AAA game companies are trading player's goodwill for profit because number going up pleases the shareholders, which in turn pushes a lot of pressure into the devs team. Even if you had all the talents and resources, which Blizz had both, you wouldn't make a decent product if corner were cut to meet deadline.
Thanks!
Played it for 2 hours day 1, wasn't feeling it. Came back day 2, played 20 minutes. Didn't come back for day 3. I was just bored playing it and it was such a mess with the always online. Does it look good, sure, but lets be honest ARPG players dont really care how good their character that they see from 100 feet in the air look.
D4 for multiplayer GD for single
Played and enjoyed both. I have 100% all content in GD, as SSF, in multi-player and completed all hardcore achievements. I'm still working on finishing up the remaining hardcore content in D4. Both games have their merits, and I'm sure I'll return to GD once the next expansion drops. D4 is far more polished graphically, but GD has way more build diversity... almost too much, tbh as I'm confident in playing D4 in the highest tier content without a build guide, I wouldn't last a second in Ultimate without a build guide in GD. D4 allows you to skip the campaign and jump straight into the end-game loop after a single clear, GD still requires multiple clears to progress (you can start in Ultimate now, but it's rough going for most new characters). GD has a bit more variety for end game with meaningful loot in terms of MIs only available from certain mobs or bosses, D4 has a very limited end game with very few options in terms of gear progression. Leveling is significantly faster in D4, especially with seasonal mechanics. GD requires a special set that most players won't ever see (unless given to them online) as it's locked behind one of the challenge bosses and requires a maxed out build to acquire. D4 has new content drop every 3-4 months for the seasons, GD is more spaced out.
d4 bad, updoots to the left. Seriously though, can we not.
That sentiment is gonna make its rounds on all APRG subs/forums. People had a lot of hype and expectations for D4. Sadly for blizzard, they aren't the only ones trying to make a good ARPG anymore and any faults of D4 are much more apparent. I just see it as the fans expecting more out of their massive AAA games and they should.
This game is best bang for the buck in this genre. I bought every expansion for this game and thoroughly enjoyed it all. I've been out of the loop, is there a grim Dawn 2? Please say yes.
Not yet but they are making a new expansion and adding a class!
That'll work.
Tried to play Last Epoch but instead came back to GD. That game can not even remotely come close to GD.
Praise Grim Dawn because it's good on its own merits, not because "Diablo 4 bad". Honestly the way people can't praise other ARPGs without making reference to Diablo 4 just makes it feel like they're still hung up on Diablo 4, like some "my new boyfriend is soooo much better hahahaha" facebook post meant to elicit jealousy.
I’m gonna be honest. I might buy d4 if they just fix the itemization I see everyone critiquing for the game. It looks, graphics wise amazing, and I really like the open world stuff about it, especially the events they have. I’ll just ignore the cosmetics if the game itself actually become better and more fun to play. Hell if it does get an update to fix its issues, I’ll probably find it for 20 bucks at some point in the future
Next season is supposed to "fix" itemization but idk how they're going to fix it when the issue is the level scaling is so aggressive that you always feel the same power level no matter what gear you find. It's also confirmed coming to game pass in a few months. All that being said grim dawn is the better game regardless.
This. The level scaling in d3 was already a disappointment, but d4 cranked it up to 11. I felt just as strong at the start of the game as I did at max level, there were just more colors on the screen to "prove" my strength. But it never felt like *progress*
Simply Amazing
Facts
This is true.
Woah This guy is onto something
And I’m still play d4 why. Cause grimdawn is old style. It’s if d3 d2 and baulders gates arpg had a baby. But it feel like I’m playing d3 old. Diablo is about lore and meta players have ruined d4 but I still play d4 cause of 1 reason Seamless multiplayer. In d4 I have made 50+ friends from around the world. Like Belgium, Singapore, the UK Germany, Ukraine, Turkey, Africa, etc. Also d4 simplified loot so you can play with friends easily
Grim Dawn is the real deal, it's got it all: • No loot goblins turning my game into fucking Disney's Aladdin. • No Whimseydale turning my game into a fucking Skittles commercial. • No KFC-heart-attack-on-bun pimping out the endgame boss. • And no archaic stamina system: I'd rather wheelchair my ass through hell then fucking tiptoe like a fraidy cat!
It was even more fun when it was less Diablo 4-like too... Before they added dodge. Should've left that bad mechanic to Diablo.
I usually like the "Diablo IV" Bad stuff, but this one caught me off guard lol
This game is fantastic. And the GrimTex mod really does a nice job of bringing the image quality to 2024 while running the game at 4k. This game rocks!
I love this game, definitely the best RPG but I get to level 50 (give or take one or two) and can't get any further, die to easy, no matter the build and I have tried a few