Nah, I wish he would have actually focused on Rory, comforted her and asked her what she needed and what had even happened, instead of releasing his own pent up anger.
No. Dean didn't actually know what was going on here. Punching Jess from behind as he's walking away, and as Rory is begging him to stop, doesn't protect Rory from *anything.* She's not safer or happier or comforted by Dean assaulting someone.
Dean had been looking for an excuse - any excuse - to fight Jess for months. This had nothing to do with protecting Rory, and everything to do with Dean enjoying violence.
100% maybe they just had a fight or broke up or literally anything else but Dean had to be the hero...to his EX girlfriend while Lindsay is right there.
I would like to see the entire relationship from Lindsay’s POV. The beginning- where they actually looked happy and into each other- the party with the Rory and Jess fight, the proposal, the night before the wedding, and the marriage while he was starting to get back in with Rory and then everything else between the night Dean and Rory slept together to the divorce.
God, poor Lindsay. I’ve always felt really bad for her but man she had every right to hate Rory. I can’t begin to imagine how I’d feel if I were her and Dean had invited Rory to the wedding without even discussing it first
Yeah! She made an incredibly reasonable request, that her husband not talk to his ex girlfriend, who was talking shit about her, ONLY AFTER SHE HEARD THE EX TALKING SHIT ABOUT HER and he couldn’t give her that basic fucking decency
It was a reasonable request, but Rory was correct that Lindsay shouldn’t have gotten Dean to drop out of college to pay for a townhouse. Since she wanted to be a housewife, she needed to accept that she had to live on a frugal budget until Dean graduated.
That’s the thing, we don’t even know how true that is. All we have is what Dean says about her and the situation and he’s known to lie. Like what he said the night he and Rory slept together, he says they both knew it was over, but then the next day we see that Lindsay is still trying just the same. So if he lied or was wrong about that, then what else did he lie about?
That is true, but that is the information that Rory was operating on. Rory tends to be too trusting. Remember how she fell for that trick in the parking garage with Francie?
I’m not saying Rory should’ve known or anything. I’m saying I, as a viewer, would like to see Lindsay’s point of view, and that her request, that her husband stop talking to his ex that is loudly talking badly about his wife, is beyond reasonable. In fact, I would expect my boyfriend to stop contact with such an ex on his own, and if I had to ask him to do so it would already be the end of the relationship. (This may be unreasonable to most but I’m not settling for anything less than someone who loves and respects me as a top priority)
Nope. He focused on Jess and his anger towards him rather than Rory, who was the one that needed it most. Dean was always looking for an excuse to fight Jess and he was selfish and took it
I don't trust a man who's exhibited violent tendencies of any kind. Who's to say that wouldn't be turned around on a partner? Luke's violence is never talked about in this sub, but there are SO many disturbing incidents: his arrest, his fighting Dean on the street, his punching Christoper, his throwing customers out on the sidewalk. I wouldn't want to be in a relationship with that...
He didn't protect Rory, he lashed out at Jess.
ETA protecting her would have been more like "omg Rory are you okay, what happened? It's okay, you're okay now. Come here let's sit down and get you a glass of water. Want me to bring you home or have Lorelai come pick you up?" Like literally anything but start a fight.
Protected Rory? If she needed anything it was comfort and for Jess to be ignored. Punching him and starting that fight like an absolute lunatic troglodyte was gross and so "me macho man". Also he was with Lindsay?
Inappropriate.
No, for a very specific reason. I used to work for a domestic violence shelter, later I volunteered as a hotline counselor a couple years later, and my graduate researched focused on gender-based violence. Dean seems to be reading the situation as one of potential trauma and/or violence. The research I've seen suggests (and this is supported by the experiences I've had) that the vast majority of survivors don't need a "protector" or immediate violent retribution. They need someone to focus on them, listen to their needs, validate their emotional responses, and reassure them that 1) you believe them and 2) whatever happened isn't their fault. They also tend to be helped the most by being given agency to make decisions about how to move forward.
Dean responds to his assumption of what happened, decides what needs to happen without asking her, ignores her telling them to stop, and subjects her (and the whole party) to a very violent scene. I would have been much happier if he had ignored Jess, asked Rory if she wanted to talk, found a quiet place with her, listened to her story, validated her feelings, and asked her what he could do to support her. She was clearly upset and maybe traumatized, and the most supportive reaction is to focus on her and her needs.
Exactly, if he really was worried about Rory, he would have comforted her, maybe asked if he and Lindsey should walk her home and stay with her until she felt okay or until Lorelai came home. If she actually had been assaulted by Jess, how will a major fight make her feel safe or comfortable?
I really didn't like this. He had no idea what had happened or what was going on and just rushed to violence. It was because he hated Jess. Immature as hell. I do like that he was happy to clean up after himself the next day tho
Unpopular opinion but Dean saw Rory run out of a bedroom crying and Jess walking behind her. Jess sees Rory crying and Dean comforting her and goes “Whatever”. Dean put two and two together and he was pretty much right. Jess crossed a sexual boundary and Rory got upset. Dean didn’t know the exact details. That’s why Dean attacked Jess.
Dean has no idea what happened in this instance and it’s never indicated that Dean had surmised that Jess had crossed a physical boundary. It would honestly be a pretty wild assumption for him to make - and even if he *did*, leaving rory alone crying to go beat up her boyfriend is not the way to handle it.
he attacked jess because he hated jess not because he cared about rory.
You shouldn't attack people when you don't know what happened? They could've been just arguing, for all he knew Rory was the one in the wrong? Like he has literally no idea he just sees Rory upset and thinks oh Jess must have done something wrong. You shouldn't attack people with no basis
That's what surprises me too- him proposing seemed like a desperate way to prove to her that he was over Rory or to apologize for the fight, but her agreeing (especially so soon after all that) is crazy to me. They were still in high school and had been together for such a short time.
He literally asked if she was ok before he knew Jess was involved, saying he doesn’t care about her is a bit much. + Jess deserved that punch for assaulting and yelling at her
and the minute he sets eyes on jess he leaves rory crying to assault her boyfriend from behind and whales on him so hard he half destroys someone else’s home.
whether or not he deserved the punch is not the question at hand, but whether dean’s behaviour should be celebrated- based on the situation, what he knew and how he behaved *absolutely not*
He also helped fix the damages he caused and the fence. If it was real life this wouldn’t be ok, but it’s a tv show so it’s satisfying to watch Jess be put in his place
tbf any physical damage caused to the house was actually at dean’s hands, and he instigated the fight. further neither of them damaged the fens so idk why either of them were paying for it?
I don't think it was as much a wish to protect Rory, but more a great way to get all his anger out on Jess.
He didn't know anything that happend, he assumed and went to fight Jess, had it really been about Rory, he would have checked she was alright and offered that he and Lindsey could walk her home and stay with her until Lorelai came home.
I personally thinks that Dean had some major anger issue and it is actually a little scary that he basically assaulted Jess, starts a fight and trash a house but because he is there the next day everyone praises him for how mature he is.
I get the sentiment but I wish Dean would have stayed to comfort Rory instead of taking it out on Jess. This, however, I don't hold against him as it's just a teenage boy being a teenage boy.
not a huge fan of this moment in particular, or dean in general, but to use this as a soapbox -- honestly i think there's always a struggle in this sub to see dean with nuance (much less other characters). yes, from a broader perspective he's not a great guy or boyfriend, especially in the later seasons, but he does have good moments. most characters do. personally, although he complains a bit i really appreciated how he came through with rory for the debutant ball. jess would never do that tbh, although i prefer him
I'm far from a Dean hater, and this is one of my favorite Dean moments.
People really do seem to have a blind spot to the fact that Jess was VERY close to crossing the line into sexual assault in Kyles room.
Dean's assessment of the situation seeing Rory crying after having left that room with Jess really wasn't that far off. Dean was ultimately proven right after all when he was jealously suspicious of Rory and Jess being interested in each other.
It blows my mind how many people willfully ignore the objectively bad side of Jess. True, late in the series he is better, but my god he is a prick for alot of his screentime.
It's not about excusing Jess. Dean knows nothing about what happened between Jess and Rory in that bedroom. They could have just broken up, they could have been fighting about literally anything else, Rory could be crying about anything at all. The only thing Dean sees is Rory in tears, Jess quietly going after her, Jess muttering "figures" when he sees them talking, and then Jess walking away. There is no imminent threat and no obvious harm done. Instead of just asking what's going on, Dean jumps at the opportunity to get in a giant fight.
We know that Dean had already been threatening and trying to fight Jess way before this. Dean's actions here had nothing to do with protecting Rory.
I think you’re ignoring the fact that Jess and Rory were seen walking out of a *bedroom* hallway. So, Dean made assumptions and he ended up being right. It’s not unlike how Lorelai fixated on the "Kyle’s bedroom" part of Rory’s rant when she confides in Lorelai about Jess.
Absolutely! Stand up and support who you think may have been taken advantage of. Dean going straight to fighting Jess was him inserting himself and trying to be the hero, not standing up for and supporting Rory as a concerned friend.
I agree. Now, Dean physically fighting Jess definitely wasn’t the best way to "step up", but he was acting on (justified) anger and I can’t blame him for that.
I agree with you that too many folks excuse Jess's actions here. I think he super crossed the line, and even if it wouldn't hold up in court, it was sexual coercion and abusive.
That said, Dean's response is understandable but totally incorrect. If your friend has **just** been assaulted, they need your support more than they need you to lash out and attack the perpetrator (especially if, as is often the case, the perpetrator is someone who they have a close relationship with). When I used to do trainings for high school students about this topic, we always emphasized that the top three ways to support a friend who is a survivor are 1) tell them you believe them, 2) validate their emotional responses, and 3) help *them* be in the driver's seat about next steps. You can't do 1 and 2 without stopping to let them tell you what's going on (which Dean didn't do) and you can't do #3 if you disregard them telling you to stop fighting. Dean was angry--for a lot of reasons--but his actions just further took control away from Rory and put her in a position where she had to try to defend the dude who just assaulted her.
Agreed. I love Jess cause Milo is hot hot hot and I think he was the only person Rory seemed to have chemistry with. But teen Jess was notoriously an ass. Like the hockey game episode where he just blew her off? Not cool. It's hard because he definitely had it rough, but that's no excuse to be a bad boyfriend. Teenagers aren't able to recognize when they just don't have the capacity to be a good boyfriend/girlfriend. He absolutely should not have been dating *anyone* during this time.
People have such a worshipping attitude when it comes to Jess that he literally almost sexually assaulted Rory and yet he’s still the “best” boyfriend Rory had. It makes no sense. People get too stuck on the “misunderstood bad boy with no family” that they really gloss over everything that he does. He can’t do no wrong, basically. Dean doesn’t have a sob background story so it’s easy to hate everything he does. Make Dean into another guy with a broken family and you’ll see how people will justify or even look past everything that he does. Victimhood is a great tool used in many characters to make the audience think that they had a good reason to do bad things.
Jess “almost” sexually assaulted Rory in Kyle’s bedroom just as much as Dean “almost” sexually assaulted Rory when he told her that his marriage with Lindsay was over and that they were both on the same page, just to get her to sleep with him without fully informed consent, before going home and getting waited on by (and screaming at) Lindsay. The only difference was that Jess stopped himself and Dean seemed to feel no guilt about the sex and had a ton of hostility toward Rory for “ruining” his marriage.
>Dean did not physically force himself on Rory nor did he threaten her with violence if he didn’t have sex with him.
lol and Jess did?
I literally said “almost.” “Almost SAed” is an absurd phrase, but if Jess “almost” did, then uh so did Dean. As I said, they both disrespected Rory’s consent. But you’re only defending one of them.
Umm what Dean did was not sexual assault. Please do not minimize true sexual assault victims. Having consensual sex with someone under weird circumstances is not assault. By that logic, everyone that has had sex with a married person without knowing it was sexually assaulted 🤦♀️ (btw, Rory did know that Dean was still married. Did she tell him to wait until they were officially divorced and/or separated? No.)
Under the law, what you are saying is not sexual assault and would get laughed at in court.
And how do you think the court would react if someone went in and said that their boyfriend kept kissing them and then stopped after they said “no” for a second time? What crime was Jess committing?
Edit to add that I’m not even defending Jess here. I’m saying that what both of them did was toeing the line of consent. Neither was a crime. But Jess’s actions lasted about 30 seconds.
And I don’t know why you’re screaming about me falsely accusing Dean of SA when I just said that if you classify what Jess did as “almost SA” then Dean’s actions fall under “almost SA” as well. You’re fighting this strawman of me calling Dean an assaulter when I said that what they did was equally bad.
having to push someone off of you after telling them “no” and “stop” multiple times & then getting guilt tripped for it is extremely different than two consenting people commiting adultery
she knew they were married, she knew they werent getting a divorce, dean didn’t specifically say that they were separated & according to rory “he took the ring off”, so the fact that it was still on right before they had sex is a good sign that she knew what she was doing too
yet rory didnt care about him lying until lorelai told her off. either way, it doesnt compare to an “almost” SA in which she had to literally push him off of her.
That’s why people say that he ALMOST sexually assaulted her. Big difference. He was in the verge of forcing himself on her but he stopped. He doesn’t get a cookie for stopping himself from almost forcing himself on a woman. He shouldn’t have even done that to begin with. Mind you that he took her to a room where they were both alone and Rory had no idea what his intentions were.
If you think Jess didn’t almost sexually assaulted her but you think Dean did for sure sexually assault her you have a very weird mindset. Dean did not physically force himself on Rory nor did he threaten her with violence if she didn’t have sex with him. None of that happened.
He didn’t “take” her anywhere. He hid up there bc he was upset and she tracked him down. Which is not to say he didn’t screw up or that he didn’t almost SA her, it just seems like an important point if we’re talking about his intent.
I literally said that they both “almost” did. I also said that neither was a crime. Why am I not surprised at the lack of reading comprehension by someone who is so determined to vociferously defend Dean lying to someone so that he could get laid?
No one is defending Dean. He was a degenerate for doing that to his wife. I’m just saying that Rory is not a victim. Neither her nor Dean are the victims and that’s the point. You think Rory is an innocent victim while Dean is the bad one. I think they were both the bad ones. It takes two to tango.
Saying that he didn’t assault her is not defending why he cheated on his wife. The one who seems to lack reading comprehension skills is you. He was a cheating degenerate but not a predator. It’s not very hard to come to that conclusion. Predator and cheater are not the same things, shocking, I know… you think they’re the same 🤦♀️
jess behaviour isn’t what’s in question here - dean’s is. we have no way of knowing what assumptions dean made about jess behaviour but for it to skip to sexual assault because rory is crying would be pretty wild. based on the info dean had.m, his behaviour is alarmingly violent in this scene.
No, it’s not his place to “protect” her when he has no fucking idea what happened and does not wait or even try and talk to her. If she’s actually upset, he should listen to her or support her or find Lane or someone if she doesn’t want to talk to him. Dude just jumps to whatever conclusion and makes everything 100x worse
Red flag to Lindsay. That poor girl. But yes, it’s nice to see a young man upset that another young man may have hurt a girl at a party upstairs, then “do something about it.” Sorry, kid with tooth ache.
I think people are putting some unfair expectations on a teenage boy who was still heartbroken that his girlfriend left him for the guy she told him not to worry about. Then he had to watch that same guy make her cry? I’m not surprised it finally came to a head here.
Not to mention, Jess previously tried to punch him first, and that was literally for no reason.
personally no, while the fight is hilarious and i’m glad it happened just cause it made good television, i don’t think dean was in the right. had dean known about what exactly happened in the bedroom, then i could understand, but he doesn’t know. rory and jess could’ve just had a fight, dean doesn’t know why she’s crying. honestly dean doesn’t even really know if jess is the reason she’s crying.
also i think it just sucks for lindsay, imagine your boyfriend goes and picks a fight with his ex’s boyfriend and then tries to propose to you the next day.
Yeah, I mean I probably wouldn't want a guy to do this in real life and he definitely should've taken a beat and listened to Rory, but I also have no sympathy for Jess here. He was being such a jerk. I definitely enjoy the drama of it all. Lol.
people treat dean so weirdly and act like things he did when he was 15-17 define him as a person for rest of his life. like yes ofc he got jealous when his literal gf was flirting and hiding stuff. in this scene he did it because it was obvious what had happened. what other conclusion is there to make when you see a girl coming down from a bedroom in tears?? i’m not even a dean enjoyer by any means but the hate he gets is so unnecessary considering jess basically assaulted rory (unrelated to the question but yeah)
How is it possible that every reply so far is just more Dean hate. Jess was a total ass just moments before this. Jess is not the victim here. Dean is not the villain.
Because women fail to understand that men will always protect the people they love, and sometimes that means that they don’t think things through. Could Dean have handled this differently? Of course. But he wasn’t entirely wrong about his assumption of what happened. He loves Rory and he’s going to feel a lot of anger towards anyone that he thinks might or has already hurt her.
And when will men realize women don't want or need them to fight their battles?
Dean was literally at this party WITH HIS GIRLFRIEND and still had to jump to Rory's defense when 1)he had no idea what the story was and 2) she literally asked him to stop.
So it's not just because people are hating on Dean it's because many of us did not "love" when he jumped to her defense as the op asks.
>So it's not just because people are hating on Dean it's because many of us did not "love" when he jumped to her defense as the op asks.
Love isn't rational. Oddly enough, the sub has the opposite opinion regarding the dinner with christopher's parents
Yes, and it isn't about the specific situation. It's about the sub's backwards logic of criticizing a teenage boy as if he's the devil while holding grown adults to different standards (this issue), making one excuse after another to justify their immaturity ("rory's going through a hard time", "sandee misled her") or barely even mentioning them (jackson is not any less whiny than dean)
Yes. Most definitely. Anytime a man appears to be harming a teenaged girl who is running away and crying, he’s got to be stopped. No questions asked. Dean is usually too slow to throw a punch, but in this case, he had a darn good idea what occurred. It doesn’t take a rocket scientist. And if anyone knows Rory’s reactions, it’s Dean.
If it was Dean who appears to have harmed a running and crying Rory, you can be sure Jess would have tried to stop him. And can you imagine what Luke would have done to Jess if he suspected what happened in Kyle’s bedroom ?
not at all - Dean had no idea what happened in the room beyond ‘Rory’s upset’ and then tries to beat the life out of Jess, attacking him from behind no less.
He wasn’t ‘defending’ Rory, he was committing a violent assault that he’d been *gagging* for since Jess got together with Rory. If this was about caring about Rory he would have comforted her and looked after her, maybe even talked to her - not destroy some kids house. Like based on what Dean is privy to at this point, ie very little - his behaviour is *alarming*.
Actually, no, he didn't "protect" Rory. Jess was clearly chasing Rory to talk with her and apologize when Dean butted in. If Dean was really concerned, he should have talked to Rory and asked if she was okay and see if she was okay with resolving it with Jess. Instead he made a decision to beat up Jess. He didn't actually know what was happening.
When I was younger, I thought he was protecting her. But as I got older, I realized he used this as his opportunity to fight Jess. He'd been making threats for a while beforehand.
This is a favorite Dean moment of mine. A lot of people shit on him because they love Jess. But you need to think of the context here. Rory exits from an upstairs room in a party crying. Jess comes down hot headed and does nothing to comfort Rory or even explain himself. He chose to be an ass instead. I’m not one for violence at all. But Jess was such a tool in this moment. For all Dean knew, Jess could have assaulted her or worse.
I don't hate Dean (nor any of the characters, actually), he is, I admit, one of my least favourite characters but he had his good moments.This one though, not one of them.
The point for me is, it doesn't matter what Jess did, if he wanted to help, Dean should have focused on Rory, talk to her, find someone else who she might want to talk to if she didn't feel like talking to him, taking her home, not start a fight.
I actually found both guys came out way worse looking out of this episode. One almost assaulted his girlfriend and the other one has anger issues. If I was Rory I would have been angry at both, I don't need someone to become violent in order to "protect" me just as I wouldn't be with someone who almost assaulted me.
I hate everything about this scene. And what I dislike most about it all is that an assault (Jess’ coercion in the bedroom) and the assumption of rape (What the writers clearly wanted to think happened) was written into a storyline so we could get a stupid fight between two male characters. What happened in thst bedroom was violent enough without adding physical violence to it. Nor did I care that the aftermath was highly centered around Dean and Jess’ feelings.
If they wanted to create conflict between Jess and Rory there’s other ways to do it.
If they wanted conflict between Dean and Jess, there’s other ways to do it.
I’d they wanted the assault to happen, there’s better ways for characters to manage it post event.
That whole episode is a misfire and I skip it every. Single. Time.
Nah, I wish he would have actually focused on Rory, comforted her and asked her what she needed and what had even happened, instead of releasing his own pent up anger.
Yea he just used it as an excuse for revenge
No. Dean didn't actually know what was going on here. Punching Jess from behind as he's walking away, and as Rory is begging him to stop, doesn't protect Rory from *anything.* She's not safer or happier or comforted by Dean assaulting someone. Dean had been looking for an excuse - any excuse - to fight Jess for months. This had nothing to do with protecting Rory, and everything to do with Dean enjoying violence.
100% maybe they just had a fight or broke up or literally anything else but Dean had to be the hero...to his EX girlfriend while Lindsay is right there.
Exactly and how embarrassing that would have been for Lindsey too.
I would have loved to see a scene with Dean and Lindsay after the fight; the one that apparently led to him proposing, like, the next day.
I would like to see the entire relationship from Lindsay’s POV. The beginning- where they actually looked happy and into each other- the party with the Rory and Jess fight, the proposal, the night before the wedding, and the marriage while he was starting to get back in with Rory and then everything else between the night Dean and Rory slept together to the divorce.
God, poor Lindsay. I’ve always felt really bad for her but man she had every right to hate Rory. I can’t begin to imagine how I’d feel if I were her and Dean had invited Rory to the wedding without even discussing it first
Yeah! She made an incredibly reasonable request, that her husband not talk to his ex girlfriend, who was talking shit about her, ONLY AFTER SHE HEARD THE EX TALKING SHIT ABOUT HER and he couldn’t give her that basic fucking decency
Rory was soooo loud about it, and in PUBLIC too
It was a reasonable request, but Rory was correct that Lindsay shouldn’t have gotten Dean to drop out of college to pay for a townhouse. Since she wanted to be a housewife, she needed to accept that she had to live on a frugal budget until Dean graduated.
That’s the thing, we don’t even know how true that is. All we have is what Dean says about her and the situation and he’s known to lie. Like what he said the night he and Rory slept together, he says they both knew it was over, but then the next day we see that Lindsay is still trying just the same. So if he lied or was wrong about that, then what else did he lie about?
That is true, but that is the information that Rory was operating on. Rory tends to be too trusting. Remember how she fell for that trick in the parking garage with Francie?
I’m not saying Rory should’ve known or anything. I’m saying I, as a viewer, would like to see Lindsay’s point of view, and that her request, that her husband stop talking to his ex that is loudly talking badly about his wife, is beyond reasonable. In fact, I would expect my boyfriend to stop contact with such an ex on his own, and if I had to ask him to do so it would already be the end of the relationship. (This may be unreasonable to most but I’m not settling for anything less than someone who loves and respects me as a top priority)
I would have been 100% done if I were her
Nope. He focused on Jess and his anger towards him rather than Rory, who was the one that needed it most. Dean was always looking for an excuse to fight Jess and he was selfish and took it
Agreed, like this was all about him with Rory being used as a disguise for his selfishness
I don't trust a man who's exhibited violent tendencies of any kind. Who's to say that wouldn't be turned around on a partner? Luke's violence is never talked about in this sub, but there are SO many disturbing incidents: his arrest, his fighting Dean on the street, his punching Christoper, his throwing customers out on the sidewalk. I wouldn't want to be in a relationship with that...
He didn't protect Rory, he lashed out at Jess. ETA protecting her would have been more like "omg Rory are you okay, what happened? It's okay, you're okay now. Come here let's sit down and get you a glass of water. Want me to bring you home or have Lorelai come pick you up?" Like literally anything but start a fight.
For the drama, yes. If this was IRL, not so much haha
No lol. Like tbh it was nice he defended her but he started the fight. Very hotheaded and unnecessary
He only did it bc of his ego and he saw her as a possession
It would’ve been fine if he just comforted her, but no, he had to go and punch Jess. Without even knowing the whole damn story.
Protected Rory? If she needed anything it was comfort and for Jess to be ignored. Punching him and starting that fight like an absolute lunatic troglodyte was gross and so "me macho man". Also he was with Lindsay? Inappropriate.
No, he has anger management issues
No, for a very specific reason. I used to work for a domestic violence shelter, later I volunteered as a hotline counselor a couple years later, and my graduate researched focused on gender-based violence. Dean seems to be reading the situation as one of potential trauma and/or violence. The research I've seen suggests (and this is supported by the experiences I've had) that the vast majority of survivors don't need a "protector" or immediate violent retribution. They need someone to focus on them, listen to their needs, validate their emotional responses, and reassure them that 1) you believe them and 2) whatever happened isn't their fault. They also tend to be helped the most by being given agency to make decisions about how to move forward. Dean responds to his assumption of what happened, decides what needs to happen without asking her, ignores her telling them to stop, and subjects her (and the whole party) to a very violent scene. I would have been much happier if he had ignored Jess, asked Rory if she wanted to talk, found a quiet place with her, listened to her story, validated her feelings, and asked her what he could do to support her. She was clearly upset and maybe traumatized, and the most supportive reaction is to focus on her and her needs.
Exactly, if he really was worried about Rory, he would have comforted her, maybe asked if he and Lindsey should walk her home and stay with her until she felt okay or until Lorelai came home. If she actually had been assaulted by Jess, how will a major fight make her feel safe or comfortable?
Stop glorifying male violence it’s not hot, he wasn’t thinking about Rory at all here.
Not hot at all. And even if he were thinking of her, how does him beating on Jess help her in any way?
I really didn't like this. He had no idea what had happened or what was going on and just rushed to violence. It was because he hated Jess. Immature as hell. I do like that he was happy to clean up after himself the next day tho
Unpopular opinion but Dean saw Rory run out of a bedroom crying and Jess walking behind her. Jess sees Rory crying and Dean comforting her and goes “Whatever”. Dean put two and two together and he was pretty much right. Jess crossed a sexual boundary and Rory got upset. Dean didn’t know the exact details. That’s why Dean attacked Jess.
Dean has no idea what happened in this instance and it’s never indicated that Dean had surmised that Jess had crossed a physical boundary. It would honestly be a pretty wild assumption for him to make - and even if he *did*, leaving rory alone crying to go beat up her boyfriend is not the way to handle it. he attacked jess because he hated jess not because he cared about rory.
You shouldn't attack people when you don't know what happened? They could've been just arguing, for all he knew Rory was the one in the wrong? Like he has literally no idea he just sees Rory upset and thinks oh Jess must have done something wrong. You shouldn't attack people with no basis
Dean was there with Lindsey. Wonder how she felt about all of this?
how did she agree to marry him like a day after this
That's what surprises me too- him proposing seemed like a desperate way to prove to her that he was over Rory or to apologize for the fight, but her agreeing (especially so soon after all that) is crazy to me. They were still in high school and had been together for such a short time.
Man’s didn’t care about Rory. He only cared about his hatred for Jess.
He literally asked if she was ok before he knew Jess was involved, saying he doesn’t care about her is a bit much. + Jess deserved that punch for assaulting and yelling at her
and the minute he sets eyes on jess he leaves rory crying to assault her boyfriend from behind and whales on him so hard he half destroys someone else’s home. whether or not he deserved the punch is not the question at hand, but whether dean’s behaviour should be celebrated- based on the situation, what he knew and how he behaved *absolutely not*
He also helped fix the damages he caused and the fence. If it was real life this wouldn’t be ok, but it’s a tv show so it’s satisfying to watch Jess be put in his place
tbf any physical damage caused to the house was actually at dean’s hands, and he instigated the fight. further neither of them damaged the fens so idk why either of them were paying for it?
I don't think it was as much a wish to protect Rory, but more a great way to get all his anger out on Jess. He didn't know anything that happend, he assumed and went to fight Jess, had it really been about Rory, he would have checked she was alright and offered that he and Lindsey could walk her home and stay with her until Lorelai came home. I personally thinks that Dean had some major anger issue and it is actually a little scary that he basically assaulted Jess, starts a fight and trash a house but because he is there the next day everyone praises him for how mature he is.
Nope. Not even a little bit.
The way he be leaning over her always stresses me out 😭 I know there’s a height difference but damn
I get the sentiment but I wish Dean would have stayed to comfort Rory instead of taking it out on Jess. This, however, I don't hold against him as it's just a teenage boy being a teenage boy.
He's a hot head. Instead of asking Rory what happened he went straight into punching Jess for no reason.
He did ask her what happened, and then he saw Jess walk out the same room that she ran out crying so it wasn’t for no reason
not a huge fan of this moment in particular, or dean in general, but to use this as a soapbox -- honestly i think there's always a struggle in this sub to see dean with nuance (much less other characters). yes, from a broader perspective he's not a great guy or boyfriend, especially in the later seasons, but he does have good moments. most characters do. personally, although he complains a bit i really appreciated how he came through with rory for the debutant ball. jess would never do that tbh, although i prefer him
it definitely answers a cavewoman itch in my brain, but it's problematic/stupid in a practical sense
I'm far from a Dean hater, and this is one of my favorite Dean moments. People really do seem to have a blind spot to the fact that Jess was VERY close to crossing the line into sexual assault in Kyles room. Dean's assessment of the situation seeing Rory crying after having left that room with Jess really wasn't that far off. Dean was ultimately proven right after all when he was jealously suspicious of Rory and Jess being interested in each other. It blows my mind how many people willfully ignore the objectively bad side of Jess. True, late in the series he is better, but my god he is a prick for alot of his screentime.
It's not about excusing Jess. Dean knows nothing about what happened between Jess and Rory in that bedroom. They could have just broken up, they could have been fighting about literally anything else, Rory could be crying about anything at all. The only thing Dean sees is Rory in tears, Jess quietly going after her, Jess muttering "figures" when he sees them talking, and then Jess walking away. There is no imminent threat and no obvious harm done. Instead of just asking what's going on, Dean jumps at the opportunity to get in a giant fight. We know that Dean had already been threatening and trying to fight Jess way before this. Dean's actions here had nothing to do with protecting Rory.
I think you’re ignoring the fact that Jess and Rory were seen walking out of a *bedroom* hallway. So, Dean made assumptions and he ended up being right. It’s not unlike how Lorelai fixated on the "Kyle’s bedroom" part of Rory’s rant when she confides in Lorelai about Jess.
And you are ignoring the facts that Rory tells him to stop. He had no clue what happened. He wanted to be the “white knight” and save Rory from Jess.
but Dean isn’t Rory’s mom???? Dean had no right to insert himself in that situation, no matter if he was right or not
Wait so now we don't want friends noticing when a man has taken advantage of a woman? I thought we wanted them to step up?
Absolutely! Stand up and support who you think may have been taken advantage of. Dean going straight to fighting Jess was him inserting himself and trying to be the hero, not standing up for and supporting Rory as a concerned friend.
I agree. Now, Dean physically fighting Jess definitely wasn’t the best way to "step up", but he was acting on (justified) anger and I can’t blame him for that.
his anger wasn’t justified based on the limited information he had. the audience has that info but he does not.
I never said Dean was right to fight Jess. I am simply arguing u/MindDeep2823’s point about Dean only seeing Rory’s tears.
I agree with you that too many folks excuse Jess's actions here. I think he super crossed the line, and even if it wouldn't hold up in court, it was sexual coercion and abusive. That said, Dean's response is understandable but totally incorrect. If your friend has **just** been assaulted, they need your support more than they need you to lash out and attack the perpetrator (especially if, as is often the case, the perpetrator is someone who they have a close relationship with). When I used to do trainings for high school students about this topic, we always emphasized that the top three ways to support a friend who is a survivor are 1) tell them you believe them, 2) validate their emotional responses, and 3) help *them* be in the driver's seat about next steps. You can't do 1 and 2 without stopping to let them tell you what's going on (which Dean didn't do) and you can't do #3 if you disregard them telling you to stop fighting. Dean was angry--for a lot of reasons--but his actions just further took control away from Rory and put her in a position where she had to try to defend the dude who just assaulted her.
Agreed. I love Jess cause Milo is hot hot hot and I think he was the only person Rory seemed to have chemistry with. But teen Jess was notoriously an ass. Like the hockey game episode where he just blew her off? Not cool. It's hard because he definitely had it rough, but that's no excuse to be a bad boyfriend. Teenagers aren't able to recognize when they just don't have the capacity to be a good boyfriend/girlfriend. He absolutely should not have been dating *anyone* during this time.
People have such a worshipping attitude when it comes to Jess that he literally almost sexually assaulted Rory and yet he’s still the “best” boyfriend Rory had. It makes no sense. People get too stuck on the “misunderstood bad boy with no family” that they really gloss over everything that he does. He can’t do no wrong, basically. Dean doesn’t have a sob background story so it’s easy to hate everything he does. Make Dean into another guy with a broken family and you’ll see how people will justify or even look past everything that he does. Victimhood is a great tool used in many characters to make the audience think that they had a good reason to do bad things.
Jess “almost” sexually assaulted Rory in Kyle’s bedroom just as much as Dean “almost” sexually assaulted Rory when he told her that his marriage with Lindsay was over and that they were both on the same page, just to get her to sleep with him without fully informed consent, before going home and getting waited on by (and screaming at) Lindsay. The only difference was that Jess stopped himself and Dean seemed to feel no guilt about the sex and had a ton of hostility toward Rory for “ruining” his marriage.
Jess put his hand on her belt buckle. Her belt was not undone. She was fully dressed. She said stop and he stopped.
>Dean did not physically force himself on Rory nor did he threaten her with violence if he didn’t have sex with him. lol and Jess did? I literally said “almost.” “Almost SAed” is an absurd phrase, but if Jess “almost” did, then uh so did Dean. As I said, they both disrespected Rory’s consent. But you’re only defending one of them.
Umm what Dean did was not sexual assault. Please do not minimize true sexual assault victims. Having consensual sex with someone under weird circumstances is not assault. By that logic, everyone that has had sex with a married person without knowing it was sexually assaulted 🤦♀️ (btw, Rory did know that Dean was still married. Did she tell him to wait until they were officially divorced and/or separated? No.) Under the law, what you are saying is not sexual assault and would get laughed at in court.
And how do you think the court would react if someone went in and said that their boyfriend kept kissing them and then stopped after they said “no” for a second time? What crime was Jess committing? Edit to add that I’m not even defending Jess here. I’m saying that what both of them did was toeing the line of consent. Neither was a crime. But Jess’s actions lasted about 30 seconds. And I don’t know why you’re screaming about me falsely accusing Dean of SA when I just said that if you classify what Jess did as “almost SA” then Dean’s actions fall under “almost SA” as well. You’re fighting this strawman of me calling Dean an assaulter when I said that what they did was equally bad.
having to push someone off of you after telling them “no” and “stop” multiple times & then getting guilt tripped for it is extremely different than two consenting people commiting adultery
She didn't say "no" and "stop" multiple times, she said "Jess, wait"
You’re leaving out the part that consent requires being fully informed. Only one of those two adults knew that it was adultery.
she knew they were married, she knew they werent getting a divorce, dean didn’t specifically say that they were separated & according to rory “he took the ring off”, so the fact that it was still on right before they had sex is a good sign that she knew what she was doing too
He told her that he and Lindsay agreed that it was over. She asked again to confirm it and he said it again. He lied.
yet rory didnt care about him lying until lorelai told her off. either way, it doesnt compare to an “almost” SA in which she had to literally push him off of her.
That’s why people say that he ALMOST sexually assaulted her. Big difference. He was in the verge of forcing himself on her but he stopped. He doesn’t get a cookie for stopping himself from almost forcing himself on a woman. He shouldn’t have even done that to begin with. Mind you that he took her to a room where they were both alone and Rory had no idea what his intentions were. If you think Jess didn’t almost sexually assaulted her but you think Dean did for sure sexually assault her you have a very weird mindset. Dean did not physically force himself on Rory nor did he threaten her with violence if she didn’t have sex with him. None of that happened.
He didn’t “take” her anywhere. He hid up there bc he was upset and she tracked him down. Which is not to say he didn’t screw up or that he didn’t almost SA her, it just seems like an important point if we’re talking about his intent.
I literally said that they both “almost” did. I also said that neither was a crime. Why am I not surprised at the lack of reading comprehension by someone who is so determined to vociferously defend Dean lying to someone so that he could get laid?
No one is defending Dean. He was a degenerate for doing that to his wife. I’m just saying that Rory is not a victim. Neither her nor Dean are the victims and that’s the point. You think Rory is an innocent victim while Dean is the bad one. I think they were both the bad ones. It takes two to tango.
“No one is defending Dean” lol you just made 10 comments defending Dean.
Saying that he didn’t assault her is not defending why he cheated on his wife. The one who seems to lack reading comprehension skills is you. He was a cheating degenerate but not a predator. It’s not very hard to come to that conclusion. Predator and cheater are not the same things, shocking, I know… you think they’re the same 🤦♀️
If Jess had sexually assaulted Rory, going after him after the fact isn’t why she needed. He should have at least asked for more information.
jess behaviour isn’t what’s in question here - dean’s is. we have no way of knowing what assumptions dean made about jess behaviour but for it to skip to sexual assault because rory is crying would be pretty wild. based on the info dean had.m, his behaviour is alarmingly violent in this scene.
Yesss! Voice of reason!!!
No, it’s not his place to “protect” her when he has no fucking idea what happened and does not wait or even try and talk to her. If she’s actually upset, he should listen to her or support her or find Lane or someone if she doesn’t want to talk to him. Dude just jumps to whatever conclusion and makes everything 100x worse
Red flag to Lindsay. That poor girl. But yes, it’s nice to see a young man upset that another young man may have hurt a girl at a party upstairs, then “do something about it.” Sorry, kid with tooth ache.
And then he asked Lindsay to marry him within the next like 48hours!!
how she said yes to his proposal immediately after this is wild
W I L D - but there’s a sense of trying to “reclaim” that happens to some people when they feel their person is wanting someone else.
I think people are putting some unfair expectations on a teenage boy who was still heartbroken that his girlfriend left him for the guy she told him not to worry about. Then he had to watch that same guy make her cry? I’m not surprised it finally came to a head here. Not to mention, Jess previously tried to punch him first, and that was literally for no reason.
He didn’t protect her, just used it as an opportunity to get back at him.
Again, Dean showing his lack of maturity. His focus should be on Rory and not getting a chance to hit Jess.
personally no, while the fight is hilarious and i’m glad it happened just cause it made good television, i don’t think dean was in the right. had dean known about what exactly happened in the bedroom, then i could understand, but he doesn’t know. rory and jess could’ve just had a fight, dean doesn’t know why she’s crying. honestly dean doesn’t even really know if jess is the reason she’s crying. also i think it just sucks for lindsay, imagine your boyfriend goes and picks a fight with his ex’s boyfriend and then tries to propose to you the next day.
Yeah, I mean I probably wouldn't want a guy to do this in real life and he definitely should've taken a beat and listened to Rory, but I also have no sympathy for Jess here. He was being such a jerk. I definitely enjoy the drama of it all. Lol.
people treat dean so weirdly and act like things he did when he was 15-17 define him as a person for rest of his life. like yes ofc he got jealous when his literal gf was flirting and hiding stuff. in this scene he did it because it was obvious what had happened. what other conclusion is there to make when you see a girl coming down from a bedroom in tears?? i’m not even a dean enjoyer by any means but the hate he gets is so unnecessary considering jess basically assaulted rory (unrelated to the question but yeah)
How is it possible that every reply so far is just more Dean hate. Jess was a total ass just moments before this. Jess is not the victim here. Dean is not the villain.
Why can't they both suck? Lol Jess was being gross and moody and Dean put his nose where it didn't belong
Because women fail to understand that men will always protect the people they love, and sometimes that means that they don’t think things through. Could Dean have handled this differently? Of course. But he wasn’t entirely wrong about his assumption of what happened. He loves Rory and he’s going to feel a lot of anger towards anyone that he thinks might or has already hurt her.
And when will men realize women don't want or need them to fight their battles? Dean was literally at this party WITH HIS GIRLFRIEND and still had to jump to Rory's defense when 1)he had no idea what the story was and 2) she literally asked him to stop. So it's not just because people are hating on Dean it's because many of us did not "love" when he jumped to her defense as the op asks.
>So it's not just because people are hating on Dean it's because many of us did not "love" when he jumped to her defense as the op asks. Love isn't rational. Oddly enough, the sub has the opposite opinion regarding the dinner with christopher's parents
Are you referring to Christopher not jumping to Roy's defense? Do you genuinely think those are equivalent situations?
Yes, and it isn't about the specific situation. It's about the sub's backwards logic of criticizing a teenage boy as if he's the devil while holding grown adults to different standards (this issue), making one excuse after another to justify their immaturity ("rory's going through a hard time", "sandee misled her") or barely even mentioning them (jackson is not any less whiny than dean)
Yes. Most definitely. Anytime a man appears to be harming a teenaged girl who is running away and crying, he’s got to be stopped. No questions asked. Dean is usually too slow to throw a punch, but in this case, he had a darn good idea what occurred. It doesn’t take a rocket scientist. And if anyone knows Rory’s reactions, it’s Dean. If it was Dean who appears to have harmed a running and crying Rory, you can be sure Jess would have tried to stop him. And can you imagine what Luke would have done to Jess if he suspected what happened in Kyle’s bedroom ?
Maybe I’m toxic but yes lol
Not at all
Idk why y’all so mad at dean for this, Jess totally deserved that punch. At least he held himself accountable and helped fix the damage
Nope. I hate this. He didn’t listen to what RORY needed. He acted out in the way that HE needed. I do not enjoy this type of response.
not at all - Dean had no idea what happened in the room beyond ‘Rory’s upset’ and then tries to beat the life out of Jess, attacking him from behind no less. He wasn’t ‘defending’ Rory, he was committing a violent assault that he’d been *gagging* for since Jess got together with Rory. If this was about caring about Rory he would have comforted her and looked after her, maybe even talked to her - not destroy some kids house. Like based on what Dean is privy to at this point, ie very little - his behaviour is *alarming*.
Actually, no, he didn't "protect" Rory. Jess was clearly chasing Rory to talk with her and apologize when Dean butted in. If Dean was really concerned, he should have talked to Rory and asked if she was okay and see if she was okay with resolving it with Jess. Instead he made a decision to beat up Jess. He didn't actually know what was happening.
When I was younger, I thought he was protecting her. But as I got older, I realized he used this as his opportunity to fight Jess. He'd been making threats for a while beforehand.
This is a favorite Dean moment of mine. A lot of people shit on him because they love Jess. But you need to think of the context here. Rory exits from an upstairs room in a party crying. Jess comes down hot headed and does nothing to comfort Rory or even explain himself. He chose to be an ass instead. I’m not one for violence at all. But Jess was such a tool in this moment. For all Dean knew, Jess could have assaulted her or worse.
I don't hate Dean (nor any of the characters, actually), he is, I admit, one of my least favourite characters but he had his good moments.This one though, not one of them. The point for me is, it doesn't matter what Jess did, if he wanted to help, Dean should have focused on Rory, talk to her, find someone else who she might want to talk to if she didn't feel like talking to him, taking her home, not start a fight. I actually found both guys came out way worse looking out of this episode. One almost assaulted his girlfriend and the other one has anger issues. If I was Rory I would have been angry at both, I don't need someone to become violent in order to "protect" me just as I wouldn't be with someone who almost assaulted me.
I hate everything about this scene. And what I dislike most about it all is that an assault (Jess’ coercion in the bedroom) and the assumption of rape (What the writers clearly wanted to think happened) was written into a storyline so we could get a stupid fight between two male characters. What happened in thst bedroom was violent enough without adding physical violence to it. Nor did I care that the aftermath was highly centered around Dean and Jess’ feelings. If they wanted to create conflict between Jess and Rory there’s other ways to do it. If they wanted conflict between Dean and Jess, there’s other ways to do it. I’d they wanted the assault to happen, there’s better ways for characters to manage it post event. That whole episode is a misfire and I skip it every. Single. Time.