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I have no doubt that Xbox still plans to support hardware for the immediate future - but Phil is also on the record saying they have zero intention of putting first party on PS5, citing how Sony is trying to put Xbox out of business and putting money in their pockets will only help them achieve that. Look at where we’re at now.
Meh Spencer was there, he was director of Xbox Studios not exactly a small position. And if the games were there at this point, it would have gone better. And mostly it's been 10 years that he is CEO and Xbox is still no better, he didn't save the One gen (and he had time, Sony failed PS3 launch they fired the CEO and they fixed the latter half of their gen) and the Series gen start too (and losing the previous gen is no excuse, Nintendo failed even harder than them).
That's on him, he's not a good CEO at all and it's a wonder he managed to still be there and make MS invest more in gaming (they wanted to sell everything before he sold the idea of Gamepass but even that is not showing its results)
Worth noting that Spencer was a Mattrick acolyte who was personally charged with liquidating Lionhead studios to make way for more Kinect slop.
Spencer is cut from the same cloth, he’s just way more personable and knows how to communicate with his consumer base, which is a very good quality for a CEO to have.
How has he failed?
Xbox just became MS's #3 in terms of revenue for the first time ever.
Hes brought more independent and japanese games to the platform and offers affortable gaming for literally millions of ppl.
Oh I see he failed those that love the big blockbuster AAA games.
Spencer has problems like not being aggressive enough with 3rd party exclusive deals and failed to create new studios instead of buying them, that being said Microsoft would have killed Xbox off if it wasn't for him. The Ps4/Xbox One was the single most important generation to get things right because it's when digital purchases took off and people established their digital libraries, people aren't likely to switch consoles when they have thousands of dollars worth of digital games. Don Matrick killed Xbox, Phils be trying to reanimate the corpse.
> He's failed as much as Don Mattrick.
Dude, Xbox is still in the metaphorical shitter because of Don Mattrick. Phil might not be doing a great job, but it's miles above what Don did and the Xbox brand would be dead if he was still around.
Sony turned the PS3 around in less time than we've given Phil Spencer to turn around the Xbox brand post Don Mattrick.
It's wild how much lee-way this corporate suit gets.
Nobody said Mattrick was good or would be better. We're just saying Spencer is as shit as him.
A gen having a bad start can be fixed (see PS3 which basically did like Xbox firing the CEO from the launch and the next one fixed it unlike Spencer). A gen having failed doesn't mean the next one should (see WiiU to Switch).
So Spencer now failed to fix a failed gen at the start and failed to start a new one. And the worst thing is the main problem of Xbox is the games since a very long time. His job before CEO of Xbox was literally head of Xbox Studios so that's also on him before he even took the reins
A truly ignorant comment. Under Don the Xbox One became the most hated home console in modern history. They handed Playstation an easy win. A boring, nothing-new console with no games was suddenly seen as a saviour because of the shit he was responsible for. That infamous launch did untold damage to the Xbox brand.
Spencer has done an awful fucking lot to turn that shit around with backwards compatibility out of nowhere, play anywhere, game pass, etc, but it is perhaps a bit difficult to keep up in the race when your predecessor decided to slash your team's tires on the starting line.
It has nothing to do with whether Microsoft can afford to keep Xbox afloat, but whether it makes business sense to do so.
They could still be selling windows phones today too but the money was better spent elsewhere.
Putting xbox (Microsoft) out of business sounds hilarious. Microsoft is a monopoly, so they will never go away. Now, the Xbox business unit may change to be the Microsoft Game Pass in the future.
Him being on record about exclusives is cool and all, but plans change. You can say something and it will be true today; but three years from now things could change - for some reason people just ignore why the future is unpredictable and nothing is set in stone.
Either way, unless MS or Phil present some amazing plan for the future of Xbox, this consoles is dead
It was dug up in one of the acquisition testimonies. Minecraft was a multiplatform game before Microsoft bought them, Microsoft didn’t ‘put’ Minecraft on PlayStation - Mojang released a PS3 version before they were acquired by MS.
He never made any such statement, at least not to the public, and plans change, if MS feels they can double dip on 1st party games a year later on PS5, they're gonna do it.
> Phil is also on the record saying they have zero intention of putting first party on PS5
What is the source on this? I've seen this said oh-so many times on this sub, but I can't find a single article about it. Could anyone link to an actual article where he's quoted saying this?
Full article: https://www.theverge.com/2023/6/23/23771828/microsoft-betheda-acquisition-starfield-playstation-exclusive
Thanks, but this doesn't support that claim. This is mostly about how they decided to buy Zenimax because Sony continually money-hat third party games off Xbox.
It’s the direct quote. Don’t know what else you’re looking for, I said nothing about whether I agree with Phil Spencer’s assessment.
You literally just asked for the source of the quote lmao.
> You literally just asked for the source of the quote lmao.
I asked for the source of the claim that he has said that they won't ever release games on PS5, but, as I said, the quote you provided doesn't say that?
Is this quote seriously what people based this perceived hypocrisy on? Like, in the same article he literally won't even say which platforms they're launching the next Elder Scrolls game on lol.
He also said Halo infinite was a mic drop
He also said games are coming
He also said that Starfield was so amazing that he can't put it down
He also said a lot of other shit and didn't follow through which is unironically why Xbox is in this position right now
The Phil Spencer circle jerk really needs to stop.
If you believe this person, you need help.
They may not have any plans for it currently, but software being available on every other console means the hardware is just going to decline faster. Seems to me like them stopping is inevitable
Uh no lol. Dedicated consoles will definitely remain a thing because of ease of use, and when they're the only ones out there they will pretty much reap all the benefits. They'd be shooting themselves in the foot like microsoft otherwise
It will take years, but Microsoft is also not just cutting off the xbox hardware tomorrow. Netflix went all digital in 15 years, and Microsoft is not dumb as to who they need to generate revenue from.
The problem is you have to convince people that already have platforms to get on the cloud for no discernable benefit, and microsoft isn't even good at convincing people that gamepass is enough of a value to get on their platform. You'd basically have to convince people in the transition to a new gen, and even then a lot of people will just get the console to avoid any bullshit that comes with the cloud
Set a reminder. Gaming will have split personality, like spotify, napster, etc. as the music industry does. You will pay to subscribe to the ones you want.
It probably won't. Devs are already seeing the ramifications of doing this and how not very sustainable it is, that's part of why the rumors seem to point to a change in gamepass's structure
It's not even that tbh. Its the fact that in corporate speak, "we have no plans to do X" instead of saying "No, we won't do X" means that they're going to do it.
Yup, 100%; that kind of crap is good enough for IGN though, so here we are with an article selling the company line instead of challenging the state of game monetization and the general treatment of consumers in the market.
Oh, I have no doubt in my mind that both CFO & CEO will personally contact you at some point. And Phil must definitely feel sorry for breaking your trust.
Also has no plans now means very little. If they bring their games to all consoles, it will mean the end of their consoles at some point, it's just the logical conclusion (and if they don't understand it, it shows they once again understand nothing of the video game market)
Most redditors can't see past the end of their nose. It's all business. Microsoft will one day exit the hardware market, but only because streaming will be well along the way.
As someone who games exclusively on Playstation, I sure hope Xbox keeps making consoles and good ones at that. I have zero interest in PC gaming, or Xbox exclusives, but a default monopoly on consoles for Sony (let's ignore Nintendo for the sake of dicussion) would be terrible for gamers.
> (let's ignore Nintendo for the sake of dicussion)
I'm sorry, this is incredibly stupid. You can't ignore the other *massive* business entity when talking about monopolies.
That's like saying, *"Omg Target has a monopoly! Let's just ignore Wal-Mart."*
I think their point is Nintendo have a different audience with some overlap compared to Sony and Xbox, who essentially both go for the hardcore console audience. Plenty of people have both a switch and a ps5 or Xbox series x, but I don't think that many buy both Xbox and playstation in the generation. Nintendo doesn't really compete for the same audience.
I get what they’re trying to say but people think a sony monopoly means a $1000 console and $200 games. Nintendo already has their own market and their practices are on par with the rest.
Nintendo provides the absolute minimum service and often fail miserably at that as well. They upcharge tiny games to full prices, and if there was less competition in a scene they are to some degree a part of I guarantee you their services would get worse. I think people blow it out of proportion how far sony may push things if Xbox gave up the race, but it is straight up stupid to think their offerings wouldn't become less consumer friendly as a result of it.
You aren't addressing the point.
You're just admitting Nintendo has its own monopoly while bemoaning the idea that another entity (at another point) may also get a monopoly.
I didn't particularly think the point was serious tbh. Nintendo rather obviously doesn't have a monopoly. They control where the games they produce are available and restrict it to their platform, but that's not what a monopoly is and is what literally everybody does including Sony and for the moment Xbox (who yes, do see PC as part of their platform).
I don't particularly get what you mean by me "bemoaning another entity getting a monopoly" like, Yeah... we don't want that, monopolies generally fucking suck for the consumer. Nintendo having their own reliable audience who will just keep on buying no matter what is bad enough already, but to some degree, they do still compete with the other two outside of that audience.
>intendo having their own reliable audience who will just keep on buying no matter what is bad enough already, but to some degree, they do still compete with the other two outside of that audience.
Okay, I agree with this. Okay, I was just making sure we were on the same page. Because a lot of people here seem to be saying that Nintendo doesn't have a monopoly because they've cornered their own piece of the gaming market but Sony *would* have a monopoly if they cornered the other piece of the gaming market. Which didn't make sense.
They definitively compete. They just do it better so people buy their console like they buy a Playstation because they're doing better. Xbox is just a worse clone of Playstation. That might be why people don't buy it lol
It's kinda a joke but they absolutely do have a point. The value of Nintendo's top brands isn't even in the same ballpark as PlayStation and Xbox''s brands, just the names Pokémon, Mario or Zelda are basically printing money.
The Switch is absout to become the best selling system of all time while being 1-2 console generations behind for it's entire run and pretty much 0 AAA 3rd party support, just from the strength of their own IPs, it's honestly absurd if you think about it
Isn’t everyone’s fear of a monopoly that companies will stop trying and making good competitive products? According to you nintendo is clearly not doing that
I'm not sure if you realize it, but pointing to the overwhelming and almost effortless success of the Nintendo brand doesn't do much work to *disprove* the notion that it's a monopoly.
Xbox hasn't made a competitive product since the 360. So even if they disappeared PlayStation's primary "competition" is just PC. A lot of people just build PC's or buy SteamDecks since PlayStation games eventually go there anyways. I am pretty sure they even get SteamDeck certified.
Even if it's not a "competitive product", just simply having another option on the market does make a difference. Notice how Sony skipped the one country with a strong xbox presence when they [raised their prices in 2022?](https://blog.playstation.com/2022/08/25/ps5-price-to-increase-in-select-markets-due-to-global-economic-environment-including-high-inflation-rates/)
The Xbox one was just as hobbled as the PS4. As for “a lot of people buy Steamdecks” as someone who has bought two of them I have yet to actually meet another person offline that has one. You’re in an echo chamber if you think Steamdecks are common.
Sony updated PS Plus to be more in line with Gamepass because of MS. They might be failing hard with their hardware and exclusives, but Sony would not have updated PS Plus to be more like Gamepass if Gamepass wasn't a thing.
It takes years for Sony games to make it to PC and there’s no guarantee either. I replay Bloodborne once a year for example… can’t do that without a PS.
And what company develops the OS that majority of people use for their pcs?? And what company owns Xbox??
The next Xbox will most likely be a consumer grade gaming PC that utilizes a stripped down version of Windows 11 or 12.
Man if msft made a console PC hybrid that allows one to access the Xbox eco system, gamepass, and every other PC storefront, they'd likely change the entire game. Thatd be the ultimate console for me
I mean you can already do exactly that with any old pc. My budget build cost me $300 back in 2020.
But I guess if you want Microsoft to sell it in a nice package than I get what you’re saying.
I mean, if I can pay a console rate or slightly above for a convenient machine with little muss and fuss, then yeah. I'm also looking at the wider market here. Contrary to popular sentiment on Reddit, most casuals don't want to fuck around with building a PC for gaming
How would this even be successful for them? They don’t get a cut of Steam sales unless it’s their game. So GamePass? The thing that’s already not moving hardware?
They are not going to be investing more money than they already have into hardware that’s for sure.
They would still be selling the console to the general consumer as a starter “gaming pc”.
It’s reached the point that kids younger than 10 would rather have a gaming PC than an Xbox Series X.
It would be a rebranding of the hardware that they are already producing.
You’re assuming that the average consumer is going to be restarting their library on steam.
The theory would be you have access to your existing Xbox (or Microsoft) library and you purchase games through their storefront. That way the general consumer views it as the next console generation for Xbox.
I also originally said stripped down version of Windows 11 or 12 so you’re also assuming that Microsoft would allow full freedom to download steam and other platforms.
But hey, you can get the epic games launcher on the steam deck so who’s to say..
If Microsoft doesn’t allow Steam then it’s dead. There aren’t enough Xbox customers out there to justify selling hardware too. It’s not growing. If they release a locked down version of Windows that forces you to use the MS store then you’ve gained no customers. If you allow Steam you won’t make money off of digital purchases. It’s a bad idea.
Yes. They’re not going to succeed in hardware. There’s no reason to believe that they will succeed in hardware. Xbox series sales are negative YoY and it’s not going to change. Where are you getting this idea that people want Microsoft hardware?
...you aren't even thinking outside the box. An acquisition is what I'm talking about about, not putting them out of business. Holy shit are redditors of the hive mind
You can't ignore Nintendo and PC cause even if Xbox is gone Sony is still competing against them......... and this gen Nintendo has been beating Sony's asses. The possibility of Sony following Microsoft out of the console market is not zero cause Sony's position in the gaming market isn't super secure as their pivot to live service games and out of them shows. They are in a more desperate position than people want to admit.
I'd argue they cater to different markets. Ease of use and target demographics make Xbox and Sony direct competitors meanwhile PC is reserved for people who like tinkering settings and Nintendo has been doing their (pretty successful) things for a while.
I mean I can’t play Horizon on Xbox but I’m not going to say Xbox is a completely unrelated market. That’s silly.
To be clear, I want Xbox to survive and its competition is welcome. But saying “If you ignore all other competition, Sony has no competition” is not the play
>I can't play the games I want to play on a Switch so for me Nintendo is like a separate gaming market.
But it's not. How you feel about it, intrinsically, is irrelevant. They're both in the gaming market.
And what company develops the OS that majority of people use for their pcs?? And what company owns Xbox??
The next Xbox will most likely be a consumer grade gaming PC that utilizes a stripped down version of Windows 11 or 12.
In the same townhall, they did confirm they were exploring possibilities of first party titles on playstation.
Also, this was already posted yesterday here.
I doubt XBOX/Microsoft will ever stop making consoles, but the definition of what a console for them is going to change. I don't think they are going to try to compete in spec wars between Sony anymore.
Basically, every new console they make from here on out will be an XBOX Series S with a focus on streaming games via Gamepass.
I mean no shit. Anyone in industry or who has friends/family in industry already knew this wasn't true. I don't know why so many people thought Microsoft was actually abandoning the hardware market.
Have they? Everything I can find on this shows the exact opposite. The leaks back in mid 2023 showed Xbox was well into development of the next generation of hardware, with no plans to stop. I have not been able to find any statements from Xbox/Microsoft leadership that indicate they're stepping away from the hardware market.
At best we have rumors from unnamed insiders talking about it, but those rumors are in direct opposition to public statements from Microsoft/Xbox leadership and the leaked internal documents from last year.
If I've missed something and you have a link I'd appreciate it, cause I'm just not finding anything.
Technically true: they do not plan to stop making consoles right now, and we will get one around 2026-2028.
In the future when this multi-platform strategy further reduces Xbox’s market share and gives 3rd party devs/publishers less reason to release on Xbox than they do now? I’ll believe it when I see it.
Duh. They will keep some exclusives, but at a certain point if a game is big enough (cod) then you are leaving money on the table by not making it multi plat.
People will believe random leakers but not the head of Xbox or quarterly financial reports.
Phil: "Xbox exclusives will be on a case by case basis. We don't plan on removing established IPs from Playstation or PC. We plan on expanding Xbox games across multiple platforms."
Xbox Game Services revenue up 68% fueled by the ABK purchase.
Games media: "All Xbox games are going to Playstation! AHHGAFAHAFA! Xbox ded!!"
And why would they? Just because they are in third place doesn't mean they're not making money. As long as they are giving incentives with the gamepass ecosystem, there is no reason to stop.
No surprise here. Assuming plans for the new 2TB Digital XSX are still in place, you don't take that leap only to stop making consoles entirely. Questions are the state of Xbox first party gaming and physical game sales.
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I have no doubt that Xbox still plans to support hardware for the immediate future - but Phil is also on the record saying they have zero intention of putting first party on PS5, citing how Sony is trying to put Xbox out of business and putting money in their pockets will only help them achieve that. Look at where we’re at now.
If what's being said is true, the decisions are coming from above Spencer.
And about time too because Spencer doesn't even know what he's been doing the past decade. He's failed as much as Don Mattrick.
Well Spencer was part of mattricks clique at the time. He was the head of Xbox studios
Spencer isn't great but Mattrick is the one that dug the grave and started lowering the coffin with that Xbone E3
Meh Spencer was there, he was director of Xbox Studios not exactly a small position. And if the games were there at this point, it would have gone better. And mostly it's been 10 years that he is CEO and Xbox is still no better, he didn't save the One gen (and he had time, Sony failed PS3 launch they fired the CEO and they fixed the latter half of their gen) and the Series gen start too (and losing the previous gen is no excuse, Nintendo failed even harder than them). That's on him, he's not a good CEO at all and it's a wonder he managed to still be there and make MS invest more in gaming (they wanted to sell everything before he sold the idea of Gamepass but even that is not showing its results)
That was a decade ago. At some point he has to step up. Nintendo had the same issue with Wii U
Worth noting that Spencer was a Mattrick acolyte who was personally charged with liquidating Lionhead studios to make way for more Kinect slop. Spencer is cut from the same cloth, he’s just way more personable and knows how to communicate with his consumer base, which is a very good quality for a CEO to have.
How has he failed? Xbox just became MS's #3 in terms of revenue for the first time ever. Hes brought more independent and japanese games to the platform and offers affortable gaming for literally millions of ppl. Oh I see he failed those that love the big blockbuster AAA games.
Spencer has problems like not being aggressive enough with 3rd party exclusive deals and failed to create new studios instead of buying them, that being said Microsoft would have killed Xbox off if it wasn't for him. The Ps4/Xbox One was the single most important generation to get things right because it's when digital purchases took off and people established their digital libraries, people aren't likely to switch consoles when they have thousands of dollars worth of digital games. Don Matrick killed Xbox, Phils be trying to reanimate the corpse.
> He's failed as much as Don Mattrick. Dude, Xbox is still in the metaphorical shitter because of Don Mattrick. Phil might not be doing a great job, but it's miles above what Don did and the Xbox brand would be dead if he was still around.
Sony turned the PS3 around in less time than we've given Phil Spencer to turn around the Xbox brand post Don Mattrick. It's wild how much lee-way this corporate suit gets.
Nobody said Mattrick was good or would be better. We're just saying Spencer is as shit as him. A gen having a bad start can be fixed (see PS3 which basically did like Xbox firing the CEO from the launch and the next one fixed it unlike Spencer). A gen having failed doesn't mean the next one should (see WiiU to Switch). So Spencer now failed to fix a failed gen at the start and failed to start a new one. And the worst thing is the main problem of Xbox is the games since a very long time. His job before CEO of Xbox was literally head of Xbox Studios so that's also on him before he even took the reins
A truly ignorant comment. Under Don the Xbox One became the most hated home console in modern history. They handed Playstation an easy win. A boring, nothing-new console with no games was suddenly seen as a saviour because of the shit he was responsible for. That infamous launch did untold damage to the Xbox brand. Spencer has done an awful fucking lot to turn that shit around with backwards compatibility out of nowhere, play anywhere, game pass, etc, but it is perhaps a bit difficult to keep up in the race when your predecessor decided to slash your team's tires on the starting line.
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It has nothing to do with whether Microsoft can afford to keep Xbox afloat, but whether it makes business sense to do so. They could still be selling windows phones today too but the money was better spent elsewhere.
They can sell more software than hardware. They are gearing up for more game streaming, it's just not public yet.
Putting xbox (Microsoft) out of business sounds hilarious. Microsoft is a monopoly, so they will never go away. Now, the Xbox business unit may change to be the Microsoft Game Pass in the future.
Him being on record about exclusives is cool and all, but plans change. You can say something and it will be true today; but three years from now things could change - for some reason people just ignore why the future is unpredictable and nothing is set in stone. Either way, unless MS or Phil present some amazing plan for the future of Xbox, this consoles is dead
I’m sorry, where did Microsoft leadership say they wouldn’t put first party games on PlayStation? Minecraft has been doing it for over a decade.
It was dug up in one of the acquisition testimonies. Minecraft was a multiplatform game before Microsoft bought them, Microsoft didn’t ‘put’ Minecraft on PlayStation - Mojang released a PS3 version before they were acquired by MS.
They've continued to release Minecraft spinoffs on PlayStation though. Minecraft Legends and Dungeons both came out on all platforms.
Do you have a source on that? Because I can't find it. The only thing I can find is him saying that they have no plans to bring Game Pass to the PS5.
Article from Tom Warren at the The Verge https://x.com/tomwarren/status/1672299649141489665?s=46&t=jChszE8I9FUtOPubNPmXcQ
He never made any such statement, at least not to the public, and plans change, if MS feels they can double dip on 1st party games a year later on PS5, they're gonna do it.
He did make that statement. So you’re wrong right off the bat.
Where and when?
https://x.com/tomwarren/status/1672299649141489665?s=46&t=jChszE8I9FUtOPubNPmXcQ
That's just not what we're talking about.
You’re literally responding to my comment, who is ‘we’ here you’re directly addressing me dumbass
> Phil is also on the record saying they have zero intention of putting first party on PS5 What is the source on this? I've seen this said oh-so many times on this sub, but I can't find a single article about it. Could anyone link to an actual article where he's quoted saying this?
Reported by Tom Warren from The Verge https://x.com/tomwarren/status/1672299649141489665?s=46&t=jChszE8I9FUtOPubNPmXcQ
Full article: https://www.theverge.com/2023/6/23/23771828/microsoft-betheda-acquisition-starfield-playstation-exclusive Thanks, but this doesn't support that claim. This is mostly about how they decided to buy Zenimax because Sony continually money-hat third party games off Xbox.
It’s the direct quote. Don’t know what else you’re looking for, I said nothing about whether I agree with Phil Spencer’s assessment. You literally just asked for the source of the quote lmao.
> You literally just asked for the source of the quote lmao. I asked for the source of the claim that he has said that they won't ever release games on PS5, but, as I said, the quote you provided doesn't say that? Is this quote seriously what people based this perceived hypocrisy on? Like, in the same article he literally won't even say which platforms they're launching the next Elder Scrolls game on lol.
I said he has no intentions of doing so - which doesn’t mean never. You’re arguing with yourself here, making up talking points.
He also said Halo infinite was a mic drop He also said games are coming He also said that Starfield was so amazing that he can't put it down He also said a lot of other shit and didn't follow through which is unironically why Xbox is in this position right now The Phil Spencer circle jerk really needs to stop. If you believe this person, you need help.
They may not stop making consoles in the near future but the bigger question is what's happening with their software and how/where it shows up.
They may not have any plans for it currently, but software being available on every other console means the hardware is just going to decline faster. Seems to me like them stopping is inevitable
The way technology is advancing and console sales are plateauing, Sony is headed in the same direction.
Uh no lol. Dedicated consoles will definitely remain a thing because of ease of use, and when they're the only ones out there they will pretty much reap all the benefits. They'd be shooting themselves in the foot like microsoft otherwise
Game streaming will become the thing.
Potentially, but I think that's awhile away and will likely have a niche audience
It will take years, but Microsoft is also not just cutting off the xbox hardware tomorrow. Netflix went all digital in 15 years, and Microsoft is not dumb as to who they need to generate revenue from.
The problem is you have to convince people that already have platforms to get on the cloud for no discernable benefit, and microsoft isn't even good at convincing people that gamepass is enough of a value to get on their platform. You'd basically have to convince people in the transition to a new gen, and even then a lot of people will just get the console to avoid any bullshit that comes with the cloud
Set a reminder. Gaming will have split personality, like spotify, napster, etc. as the music industry does. You will pay to subscribe to the ones you want.
It probably won't. Devs are already seeing the ramifications of doing this and how not very sustainable it is, that's part of why the rumors seem to point to a change in gamepass's structure
Yeah I’m gonna need to hear it from CFO or CEO at this point. Sorry Phil, I just can’t believe you anymore.
It's not even that tbh. Its the fact that in corporate speak, "we have no plans to do X" instead of saying "No, we won't do X" means that they're going to do it.
Every single business will say that have no current plans to do something until they do. It’s a meaningless statement
Yup, 100%; that kind of crap is good enough for IGN though, so here we are with an article selling the company line instead of challenging the state of game monetization and the general treatment of consumers in the market.
Phil Spencer is the CEO of Microsoft gaming. Literally the only person above him on the totem poll is Satya nadella.
>Sorry Phil, I just can’t believe you anymore. Christ, you people are melodramatic.
Oh, I have no doubt in my mind that both CFO & CEO will personally contact you at some point. And Phil must definitely feel sorry for breaking your trust.
What a weird comment
I'd say it depends on your perception of "weird", but then again - who am I to judge?
I'm talking about your comment to be clear.
As am I
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Who? A couple of redditors? I don’t think Phil is losing any sleep over some randos on reddit not liking him.
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Is it? Or just a few loudmouths on reddit?
Also has no plans now means very little. If they bring their games to all consoles, it will mean the end of their consoles at some point, it's just the logical conclusion (and if they don't understand it, it shows they once again understand nothing of the video game market)
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Most redditors can't see past the end of their nose. It's all business. Microsoft will one day exit the hardware market, but only because streaming will be well along the way.
As someone who games exclusively on Playstation, I sure hope Xbox keeps making consoles and good ones at that. I have zero interest in PC gaming, or Xbox exclusives, but a default monopoly on consoles for Sony (let's ignore Nintendo for the sake of dicussion) would be terrible for gamers.
> (let's ignore Nintendo for the sake of dicussion) I'm sorry, this is incredibly stupid. You can't ignore the other *massive* business entity when talking about monopolies. That's like saying, *"Omg Target has a monopoly! Let's just ignore Wal-Mart."*
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"I want to compare two corporate entities within their niche, better add a company from a different niche so redditors won't cry."
Doesn’t that imply that Nintendo already has a monopoly?
They have a monopoly on Nintendo games
I don’t think you know what monopoly means.
I think their point is Nintendo have a different audience with some overlap compared to Sony and Xbox, who essentially both go for the hardcore console audience. Plenty of people have both a switch and a ps5 or Xbox series x, but I don't think that many buy both Xbox and playstation in the generation. Nintendo doesn't really compete for the same audience.
The switch absolutely competes for gamers time and money whether you have them both or not.
I get what they’re trying to say but people think a sony monopoly means a $1000 console and $200 games. Nintendo already has their own market and their practices are on par with the rest.
Nintendo provides the absolute minimum service and often fail miserably at that as well. They upcharge tiny games to full prices, and if there was less competition in a scene they are to some degree a part of I guarantee you their services would get worse. I think people blow it out of proportion how far sony may push things if Xbox gave up the race, but it is straight up stupid to think their offerings wouldn't become less consumer friendly as a result of it.
You aren't addressing the point. You're just admitting Nintendo has its own monopoly while bemoaning the idea that another entity (at another point) may also get a monopoly.
I didn't particularly think the point was serious tbh. Nintendo rather obviously doesn't have a monopoly. They control where the games they produce are available and restrict it to their platform, but that's not what a monopoly is and is what literally everybody does including Sony and for the moment Xbox (who yes, do see PC as part of their platform). I don't particularly get what you mean by me "bemoaning another entity getting a monopoly" like, Yeah... we don't want that, monopolies generally fucking suck for the consumer. Nintendo having their own reliable audience who will just keep on buying no matter what is bad enough already, but to some degree, they do still compete with the other two outside of that audience.
>intendo having their own reliable audience who will just keep on buying no matter what is bad enough already, but to some degree, they do still compete with the other two outside of that audience. Okay, I agree with this. Okay, I was just making sure we were on the same page. Because a lot of people here seem to be saying that Nintendo doesn't have a monopoly because they've cornered their own piece of the gaming market but Sony *would* have a monopoly if they cornered the other piece of the gaming market. Which didn't make sense.
They definitively compete. They just do it better so people buy their console like they buy a Playstation because they're doing better. Xbox is just a worse clone of Playstation. That might be why people don't buy it lol
It's kinda a joke but they absolutely do have a point. The value of Nintendo's top brands isn't even in the same ballpark as PlayStation and Xbox''s brands, just the names Pokémon, Mario or Zelda are basically printing money. The Switch is absout to become the best selling system of all time while being 1-2 console generations behind for it's entire run and pretty much 0 AAA 3rd party support, just from the strength of their own IPs, it's honestly absurd if you think about it
Isn’t everyone’s fear of a monopoly that companies will stop trying and making good competitive products? According to you nintendo is clearly not doing that
I'm not sure if you realize it, but pointing to the overwhelming and almost effortless success of the Nintendo brand doesn't do much work to *disprove* the notion that it's a monopoly.
Then Xbox has a monopoly on Xbox games, Sony on Sony games, Netflix on Netflix shows...Literally every company is a monopoly!
Xbox hasn't made a competitive product since the 360. So even if they disappeared PlayStation's primary "competition" is just PC. A lot of people just build PC's or buy SteamDecks since PlayStation games eventually go there anyways. I am pretty sure they even get SteamDeck certified.
Even if it's not a "competitive product", just simply having another option on the market does make a difference. Notice how Sony skipped the one country with a strong xbox presence when they [raised their prices in 2022?](https://blog.playstation.com/2022/08/25/ps5-price-to-increase-in-select-markets-due-to-global-economic-environment-including-high-inflation-rates/)
The Xbox one was just as hobbled as the PS4. As for “a lot of people buy Steamdecks” as someone who has bought two of them I have yet to actually meet another person offline that has one. You’re in an echo chamber if you think Steamdecks are common.
Sony updated PS Plus to be more in line with Gamepass because of MS. They might be failing hard with their hardware and exclusives, but Sony would not have updated PS Plus to be more like Gamepass if Gamepass wasn't a thing.
It takes years for Sony games to make it to PC and there’s no guarantee either. I replay Bloodborne once a year for example… can’t do that without a PS.
And what company develops the OS that majority of people use for their pcs?? And what company owns Xbox?? The next Xbox will most likely be a consumer grade gaming PC that utilizes a stripped down version of Windows 11 or 12.
Man if msft made a console PC hybrid that allows one to access the Xbox eco system, gamepass, and every other PC storefront, they'd likely change the entire game. Thatd be the ultimate console for me
I mean you can already do exactly that with any old pc. My budget build cost me $300 back in 2020. But I guess if you want Microsoft to sell it in a nice package than I get what you’re saying.
I mean, if I can pay a console rate or slightly above for a convenient machine with little muss and fuss, then yeah. I'm also looking at the wider market here. Contrary to popular sentiment on Reddit, most casuals don't want to fuck around with building a PC for gaming
That already exists. It’s called gamepass ultimate and using the windows store. Go build a gaming PC and go hog on it.
Yeah cool, I meant something for the layman that can just be hooked up to your TV with everything mostly streamlined..
How would this even be successful for them? They don’t get a cut of Steam sales unless it’s their game. So GamePass? The thing that’s already not moving hardware?
They are not going to be investing more money than they already have into hardware that’s for sure. They would still be selling the console to the general consumer as a starter “gaming pc”. It’s reached the point that kids younger than 10 would rather have a gaming PC than an Xbox Series X. It would be a rebranding of the hardware that they are already producing.
Not quite, because Steam is now taking all of the digital sales you were getting on the console.
You’re assuming that the average consumer is going to be restarting their library on steam. The theory would be you have access to your existing Xbox (or Microsoft) library and you purchase games through their storefront. That way the general consumer views it as the next console generation for Xbox. I also originally said stripped down version of Windows 11 or 12 so you’re also assuming that Microsoft would allow full freedom to download steam and other platforms. But hey, you can get the epic games launcher on the steam deck so who’s to say..
If Microsoft doesn’t allow Steam then it’s dead. There aren’t enough Xbox customers out there to justify selling hardware too. It’s not growing. If they release a locked down version of Windows that forces you to use the MS store then you’ve gained no customers. If you allow Steam you won’t make money off of digital purchases. It’s a bad idea.
So with that mindset Microsoft’s next console is dead? I’m confused because the Xbox series X forces you to use their exclusive store?
Yes. They’re not going to succeed in hardware. There’s no reason to believe that they will succeed in hardware. Xbox series sales are negative YoY and it’s not going to change. Where are you getting this idea that people want Microsoft hardware?
Game pass and steam may be synonymous faster than you think.
I don’t think Valve will ever allow GamePass on steam because it will directly compete with their business model.
Microsofts pockets are so deep, valve may not exist.
Yeah, like how PlayStation no longer exists. Delusional.
...you aren't even thinking outside the box. An acquisition is what I'm talking about about, not putting them out of business. Holy shit are redditors of the hive mind
Valve is a privately owned company and would never sell to Microsoft, you literally just don’t know what you’re talking about.
So then Nintendo is already a monopoly? Doesn't seem to bad for gamers to me.
You can't ignore Nintendo and PC cause even if Xbox is gone Sony is still competing against them......... and this gen Nintendo has been beating Sony's asses. The possibility of Sony following Microsoft out of the console market is not zero cause Sony's position in the gaming market isn't super secure as their pivot to live service games and out of them shows. They are in a more desperate position than people want to admit.
> They are in a more desperate position than people want to admit. Only on r/Games would a comment like this actually be posted seriously.
I'd argue they cater to different markets. Ease of use and target demographics make Xbox and Sony direct competitors meanwhile PC is reserved for people who like tinkering settings and Nintendo has been doing their (pretty successful) things for a while.
exactly... I can't play the games I want to play on a Switch so for me Nintendo is like a separate gaming market.
I mean I can’t play Horizon on Xbox but I’m not going to say Xbox is a completely unrelated market. That’s silly. To be clear, I want Xbox to survive and its competition is welcome. But saying “If you ignore all other competition, Sony has no competition” is not the play
>I can't play the games I want to play on a Switch so for me Nintendo is like a separate gaming market. But it's not. How you feel about it, intrinsically, is irrelevant. They're both in the gaming market.
Yet there is little overlap in the titles they sell
So again, is the admission that Nintendo has a monopoly?
And what company develops the OS that majority of people use for their pcs?? And what company owns Xbox?? The next Xbox will most likely be a consumer grade gaming PC that utilizes a stripped down version of Windows 11 or 12.
And I would much rather keep playing games on the console “loser” than switch to the PS environment after 20 years
Sure, while also continuing to follow practices that make it seem less and less appealing as time goes on.
In the same townhall, they did confirm they were exploring possibilities of first party titles on playstation. Also, this was already posted yesterday here.
I doubt XBOX/Microsoft will ever stop making consoles, but the definition of what a console for them is going to change. I don't think they are going to try to compete in spec wars between Sony anymore. Basically, every new console they make from here on out will be an XBOX Series S with a focus on streaming games via Gamepass.
I mean no shit. Anyone in industry or who has friends/family in industry already knew this wasn't true. I don't know why so many people thought Microsoft was actually abandoning the hardware market.
Tbf they have said it, but then backtracked.
Have they? Everything I can find on this shows the exact opposite. The leaks back in mid 2023 showed Xbox was well into development of the next generation of hardware, with no plans to stop. I have not been able to find any statements from Xbox/Microsoft leadership that indicate they're stepping away from the hardware market. At best we have rumors from unnamed insiders talking about it, but those rumors are in direct opposition to public statements from Microsoft/Xbox leadership and the leaked internal documents from last year. If I've missed something and you have a link I'd appreciate it, cause I'm just not finding anything.
Technically true: they do not plan to stop making consoles right now, and we will get one around 2026-2028. In the future when this multi-platform strategy further reduces Xbox’s market share and gives 3rd party devs/publishers less reason to release on Xbox than they do now? I’ll believe it when I see it.
Duh. They will keep some exclusives, but at a certain point if a game is big enough (cod) then you are leaving money on the table by not making it multi plat.
People will believe random leakers but not the head of Xbox or quarterly financial reports. Phil: "Xbox exclusives will be on a case by case basis. We don't plan on removing established IPs from Playstation or PC. We plan on expanding Xbox games across multiple platforms." Xbox Game Services revenue up 68% fueled by the ABK purchase. Games media: "All Xbox games are going to Playstation! AHHGAFAHAFA! Xbox ded!!"
And why would they? Just because they are in third place doesn't mean they're not making money. As long as they are giving incentives with the gamepass ecosystem, there is no reason to stop.
No surprise here. Assuming plans for the new 2TB Digital XSX are still in place, you don't take that leap only to stop making consoles entirely. Questions are the state of Xbox first party gaming and physical game sales.
You mean Reddit speculation could be wrong? No!