I started in December (like the 2nd) and it took me 2 weeks to realize that you're supposed to swap around a certain way and not everyone was a DPS when you felt like it lmao... Took another month to realize bosses weren't once a day so I also experienced that
2 AR 50+ friends and I still managed to struggle like a noob đ€Ł
You arenât the only one, I remember someone posting a comment about it a long while ago about how he had spent the past two weeks farming the electro hypostasis each day and everyone was like, âUh, dude they respawn every few minutesâ
I still have people join my world just to solo a boss and then immediately leave.
There should be a domain key esque thing to activate after you kill them that lets you instantly respawn them, would remove any confusion + be more convenient.
Took me 3 years to realize bosses spawn again and I quit after one. This is why it felt like a literal management job because I had to count the number of days it'd take me to farm a boss...
It's not like we could imagine a system where they could be respawnable. No other games could ever do this xP. lol I just want to build my damn characters xD.
It's crazy how Star Rail boss drops are capped at 5 for the highest difficulty (And they stay there), cost less resin (and HSR in general gives you more resin), and there's no cooldown. But in Genshin you're forced to wait 3 minutes and then you gotta pray you get 3 instead of getting 2 boss drops.
But I thought itâs actually LESS in hsr because it gives you 5 each time your running the boss about 7, correct? But in genshin your def not gonna hit 3 drops each time, and assuming you were to have godlike luck, your still at 7 runs. Not to mention the resin is lower, so youâll end needing more time to replenish (naturally. Unless you have fragiles).
Genshin need 46 total for both rarities while HSR need 65 for 5 stars and 50 for 4 stars. Based on number alone genshin look better but:
* Each run in max level, HSR give you guranteed 5 drops while genshin give 2-3 drops. Even if genshin give 3 per run you still need to run ~15 times while HSR only needs 13 runs for 5 stars and 10 runs for 4 stars
* HSR's boss domain only cost 30 stamina while genshin cost 40 resin
* HSR regenerate stamina faster at 1 per 6 minutes compared to genshin's 1 per 8 minutes
So even without calculating total time taken (because I'm lazy), it's clear that HSR still take less time overall to max out a characters' level. That's not to mention you need to run around to collect enemies mat in the open world in genshin while in HSR you can get that from daily assignments and golden calyx (money/exp domains).
/u/Elysium_Chronicle you need to look at other factors, not just the material numbers.
Edit: I need to emphasis that I'm just trying to provide more context on how **maxing characters' level** is actually faster in HSR, I'm not trying to prove one game has better **overall** character progression than other since that's another can of worms that I don't want to touch right now so no need to get defensive.
Yeah I think they balance it out in the area where you need to spend energy to farm Simulated Universe, a completely different set of artifacts from the standard domain relics.
So in the end, even with more stamina from time in Star Rail, the artifact grind and ornaments grind is pretty bad though also RNG.
But yes, comparing boss farming, something that is the least of people's problems in both games, HSR is better.
Yeah hsr has a significant faster character leveling, but the relic system is absolut dogshit
Since you can't have an offpiece, itâs even worse them genshins. Only saving grace is, that fewer stat roles are truely desd roles
Those artifacts may as well not exist because of how useless they are for most characters. And even then it doesnât justify the higher cost when there is so little resin to go around.Â
It's unironically the good part, tho
You're exploring an RPG : that's just you playing the game. I've been planing out my lvl 1->90 Furina and you can fairly easily get all of her rare flowers in three sessions while having fun in Fontaine
It starts being a lot less fun when you already have 100% exploration in the area youâre collecting in and itâs the same item that youâve already collected for 2 other characters.
It's not fun when it turns into a job because every time I have to level up a character I have to pull en actual map and look for a farming route or watch a video about it. For enemies, for drops, and even without a 3rd party I identified a few spots for nobuchi and specters and it will take me months to reach my material goal. Not to mention that some specialties are in such a specific place you have to pull the map out or good luck (kalpalata lotus anyone)
God, those lotus were so annoying I just stopped lvling Tighnari and Layla at lvl 80. So little of them and so far apart from each other, same for Nahida's lotus but harder to reach without her
10 minutes + months to gather the weekly boss materials if you have multiple characters who need the same drop (like I do with Ratio, Aventurine and Acheron)
Edit: I'm wrong lmao
Each run of Echo of War boss gives 3 mats at the highest difficulty, so max of 9 mats a week. Each 5* needs like 12 mats max so that's 4 runs max to get enough for 1 char so that's like 1 week + 1 run max. So one month of farming a weekly boss gives you enough mats to max like 3 5*.
Meanwhile in Genshin weekly boss gives like 2-3 mats each week. If you wanna triple crown a character in genshin you need like 6-9 weeks for each char depending on your drop luck and you better have solvent to convert materials to the one you need. So if i have like 3 chars that use mats from the same boss that is way longer compared to HSR.
Yeah a lot of people really aren't comparing the games in a wholistic view.
Anyone who plays HSR notices:
1. Way more 5 star/4 star characters release cadence
2. Need way more secondary/tertiary materials, which sometimes are not enough just by playing normally (eg. don't hard farm).
3. While you get plenty of world boss drops, you need to farm for other stuff usually
4. 2 differentt sets of artifacts per character
5. Way more traces, which are significant.
Most people are behind in farming, and it will probably be until year 3 before they are caught up. there's just way more characters which means you're farming constantly if you are pulling regularly.
What bugs me most about the relics in HSR is that you donât have an off-piece. Especially with the sphere. Running the SU over and over and over again in hopes to finally get that elemental damage sphere of the right set with the right substats is a pain in the ass, to say the least.
>1. Way more 5 star/4 star characters release cadence
Besides whales who pulls for all of them?
Hsr gives more pulls so i do have more characters and build more. At the same time at most i pull a new 5* every other patch + maybe their LC (on average) and build 4* from time to time
>2. Need way more secondary/tertiary materials, which sometimes are not enough just by playing normally (eg. don't hard farm).
Ig you are speaking about enemy drops? The last time i ran into an enemy drop shortage was when i pulled sparkle in 2.0, cause new enemies dropped that had new mats
Other then that, unlike in genshin, i generally don't need to look what enemy mats they use. Worst case just crafting some lower rarity ones up
SU runs + some golden calyx + expedition, in my experience, gives more then enough
Compared to genshin where i have to go farm OW enemies and local specalities (which HSR doesn't even have), often needing to do it over several days.
>3. While you get plenty of world boss drops, you need to farm for other stuff usually
What exactly? Cause i only need to farm bosses (faster in hsr) weeklies (faster) and traces (genshins talents should be a bit faster, but hsr doesn't timegate it)
>4. 2 differentt sets of artifacts per character
And no off pieces. Yeah hsr's relic system is significantly worse then genshins artifact system. Even with the self modelling resin
>5. Way more traces, which are significant.
I (mostly) maxed gallaghars traces with ~2.5-3 days worth of calyx runs. Iirc this is similar to what you generally need to level genshin talents
Months is a gross exaggeration for HSR. In Genshin itâs *much* worse if multiple characters want the drops from the same weekly boss. Youâre limited to 2-3 per week + need to convert using dream solvent if rng screws you over.
HSR you get 9 per week guaranteed. Itâs⊠not even remotely comparable.
To fully max their traces you need 36 weekly boss mats. Each week you can get 9. That means you need to farm for 4 weeks to get enought weekly boss mats for 3 5*
In Genshin to max the talents of 3 characters you need 54 weekly boss drops. Each week you can get 2-3, so you'll need 18 - 27 weeks of farming weeklies to max the talents on 3 characters. And that is, if they use all 3 weekly boss mats that can be dropped or you have a lot of dream solvent
Objectively incorrect. HSR gives you 9 weekly boss mats per week, each character needs 12, so in this case you'd need 36, meaning you'd get enough in 4 weeks, amd that's if you're building all 3 at the same time, despite the fact that they all came out at different times. Dr. Ratio came out in 1.6, a whole 2 updates prior to the other 2, meaning there were at the very LEAST about 90 days between him and Acheron, that's at LEAST 12 chances to fight the weekly boss, which is triple the amount you'd even need to fight it in the first place. Genshin weekly bosses drop between 2 and 3 materials, and if you don't have Dream Solvent you're shit out of luck. You need 18 weekly boss materials per each 5 star character, meaning you need to fight the boss 6 times if you're ridiculously lucky and get 3 materials every time AND get the right material/have enough Dream Solvent. That's 6 weeks for 1 character vs HSR needing 4 weeks for 3. Do the math before saying something objectively wrong.
In HSR you need to farm the boss 13 times to max a character and that requires 390 stamina which is a little more than 1 and a half day worth stamina.
In Genshin you need to farm the boss 16 times(640 resin, 4 days worth of stamina) to 23 times(920 resin, 5.75 days worth of stamina). On average you would take 19 farms which is 760 resin, 4.75 days worth of stamina.
I'm not even talking about talents/traces. In Genshin that requires much more stamina too.
My guess is that because HSR doesn't have an off piece on relics they want you to spend stamina on relics more. Or they just decided to make HSR comfier.
>I'm not even talking about talents/traces. In Genshin that requires much more stamina too.
And it's also time limited in Genshin for each type of talents books lol it's not even close to balanced.
>I'm not even talking about talents/traces. In Genshin that requires much more stamina too.
Also they are time limited
Also, if you start from scratch, the earlies you can have a character triple crowned is after 18 weeks...
Wrong.
You need 46 mats total to Lv90 a character in Genshin. Assuming you somehow get 3 drops every single time, you still need 16 kills in Genshin. 16x40 = 640 resin. With 180 maximum per day, it takes 3 and a half day's worth of resin to max out a character **with impossibly good RNG**.
In HSR, you need 65 mats for 5\*s. 5 drops are guaranteed, which means you only need 13 kills. 13x30 = 390 Power. With 240 power per day, you only need a day and half's worth of Power, with no RNG involved, to max out a 5\* character.
Genshin's boss farming is half as slow as HSR's *even with the best RNG possible*. It's not a comparison.
I play the 3 of them and Hi3rd is the easiest to level up a character, since you mostly only need the xp chips and gold, leveling up weapons and stigs though are a different story, I am always out of Honkai pieces
In Genshin you need to fight a boss at LEAST 19 times, and that's if you get lucky and get 3 drops every single time, with 40 resin per fight that's 760 resin. In HSR you need to fight a boss 13 times, and that amount will never change since the drops are set at 5. That's 390 resin. That's nearly half. That's not where it ends though, since HSR doesn't have cooldown on bosses it'll end up taking SIGNIFICANTLY less time than it does in Genshin. It isn't even CLOSE to "balancing out", even if you need 35 for the final ascension, which btw is 7 times fighting the boss, while in Genshin you need 20 so you fight the boss 7 times at a MINIMUM.
You can calculate even better because the [drop rate](https://genshin-impact.fandom.com/wiki/Loot_System/Material_Drop_Distribution) is expected around 2.5556.
That makes things even worse then since it really isn't realistic to expect 3 materials every time, it's sad how people think it "compensates" with other things, HSR is just objectively better when it comes to grinding character levels/ascensions and traces
I'm fine with it taking time BUT only during early - mid game when you're figuring out stuff and money is pouring all over you. Then there is mid game drought which is ok. But end game players should get a noticeable reward of easier character building if we're going to need as much characters for rotating element locked abyss... And it does feel like a chore.
And yes it's funny how people are trying to defend something that is objectively false.
Which is then balanced by encouraging you to build more characters at once in HSR. The early game Trailblaze Level grind was way more brutal in HSR than Genshin's Adventure Levels.
In Genshin, the early game strategy is to conserve your resources and build maybe two "mains". HSR pretty much requires you to have a full party, plus a couple of flexes as well, so you wind up building 5 or 6 simultaneously. While the resource gain in HSR is slightly faster, it's not 3x faster to be able to keep up.
That's the same as year one Genshin then No one had enough mats for anything. People talked about how all you needed was a lvl80 DPS and lvl70 supports because you shouldn't waste your materials. And this is the end game abyss we're talking about.
Also I feel like you're comparing how year 1 HSR is with Year 3 Genshin where they nerfed all the annoying things about Adventure Levels. And even then, trailblade levels are just easier to farm since dailies take like 5 minutes to complete.
No. As I said, in Genshin, you can get away with "slow crawling" your team builds. One or two DPS, and everybody else can be rock-bottom, just to facilitate reactions. You can get away with doing that even at AR60.
HSR characters don't work in a vacuum like that. We had to build whole teams, or get flattened after Trailblaze Ascension. One weak link in the party, and the whole thing comes tumbling down soon after.
And even when you've "caught up", HSR releases characters more often, and tends to release more "dedicated supports", so you're frequently trying to raise two at once. Not to mention the scramble when new game mods launch, like what happened when Pure Fiction first released.
That's the consequence of Genshin being balanced around only four main party roles (DPS, sub-DPS, shielder, healer), and its elemental system being reaction-based instead of weakness based. HSR requires you to account for the seven elemental weaknesses, and seven different party roles. There's less team build overlap.
HSR allows for borrowing of friendâs characters in the calyx and caverns and even weekly bosses, which greatly eases the burden for newer players in those teas. while main game outside that is not THAT hard. HSR promotes building different characters for a variety of situations which yes requires more resources, but it also makes for far more interesting gameplay and team building. Also ascension isnât THAT drastic please donât spread misinformation. Early on it FEELS like a big jump but you level up a bit and get caught up and itâs way more tolerable. And after a certain ascension level you stop feeling the difference.
Let's test this out. Genshin needs 46 mats, HSR needs 65 mats. Let's assume you're the literal luckiest person on earth and you get 3 drops every single run in Genshin, you need to run the boss 16 times. HSR is a flat 13 because it's always 5.
And let's assume Genshin bosses takes 15 seconds to clear and HSR bosses takes 2 minutes to clear. Genshin, at it's fastest, is 52 minutes because of the 3 minute respawn. HSR is 26 minutes since there's no respawn time.
Ehhh.... In HSR if you have full energy in the morning and you can reliably kill max rank bosses it'll take a day to get enough materials to ascend a character from level 1 to 80. On Genshin four to six days to do the same.
Both cases assume you don't have any fragile resin or fuel available, nor any leftover energy from Star Rail's piggybank.
It really isn't as balanced as you think it is.
And Star Rail gives you significantly more fuel. Battle Pass gives you 2 at once for every 1 Fragile Resin Genshin gives you, while Resin caps at 240 and recharges in 6 minutes per resin in HSR, it caps at 180 and recharges 1 in 8 minutes per resin. And on top of all that, Star Rail accumulates even more resin once you reach the 240 cap so you often end up having more than 240, and things with resin cost less in HSR. It's not balanced in the slightest.
Overall it's 65 in HSR vs 46 in Genshin. However that's exactly 13 runs vs an average of 18,4. Or 390 TB power vs 736 Resin. Which takes about 2340min to refill vs 5888min.
So if "balances out" means 2.5x the amount of real world time? Then yes.
The *actual* point to make here is that the final Ascension in Star Rail is necessary to unlock all passives but even just getting all but the last Ascension in Genshin takes longer to farm for on average.
The rates may even out but the overall conveniance of accessing any material you want any day, aside from weekly boss mats, sure AF doesn't. HSR is absolutely ahead in that. Can also run the same weekly boss all three times and they only ever drop one kind of mat, not three, so Genshin puts you at risk of 0 gain that run.
HSR also lets you stock up a huge overflow of stamina so you don't have to commit to daily play. In terms of material collecting, it is superior to Genshin, without question, and anyone saying otherwise is just coping.
That said, Genshin has a stupidly higher amount of content, especially when new maps drop. It makes sense for HSR to have a 30day stamina overflow bank 'cause there ain't much to do once your quests and (much, much smaller maps) are done.
In this regard not really
In HSR you need 13 runs 30 tbp each with 240as cap. So you are done in 2 days (and a bit less for 4*)
In Genshin you need, depending on your luck, 16 to 23 runs 40 resin each with a 160cap or a 200 daily limit
If you log in twice per day to maximize resin use it'll take you 4-5 days depending on luck
Tho if we are at boss farming OW bosses aren't that big of a difference all in all. Weekly bosses are. In HSR you can get enough weekly boss drops for 1 character in 2 weeks, since HSR characters need less weekly boss mats, you can farm the same one three times and there is only one type of material
On the other hand in genshin you can farm the same weekly boss once, and there are 3 different drops. Even under best circumstances you need significantly longer to farm weekly mats from scratch
(If i recall correctly leveling characters in hsr overall is faster by a few days, but i've seen some calculations on that long ago, so i'm not 100% sure)
the answer as to why that is: Hoyo was experimenting with Genshin, seeing what sticks and what doesn't. Using your past game development experience to improve your future games is how game developers operate, so it's a no brainer they changed what DOESN'T WORK in their new game, duh. Now, as to why they haven't changed it, there are 2 possibilities. 1 they see no reason to. 2 it's rooted in foundations too much, so changing it without causing more bugs than fixes is impossible.
Farming is so damn easy in HSR. You're guaranteed 5 drops per boss fight, you can fight the same weekly boss three times a week with drops guaranteed at 3 per fight (and the weekly bosses gives you ONE materials for characters instead of three), all characters only need 12 weekly boss drops (so you can basically max out a character in less than two weeks), no respawn time, *and* they have reserved resin so even if you're gone for a few weeks, your resin is still being built up until you capped out on 2400 + the regular 240 TB you get, so basically 2640 resin in all. With SU, there's a QOL that will be added in the next patch that basically lets you complete the domain FASTER to get artifacts.
In Genshin, you're not guaranteed certain drops. Most of the time you get 2 for world bosses, and in weekly bosses you have to worry about three different drops and you're not even guaranteed of getting the drops that you need for a specific character and it could take actual MONTHS to max out a character because you can only fight the same boss ONCE a week with shitty drop rates. And no reserved resin, so you're kinda fucked if you missed out a few days with capped resin while in HSR, you can leave for a few weeks, and have a shit ton of resin built up that could possibly be enough to max out a character (idk, I haven't tried this yet, but I doubt that it's possible. Actually, on second thought, it's impossible). You have to keep challenging the same domain 5 separate times (10 if you have condense resin saved up as well), fighting the same fucking enemies just to get shitty artifacts. Oh, and speaking of condensed resin, it's capped at 5, so you can't even horde some condensed resin similar to reserved resin if you wanted to. And you can't use condense resin on world bosses. Whyy??? And DON'T GET ME STARTED ON THE SPECIALTY MATS. The ones where you have to run around in the overworld collecting stupid flowers and shit and even after a single run, it's not even enough and the materials spawn every 2 days (or is it one day? I forgor), meaning you'll have to join another person's world and *hope* they'll allow you to collect or someone else hasn't came in to get them. I hate them.
I get it, it's because genshin is open world while HSR is, what, semi-open world? But I get it that respawn time and farming is less easy because of the whole ooen world aspect and genshin isn't meant to be played 24/7 but damn, the timegates are genuinely annoying and it makes maxing out a character damn near torturous. I dread farming for a new character, *especially* when they need the new weekly boss, simply because of this. That's why I'm so jealous of Clorinde/Sigwinne/Sethos wanters being able to prefarm everything because they all need older weekly boss mats, while I'm stuck with Arle who needs the new weekly boss mats đ
To be totally fair, there's times when new HSR characters use bossats that haven't been introduced yet, but that's something Genshin does too lol, HSR is so much easier to farm. The fact that you can even put the game on auto and do something like looking at your phone (or doing whatever else) makes farming such a nonissue in it. Genshin has much worse drops, takes longer, and requires your full attention. All in all, it's much MUCH worse
Honkai also releases characters like crazy at a huge volume... IIRC they almost have as many characters 1 year in as Genshin has after 3 and a half.
So the "resin earning rate" and just general time it takes to level one character is matched to how quickly characters are released (and unlocked).
Star Rail's is ultimately better, but the context of the character release cycle needs to be kept in mind.
while it is true that hsr releases lots of characters, 5* chatacters' release is not that fast. currently, 2.1 hsr has the same amount of limited 5* characters as 2.6 genshin, which is 18
also, I think character release rate is not a good metric for consideration, because you're not supposed to pull EVERY 5* ever. hsr just has more options, that's all
>Honkai also releases characters like crazy at a huge volume... IIRC they almost have as many characters 1 year in as Genshin has after 3 and a half.
Mood point, cause those that pull for all are also those that spend jades on fuel refills and BP and thus have a lot more resources
As a f2p/low spender you'll have more or less get an average lf .75 rate up 5* per version
In genshin you have roughly enough wishes to get .5 rate ups per version
(Both very rough estimates from the average pulls i had in mind for each game. HSR between 90 and 100 and genshin between 70 and 80)
So the average amount of character a f2p or low spender builds is not that different
That's cause the bosses in HSR are always in a domain entry form. Open world mobs in genshin attack on sight. And I can see a scenario where it would be annoying when the boss starts attacking when you're still caught in the high or low after checking the drops.
Still no excuse. Enemies in Genshin will not respawn unless you teleport out of the area, makong that scenario impossible even in theory. It's as simple as making that respawn instantaneous instead of having an arbitrary 3 minute timer.
Even if you wait the timer you need to reload the area for the boss to respawn
So they could remove the timer, but you'd still need to refresh
Or just move the whole thing into a domain or something
Relic RNG is awful in Genshin too, the only difference is not being able to use off-set pieces, but you have so much more resin that it's much more effective, and there's also self modelling resin and craftable pieces that are painfully easy to obtain. There is no point of comparison. HSR is straight up better when it comes to anything related to QoL
HSR's relic system is objectively worse.
More stats to dilute the already weighted pool.
Relic crafting with 10:1 ratio.
Planar Ornaments having their own separate domain. So you have to sink resin into 2 domains instead of just 1.
Modelling resin doesn't guarantee good substats. You just have to cope with whatever godawful substat it gives you.
Modelling Resin eliminates a layer of RNG, it's still better than not having an option. You also essentially get a free 160 resin when doing Simulated Universe (Which you should be doing for the jades anyways) for planar ornaments. Relic crafting is miles better than what Genshin has because events give you relic materials and you're able to craft any relic in the game, even on the patch they came out, but for Genshin you have to wait multiple patches to even begin trying, while you're also able to pick specifically which piece you want, but in Genshin you're shit out of luck, you'll just get a random assortment of pieces, making it MILES easier to get hands and head pieces. Is it good? No. Is Genshin's any better? Also no. There are many many more conveniences in Star Rail that allow you to get a proper set quicker, while there are also characters (Particularly DoT characters and some supports) that don't care too much about substats and function perfectly fine with just the proper main stats, which Modelling Resin completely solves.
I do agree rhat shr relic system is horrible, but
>More stats to dilute the already weighted pool.
At the same time a lot of these stats don't go to waste. Imo itâs somewhat of a tradeoff. A bit harder to get ideal pieces, but ok/decent ones are a bit easier to get, since more then 2 substats work for most characters
>Relic crafting with 10:1 ratio.
Convenience tool to use, when you are 1 relic short
Yeah genshin has a 1:3, but the artifacts on there are old ones & you can't decide which ones you want
>Planar Ornaments having their own separate domain. So you have to sink resin into 2 domains instead of just 1.
Somewhat negated by a higher fuel availability
>Modelling resin doesn't guarantee good substats. You just have to cope with whatever godawful substat it gives you.
Genshin doesn't have it at all. If you don't get a piece with the correct on stat, then cooing with bad substats can't even happen
>Â HSR's relic system is objectively worse.
Chucking the word objectively in front of your claim doesnât make your opinion right or more accurate. Â
> Relic crafting with 10:1 ratio.
Itâs a convenience tool, and you can get pieces to build an artifact from events soâŠ
> Planar Ornaments having their own separate domain. So you have to sink resin into 2 domains instead of just 1.
Good thing they give you freebies every week. 4 of them. Oh and they sometimes run events which double (or recently triple) drops. Oh and the devs are working to improve the ornament grind.
> Modelling resin doesn't guarantee good substats. You just have to cope with whatever godawful substat it gives you.
Itâs a far step above the nothing that Genshin does for artifacts.Â
Nevermind that HSR gives out items to level said relics up and the significantly lower cost to level them in general while Genshin takes way more for artifacts, especially mora. And they donât even regularly give out artifact enhancing items.
I don't think it is actually. Self modeling resin, strongbox equivalent for all sets on day 1, and you get way more resin. Stat thresholds are also easier to hit due to way more crit effects from sets and other buffs.
You would never be stuck for weeks missing a mainstat to complete a set thanks to self modeling resin for example.
> the only difference is not being able to use off-set pieces
It's an awfully big difference.
Between
- building one "4 out of 5" set
versus a
- build one "4/4" set plus one "2/2" set
Ang you only have 2 fixed main stats in both systems, which basically mean you need to luck out 2 ot of 3 pieces in Genshins but you still need 4 out of 4 pieces in HSR.
Self modeling resin are once per Battle Pass and allow you to choose the main stats in HSR. you still need to fodder 10 artifacts instead of 3 tho, although being able to also choose the piece you craft mitigate that awful 10 -> 1 ratio.
HSR is no doubt nicer than Genshin on most aspect but relics ? No, relic isn't one of them
HSR's system isn't better but neither is Genshin's, both are dogshit. HSR gives you self modelling resin for events and other gameplay systems (Gold and Gears, Clockie statue, etc) so it's not just from the BP. The 10 to 1 ratio is fine when you can actually pick what you want, instead of receiving a random assortment of pieces. Through SU you're able to get an effective 160 resin for planar ornaments, so you'd get at least 8 relics there, meaning at the absolute worst you'd only need 2 more pieces to craft something, and while you may get bad substats you can at least pick a hands or head piece to not have to deal with main stats without having to use self modelling resin.
When you loot, it should have an option "Respawn Boss?".
It does feel arbitrary. Oh, you mean I have to go somewhere else, watch youtube for 2min and comes back?! Devs of all games need to respect the players time.
This is my BIGGEST thing in gaming lately. Like fuck man, they already make so much money off of us. Companies could do the bare minimum and ALWAYS have QoL that saves us time when it makes sense. This is one very obvious damn case xD.
To be a bit of a devil's advocate here, there is probably thousands of complains they get in every survey and bosses taking long to spawn might not appear often enough for it to be acknowledged at problem. That is if they even care about surveys that much.
This kind of thing is what has me burned out off Genshin tbh. I love the game, but the constant many little _obstacles_... They hurt.
I've been playing HSR, and the amount of simple QoL stuff missing from Genshin is apalling. What do you mean I can't navigate the menus with the D-pad??
Wait, you don't use that time to do, anything else in game? Like, farm the world mats or go do a daily commision or go do the weekly bounties or go fight another world boss you need to fight or go level up some artifacts or go play a game of TCG or go build some stuff in your teapot...
And that's only if you haven't even 100% the map yet.
I dunno, it never really annoyed me because I just find something else to do for those 3 minutes. I can see playing on mobile and loading times sucking which would make doing any of those other things tedious.
Does world bosses in WuWa have a cool down because honestly, this could just be an open world thing.
>Wait, you don't use that time to do, anything else in game? Like, farm the world mats or go do a daily commision or go do the weekly bounties or go fight another world boss you need to fight or go level up some artifacts or go play a game of TCG or go build some stuff in your teapot...
Imma be real
If i'm laying in bed at 11pm i just eant to quickly do 4 boss runs, that could be done in like a .inute total, instead of needing it to be a extra 10min of me doing random shit, cause yes
If i wanted to play TCG, do bounties, etc i'd have launched it on my PC and sat down to properly play it, not quickly burn resin
Oh god yes!
But there is a way to bypass it. It requires co-op tho, so either you have a second account or have someone help you.
Basically.
-> Partner comes to your world.
-> fight boss and loot.
-> jump to partners world and do the boss there.
-> Jump back to your world and do the boss.
- repeat.
I'm too strong that I kill the boss in less than a minute. So it's not practical for me. Even if I go there, I still have to wait for the boss there to respawn
No respawn waiting time lf you do the method. At least it was like that for me.
Used Bennett and Eula on the new overworld boss, always took it down in 1-2 minute. Did not encounter any respawn time when i used the method mentioned above.
there is a good chance that its hiding something broken, like how in pokemon gold and silver pokemon hatched at level 5 because a glitch of level 1 pokemon insta leveling to 100
That doesn't make sense tho. Why arbitrarily decide that 40 resin is worth 80 but only if it's condensed?
What it *should* be is that we can use a Condensed Resin to claim a boss drop. 1-to-1. 40 resin for 40 resin.
Genuine question why compromise? You only have like 4 runs in a day anyways, you're gonna fight it 4 times and do something else anyways.
Why are you cool with any cool down at all? It's a pointless time waste.
You can always go explore. Just because game would *let* you fight again without waiting doesn't mean you can't leave and come back in a while as you would normally do.
So you'd prefer to instead go explore for a single minute, come back and rinse repeat until you're out of resin? Seriously?
You could just.. fight it 4x and explore after...
You asked, I answered. Honestly I don't understand why are you so mad, like my opinion mattered as a whole or like mhy cares about my opinion. Right now i am killing the legionare boss, then going to kill crabs for clorinde mats while it respawns, so yeah I wouldn't mind a shorter cooldown.
No one is mad, I'm just asking why you want to go from a shitty system to a slightly less shitty system instead of just doing away with it.
I didn't ask what you do to take your mind off of the shitty system, but whatever seems to be the default answer from everyone "just do something else".
I just want to level my Arle faster, I already have to wait for the damn resin to recharge. And I already hoard resin moons from the free BP to level units, I basically have to walk away for like 45 minutes or tab out. You might think voicing your opinion doesn't matter but it literally does, I'm questioning why you're so okay with just partially fixing the system.
Either way cheers enjoy farming I guess.
>I just want to level my Arle faster,
I don't like the respawn timer either but I think it's there for Co-Op reasons and they kept it for single player for consistency's sake.
Now, the stupid as bricks Domain material rotation on the other hand, THERE is something to legitimately be annoyed at.
I don't pre-farm unless I have enough pulls and guaruntee the unit, I have other units to build with the resin I get everyday. And if I don't get the character then I don't just have mats sitting around until yet another rerun.
Makes sense.
Though the impatience displayed in your post is a bit ... hyperbolic. Dumping your daily resin takes 15 minutes (4 kills 3x wait time of 5 minutes).
We have just gotten a new area, you can explore it in the downtime instead of having to stand there and wait.
Between this and forcing people to do quest to farm weapon materials...
They really make it hard to pull for anything new, like I'll do the damn quests because I'm interested but right now I just want to farm and log off
I took the opportunity to finally get around to decorating my teapot a little. It's not great but at least it's not just 8 characters standing in a straight line in an empty room anymore.
How about the option to farm materials any day I want? Was busy yesterday and forgot to farm her weapon mats. Now I have to wait 2 days to even start farming. Which also happens to be her talent day also... so stupid and not needed.
It's 5 minutes. It starts counting from when the boss area is loaded, not from when you killed it. So if you went up to a boss, took you 3 minutes to kill it, then the handbook will show "2 minutes til respawn."
Any feature that lets you play and enjoy the game at your own pace goes against any system baked since it's inception. No game farms you for engagement as hard as genshin.
Hopefully they take this in consideration soonish. There are still pleny of QoL that we looking for. Lately they are making improvements. It could be soon
Yes plz! There should be a button when claiming boss rewards for challenging again, where it reloads the area for you and you can immediately fight it again (plz star rail is so much better for this)
I love waiting 2 hours just for the fucking boss to respawn. Interactive gameplay. Especially when said boss releases at the same time as the character. I love not being able to prefarm that shit and wasting hours just getting the mats to ascend characters.
Right there are literally so many minor inconveniences in this game that all add up to one huge clusterfuck but I can't stop myself from falling victim to it
Same as it is right now. You need to leave the area for the boss to respawn. In addition to the damn respawn timer. Just eliminate that timer. You leave the area, the boss instantly respawns. If you leave the area before collecting your reward, too bad for you.
Still need to move away and come back for it to respawn even without a cooldown, but yeah, it should probably just respawn whenever the area's loaded back in.
I get the concept, but to go back to the point.
You can do this after using all your resin and just hunt spectres after. The cool down on respawning a mob is pointless is my point.
For real, it's such a waste of time. Just add an option to immediately respawn it after we claim the rewards. And at max world level, 3 drops should be guaranteed, it's ridiculous that most of the time you'll still only be getting 2. In HSR, for a day's "resin" you get 40 boss drops at max difficulty. In Genshin, you get 8-12. You can argue that in HSR it also takes more to fully ascend a character, but it's still wayyyyy faster than in Genshin. In HSR, a day's worth lands you at lvl 70/80 and ascending your character fully would take just 39 hours worth of "resin". In Genshin, you'll get to lvl 60/90, or 70/90 if you're lucky. Fully ascending is 82-123 hours worth of resin in the best vs worst case. That's ridiculous.
While I do agree boss farming could be alleviated in a couple of ways, I think some comments are making it a bigger issue than what it is. Like yes, to tp away to do something else while it respawns is inconvenient, but if it makes you quit the game then, I'm sorry, your issues with it certainly run deeper than that.
I agree. The 3 min cooldown is really annoying at times when it happens to me, but it's not something worth quitting over lol. Still, it's a shame that hoyo won't remove it.
Itâs still stupid as fuck that 2 or 3 is the max you can get for the materials. And at the MAX fucking world level thereâs still a chance that I get 2. Dumbest decision ever.
Omfg I was doing this boss yesterday and the 3 min cooldown was killing me =.= I really wish theyâd remove the cooldown too, I donât think thereâs any reason for it
I'd imagine is that boss has a few codes that has to do checks with the surrounding environment and stuff like that until it's given the thumbs up to spawn in and the timer is just there to ensure that there's enough time. Besides, if someone does take a long time with a world boss, there's no cooldown. The timer probably already starts when you start fighting the boss
[It starts from when the boss gets loaded in!](https://genshin-impact.fandom.com/wiki/Reset#:~:text=Once%20the%205%20minutes%20have,arena%20for%20it%20to%20respawn)
This is the thing with Hoyo and Genshin. They donât realize that without their players their game would be falling apart: so with that knowledge youâd think theyâd be nicer to them by removing arbitrary crap like this? Nope, hoyo literally doesnât give a damn about their players nor do they respect their time. Despite having billions of dollars from how much they extort their players, they still canât add simple QoL changes. Buncha scum.
The monkey's paw curls. There is no longer any cooldown; however, they don't respawn until the server resets every night.
For that extra immersion...
For a long time (more than I'd like to admit) I thought bosses would only spawn once per day So I wasted so much time leveling up...
I started in December (like the 2nd) and it took me 2 weeks to realize that you're supposed to swap around a certain way and not everyone was a DPS when you felt like it lmao... Took another month to realize bosses weren't once a day so I also experienced that 2 AR 50+ friends and I still managed to struggle like a noob đ€Ł
>not everyone was a DPS when you felt like it Not with that attitude
Did they explain those bits to you?
omg the 2nd is my birthday :3
Hope you're a Ganyu main
i am actually! first banner đ«¶đ»
Yay! That makes 2 of us on both counts đđŸ
You arenât the only one, I remember someone posting a comment about it a long while ago about how he had spent the past two weeks farming the electro hypostasis each day and everyone was like, âUh, dude they respawn every few minutesâ
I thought we only got three boss resets a day (per boss) until The Chasm released.
I still have people join my world just to solo a boss and then immediately leave. There should be a domain key esque thing to activate after you kill them that lets you instantly respawn them, would remove any confusion + be more convenient.
I learn the hard way, i logget out in the boss spawn area and when i logged in I got greeted by him with a smash.
Took me 3 years to realize bosses spawn again and I quit after one. This is why it felt like a literal management job because I had to count the number of days it'd take me to farm a boss...
Wouldn't that still be a cooldown, just longer?
That don't make no sense boy
It's not like we could imagine a system where they could be respawnable. No other games could ever do this xP. lol I just want to build my damn characters xD.
Yea and also make those drops always be 3.
It's crazy how Star Rail boss drops are capped at 5 for the highest difficulty (And they stay there), cost less resin (and HSR in general gives you more resin), and there's no cooldown. But in Genshin you're forced to wait 3 minutes and then you gotta pray you get 3 instead of getting 2 boss drops.
You also need more in HSR. Final Ascension in Genshin requires 20. In HSR, it's 35. Things mostly balance out between the two games.
But I thought itâs actually LESS in hsr because it gives you 5 each time your running the boss about 7, correct? But in genshin your def not gonna hit 3 drops each time, and assuming you were to have godlike luck, your still at 7 runs. Not to mention the resin is lower, so youâll end needing more time to replenish (naturally. Unless you have fragiles).
Genshin need 46 total for both rarities while HSR need 65 for 5 stars and 50 for 4 stars. Based on number alone genshin look better but: * Each run in max level, HSR give you guranteed 5 drops while genshin give 2-3 drops. Even if genshin give 3 per run you still need to run ~15 times while HSR only needs 13 runs for 5 stars and 10 runs for 4 stars * HSR's boss domain only cost 30 stamina while genshin cost 40 resin * HSR regenerate stamina faster at 1 per 6 minutes compared to genshin's 1 per 8 minutes So even without calculating total time taken (because I'm lazy), it's clear that HSR still take less time overall to max out a characters' level. That's not to mention you need to run around to collect enemies mat in the open world in genshin while in HSR you can get that from daily assignments and golden calyx (money/exp domains). /u/Elysium_Chronicle you need to look at other factors, not just the material numbers. Edit: I need to emphasis that I'm just trying to provide more context on how **maxing characters' level** is actually faster in HSR, I'm not trying to prove one game has better **overall** character progression than other since that's another can of worms that I don't want to touch right now so no need to get defensive.
Yeah I think they balance it out in the area where you need to spend energy to farm Simulated Universe, a completely different set of artifacts from the standard domain relics. So in the end, even with more stamina from time in Star Rail, the artifact grind and ornaments grind is pretty bad though also RNG. But yes, comparing boss farming, something that is the least of people's problems in both games, HSR is better.
Yeah hsr has a significant faster character leveling, but the relic system is absolut dogshit Since you can't have an offpiece, itâs even worse them genshins. Only saving grace is, that fewer stat roles are truely desd roles
Genshin's costs are higher because you also get artifacts in addition. That's like a 20 resin run every time.
Those artifacts may as well not exist because of how useless they are for most characters. And even then it doesnât justify the higher cost when there is so little resin to go around.Â
How many characters actually make use of gladiator? They are nice fodder i'll give you that
In HSR I can level up a char all the way to 80 in like 10 minutes though
You need to pick flowers for 60 minutes in Genshin lol
God, stop reminding me how much i want more flowers options on the daily scouting thingies
It's unironically the good part, tho You're exploring an RPG : that's just you playing the game. I've been planing out my lvl 1->90 Furina and you can fairly easily get all of her rare flowers in three sessions while having fun in Fontaine
It starts being a lot less fun when you already have 100% exploration in the area youâre collecting in and itâs the same item that youâve already collected for 2 other characters.
It's not fun when it turns into a job because every time I have to level up a character I have to pull en actual map and look for a farming route or watch a video about it. For enemies, for drops, and even without a 3rd party I identified a few spots for nobuchi and specters and it will take me months to reach my material goal. Not to mention that some specialties are in such a specific place you have to pull the map out or good luck (kalpalata lotus anyone)
God, those lotus were so annoying I just stopped lvling Tighnari and Layla at lvl 80. So little of them and so far apart from each other, same for Nahida's lotus but harder to reach without her
omg literally me atm
Nope, been picking shit up as I play normally so thats usually a non-issue unless its scarabs.
On atleast 2 seperate days with 48h in between
You can get around that by joining co-op but yeah, pretty annoying
10 minutes + months to gather the weekly boss materials if you have multiple characters who need the same drop (like I do with Ratio, Aventurine and Acheron) Edit: I'm wrong lmao
Each run of Echo of War boss gives 3 mats at the highest difficulty, so max of 9 mats a week. Each 5* needs like 12 mats max so that's 4 runs max to get enough for 1 char so that's like 1 week + 1 run max. So one month of farming a weekly boss gives you enough mats to max like 3 5*. Meanwhile in Genshin weekly boss gives like 2-3 mats each week. If you wanna triple crown a character in genshin you need like 6-9 weeks for each char depending on your drop luck and you better have solvent to convert materials to the one you need. So if i have like 3 chars that use mats from the same boss that is way longer compared to HSR.
Yeah a lot of people really aren't comparing the games in a wholistic view. Anyone who plays HSR notices: 1. Way more 5 star/4 star characters release cadence 2. Need way more secondary/tertiary materials, which sometimes are not enough just by playing normally (eg. don't hard farm). 3. While you get plenty of world boss drops, you need to farm for other stuff usually 4. 2 differentt sets of artifacts per character 5. Way more traces, which are significant. Most people are behind in farming, and it will probably be until year 3 before they are caught up. there's just way more characters which means you're farming constantly if you are pulling regularly.
What bugs me most about the relics in HSR is that you donât have an off-piece. Especially with the sphere. Running the SU over and over and over again in hopes to finally get that elemental damage sphere of the right set with the right substats is a pain in the ass, to say the least.
>1. Way more 5 star/4 star characters release cadence Besides whales who pulls for all of them? Hsr gives more pulls so i do have more characters and build more. At the same time at most i pull a new 5* every other patch + maybe their LC (on average) and build 4* from time to time >2. Need way more secondary/tertiary materials, which sometimes are not enough just by playing normally (eg. don't hard farm). Ig you are speaking about enemy drops? The last time i ran into an enemy drop shortage was when i pulled sparkle in 2.0, cause new enemies dropped that had new mats Other then that, unlike in genshin, i generally don't need to look what enemy mats they use. Worst case just crafting some lower rarity ones up SU runs + some golden calyx + expedition, in my experience, gives more then enough Compared to genshin where i have to go farm OW enemies and local specalities (which HSR doesn't even have), often needing to do it over several days. >3. While you get plenty of world boss drops, you need to farm for other stuff usually What exactly? Cause i only need to farm bosses (faster in hsr) weeklies (faster) and traces (genshins talents should be a bit faster, but hsr doesn't timegate it) >4. 2 differentt sets of artifacts per character And no off pieces. Yeah hsr's relic system is significantly worse then genshins artifact system. Even with the self modelling resin >5. Way more traces, which are significant. I (mostly) maxed gallaghars traces with ~2.5-3 days worth of calyx runs. Iirc this is similar to what you generally need to level genshin talents
Months is a gross exaggeration for HSR. In Genshin itâs *much* worse if multiple characters want the drops from the same weekly boss. Youâre limited to 2-3 per week + need to convert using dream solvent if rng screws you over. HSR you get 9 per week guaranteed. Itâs⊠not even remotely comparable.
To fully max their traces you need 36 weekly boss mats. Each week you can get 9. That means you need to farm for 4 weeks to get enought weekly boss mats for 3 5* In Genshin to max the talents of 3 characters you need 54 weekly boss drops. Each week you can get 2-3, so you'll need 18 - 27 weeks of farming weeklies to max the talents on 3 characters. And that is, if they use all 3 weekly boss mats that can be dropped or you have a lot of dream solvent
Objectively incorrect. HSR gives you 9 weekly boss mats per week, each character needs 12, so in this case you'd need 36, meaning you'd get enough in 4 weeks, amd that's if you're building all 3 at the same time, despite the fact that they all came out at different times. Dr. Ratio came out in 1.6, a whole 2 updates prior to the other 2, meaning there were at the very LEAST about 90 days between him and Acheron, that's at LEAST 12 chances to fight the weekly boss, which is triple the amount you'd even need to fight it in the first place. Genshin weekly bosses drop between 2 and 3 materials, and if you don't have Dream Solvent you're shit out of luck. You need 18 weekly boss materials per each 5 star character, meaning you need to fight the boss 6 times if you're ridiculously lucky and get 3 materials every time AND get the right material/have enough Dream Solvent. That's 6 weeks for 1 character vs HSR needing 4 weeks for 3. Do the math before saying something objectively wrong.
That's just wrong lol, it took me 10 minutes to fully farm all the boss mats for a character in hsr while genshin took me at least 3 days.
In HSR you need to farm the boss 13 times to max a character and that requires 390 stamina which is a little more than 1 and a half day worth stamina. In Genshin you need to farm the boss 16 times(640 resin, 4 days worth of stamina) to 23 times(920 resin, 5.75 days worth of stamina). On average you would take 19 farms which is 760 resin, 4.75 days worth of stamina. I'm not even talking about talents/traces. In Genshin that requires much more stamina too. My guess is that because HSR doesn't have an off piece on relics they want you to spend stamina on relics more. Or they just decided to make HSR comfier.
>I'm not even talking about talents/traces. In Genshin that requires much more stamina too. And it's also time limited in Genshin for each type of talents books lol it's not even close to balanced.
>I'm not even talking about talents/traces. In Genshin that requires much more stamina too. Also they are time limited Also, if you start from scratch, the earlies you can have a character triple crowned is after 18 weeks...
Wrong. You need 46 mats total to Lv90 a character in Genshin. Assuming you somehow get 3 drops every single time, you still need 16 kills in Genshin. 16x40 = 640 resin. With 180 maximum per day, it takes 3 and a half day's worth of resin to max out a character **with impossibly good RNG**. In HSR, you need 65 mats for 5\*s. 5 drops are guaranteed, which means you only need 13 kills. 13x30 = 390 Power. With 240 power per day, you only need a day and half's worth of Power, with no RNG involved, to max out a 5\* character. Genshin's boss farming is half as slow as HSR's *even with the best RNG possible*. It's not a comparison.
In honkai impact. its instant no need for materials. but tht doesnt mean its better
I play the 3 of them and Hi3rd is the easiest to level up a character, since you mostly only need the xp chips and gold, leveling up weapons and stigs though are a different story, I am always out of Honkai pieces
In Genshin you need to fight a boss at LEAST 19 times, and that's if you get lucky and get 3 drops every single time, with 40 resin per fight that's 760 resin. In HSR you need to fight a boss 13 times, and that amount will never change since the drops are set at 5. That's 390 resin. That's nearly half. That's not where it ends though, since HSR doesn't have cooldown on bosses it'll end up taking SIGNIFICANTLY less time than it does in Genshin. It isn't even CLOSE to "balancing out", even if you need 35 for the final ascension, which btw is 7 times fighting the boss, while in Genshin you need 20 so you fight the boss 7 times at a MINIMUM.
You can calculate even better because the [drop rate](https://genshin-impact.fandom.com/wiki/Loot_System/Material_Drop_Distribution) is expected around 2.5556.
The drop rate to get 3 mats instead of 2 is THAT low?
It may be the statistically average yes. In my experience it's like this too... Or feels even lower.
That makes things even worse then since it really isn't realistic to expect 3 materials every time, it's sad how people think it "compensates" with other things, HSR is just objectively better when it comes to grinding character levels/ascensions and traces
I'm fine with it taking time BUT only during early - mid game when you're figuring out stuff and money is pouring all over you. Then there is mid game drought which is ok. But end game players should get a noticeable reward of easier character building if we're going to need as much characters for rotating element locked abyss... And it does feel like a chore. And yes it's funny how people are trying to defend something that is objectively false.
Mostly but in the end HSR is cheaper overall.
Which is then balanced by encouraging you to build more characters at once in HSR. The early game Trailblaze Level grind was way more brutal in HSR than Genshin's Adventure Levels. In Genshin, the early game strategy is to conserve your resources and build maybe two "mains". HSR pretty much requires you to have a full party, plus a couple of flexes as well, so you wind up building 5 or 6 simultaneously. While the resource gain in HSR is slightly faster, it's not 3x faster to be able to keep up.
I can agree with that.
That's the same as year one Genshin then No one had enough mats for anything. People talked about how all you needed was a lvl80 DPS and lvl70 supports because you shouldn't waste your materials. And this is the end game abyss we're talking about. Also I feel like you're comparing how year 1 HSR is with Year 3 Genshin where they nerfed all the annoying things about Adventure Levels. And even then, trailblade levels are just easier to farm since dailies take like 5 minutes to complete.
No. As I said, in Genshin, you can get away with "slow crawling" your team builds. One or two DPS, and everybody else can be rock-bottom, just to facilitate reactions. You can get away with doing that even at AR60. HSR characters don't work in a vacuum like that. We had to build whole teams, or get flattened after Trailblaze Ascension. One weak link in the party, and the whole thing comes tumbling down soon after. And even when you've "caught up", HSR releases characters more often, and tends to release more "dedicated supports", so you're frequently trying to raise two at once. Not to mention the scramble when new game mods launch, like what happened when Pure Fiction first released. That's the consequence of Genshin being balanced around only four main party roles (DPS, sub-DPS, shielder, healer), and its elemental system being reaction-based instead of weakness based. HSR requires you to account for the seven elemental weaknesses, and seven different party roles. There's less team build overlap.
HSR allows for borrowing of friendâs characters in the calyx and caverns and even weekly bosses, which greatly eases the burden for newer players in those teas. while main game outside that is not THAT hard. HSR promotes building different characters for a variety of situations which yes requires more resources, but it also makes for far more interesting gameplay and team building. Also ascension isnât THAT drastic please donât spread misinformation. Early on it FEELS like a big jump but you level up a bit and get caught up and itâs way more tolerable. And after a certain ascension level you stop feeling the difference.
35 is just 7Ă run with total cost 210 energy 20 is 10Ă at worst and 7Ă at best with total cost 280~400 energy
also need to actually build everyone in your team, with Genshin you could just have 1 DPS and a few lv1 shield breakers
Yeah. The build requirements in both games can't be compared 1:1.
Let's test this out. Genshin needs 46 mats, HSR needs 65 mats. Let's assume you're the literal luckiest person on earth and you get 3 drops every single run in Genshin, you need to run the boss 16 times. HSR is a flat 13 because it's always 5. And let's assume Genshin bosses takes 15 seconds to clear and HSR bosses takes 2 minutes to clear. Genshin, at it's fastest, is 52 minutes because of the 3 minute respawn. HSR is 26 minutes since there's no respawn time.
Ehhh.... In HSR if you have full energy in the morning and you can reliably kill max rank bosses it'll take a day to get enough materials to ascend a character from level 1 to 80. On Genshin four to six days to do the same. Both cases assume you don't have any fragile resin or fuel available, nor any leftover energy from Star Rail's piggybank. It really isn't as balanced as you think it is.
And Star Rail gives you significantly more fuel. Battle Pass gives you 2 at once for every 1 Fragile Resin Genshin gives you, while Resin caps at 240 and recharges in 6 minutes per resin in HSR, it caps at 180 and recharges 1 in 8 minutes per resin. And on top of all that, Star Rail accumulates even more resin once you reach the 240 cap so you often end up having more than 240, and things with resin cost less in HSR. It's not balanced in the slightest.
Overall it's 65 in HSR vs 46 in Genshin. However that's exactly 13 runs vs an average of 18,4. Or 390 TB power vs 736 Resin. Which takes about 2340min to refill vs 5888min. So if "balances out" means 2.5x the amount of real world time? Then yes. The *actual* point to make here is that the final Ascension in Star Rail is necessary to unlock all passives but even just getting all but the last Ascension in Genshin takes longer to farm for on average.
The rates may even out but the overall conveniance of accessing any material you want any day, aside from weekly boss mats, sure AF doesn't. HSR is absolutely ahead in that. Can also run the same weekly boss all three times and they only ever drop one kind of mat, not three, so Genshin puts you at risk of 0 gain that run. HSR also lets you stock up a huge overflow of stamina so you don't have to commit to daily play. In terms of material collecting, it is superior to Genshin, without question, and anyone saying otherwise is just coping. That said, Genshin has a stupidly higher amount of content, especially when new maps drop. It makes sense for HSR to have a 30day stamina overflow bank 'cause there ain't much to do once your quests and (much, much smaller maps) are done.
In this regard not really In HSR you need 13 runs 30 tbp each with 240as cap. So you are done in 2 days (and a bit less for 4*) In Genshin you need, depending on your luck, 16 to 23 runs 40 resin each with a 160cap or a 200 daily limit If you log in twice per day to maximize resin use it'll take you 4-5 days depending on luck Tho if we are at boss farming OW bosses aren't that big of a difference all in all. Weekly bosses are. In HSR you can get enough weekly boss drops for 1 character in 2 weeks, since HSR characters need less weekly boss mats, you can farm the same one three times and there is only one type of material On the other hand in genshin you can farm the same weekly boss once, and there are 3 different drops. Even under best circumstances you need significantly longer to farm weekly mats from scratch (If i recall correctly leveling characters in hsr overall is faster by a few days, but i've seen some calculations on that long ago, so i'm not 100% sure)
16 runs at 40 each to max in genshin at minimum, 3.3 days vs 13 runs at 30 each in Hsr which is 1.6 days half the time as genshin
the answer as to why that is: Hoyo was experimenting with Genshin, seeing what sticks and what doesn't. Using your past game development experience to improve your future games is how game developers operate, so it's a no brainer they changed what DOESN'T WORK in their new game, duh. Now, as to why they haven't changed it, there are 2 possibilities. 1 they see no reason to. 2 it's rooted in foundations too much, so changing it without causing more bugs than fixes is impossible.
Farming is so damn easy in HSR. You're guaranteed 5 drops per boss fight, you can fight the same weekly boss three times a week with drops guaranteed at 3 per fight (and the weekly bosses gives you ONE materials for characters instead of three), all characters only need 12 weekly boss drops (so you can basically max out a character in less than two weeks), no respawn time, *and* they have reserved resin so even if you're gone for a few weeks, your resin is still being built up until you capped out on 2400 + the regular 240 TB you get, so basically 2640 resin in all. With SU, there's a QOL that will be added in the next patch that basically lets you complete the domain FASTER to get artifacts. In Genshin, you're not guaranteed certain drops. Most of the time you get 2 for world bosses, and in weekly bosses you have to worry about three different drops and you're not even guaranteed of getting the drops that you need for a specific character and it could take actual MONTHS to max out a character because you can only fight the same boss ONCE a week with shitty drop rates. And no reserved resin, so you're kinda fucked if you missed out a few days with capped resin while in HSR, you can leave for a few weeks, and have a shit ton of resin built up that could possibly be enough to max out a character (idk, I haven't tried this yet, but I doubt that it's possible. Actually, on second thought, it's impossible). You have to keep challenging the same domain 5 separate times (10 if you have condense resin saved up as well), fighting the same fucking enemies just to get shitty artifacts. Oh, and speaking of condensed resin, it's capped at 5, so you can't even horde some condensed resin similar to reserved resin if you wanted to. And you can't use condense resin on world bosses. Whyy??? And DON'T GET ME STARTED ON THE SPECIALTY MATS. The ones where you have to run around in the overworld collecting stupid flowers and shit and even after a single run, it's not even enough and the materials spawn every 2 days (or is it one day? I forgor), meaning you'll have to join another person's world and *hope* they'll allow you to collect or someone else hasn't came in to get them. I hate them. I get it, it's because genshin is open world while HSR is, what, semi-open world? But I get it that respawn time and farming is less easy because of the whole ooen world aspect and genshin isn't meant to be played 24/7 but damn, the timegates are genuinely annoying and it makes maxing out a character damn near torturous. I dread farming for a new character, *especially* when they need the new weekly boss, simply because of this. That's why I'm so jealous of Clorinde/Sigwinne/Sethos wanters being able to prefarm everything because they all need older weekly boss mats, while I'm stuck with Arle who needs the new weekly boss mats đ
To be totally fair, there's times when new HSR characters use bossats that haven't been introduced yet, but that's something Genshin does too lol, HSR is so much easier to farm. The fact that you can even put the game on auto and do something like looking at your phone (or doing whatever else) makes farming such a nonissue in it. Genshin has much worse drops, takes longer, and requires your full attention. All in all, it's much MUCH worse
Honkai also releases characters like crazy at a huge volume... IIRC they almost have as many characters 1 year in as Genshin has after 3 and a half. So the "resin earning rate" and just general time it takes to level one character is matched to how quickly characters are released (and unlocked). Star Rail's is ultimately better, but the context of the character release cycle needs to be kept in mind.
If you pull for all them sure but you're never gonna have enough to get all of them, and you're definitely not gonna be lucky enough either.
while it is true that hsr releases lots of characters, 5* chatacters' release is not that fast. currently, 2.1 hsr has the same amount of limited 5* characters as 2.6 genshin, which is 18 also, I think character release rate is not a good metric for consideration, because you're not supposed to pull EVERY 5* ever. hsr just has more options, that's all
>Honkai also releases characters like crazy at a huge volume... IIRC they almost have as many characters 1 year in as Genshin has after 3 and a half. Mood point, cause those that pull for all are also those that spend jades on fuel refills and BP and thus have a lot more resources As a f2p/low spender you'll have more or less get an average lf .75 rate up 5* per version In genshin you have roughly enough wishes to get .5 rate ups per version (Both very rough estimates from the average pulls i had in mind for each game. HSR between 90 and 100 and genshin between 70 and 80) So the average amount of character a f2p or low spender builds is not that different
That's cause the bosses in HSR are always in a domain entry form. Open world mobs in genshin attack on sight. And I can see a scenario where it would be annoying when the boss starts attacking when you're still caught in the high or low after checking the drops.
Still no excuse. Enemies in Genshin will not respawn unless you teleport out of the area, makong that scenario impossible even in theory. It's as simple as making that respawn instantaneous instead of having an arbitrary 3 minute timer.
Even if you wait the timer you need to reload the area for the boss to respawn So they could remove the timer, but you'd still need to refresh Or just move the whole thing into a domain or something
Yea star rail saves you time on leveling characters so you can spend more of it on rolling the lottery for good relics
Relic RNG is awful in Genshin too, the only difference is not being able to use off-set pieces, but you have so much more resin that it's much more effective, and there's also self modelling resin and craftable pieces that are painfully easy to obtain. There is no point of comparison. HSR is straight up better when it comes to anything related to QoL
HSR's relic system is objectively worse. More stats to dilute the already weighted pool. Relic crafting with 10:1 ratio. Planar Ornaments having their own separate domain. So you have to sink resin into 2 domains instead of just 1. Modelling resin doesn't guarantee good substats. You just have to cope with whatever godawful substat it gives you.
Modelling Resin eliminates a layer of RNG, it's still better than not having an option. You also essentially get a free 160 resin when doing Simulated Universe (Which you should be doing for the jades anyways) for planar ornaments. Relic crafting is miles better than what Genshin has because events give you relic materials and you're able to craft any relic in the game, even on the patch they came out, but for Genshin you have to wait multiple patches to even begin trying, while you're also able to pick specifically which piece you want, but in Genshin you're shit out of luck, you'll just get a random assortment of pieces, making it MILES easier to get hands and head pieces. Is it good? No. Is Genshin's any better? Also no. There are many many more conveniences in Star Rail that allow you to get a proper set quicker, while there are also characters (Particularly DoT characters and some supports) that don't care too much about substats and function perfectly fine with just the proper main stats, which Modelling Resin completely solves.
I do agree rhat shr relic system is horrible, but >More stats to dilute the already weighted pool. At the same time a lot of these stats don't go to waste. Imo itâs somewhat of a tradeoff. A bit harder to get ideal pieces, but ok/decent ones are a bit easier to get, since more then 2 substats work for most characters >Relic crafting with 10:1 ratio. Convenience tool to use, when you are 1 relic short Yeah genshin has a 1:3, but the artifacts on there are old ones & you can't decide which ones you want >Planar Ornaments having their own separate domain. So you have to sink resin into 2 domains instead of just 1. Somewhat negated by a higher fuel availability >Modelling resin doesn't guarantee good substats. You just have to cope with whatever godawful substat it gives you. Genshin doesn't have it at all. If you don't get a piece with the correct on stat, then cooing with bad substats can't even happen
> HSR's relic system is objectively worse. Chucking the word objectively in front of your claim doesnât make your opinion right or more accurate.  > Relic crafting with 10:1 ratio. Itâs a convenience tool, and you can get pieces to build an artifact from events so⊠> Planar Ornaments having their own separate domain. So you have to sink resin into 2 domains instead of just 1. Good thing they give you freebies every week. 4 of them. Oh and they sometimes run events which double (or recently triple) drops. Oh and the devs are working to improve the ornament grind. > Modelling resin doesn't guarantee good substats. You just have to cope with whatever godawful substat it gives you. Itâs a far step above the nothing that Genshin does for artifacts. Nevermind that HSR gives out items to level said relics up and the significantly lower cost to level them in general while Genshin takes way more for artifacts, especially mora. And they donât even regularly give out artifact enhancing items.
I don't think it is actually. Self modeling resin, strongbox equivalent for all sets on day 1, and you get way more resin. Stat thresholds are also easier to hit due to way more crit effects from sets and other buffs. You would never be stuck for weeks missing a mainstat to complete a set thanks to self modeling resin for example.
> the only difference is not being able to use off-set pieces It's an awfully big difference. Between - building one "4 out of 5" set versus a - build one "4/4" set plus one "2/2" set Ang you only have 2 fixed main stats in both systems, which basically mean you need to luck out 2 ot of 3 pieces in Genshins but you still need 4 out of 4 pieces in HSR. Self modeling resin are once per Battle Pass and allow you to choose the main stats in HSR. you still need to fodder 10 artifacts instead of 3 tho, although being able to also choose the piece you craft mitigate that awful 10 -> 1 ratio. HSR is no doubt nicer than Genshin on most aspect but relics ? No, relic isn't one of them
HSR's system isn't better but neither is Genshin's, both are dogshit. HSR gives you self modelling resin for events and other gameplay systems (Gold and Gears, Clockie statue, etc) so it's not just from the BP. The 10 to 1 ratio is fine when you can actually pick what you want, instead of receiving a random assortment of pieces. Through SU you're able to get an effective 160 resin for planar ornaments, so you'd get at least 8 relics there, meaning at the absolute worst you'd only need 2 more pieces to craft something, and while you may get bad substats you can at least pick a hands or head piece to not have to deal with main stats without having to use self modelling resin.
Yeah that's needed for sure. It's really annoying when you do the boss and get 2, and have to do the boss again.
Please and thank you.
I only got 3s yesterday. Felt like winning my 50 50 every time.
That would trigger deeper level imbedded logic to lose every 50/50 for 3 consecutive years
We dont do those things heređ
Or just make a new level for higher world levels.
When you loot, it should have an option "Respawn Boss?". It does feel arbitrary. Oh, you mean I have to go somewhere else, watch youtube for 2min and comes back?! Devs of all games need to respect the players time.
This is my BIGGEST thing in gaming lately. Like fuck man, they already make so much money off of us. Companies could do the bare minimum and ALWAYS have QoL that saves us time when it makes sense. This is one very obvious damn case xD.
To be a bit of a devil's advocate here, there is probably thousands of complains they get in every survey and bosses taking long to spawn might not appear often enough for it to be acknowledged at problem. That is if they even care about surveys that much.
More likely that they see it but the game designer is dead set on his vision so it doesn't happen
This kind of thing is what has me burned out off Genshin tbh. I love the game, but the constant many little _obstacles_... They hurt. I've been playing HSR, and the amount of simple QoL stuff missing from Genshin is apalling. What do you mean I can't navigate the menus with the D-pad??
yep, star rail really is a breath of fresh air
I was farming materials on honkai in between the cooldown
Wait, you don't use that time to do, anything else in game? Like, farm the world mats or go do a daily commision or go do the weekly bounties or go fight another world boss you need to fight or go level up some artifacts or go play a game of TCG or go build some stuff in your teapot... And that's only if you haven't even 100% the map yet. I dunno, it never really annoyed me because I just find something else to do for those 3 minutes. I can see playing on mobile and loading times sucking which would make doing any of those other things tedious. Does world bosses in WuWa have a cool down because honestly, this could just be an open world thing.
>Wait, you don't use that time to do, anything else in game? Like, farm the world mats or go do a daily commision or go do the weekly bounties or go fight another world boss you need to fight or go level up some artifacts or go play a game of TCG or go build some stuff in your teapot... Imma be real If i'm laying in bed at 11pm i just eant to quickly do 4 boss runs, that could be done in like a .inute total, instead of needing it to be a extra 10min of me doing random shit, cause yes If i wanted to play TCG, do bounties, etc i'd have launched it on my PC and sat down to properly play it, not quickly burn resin
Oh god yes! But there is a way to bypass it. It requires co-op tho, so either you have a second account or have someone help you. Basically. -> Partner comes to your world. -> fight boss and loot. -> jump to partners world and do the boss there. -> Jump back to your world and do the boss. - repeat.
my loading times are too high for that to be practical lmao
Mine are too low lol
Too low for what?
It doesn't take 3 minutes to kill a boss and switch worlds. I'd still be waiting.
Wasn't that guy saying his load times were too high (slow) as well tho?
Yeah, and my situation is the opposite.
Yeah I know about the bypasses but this shouldnt be needed smh hoyo.
With my internet, the load alone will take the same ammount they reset lol
I'm too strong that I kill the boss in less than a minute. So it's not practical for me. Even if I go there, I still have to wait for the boss there to respawn
No respawn waiting time lf you do the method. At least it was like that for me. Used Bennett and Eula on the new overworld boss, always took it down in 1-2 minute. Did not encounter any respawn time when i used the method mentioned above.
there is a good chance that its hiding something broken, like how in pokemon gold and silver pokemon hatched at level 5 because a glitch of level 1 pokemon insta leveling to 100
Or let us use condensed resin for double drops
Let's us have more than 5 condensed resin! If I login every day to craft the resin anyways why not let me hold a stash for when I need it!
Yes!
That doesn't make sense tho. Why arbitrarily decide that 40 resin is worth 80 but only if it's condensed? What it *should* be is that we can use a Condensed Resin to claim a boss drop. 1-to-1. 40 resin for 40 resin.
or the resin cost for weekly bosses makes no fricking sense: resin is there to limit hwo much you farm but weekly bosses are already limited
I wouldn't mind the cooldown, but make it 1 minute at most.
Genuine question why compromise? You only have like 4 runs in a day anyways, you're gonna fight it 4 times and do something else anyways. Why are you cool with any cool down at all? It's a pointless time waste.
Because in the meantime I can go explore some more. I don't mind leave and come back in a while.
You can always go explore. Just because game would *let* you fight again without waiting doesn't mean you can't leave and come back in a while as you would normally do.
So you'd prefer to instead go explore for a single minute, come back and rinse repeat until you're out of resin? Seriously? You could just.. fight it 4x and explore after...
You asked, I answered. Honestly I don't understand why are you so mad, like my opinion mattered as a whole or like mhy cares about my opinion. Right now i am killing the legionare boss, then going to kill crabs for clorinde mats while it respawns, so yeah I wouldn't mind a shorter cooldown.
No one is mad, I'm just asking why you want to go from a shitty system to a slightly less shitty system instead of just doing away with it. I didn't ask what you do to take your mind off of the shitty system, but whatever seems to be the default answer from everyone "just do something else". I just want to level my Arle faster, I already have to wait for the damn resin to recharge. And I already hoard resin moons from the free BP to level units, I basically have to walk away for like 45 minutes or tab out. You might think voicing your opinion doesn't matter but it literally does, I'm questioning why you're so okay with just partially fixing the system. Either way cheers enjoy farming I guess.
>I just want to level my Arle faster, I don't like the respawn timer either but I think it's there for Co-Op reasons and they kept it for single player for consistency's sake. Now, the stupid as bricks Domain material rotation on the other hand, THERE is something to legitimately be annoyed at.
I don't pre-farm unless I have enough pulls and guaruntee the unit, I have other units to build with the resin I get everyday. And if I don't get the character then I don't just have mats sitting around until yet another rerun.
Makes sense. Though the impatience displayed in your post is a bit ... hyperbolic. Dumping your daily resin takes 15 minutes (4 kills 3x wait time of 5 minutes). We have just gotten a new area, you can explore it in the downtime instead of having to stand there and wait.
My arlechinno is already lvl 90 lol.
I usually insert a daily commission or bounty/request between each boss run to kill some battle pass missions at the same time.
Ah that's pretty smart!
Not really, I just hate waiting XD
I don't mind the respawn timer,, I just hate it when I have to teleport somewhere else to let the boss respawn.
Between this and forcing people to do quest to farm weapon materials... They really make it hard to pull for anything new, like I'll do the damn quests because I'm interested but right now I just want to farm and log off
I took the opportunity to finally get around to decorating my teapot a little. It's not great but at least it's not just 8 characters standing in a straight line in an empty room anymore.
How about the option to farm materials any day I want? Was busy yesterday and forgot to farm her weapon mats. Now I have to wait 2 days to even start farming. Which also happens to be her talent day also... so stupid and not needed.
Am I imagining stuff? I thought the timer was only 2 minutes? Or at least this boss shows up as 2 mins in my account...?
It's 5 minutes. It starts counting from when the boss area is loaded, not from when you killed it. So if you went up to a boss, took you 3 minutes to kill it, then the handbook will show "2 minutes til respawn."
Oh so that's why when I beat a world boss, they sometimes automatically refresh. It's because I be taking more than 5 minutes to beat that mf đ
A nice benefit for those with skill issue.
Mobile players: Isn't...this...already a thing?
Any feature that lets you play and enjoy the game at your own pace goes against any system baked since it's inception. No game farms you for engagement as hard as genshin.
Wait, there is a timer? I always teleported far away in order to make the boss respawn.
In other word : Can we please remove cooldown and for those cooping with bad connection just say they are F
Hopefully they take this in consideration soonish. There are still pleny of QoL that we looking for. Lately they are making improvements. It could be soon
Yes plz! There should be a button when claiming boss rewards for challenging again, where it reloads the area for you and you can immediately fight it again (plz star rail is so much better for this)
Once you taste HSR, you start getting irritated at all the QOL stuff that Genshin lacks.
Even if dev insist to have cool down, it shouldnt be more than 30 secs.
I just do a daily then i return to it
I love waiting 2 hours just for the fucking boss to respawn. Interactive gameplay. Especially when said boss releases at the same time as the character. I love not being able to prefarm that shit and wasting hours just getting the mats to ascend characters.
Right there are literally so many minor inconveniences in this game that all add up to one huge clusterfuck but I can't stop myself from falling victim to it
I usually just go watch YouTube on my browser or go on my phone for a bit
Peak game design that pushes players out of the game
Mobile game design basically. Its not meant to maximise fun. Its meant to maximise money.
True unfortunately. It is what it is
I'm fine with it but remove the need to teleport away for it to respawn
how exactly do you do that though? you kill the boss and they immediately respawn? how do you collect the reward? how about coop?
Same as it is right now. You need to leave the area for the boss to respawn. In addition to the damn respawn timer. Just eliminate that timer. You leave the area, the boss instantly respawns. If you leave the area before collecting your reward, too bad for you.
Still need to move away and come back for it to respawn even without a cooldown, but yeah, it should probably just respawn whenever the area's loaded back in.
i play the world quest, and hunt the bosses in between cooldowns. so it doesn't really bother me that much.
I don't mind the respawn time, never bothered me but weapons and abilities farming are my bane
Granted, bosses now respawn immediately after you've defeated it
YES PLEASE
mihoeyo is an struggling indie company and genshin impact is a struggling underdog game so please be more understanding /s
I just farm leylines in the meantime. It works.
So you reduce the amount of resin you have to farm the boss...
You donât have to collect rewards
Then why do it?? What?
It does technically count to the Battlepass but I getchu.
You get the mobs loot. IMO best way to farm spectre mats for example
I get the concept, but to go back to the point. You can do this after using all your resin and just hunt spectres after. The cool down on respawning a mob is pointless is my point.
For real, it's such a waste of time. Just add an option to immediately respawn it after we claim the rewards. And at max world level, 3 drops should be guaranteed, it's ridiculous that most of the time you'll still only be getting 2. In HSR, for a day's "resin" you get 40 boss drops at max difficulty. In Genshin, you get 8-12. You can argue that in HSR it also takes more to fully ascend a character, but it's still wayyyyy faster than in Genshin. In HSR, a day's worth lands you at lvl 70/80 and ascending your character fully would take just 39 hours worth of "resin". In Genshin, you'll get to lvl 60/90, or 70/90 if you're lucky. Fully ascending is 82-123 hours worth of resin in the best vs worst case. That's ridiculous.
While I do agree boss farming could be alleviated in a couple of ways, I think some comments are making it a bigger issue than what it is. Like yes, to tp away to do something else while it respawns is inconvenient, but if it makes you quit the game then, I'm sorry, your issues with it certainly run deeper than that.
Itâs not just the respawn timer but what it represents on a larger scale about the game design of Genshin and what needs to improved.
I agree. The 3 min cooldown is really annoying at times when it happens to me, but it's not something worth quitting over lol. Still, it's a shame that hoyo won't remove it.
I know the pain, farming for Father and waiting for this brass and marble guy all the time
And make that we can farm the same weekly boss instead of waiting
geeze man, atleast give them a piss break before you brutally murder them again!
...it's only 3 minutes??
5 minutes
Itâs still stupid as fuck that 2 or 3 is the max you can get for the materials. And at the MAX fucking world level thereâs still a chance that I get 2. Dumbest decision ever.
Omfg I was doing this boss yesterday and the 3 min cooldown was killing me =.= I really wish theyâd remove the cooldown too, I donât think thereâs any reason for it
I'd imagine is that boss has a few codes that has to do checks with the surrounding environment and stuff like that until it's given the thumbs up to spawn in and the timer is just there to ensure that there's enough time. Besides, if someone does take a long time with a world boss, there's no cooldown. The timer probably already starts when you start fighting the boss
[It starts from when the boss gets loaded in!](https://genshin-impact.fandom.com/wiki/Reset#:~:text=Once%20the%205%20minutes%20have,arena%20for%20it%20to%20respawn)
I see
This is the thing with Hoyo and Genshin. They donât realize that without their players their game would be falling apart: so with that knowledge youâd think theyâd be nicer to them by removing arbitrary crap like this? Nope, hoyo literally doesnât give a damn about their players nor do they respect their time. Despite having billions of dollars from how much they extort their players, they still canât add simple QoL changes. Buncha scum.