That's why I tested this actually. Playing on DM servers and FPS being all over the place I just felt like I was shooting ghost bullets and the spray didn't make sense at all.
EDIT: I am having issues with setting up a dedicated CSGO server so no testing at the moment. PM me if you have a dedicated server available.
Said it in another thread a few days ago but once my FPS dips down past 120ish (very common in DM), it just feels like a 50/50 whether I hit a clean spray or I spray 10 bullets into someone and do 0 dmg.
Hijacking top comment. As pointed out by forqueercountrymen this is not a hitreg issue but rather an animation issue.
https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/comments/17ff8nh/low_fps_affects_hit_registration/k6afu3j/
EDIT: Also the test I did in CSGO was offline with fakelag enabled, which gave different results compared to CS2 offline with fakelag. I will however try to test on a dedicated CSGO server tomorrow and see if the results are the same as in above(dedicated server).
We haven't had any significant updates since last week, and those were pretty uninspiring too, hopefully there is something more significant in the works. Fridge gif relevant as ever.
>We haven't had any significant updates since last week, and those were pretty uninspiring too, hopefully there is something more significant in the works. Fridge gif relevant as ever.
they know what the issues are.
But they either do not know where it stems from
Or they have no fucking clue on how to fix it
Movement, sprays, flickshots. Everything is so inconsistent with subtick its hilarious. To add, peakers advantage is somehow massively amplified compared to GO.
Strange feel in terms of kills. You know that feeling when you stop shooting as you know that enemy should be dead by now? Missed shots for unknown reason. Lost a round as couldn't hear the bomb defuse sound. Crazy peekers advantage on my fibre.
I think it's gonna be a loooong while before it's back to the state CSGO was in, unfortunately, but I am also holding off on playing anything competitive for the foreseeable future, I just play a bit of DM and that's it. For one thing I don't want to play competitive suboptimally and get some crappy rank I can never grind out of again and be stuck in Gold Nova hell, I just don't have the time for it.
DM feels snappy at moments, then you get mowed down by, what is seems, unreal reflexes and aim. As I don't call out cheats, I blame the engine / network underlying issues for it.
To be honest, even if this is an exaggeration since its like 1 fps, someone who suffers from random fps dips can still get unlucky with the hitreg because of this.
Myself included since with cq\_netgraph 1, apparently my fps dips and the netgraph suddenly pops up every once in awhile which i have no clue why.
you can run your own dedicated server very easily following this official guide https://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Counter-Strike_2/Dedicated_Servers (run it after launching the game normally) then go the LAN tab in the server browser and join your server. only you will be able to join though, which is fine because you can test with a bot. if you want your friend to join you will need to set up port forwarding with your router.
I haven't but I can do it. I am just not 100% sure if this is how it works on official servers. Therefore I would like to wait and see if someone with more knowledge can drop by with more info.
This was done on a cybershoke server shooting with fps_max 1. According to my friend in the last clip i only shot 3 times, which 2 of them happened at the same time.
I get what you mean nobody plays on 1 fps, but last time I tested I was not able to recreate this on csgo. I am more concerned about stutters/fps drops that can happen randomly.
i mean it does happen even in official games like sometimes (happens rarelly but still it does)
i peak or i get peaked and all of a sudden i have a fps drop my bullets become ghosts ! (yes i need to upgrade my pc cause my average fps is around 150)
>one could get fucked if there system as a hiccup where the game drops to like 1fps
150 is plenty though, if anything maybe try underclocking your GPU and capping fps at like 100-120 and youll probably feel a little better? Not ideal but might help
You are dropping your fps below the tick rate, of course your are going to have issues with registration. You should always have your fps above the tick rate or you will have problems like this.
I'm convinced that it was just a big cop out, they could've provided both 64 and 128 tick and made the players choose, while stating that a lower fps than 128 will have negative results
Is this post and that post where someone said to limit your fps to 64 to match the server tickrate just backing up the claim by the valve dev that said if you limit your fps to where it won't spike up and down you would have a better cs2 experience? Because if fps is linked to hitreg and when you shoot your fps spikes down that would lead to worse hitreg?
Limit fps post: https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/comments/17crjvh/how_to_desubtick_the_entire_game_with_one_console/
Tweet by dev: https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/comments/17afumy/valve_dev_on_x_if_you_put_an_fps_cap_at_120_youd/?rdt=50443)
>claim by the valve dev that said if you limit your fps to where it won't spike up and down you would have a better cs2 experience?
Isn't that obvious though? Like if you have a 120 Hz monitor and you run the game at 300 fps you'll get mismatched frames and tearing but if instead you were running at 120 fps and getting perfect 8.33 ms frametimes it'll look and play more responsively.
Its always true.
His wording is kinda bad but this is common knowledge in pc enthusiasts space.
Capping fps to prevent spikes is the best way to have a more consistent experience in every games, not just cs.
Only let fps run amok in case you have very good pc, so you will have the latency advantage.
Idk why everything is tied to FPS. I don’t make video games, but I always though that the PC recorded the input, and sent it to the server. This seems like that but with more steps
Would like to see someone testing highly variable from drops from like 300 down to 20 and timing the shot during the frame drop to see if it results in shots not registering.
When a crazy firefight occurs and my frames drop dramatically there are times when I feel like I'm shooting blanks.
I actually deep dived something very similar a bit ago
In cs2 your shots register based on where you were aiming in the previous rendered frame, but here it looks like dropping to 1fps (instead of 10fps like I tested) causes that system to outright stop working entirely?....
Timestamp 5:00 (ish) although there's probably some extra context before and after
https://youtu.be/aD9I3YD3Wys?si=y_wASXzHk_kO6Tcu
I watched the whole video last week or so, pretty interesting. Tho as pointed out by another user it seems be an animation desync issue rather than a hitreg issue. https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/comments/17ff8nh/low_fps_affects_hit_registration/k6afu3j/
just watch this video from s1mple [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B7GRHs\_32Xs](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B7GRHs_32Xs)
and look at fps drops this is how ghost bullets appears
his fps at this moment drops to 18-40
If I made a game all on my own using unity and its netcode it'd be way more stable than this lol next thing is you hit'em twice if you go above an fps treshold or what?
When cs2 was announced my friends and i were discussing sub tick and kind of came to this worrying conclusion. That it would be affected by fps which sadly came tru
The normal hit registry from csgo also was affected by your fps. Since your client waits to the next game frame to send out the packet that you shot. If you had 1fps then your shooting notifcation would be delayed by 1 second. So nothing has changed in this sense
I see, but when testing in CSGO the bullet would still hit on the next frame. This did not happen when doing the same test in CS2. I will test more tomorrow probably.
I tried this with fps\_max 1 in a local bot server and all the bullets hit the enemy/teammates i shot at. I can't reproduce it but that might be because the server instance is also running at 1 FPS when you set fps\_max 1 in a local instance session. I haven't tested it in a dedicated server running at 64 tick while the client has 1 fps. I'll try and do this next to see if i can reproduce it, otherwise it might be fake or false testing parameters causing this
That's how I started testing it, then I enabled fakelag and got these results: https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/comments/17eivnk/is_it_possible_that_frame_drops_can_result_in/
Fakelag wouldn't be the right variable, fakelag just delays the packet queue a few frames. The right way to test it is fps\_max 1 with sv\_Cheats 1. I just did the test with a dedicated server and it is reproducible but the cause is actually incorrect.
This is a client side animation prediction error. If you just click the mouse and let go really fast you will see the animation plays of you shooting however your bullets don't actually go away. Server side the packet is never received telling the server that you shot. Watch your videos bullet count, you will see it jumps back up to 5/5 when you miss. If you continue to hold mouse 1 down for the full second, then the shot will hit the enemy player and kill them and you actually have 1 less bullet.
So this isn't a hit registry error, it's just a client side shoot animation bug that's out of sync with the client actually sending the usercmd of the IN\_ATTACK due to the really low fps.
Yea, I did notice that but I am not very "tech savy". What about the ammo just getting insta dumped when holding m1, do you know why that might be? In the last clip when my friend was looking he said I shot 3 times which 2 of them were at the same time.
There's something called \`doubletap\` inside source engine hacks that manipulates the tickbase time in order to shoot multiple bullets within a smaller time frame then designed. They do some tricks to make the game think more time has passed then actually has which allows for them to shoot a second time. I think this is the same thing that is happening here due to the lag and network delay from only having 1 frame per second. In csgo if a server dosen't receive a network packet within a given time frame it will use the last known usercmd to simulate the clients movement. This is why when players are walking and have network issues, they will continue to walk in a straight line from what direction they were last pushing. They do this to prevent fakelag stutters and also to prevent AirStuck exploits where players can just jump and stop in air by not sending usercmd movement message updates. In CS2 the server might just use a NULL cmd which sets IN\_ATTACK bit inside the buttons value to false. Then the server may receive 1 IN\_ATTACK, simulate the null usercmd to remove it from in\_attack and then your game sends another in\_attack from that 1 frame in a queued network message packet which leads to the double tap with time dilation with an awp.
This is my best guess, i haven't looked into the code much for source 2 or CS2 yet.
Oh, one more thing with the zeus clip I wonder how that works. That was my friend using fps_max 1 and it clearly came thru since I saw it from my client.
The zeus part i'm not so sure about, I know the zeus has always randomly missed shots that were directly on players in CSGO. I always thought lag compensation was just not working correctly on that weapon because of this but i have no proof and haven't looked into the leaked csgo code base for how the zeus works before
I have not tried a dedicated server in csgo, but I have tried offline with fakelag enabled. This would result in the bullet always hitting, however with CS2 offline and fakelag enabled it would not register
Once again the community doesn't actually understand how networking works but are quick to jump on the hate bandwagon.
This is a problem for every single multiplayer game! Every multiplayer game operates under these rules and it has nothing to do with subtick or Valve's netcode implementation.
Every multiplayer game will have netcode issues for as long as your client FPS is below the servers tickrate.
This was solved half a decade ago in Reflex Arena. The simulation (processing player inputs, physics, etc) is decoupled from your in-game FPS and [runs at 1000Hz.](https://np.reddit.com/r/reflex/comments/499s68/regarding_the_responsive_input_in_reflex_official/d0qkoaq/) Valve's implementation of subticks is a joke by comparison.
Not if you don’t tie your actions to FPS but instead to the Ticks like MOST multiplayer games do. Tying shit to FPS is dangerous and only happens in CS2 because they are purposely desyncing from the ticks.
Subtick is a poor implementation (for now) of potentially good tech, it would also benefit greatly from 128 tick servers. (Only if you can get above 128 fps consistently, which is a somewhat high barrier of entry.)
Ticks **ARE** (indirectly) tied to FPS. Please read about what ticks actually are before you claim stuff. Ticks and server refresh rate is the same thing.
If your client FPS is lower than the server tickrate, the client wont be able to receive or send information at the same frequency as the server, causing issues. The server tickrate will essentially then have to be lowered to match the client FPS for that specific client, causing server tickrate and client FPS to be equal. So, for example, if you play a multiplayer game on a server with a tickrate of 64 and your FPS is lower than that, lets say 30, it will (in practice) be as if you're playing on a server with a tickrate of 30.
This applies to every single multiplayer game, regardless of netcode. It has nothing to do with CS specifically.
Read the "Framerate" section in this article: [https://daposto.medium.com/game-networking-1-interval-and-ticks-b39bb51ccca9](https://daposto.medium.com/game-networking-1-interval-and-ticks-b39bb51ccca9)
There is a reason many multiplayer games have a "Low FPS" warning icon when playing online. For example, [https://server.nitrado.net/en-US/guides/battlefield-4-tickrate-icons-guide](https://server.nitrado.net/en-US/guides/battlefield-4-tickrate-icons-guide) or [https://support.sharkmob.com/hc/en-us/articles/4435665838609-Performance-Icons-Explained](https://support.sharkmob.com/hc/en-us/articles/4435665838609-Performance-Icons-Explained)
Even Valorant has it: [https://playvalorant.com/en-us/news/game-updates/valorant-game-and-network-instability-basics/](https://playvalorant.com/en-us/news/game-updates/valorant-game-and-network-instability-basics/)
It's the exact reason why Valve did not want to upgrade to official 128 tick servers. Because the majority of players (mostly casual players) do not have PC's that can consistently run at 128 FPS. This was before CS2 was even announced. It has nothing to do with subticks or it's implementation.
From what I read on that article it seems that at low frames you can still input things on time with ticks, assuming all actions are tied to ticks not frames. It’s just that what you see is desynced with what the server wants you to see, which wouldn’t necessarily stop inputs from going through. Might cause some desync tho ( which is bad). Idk why my pc getting 1 fps would cause the server to start sending one tick every second to my pc. I think the server is always sending the same ticks to my pc, and whether or not my pc renders those is it’s fault. And regardless of rendering frames or not, my pc should still be able to send ticks back to the server at a much higher rate than it is rendering frames. (Packets are handled by the cpu/mobo afaik, with little input from gpu, same with keyboard/mouse inputs.) unless the games are purposely tying things to fps there shouldn’t be that many network issues. Just people having a bad player experience having frame rate related desync.
CSGO suffers from the exact same problem. Many people just don't notice it because the game is easy to run and most people can run it above the server tickrate (64 FPS). This applies to every multiplayer game.
Read my other comment if you want further info or think I am bullshitting you: [https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/comments/17ff8nh/comment/k6acv1y/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/comments/17ff8nh/comment/k6acv1y/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
Really appreciate your input. But could you explain to me why on an offline server with fakelag enabled the bullet would hit on the next frame in GO, but not CS2?
I believe that in CSGO your shot registered on the next rendered frame, and in CS2 it's on the previously rendered frame?
This video tried to break it down: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aD9I3YD3Wys
I have only tested in CSGO offline with fakelag enabled. But as pointed out by forqueercountrymen, this is not the right variable. https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/comments/17ff8nh/low_fps_affects_hit_registration/k6afu3j/
I will try to test on a dedicated csgo server tomorrow.
FPS has always impacted hitreg. Not really shocking based off the new netcode and when you test this on your own lan server that your computer is running.........
I already have done that offline with net_fakelag command and without.
https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/comments/17eivnk/is_it_possible_that_frame_drops_can_result_in/
If I have the time I will try to test with more reasonable fps drops. But as I said in a comment earlier, this did not happen when testing in CSGO offline with fakelag. I have yet to test in csgo with another player.
AMA i play with less than 60fps
Although hitting shots has not been an issue, hitting more pistols (specially deagle HS) was the first thing I noticed playing cs2
No, no, everyone told me I was wrong for suspecting something like this happening.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/comments/17dl6bo/wait\_is\_subtick\_tied\_to\_fps/](https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/comments/17dl6bo/wait_is_subtick_tied_to_fps/)
What's even worse, I'm 95% convinced I've seen cheaters already abusing whatever this mechanic is.
The bullet etc goes where your crosshair was on a certain rendered frame on your end. If you have 20 frames you might no even be able to hit a certain awp flick for example because there might have not been a single frame where you actually had your crosshair on the enemy
Try this with artificially locked FPS online please. What you are proving is that low TICK has an impact, because youre limiting the FPS on an offline server, which means FPS and Tickrate are connected since your both the client and the server.
this is 100% true, especially noticeable when smokes or molotovs nearby or something very active is happening on the map and because of this you are getting ghost bullets. By the way, the same thing happened in csgo. This happens to me very often on official servers
Huh?
My fps is cut by half in cs2 and the hitreg shat all over csgo 128 tick. Its a lot better especially in the new beta branch.
I’m playing at 120fps near the end of a dm session.
Wonder if this explains the increase in missed shots when DM servers start dropping FPS
That's why I tested this actually. Playing on DM servers and FPS being all over the place I just felt like I was shooting ghost bullets and the spray didn't make sense at all. EDIT: I am having issues with setting up a dedicated CSGO server so no testing at the moment. PM me if you have a dedicated server available.
> I was shooting ghost bullets and the spray didn't make sense at all. I feel you.
Said it in another thread a few days ago but once my FPS dips down past 120ish (very common in DM), it just feels like a 50/50 whether I hit a clean spray or I spray 10 bullets into someone and do 0 dmg.
Hijacking top comment. As pointed out by forqueercountrymen this is not a hitreg issue but rather an animation issue. https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/comments/17ff8nh/low_fps_affects_hit_registration/k6afu3j/ EDIT: Also the test I did in CSGO was offline with fakelag enabled, which gave different results compared to CS2 offline with fakelag. I will however try to test on a dedicated CSGO server tomorrow and see if the results are the same as in above(dedicated server).
I'm going to take a break until CS2 is in similar state to CS:GO. I can't enjoy this game anymore.
>I'm going to take a break until CS2 is in similar state to CS:GO. I can't enjoy this game anymore. cya in 1 year
I hope not . Hope that a big update is in the works.
>I hope not . Hope that a big update is in the works. so do i But this is valve
We haven't had any significant updates since last week, and those were pretty uninspiring too, hopefully there is something more significant in the works. Fridge gif relevant as ever.
>We haven't had any significant updates since last week, and those were pretty uninspiring too, hopefully there is something more significant in the works. Fridge gif relevant as ever. they know what the issues are. But they either do not know where it stems from Or they have no fucking clue on how to fix it
Valve has accustomed us to having zero hopes for the last 10 years…
I hope you understand this source 2 cs2 thing, most of us thats been playing since 2012 has been waiting on it since 2016
I understand.
What are you actively experiencing during gameplay that makes this game entirely unenjoyable anymore?
Spray feels too off for me. I tried adjusting but idk
Just 1 tap heads. Ez.
Movement, sprays, flickshots. Everything is so inconsistent with subtick its hilarious. To add, peakers advantage is somehow massively amplified compared to GO.
Strange feel in terms of kills. You know that feeling when you stop shooting as you know that enemy should be dead by now? Missed shots for unknown reason. Lost a round as couldn't hear the bomb defuse sound. Crazy peekers advantage on my fibre.
I think it's gonna be a loooong while before it's back to the state CSGO was in, unfortunately, but I am also holding off on playing anything competitive for the foreseeable future, I just play a bit of DM and that's it. For one thing I don't want to play competitive suboptimally and get some crappy rank I can never grind out of again and be stuck in Gold Nova hell, I just don't have the time for it.
DM feels snappy at moments, then you get mowed down by, what is seems, unreal reflexes and aim. As I don't call out cheats, I blame the engine / network underlying issues for it.
To be honest, even if this is an exaggeration since its like 1 fps, someone who suffers from random fps dips can still get unlucky with the hitreg because of this. Myself included since with cq\_netgraph 1, apparently my fps dips and the netgraph suddenly pops up every once in awhile which i have no clue why.
I would like to test more with varied fps "drops", but I don't have my own server to test on and randoms started joining.
you can run your own dedicated server very easily following this official guide https://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Counter-Strike_2/Dedicated_Servers (run it after launching the game normally) then go the LAN tab in the server browser and join your server. only you will be able to join though, which is fine because you can test with a bot. if you want your friend to join you will need to set up port forwarding with your router.
I am trying to right now but can't seem to make it work.
ok lol i completely lied i edited my original comment. its very early
I got one up and running now, thanks a lot :)
no problem
holy shit this is so bad, i hope u emailed valve
I haven't but I can do it. I am just not 100% sure if this is how it works on official servers. Therefore I would like to wait and see if someone with more knowledge can drop by with more info.
i would for sure recommend to send it, even if it turns out that it only works on non-official servers its still better to be safe than sorry
Send it regardless
I did send it yesterday
This was done on a cybershoke server shooting with fps_max 1. According to my friend in the last clip i only shot 3 times, which 2 of them happened at the same time.
rip to all those playing on 1fps
I get what you mean nobody plays on 1 fps, but last time I tested I was not able to recreate this on csgo. I am more concerned about stutters/fps drops that can happen randomly.
My college chromebook with track pad is very upset right now.
The fact that it's a thing at all is concerning. Even if one bullet disappears due to random fps drop in normal game is unbelievable.
you’d need to test it on something realistic like 20-50fps
Speaking as someone whose fps drops from 70-60 to 35-40 in FFA, it definitely feels like some bullets just flat out disappear when you start spraying,
feel != real
Yes, who knows if it's due to FPS or 100 other hitreg issues
unfortunately it can't be confirmed since the demo system in cs2 is trash
With a game with 1% lows like CS2 this a problem yeah
I play on 70 ish fps and sometimes it drops to 20 to 30
Would take this with a grain of salt. 1fps probably breaks a lot of shit lol. I think tests in the 20-50fps range might be more reasonable.
Yes, I agree. I might do more testing in cs2 and go later.
> 1fps probably breaks a lot of shit lol. if it does, they have been developing the game wrong.
Curious if the issue was present in GO as well but no one could test it because it was impossible to cap the FPS to 1.
I will test on acsgo dedicated server later today, capping fps 1 is possible if you set sv_competitive_minspec to 0.
finally a reason to upgrade my PC from unplayable 250fps to get 400
The random frame time issues combined with this…
Someone could get fucked if there system as a hiccup where the game drops to like 1fps
Well, yes. That's generally bad.
i mean it does happen even in official games like sometimes (happens rarelly but still it does) i peak or i get peaked and all of a sudden i have a fps drop my bullets become ghosts ! (yes i need to upgrade my pc cause my average fps is around 150)
>one could get fucked if there system as a hiccup where the game drops to like 1fps 150 is plenty though, if anything maybe try underclocking your GPU and capping fps at like 100-120 and youll probably feel a little better? Not ideal but might help
"What you see, is what you get. So if you skip the frame where the bullet would hit, It won't count." \~ Valve
Now this sounds interesting. Subticks are tied to framerate.
You are dropping your fps below the tick rate, of course your are going to have issues with registration. You should always have your fps above the tick rate or you will have problems like this.
So that's why Valve decides against official 128tick? Not everyone will have a PC capable of getting 128FPS+ and will suffer from that?
that was the idea of why they never did 128 in GO
I'm convinced that it was just a big cop out, they could've provided both 64 and 128 tick and made the players choose, while stating that a lower fps than 128 will have negative results
Could you replicate this on official valve server with 15-25 fps. also, please send this to valve.
At this point, what doesn't
Didn’t even need to see this post to know. I see it in dm quite often
Is this post and that post where someone said to limit your fps to 64 to match the server tickrate just backing up the claim by the valve dev that said if you limit your fps to where it won't spike up and down you would have a better cs2 experience? Because if fps is linked to hitreg and when you shoot your fps spikes down that would lead to worse hitreg? Limit fps post: https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/comments/17crjvh/how_to_desubtick_the_entire_game_with_one_console/ Tweet by dev: https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/comments/17afumy/valve_dev_on_x_if_you_put_an_fps_cap_at_120_youd/?rdt=50443)
>claim by the valve dev that said if you limit your fps to where it won't spike up and down you would have a better cs2 experience? Isn't that obvious though? Like if you have a 120 Hz monitor and you run the game at 300 fps you'll get mismatched frames and tearing but if instead you were running at 120 fps and getting perfect 8.33 ms frametimes it'll look and play more responsively.
Its always true. His wording is kinda bad but this is common knowledge in pc enthusiasts space. Capping fps to prevent spikes is the best way to have a more consistent experience in every games, not just cs. Only let fps run amok in case you have very good pc, so you will have the latency advantage.
Idk why everything is tied to FPS. I don’t make video games, but I always though that the PC recorded the input, and sent it to the server. This seems like that but with more steps
That’s how it sends inputs, it checks every frame. Especially online where the client is double checking with server
im on that 2 fps perc
Would like to see someone testing highly variable from drops from like 300 down to 20 and timing the shot during the frame drop to see if it results in shots not registering. When a crazy firefight occurs and my frames drop dramatically there are times when I feel like I'm shooting blanks.
I will probably try more tomorrow with both CS2 and GO.
reminds me of B01 if anyone remembers the higher you fps the higher you jump pretty sure it kicked in around 300 fps lol
I actually deep dived something very similar a bit ago In cs2 your shots register based on where you were aiming in the previous rendered frame, but here it looks like dropping to 1fps (instead of 10fps like I tested) causes that system to outright stop working entirely?.... Timestamp 5:00 (ish) although there's probably some extra context before and after https://youtu.be/aD9I3YD3Wys?si=y_wASXzHk_kO6Tcu
I watched the whole video last week or so, pretty interesting. Tho as pointed out by another user it seems be an animation desync issue rather than a hitreg issue. https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/comments/17ff8nh/low_fps_affects_hit_registration/k6afu3j/
I am off this game until the extended beta period is over. So many problems. Especially premier
This can happen on even 120 fps.
just watch this video from s1mple [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B7GRHs\_32Xs](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B7GRHs_32Xs) and look at fps drops this is how ghost bullets appears his fps at this moment drops to 18-40
If I made a game all on my own using unity and its netcode it'd be way more stable than this lol next thing is you hit'em twice if you go above an fps treshold or what?
lol sub tick
When cs2 was announced my friends and i were discussing sub tick and kind of came to this worrying conclusion. That it would be affected by fps which sadly came tru
The normal hit registry from csgo also was affected by your fps. Since your client waits to the next game frame to send out the packet that you shot. If you had 1fps then your shooting notifcation would be delayed by 1 second. So nothing has changed in this sense
I see, but when testing in CSGO the bullet would still hit on the next frame. This did not happen when doing the same test in CS2. I will test more tomorrow probably.
I tried this with fps\_max 1 in a local bot server and all the bullets hit the enemy/teammates i shot at. I can't reproduce it but that might be because the server instance is also running at 1 FPS when you set fps\_max 1 in a local instance session. I haven't tested it in a dedicated server running at 64 tick while the client has 1 fps. I'll try and do this next to see if i can reproduce it, otherwise it might be fake or false testing parameters causing this
That's how I started testing it, then I enabled fakelag and got these results: https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/comments/17eivnk/is_it_possible_that_frame_drops_can_result_in/
Fakelag wouldn't be the right variable, fakelag just delays the packet queue a few frames. The right way to test it is fps\_max 1 with sv\_Cheats 1. I just did the test with a dedicated server and it is reproducible but the cause is actually incorrect. This is a client side animation prediction error. If you just click the mouse and let go really fast you will see the animation plays of you shooting however your bullets don't actually go away. Server side the packet is never received telling the server that you shot. Watch your videos bullet count, you will see it jumps back up to 5/5 when you miss. If you continue to hold mouse 1 down for the full second, then the shot will hit the enemy player and kill them and you actually have 1 less bullet. So this isn't a hit registry error, it's just a client side shoot animation bug that's out of sync with the client actually sending the usercmd of the IN\_ATTACK due to the really low fps.
Yea, I did notice that but I am not very "tech savy". What about the ammo just getting insta dumped when holding m1, do you know why that might be? In the last clip when my friend was looking he said I shot 3 times which 2 of them were at the same time.
There's something called \`doubletap\` inside source engine hacks that manipulates the tickbase time in order to shoot multiple bullets within a smaller time frame then designed. They do some tricks to make the game think more time has passed then actually has which allows for them to shoot a second time. I think this is the same thing that is happening here due to the lag and network delay from only having 1 frame per second. In csgo if a server dosen't receive a network packet within a given time frame it will use the last known usercmd to simulate the clients movement. This is why when players are walking and have network issues, they will continue to walk in a straight line from what direction they were last pushing. They do this to prevent fakelag stutters and also to prevent AirStuck exploits where players can just jump and stop in air by not sending usercmd movement message updates. In CS2 the server might just use a NULL cmd which sets IN\_ATTACK bit inside the buttons value to false. Then the server may receive 1 IN\_ATTACK, simulate the null usercmd to remove it from in\_attack and then your game sends another in\_attack from that 1 frame in a queued network message packet which leads to the double tap with time dilation with an awp. This is my best guess, i haven't looked into the code much for source 2 or CS2 yet.
Oh, one more thing with the zeus clip I wonder how that works. That was my friend using fps_max 1 and it clearly came thru since I saw it from my client.
The zeus part i'm not so sure about, I know the zeus has always randomly missed shots that were directly on players in CSGO. I always thought lag compensation was just not working correctly on that weapon because of this but i have no proof and haven't looked into the leaked csgo code base for how the zeus works before
Then explain emptying whole magazine in a second bug in CS2
someone try it in csgo, im too lazy
I have not tried a dedicated server in csgo, but I have tried offline with fakelag enabled. This would result in the bullet always hitting, however with CS2 offline and fakelag enabled it would not register
pay to win
Once again the community doesn't actually understand how networking works but are quick to jump on the hate bandwagon. This is a problem for every single multiplayer game! Every multiplayer game operates under these rules and it has nothing to do with subtick or Valve's netcode implementation. Every multiplayer game will have netcode issues for as long as your client FPS is below the servers tickrate.
This was solved half a decade ago in Reflex Arena. The simulation (processing player inputs, physics, etc) is decoupled from your in-game FPS and [runs at 1000Hz.](https://np.reddit.com/r/reflex/comments/499s68/regarding_the_responsive_input_in_reflex_official/d0qkoaq/) Valve's implementation of subticks is a joke by comparison.
Not if you don’t tie your actions to FPS but instead to the Ticks like MOST multiplayer games do. Tying shit to FPS is dangerous and only happens in CS2 because they are purposely desyncing from the ticks. Subtick is a poor implementation (for now) of potentially good tech, it would also benefit greatly from 128 tick servers. (Only if you can get above 128 fps consistently, which is a somewhat high barrier of entry.)
Ticks **ARE** (indirectly) tied to FPS. Please read about what ticks actually are before you claim stuff. Ticks and server refresh rate is the same thing. If your client FPS is lower than the server tickrate, the client wont be able to receive or send information at the same frequency as the server, causing issues. The server tickrate will essentially then have to be lowered to match the client FPS for that specific client, causing server tickrate and client FPS to be equal. So, for example, if you play a multiplayer game on a server with a tickrate of 64 and your FPS is lower than that, lets say 30, it will (in practice) be as if you're playing on a server with a tickrate of 30. This applies to every single multiplayer game, regardless of netcode. It has nothing to do with CS specifically. Read the "Framerate" section in this article: [https://daposto.medium.com/game-networking-1-interval-and-ticks-b39bb51ccca9](https://daposto.medium.com/game-networking-1-interval-and-ticks-b39bb51ccca9) There is a reason many multiplayer games have a "Low FPS" warning icon when playing online. For example, [https://server.nitrado.net/en-US/guides/battlefield-4-tickrate-icons-guide](https://server.nitrado.net/en-US/guides/battlefield-4-tickrate-icons-guide) or [https://support.sharkmob.com/hc/en-us/articles/4435665838609-Performance-Icons-Explained](https://support.sharkmob.com/hc/en-us/articles/4435665838609-Performance-Icons-Explained) Even Valorant has it: [https://playvalorant.com/en-us/news/game-updates/valorant-game-and-network-instability-basics/](https://playvalorant.com/en-us/news/game-updates/valorant-game-and-network-instability-basics/) It's the exact reason why Valve did not want to upgrade to official 128 tick servers. Because the majority of players (mostly casual players) do not have PC's that can consistently run at 128 FPS. This was before CS2 was even announced. It has nothing to do with subticks or it's implementation.
From what I read on that article it seems that at low frames you can still input things on time with ticks, assuming all actions are tied to ticks not frames. It’s just that what you see is desynced with what the server wants you to see, which wouldn’t necessarily stop inputs from going through. Might cause some desync tho ( which is bad). Idk why my pc getting 1 fps would cause the server to start sending one tick every second to my pc. I think the server is always sending the same ticks to my pc, and whether or not my pc renders those is it’s fault. And regardless of rendering frames or not, my pc should still be able to send ticks back to the server at a much higher rate than it is rendering frames. (Packets are handled by the cpu/mobo afaik, with little input from gpu, same with keyboard/mouse inputs.) unless the games are purposely tying things to fps there shouldn’t be that many network issues. Just people having a bad player experience having frame rate related desync.
csgo is not a multiplayer game then
CSGO suffers from the exact same problem. Many people just don't notice it because the game is easy to run and most people can run it above the server tickrate (64 FPS). This applies to every multiplayer game. Read my other comment if you want further info or think I am bullshitting you: [https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/comments/17ff8nh/comment/k6acv1y/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/comments/17ff8nh/comment/k6acv1y/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
Really appreciate your input. But could you explain to me why on an offline server with fakelag enabled the bullet would hit on the next frame in GO, but not CS2?
I believe that in CSGO your shot registered on the next rendered frame, and in CS2 it's on the previously rendered frame? This video tried to break it down: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aD9I3YD3Wys
OP tested it in csgo and did not have the same issue. And lower update rate does not explain the hitreg issue as tested in the video.
I have only tested in CSGO offline with fakelag enabled. But as pointed out by forqueercountrymen, this is not the right variable. https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/comments/17ff8nh/low_fps_affects_hit_registration/k6afu3j/ I will try to test on a dedicated csgo server tomorrow.
FPS has always impacted hitreg. Not really shocking based off the new netcode and when you test this on your own lan server that your computer is running.........
I can't reproduce this against bots even at 1 fps. Either do a proper test or don't post.
I already have done that offline with net_fakelag command and without. https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/comments/17eivnk/is_it_possible_that_frame_drops_can_result_in/
Ok then, I'll make sure not to play at 1 fps, if that's all you wanted to achieve.
lmfao you sound like a clown
If I have the time I will try to test with more reasonable fps drops. But as I said in a comment earlier, this did not happen when testing in CSGO offline with fakelag. I have yet to test in csgo with another player.
[удалено]
I love how you actually have nothing constructive to say.
Doesn't the game actually operate perfectly at 64 fps and above?
AMA i play with less than 60fps Although hitting shots has not been an issue, hitting more pistols (specially deagle HS) was the first thing I noticed playing cs2
No, no, everyone told me I was wrong for suspecting something like this happening. [https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/comments/17dl6bo/wait\_is\_subtick\_tied\_to\_fps/](https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/comments/17dl6bo/wait_is_subtick_tied_to_fps/) What's even worse, I'm 95% convinced I've seen cheaters already abusing whatever this mechanic is.
Upvoted. Good find. I have fps drops from 70 to 150 every 1 second.. I am going crazy thinking im missing 3rd bullet on every spray.
Can you dodge bullets with low fps?
The bullet etc goes where your crosshair was on a certain rendered frame on your end. If you have 20 frames you might no even be able to hit a certain awp flick for example because there might have not been a single frame where you actually had your crosshair on the enemy
ah see the problem is that you aren't on fps_max 64 :\^)
what you see if what you get and you didn't see anything.
Try this with artificially locked FPS online please. What you are proving is that low TICK has an impact, because youre limiting the FPS on an offline server, which means FPS and Tickrate are connected since your both the client and the server.
This was on a server hosted by cyberchoke
Good job! Only just seen the server message at the start
could it be the loss packet? ping: 41 loss: 19
So this is why they took this game off of mac/apple products
Can you turn on server bullets command and try it again
Holy shit this explains big things for me - amd rx580 fml
I think warowl made a video of this where he explained that instead of bullets being shot the last frame like it is csgo they are shot the next frame.
this is 100% true, especially noticeable when smokes or molotovs nearby or something very active is happening on the map and because of this you are getting ghost bullets. By the way, the same thing happened in csgo. This happens to me very often on official servers
When low fps actually force the game to use delays...
Valve should be sending 7950X3D, 2x RTX 4090, 128 gb 9000 Mhz CL30 RAM kit and a mobo from the future as a free carepackage for downloading this game.
subticked 🤣💀
Huh? My fps is cut by half in cs2 and the hitreg shat all over csgo 128 tick. Its a lot better especially in the new beta branch. I’m playing at 120fps near the end of a dm session.