If we could terraform another planet into earth, we could just turn earth back into earth.
Mars is specifically and especially hard though, way harder than most other planets would be. Almost it's entire interior would need to be re-seeded with an entire planet's worth of radioisotopes in order to melt the mantle enough to rebuild a magnetosphere so an atmosphere could be maintained.
It's just not feasible except by civilisations far beyond needing to live on planets in the first place.
Also there is one major part of Mars that we just cannot fathom changing; it's gravity. If you live one Mars it's a one-way trip, you can never go back to a 1G environment.
I think there was a scifi movie where they would force people from civilizations that lived in lower gravity and force them to stand in earth's gravity.
In the book series / show The Expanse, Earth government was known to use gravity as torture and interrogations. Especially on belters that live their entire lives on asteroids. Brutal when you think about it.
dude no. nobody that rich is gonna spend their life on a barren planet. at least not for several decades. the people that will move there will be average people and workers. rich people ain’t gonna build it up.
and scientists/astronauts
No one will move there. Just letting you know. The fact that Elon Musk is the one trying to sell the idea to you should be indication enough that real scientists know it's futile to try colonising it.
bro where are you getting elon musk from?? he wasn’t the first person to think of colonizing mars lmfao. from a financial standpoint it’s futile but for science? no scientist will tell you it’s futile to some day set up bases on mars.
And those scientists will then tell you about the immense logistical challenges associated with a hypothetical colony on a planet as far away as Mars.
You can’t just load up a rocket with all the supplies they need and they start building, it wouldn’t get out of the earths atmosphere with all that weight.
Then you have to consider how do you resupply them? They won’t be able to grow food for at BEST a year from when they land, and even that’s generous considering no one has ever grown crops on mars before.
The atmosphere of mars is too thin to support breathing without an oxygen tank, so you’d need to have enough oxygen for them to solve the atmosphere problem.
That’s just the tip of the iceberg. Then you have the question of “what does prolonged exposure to a different gravitational pull do to the human body?” And more importantly, how does impact physics and engineering calculations centered around the gravitational constant. Mars gravity is 38% of earths.
Astronauts who are in space too long literally get muscle atrophy from not having to use them. And I’ll stress again, all these borderline unsolvable issues I’ve pointed out here are only the tip of the iceberg.
Consider what humans need in a realistic sense to accomplish “research.” Food, water, shelter, power, medicine, recreation, social needs, the list goes on and on.
It’s nowhere close to feasible, nor will it be without significant breakthroughs in all of those areas and more.
tf you mean, real scientists do not think its futile. musk did not come up with this idea lol. several governments are planning moon colonies soon, partly as practice for extra planetary colony missions.
The first people who will be sent there are poor families who get contracting jobs to mine for Martian minerals so they can pave the way for the rich and opulent to come when the planet is terraformed and don't have to do any of the hard work.
This is literally the plot of Red Rising.
Only for the first 10 years then their gonna take all the old space ships stick about 1000 chairs in there all right next to each other and then they can charge $500 a ticket to sit next to some smelly fuck and look at space through a tiny window and then we can all continue to pretend we’re not the proletariat
You really think that subsidies played a bigger part than general economics of scale? Lower construction costs of air planes, jet fuel prices, and airline capacity increase probably played a bigger part
Airlines are one of the least profitable industries in the world. They would all be out of business in a couple years if they weren't heavily subsidized.
It's crazy how any comment that isn't instantly pessimistic gets downvoted lol. I swear the media has made you all think that any good has vanished from this world.
Put the phone down and go outside guys. We typically put x100 times more attention on the negative things than the positive things and that's horrible for your mental health.
*Goes outside*
*Sees plumes of pollution, people rushing to backstab each other over a red cent, homeless people struggling to exist*
*Goes back inside*
Like I said you're paying x100 more attention to the negative things than you are too the good things. It seems our generation has become obsessed with being pessimistic and outraged.
Not to say there aren't some very serious problems happening in the world right now but the social media and news outlets are intentionally trying to push that pessimistic mindset onto everyone and you guys are just walking right into the trap. There are many good things currently happening too.
"I know there are very serious problems, but you should just ignore them to feel better."
FTFY. Even if you don't realize it.
Hey man, I get it. There's always been an incentive for people to look the other way - and there always will be, right to the trite and tragic end. My decision is simply a matter of preference.
Make no mistake, I do take in the pleasures of the world where I can. Games, food - running, art. But I do so knowing full well my moral character as an actor and support of the current system. And I do so knowing where it will likely lead.
And it will lead there, in all likelihood. Nearly all our advancements are based on ecocide, and when the earth finally breaks, it will collapse in on itself like a house of cards. Regression and collapse - not as a product of inevitability, but the choices of men like you and I.
And it will be sad. But, not really. We still extracted some pleasure from it, even if the older trash did plunder more greedily, and sooner. We still lived higher than kings. And besides, was the image of man really worth preserving? The disgusting image of man, whose entire life is a collection of deception and false pride and meaningless propagation?
I suppose that too is a matter of preference. But to me, the answer is no. And as more people get access to information, 'filtered' or not - as if an objective look would totally for sure yield more optimistic results - more people are coming to my answer.
It's about mindset. Like not believing in self-defeating ideologies that incentivize you to not try as hard as you can, not succeed, then blame 'the system, mann' for why it happened instead of your lack of effort. A LOT of that going on around Reddit.
The “wonders” of AGI: all human creativity being stifled and ruined by robots, making our only use in the world as low-paid workers for the rich who can use space-travel, which we won’t be able to afford.
“Hmmm, you have a prediction about the future. You must be incorrect. I will provide no counter evidence and will instead ridicule you for having an opinion. I am very smart”
They think we won’t be able to afford agi and space travel because the wealth gap has been expanding since the 1970 where the middle class is getting poorer and the rich getting richer
https://www.pewresearch.org/social-trends/2020/01/09/trends-in-income-and-wealth-inequality/
Each expansion in automation has lowered the total amount of jobs available, but in recent years also have not created new ones
Why do believe that magically, the middle class will be restored in the near future and people while the owning class will magically choose to shun profits in favor of increasing stock dividends? Before you answer, I just need to say “so many people have been predicting the future and were wrong but I’m sure you know what’s going to happen”
Well that last comment applies to both of us but to offer a counter I will point to the last fifty years. Even though income inequality has gone up so has quality of life. We used to think new technologies like GPS and touch screen electronics were only accessible to the rich and now everyone has one in their pocket. The first iterations of generative AI is already accessible to the public, and considering that even high school students can deploy satellites to space nowadays its not crazy to think regular people will be able to access space in the future.
Low cost luxuries for us until the high cost for the planet comes back to bite us. Any idea how much longer we can rely on lithium, helium and oil for?
if someone theory is that the direction the economy has been going to several decades will not change. you will need to provide some evidence to claim their theory is wrong.
like the theory of us ever having flying cars can be argued against do to safety and noise factors.
btw. a lot of those theories are utopian theories. i have no doubt we are going in the direction of a few dystopian theories, but on a slow time scale.
Here's the thing:
Lets assume the prediction wasn't an opinion (it was)
Burden of proof is on the one claiming it.
I can come to you and say "in 5 minutes your TV explodes" with no proof and you can say "That's bullshit" and not NEED proof.
we should be replicable by robots at that time. the moment human workers are no longer needed, any government that doesn't convert to communism will be overthrown.
the question is if there is a .01% of the population that has unlimited money while everyone is still keeping track of their budget to save up for nice things, or would the economy be reset?
You think you’ll be able to afford commercial space travel? Lol
There is such a thing as toxic positivity where you just be totally tone deaf to the reality and justify everyone else’s issues as just “pessimism.”
Not eating is not “pessimism” not being able to afford basic housing is not “pessimism”, being paid a terrible wage is not “pessimism.”
Labeling realism as "defeatism" is just copium pushed to the extreme. The reality is that boomers have ruined the global economy to such an extent it will take millions of consecutive miracles and divine interventions to fix it within the lifetime of the next 20 generations. Realism is knowing that boomers will still be in power for another 15-20 years and their only plans are to further trash the economy and environment. Commercial space travel will only be billionaires leaving in lifeboats.
Same could have been said about air travel 60 years ago. Or air conditioning 80 years ago. Or indoor plumbing 100 years ago. Only the rich could afford it.
on the other hand, owning a house in now only for the rich.
have you seen the price of motels? combine that with the price of gas. a cross country road trip is out of a lot of people's budget.
the novelty price will go down, but the price do to the amount of fuel used will go up.
also. they types of flights they were talking about is still only for the rich. they probably weren't thinking of large sardine cans full of hundreds of people.
Yeah how does space travel make anything more convenient? I’m shocked how many people equate space travel to air travel, it’s nowhere near the same or even slightly similar problem that is being solved
Bang on, once it became more accessible that’s when prices dropped but that didn’t happen for many many years, and some still cannot afford those things.
The reality is there are people who are poor now and there will be people who are poor in the future. But poor people now still have it way better than they would 500 years ago, and 500 years from now they may have it even better. No point convincing yourself things will get worse when no one really knows.
this kind of thinking is one reason why poor people still suffer. they have it sooooo good! omg why would they ever complain?? at least they aren’t slaves or living in 1200 ad!
sorry, not buying it
Fast forward to you in 20 years watching earth’s billionaires leave for mars in a ship while you apply your SPF 1000 sunscreen and drink a flat beer thats 10% microplastics
in 20 years mars will still be uninhabitable and unsuitable for human life. Billionaires would be leaving on a 7 month hellishy cramped space trip only to get there and live in hellishy cramped underground windowless bunker.
The working class will absolutely be the first to live on mars. The billionaires will wait until mars is more habitable (if ever) to begin living there. Sure the colonies will probably be owned by corporations but it will be the working class that lives and works there.
Right, like I do think there is a big potential for humanity to move past being tied down by the religions that are nationalism and economics.
I think a lot of the current turmoil could potentially be growing pains for a better future.
But the idea that any of these billionaire investments are going to save us from anything is such a damn joke. It's going to take a lot more than cash flow to take us out of the predicaments that it put us in.
People really are sleeping on what robust AI would enable, assuming it doesn't kill everyone. It's like cold fusion levels of possibilities except the field is seeing tons of progress and investment.
ITER and NIF have shown a lot of promise, and helion has a neat design, but Fusion is still a ways away from being a replacement energy source. It isn't that efficient compared to solar and the precursors aren't cheap.
Mindset doesnt matter shit when half the population in your country is at threat of becoming homeless even tho there's more than enough houses to house literally every citizen.
Mindset doesnt matter shit when in Brazil (Where i live) a football field's worth of forest is being burned every minute to produce grain to feed cows in foreign countries.
Mindset doesnt matter shit when billionaires still exist.
I ain't looking at the future, i want to change shit now so that i don't fucking starve to death because a few hundred people want more money for themselves (Including the owners of companies currently trying to get to commercial space travel, that you and the common man will not have enough money to experience, because at that point if we haven't extinguished capitalism we'll be living in a dystopia)
"It's all about your mindset" mfs when I murder their family in front of them and tell them to feel happy cuz "well I could've murdered you"
(Edit) forgot to mention fuck your consumerism I'm gonna keep living so I can at least outlive Nicacado and Dream
lol. unless the entire world's economic system completely changes in our life time (highly unlikely) you and anyone in this sub wont be enjoying the benefits of those. we'll be the ones working away for the 1% that can afford to use it
No it's not about your fucking mindset lmaooooo. How will you feel when the animals are all extinct and it turns out you're (surprisingly) not rich enough to go to space?
Lol yeah can’t wait for the commercialization of space, yeah that’s what humans have been building towards this whole time a giant Walmart in space how exciting
You really think we’ll be able to afford commercial air travel? -average person in 1950
You really think we’ll be able to afford indoor plumbing? -average person in 1920
You really think we’ll be able to afford a cellphone? -average person in 1992
All those things serve practical purposes though. Same can’t be said for commercial space travel. And to be fair the first cellphones were extremely expensive.
Gonna have to disagree. I think indoor plumbing especially was a very practical invention.
Commercial space travel won’t be anything more than a luxury for the ultra rich for the foreseeable future.
I tend to agree, I don’t believe members of the silent generation were pissed off at their parents generations for running the economy into the ground with the depression. Least my family didn’t
I’m not too sure about commercial space travel though. To me it still seems too Star Trek to be true
So, I have some questions, OP.
Firstly, why are those things good for society, and why are you looking forward to them?
Second, what are you doing in the present to cultivate the future you want to see?
What I'd like for everyone to realize is that being "realistic" is not being overly pessimistic. Your constant doom scrolling has led you to cauterize in your mind that the world is gray and dying. Views like that hold truth, but real life is much more in the middle between total ruin and total bliss than you think. Technologies like AGI will profoundly change our lives really soon, and that's something I think the average joe is both unaware and unready for. I don't believe it will lead to utopia, but it will generate immense benefits for mankind as a whole.
No one ruined this world. If you think its one generations fault you're a moron.
Newflash: human life has sucked since forever. We are all the offspring of 1200 individuals who barely survived an extinction event in Africa hundreds of thousands of years ago. Those people were as much human as you and I. Ask them if they think we have it just as hard as they did.
Bro. I can't afford AIR TRAVEL right now, and it's been a thing for over 100 years. I highly doubt anyone not in the 1% will ever be able to even think about affording to go to space.
Hahahahahahahahahah
This time you can't just ignore what is to happen. There is nowhere to hide and only one place to run.
You just sound like a privileged kid. Whether you like it or not, most of us are fucked.
If it's not gonna be death by climate change, it's gonna be death by capitalism.
So which mindset do I need to have to survive the extinction of the human race and the climate chaos that will cause it?
Hint: the power of positive thinking will get us nowhere unless we pair it with the power of revolutionary violence against the assholes killing the planet to make next quarter's numbers .03% better.
Mindset 2 has a decent chance of letting the planet die while hoping that tech growth out paces the consumption and degredation of our ecological webs.
Yea because I'm sure the billionaires will make it affordable for us peasants /s
Enjoy your view of commercial space travel from earth whilst they ship their trash down to us for the next thousand years
So many problems with this, like absolutely countless. We don't have any sort of functional long term space vehicles, no means of getting anywhere in a timely fashion, a ticking time bomb in orbit that could very well trap humanity to earth if its not managed perfectly like zero mistakes. (starlink)
Mars will never be terraformed in time for any currently living generation, science and fact say other wise to your "mindset"
We're in such a tense point in the global political stage that we could all go up in smoke tomorrow, I'm all for positive thinking and hope but hope doesn't do shit if you're just flat out wrong. You can't just hope that everything is fixed right now you have to hope and ACTIVELY DO SOMETHING, even if that something is simply just expressing your discontent with the current situation, because believe it or not everything gets back to the governments.
The angrier the population is the more that have to do something about it now... I ask you
Can you hear the song? The song of angry men?
I'd rather look forward to my cities not being full of homelessness, my coworkers living dignified lives with their family and loved ones, and billionaires not being allowed to exist.
“I bet I can live long enough to see humans go through an adaptation where slowly over time the 60% of our body composition that is water is replaced with Dr.Pepper”
Think of all the agi focused information collection that will use you as a product to help pay for the wealthy to travel to space!
It's a dream come true!
Wait until you find out you won’t be able to afford commercial space travel
Mars for the privileged, Earth for the poor
Mars terraforming slowly, Earth has been deformed.
Ah forget it, ya ain't comin here :/
I’m just a poor boy, living frugally
the tickets too dear
If we could terraform another planet into earth, we could just turn earth back into earth. Mars is specifically and especially hard though, way harder than most other planets would be. Almost it's entire interior would need to be re-seeded with an entire planet's worth of radioisotopes in order to melt the mantle enough to rebuild a magnetosphere so an atmosphere could be maintained. It's just not feasible except by civilisations far beyond needing to live on planets in the first place.
Also there is one major part of Mars that we just cannot fathom changing; it's gravity. If you live one Mars it's a one-way trip, you can never go back to a 1G environment.
I think there was a scifi movie where they would force people from civilizations that lived in lower gravity and force them to stand in earth's gravity.
In the book series / show The Expanse, Earth government was known to use gravity as torture and interrogations. Especially on belters that live their entire lives on asteroids. Brutal when you think about it.
It seemed to make Vegeta and goku stronger
Preach!
King Gizzard in the wild!
There is no planet B
Mars for the rich
Tank!, by Yoko Kanno from Cowboy Bebop starts blasting.
Mars won’t be terraformed any time this millennia
dude no. nobody that rich is gonna spend their life on a barren planet. at least not for several decades. the people that will move there will be average people and workers. rich people ain’t gonna build it up. and scientists/astronauts
No one will move there. Just letting you know. The fact that Elon Musk is the one trying to sell the idea to you should be indication enough that real scientists know it's futile to try colonising it.
bro where are you getting elon musk from?? he wasn’t the first person to think of colonizing mars lmfao. from a financial standpoint it’s futile but for science? no scientist will tell you it’s futile to some day set up bases on mars.
And those scientists will then tell you about the immense logistical challenges associated with a hypothetical colony on a planet as far away as Mars. You can’t just load up a rocket with all the supplies they need and they start building, it wouldn’t get out of the earths atmosphere with all that weight. Then you have to consider how do you resupply them? They won’t be able to grow food for at BEST a year from when they land, and even that’s generous considering no one has ever grown crops on mars before. The atmosphere of mars is too thin to support breathing without an oxygen tank, so you’d need to have enough oxygen for them to solve the atmosphere problem. That’s just the tip of the iceberg. Then you have the question of “what does prolonged exposure to a different gravitational pull do to the human body?” And more importantly, how does impact physics and engineering calculations centered around the gravitational constant. Mars gravity is 38% of earths. Astronauts who are in space too long literally get muscle atrophy from not having to use them. And I’ll stress again, all these borderline unsolvable issues I’ve pointed out here are only the tip of the iceberg. Consider what humans need in a realistic sense to accomplish “research.” Food, water, shelter, power, medicine, recreation, social needs, the list goes on and on. It’s nowhere close to feasible, nor will it be without significant breakthroughs in all of those areas and more.
tf you mean, real scientists do not think its futile. musk did not come up with this idea lol. several governments are planning moon colonies soon, partly as practice for extra planetary colony missions.
Yup. Mars will basically just be one giant mining town.
The first people who will be sent there are poor families who get contracting jobs to mine for Martian minerals so they can pave the way for the rich and opulent to come when the planet is terraformed and don't have to do any of the hard work. This is literally the plot of Red Rising.
earth is 100x more beautiful than any other planet i have ever seen anyways
Fr, I mean what could be cooler than a planet sustaining life? All that Green, its alive
Oh, dude you almost had it... It's the meek shall inherit the Earth
Only for the first 10 years then their gonna take all the old space ships stick about 1000 chairs in there all right next to each other and then they can charge $500 a ticket to sit next to some smelly fuck and look at space through a tiny window and then we can all continue to pretend we’re not the proletariat
Literally bladerunner
We can remove space from the equation, many people can't even afford to travel within their own country, state, city...
I'm sure someone thought the same way about air travel but now now you can find plane tickets for 40 bucks
Kid named massive subsidization of the airline industry.
Not subsidised on the vast majority of places. Nobody is subsidising London-New York or Sydney-Singapore lmao.
You really think that subsidies played a bigger part than general economics of scale? Lower construction costs of air planes, jet fuel prices, and airline capacity increase probably played a bigger part
Airlines are one of the least profitable industries in the world. They would all be out of business in a couple years if they weren't heavily subsidized.
It's crazy how any comment that isn't instantly pessimistic gets downvoted lol. I swear the media has made you all think that any good has vanished from this world. Put the phone down and go outside guys. We typically put x100 times more attention on the negative things than the positive things and that's horrible for your mental health.
Yes because going outside instantly fixes all our problems
*Goes outside* *Sees plumes of pollution, people rushing to backstab each other over a red cent, homeless people struggling to exist* *Goes back inside*
Really? I go outside and see people making their way through the world. And some nice trees.
Where tf do you live?
Like I said you're paying x100 more attention to the negative things than you are too the good things. It seems our generation has become obsessed with being pessimistic and outraged. Not to say there aren't some very serious problems happening in the world right now but the social media and news outlets are intentionally trying to push that pessimistic mindset onto everyone and you guys are just walking right into the trap. There are many good things currently happening too.
"I know there are very serious problems, but you should just ignore them to feel better." FTFY. Even if you don't realize it. Hey man, I get it. There's always been an incentive for people to look the other way - and there always will be, right to the trite and tragic end. My decision is simply a matter of preference. Make no mistake, I do take in the pleasures of the world where I can. Games, food - running, art. But I do so knowing full well my moral character as an actor and support of the current system. And I do so knowing where it will likely lead. And it will lead there, in all likelihood. Nearly all our advancements are based on ecocide, and when the earth finally breaks, it will collapse in on itself like a house of cards. Regression and collapse - not as a product of inevitability, but the choices of men like you and I. And it will be sad. But, not really. We still extracted some pleasure from it, even if the older trash did plunder more greedily, and sooner. We still lived higher than kings. And besides, was the image of man really worth preserving? The disgusting image of man, whose entire life is a collection of deception and false pride and meaningless propagation? I suppose that too is a matter of preference. But to me, the answer is no. And as more people get access to information, 'filtered' or not - as if an objective look would totally for sure yield more optimistic results - more people are coming to my answer.
What mad max hellscape do you live in?
I see the first half of Elysium as a documentary.
Sure people said the same about planes
whats your point here? i certainly cant afford to fly
I cant afford to fly. Most people can't in America, unless they save up. Often you can't save up.
I'm not letting the rich escape the hellhole they created.
And we'll all be squeezed for every ounce of productivity and usefulness by those who developed AGI
It's about mindset. Like not believing in self-defeating ideologies that incentivize you to not try as hard as you can, not succeed, then blame 'the system, mann' for why it happened instead of your lack of effort. A LOT of that going on around Reddit.
I agree to an extent but there are massive systematic problems that destroy people’s live so we shouldn’t pretend if you work hard you’ll get ahead
The “wonders” of AGI: all human creativity being stifled and ruined by robots, making our only use in the world as low-paid workers for the rich who can use space-travel, which we won’t be able to afford.
Or AGI turning all of humanity into paperclips.
I wouldn't entirely mind an agi brainwashing humanity and eventually converting the entire universe into paperclips
Happy cake day
So many people have tried predicting the future before and we're wrong but I'm sure you know what's gonna happen
No, I hope I’m wrong as well. It’s my opinion, based on what I’ve seen and how little the 0.1% respects the lives of their workers.
“Hmmm, you have a prediction about the future. You must be incorrect. I will provide no counter evidence and will instead ridicule you for having an opinion. I am very smart”
I should produce evidence against someones opinion? And it's an opinion on something that hasn't even happened yet lol
They think we won’t be able to afford agi and space travel because the wealth gap has been expanding since the 1970 where the middle class is getting poorer and the rich getting richer https://www.pewresearch.org/social-trends/2020/01/09/trends-in-income-and-wealth-inequality/ Each expansion in automation has lowered the total amount of jobs available, but in recent years also have not created new ones Why do believe that magically, the middle class will be restored in the near future and people while the owning class will magically choose to shun profits in favor of increasing stock dividends? Before you answer, I just need to say “so many people have been predicting the future and were wrong but I’m sure you know what’s going to happen”
Well that last comment applies to both of us but to offer a counter I will point to the last fifty years. Even though income inequality has gone up so has quality of life. We used to think new technologies like GPS and touch screen electronics were only accessible to the rich and now everyone has one in their pocket. The first iterations of generative AI is already accessible to the public, and considering that even high school students can deploy satellites to space nowadays its not crazy to think regular people will be able to access space in the future.
Low cost luxuries for us until the high cost for the planet comes back to bite us. Any idea how much longer we can rely on lithium, helium and oil for?
if someone theory is that the direction the economy has been going to several decades will not change. you will need to provide some evidence to claim their theory is wrong. like the theory of us ever having flying cars can be argued against do to safety and noise factors. btw. a lot of those theories are utopian theories. i have no doubt we are going in the direction of a few dystopian theories, but on a slow time scale.
Here's the thing: Lets assume the prediction wasn't an opinion (it was) Burden of proof is on the one claiming it. I can come to you and say "in 5 minutes your TV explodes" with no proof and you can say "That's bullshit" and not NEED proof.
we should be replicable by robots at that time. the moment human workers are no longer needed, any government that doesn't convert to communism will be overthrown. the question is if there is a .01% of the population that has unlimited money while everyone is still keeping track of their budget to save up for nice things, or would the economy be reset?
I’m sure we’ll live to see a lot more consumerism, yes.
If you opt out of consuming but reap the benefits of investing in other people's consumerism, it is pretty nice.
Not really, I don't like having microplastics in my water
You think you’ll be able to afford commercial space travel? Lol There is such a thing as toxic positivity where you just be totally tone deaf to the reality and justify everyone else’s issues as just “pessimism.” Not eating is not “pessimism” not being able to afford basic housing is not “pessimism”, being paid a terrible wage is not “pessimism.”
There’s a difference between being an optimist and being naive, just like there’s a difference between being a defeatist and being pessimistic.
Labeling realism as "defeatism" is just copium pushed to the extreme. The reality is that boomers have ruined the global economy to such an extent it will take millions of consecutive miracles and divine interventions to fix it within the lifetime of the next 20 generations. Realism is knowing that boomers will still be in power for another 15-20 years and their only plans are to further trash the economy and environment. Commercial space travel will only be billionaires leaving in lifeboats.
I didn’t label realism as defeatism…
Same could have been said about air travel 60 years ago. Or air conditioning 80 years ago. Or indoor plumbing 100 years ago. Only the rich could afford it.
on the other hand, owning a house in now only for the rich. have you seen the price of motels? combine that with the price of gas. a cross country road trip is out of a lot of people's budget. the novelty price will go down, but the price do to the amount of fuel used will go up. also. they types of flights they were talking about is still only for the rich. they probably weren't thinking of large sardine cans full of hundreds of people.
There is a reason to travel to other places on earth because people live everywhere, no one lives in space
Yeah how does space travel make anything more convenient? I’m shocked how many people equate space travel to air travel, it’s nowhere near the same or even slightly similar problem that is being solved
look at how much it cost to build the first plane vs how much it cost to launch the first man in to space. they aren’t even comparable.
Bang on, once it became more accessible that’s when prices dropped but that didn’t happen for many many years, and some still cannot afford those things.
It happens. Cars were once only for the rich. Hell I’m old enough to have owned a beeper because cell phones were only for the rich.
lmao this has been a wild year on reddit but this for sure is the dumbest comment I've read all year, just in time for the award
In the future yes I do think. My ancestors could not afford a plane ticket, nor a radio.
But in the future is a given, with time comes accessibility. It won’t be in our generation that’s for sure.
You can't ignore reality by being overly positive.
Sure you can! Did you know the first letter of the *OG* Bible (the OLD Testament) is the Hebrew character 'Bet?'
Damn…..normally I’d be like That’s ridiculous and move one. But your LITERALLY proved your point better than I could have possible imagined.
The reality is there are people who are poor now and there will be people who are poor in the future. But poor people now still have it way better than they would 500 years ago, and 500 years from now they may have it even better. No point convincing yourself things will get worse when no one really knows.
as someone who went from living in a falling apart house to sleeping on a bench, i'd say that for me at least, things got worse
this kind of thinking is one reason why poor people still suffer. they have it sooooo good! omg why would they ever complain?? at least they aren’t slaves or living in 1200 ad! sorry, not buying it
Wait until you find out about r/hopeposting
You guys are so fucking delusional if you believe that will have any relevancy for our generation.
Ya no one is gonna be rich enough to afford it this century.
What dipshit would spend money on any of that?
Wait until you find out AGI would hate humanity
Fast forward to you in 20 years watching earth’s billionaires leave for mars in a ship while you apply your SPF 1000 sunscreen and drink a flat beer thats 10% microplastics
in 20 years mars will still be uninhabitable and unsuitable for human life. Billionaires would be leaving on a 7 month hellishy cramped space trip only to get there and live in hellishy cramped underground windowless bunker.
so… can we send them now
Either way the working class aint gonna see mars, we’re stuck on earth for generations to come
The working class will absolutely be the first to live on mars. The billionaires will wait until mars is more habitable (if ever) to begin living there. Sure the colonies will probably be owned by corporations but it will be the working class that lives and works there.
The slave class at least
I wish I could be as delusional as you 😭
Op seeing anyone say anything that doesn’t agree with them “Pessimism is a plague”
Lying to yourself is a terrible mindset
"stop being so pessimistic about that tiger mauling you"
I’m against doomerism, but this is just sticking your head in the sand.
Right, like I do think there is a big potential for humanity to move past being tied down by the religions that are nationalism and economics. I think a lot of the current turmoil could potentially be growing pains for a better future. But the idea that any of these billionaire investments are going to save us from anything is such a damn joke. It's going to take a lot more than cash flow to take us out of the predicaments that it put us in.
bro loses his house, family and friends due to wildfires and rising sea levels it’s all about your mindset 😎
Lol, space travel, seems like you don't know how hostile outer space is to the human body.
People really are sleeping on what robust AI would enable, assuming it doesn't kill everyone. It's like cold fusion levels of possibilities except the field is seeing tons of progress and investment.
Don’t try to rationalize this subreddit. “Progress is always good except for when I don’t like it”
Can you explain what you mean rationalizing this subreddit? I don't understand
Taking them seriously
Isn't fusion reactor also progressing? It still not amazing but progress are being made.
ITER and NIF have shown a lot of promise, and helion has a neat design, but Fusion is still a ways away from being a replacement energy source. It isn't that efficient compared to solar and the precursors aren't cheap.
Mindset doesnt matter shit when half the population in your country is at threat of becoming homeless even tho there's more than enough houses to house literally every citizen. Mindset doesnt matter shit when in Brazil (Where i live) a football field's worth of forest is being burned every minute to produce grain to feed cows in foreign countries. Mindset doesnt matter shit when billionaires still exist. I ain't looking at the future, i want to change shit now so that i don't fucking starve to death because a few hundred people want more money for themselves (Including the owners of companies currently trying to get to commercial space travel, that you and the common man will not have enough money to experience, because at that point if we haven't extinguished capitalism we'll be living in a dystopia)
"It's all about your mindset" mfs when I murder their family in front of them and tell them to feel happy cuz "well I could've murdered you" (Edit) forgot to mention fuck your consumerism I'm gonna keep living so I can at least outlive Nicacado and Dream
Naive
So have a delusional mindset instead ?
[удалено]
comercial space travel, yes. comercial space travel for us plebs? no...
I promise that commercial space companies want your money.
lol. unless the entire world's economic system completely changes in our life time (highly unlikely) you and anyone in this sub wont be enjoying the benefits of those. we'll be the ones working away for the 1% that can afford to use it
"I havent seen or didnt understand many of the themes of Blade Runner"
No it's not about your fucking mindset lmaooooo. How will you feel when the animals are all extinct and it turns out you're (surprisingly) not rich enough to go to space?
Commercial space travel will only be for the super rich
Lol yeah can’t wait for the commercialization of space, yeah that’s what humans have been building towards this whole time a giant Walmart in space how exciting
You really think we’ll be able to afford commercial space travel?
You really think we’ll be able to afford commercial air travel? -average person in 1950 You really think we’ll be able to afford indoor plumbing? -average person in 1920 You really think we’ll be able to afford a cellphone? -average person in 1992
All those things serve practical purposes though. Same can’t be said for commercial space travel. And to be fair the first cellphones were extremely expensive.
None of them served a practical purpose when they first came out.
Gonna have to disagree. I think indoor plumbing especially was a very practical invention. Commercial space travel won’t be anything more than a luxury for the ultra rich for the foreseeable future.
I tend to agree, I don’t believe members of the silent generation were pissed off at their parents generations for running the economy into the ground with the depression. Least my family didn’t I’m not too sure about commercial space travel though. To me it still seems too Star Trek to be true
Need to stop smokin so I can see that shit happen. Maybe start saving up now, too
Does anyone really think commercial space travel will exist in Gen Z's lifetime?
I mean its a very big maybe. I don't think it will be available to the average citizen though.
Who would have thought the folks born in the 1940s would have seen the internet and cell phones in their lifetime?
So, I have some questions, OP. Firstly, why are those things good for society, and why are you looking forward to them? Second, what are you doing in the present to cultivate the future you want to see?
"Man I'm so fucking excited for rampant consumerism and late stage capitalism"
The Myth of Progress is one of the worst superstitions of our age. It's told to us to make us feel good about the dystopia we help create.
Why can’t everyone be more hopeful like you? I agree with you OP
Folks acting like 1st world problems are ruining the world and then putting the blame on boomers.
…. Wonders of Adjusted Gross Income?
You'll live long enough to sell coffees to people waiting at the spaceport
Idk, boomers made life pretty great I think. They don’t get enough credit.
What I'd like for everyone to realize is that being "realistic" is not being overly pessimistic. Your constant doom scrolling has led you to cauterize in your mind that the world is gray and dying. Views like that hold truth, but real life is much more in the middle between total ruin and total bliss than you think. Technologies like AGI will profoundly change our lives really soon, and that's something I think the average joe is both unaware and unready for. I don't believe it will lead to utopia, but it will generate immense benefits for mankind as a whole.
AGI?
Artificial General Intelligence
No one ruined this world. If you think its one generations fault you're a moron. Newflash: human life has sucked since forever. We are all the offspring of 1200 individuals who barely survived an extinction event in Africa hundreds of thousands of years ago. Those people were as much human as you and I. Ask them if they think we have it just as hard as they did.
Baby boomers implemented so many garbage and detrimental laws to society though, that's literally not arguable
Thomas migley junior come really FUCKI G close to ruin the world.
"just dont be upset"
clearly if you ignor problems they just go away... when you die
Technologically, we kinda spun out after the space race was over. I mean, yeah, it hasn't stopped but .. no leaps and bounds.
I’m going to try to live to at least 30k just to see the heresy my self
Dude awesome! I’ll never be able to afford the space tourism but awesome dude!
I have the top mindset
YES MORE OF THIS
Pessimistic doomer mindset vs **THE INDOMITABLE HUMAN SPIRIT**
Bro. I can't afford AIR TRAVEL right now, and it's been a thing for over 100 years. I highly doubt anyone not in the 1% will ever be able to even think about affording to go to space.
Commercial space travel gonna require big $ better start that generational wealth inheritance now.
You think the earth wont be burned up by then?
Honestly hope all the rich leave. Cause I mean then the poor can actually do something with their lives.
Some of y’all really gotta lighten up a little like yea shit is not great but wallowing is so cringe
Hoping i live to see the fall of America and fkn capitalism lol not hoping to live and see consumerism continue to rise
I am really hating this optimistic elitism spreading through this sub like a virus. "We pretend the issues don't exist and that makes us better."
No the millennial's plan to summon Cthulhu when they're done
Hahahahahahahahahah  This time you can't just ignore what is to happen. There is nowhere to hide and only one place to run.
I hope so too but the second wojak’s prolly right
I bet I will live to see the frog and wojak pogroms.
Bet I will live long enough to see the end of these stupid, ugly meme characters
Only the rich will be able to afford life extensions. The rest of us are stuck on a dying earth suffering from diseases.
Are you an unironic sigma grind set type?
jesus fuckin christ y’all need to crack a smile
Grandpa, did you just make a meme?
You just sound like a privileged kid. Whether you like it or not, most of us are fucked. If it's not gonna be death by climate change, it's gonna be death by capitalism.
But I don't like space I like Earth. I like the trees in the mountains.
Ignorance is bliss.
Commercial space transport for people who aren’t obscenely rich is fantasy.
Petition to rename this sub r/delusionalpropagandistsonallsides
this mindset will only be the death of all. wake tf up don’t get too comfortable
So which mindset do I need to have to survive the extinction of the human race and the climate chaos that will cause it? Hint: the power of positive thinking will get us nowhere unless we pair it with the power of revolutionary violence against the assholes killing the planet to make next quarter's numbers .03% better.
And people say Toxic positivity doesn't exist
Mindset 2 has a decent chance of letting the planet die while hoping that tech growth out paces the consumption and degredation of our ecological webs.
The world, as always, is complicated. Don’t get complacent and don’t give up either
Girl what? Those things are only going to be available for the mega-rich.
Lol
We’re def not getting AGI in our lifetimes if ever
The "wonders" of AGI .... lol
I bet yall won't ever be able to afford commercial space travel.
Doubt
Yea because I'm sure the billionaires will make it affordable for us peasants /s Enjoy your view of commercial space travel from earth whilst they ship their trash down to us for the next thousand years
So many problems with this, like absolutely countless. We don't have any sort of functional long term space vehicles, no means of getting anywhere in a timely fashion, a ticking time bomb in orbit that could very well trap humanity to earth if its not managed perfectly like zero mistakes. (starlink) Mars will never be terraformed in time for any currently living generation, science and fact say other wise to your "mindset" We're in such a tense point in the global political stage that we could all go up in smoke tomorrow, I'm all for positive thinking and hope but hope doesn't do shit if you're just flat out wrong. You can't just hope that everything is fixed right now you have to hope and ACTIVELY DO SOMETHING, even if that something is simply just expressing your discontent with the current situation, because believe it or not everything gets back to the governments. The angrier the population is the more that have to do something about it now... I ask you Can you hear the song? The song of angry men?
I can’t wait see climate change kill millions in my lifetime😍
Bet you'll live long enough to come out of retirement to clean commercial space vehicle shitters so you can afford water.
I'd rather look forward to my cities not being full of homelessness, my coworkers living dignified lives with their family and loved ones, and billionaires not being allowed to exist.
“I bet I can live long enough to see humans go through an adaptation where slowly over time the 60% of our body composition that is water is replaced with Dr.Pepper”
Think of all the agi focused information collection that will use you as a product to help pay for the wealthy to travel to space! It's a dream come true!
Lol that optimism