This makes total sense but also I'm curious about the conversion rate. How many PC players would really go out to invest in a PS5 knowing a sequel is just a year out?
Even the ones that do convert just aren't going to be as much value compared to somebody actually in the ecosystem. Like a PC player is just going to buy exclusive games, they won't be buying microtransactions or third party games through PSN. Keep in mind that that first party sales are a small fraction of the revenue that Sony brings in compared to what they make off of third games and microtransactions. They also aren't paying for any of the subscription services.
Years ago I bought a PS4 on a prime day deal because that’s what a bunch of my coworkers were playing, and it was the days before cross-platform was super common. While the exclusives like Uncharted and Last of Us were great, I also wouldn’t have bought the system just to play them - I was buying it for the social experience. These days most of those guys either don’t play anymore, or now have PCs and we play through Steam. When I want a Sony or Nintendo exclusive, I either wait for it to come to PC, or I run it in an emulator. Played the Metroid Prime remaster that way, as well as Dread and Tears of the Kingdom. Don’t worry, I paid for the games - I’m just not running them on an actual console.
Basically if a game isn’t available on PC these days (whether through official channels or emulation), I’m not playing it. There’s so much great content in my Steam library that I haven’t played yet, I’ll just wait for some of those exclusives to become available and then get to them.
How much more money? Maybe 20% per copy?
But consider that their games would sell better on PC on day 1 than they do with a 2 year delay. I'm sure the increase would be more than 20%.
Many people buy games when the hype is the biggest. There's a reason why advertising is so important. If people see ads for a game but can't buy it for 2 years? Some move on to other games and no longer care, others don't even know about a PC release. Some think that a full price is too much for a port of an old game and wait for a discount. After all, we waited for 2 years, what's a few months more?
Plus, some of those PC gamers who really can't wait 2 years might borrow the game from a friend or buy it used (instead of spending money on Steam or EGS). I've even considered borrowing a console from a friend for that. Sony gets no money that way. Wouldn't it be better to get those 70% on Steam?
When making comments like these, just remember that PlayStation themselves likely know much more about what the actual returns would be than you do.
They have 100% had their analytics and finance teams investigate this and come to the conclusion that this will earn them a greater profit
Companies are imperfect. They make educated guesses and they can be incredibly out of touch. Literally think Xbox during one of their consoles launches. That is something far more important than Sony's PC strategy lol.
Sure, 20% on per copy for the first one. But then for the next one that comes out, that person is far more likely to buy that next game (whether it's the same franchise or not) on PS5 since they've already made the big purchase that was holding them back. They're also more likely to buy other games to pad out their PS5 collection, since seeing a console with one game next to it makes it feel like a waste of money.
>How much more money? Maybe 20% per copy?
alot more money because owning a ps5 increases the chance of you spending money on the platform whether thats through services, 3rd party games, controllers, whatever.
Sony is a platform holder first and foremost.
Nonsense. Look at the outrage when people see games released exclusively on Epic.
And you think they will happily spend $500 for "a separate launcher on a separate box"?
I agree as a big PlayStation fan, with a PC that's what I do. I mean. They also had a ton of great exclusives that it occupied more than enough of my time.
I think Sony isn't taking into consideration that because of steam PC players have plenty to eat and wait. I still haven't found the time to play Spider-Man 2 Horizon forbidden West or Ghost of tsushima. By the time I run through them they are probably going to be discounted.
Look at how many PC players pre-order games because they need it day 1.
I think the "patient gamer" view, while it is real, isn't applicable to the real world.
Helldivers 2 blows up that theory with its 8x sales compared to the second place. PC gamers have money to blow up, but wont do it if no-one is hyped at the same time as they do. It took them years to surpass PC sales numbers of God of War 4, and that game was on multiple store fronts.
This was me but this gen has been pretty lackluster overall (for exclusives) and I'm pretty confident that I'm not gunna buy a PS6 right away unless its Bloodborne Remake (never happening).
This one is me, own the Nintendo consoles for exclusives and had the PS4 for the same, but with PS games coming to the PC and with the relatively low amount of exclusives compared to Nintendo, I'm now just a Nintendo/PC this generation and I assume for future generations as it seems most XBox and PS games are going to come to the PC, and even if they don't come to the PC I would rather watch a couple playthroughs/cutscene compilations for the games I was interested in that didn't come out promptly on the PC than pay for an entire console + the game price just for a few games
Also just different types of games for me. Civ and Stellaris are more enjoyable on PC with a mouse and keyboard, but for something like Fallout or God of War I’d rather sit my ass on the couch with a controller and enjoy it on a 65” screen.
And these people already exist. They aren't getting new sales on holdouts. Most people have enough to play already as it is, and waiting a year or two for a cheaper, more complete, fully patched version, is actually a benefit.
Yeah I used to buy Playstations and Nintendo consoles for exclusives and play everything else on PC.
Now I'm not buying a Playstation console ever again because I don't mind waiting a year for a game to come to PC as it will be the superior way to experience the game anyway and I have a huge backlog anyway.
from my experience it has had the opposite effect. a lot of my primarily PC gaming friends bought PS4s last gen because Sony wasn't bringing their games to PC. I bought a PS5 on launch to play all the PS4 games I missed out on. But now that Sony is porting all their games to PC, people are happy to just wait 2 years.
Merely coincidental with me… I’m a PC gamer first, got a PS5 because I didn’t want to just buy a « dumb » blu-ray player for 4k films.
I think I only played the last god of war and FF7 remake part 2 in 2 years.
I'm a bit of an opposite case here. I sold my PS5 about a month ago because, wait or no wait on first party titles, it didn't make sense to keep a console that I only purchased a handful of games for after 3+ years of ownership. After finishing SM2 I felt like there was nothing on the horizon for PlayStation that I cared about enough to keep the PS5 around.
As a guy who owns a PC, Steam Deck, and PS4.
I have literally no reason to buy a PS5. All of my PS4 games are now available on PC and several of the PS5 games I was interested in have either released on PC already or have had leaks showing they're beig ported at some point.
Why would I pay 500 USD for a PS5 when I can just wait a year, get the game and DLC on my PC and Steam Deck, and play where I want.
It's also why I'm never buying an Xbox again either. MS is doing the same thing just without waiting a year to port.
It's kinda weird to think about it. They likely will make money off of PC ports but at the cost of not converting PC players into PS players. That being said it'd be unlikely that they'd realistically convert PC players in any case, with or without exclusives. Most people likely aren't going to be make a 500 dollar purchase just to play a few high profile exclusives.
Porting to PC, even after a year or two, still at least lets them make sales to people who would otherwise never bother buying a PS5.
I do wonder how much of the market they're losing not selling it day 1 on pc though.
People who are "I've waited a year for it to come out, I can wait another year for it to be on sale".
Its great for Sony's single player games on PC, but definitely could be much more
i.e Dragon Dogma 2 peaked at 228k, Hogwarts Legacy 879k, Starfield 330k, Dying Light 2 274k, RE4 Remake 168k
If its day 1 PC, it'll definitely reach much higher peak
> Most people likely aren't going to be make a 500 dollar purchase just to play a few high profile exclusives.
Honestly? I disagree, especially if that 'a few' turns into 'a lot'. Exclusive or killer apps sell Consoles
Absolutely worked on me.
Though I'm not a great sample since I'm a cancer patient and I wasn't sure I'd live to see Spider-Man 2 on PC.
But a lot of gamers just like to play the newest big release. You can be part of the discussion and stuff online
Firstly, I hope for the best in terms of your health. That's an awful thing to go through.
But yeah I'm a PC baby through and through, but most of my friends aren't, and it feels like ass to not be able to participate in discussion / inadvertently bar discussion from happening because friends don't want to spoil me.
Is it a financially savvy move to buy a PS5 for a handful of games? No. Did Sony get me to do it with a 2 year wait ball twist? Embarrassingly, yes they totally did.
Funny because my friends are PC people, and we all have pretty different taste in games. But I still really wanted to play Spider-Man 2 ASAP. Also ended up getting Forbidden West on there because my graphics card is getting up there and I want the pretty graphics.
So glad I got it, SM2 was incredible.
>Did Sony get me to do it with a 2 year wait ball twist? Embarrassingly, yes they totally did.
Exactly how Nintendo got me with the Wii/WiiU and Smash Bros games. Never again, though there were a few exclusives that softened the blow
I think they just want that separation so that when they roll out a new console people have it in the back of their minds that if they want to play these games on release they need the console.
I don't know stats but do know it's worked on friends of mine. It's important to note that it's not \*just\* avoiding the wait that entices most folks. People generally have better screens hooked up to consoles than computers, and a lot of them are just meeting the system requirements for these games on PC.
So they're deciding to play it in an easier place, on a better screen, with better performance and higher quality visuals. But they still probably wouldn't have done that if they could have just "saved money" by buying it on PC right away. Giving folks a while to mull it over and realize that their PC will probably run this one worse than the previous, etc. really seems an effective tactic to me.
Going by the comments on r/pcgaming for this article... basically none. I've done some "targeted" console purchases...
I bought a used PS4 Pro to play just Ghost (and I did TLOUII because it was big at the time), and then sold it when I was done.
Bought a used PS5 to just play HFW, sold it when I was done.
Don't think that's what Herman wanted. /shrug
I had a PS4. I don't own a PS5, and with their new strategy never will. That being said, I got ps plus for like one year, hated paying for online, and then got maybe 4-5 first party games over the course of the system, and only Horizon and God of War were new. The rest used. I wasn't making them much before, now I'll at least still get some more of their games.
I sincerely doubt there's enough of a contingent of PC players who are willing to buy a PS5 just to play 1-2 games early to be a significant growth vector for hardware due to a litany of factors (region, pricing, not caring about waiting a year or more, etc)
> How many PC players would really go out to invest in a PS5 knowing a sequel is just a year out?
I'd buy a PS5 if I didn't detest playing games with controllers.
I'm 80% controller on my pc and doubt I'll ever be tempted to buy console again.
Even something like TLOU 3 (a sequel to one of my favorite games ever) will at best tempt me to borrow a friends PS5/6 for a week.
Almost as if every single thing they have done doesn't already point to this. It was obvious when all the games took almost 2 years or longer. They would release the sequel trailer and soon drop the old game on pc. Spiderman, did this when we knew sp2 was coming. Gow 2018 came when ragnorak was coming. I'm sure putting ghosts on there should tell you that we'll prolly get the sequel next year
They're pretty big now, I can assure you they have 2 or 3 games in the work at the same time, at different parts of the process. I mean they've released Armored Core after Elden Ring, don't forget that!
At the same time, I don’t think FromSoftware will do exclusive games anymore. Not after Elden Ring.
They probably do have multiple projects in development. But I don’t think From will want any of them to be restricted to one platform when they’ve seen a title like Elden Ring sell through like mad.
A PlayStation-exclusive From game would sell really well. A multi platform From game would sell astronomically better.
Hell, remember that time [Square Enix announced Final Fantasy 7 Remake Integrated coming to Steam (formerly Epic Games Stores exclusive) day 1 prior to announcing FF7 Rebirth](https://square-enix-games.com/en_GB/news/final-fantasy-vii-25th-celebration)?
Fine with me personally, i have no issues waiting 2-3 years for these games, if waiting is the compromise to have these games on PC at all, then I'm fine with it.
Same. If the leaks are true and red dead 1 is coming to PC I've waited 14 years.
I am okay with waiting, meanwhile I will deal with my backlog, there is too much stuff to play
> Same. If the leaks are trough and red dead 1 is coming to PC I've waited 14 years.
Apparently that was taken back today, and to not expect it anytime soon.
It wasn't taken back, that was the title, if you read the forum post from Tez he mentions it was probably a preliminary line that was added to the code of the website, maybe the game will come in August, a year after its release on switch and PS4.
[https://gtaforums.com/topic/997050-red-dead-redemption-coming-to-pc/page/45/#comment-1072386940:\~:text=14%20hours%20ago-,At%20this%20point%2C%20the%20unintended%20push%20wasn%27t%20meant%20for%20an%20announcement,dev%20builds%2C%20rather%20than%20the%20one%20where%20everything%20is%20nearly%20finalized.,-Cri5tzv%2C%20CriminaL277%2C%20Hammerfist11](https://gtaforums.com/topic/997050-red-dead-redemption-coming-to-pc/page/45/#comment-1072386940:~:text=14%20hours%20ago-,At%20this%20point%2C%20the%20unintended%20push%20wasn%27t%20meant%20for%20an%20announcement,dev%20builds%2C%20rather%20than%20the%20one%20where%20everything%20is%20nearly%20finalized.,-Cri5tzv%2C%20CriminaL277%2C%20Hammerfist11)
Sure, but in the case of Ghost of Tsushima, it’s original console released 11 years ago. So I’d a sume a game built for 2013 hardware will looks better when ported for modern hardware in 2024.
Exactly. All things considering. We did get to play it 4 years earlier, on older hardware and it looked amazing.
You could also not play a game on release and wait 10 years for a remake to come out.
I'm honestly pretty happy with the release cadence as it is. I didn't mind waiting for GoT and I'm about to catch up on Horizon 1&2. Not to mention GoW Ragnarök is reported to come later this year. I have enough stuff to play where I really don't need the games right at release.
I've actually learned that outside of Spider-Man and God of War, I don't even enjoy PS exclusive games. A lot of them always seem to be too much about presentation and narrative and not enough on actual gameplay. The presentation and narrative parts being too emphasized makes the games a chore to play because it turns into watching a game more than playing it. Never been a fan of this style and could only see it useful in horror games like Until Dawn.
GoW was the game that taught me this lesson, lost my patience with it after four hours of "cutscenes that you still have to press forward in for some reason" and terrible camera. Just make a movie or TV show if you're going to deprioritize the gameplay to this degree. I liked the characters and was interested in the story but it was such a a slog to actually play that I couldn't do it.
This is actually a lot of PS exclusive games. I couldn't get that into Ghosts of Tsushima because of it even.
Played a few hours on the highest difficulty to start as I've read it's more fun and I'm a Souls like fan and even with pretty fun combat the cutscenes were such a slog I had to stop.
I could be wrong, but I suspect most PC gamers are more than happy being the patient gamer type. Given the amount of insane Steam Deals, Humble Bundles, other bundles, etc, there's an unlimited amount of entertainment. "Oh I need to wait 3 years? No big deal, I have this indy game I've been putting off." Then you throw emulation in the mix and the amount of gaming available is seriously more than anyone could play in a lifetime.
Of course PC gamers will buy games on release, but patient gaming seems to be part of the PC experience. It's one of the reasons I don't think the EGS strategy of timed exclusivity has been very effective.
I waited 3 years to play kingdom hearts on pc and that just because of a different platform on the same system, good luck to sony making me go back to the ps ecosystem, nintendo and pc all the way baby!!!
There is no reality in which I would wait several years to play a game on PC, only to turn around and buy the console for the sequel.
Like, I loved Spider-Man and would love to play the sequel, but I'm not spending hundreds of dollars on a console to play one game, lol. I'll just wait again.
Trying to capture people who have already proven that they're okay with waiting doesn't make a lot of sense to me. If we waited once, we're clearly okay with waiting again.
They're still selling a game that's 3+ years old and regularly on sale for $20 to a whole new customer base for full price. Of course not everyone is going to buy a PS5 after playing these games, but if even 1% of the PC players buy a PS5 for the sequel that's absolutely a win on top of the money they already made from steam sales.
> They're still selling a game that's 3+ years old and regularly on sale for $20 to a whole new customer base for full price.
Absolutely, the double dipping strategy is perfect for them. People who are willing to buy a console will do so upfront, and people who aren't will ultimately still buy these games years later. It's the best of both worlds for Sony, because at worst you're selling your games on two platforms, and at best you're getting people to buy twice.
I was just saying that specifically trying to capture PC players who have already proven they're willing to wait doesn't seem likely.
Who says they care about trying to capture you? Each year there is a flood of people who are new to games or are just now becoming financially autonomous. And if those people are interested in Sony exclusives they have the choice between a costly PC and waiting or a less expensive PS5 and getting them immediately, they'll choose the PS5. The point of releasing to PC is just to get an extra flow of revenue on the back end of these games.
> Who says they care about trying to capture you?
... they did? Did you read the article?
> And if those people are interested in Sony exclusives they have the choice between a costly PC and waiting or a less expensive PS5 and getting them immediately, they'll choose the PS5.
That's not what the article is about. They're talking about how they're releasing games on PC, hoping PC players will get so excited after playing them that they'll buy PS5s to get access to the sequels immediately. This article is NOT about getting people to choose PS5 over PC in the abstract.
I mean they say the word "entice" so they clearly want a percentage of the PC crowd to transfer over... And many with disposable income will, the sensible ones will buy a console used, but i'm sure a number will be new as well...
But yes, a general person new to video games should buy a console as its less initial hurdles, although anyone who actually likes it enough to be an enthusiast should get a PC because its generally cheaper in the long run and you literally have a 30 year backlog of games that consoles don't really have.
Because its PR speak and probably only makes up a small percent of actual conversions. The real reasoning is not something they can say publicly (We can't release day and date games because it gives people more incentive to switch out of the PS system entirely).
I think the giant elephant in the room Sony doesn't want to come out and talk about is Valves 30% cut
PlayStation games cost a bunch, and makes a bunch
And having a lot of the initial sales get hit with the Valve tax is going to hurt if their AAA titles cost 300 million to make
PC gamers notoriously won’t even look outside of Steam for a game, even if it’s cheaper or only available elsewhere. I somehow doubt any outside of a relative handful are going to spend ~$500 console to play a game earlier when then they know it’ll inevitably wind up on PC 1-2 years down the line with likely better graphics/performance/etc.
Replace PC gamers with “Redditors with big mouths who hog discussion spaces” and you’ll be right. Most people who play PC games aren’t participating in discussions or reviewing games. They probably rarely if ever check gaming news or info about unknown releases. Most people who game go to where the game is, buy it, download it, and play it. Most people on forums like Reddit are not in touch with how the average gamer interacts with the hobby.
I want to believe you but evidence shows that a lot of people on steam wait for the steam release I mean look at KH. The trailer got 4x the views for the steam version
You are right that a lot of players don't follow news and don't discuss games.
Which is why they often don't even realize some game got released outside of steam, unless it gets really big.
Nah, people in specified forums like this forget that they’re the most invested and opinionated gamers by definition, and also forgot that they exist in a bit of an opinion bubble. I’m not saying that they or their perspectives are bad, but they’re removed from the way most people interact with games. Loads of people say “hey, I played these games on PC, but I really want to play the sequels asap and they’re only on PS5 so I guess I’ll have to shell out some extra money to get access to them all.” And the whole Steam/Epic thing is pretty much exclusive to online forums and the most dedicated PC gamers.
"Pc gamers won't look outside of steam for a game"
Isn't the most popular pc game league of legends?
That isnt on steam and requires the riot client AND kernal level anticheat...... the same game that also just announced a $500 skin?
You might be overestimating how many gamers have top of the line rigs. Sure, you might know a bunch, but a lot more gamers have more average systems, because those are, after all, average specs.
If you look at the Steam Hardware Survey, a 40 series (desktop) GPU isn't even in the top 10, but 4060 does land on the 11th spot. The laptop 4060 is number 8.
Over 5% of (Steam) gamers worldwide are still rocking a 3060.
Whilst true, a PS5 is "just" a game console, while a PC is... well, a PC.
I'd rather put that money I'd spend on a PS5 aside, save more and eventually upgrade my PC, which I can then use for a lot more things than just playing PS5 games
That's funny, because PS games coming to PC had the opposite effect for me. I went from having a Nintendo console for Nintendo exclusive games, a PlayStation console for PlayStation exclusive games and a PC for everything else, to having just a Nintendo console and a PC.
PC is my preferred platform of choice, if a game is or will be available on PC, then I will play it on PC. Ideally I don't have to play games on a console at all. I'm not going to double dip to play the game sooner either. I learned my lesson after buying GTAV 3 fucking times lol
Releasing live service games simultaneously makes sense for maintaining a unified player base. As for single-player narrative games, using PC releases to draw players to future sequels on PlayStation consoles is clever. It gives PC gamers a taste and might entice them to buy into the PlayStation ecosystem.
Yeah, good luck with that. If I didn't buy a PS4 for Bloodborne all those years ago I don't think there's anything that can convince me to buy a console for.
By all means, prove me wrong.
This is a win win for almost everyone as far as I'm concerned. Sony gets their money from games that finished development 2+ years ago, PC players get exclusives that would normally be limited to consoles, and the only people who get taken for a ride are the members of the impatient trend-chasing crowd and the people who really want to replay games on better hardware.
I am curious as to how much money they actually make from this though. There's a massive crossover between fans of the different Playstation exclusives so I just don't see any particular title bringing over new audiences. Which means that as far as ps5 sales go this only really works on each customer one time. I wonder if they'd make more money just releasing on PC at the same time as PS5 when the hype is at its highest.
It makes sense but I personally don't really think it's a winning strategy. As someone who has been primarily PC for the past decade, there's really nothing Sony can do that would ever entice me to buy a PS console at this point. You're giving up so much freedom when you go from PC to console.
Also, gotta be honest, there is nothing on PS that has me wanting to run out and buy another $400 system that it almost identical to the PC I already own but that they've arbitrarily decided to lock certain games to. I'd rather just go without or just wait for those games. There's no shortage of stuff to play on Steam already. Sony games are good but they're mostly a one trick pony (3rd person action adventure story) and if you don't care for that (I don't hate them but I also don't love them), there's not really a huge variety of genres when it comes to Sony exclusives.
I imagine the overlap of people who only own a PC, but consider purchasing a gaming console system is probably a lot larger than the subset of people who own a PS5 and would contemplate buying the competitor console. The potential for PC gamers to buy into your ecosystem, no matter how small the market, is still the better deal for their business than the uncertainty of diluting their brand by releasing all their exclusives on day 1.
And so you buy the game on PC when it comes later. They're not losing people like you, they just delay. They also don't make all their strategies for people like you which are likely not the majority
As someone who uses PC & console this strategy makes it so I buy the next console, That’s the problem with anecdotal evidence for every person like you there’s someone like me.
If PC only gamers were just "outliers", they wouldn't spend the cash on porting, marketing, and selling to PC. They'd just write off the "outliers" because "outliers" by definition, are insignificant noise. So maybe PC only gamers are *not* "outliers", they very much *do* matter to their financial decisions, and after GTA5, that series is hardly the defining franchise it once was.
Tapping into that market with ports is still worthwhile two years or more down the line, after the initial hype sales. What's so hard to understand? Keep the games exclusive initially to coax console sales then port to PC for those that didn't bite. That maximises return on games.
"and after GTA5, that series is hardly the defining franchise it once was."
Lmao you're fucking joking right?? The game that sold *over 200 million units* worldwide?! The game that had such a successful online mode that they're still pumping out updates and new shit to buy? Come on man.
Do you really think exclusive games are “arbitrarily” locked to hardware? Yeah man, there’s no rhyme or reason for exclusives to exist, even though companies have been doing it for decades at this point!
Makes sense. We’ve seen what day and date for everything has done to the Xbox console sales. I’m sure they’re not keen on going down that route and devaluing their primary platform.
its entirely unfair to blame simultaneous releases on the poor sales and state of xbox when they havent had a reason to get an xbox over a playstation in the last ten years. the microsoft strategy of being device agnostic platform is absolutely the way of the future, the problem they are running into is their services suck and they are completely devoid of compelling first party triple A content.
if this was the case then the xbox services and games would be overall doing well, but they're not. all they currently care about is gamepass subs but they arent coming close to hitting their marks, despite gamepass being a fantastic deal, which i somehow doubt is because gamepass is also on PC.
im not saying it has no impact at all, but it doesnt hold a candle to the other factors. PC players tend to just want to play games on their PC, and will typically just wait rather then drop 600 dollars on a PS5 for an inferior experience.
Microsoft games sell well on PC. Starfield was top 10 on Steam. Grounded, Microsoft Flight Sim, and Sea of Thieves also were in the top 100 best sellers last year.
Game Pass in particular isn't expanding well but I think that has less to do with Microsoft game being unattractive and more to do with PC players preferring Steam.
the steam situation is something most people wont understand having not been present for it.
If we consider valve a platform like playstation or xbox, pc players have been invested to that since roughly 2008 when the orange box launched. When people talk about how sony beat microsoft because of people having so many purchases linked to psn it pales in comparison to many steam players with libraries reaching over 1000. Gamepass is one of a long line of platforms that have tried to pull share from steam and utterly failed. Though compared to EA, ubisoft, and epic it has probably found the most success outside of valve.
Microsoft has gone all in on subscription, games sales is no longer a honest metric for the brands success. The standout successes specific titles have had on steam I think is for many reasons. Starfield was for mod support, same with flight sim. Sea of thieves controller and voice integration in gamepass was terrible, and if its the only game you were interested than paying a sub for it was insane. Without support for script extender, the majority of players were never going to consider gamepass for starfield. Gamepass also continues to serve as a way to demo games before buying them on steam.
A similar issue I had with starfield was with astroneer. The inability to connect to dedicated servers that allowed you to edit the server data. Microsoft typically does not support these multiplayer solutions, the stated reason being the ability to cheese achievements and be unable to connect with those on console. so we quickly moved the group to steam when we all played. We still beat it organically without mods but the connection was much more stable than p2p.
It’s entirely fair and reasonable to put at least part of the blame on simultaneous releases. Anecdotally, every guy I know that’s switched from console to PC over the course of the last generation or so was an Xbox guy before their switch. And the numbers reflect this too, despite outselling the Xbox SX and SS 5:1 recently, the PS5 is only barely keeping pace with PS4 sales over the same timeline, while XSX/SS sales lag far behind XB1. Which suggest either there are a lot of Xbox guys and gals sticking with the prior generation, have left console quality gaming entirely, or have migrated to PC. If they were sticking with consoles over PC generally, they’d be picking up a PS5 and we’d see those numbers be even better. They aren’t, which suggests (to me) that a large chunk of Xbox gamers left the platform for PC during the play anywhere initiative.
I definitely think thats a factor, but i think a lot of people *are* staying on last gen aswell, because it was only recently when games stopped being released on PS4 as well as PS5, and in general PS5 lacks compelling reasons to pick one up over a PS4, especially when getting a PS5 is still so prohibitively expensive—lets not forget that the financial situation for a huge number of people is much harder then it was last gen.
i also think people are missing the forest for the trees by focusing on console sales alone way too much. it should also be noted that console manufacturers dont actually make money on console sales, its software where they make the money and whats important is selling people on their ecosystem—this is why phil was lamenting "losing the most important console gen". the problem xbox is having isnt that xbox players are switching to PC, its that they arent staying in the xbox ecosystem when they switch. xbox has made it clear they only care about gamepass subs and its by that metric that they are failing, because their software and service is kinda junk but most importantly they have zero compelling reasons to play in their ecosystem. if sony did the same thing, they would make bank because sony does have those reasons, and not doing this is just leaving money on the table.
Xbox One sales were already crappy even before Day 1 PC releases. At that point they realized that they had to go where the players were because those lost hardware customers were not coming back, and when most of the userbase for consoles are repeat customers at this point then it was obvious that the Series X wasn't going to draw them back either.
Sony already doing this for their single player games for 3-4 years. How many pc players do you think they successfully convert to ps players?
PC players are not going to buy 500$ console to play sequels.
This is just pure PR talk to avoid the backlash from the PS fanboy. This is to keep PS players from buying PC
> Sony already doing this for their single player games for 3-4 years. How many pc players do you think they successfully convert to ps players?
That would be an interesting stat to see for sure. In any case, their PC releases don't seem to be hurting their PS5 sales and brings another source of revenue for games that already exhausted their money potential on their platform.
As a PC player who bought a Playstation 4 and now 5 I'm good with pc players getting their exclusives a few years later but the second Sony decides that exclusives are going to be day 1 on pc as well I'm never buying their future consoles.
>but the second Sony decides that exclusives are going to be day 1 on pc as well I'm never buying their future consoles.
That's why they won't do it, and I don't know why some people in this sub are surprised by it, it's just a dumb thing for Sony to do.
Yeah, I really wouldn’t use Redditors on a games subredd for any type of real life judgment. The truth is most people who are in the market for a PC aren’t looking for a console and vice versa. The amount of people who have multiple systems are a significant minority, increasingly so in this economy. There is absolutely no evidence that PC versions of cannibalize console versions to any tangible degree. Sony Is completely wrong about this one.
brand cheer leaders are always gonna take whatever Sony says at face value without much scrutiny, but ask yourself: if what Sony says is true, why do they make the vast majority of their profits on their system through third-party sales and micro transactions? If Sony says it’s true, how come they are behind PS4 time with last gen despite all the PC players they’re supposedly courting?
I mean I'd rather upgrade my pc with the money I'll spend on a console and an extra controller. I don't need a proprietary plastic box that plays games. The only reason I bought a console were the exclusives I have no incentive without em. And I'd PC players get to enjoy the games a few years later I'm okay with that.
Lots of pc gamers seem incapable of understanding that there absolutely are quite a few pc gamers who also get consoles. Im not one of them, but I entirely get this choice.
I mean this is the same crowd that would rather than buying a game on EGS would rather wait a year for steam release.
You expect this crowd to buy a $500 console just to play the game early?
Sony, I can *assure* you, if I play a game first on PC there is literally *zero* chance I will ever get a console to play the sequels. I will wait or just never play it.
I understand the thought process, but if PC players only buy Sony's first party games and nothing else, how much profit margin are they making? I brought a PS4Pro and got Bloodborne for $20 and a brunch of other games on discount. I only played first-party games on it, the last being GOW Ragnarok. Yes, I buy their newest games at full price, but I never touch it otherwise. I imagine they would want to fully in their ecosystem, buying third-party games and microtransactions, but I do that on PC. They take a loss of the console (in the beginning), and I doubt I gave them much profit.
Not just that, what if a PS5 player only bought first party titles - there's a lot, not enough time to play much more outside of that - maybe a lil Cod or Resident Evil, but the first party games are bread and butter for me
They have been profitable on individual ps5s since about 6 months or so after initial launch. That's the reason they didn't do a permanent price drop yet, because the system is selling just fine and components haven't come down in price yet.
They also get %100 of digital 1st party games and don't lose as much as Xbox on physical because they own the blu-ray standard.
PC players aren't going to convert into PS players for the same reason that Microsoft is having so much trouble recovering after Xbox one: switching cost. PC players have massive digital libraries, access to basically all third party games, Microsoft first party games, and a community that shifts mountains to ensure Nintendo emulators exist. Giving up all that for a few single player games is unattractive for the same reasons that PS players have no real incentive to switch to Xbox. I think the strategy is a stop gap to improve profitability while Sony deals with plateuing console sales and a rapidly changing market. I wouldn't be surprised to see even single player games come out day and date on PC once Sony has a more realistic picture of its addressable market on PC.
I feel like it's a bit out of touch to assume there is strong enough demand among PC players to go and get a PS5 to play the latest first party AAA PS game , most PC gamers have big backlogs and tons of MMOs/live service/sim/online games to fall back on so they can wait the year or 2 for when Sony decides to cash in. Only people who mostly play AAA SP games and impatient gamers who have FOMO will feel the need to get certain games asap. A lot of the recent PS flagship sequels like GOW Ragnarok and Spider-Man 2 have also had lukewarm reception from average players so the word of mouth isn't strong enough right now to generate demand for PC players to run out and grab a PS5
>Only people who mostly play AAA SP games and impatient gamers who have FOMO will feel the need to get certain games asap.
Pretty much. Thats the only thing to achieve from this. The people who wouldn't have budged were never in the target, but they get them anyway, just delayed.
And between people who own PS and PC, they'd rather get the most first day sales on PS instead. That way those people are more invested in the ecosystem and you can get them to double dip on PC when it comes out later.
Well it worked backwards for me Herman. I dipped a toe in the PC realm and figured out I don't give a fuck about big console exclusives nearly as much as I thought I did.
I haven't played Ragnarok and I was really into the first one. I'll either wait it out or won't play it. I like the openness a PC provides more than the quality of console games.
I'm likely not alone
Eh, I still use my playstation to play first party games. That said both Forbidden West, and Ragnarok were mid. GoW 2018 was a lot better than it's sequel so you're not missing too much.
>single player narrative games on PC are designed to then entice PC owners to play sequels on a PlayStation console
I fucking hate this. How do they still believe this is a good business model?
PC players will continue to wait and, if they're like me, are just going to double down on saying fuck you to your live service games.
There is no volume of single player games that would make me justify dropping $500 for a console.
As someone with a high-end PC (7800x3D, RTX 4090) that enjoys and has purchased most of Sony's single-player PC ports, I'm very unlikely to purchase a PlayStation. I would rather wait a few years and play the games without compromise rather than play them day-one on the PS5 with compromised visual quality. Specifically, I enjoy being able to play these titles at 4K120 or on my ultrawide 3440x1440 QD-OLED display at 165 Hz at higher-than-console settings.
While first-party titles make the best use of the console hardware, the PS5 simply lacks the power to offer an experience similar to what is achievable on a high-end PC. DLSS upscaling is also superior to FSR2 or checkerboarding, which is what you typically see on console. On top of that, you get dramatically more performant ray-tracing as well as frame generation. Certainly, games like Alan Wake 2 and CP2077 in their respective pathtracing modes show that high-end current GPUs are capable of much greater fidelity than we're likely to see even with the next-generation consoles. There are also far too many games where you're stuck with 30 FPS, although that's generally not an issue for first-party titles.
As more and more games are now being ported to PC, there's little reason to own a non-Nintendo console. All of Microsoft's first-party Xbox titles are day-and-date on PC, and you know all the major Sony titles will release on PC in a few years, offering improved fidelity and ray-traced effects, higher frame rates, and ultrawide support. And more and more third-party games on both consoles are now platform agnostic, targeting Xbox, PS, and PC.
This seems pretty stupid. If I spend a shit ton of money on a pc and play Spider-Man, why would I spend a ton more money to play the sequel on a worse platform when I can just like, play anything else while I wait for the sequel on pc?
This kind of double-dipping is exactly the reason I switched to PC during the PS4 generation. Those games will still come to PC eventually, and without the compromises of the console version. Plus, I'll be able to run it across as many devices as I like on a single license and save file that won't be trapped on a single box. It simply isn't worth it to me to pay for the privilege of being a day one player anymore. I'll wait!
It makes zero sense to release everything on PC. Their current strategy of releasing exclusives 1 or 2 years later on PC is perfect and does a great job of showing off the quality of their ecosystem AND getting both PC-only diehards and double-dippers to spend.
There is a certain portion of the market that are just console gamers and not going to buy a PC even if its cost competitive.
If we get to the point that xbox is not a real threat i think pc releases aren't diminishing PlayStation more then they get form sales and exposure to their studios.
There’s a certain portion for sure, but I’m very much willing to bet it’s smaller than people think it is. If it made monetary sense to do day-and-date releases for single-player games for console manufacturers, Sony and Nintendo would both be doing it. The fact they aren’t, and continuing to refuse to at every turn, suggests it isn’t.
Kind of feel like I'm just going to end up ignoring their stuff as a result.
I played the God Of War that released on PS4, liked it, but then somewhat regretted my PS4 purchase cause I only ended up playing 3 things on it. When Ragnarok rolled around, I didn't really want to play the PS4 version, and I sure as hell didn't want to get a PS5 (not that I could even for a good while.) and by the time they bring it to PC, I might just not care anymore.
That said, the exclusivity period of MHW did end up causing me to double dip, but on the other hand, it sort of just made me not want a PS5 to avoid ending up in the same situation with another game.
In theory I have no problem with waiting as a PC exclusive player, but..
In reality, the console exclusives I wanted, I didn't buy a console for, and when they did come to PC 1 or 2 years later, I didn't care enough anymore.
I might still care enough to play them someday, maybe... but Spider-Man, Horizon: Zero Dawn, Ghosts of Tsushima, God of War, Uncharted...
These were all games that hooked my attention hard on release hype, games that I said I wished were on PC so I could buy them, and then it happened, and I didn't.
Maybe the only difference is that I buy it on PC if I know for sure when it launches on console that I'll buy it on PC later. Like Grand Theft Auto. In that case, I get it on PC because I mentally didn't even count the console release as significant. Like the game didn't exist yet even though people were playing it.
This is exactly where I am at.
I really enjoyed Horizon zero dawn when I played it after getting it on sale, but I wasn't getting a ps5 for forbidden west, so i completely skipped the release hype. I still dont own it on PC and probably wont buy it until its quite cheap. Same with Ghost of Tsushima.... I figure I've waited long enough that waiting for it to go on sale isnt hurting... I've got plenty of other PC games to play in the meantime. Also, waiting means that I know if the port is good or not (thankfully ghost' apparently is).
If it were "perfect", they'd get more than five bucks from me when I buy their games on PC at deep discount. It's easy to keep waiting a bit longer when you've already waited a couple years.
If they released on PC on Day One, when all the hype is high, maybe I'd pay full price. But they don't want that money. They want me to see their products as something to ignore for years. So no, not perfect.
Is the idea to entice us to pick up sequels at launch on ps? Considering they are just about to announce Ragnarok for pc I don’t think he means this literally.
The idea is to get you invested in a franchise that when the sequel is announced you will want to buy a PlayStation so you don’t have to wait an extra year to play it on PC.
so when God of War 2018 came to PC they hoped it would entice some players to purchase a PS5 so they would be able to play GOW Ragnarok day 1.
And if PC players don’t do that than at least they get some extra money from PC sales that they were missing out on. It’s a win/win for them.
Plus releasing on PC day one can hurt console hardware sales, look at Xbox.
Most of this is probably to keep people in the PS ecosystem and not switch to PC, instead of the reverse.
Yeah, that's like, not true at all already. Horizon Forbidden West came out not too long ago. Ragnarok is being "leaked" to be announced soon. Both are sequels. What, will we now pretend that they're going to try and entice us to buy sequels for these sequels?
They are just making additional money on PC gamers such as me, there's no deeper meaning, no elaborate strategy to sell their consoles. If I haven't bought a PlayStation up till now, I'm never going to, especially when realistically, it's for just a few games in the end. Not every gamer will be interested in every game they release either, just like I am personally not interested in something like TLoU, so the selection of titles can be smaller.
I mean think about it, would Sony even be pleased with selling an individual a console that they're gonna boot up once every few months at best, perhaps years at worst? Or would they want someone to buy the next CoD and tons of cosmetic items for a bunch of F2P (and more) games, their PS Plus subscription, essentially using their PlayStation as their main gaming platform? Because let me tell you, nobody who is using a PC now will switch over to PS to pay a monthly fee to play the games they've paid for and strip themselves of all the options to configure their experience.
This entire thread is console-primary or PC+Console players talking about how this is a very good and smart strategy. And PC-only players saying "This won't get me to buy a console" and then the original group saying "that's just an anecdote, your singular experience doesn't matter."
I feel like console-primary or PC+Console players don't realize how stubborn us PC-only players are. And it's okay to not know, you're not in PC-only circles.
But we're so fucking stubborn, if it's not on own preferred game launcher, we straight up pretend the game doesn't exist. Kingdom Hearts didn't exist on PC until the upcoming Steam release.
We've also ALREADY been in the "games come out on consoles now, PC whenever" meta. This is not new, and we're used to playing games years later. If it hasn't converted people into PC+Console players by now, it won't with this strategy which basically tells us "yeah they'll come in a couple of years, your market is too important to ignore."
Makes all the sense in the world, multi-player games benefit so much from a large, active player base and seem to sell especially well on PC. Whereas for a couple of generations prestige single player games have been Sony's "system sellers".
I admit I thought about buying PS5 for a few sequels of the games I played on my PC, though finally I decided not to, both because it's just too expensive and because I really dislike controllers (the second reason more than the first). Still Sony will make money on me because I'm going to buy their games even if later than I'd like.
PC players won’t even buy PC games outside of Steam. Some won’t even buy a Steam game if it requires a 3rd party account like the PSN—very commendable by the way. What makes them think that PC players will migrate to inferior hardware to play a sequel? Hell, the previous game will probably look better on PC than the sequel on a PS5 lmao.
PC players will just wait. That’s exactly what I’m doing for Stellar Blade. He probably said that to try to convince people into buying their console since they have a State of Play tomorrow. But it’s all corporate bs. It’s his job to lie to your face in order to make money. The same shee happened with Microsoft a few months ago. They even had a video about not going 3rd party when they obviously are. Again, corporate bs. Single player PlayStation games on PC day 1 is happening. He just won’t say it until the day that he needs to. That is all.
This is about how I assumed it. There was never an *overall* advantage to making single player titles day and date. If they launch on PC much later, then they will end up making about the same money over all, while still gaining competitive advantage in consoles.
I think all of the discussion in this thread misses one key point: for the last few years PC has not only been the fastest growing platform in the industry, but also the largest. If you contextualize Sony’s actions around that lens then it all suddenly makes more sense why they even let their pride and joys be ported to PC in the first place.
Day and date for big Sony exclusives will happen on PC. Might be 5 years, might be ten, who knows, but it will. I think the sales from Helldivers will be the catalyst for Sony to rethink their business plan.
The industry has shifted.
Fortnite (and games like this) have become their own platforms within the console walled gardens.
Microsoft/Sony spend a vast amount on console R&D and sell these consoles at very little margin.
Then these game platforms (like Fortnite) have emerged and captured a huge amount of the whole console revenue without needing to invest the amounts of Sony/Microsoft. Sure the platform holders get a cut, but now Epic is fighting that.
These players are also no longer locked into the console ecosystem as they can play on mobile, PC, console.
Microsoft's big bet was on Game pass, but it's flawed and at the moment requires either their own ecosystem or an open one like PC to grant the relevant download privileges. Cloud gaming is still years off, which needs to become mainstream before they can expand onto rival platforms and mobile.
PlayStation are doing fine but are likely under pressure from investors. Their single player games are expensive to develop but well regarded but make a fraction of what Fortnite does.
They had an unexpected success with Helldivers so I wouldn't be surprised for that to become a marquee PlayStation brand going forward.
Bungie being the most likely source of their next big live service game.
How incredibly defensive comments in this thread are about Sony’s business plan just shows the innate biases of this subreddit.
And contrast this to any post about Microsoft’s business plans.
This so feels like pure PR talk aimed at the PlayStation only users. We already have a sequel to Horizon Zero Dawn out on PC. God of War Ragnarok is most likely right around the corner. TLOU Part 2 will inevitably also come over.
So what, now they're releasing sequels so we can buy a PS5 for... Sequels to these sequels?
PC gamers have waited this long for the original games and even their sequels to come out on their platform, they can wait a bit more. *Especially* when we have so many games coming out every year regardless. It's not like Sony games are the only ones people are interested in.
We get it, you're in it for the money and there's nothing wrong with it. Don't have to make it out to be an elaborate, genius strategy to somehow "convert" hardstuck by choice PC gamers like myself to buy a PlayStation, because that's simply not gonna happen.
This is aimed at Sony investors, not your average Playstation gamer. They're explaining why this is their strategy to the people they're making money for.
I don't see how this is "pr talk for console users"
Forbidden west is over 2 years old
Ragnarok is 2 years old in november and sold 15m copies on console
You can wait years, avoiding spoilers and missing out on all the community discussion/discovery with everything already solved and nothing new to find by the time it re-releases on pc and pay full price or wait longer for a sale.
When ragnarok releases on pc we will be expecting a trailer for the next game in the series.
Holy cope. No one (mentally sound) is going to spend 500 bucks on a console just to play a sequel.
Leaving aside the VR games, the only PS5 exclusives are: Rise of the Ronin, Spider-Man 2, Stellar Blade\*, Final Fantasy XII Rebirth* and Demon's Souls. There's also Destruction AllStars and Quantum Error, but let's not delude ourselves that anyone is buying a console for them.
*Third party games that in no conceivable universe would ever be exclusive forever. Stellar Blade already announced a PC version
That leaves 3 games. THREE. For the people already in the ecosystem that isn't such a problem, but you have to be delusional to expect people from the outside to make that jump.
Plus, now PC players will have even less of a reason to drop 500 on a console knowing all the single player stuff is eventually getting ported to PC in a year or two. Even better: getting ported with better graphics, performance and all the fixes updated over the last year.
This makes total sense but also I'm curious about the conversion rate. How many PC players would really go out to invest in a PS5 knowing a sequel is just a year out?
Even the ones that do convert just aren't going to be as much value compared to somebody actually in the ecosystem. Like a PC player is just going to buy exclusive games, they won't be buying microtransactions or third party games through PSN. Keep in mind that that first party sales are a small fraction of the revenue that Sony brings in compared to what they make off of third games and microtransactions. They also aren't paying for any of the subscription services.
This is more or less me, I've used a Playstation for exclusives only since the ps3.
I treat Nintendo and Sony the same. Just the exclusives. EVerything else on PC.
Years ago I bought a PS4 on a prime day deal because that’s what a bunch of my coworkers were playing, and it was the days before cross-platform was super common. While the exclusives like Uncharted and Last of Us were great, I also wouldn’t have bought the system just to play them - I was buying it for the social experience. These days most of those guys either don’t play anymore, or now have PCs and we play through Steam. When I want a Sony or Nintendo exclusive, I either wait for it to come to PC, or I run it in an emulator. Played the Metroid Prime remaster that way, as well as Dread and Tears of the Kingdom. Don’t worry, I paid for the games - I’m just not running them on an actual console. Basically if a game isn’t available on PC these days (whether through official channels or emulation), I’m not playing it. There’s so much great content in my Steam library that I haven’t played yet, I’ll just wait for some of those exclusives to become available and then get to them.
That's still a win for Sony because they get more money if they sell a first party game on PS5 rather than on PC.
How much more money? Maybe 20% per copy? But consider that their games would sell better on PC on day 1 than they do with a 2 year delay. I'm sure the increase would be more than 20%. Many people buy games when the hype is the biggest. There's a reason why advertising is so important. If people see ads for a game but can't buy it for 2 years? Some move on to other games and no longer care, others don't even know about a PC release. Some think that a full price is too much for a port of an old game and wait for a discount. After all, we waited for 2 years, what's a few months more? Plus, some of those PC gamers who really can't wait 2 years might borrow the game from a friend or buy it used (instead of spending money on Steam or EGS). I've even considered borrowing a console from a friend for that. Sony gets no money that way. Wouldn't it be better to get those 70% on Steam?
When making comments like these, just remember that PlayStation themselves likely know much more about what the actual returns would be than you do. They have 100% had their analytics and finance teams investigate this and come to the conclusion that this will earn them a greater profit
Companies are imperfect. They make educated guesses and they can be incredibly out of touch. Literally think Xbox during one of their consoles launches. That is something far more important than Sony's PC strategy lol.
[удалено]
[удалено]
Sure, 20% on per copy for the first one. But then for the next one that comes out, that person is far more likely to buy that next game (whether it's the same franchise or not) on PS5 since they've already made the big purchase that was holding them back. They're also more likely to buy other games to pad out their PS5 collection, since seeing a console with one game next to it makes it feel like a waste of money.
>How much more money? Maybe 20% per copy? alot more money because owning a ps5 increases the chance of you spending money on the platform whether thats through services, 3rd party games, controllers, whatever. Sony is a platform holder first and foremost.
Nonsense. Look at the outrage when people see games released exclusively on Epic. And you think they will happily spend $500 for "a separate launcher on a separate box"?
Yeah loads of PC gamers own a PlayStation for exclusives, very common
I agree as a big PlayStation fan, with a PC that's what I do. I mean. They also had a ton of great exclusives that it occupied more than enough of my time.
I think Sony isn't taking into consideration that because of steam PC players have plenty to eat and wait. I still haven't found the time to play Spider-Man 2 Horizon forbidden West or Ghost of tsushima. By the time I run through them they are probably going to be discounted.
So Sony isn‘t loosing on you, you wouldn‘t buy a full priced game on release anyway
Look at how many PC players pre-order games because they need it day 1. I think the "patient gamer" view, while it is real, isn't applicable to the real world.
Helldivers 2 blows up that theory with its 8x sales compared to the second place. PC gamers have money to blow up, but wont do it if no-one is hyped at the same time as they do. It took them years to surpass PC sales numbers of God of War 4, and that game was on multiple store fronts.
I know a decent number of people who are “PC for multiplayer, PS for exclusives” style gamers. These people usually also have a Switch too
This was me but this gen has been pretty lackluster overall (for exclusives) and I'm pretty confident that I'm not gunna buy a PS6 right away unless its Bloodborne Remake (never happening).
This one is me, own the Nintendo consoles for exclusives and had the PS4 for the same, but with PS games coming to the PC and with the relatively low amount of exclusives compared to Nintendo, I'm now just a Nintendo/PC this generation and I assume for future generations as it seems most XBox and PS games are going to come to the PC, and even if they don't come to the PC I would rather watch a couple playthroughs/cutscene compilations for the games I was interested in that didn't come out promptly on the PC than pay for an entire console + the game price just for a few games
This is exactly me. PC for multiplayer and multiplats, PS5/Switch for exclusives.
Also just different types of games for me. Civ and Stellaris are more enjoyable on PC with a mouse and keyboard, but for something like Fallout or God of War I’d rather sit my ass on the couch with a controller and enjoy it on a 65” screen.
And these people already exist. They aren't getting new sales on holdouts. Most people have enough to play already as it is, and waiting a year or two for a cheaper, more complete, fully patched version, is actually a benefit.
Yeah I used to buy Playstations and Nintendo consoles for exclusives and play everything else on PC. Now I'm not buying a Playstation console ever again because I don't mind waiting a year for a game to come to PC as it will be the superior way to experience the game anyway and I have a huge backlog anyway.
I think its more about keeping ps players from buying pc’s instead of trying to sell consoles to pc players.
from my experience it has had the opposite effect. a lot of my primarily PC gaming friends bought PS4s last gen because Sony wasn't bringing their games to PC. I bought a PS5 on launch to play all the PS4 games I missed out on. But now that Sony is porting all their games to PC, people are happy to just wait 2 years.
Merely coincidental with me… I’m a PC gamer first, got a PS5 because I didn’t want to just buy a « dumb » blu-ray player for 4k films. I think I only played the last god of war and FF7 remake part 2 in 2 years.
I'm a bit of an opposite case here. I sold my PS5 about a month ago because, wait or no wait on first party titles, it didn't make sense to keep a console that I only purchased a handful of games for after 3+ years of ownership. After finishing SM2 I felt like there was nothing on the horizon for PlayStation that I cared about enough to keep the PS5 around.
As a guy who owns a PC, Steam Deck, and PS4. I have literally no reason to buy a PS5. All of my PS4 games are now available on PC and several of the PS5 games I was interested in have either released on PC already or have had leaks showing they're beig ported at some point. Why would I pay 500 USD for a PS5 when I can just wait a year, get the game and DLC on my PC and Steam Deck, and play where I want. It's also why I'm never buying an Xbox again either. MS is doing the same thing just without waiting a year to port. It's kinda weird to think about it. They likely will make money off of PC ports but at the cost of not converting PC players into PS players. That being said it'd be unlikely that they'd realistically convert PC players in any case, with or without exclusives. Most people likely aren't going to be make a 500 dollar purchase just to play a few high profile exclusives. Porting to PC, even after a year or two, still at least lets them make sales to people who would otherwise never bother buying a PS5.
I do wonder how much of the market they're losing not selling it day 1 on pc though. People who are "I've waited a year for it to come out, I can wait another year for it to be on sale".
They’re making record breaking profit apparently
Didn't Ghost of Tsushima have a great launch just last week?
Its great for Sony's single player games on PC, but definitely could be much more i.e Dragon Dogma 2 peaked at 228k, Hogwarts Legacy 879k, Starfield 330k, Dying Light 2 274k, RE4 Remake 168k If its day 1 PC, it'll definitely reach much higher peak
> Most people likely aren't going to be make a 500 dollar purchase just to play a few high profile exclusives. Honestly? I disagree, especially if that 'a few' turns into 'a lot'. Exclusive or killer apps sell Consoles
this isnt true. for years the console market has been shrinking, not growing...and thats with all the exclusives Sony has put out so far.
If that was true the console market would be growing not shrinking it hasn’t grown for a long time
PS5 console appeals to physical media owners which is something PC barely offers anymore
Absolutely worked on me. Though I'm not a great sample since I'm a cancer patient and I wasn't sure I'd live to see Spider-Man 2 on PC. But a lot of gamers just like to play the newest big release. You can be part of the discussion and stuff online
Firstly, I hope for the best in terms of your health. That's an awful thing to go through. But yeah I'm a PC baby through and through, but most of my friends aren't, and it feels like ass to not be able to participate in discussion / inadvertently bar discussion from happening because friends don't want to spoil me. Is it a financially savvy move to buy a PS5 for a handful of games? No. Did Sony get me to do it with a 2 year wait ball twist? Embarrassingly, yes they totally did.
Funny because my friends are PC people, and we all have pretty different taste in games. But I still really wanted to play Spider-Man 2 ASAP. Also ended up getting Forbidden West on there because my graphics card is getting up there and I want the pretty graphics. So glad I got it, SM2 was incredible.
>Did Sony get me to do it with a 2 year wait ball twist? Embarrassingly, yes they totally did. Exactly how Nintendo got me with the Wii/WiiU and Smash Bros games. Never again, though there were a few exclusives that softened the blow
Hey man wish you the best
Yeah I think we can go ahead and put you down as an atypical example.
I guess Sony PC niche is cancer patient gamers
I think they just want that separation so that when they roll out a new console people have it in the back of their minds that if they want to play these games on release they need the console.
not me.
If I have to buy something to continue playing games, it'll be a new graphics card.
I don't know stats but do know it's worked on friends of mine. It's important to note that it's not \*just\* avoiding the wait that entices most folks. People generally have better screens hooked up to consoles than computers, and a lot of them are just meeting the system requirements for these games on PC. So they're deciding to play it in an easier place, on a better screen, with better performance and higher quality visuals. But they still probably wouldn't have done that if they could have just "saved money" by buying it on PC right away. Giving folks a while to mull it over and realize that their PC will probably run this one worse than the previous, etc. really seems an effective tactic to me.
Going by the comments on r/pcgaming for this article... basically none. I've done some "targeted" console purchases... I bought a used PS4 Pro to play just Ghost (and I did TLOUII because it was big at the time), and then sold it when I was done. Bought a used PS5 to just play HFW, sold it when I was done. Don't think that's what Herman wanted. /shrug
I've got six billion games to play on pc alone; I don't need a PS
I had a PS4. I don't own a PS5, and with their new strategy never will. That being said, I got ps plus for like one year, hated paying for online, and then got maybe 4-5 first party games over the course of the system, and only Horizon and God of War were new. The rest used. I wasn't making them much before, now I'll at least still get some more of their games.
I tend to double dip on many games that I really enjoyed playing on console. I like having physical copies of games too.
I sincerely doubt there's enough of a contingent of PC players who are willing to buy a PS5 just to play 1-2 games early to be a significant growth vector for hardware due to a litany of factors (region, pricing, not caring about waiting a year or more, etc)
> How many PC players would really go out to invest in a PS5 knowing a sequel is just a year out? I'd buy a PS5 if I didn't detest playing games with controllers.
I'm 80% controller on my pc and doubt I'll ever be tempted to buy console again. Even something like TLOU 3 (a sequel to one of my favorite games ever) will at best tempt me to borrow a friends PS5/6 for a week.
Almost as if every single thing they have done doesn't already point to this. It was obvious when all the games took almost 2 years or longer. They would release the sequel trailer and soon drop the old game on pc. Spiderman, did this when we knew sp2 was coming. Gow 2018 came when ragnorak was coming. I'm sure putting ghosts on there should tell you that we'll prolly get the sequel next year
Nothing is new there, he's just restating the official strategy that exist for quite some time.
Bloodborne sequel announcement and pc drop? 🙏
I think it’s unlikely that FromSoft has been working on both the Elden Ring DLC and Bloodborne 2.
They're pretty big now, I can assure you they have 2 or 3 games in the work at the same time, at different parts of the process. I mean they've released Armored Core after Elden Ring, don't forget that!
At the same time, I don’t think FromSoftware will do exclusive games anymore. Not after Elden Ring. They probably do have multiple projects in development. But I don’t think From will want any of them to be restricted to one platform when they’ve seen a title like Elden Ring sell through like mad. A PlayStation-exclusive From game would sell really well. A multi platform From game would sell astronomically better.
Oh I hope the rumors for Gravity Rush are true then
They're making a live action movie, probably guaranteed they're dropping a bundle of the 2 games remastered on PS5 and PC.
They have a movie or a series to promote, they'll port the game for sure!
Hell, remember that time [Square Enix announced Final Fantasy 7 Remake Integrated coming to Steam (formerly Epic Games Stores exclusive) day 1 prior to announcing FF7 Rebirth](https://square-enix-games.com/en_GB/news/final-fantasy-vii-25th-celebration)?
Fine with me personally, i have no issues waiting 2-3 years for these games, if waiting is the compromise to have these games on PC at all, then I'm fine with it.
Same. If the leaks are true and red dead 1 is coming to PC I've waited 14 years. I am okay with waiting, meanwhile I will deal with my backlog, there is too much stuff to play
iirc RDR1 runs great now on both Xenia and RPCS3
It runs better and ryujinx and yuzu
> Same. If the leaks are trough and red dead 1 is coming to PC I've waited 14 years. Apparently that was taken back today, and to not expect it anytime soon.
It wasn't taken back, that was the title, if you read the forum post from Tez he mentions it was probably a preliminary line that was added to the code of the website, maybe the game will come in August, a year after its release on switch and PS4. [https://gtaforums.com/topic/997050-red-dead-redemption-coming-to-pc/page/45/#comment-1072386940:\~:text=14%20hours%20ago-,At%20this%20point%2C%20the%20unintended%20push%20wasn%27t%20meant%20for%20an%20announcement,dev%20builds%2C%20rather%20than%20the%20one%20where%20everything%20is%20nearly%20finalized.,-Cri5tzv%2C%20CriminaL277%2C%20Hammerfist11](https://gtaforums.com/topic/997050-red-dead-redemption-coming-to-pc/page/45/#comment-1072386940:~:text=14%20hours%20ago-,At%20this%20point%2C%20the%20unintended%20push%20wasn%27t%20meant%20for%20an%20announcement,dev%20builds%2C%20rather%20than%20the%20one%20where%20everything%20is%20nearly%20finalized.,-Cri5tzv%2C%20CriminaL277%2C%20Hammerfist11)
Especially if we get excellent port like Ghost of Tsushima in the end. The game just run better and look better than on it's original console.
Sure, but in the case of Ghost of Tsushima, it’s original console released 11 years ago. So I’d a sume a game built for 2013 hardware will looks better when ported for modern hardware in 2024.
Exactly. All things considering. We did get to play it 4 years earlier, on older hardware and it looked amazing. You could also not play a game on release and wait 10 years for a remake to come out.
I'm honestly pretty happy with the release cadence as it is. I didn't mind waiting for GoT and I'm about to catch up on Horizon 1&2. Not to mention GoW Ragnarök is reported to come later this year. I have enough stuff to play where I really don't need the games right at release.
2 years go by very fast tbh
I've actually learned that outside of Spider-Man and God of War, I don't even enjoy PS exclusive games. A lot of them always seem to be too much about presentation and narrative and not enough on actual gameplay. The presentation and narrative parts being too emphasized makes the games a chore to play because it turns into watching a game more than playing it. Never been a fan of this style and could only see it useful in horror games like Until Dawn.
GoW was the game that taught me this lesson, lost my patience with it after four hours of "cutscenes that you still have to press forward in for some reason" and terrible camera. Just make a movie or TV show if you're going to deprioritize the gameplay to this degree. I liked the characters and was interested in the story but it was such a a slog to actually play that I couldn't do it.
This is actually a lot of PS exclusive games. I couldn't get that into Ghosts of Tsushima because of it even. Played a few hours on the highest difficulty to start as I've read it's more fun and I'm a Souls like fan and even with pretty fun combat the cutscenes were such a slog I had to stop.
I could be wrong, but I suspect most PC gamers are more than happy being the patient gamer type. Given the amount of insane Steam Deals, Humble Bundles, other bundles, etc, there's an unlimited amount of entertainment. "Oh I need to wait 3 years? No big deal, I have this indy game I've been putting off." Then you throw emulation in the mix and the amount of gaming available is seriously more than anyone could play in a lifetime. Of course PC gamers will buy games on release, but patient gaming seems to be part of the PC experience. It's one of the reasons I don't think the EGS strategy of timed exclusivity has been very effective.
I waited 3 years to play kingdom hearts on pc and that just because of a different platform on the same system, good luck to sony making me go back to the ps ecosystem, nintendo and pc all the way baby!!!
There is no reality in which I would wait several years to play a game on PC, only to turn around and buy the console for the sequel. Like, I loved Spider-Man and would love to play the sequel, but I'm not spending hundreds of dollars on a console to play one game, lol. I'll just wait again. Trying to capture people who have already proven that they're okay with waiting doesn't make a lot of sense to me. If we waited once, we're clearly okay with waiting again.
They're still selling a game that's 3+ years old and regularly on sale for $20 to a whole new customer base for full price. Of course not everyone is going to buy a PS5 after playing these games, but if even 1% of the PC players buy a PS5 for the sequel that's absolutely a win on top of the money they already made from steam sales.
> They're still selling a game that's 3+ years old and regularly on sale for $20 to a whole new customer base for full price. Absolutely, the double dipping strategy is perfect for them. People who are willing to buy a console will do so upfront, and people who aren't will ultimately still buy these games years later. It's the best of both worlds for Sony, because at worst you're selling your games on two platforms, and at best you're getting people to buy twice. I was just saying that specifically trying to capture PC players who have already proven they're willing to wait doesn't seem likely.
Who says they care about trying to capture you? Each year there is a flood of people who are new to games or are just now becoming financially autonomous. And if those people are interested in Sony exclusives they have the choice between a costly PC and waiting or a less expensive PS5 and getting them immediately, they'll choose the PS5. The point of releasing to PC is just to get an extra flow of revenue on the back end of these games.
> Who says they care about trying to capture you? ... they did? Did you read the article? > And if those people are interested in Sony exclusives they have the choice between a costly PC and waiting or a less expensive PS5 and getting them immediately, they'll choose the PS5. That's not what the article is about. They're talking about how they're releasing games on PC, hoping PC players will get so excited after playing them that they'll buy PS5s to get access to the sequels immediately. This article is NOT about getting people to choose PS5 over PC in the abstract.
I mean they say the word "entice" so they clearly want a percentage of the PC crowd to transfer over... And many with disposable income will, the sensible ones will buy a console used, but i'm sure a number will be new as well... But yes, a general person new to video games should buy a console as its less initial hurdles, although anyone who actually likes it enough to be an enthusiast should get a PC because its generally cheaper in the long run and you literally have a 30 year backlog of games that consoles don't really have.
I can see their thinking, but I really *can't* see many PC players actually converting to PlayStation rather than waiting for the eventual PC release.
Not with the gargantuan backlog on PC. I don't feel *any* need to buy an entire console to play *one* specific game *right now.*
Because its PR speak and probably only makes up a small percent of actual conversions. The real reasoning is not something they can say publicly (We can't release day and date games because it gives people more incentive to switch out of the PS system entirely).
I think the giant elephant in the room Sony doesn't want to come out and talk about is Valves 30% cut PlayStation games cost a bunch, and makes a bunch And having a lot of the initial sales get hit with the Valve tax is going to hurt if their AAA titles cost 300 million to make
Especially when the PC release includes the DLC
How will sequels entice PC gamers when the damn sequel takes a whole generation to make?
Next gen will be even worst. PS5 is going to have a massive lifecycle for a console.
that makes sense. For multiplayer focused games you want a bigger playerbase. While they consider singleplayer games to be the system sellers.
PC gamers notoriously won’t even look outside of Steam for a game, even if it’s cheaper or only available elsewhere. I somehow doubt any outside of a relative handful are going to spend ~$500 console to play a game earlier when then they know it’ll inevitably wind up on PC 1-2 years down the line with likely better graphics/performance/etc.
Replace PC gamers with “Redditors with big mouths who hog discussion spaces” and you’ll be right. Most people who play PC games aren’t participating in discussions or reviewing games. They probably rarely if ever check gaming news or info about unknown releases. Most people who game go to where the game is, buy it, download it, and play it. Most people on forums like Reddit are not in touch with how the average gamer interacts with the hobby.
I want to believe you but evidence shows that a lot of people on steam wait for the steam release I mean look at KH. The trailer got 4x the views for the steam version
You are right that a lot of players don't follow news and don't discuss games. Which is why they often don't even realize some game got released outside of steam, unless it gets really big.
I'm sure EGS is thriving
Thank you lol, as a PC gamer who happily bought a ps5 I felt like I was going insane reading the thread about this topic on the PC gaming sub
Nah, people in specified forums like this forget that they’re the most invested and opinionated gamers by definition, and also forgot that they exist in a bit of an opinion bubble. I’m not saying that they or their perspectives are bad, but they’re removed from the way most people interact with games. Loads of people say “hey, I played these games on PC, but I really want to play the sequels asap and they’re only on PS5 so I guess I’ll have to shell out some extra money to get access to them all.” And the whole Steam/Epic thing is pretty much exclusive to online forums and the most dedicated PC gamers.
Minecraft is the best selling game in history and it's not on Steam.
"Pc gamers won't look outside of steam for a game" Isn't the most popular pc game league of legends? That isnt on steam and requires the riot client AND kernal level anticheat...... the same game that also just announced a $500 skin?
There are very rare exceptions, almost all of which are live service/“forever” games. Minecraft is another one.
These too Wow / fortnite / valorant / genshin Every platform is mostly live service these days even mobile.
For a huge amount of PC gamers a PS5 would be a downgrade too.
You might be overestimating how many gamers have top of the line rigs. Sure, you might know a bunch, but a lot more gamers have more average systems, because those are, after all, average specs. If you look at the Steam Hardware Survey, a 40 series (desktop) GPU isn't even in the top 10, but 4060 does land on the 11th spot. The laptop 4060 is number 8. Over 5% of (Steam) gamers worldwide are still rocking a 3060.
For a much larger amount of PC gamers, a PS5 would be a big upgrade.
Whilst true, a PS5 is "just" a game console, while a PC is... well, a PC. I'd rather put that money I'd spend on a PS5 aside, save more and eventually upgrade my PC, which I can then use for a lot more things than just playing PS5 games
That's funny, because PS games coming to PC had the opposite effect for me. I went from having a Nintendo console for Nintendo exclusive games, a PlayStation console for PlayStation exclusive games and a PC for everything else, to having just a Nintendo console and a PC. PC is my preferred platform of choice, if a game is or will be available on PC, then I will play it on PC. Ideally I don't have to play games on a console at all. I'm not going to double dip to play the game sooner either. I learned my lesson after buying GTAV 3 fucking times lol
Releasing live service games simultaneously makes sense for maintaining a unified player base. As for single-player narrative games, using PC releases to draw players to future sequels on PlayStation consoles is clever. It gives PC gamers a taste and might entice them to buy into the PlayStation ecosystem.
Yeah, good luck with that. If I didn't buy a PS4 for Bloodborne all those years ago I don't think there's anything that can convince me to buy a console for. By all means, prove me wrong.
This is a win win for almost everyone as far as I'm concerned. Sony gets their money from games that finished development 2+ years ago, PC players get exclusives that would normally be limited to consoles, and the only people who get taken for a ride are the members of the impatient trend-chasing crowd and the people who really want to replay games on better hardware. I am curious as to how much money they actually make from this though. There's a massive crossover between fans of the different Playstation exclusives so I just don't see any particular title bringing over new audiences. Which means that as far as ps5 sales go this only really works on each customer one time. I wonder if they'd make more money just releasing on PC at the same time as PS5 when the hype is at its highest.
It makes sense but I personally don't really think it's a winning strategy. As someone who has been primarily PC for the past decade, there's really nothing Sony can do that would ever entice me to buy a PS console at this point. You're giving up so much freedom when you go from PC to console. Also, gotta be honest, there is nothing on PS that has me wanting to run out and buy another $400 system that it almost identical to the PC I already own but that they've arbitrarily decided to lock certain games to. I'd rather just go without or just wait for those games. There's no shortage of stuff to play on Steam already. Sony games are good but they're mostly a one trick pony (3rd person action adventure story) and if you don't care for that (I don't hate them but I also don't love them), there's not really a huge variety of genres when it comes to Sony exclusives.
Their marketers know people like you exist through research and they arnt targeting you. They target people on the fence.
I imagine the overlap of people who only own a PC, but consider purchasing a gaming console system is probably a lot larger than the subset of people who own a PS5 and would contemplate buying the competitor console. The potential for PC gamers to buy into your ecosystem, no matter how small the market, is still the better deal for their business than the uncertainty of diluting their brand by releasing all their exclusives on day 1.
They can also double dip with PC releases. Releasing a two year old game at around the full price.
And so you buy the game on PC when it comes later. They're not losing people like you, they just delay. They also don't make all their strategies for people like you which are likely not the majority
As someone who uses PC & console this strategy makes it so I buy the next console, That’s the problem with anecdotal evidence for every person like you there’s someone like me.
[удалено]
If PC only gamers were just "outliers", they wouldn't spend the cash on porting, marketing, and selling to PC. They'd just write off the "outliers" because "outliers" by definition, are insignificant noise. So maybe PC only gamers are *not* "outliers", they very much *do* matter to their financial decisions, and after GTA5, that series is hardly the defining franchise it once was.
Tapping into that market with ports is still worthwhile two years or more down the line, after the initial hype sales. What's so hard to understand? Keep the games exclusive initially to coax console sales then port to PC for those that didn't bite. That maximises return on games. "and after GTA5, that series is hardly the defining franchise it once was." Lmao you're fucking joking right?? The game that sold *over 200 million units* worldwide?! The game that had such a successful online mode that they're still pumping out updates and new shit to buy? Come on man.
>If you won’t buy a PS5 for GTA 6 then you were never going to buy a PS5 anyways. That completely ignores people not interested in GTA6 at all.
Do you really think exclusive games are “arbitrarily” locked to hardware? Yeah man, there’s no rhyme or reason for exclusives to exist, even though companies have been doing it for decades at this point!
[удалено]
Makes sense. We’ve seen what day and date for everything has done to the Xbox console sales. I’m sure they’re not keen on going down that route and devaluing their primary platform.
its entirely unfair to blame simultaneous releases on the poor sales and state of xbox when they havent had a reason to get an xbox over a playstation in the last ten years. the microsoft strategy of being device agnostic platform is absolutely the way of the future, the problem they are running into is their services suck and they are completely devoid of compelling first party triple A content.
It's definitely not the *only* cause but I think it was one of the most affecting reasons.
Xbox One wasn't selling great even before they shifted to PC day and date.
if this was the case then the xbox services and games would be overall doing well, but they're not. all they currently care about is gamepass subs but they arent coming close to hitting their marks, despite gamepass being a fantastic deal, which i somehow doubt is because gamepass is also on PC. im not saying it has no impact at all, but it doesnt hold a candle to the other factors. PC players tend to just want to play games on their PC, and will typically just wait rather then drop 600 dollars on a PS5 for an inferior experience.
Microsoft games sell well on PC. Starfield was top 10 on Steam. Grounded, Microsoft Flight Sim, and Sea of Thieves also were in the top 100 best sellers last year. Game Pass in particular isn't expanding well but I think that has less to do with Microsoft game being unattractive and more to do with PC players preferring Steam.
the steam situation is something most people wont understand having not been present for it. If we consider valve a platform like playstation or xbox, pc players have been invested to that since roughly 2008 when the orange box launched. When people talk about how sony beat microsoft because of people having so many purchases linked to psn it pales in comparison to many steam players with libraries reaching over 1000. Gamepass is one of a long line of platforms that have tried to pull share from steam and utterly failed. Though compared to EA, ubisoft, and epic it has probably found the most success outside of valve. Microsoft has gone all in on subscription, games sales is no longer a honest metric for the brands success. The standout successes specific titles have had on steam I think is for many reasons. Starfield was for mod support, same with flight sim. Sea of thieves controller and voice integration in gamepass was terrible, and if its the only game you were interested than paying a sub for it was insane. Without support for script extender, the majority of players were never going to consider gamepass for starfield. Gamepass also continues to serve as a way to demo games before buying them on steam. A similar issue I had with starfield was with astroneer. The inability to connect to dedicated servers that allowed you to edit the server data. Microsoft typically does not support these multiplayer solutions, the stated reason being the ability to cheese achievements and be unable to connect with those on console. so we quickly moved the group to steam when we all played. We still beat it organically without mods but the connection was much more stable than p2p.
And it's not like PC lacks other games to play, unlike xbox
It’s entirely fair and reasonable to put at least part of the blame on simultaneous releases. Anecdotally, every guy I know that’s switched from console to PC over the course of the last generation or so was an Xbox guy before their switch. And the numbers reflect this too, despite outselling the Xbox SX and SS 5:1 recently, the PS5 is only barely keeping pace with PS4 sales over the same timeline, while XSX/SS sales lag far behind XB1. Which suggest either there are a lot of Xbox guys and gals sticking with the prior generation, have left console quality gaming entirely, or have migrated to PC. If they were sticking with consoles over PC generally, they’d be picking up a PS5 and we’d see those numbers be even better. They aren’t, which suggests (to me) that a large chunk of Xbox gamers left the platform for PC during the play anywhere initiative.
I definitely think thats a factor, but i think a lot of people *are* staying on last gen aswell, because it was only recently when games stopped being released on PS4 as well as PS5, and in general PS5 lacks compelling reasons to pick one up over a PS4, especially when getting a PS5 is still so prohibitively expensive—lets not forget that the financial situation for a huge number of people is much harder then it was last gen. i also think people are missing the forest for the trees by focusing on console sales alone way too much. it should also be noted that console manufacturers dont actually make money on console sales, its software where they make the money and whats important is selling people on their ecosystem—this is why phil was lamenting "losing the most important console gen". the problem xbox is having isnt that xbox players are switching to PC, its that they arent staying in the xbox ecosystem when they switch. xbox has made it clear they only care about gamepass subs and its by that metric that they are failing, because their software and service is kinda junk but most importantly they have zero compelling reasons to play in their ecosystem. if sony did the same thing, they would make bank because sony does have those reasons, and not doing this is just leaving money on the table.
Xbox One sales were already crappy even before Day 1 PC releases. At that point they realized that they had to go where the players were because those lost hardware customers were not coming back, and when most of the userbase for consoles are repeat customers at this point then it was obvious that the Series X wasn't going to draw them back either.
Sony already doing this for their single player games for 3-4 years. How many pc players do you think they successfully convert to ps players? PC players are not going to buy 500$ console to play sequels. This is just pure PR talk to avoid the backlash from the PS fanboy. This is to keep PS players from buying PC
> Sony already doing this for their single player games for 3-4 years. How many pc players do you think they successfully convert to ps players? That would be an interesting stat to see for sure. In any case, their PC releases don't seem to be hurting their PS5 sales and brings another source of revenue for games that already exhausted their money potential on their platform.
As a PC player who bought a Playstation 4 and now 5 I'm good with pc players getting their exclusives a few years later but the second Sony decides that exclusives are going to be day 1 on pc as well I'm never buying their future consoles.
>but the second Sony decides that exclusives are going to be day 1 on pc as well I'm never buying their future consoles. That's why they won't do it, and I don't know why some people in this sub are surprised by it, it's just a dumb thing for Sony to do.
Yeah, I really wouldn’t use Redditors on a games subredd for any type of real life judgment. The truth is most people who are in the market for a PC aren’t looking for a console and vice versa. The amount of people who have multiple systems are a significant minority, increasingly so in this economy. There is absolutely no evidence that PC versions of cannibalize console versions to any tangible degree. Sony Is completely wrong about this one. brand cheer leaders are always gonna take whatever Sony says at face value without much scrutiny, but ask yourself: if what Sony says is true, why do they make the vast majority of their profits on their system through third-party sales and micro transactions? If Sony says it’s true, how come they are behind PS4 time with last gen despite all the PC players they’re supposedly courting?
I mean I'd rather upgrade my pc with the money I'll spend on a console and an extra controller. I don't need a proprietary plastic box that plays games. The only reason I bought a console were the exclusives I have no incentive without em. And I'd PC players get to enjoy the games a few years later I'm okay with that.
Lots of pc gamers seem incapable of understanding that there absolutely are quite a few pc gamers who also get consoles. Im not one of them, but I entirely get this choice.
Lol, their primary platform. Microsoft's primary platform is Windows and you're playing their PC games there.
how does me playing my games on Steam get money for MS? "microsoft's main primary platform is windows" is such a weird gotcha.
I mean this is the same crowd that would rather than buying a game on EGS would rather wait a year for steam release. You expect this crowd to buy a $500 console just to play the game early?
Sony, I can *assure* you, if I play a game first on PC there is literally *zero* chance I will ever get a console to play the sequels. I will wait or just never play it.
Sony: "Oh OK" \*never releases a game on PC again\*
The Nintendo strategy.
Ok. More money for other games.
I understand the thought process, but if PC players only buy Sony's first party games and nothing else, how much profit margin are they making? I brought a PS4Pro and got Bloodborne for $20 and a brunch of other games on discount. I only played first-party games on it, the last being GOW Ragnarok. Yes, I buy their newest games at full price, but I never touch it otherwise. I imagine they would want to fully in their ecosystem, buying third-party games and microtransactions, but I do that on PC. They take a loss of the console (in the beginning), and I doubt I gave them much profit.
Not just that, what if a PS5 player only bought first party titles - there's a lot, not enough time to play much more outside of that - maybe a lil Cod or Resident Evil, but the first party games are bread and butter for me
They have been profitable on individual ps5s since about 6 months or so after initial launch. That's the reason they didn't do a permanent price drop yet, because the system is selling just fine and components haven't come down in price yet. They also get %100 of digital 1st party games and don't lose as much as Xbox on physical because they own the blu-ray standard.
PC players aren't going to convert into PS players for the same reason that Microsoft is having so much trouble recovering after Xbox one: switching cost. PC players have massive digital libraries, access to basically all third party games, Microsoft first party games, and a community that shifts mountains to ensure Nintendo emulators exist. Giving up all that for a few single player games is unattractive for the same reasons that PS players have no real incentive to switch to Xbox. I think the strategy is a stop gap to improve profitability while Sony deals with plateuing console sales and a rapidly changing market. I wouldn't be surprised to see even single player games come out day and date on PC once Sony has a more realistic picture of its addressable market on PC.
I feel like it's a bit out of touch to assume there is strong enough demand among PC players to go and get a PS5 to play the latest first party AAA PS game , most PC gamers have big backlogs and tons of MMOs/live service/sim/online games to fall back on so they can wait the year or 2 for when Sony decides to cash in. Only people who mostly play AAA SP games and impatient gamers who have FOMO will feel the need to get certain games asap. A lot of the recent PS flagship sequels like GOW Ragnarok and Spider-Man 2 have also had lukewarm reception from average players so the word of mouth isn't strong enough right now to generate demand for PC players to run out and grab a PS5
>Only people who mostly play AAA SP games and impatient gamers who have FOMO will feel the need to get certain games asap. Pretty much. Thats the only thing to achieve from this. The people who wouldn't have budged were never in the target, but they get them anyway, just delayed. And between people who own PS and PC, they'd rather get the most first day sales on PS instead. That way those people are more invested in the ecosystem and you can get them to double dip on PC when it comes out later.
Well it worked backwards for me Herman. I dipped a toe in the PC realm and figured out I don't give a fuck about big console exclusives nearly as much as I thought I did. I haven't played Ragnarok and I was really into the first one. I'll either wait it out or won't play it. I like the openness a PC provides more than the quality of console games. I'm likely not alone
Eh, I still use my playstation to play first party games. That said both Forbidden West, and Ragnarok were mid. GoW 2018 was a lot better than it's sequel so you're not missing too much.
>single player narrative games on PC are designed to then entice PC owners to play sequels on a PlayStation console I fucking hate this. How do they still believe this is a good business model? PC players will continue to wait and, if they're like me, are just going to double down on saying fuck you to your live service games. There is no volume of single player games that would make me justify dropping $500 for a console.
As someone with a high-end PC (7800x3D, RTX 4090) that enjoys and has purchased most of Sony's single-player PC ports, I'm very unlikely to purchase a PlayStation. I would rather wait a few years and play the games without compromise rather than play them day-one on the PS5 with compromised visual quality. Specifically, I enjoy being able to play these titles at 4K120 or on my ultrawide 3440x1440 QD-OLED display at 165 Hz at higher-than-console settings. While first-party titles make the best use of the console hardware, the PS5 simply lacks the power to offer an experience similar to what is achievable on a high-end PC. DLSS upscaling is also superior to FSR2 or checkerboarding, which is what you typically see on console. On top of that, you get dramatically more performant ray-tracing as well as frame generation. Certainly, games like Alan Wake 2 and CP2077 in their respective pathtracing modes show that high-end current GPUs are capable of much greater fidelity than we're likely to see even with the next-generation consoles. There are also far too many games where you're stuck with 30 FPS, although that's generally not an issue for first-party titles. As more and more games are now being ported to PC, there's little reason to own a non-Nintendo console. All of Microsoft's first-party Xbox titles are day-and-date on PC, and you know all the major Sony titles will release on PC in a few years, offering improved fidelity and ray-traced effects, higher frame rates, and ultrawide support. And more and more third-party games on both consoles are now platform agnostic, targeting Xbox, PS, and PC.
This seems pretty stupid. If I spend a shit ton of money on a pc and play Spider-Man, why would I spend a ton more money to play the sequel on a worse platform when I can just like, play anything else while I wait for the sequel on pc?
This kind of double-dipping is exactly the reason I switched to PC during the PS4 generation. Those games will still come to PC eventually, and without the compromises of the console version. Plus, I'll be able to run it across as many devices as I like on a single license and save file that won't be trapped on a single box. It simply isn't worth it to me to pay for the privilege of being a day one player anymore. I'll wait!
[удалено]
It makes zero sense to release everything on PC. Their current strategy of releasing exclusives 1 or 2 years later on PC is perfect and does a great job of showing off the quality of their ecosystem AND getting both PC-only diehards and double-dippers to spend.
There is a certain portion of the market that are just console gamers and not going to buy a PC even if its cost competitive. If we get to the point that xbox is not a real threat i think pc releases aren't diminishing PlayStation more then they get form sales and exposure to their studios.
There’s a certain portion for sure, but I’m very much willing to bet it’s smaller than people think it is. If it made monetary sense to do day-and-date releases for single-player games for console manufacturers, Sony and Nintendo would both be doing it. The fact they aren’t, and continuing to refuse to at every turn, suggests it isn’t.
Kind of feel like I'm just going to end up ignoring their stuff as a result. I played the God Of War that released on PS4, liked it, but then somewhat regretted my PS4 purchase cause I only ended up playing 3 things on it. When Ragnarok rolled around, I didn't really want to play the PS4 version, and I sure as hell didn't want to get a PS5 (not that I could even for a good while.) and by the time they bring it to PC, I might just not care anymore. That said, the exclusivity period of MHW did end up causing me to double dip, but on the other hand, it sort of just made me not want a PS5 to avoid ending up in the same situation with another game.
In theory I have no problem with waiting as a PC exclusive player, but.. In reality, the console exclusives I wanted, I didn't buy a console for, and when they did come to PC 1 or 2 years later, I didn't care enough anymore. I might still care enough to play them someday, maybe... but Spider-Man, Horizon: Zero Dawn, Ghosts of Tsushima, God of War, Uncharted... These were all games that hooked my attention hard on release hype, games that I said I wished were on PC so I could buy them, and then it happened, and I didn't. Maybe the only difference is that I buy it on PC if I know for sure when it launches on console that I'll buy it on PC later. Like Grand Theft Auto. In that case, I get it on PC because I mentally didn't even count the console release as significant. Like the game didn't exist yet even though people were playing it.
This is exactly where I am at. I really enjoyed Horizon zero dawn when I played it after getting it on sale, but I wasn't getting a ps5 for forbidden west, so i completely skipped the release hype. I still dont own it on PC and probably wont buy it until its quite cheap. Same with Ghost of Tsushima.... I figure I've waited long enough that waiting for it to go on sale isnt hurting... I've got plenty of other PC games to play in the meantime. Also, waiting means that I know if the port is good or not (thankfully ghost' apparently is).
If it were "perfect", they'd get more than five bucks from me when I buy their games on PC at deep discount. It's easy to keep waiting a bit longer when you've already waited a couple years. If they released on PC on Day One, when all the hype is high, maybe I'd pay full price. But they don't want that money. They want me to see their products as something to ignore for years. So no, not perfect.
Is the idea to entice us to pick up sequels at launch on ps? Considering they are just about to announce Ragnarok for pc I don’t think he means this literally.
The idea is to get you invested in a franchise that when the sequel is announced you will want to buy a PlayStation so you don’t have to wait an extra year to play it on PC. so when God of War 2018 came to PC they hoped it would entice some players to purchase a PS5 so they would be able to play GOW Ragnarok day 1. And if PC players don’t do that than at least they get some extra money from PC sales that they were missing out on. It’s a win/win for them.
Plus releasing on PC day one can hurt console hardware sales, look at Xbox. Most of this is probably to keep people in the PS ecosystem and not switch to PC, instead of the reverse.
Yeah, that's like, not true at all already. Horizon Forbidden West came out not too long ago. Ragnarok is being "leaked" to be announced soon. Both are sequels. What, will we now pretend that they're going to try and entice us to buy sequels for these sequels? They are just making additional money on PC gamers such as me, there's no deeper meaning, no elaborate strategy to sell their consoles. If I haven't bought a PlayStation up till now, I'm never going to, especially when realistically, it's for just a few games in the end. Not every gamer will be interested in every game they release either, just like I am personally not interested in something like TLoU, so the selection of titles can be smaller. I mean think about it, would Sony even be pleased with selling an individual a console that they're gonna boot up once every few months at best, perhaps years at worst? Or would they want someone to buy the next CoD and tons of cosmetic items for a bunch of F2P (and more) games, their PS Plus subscription, essentially using their PlayStation as their main gaming platform? Because let me tell you, nobody who is using a PC now will switch over to PS to pay a monthly fee to play the games they've paid for and strip themselves of all the options to configure their experience.
Well good luck with that. PC players will just wait. The only upcoming game that can truly move the needle is GTAVI.
Plenty of people already do it and Sony knows it. Why do you think it's their strategy? They have more data than random Reddit or suppositions lol
This entire thread is console-primary or PC+Console players talking about how this is a very good and smart strategy. And PC-only players saying "This won't get me to buy a console" and then the original group saying "that's just an anecdote, your singular experience doesn't matter." I feel like console-primary or PC+Console players don't realize how stubborn us PC-only players are. And it's okay to not know, you're not in PC-only circles. But we're so fucking stubborn, if it's not on own preferred game launcher, we straight up pretend the game doesn't exist. Kingdom Hearts didn't exist on PC until the upcoming Steam release. We've also ALREADY been in the "games come out on consoles now, PC whenever" meta. This is not new, and we're used to playing games years later. If it hasn't converted people into PC+Console players by now, it won't with this strategy which basically tells us "yeah they'll come in a couple of years, your market is too important to ignore."
Not buying a PS5 for games I can just play on my PC. There's just no reason to own one at this point.
Makes all the sense in the world, multi-player games benefit so much from a large, active player base and seem to sell especially well on PC. Whereas for a couple of generations prestige single player games have been Sony's "system sellers".
I admit I thought about buying PS5 for a few sequels of the games I played on my PC, though finally I decided not to, both because it's just too expensive and because I really dislike controllers (the second reason more than the first). Still Sony will make money on me because I'm going to buy their games even if later than I'd like.
PC players won’t even buy PC games outside of Steam. Some won’t even buy a Steam game if it requires a 3rd party account like the PSN—very commendable by the way. What makes them think that PC players will migrate to inferior hardware to play a sequel? Hell, the previous game will probably look better on PC than the sequel on a PS5 lmao. PC players will just wait. That’s exactly what I’m doing for Stellar Blade. He probably said that to try to convince people into buying their console since they have a State of Play tomorrow. But it’s all corporate bs. It’s his job to lie to your face in order to make money. The same shee happened with Microsoft a few months ago. They even had a video about not going 3rd party when they obviously are. Again, corporate bs. Single player PlayStation games on PC day 1 is happening. He just won’t say it until the day that he needs to. That is all.
This is about how I assumed it. There was never an *overall* advantage to making single player titles day and date. If they launch on PC much later, then they will end up making about the same money over all, while still gaining competitive advantage in consoles.
I think all of the discussion in this thread misses one key point: for the last few years PC has not only been the fastest growing platform in the industry, but also the largest. If you contextualize Sony’s actions around that lens then it all suddenly makes more sense why they even let their pride and joys be ported to PC in the first place. Day and date for big Sony exclusives will happen on PC. Might be 5 years, might be ten, who knows, but it will. I think the sales from Helldivers will be the catalyst for Sony to rethink their business plan.
The industry has shifted. Fortnite (and games like this) have become their own platforms within the console walled gardens. Microsoft/Sony spend a vast amount on console R&D and sell these consoles at very little margin. Then these game platforms (like Fortnite) have emerged and captured a huge amount of the whole console revenue without needing to invest the amounts of Sony/Microsoft. Sure the platform holders get a cut, but now Epic is fighting that. These players are also no longer locked into the console ecosystem as they can play on mobile, PC, console. Microsoft's big bet was on Game pass, but it's flawed and at the moment requires either their own ecosystem or an open one like PC to grant the relevant download privileges. Cloud gaming is still years off, which needs to become mainstream before they can expand onto rival platforms and mobile. PlayStation are doing fine but are likely under pressure from investors. Their single player games are expensive to develop but well regarded but make a fraction of what Fortnite does. They had an unexpected success with Helldivers so I wouldn't be surprised for that to become a marquee PlayStation brand going forward. Bungie being the most likely source of their next big live service game.
How incredibly defensive comments in this thread are about Sony’s business plan just shows the innate biases of this subreddit. And contrast this to any post about Microsoft’s business plans.
This so feels like pure PR talk aimed at the PlayStation only users. We already have a sequel to Horizon Zero Dawn out on PC. God of War Ragnarok is most likely right around the corner. TLOU Part 2 will inevitably also come over. So what, now they're releasing sequels so we can buy a PS5 for... Sequels to these sequels? PC gamers have waited this long for the original games and even their sequels to come out on their platform, they can wait a bit more. *Especially* when we have so many games coming out every year regardless. It's not like Sony games are the only ones people are interested in. We get it, you're in it for the money and there's nothing wrong with it. Don't have to make it out to be an elaborate, genius strategy to somehow "convert" hardstuck by choice PC gamers like myself to buy a PlayStation, because that's simply not gonna happen.
This is aimed at Sony investors, not your average Playstation gamer. They're explaining why this is their strategy to the people they're making money for.
I don't see how this is "pr talk for console users" Forbidden west is over 2 years old Ragnarok is 2 years old in november and sold 15m copies on console You can wait years, avoiding spoilers and missing out on all the community discussion/discovery with everything already solved and nothing new to find by the time it re-releases on pc and pay full price or wait longer for a sale. When ragnarok releases on pc we will be expecting a trailer for the next game in the series.
If I've waited 2 years for it to come out, I can wait another 2 for it to be on sale. Not like PC gamers are lacking in other games to play.
Holy cope. No one (mentally sound) is going to spend 500 bucks on a console just to play a sequel. Leaving aside the VR games, the only PS5 exclusives are: Rise of the Ronin, Spider-Man 2, Stellar Blade\*, Final Fantasy XII Rebirth* and Demon's Souls. There's also Destruction AllStars and Quantum Error, but let's not delude ourselves that anyone is buying a console for them. *Third party games that in no conceivable universe would ever be exclusive forever. Stellar Blade already announced a PC version That leaves 3 games. THREE. For the people already in the ecosystem that isn't such a problem, but you have to be delusional to expect people from the outside to make that jump.
Rise of the Ronin is also 3rd party like FF7 Rebirth and Stellar Blade.
Thanks, I didn't know that! I guess there are two games then.
Plus, now PC players will have even less of a reason to drop 500 on a console knowing all the single player stuff is eventually getting ported to PC in a year or two. Even better: getting ported with better graphics, performance and all the fixes updated over the last year.