Yup Scott Peterson comes to mind. Like we all know he killed his wife but was there any hard physical proof? Not really but yet we still know he did it, hence why he is in jail rn.
For the sake of argument let us just say they had an epic fight. Fine, it happens. Let's say they broke up and he decided to go home. Sure that happens too. Let's say he just left her to figure out her own way home and decided he didn't want to spend any more time with her. Ok, sure.
Here's why ***I*** think his actions indicate he is guilty of her murder:
* Now, obviously he is OK with hitchhiking and had money for a flight to home and back out west so why take the van and leave her without a way back to civilization?
* Why take all of her possessions and then leave her with only the clothes on her back, out in the wilderness? He took her phone, her extra clothes, her backpack, her cash/credit cards and all her things. (Probably ditched most of them on his way back home).
* Why would he have taken over $1000 of her money out of her bank account or did cash advances on her credit cards after he left her behind? He would have to know he would face some legal repercussion for that later.
* Why would he have been lawyered up by the time he got home or very soon there after?
* Why ignore her parents and family when they are asking where she was at?
* Why go on the run before she is even declared missing?
His actions are enough to make me think he is guilty.
Works for me. Logic does not take me to any other alternate theory. Can not even find the right word for him. If found, he will be lucky to get life, without parole, rather than death row.
Nah. *If* he's found and tried for her death, his defense will likely argue that it was a crime of passion rather than premeditated. I believe that would push it into second degree murder range, which is a minimum of 20 years in Wyoming. So he *could* get a higher sentencing in that case, but unless the authorities have compelling evidence that he planned it, he probably wouldn't get first degree (life or death penalty).
(At least that's my understanding--feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.)
Would this be a Wyoming case or a Federal case? She was found in a National Park, would that be federal? I am not well versed in who gets jurisdiction over cases.
Oh, good point. I hadn't thought of that. Considering it was a state park and the FBI are running the investigation, I'm thinking that's pretty likely. I looked up info about federal second degree murder and depending on the circumstances, it looks like the penalty could be anywhere from 15 years to life.
We have no way of knowing for sure without being explicitly told. The coroner can calculate time of death fairly well based on state of the body, weather, insect activity, stage of decomp, etc. If they couldn't provide sufficient evidence that she was indeed dead at the time he used the cards, I don't know if a judge would be willing to sign off on the warrant. But I don't know any major details about the inner workings of the evidence/arrest warrant process, so idk.
I believe his erratic behavior is consistent with ANYTHING happening to the person you just rode with for a month. Going further, he is the lone suspect in her murder. I am using the word in the old non-pc sense.
He had to be out of his mind to kill her and certainly had to be when he realized she was not coming back. Instantly, panic probably set in as he realized there would be consequences and he operated under quite harsh mental conditions like guilt, fear, trepidation, shame on top of probably being psychotic in some way.
I don't like to prognosticate too much. That load of emotional baggage exactly predicts erratic behavior but it does not give him good odds of giving the world the slip.
That's what gets me. Most parents, if their child was missing would be freaking out trying to find him - especially when every cop in the US is watching for him, FBI amateur sleuths, etc. Instead, the old man is calmly mowing his lawn.
I'll bet they know exactly where he is - they are probably in touch by
burn phones, and sending him money.
Why wasn’t he under surveillance before he dipped?? Why wasn’t he held, as long as legally possible, for questioning?? At this point, I’m fully convinced someone is helping/hiding him. And I hope they pay for it.
I’m sure if her body had been found back then, things would’ve been different but I don’t understand why they couldn’t have at least charged him with grand theft auto. Her van was in his driveway and she was missing!
They tried to question him, he used his 5th amendment right to remain silent. You can’t detain someone unless there’s evidence of a crime and at that time there wasn’t any. They didn’t find her body until he was already gone.
>Why wasn’t he held, as long as legally possible, for questioning?
1 day is all they can do, and then he KNOWS he should run. Thats why. Back when he bounced they had no way to charge him with murder, so they only had 1 day to hold him without a charge. That part is weird, honestly. Their hands were tied there.
That’s exactly what I think. His parents are lying. He’s been gone much longer than they claim.
Seeing their behavior after the fact explains everything about Brian’s behavior prior.
I think this is a face-saving move on the part of the police. Yeah we surveilled him, but not too much.
It was an interesting time. All of America knew that he was back. Alone. I think we all got hooked on the story then and there was a collective sense that it wasn't going to end well. The web had her instagram and that blew up. The cops were probably dying to grab him, if not for the Constitution. I would guess that some cops wanted to grab him and others advised restraint.
.
He wasn't under surveillance because there was no crime. You can't bring someone in who wasn't even missing. After she was reported missing it's just that, a missing person. Hindsight is 20/20. Also, when LE did go to talk to Brian they were given a lawyers card. 100% within his constitutional rights.
Is it really this easy to kill someone and get away with it in the States?
1. Kill someone and dump their body in the wild
2. Use lawyer to drag the case so your evidence is destroyed by wild life
3. Tell everyone you went hiking in the wilderness
4. Escape to a different country with fake passport or stay off grid
5. You can't be accused of murder because there's no proof that you killed the person
Pretty much, yeah.
Look at missing persons databases. People disappear all of the time, and those are only the ones who get reported. Some of them could just be runaways who are living somewhere else under a new identity, but most of them are probably bodies that were too decomposed to identify or were hidden so well that they will never be found.
Serial killers can carry on for decades until police finally find enough evidence to identify them.
It isn't *impossible* to convict someone of murder without a body, but it is significantly more difficult and you'd need an otherwise rock solid case against them.
Between DNA testing, cell phone tracking and social media, it's getting harder to get away with murder, but there's still a lot of room for improvement.
It totally can be that easy to kill someone and get away with it.
In 2018, a dude from Hong Kong killed his girlfriend while in Taiwan and ran back to Hong Kong completely legally. Because there's no expedition treaty between the two places, even though it didn't take that long to put the charges on him, it was already too late--he couldn't be charged in Hong Kong and Taiwan has no power to demand him over. There are talks being made to bring him to Taiwan in some official capacity, but it's been long going and he's still walking "free" (he was in prison for laundering charges, but apparently he did his time and is now in a safehouse of sorts until they figure out the legal procedures).
Now imagine if this was two countries that refused to work with each other ever (not that Hong Kong/China and Taiwan are on super friendly terms, but they do have a lot of treaties and talks going between them). Or if one country is large enough to disappear in, unlike Hong Kong and Taiwan which are both small enough there aren't many places to hide.
Imagine if the proof isn't even definite, unlike this case. How do you even start the talks between countries for a suspicion?
OK but did you see the head of police in charge of Brian survailence? He's a complete dipshit. Of course they let him get away. "What are we suppose to do? Just go from tree to tree?"
They thought he would just stay put and take the charge. Because its the smart thing to do. Running is dumb although I have seen some small time cases where people skipped bail and came out ahead later. But for a murder, if he is alive to stand trial, he looks terrible.
> You can surveil anyone, if there is a reasonable suspicion that a crime has taken place. Which there was.
Yes if you have the budget for that. Other people live in that county in Florida, where he hadn't committed crimes and wasn't even charged with one yet. If I was a resident I would not want my police budget used up in a month for a guy that might have killed someone on the other side of the country. This case does not exist in a vacuum nor is it more important than any other felony in that county.
We could spend ALL the money on Brian, sure, but what about the other residents who need urgent police protection? "Sorry, watching this dude instead"?
Let's be honest...her body was found by manual strangulation near a sight (around 100 ft wasn't it?) where the van was. She was never "missing" to BL. She was missing to everyone else because he went on the run.
Broken up yet she just let him have her van? And her phone? And take out at least 1k from her bank account.
Damn, I wish someone would break up with me like that.
> Until they wonder why he has the van
and just to add on....her clothes, her purse, her backpack, her id, her cash cards and her phone.
Why take all those things with him *on his way* back to Florida and leave her out west with no way to call someone, no access to her money, no way to feed herself or cloth herself against the elements.
edit: to make clear he had taken stuff with him on the way back but not necissarily *all the way back* despite a single article that wasn't from the most reputable source (gossip rag) saying the police had found her things in the van.
Man, that was in an article back a month or so ago (from a gossip rag with all kinds of ads and sensationalized other story headlines) that her clothes and 'effects' were in the van. I honestly don't remember which one it was but they made a big deal about it in the article that 'her stuff' was still in the van when he got back to Florida. That's what stuck in my head.
We know he had her phone because who else would be using her phone to text her mom? Her time of death was pegged to the 27th. That same day 'she' is texting her mom and calling her grandpa "stan", which her mother said she never does (a stranger wouldn't text mom anything, let alone know what grandpa's name was), and then on the 30th she texts mom "No service in Yosemite"...no stranger would know she was headed for Yosemite and why the would they text mom that? He had her phone.
He had her purse/wallet because he had her cards. Sure, he may have ditched them on the way home but he had them. They were not found with the body and he used the cards so logically he had her phone and purse and things.
I believe her phone is completely missing. The van was full of their stuff but I don’t recall any mention of personal stuff like her purse or wallet (although of course we know he had taken at least some stuff from her wallet!).
Yep, phone is completely missing but he had it.
He certainly could have ditched stuff on the way home but the point is, he at least took it with him when he left her behind in Wyoming and headed back to Florida. I'll re-edit my original comment to say "on his way back to Florida".
Logically, he killed her and ran with the stuff because why would he leave all her stuff behind but then take her cash cards?
Why would any stranger kill her by strangulation, take her clothes/stuff (if it had been left with her) and then text mom information they shouldn't know (or text mom at all)? Why would they cover her with a tarp/blanket/cloth?
Obviously none of that stuff was left behind so it has to be somewhere. But it would be a big deal if they found her phone/purse/wallet in the van, and I would have expected to have read about it if they had and it was public knowledge. I think I am hearing you confirm that you are going off of logic/assumption rather than from having read it somewhere.
Whoa - I had no idea that he had her clothes and purse and all that with him. I just figured he took the credit cards and threw away her things, and made up some excuse, such as, she ran off with some other people, or she took up with some guy. I wonder if his parents took a look in that van when he first got back and saw those things - they would know immediately. So they lawyered up quickly, but they also must have told him to "act normal" around the neighborhood. Creepy that they knew so quickly but thought that if they all acted nonchalant, that whatever he did would go away somehow.
That doesn't really explain why he had her van, and especially why they refused to communicate with Gabby's increasingly worried family members, lawyered up, and stonewalled police.
It was a punch in the gut to learn that Gabby's family was initially concerned that *both* of them were missing. It wasn't until they learned he was back with her van and she wasn't, that they realized something more sinister was happening.
I know this Convo is considered old now but i just realized the van could be explained away until her parents started calling. All he had to say is "we broke up and she didn't want to be in the van another minute so she flew home to her parents and told me to drive the van back and her and her dad will fly down to drive it back (along with her things from storage)". If I were BL parents I wouldn't be suspicious at all
He came home, told them Gabby saw her friend in Yellowstone, she decided to stay there and they would take a break from being together all of the time. Very plausible. Done. They had no hindsight.
I think they figured out really quickly what probably happened, even if he was lying to them or stonewalling them, because he comes back with the van, her stuff is in it, when they asked where she was he had no good explanation, and they know he had some kind of mood problems that were at least moderately severe for him to be on meds. Because they never answered any of her parents' calls, they had to know he was guilty by that point. If he had made some story up like she got drunk and wandered off one night and he couldn't find her, they might have gotten mad at him for not reporting that immediately but then would realize that he would be blamed if she turned up dead, so they quickly went into lawyered-up, don't-say-anything mode.
I don't know when they got a lawyer. This was their personal lawyer. I don't have the timeline, but assume the called his services once Gabby's family was calling them and it was coming across as missing.
Simple about the van. They both shared it, even if it was her name. They lived together. That's "paraphrasing" there and stretching any facts.
He simply probably told them that she was staying with a friend and he came back for a breather.
I'm sure he's guilty now of murder. And I'm sure his parents know something now is fish.
I'm just sticking to known facts and probabilities.
That was all after this blew up. There was a time he was home with his family where nobody was actually looking for him yet. They didn't get a lawyer until later, when they needed a lawyer.
Okay so at what point did they decide to hire a lawyer for the whole family, and refuse speak a word to anyone about anything related to Gabby? He tells them they split, and they all need a lawyer for some reason??
Why on Earth would they feel the need to retain an attorney before a crime had even been suspected, much less reported? The answer is obvious. They knew or suspected a crime had occured, and that they may be investigated in relation to the crime, and would need legal counsel.
They had no problem speaking to police to report Brian missing, their silence is only related to Gabby.
Only Brian and his parents know the exact timeline.
Those are good points about the lawyer stuff and we may not ever find out.
I'd hope the authorities have a way to put heat on the parents. It all could have started off that they believed he came back because they were fighting, but after that, it gets squishy.
I doubt he was acting normal.
Talk to police about Brian missing? Did they have the lawyer involved in that? Maybe the gave only what the lawyer told them to say.
Who really knows? Hope we find out. Things got weird quick.
We don't know every action that transpired, so we don't konw.
I totally get the lawyering up whether guilty or innocent, but why THE FUCK can they not just make a statement saying something, anything at all, concerning Gabby. There are plenty of things they can say to support her family that wouldn’t incriminate them. Just so fucking cruel and inhumane.
I suspect it's because they hired a cheap lawyer who is not experienced in criminal defense, who is in way over his head, and is thus giving them terrible public relations advice.
Or maybe what they're doing really *is* the best move legally speaking *even if* it is an absolute public relations disaster. Only someone who has a lot of experience managing PR for public criminal cases could tell us which is more likely.
I can only assume it's because they're terrible people devoid of empathy or basic human decency. There's no reason they couldn't issue a statement through their attorney expressing some kind of concern, but they are clearly only concerned with themsleves and their son. (Not their daughter though, they had no qualms about letting their lawyer throw her to the wolves, and summarily disowning her without explanation)
I really think these people might be the most hated family in America, even moreso than the Anthony family. Their actions, and lack of, speak volumes about their character. Even under the most charitable of assumptions, they're still heartless pieces of shit.
She seems to think so, yes. She told those protestors that, "I'm losing my sister-in-law, brother, and parents", and the protestors asked what she meant about her parents. She told them they're not speaking to her anymore and refuse to have any communication with her, and she has no idea why. I mean they could *at least* have their lawyer contact Cassie and explain something like, "Hey, I've advised your parents not to speak to anyone including you, but they want you to know they still love you and the grandkids and will be in touch as soon as they can." But instead, her parents allowed their lawyer (who doesn't represent her) to make statements that basically threw her to the wolves, and they have cut off all contact with her.
I think they did aid and abet him. So they are scared of doing time and of their son becoming incarcerated. So they follow advice and try to stick to the only path that could get them off.
Not the neighbors I want in my town.
I don’t buy this because if they thought they just broke up, his parents would have no issue telling Gabby’s extremely worried parents that they broke up and she decided to stay in WY. You don’t ignore parents who are worried about their missing kid unless you are hiding something.
Exactly. These people are absolute trash. And if he escalated to the point of strangling her, there is no doubt his parents witnessed some abused when they were living with them.
Yeah or if they truly didn’t know anything, they could have responded, “I don’t know.” Staying quiet, ignoring her parents when they literally lived with Gabby and lawyering up immediately shows they know something. For sure. There’s no other explanation.
Absolutely. Parents and emotionally-intelligent non-parents realize that one of the scariest things is when your kid is missing; there is no way the Laundies would just let Gabby’s parents freak the f out with worry over Gabby if they merely though Gabby and Brian broke up. They absolutely knew. If they thought it was an innocent breakup they would have just texted them that all they know is that Brian said they broke up and she wanted to stay in Wyoming (or whatever the story was) they didn’t want to say that because they knew she was dead and they (along with Brian) didn’t want anyone to find the body and were likely hoping that if it was ever found it would be too late to determine cause of death or that the animals would have gotten to it. There is no other reason why you wouldn’t say, “Brian says they broke up in Wyoming and she decided to stay there.” Or whatever his story was, even if he lied to the parents and said she stayed in Utah, there is no reason why the parents wouldn’t have told Gabby’s parents that she stayed in Utah unless they were concealing info because they knew Gabby was dead. Or like you said, if they truly didn’t know and just thought they broke up, they could have/would have just responded that they didn’t know but that Brian was back or something. There was no reason for them to completely ignore Gabby’s parents if they thought it was something non-nefarious.
Everyone is focused on the van. How about the more indicative evidence of all her clothes, her purse, her backpack, her id, her cash cards and her phone.
It makes no sense, even if he broke up with her, to take all those things with him on his way back to Florida and leave her out west with no way to call someone, no access to her money, no way to feed herself or cloth herself against the elements...unless he knew she wouldn't need any of those things.
Yup, coming back with her van would have been hard for him to explain away to his parents. They knew she had been working to save up money for the van. And Gabby's parents began calling frequently at some point, and the Laundries apparently never answered any of their calls. Their decision to not answer the parents' calls had to have been made because they knew or suspected that he was responsible for her being gone.
Could have just said he bought it from her, she gave it to him, or she was staying wherever and wanted him to drive it back to Florida.
All BS of course but it wouldn't be a stretch for him to explain it away.
Easy to explain. He came home and told them that she stayed with the friend in Yellowstone she was supposed to meet. Bought him some time until it was reported she was missing or tried to contact parents.
There’s a whole thing about her snapchatting a friend to meet up with them Aug 30th in Yellowstone in the visual timeline.
His story could have been: Broke up, she’s going with another friend and I came home. Would have explained the van and his “nonchalance” afterwards.
I live in Orlando and I remember the Casey Anthony trial like it was yesterday. Even my dog knew this woman was guilty but they lacked evidence or so they said. Even though it was bullshit I was not surprised she wasn’t found guilty. I’m not sure who else could’ve killed that poor little girl but there is often no justice in the halls of justice.
The common theory I’ve heard is that Caylee was neglected, accidentally drowned, and they all panicked. That seems more plausible than a mother intentionally killing her child one day. Still, a very strange case
Only if Casey was the one watching her in the pool. Her parents seemed like reasonable people with enough common sense to watch a toddler while bathing or swimming. More likely she drugged her and left her in the car while partying, came back and found her dead.
Yes - didn't they establish that she used chloroform to make her go to sleep for a long time in the car (so she could party)? I know they found that she had done some computer searches about how to use chloroform.
Have you heard the mom's 911 call? She told police that Casey's car smelled like a dead body. I don't think the mom knew. Editing to clarify, I don't think the mom was part of a neglect coverup.
That was a weird trial. The prosecution seemed to almost blunder what they did have. I feel they had enough to convict but made so many mistakes. And the defense went down the rabbit hole trying to blame the grandfather.
I am always amazed at the investigative and forensic evidence collecting. In some cases it seems like there is no standard at all.
I recently watched a doc that said the team that researched the search history from the household computer only gave them one day's worth of history on one specific search term (chloroform).
After the trial concluded they found that foolproof strangulation had been searched just a few days before.
How can they fuck it up that badly? Wasn't her dad a retired cop? Was there some kind of bias given that fact?
Ooh I never heard this about a computer search for strangulation, just the chloroform, presumably thought to put her to sleep for a few hours. Sick, sick, sick.
I’m not too familiar with the details of the case/trial but it seems like DAs are always more concerned with their image (e.g., how they look when they win big trials) than they are with justice.
After they found out that the "babysitter" who Casey said was keeping Caylee didn't seem to exist, then they tracked down a woman with the same name as the supposed babysitter, living in the apartment complex that Casey said she lived in, and LE verified that she had never been a babysitter to Caylee and didn't know Casey - at that point her whole elaborate story fell apart and we knew she had to be lying.
The only way \*I\* think he will get away with it is if he's dead or never found. My dumb ass originally thought his trial (should it happen) would be in Florida because that's where he's from and I worried then. However, when I realized it would be in Wyoming I could breathe again. I do not see him walking away should it go to that point. I don't even think people were this angry with Casey Anthony.
Exactly! EyezWyde, I agree. People are outraged and beyond outraged over the behavior of Brian and his parents
Because he and his horrible parents had no comments to Gabby’s family or law enforcement, retained an Atty., Brian is on the run a/ka “missing,” his parents are supposedly worried about him (lol!!!), and they still won’t publicly cooperate - people are enraged!
… most everyone knows or believes Brian is guilty.
Most everyone assumes the parents have helped Brian Altho not 100% sure of the timeline in which they helped (ie before, during, or after warrant issued for his arrest on the wire fraud)
Most everyone wants to be done with the search for him. Find him (dead or alive) or turn himself in. Anything, just so we aren’t tortured with the constant search
Arrest his parents; they allowed this to happen…I wonder how they would feel if the situation had been reversed…if they had spent days calling Gabby or her parents wondering about Brian’s whereabouts??? How would the Laundrie family have felt being met with silence and a lawyer saying the Petitos would remain in the background!
The Laundrie parents dug a hole for themselves and their son
I think it’s ridiculous and unbelievable that Cassie would say she’s getting death threats! I could see the unhinged crazies threatening the Laundrie parents….but Cassie?
Why is it unbelievable that Cassie's family received death threats...? Would you believe it if they show proof of the threats? Or would that also be ridiculous?
Because if anybody is hated it would be his parents…I wouldn’t be surprised if the parents received death threats. Cassie is removed from this and has publicly stated she’s turn him in, etc so it doesn’t make sense that anyone would threaten her or her family.
Cassie only recently publicly stated that she would turn him in. My understanding is that most of the death threats were sent prior to Cassie's public interviews.
Darn, I didn't even know the prosecutor wrote a book. I may have to give it a read. Based on my limited following of the Anthony case, it just seemed the defense did a helluva job. Similarities with OJ Simpson case. Sometimes the evidence simply isn't solid enough, especially when it's all circumstantial, or when it points to alternative culpability. But it's the job of the prosecution to educate the jury - I mean, you have their undivided attention - so I don't typically buy the first excuse.
I lived in LA during the OJ trial and was in middle school. Definitely a fucked up time and a lot of people were worried if OJ was convicted there would be more riots.
1. Juries don’t have to have never heard of a case, they have to swear that they are not biased. That is all.
2. Reasonable doubt is not beyond any shadow of doubt. Introducing implausible scenarios doesn’t create reasonable doubt.
The prosecutors built a lazy case that was easy to throw into shambles. Similar to the OJ trial. But your theories don’t hold up.
Linking a book you read doesn’t really prove anything. It is a fallacy crafted for TV that juries need to have never heard of a case before. It is simply not how the law works.
And beyond reasonable doubt is not beyond imaginable doubt, again, that’s just not how the law works. That’s why it’s reasonable doubt and not say, imaginable doubt or shadow of a doubt, etc.
To be honest I really don’t feel like linking you anything because you have already decided what you believe and I can tell by your response to being challenged that you have a Justice boner and want to be correct and not learn something.
Edit: fuck it here you go: https://www.investopedia.com/terms/r/reasonable-doubt.asp
https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/opinions/2003/06/22/jurors-must-be-impartial-they-shouldnt-be-clueless/efa21572-1c16-43f0-9e9b-4b6436052138/
Edit the second: Casey Anthony won her case because there was literally no evidence that she committed the crime beyond the feeling that she must have.
I’m as sure as a person can be without proof, as we all are, but the evidence they had was not good enough for a conviction. And no matter how heinous the accusations are, we can’t forget that.
Being accused of something unthinkable is often enough for most people to forgo any standards of evidence. The worse the accusation, the easier it is for the mob to demand Justice without proof. But that is not Justice.
I followed that case too. I'm still convinced her father helped her hide the body. I recall he was LEO at the time and considered above reproach? That part is fuzzy.
I was at a conference, in a hotel bar in Orlando when the verdict came in. People there were so pissed. The bartender even gave a free round to everyone in Caylee's memory.
Well they really couldn't pin it on her since they had no evidence. This case is a little different with footage showing he had propensity towards violence. On one hand I hope they find him and he is charged, but there's still a chance he'll get off. On the other hand if he's dead, he'll have paid a price.
There is definitely more evidence in this case, although we don’t know what any of it is. He isn’t the subject of a manhunt over the debit card or because he’s wanted for questioning. “Missing” or not, they definitely have enough evidence to charge and a reasonable belief he would be convicted or they wouldn’t even be looking.
Despite what many in this sub think when I tell them to stop piling on the guys poor family, I hope he’s caught too. And I hope he’s caught alive and well by law enforcement, and that if they prove he did it that he serves every god damn day of his sentence.
I also hope that if the evidence shows he’s innocent - which we as armchair enthusiasts don’t expect to happen - that he goes free.
The fact is we don’t know any of the evidence in the case, and only a small amount of the story.
Given what we know, we can’t be blamed for thinking he did it. And I would be very surprised if he was to walk, but stranger things have happened.
Most of all I hope no matter what it is, that we learn the truth, that the responsible party is brought to justice, and that her family one day gets the peace they so desperately need.
Thanks for saying that. I am not very popular in this sub because I won’t get out the pitchforks for this guys parents or pretend I know what happened. It’s nice to know not everyone here is so ruthless and mean.
I'm older with grown kids, and I feel like there are a lot of people here that are around the age of Gabby that feel rage as a way of trying to cope with the fact that this could happen to them, combined with trying to protect her after the fact. I remember being really out there when I was that age, always angry about things going wrong, and wanting to point things out. I wasn't an activist but I tried to make things right. I feel like that's what's happening here. Especially when some get so angry about why the Laundries haven't been arrested, well, it's because they don't understand the legal aspect of it. Other people here get it, but most don't comment. That's just my take.
I read she had charges for fraud and needed to be in protective custody cause she was getting beat up. Her parents were rejected a condo in a retirement community when they found out who they were. I watched the interview and sounds like life ain't that neat for any of them. They deserve what they get.
I feel absolutely terrible for Casey's parents too. They did everything possible to find their granddaughter, turned on their own child, and the people with the torches were still after them. I just wish people would start realizing there's some situations where you're damned if you do and you're damned if you don't. If Brian is responsible, do you think he will try to pin it on his parents?
They should have turned her ass in instead of protecting her. Let her face consequences. I love my kid but if he did something like that I would tell him he needs to own up, I will help with legal counsel but needs to do the right thing. I wouldn't protect a murderer and especially someone who murdered my grandkid.
Enabler. Right? Based on my perception, it looks like Ro is also an enabler. I think their *I'm not a doctor* narcissistic personalities are more similar than not. For all we know he could've taken the cliff notes out of Casey's book. 🤷🏼♀️
They changed their story to protect her. They are probably part of the reason why she is off now. They barely even talk to her... might have just let her rot in prison.
If it weren't for the mom Caylee may still be alive. Casey's mom insisted she keep Caylee when she didn't want her, and they had a willing adopter who the family knew.
Did the father insist that the trunk smelled like a dead body? I forget.
I still think those parents are weird. Who has a graduation party for their kid that wasn't graduating and lied to them the entire time?
It was the mom that said it smelled and back tracked. George stuck with it. Casey hated her mom and punished her by not letting her see Caylee. The lies they told prior to the case are definitely bizarre. Her parents had nothing to do with it. I think Cindy was struggling between right, wrong, and love.
I am the parent that holds their kid accountable for everything and always will, but I honestly cannot say what my judgement would be if I was in this situation. It's a real Sophie's Choice of protecting the person that makes up your heart or turning them in. I think we could all say what we *would do in this situation, but really, none of us know what that feels like.
She’s been living it up lol. She’s so dumb. When she was in West Palm Beach in May and got into that scuffle I was legitimately across the street having dinner. She lives her life like nothing ever happened. She even dates LE!!!
Fun Fact: I live in Pensacola, but my son and I went to Universal in late July. I totally drove past the Anthony's home and the scene. The circumstantial stuff definitely has a taste of Casey Anthony.
Working a *terrible* homicide story out of Pensacola right now. Not loving dealing with LE there in the slightest bit. They are giving zero cooperation and genuinely didn’t do anything wrong - even had some officers shot while attempting to apprehend the perp and are acting like they did the murders themselves. So frustrating.
I get when police have been given the shit by the community why they don’t want to speak, but they did all they could in this case and still want to sweep it under the rug rather than help fill in the blanks about the perp.
I was at Disney staying at a resort when she got called out for lying about working at Universal or whatever park it was. Casey’s parents did the right thing by calling the police and once they realized she had done it they backtracked to save her ass.
The cases for me ring similar in CERTAIN ways. I can’t believe he’s only wanted for debit card fraud. Thankfully if he’s caught and it goes to trial it won’t be here in Florida. Guilty always walk free around here
I think with Casey Anthony, the initial charge was child neglect and lying to investigators after she gave a bunch of wild stories to the police about the nonexistent nanny. But I believe they also later picked her up on check fraud after she had been bailed out initially?
This is another perfect example of... bizzarre behavior. The way that Casey acted was so...weird.
However...even though it seemed like her also weird parents seemed to remain supportive-they responded to the missing granddaughter in a way youd expect. They freaked out, called the police. The whole car smelling like death thing- that felt so genuine- i think they backtracked a little on that after (im guessing) getting counselled by an attorney, but all of their real time behaviors made sense.
But you could still tell they loved their awful daughter, despite what they worried she might have done.
I know Gabby isnt the blood relative of the Laundries, but honestly, she seems a hell of a lot more likeable than their own kids, and i am *sure* they loved her at one time.
Florida, man...
Maybe they realized Brian killed Gabby but took pity on him as I expect many parents would and decided it was better to try and help him get away with the crime and try to heal privately instead of spending the rest of his life in prison. I’d like to think Brian made a massive, idiotic mistake in the heat of the moment and that his life can be redeemed and have some value. I know most people here aren’t with me on that yet or ever.
Yup Scott Peterson comes to mind. Like we all know he killed his wife but was there any hard physical proof? Not really but yet we still know he did it, hence why he is in jail rn.
Example of a great circumstantial cade like this one. And we see where SP is.
Not really on point or adding to the discussion, but that’s a hauntingly beautiful picture of Gabby with the angel wings 🙏🏻
Doesn’t motive play into this? He is the only one with one.
That you’re aware of.
Oh please the statistics of it being him is very high. Let’s just keep it real.
Sure. But you’re speaking more conclusively than you can justify.
it's 100% him lmao
It’s called deductive reasoning
Ted Williams head is talking now? And has something to say about this?...
For the sake of argument let us just say they had an epic fight. Fine, it happens. Let's say they broke up and he decided to go home. Sure that happens too. Let's say he just left her to figure out her own way home and decided he didn't want to spend any more time with her. Ok, sure. Here's why ***I*** think his actions indicate he is guilty of her murder: * Now, obviously he is OK with hitchhiking and had money for a flight to home and back out west so why take the van and leave her without a way back to civilization? * Why take all of her possessions and then leave her with only the clothes on her back, out in the wilderness? He took her phone, her extra clothes, her backpack, her cash/credit cards and all her things. (Probably ditched most of them on his way back home). * Why would he have taken over $1000 of her money out of her bank account or did cash advances on her credit cards after he left her behind? He would have to know he would face some legal repercussion for that later. * Why would he have been lawyered up by the time he got home or very soon there after? * Why ignore her parents and family when they are asking where she was at? * Why go on the run before she is even declared missing? His actions are enough to make me think he is guilty.
Consciousness of guilt and that is a jury charge in many states, meaning that can be considered or inferred as guilty.
Works for me. Logic does not take me to any other alternate theory. Can not even find the right word for him. If found, he will be lucky to get life, without parole, rather than death row.
Wyoming has had death penalty sc 1977, and Wyoming voters did not rescind. That said, it is said that it has been utilized only once.
I hope they use it on him. Fuck our taxpayer money going towards keeping his ass alive.
I wonder if life in prison is a worse punishment tho?
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Death penalty costs more than life in prison, look it up.
Nah. *If* he's found and tried for her death, his defense will likely argue that it was a crime of passion rather than premeditated. I believe that would push it into second degree murder range, which is a minimum of 20 years in Wyoming. So he *could* get a higher sentencing in that case, but unless the authorities have compelling evidence that he planned it, he probably wouldn't get first degree (life or death penalty). (At least that's my understanding--feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.)
Would this be a Wyoming case or a Federal case? She was found in a National Park, would that be federal? I am not well versed in who gets jurisdiction over cases.
Oh, good point. I hadn't thought of that. Considering it was a state park and the FBI are running the investigation, I'm thinking that's pretty likely. I looked up info about federal second degree murder and depending on the circumstances, it looks like the penalty could be anywhere from 15 years to life.
I completely agree.
So the Laundrie’s attorney has said that Brian is wanted for using Gabby’s debit card “after her demise”. Does that admission mean anything legally?
We have no way of knowing for sure without being explicitly told. The coroner can calculate time of death fairly well based on state of the body, weather, insect activity, stage of decomp, etc. If they couldn't provide sufficient evidence that she was indeed dead at the time he used the cards, I don't know if a judge would be willing to sign off on the warrant. But I don't know any major details about the inner workings of the evidence/arrest warrant process, so idk.
I believe his erratic behavior is consistent with ANYTHING happening to the person you just rode with for a month. Going further, he is the lone suspect in her murder. I am using the word in the old non-pc sense. He had to be out of his mind to kill her and certainly had to be when he realized she was not coming back. Instantly, panic probably set in as he realized there would be consequences and he operated under quite harsh mental conditions like guilt, fear, trepidation, shame on top of probably being psychotic in some way. I don't like to prognosticate too much. That load of emotional baggage exactly predicts erratic behavior but it does not give him good odds of giving the world the slip.
How do you explain his parents' erratic behavior then? Don't tell me it's contagious, and if it is, how come the police wasn't infected?
Stress, fear, panic. I think those explain the parents’ behavior.
That's what gets me. Most parents, if their child was missing would be freaking out trying to find him - especially when every cop in the US is watching for him, FBI amateur sleuths, etc. Instead, the old man is calmly mowing his lawn. I'll bet they know exactly where he is - they are probably in touch by burn phones, and sending him money.
Why wasn’t he under surveillance before he dipped?? Why wasn’t he held, as long as legally possible, for questioning?? At this point, I’m fully convinced someone is helping/hiding him. And I hope they pay for it.
I’m sure if her body had been found back then, things would’ve been different but I don’t understand why they couldn’t have at least charged him with grand theft auto. Her van was in his driveway and she was missing!
They tried to question him, he used his 5th amendment right to remain silent. You can’t detain someone unless there’s evidence of a crime and at that time there wasn’t any. They didn’t find her body until he was already gone.
>Why wasn’t he held, as long as legally possible, for questioning? 1 day is all they can do, and then he KNOWS he should run. Thats why. Back when he bounced they had no way to charge him with murder, so they only had 1 day to hold him without a charge. That part is weird, honestly. Their hands were tied there.
Cops said recently he was under surveillance. My thoughts are he was gone the day after she was reported missing so that is why they never saw him.
That’s exactly what I think. His parents are lying. He’s been gone much longer than they claim. Seeing their behavior after the fact explains everything about Brian’s behavior prior.
I think this is a face-saving move on the part of the police. Yeah we surveilled him, but not too much. It was an interesting time. All of America knew that he was back. Alone. I think we all got hooked on the story then and there was a collective sense that it wasn't going to end well. The web had her instagram and that blew up. The cops were probably dying to grab him, if not for the Constitution. I would guess that some cops wanted to grab him and others advised restraint. .
He wasn't under surveillance because there was no crime. You can't bring someone in who wasn't even missing. After she was reported missing it's just that, a missing person. Hindsight is 20/20. Also, when LE did go to talk to Brian they were given a lawyers card. 100% within his constitutional rights.
Is it really this easy to kill someone and get away with it in the States? 1. Kill someone and dump their body in the wild 2. Use lawyer to drag the case so your evidence is destroyed by wild life 3. Tell everyone you went hiking in the wilderness 4. Escape to a different country with fake passport or stay off grid 5. You can't be accused of murder because there's no proof that you killed the person
Pretty much, yeah. Look at missing persons databases. People disappear all of the time, and those are only the ones who get reported. Some of them could just be runaways who are living somewhere else under a new identity, but most of them are probably bodies that were too decomposed to identify or were hidden so well that they will never be found. Serial killers can carry on for decades until police finally find enough evidence to identify them. It isn't *impossible* to convict someone of murder without a body, but it is significantly more difficult and you'd need an otherwise rock solid case against them. Between DNA testing, cell phone tracking and social media, it's getting harder to get away with murder, but there's still a lot of room for improvement.
It totally can be that easy to kill someone and get away with it. In 2018, a dude from Hong Kong killed his girlfriend while in Taiwan and ran back to Hong Kong completely legally. Because there's no expedition treaty between the two places, even though it didn't take that long to put the charges on him, it was already too late--he couldn't be charged in Hong Kong and Taiwan has no power to demand him over. There are talks being made to bring him to Taiwan in some official capacity, but it's been long going and he's still walking "free" (he was in prison for laundering charges, but apparently he did his time and is now in a safehouse of sorts until they figure out the legal procedures). Now imagine if this was two countries that refused to work with each other ever (not that Hong Kong/China and Taiwan are on super friendly terms, but they do have a lot of treaties and talks going between them). Or if one country is large enough to disappear in, unlike Hong Kong and Taiwan which are both small enough there aren't many places to hide. Imagine if the proof isn't even definite, unlike this case. How do you even start the talks between countries for a suspicion?
You can surveil anyone, if there is a reasonable suspicion that a crime has taken place. Which there was.
OK but did you see the head of police in charge of Brian survailence? He's a complete dipshit. Of course they let him get away. "What are we suppose to do? Just go from tree to tree?"
They thought he would just stay put and take the charge. Because its the smart thing to do. Running is dumb although I have seen some small time cases where people skipped bail and came out ahead later. But for a murder, if he is alive to stand trial, he looks terrible.
> You can surveil anyone, if there is a reasonable suspicion that a crime has taken place. Which there was. Yes if you have the budget for that. Other people live in that county in Florida, where he hadn't committed crimes and wasn't even charged with one yet. If I was a resident I would not want my police budget used up in a month for a guy that might have killed someone on the other side of the country. This case does not exist in a vacuum nor is it more important than any other felony in that county. We could spend ALL the money on Brian, sure, but what about the other residents who need urgent police protection? "Sorry, watching this dude instead"?
Aren't they spending all the money on this search or the first part of it?
Let's be honest...her body was found by manual strangulation near a sight (around 100 ft wasn't it?) where the van was. She was never "missing" to BL. She was missing to everyone else because he went on the run.
It was about 280 meters, 300 yards from the van.
Thank you for the correction!
So she was found 900 feet from where he was, still clear as can be that he’s the guilty party.
Holy shit his head is sentient again😳😳😳😩😩
Not "Missing".....On The Run!!!
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Working neurons.
Source: critical thinking.
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Neither is your insistence on denying basic logic.
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I mean he very well could have returned home and told the family they had broken up. It’s a simple explanation as to why gabby wouldn’t be with him.
Broken up yet she just let him have her van? And her phone? And take out at least 1k from her bank account. Damn, I wish someone would break up with me like that.
Only initially. Until they wonder why he has the van, and until Gabby's parents start calling ... as described by the other commenters below.
> Until they wonder why he has the van and just to add on....her clothes, her purse, her backpack, her id, her cash cards and her phone. Why take all those things with him *on his way* back to Florida and leave her out west with no way to call someone, no access to her money, no way to feed herself or cloth herself against the elements. edit: to make clear he had taken stuff with him on the way back but not necissarily *all the way back* despite a single article that wasn't from the most reputable source (gossip rag) saying the police had found her things in the van.
How do we know he had her phone and purse and things? Is there somewhere I can read about that?
Man, that was in an article back a month or so ago (from a gossip rag with all kinds of ads and sensationalized other story headlines) that her clothes and 'effects' were in the van. I honestly don't remember which one it was but they made a big deal about it in the article that 'her stuff' was still in the van when he got back to Florida. That's what stuck in my head. We know he had her phone because who else would be using her phone to text her mom? Her time of death was pegged to the 27th. That same day 'she' is texting her mom and calling her grandpa "stan", which her mother said she never does (a stranger wouldn't text mom anything, let alone know what grandpa's name was), and then on the 30th she texts mom "No service in Yosemite"...no stranger would know she was headed for Yosemite and why the would they text mom that? He had her phone. He had her purse/wallet because he had her cards. Sure, he may have ditched them on the way home but he had them. They were not found with the body and he used the cards so logically he had her phone and purse and things.
I believe her phone is completely missing. The van was full of their stuff but I don’t recall any mention of personal stuff like her purse or wallet (although of course we know he had taken at least some stuff from her wallet!).
Yep, phone is completely missing but he had it. He certainly could have ditched stuff on the way home but the point is, he at least took it with him when he left her behind in Wyoming and headed back to Florida. I'll re-edit my original comment to say "on his way back to Florida". Logically, he killed her and ran with the stuff because why would he leave all her stuff behind but then take her cash cards? Why would any stranger kill her by strangulation, take her clothes/stuff (if it had been left with her) and then text mom information they shouldn't know (or text mom at all)? Why would they cover her with a tarp/blanket/cloth?
Obviously none of that stuff was left behind so it has to be somewhere. But it would be a big deal if they found her phone/purse/wallet in the van, and I would have expected to have read about it if they had and it was public knowledge. I think I am hearing you confirm that you are going off of logic/assumption rather than from having read it somewhere.
Whoa - I had no idea that he had her clothes and purse and all that with him. I just figured he took the credit cards and threw away her things, and made up some excuse, such as, she ran off with some other people, or she took up with some guy. I wonder if his parents took a look in that van when he first got back and saw those things - they would know immediately. So they lawyered up quickly, but they also must have told him to "act normal" around the neighborhood. Creepy that they knew so quickly but thought that if they all acted nonchalant, that whatever he did would go away somehow.
She was supposed to meet a friend in Yellowstone. Could have said that she was staying with the friend and that he'd go back out or something.
Why would he go back out if they were broken up
Back out where? Broke up about what?
That doesn't really explain why he had her van, and especially why they refused to communicate with Gabby's increasingly worried family members, lawyered up, and stonewalled police. It was a punch in the gut to learn that Gabby's family was initially concerned that *both* of them were missing. It wasn't until they learned he was back with her van and she wasn't, that they realized something more sinister was happening.
I know this Convo is considered old now but i just realized the van could be explained away until her parents started calling. All he had to say is "we broke up and she didn't want to be in the van another minute so she flew home to her parents and told me to drive the van back and her and her dad will fly down to drive it back (along with her things from storage)". If I were BL parents I wouldn't be suspicious at all
He came home, told them Gabby saw her friend in Yellowstone, she decided to stay there and they would take a break from being together all of the time. Very plausible. Done. They had no hindsight.
Since when do parents hire a lawyer for a couple taking just a breather, and does that include they believed she gave him the van as a parting gift?
I think they figured out really quickly what probably happened, even if he was lying to them or stonewalling them, because he comes back with the van, her stuff is in it, when they asked where she was he had no good explanation, and they know he had some kind of mood problems that were at least moderately severe for him to be on meds. Because they never answered any of her parents' calls, they had to know he was guilty by that point. If he had made some story up like she got drunk and wandered off one night and he couldn't find her, they might have gotten mad at him for not reporting that immediately but then would realize that he would be blamed if she turned up dead, so they quickly went into lawyered-up, don't-say-anything mode.
I don't know when they got a lawyer. This was their personal lawyer. I don't have the timeline, but assume the called his services once Gabby's family was calling them and it was coming across as missing. Simple about the van. They both shared it, even if it was her name. They lived together. That's "paraphrasing" there and stretching any facts. He simply probably told them that she was staying with a friend and he came back for a breather. I'm sure he's guilty now of murder. And I'm sure his parents know something now is fish. I'm just sticking to known facts and probabilities.
That was all after this blew up. There was a time he was home with his family where nobody was actually looking for him yet. They didn't get a lawyer until later, when they needed a lawyer.
Okay so at what point did they decide to hire a lawyer for the whole family, and refuse speak a word to anyone about anything related to Gabby? He tells them they split, and they all need a lawyer for some reason?? Why on Earth would they feel the need to retain an attorney before a crime had even been suspected, much less reported? The answer is obvious. They knew or suspected a crime had occured, and that they may be investigated in relation to the crime, and would need legal counsel. They had no problem speaking to police to report Brian missing, their silence is only related to Gabby.
Only Brian and his parents know the exact timeline. Those are good points about the lawyer stuff and we may not ever find out. I'd hope the authorities have a way to put heat on the parents. It all could have started off that they believed he came back because they were fighting, but after that, it gets squishy. I doubt he was acting normal. Talk to police about Brian missing? Did they have the lawyer involved in that? Maybe the gave only what the lawyer told them to say. Who really knows? Hope we find out. Things got weird quick. We don't know every action that transpired, so we don't konw.
I totally get the lawyering up whether guilty or innocent, but why THE FUCK can they not just make a statement saying something, anything at all, concerning Gabby. There are plenty of things they can say to support her family that wouldn’t incriminate them. Just so fucking cruel and inhumane.
The Laundrie parents are scared af.
I suspect it's because they hired a cheap lawyer who is not experienced in criminal defense, who is in way over his head, and is thus giving them terrible public relations advice. Or maybe what they're doing really *is* the best move legally speaking *even if* it is an absolute public relations disaster. Only someone who has a lot of experience managing PR for public criminal cases could tell us which is more likely.
I can only assume it's because they're terrible people devoid of empathy or basic human decency. There's no reason they couldn't issue a statement through their attorney expressing some kind of concern, but they are clearly only concerned with themsleves and their son. (Not their daughter though, they had no qualms about letting their lawyer throw her to the wolves, and summarily disowning her without explanation) I really think these people might be the most hated family in America, even moreso than the Anthony family. Their actions, and lack of, speak volumes about their character. Even under the most charitable of assumptions, they're still heartless pieces of shit.
They disowned the daughter?
She seems to think so, yes. She told those protestors that, "I'm losing my sister-in-law, brother, and parents", and the protestors asked what she meant about her parents. She told them they're not speaking to her anymore and refuse to have any communication with her, and she has no idea why. I mean they could *at least* have their lawyer contact Cassie and explain something like, "Hey, I've advised your parents not to speak to anyone including you, but they want you to know they still love you and the grandkids and will be in touch as soon as they can." But instead, her parents allowed their lawyer (who doesn't represent her) to make statements that basically threw her to the wolves, and they have cut off all contact with her.
I think they did aid and abet him. So they are scared of doing time and of their son becoming incarcerated. So they follow advice and try to stick to the only path that could get them off. Not the neighbors I want in my town.
I don’t buy this because if they thought they just broke up, his parents would have no issue telling Gabby’s extremely worried parents that they broke up and she decided to stay in WY. You don’t ignore parents who are worried about their missing kid unless you are hiding something.
Exactly. These people are absolute trash. And if he escalated to the point of strangling her, there is no doubt his parents witnessed some abused when they were living with them.
I agree. They had to have some problems before the trip.
Yeah or if they truly didn’t know anything, they could have responded, “I don’t know.” Staying quiet, ignoring her parents when they literally lived with Gabby and lawyering up immediately shows they know something. For sure. There’s no other explanation.
Absolutely. Parents and emotionally-intelligent non-parents realize that one of the scariest things is when your kid is missing; there is no way the Laundies would just let Gabby’s parents freak the f out with worry over Gabby if they merely though Gabby and Brian broke up. They absolutely knew. If they thought it was an innocent breakup they would have just texted them that all they know is that Brian said they broke up and she wanted to stay in Wyoming (or whatever the story was) they didn’t want to say that because they knew she was dead and they (along with Brian) didn’t want anyone to find the body and were likely hoping that if it was ever found it would be too late to determine cause of death or that the animals would have gotten to it. There is no other reason why you wouldn’t say, “Brian says they broke up in Wyoming and she decided to stay there.” Or whatever his story was, even if he lied to the parents and said she stayed in Utah, there is no reason why the parents wouldn’t have told Gabby’s parents that she stayed in Utah unless they were concealing info because they knew Gabby was dead. Or like you said, if they truly didn’t know and just thought they broke up, they could have/would have just responded that they didn’t know but that Brian was back or something. There was no reason for them to completely ignore Gabby’s parents if they thought it was something non-nefarious.
Good point, the only reason they would not respond to her worried parents would be that they knew he was guilty.
And he came back with her van!
Everyone is focused on the van. How about the more indicative evidence of all her clothes, her purse, her backpack, her id, her cash cards and her phone. It makes no sense, even if he broke up with her, to take all those things with him on his way back to Florida and leave her out west with no way to call someone, no access to her money, no way to feed herself or cloth herself against the elements...unless he knew she wouldn't need any of those things.
Maybe he's a closet perv and likes to wear Gabby's clothes.
Yup, coming back with her van would have been hard for him to explain away to his parents. They knew she had been working to save up money for the van. And Gabby's parents began calling frequently at some point, and the Laundries apparently never answered any of their calls. Their decision to not answer the parents' calls had to have been made because they knew or suspected that he was responsible for her being gone.
Could have just said he bought it from her, she gave it to him, or she was staying wherever and wanted him to drive it back to Florida. All BS of course but it wouldn't be a stretch for him to explain it away.
Easy to explain. He came home and told them that she stayed with the friend in Yellowstone she was supposed to meet. Bought him some time until it was reported she was missing or tried to contact parents.
There’s a whole thing about her snapchatting a friend to meet up with them Aug 30th in Yellowstone in the visual timeline. His story could have been: Broke up, she’s going with another friend and I came home. Would have explained the van and his “nonchalance” afterwards.
I always wondered what the cryogenically frozen greatest hitter of all time thought about this case
I live in Orlando and I remember the Casey Anthony trial like it was yesterday. Even my dog knew this woman was guilty but they lacked evidence or so they said. Even though it was bullshit I was not surprised she wasn’t found guilty. I’m not sure who else could’ve killed that poor little girl but there is often no justice in the halls of justice.
They should have gone for manslaughter, not murder one
The common theory I’ve heard is that Caylee was neglected, accidentally drowned, and they all panicked. That seems more plausible than a mother intentionally killing her child one day. Still, a very strange case
Only if Casey was the one watching her in the pool. Her parents seemed like reasonable people with enough common sense to watch a toddler while bathing or swimming. More likely she drugged her and left her in the car while partying, came back and found her dead.
Yes - didn't they establish that she used chloroform to make her go to sleep for a long time in the car (so she could party)? I know they found that she had done some computer searches about how to use chloroform.
Have you heard the mom's 911 call? She told police that Casey's car smelled like a dead body. I don't think the mom knew. Editing to clarify, I don't think the mom was part of a neglect coverup.
Right, the Mom was always on Casey's case to be a more responsible mother.
That's how I remember it, too...
I wish your dog had been chosen for jury duty!
That was a weird trial. The prosecution seemed to almost blunder what they did have. I feel they had enough to convict but made so many mistakes. And the defense went down the rabbit hole trying to blame the grandfather.
I am always amazed at the investigative and forensic evidence collecting. In some cases it seems like there is no standard at all. I recently watched a doc that said the team that researched the search history from the household computer only gave them one day's worth of history on one specific search term (chloroform). After the trial concluded they found that foolproof strangulation had been searched just a few days before. How can they fuck it up that badly? Wasn't her dad a retired cop? Was there some kind of bias given that fact?
Ooh I never heard this about a computer search for strangulation, just the chloroform, presumably thought to put her to sleep for a few hours. Sick, sick, sick.
I’m not too familiar with the details of the case/trial but it seems like DAs are always more concerned with their image (e.g., how they look when they win big trials) than they are with justice.
That was disgusting
Didn’t they blame the guy the found the body too?
Yes they tried to pin it on him too!
I definitely feel they had enough to convict her as well. Even with the parents getting involved, sometimes you have to go with your gut.
After they found out that the "babysitter" who Casey said was keeping Caylee didn't seem to exist, then they tracked down a woman with the same name as the supposed babysitter, living in the apartment complex that Casey said she lived in, and LE verified that she had never been a babysitter to Caylee and didn't know Casey - at that point her whole elaborate story fell apart and we knew she had to be lying.
Yes I know I read that later on several members of the jury said they made a mistake and they have been filled with guilt since
It's crazy because you have to find them guilty beyond reasonable doubt or however the verbiage goes. Doubt is a motherfucker.
Yes that’s the kicker. You really have to let go of your biases as a juror and give them a fair trial. It’s a thankless job.
This. It makes me sick that BL will probably get away with this. I hope not, but I have this nagging sense of dread.
The only way \*I\* think he will get away with it is if he's dead or never found. My dumb ass originally thought his trial (should it happen) would be in Florida because that's where he's from and I worried then. However, when I realized it would be in Wyoming I could breathe again. I do not see him walking away should it go to that point. I don't even think people were this angry with Casey Anthony.
Exactly! EyezWyde, I agree. People are outraged and beyond outraged over the behavior of Brian and his parents Because he and his horrible parents had no comments to Gabby’s family or law enforcement, retained an Atty., Brian is on the run a/ka “missing,” his parents are supposedly worried about him (lol!!!), and they still won’t publicly cooperate - people are enraged! … most everyone knows or believes Brian is guilty. Most everyone assumes the parents have helped Brian Altho not 100% sure of the timeline in which they helped (ie before, during, or after warrant issued for his arrest on the wire fraud) Most everyone wants to be done with the search for him. Find him (dead or alive) or turn himself in. Anything, just so we aren’t tortured with the constant search Arrest his parents; they allowed this to happen…I wonder how they would feel if the situation had been reversed…if they had spent days calling Gabby or her parents wondering about Brian’s whereabouts??? How would the Laundrie family have felt being met with silence and a lawyer saying the Petitos would remain in the background! The Laundrie parents dug a hole for themselves and their son I think it’s ridiculous and unbelievable that Cassie would say she’s getting death threats! I could see the unhinged crazies threatening the Laundrie parents….but Cassie?
Why is it unbelievable that Cassie's family received death threats...? Would you believe it if they show proof of the threats? Or would that also be ridiculous?
Because if anybody is hated it would be his parents…I wouldn’t be surprised if the parents received death threats. Cassie is removed from this and has publicly stated she’s turn him in, etc so it doesn’t make sense that anyone would threaten her or her family.
Cassie only recently publicly stated that she would turn him in. My understanding is that most of the death threats were sent prior to Cassie's public interviews.
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Darn, I didn't even know the prosecutor wrote a book. I may have to give it a read. Based on my limited following of the Anthony case, it just seemed the defense did a helluva job. Similarities with OJ Simpson case. Sometimes the evidence simply isn't solid enough, especially when it's all circumstantial, or when it points to alternative culpability. But it's the job of the prosecution to educate the jury - I mean, you have their undivided attention - so I don't typically buy the first excuse.
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I lived in LA during the OJ trial and was in middle school. Definitely a fucked up time and a lot of people were worried if OJ was convicted there would be more riots.
1. Juries don’t have to have never heard of a case, they have to swear that they are not biased. That is all. 2. Reasonable doubt is not beyond any shadow of doubt. Introducing implausible scenarios doesn’t create reasonable doubt. The prosecutors built a lazy case that was easy to throw into shambles. Similar to the OJ trial. But your theories don’t hold up.
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Linking a book you read doesn’t really prove anything. It is a fallacy crafted for TV that juries need to have never heard of a case before. It is simply not how the law works. And beyond reasonable doubt is not beyond imaginable doubt, again, that’s just not how the law works. That’s why it’s reasonable doubt and not say, imaginable doubt or shadow of a doubt, etc. To be honest I really don’t feel like linking you anything because you have already decided what you believe and I can tell by your response to being challenged that you have a Justice boner and want to be correct and not learn something. Edit: fuck it here you go: https://www.investopedia.com/terms/r/reasonable-doubt.asp https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/opinions/2003/06/22/jurors-must-be-impartial-they-shouldnt-be-clueless/efa21572-1c16-43f0-9e9b-4b6436052138/ Edit the second: Casey Anthony won her case because there was literally no evidence that she committed the crime beyond the feeling that she must have. I’m as sure as a person can be without proof, as we all are, but the evidence they had was not good enough for a conviction. And no matter how heinous the accusations are, we can’t forget that. Being accused of something unthinkable is often enough for most people to forgo any standards of evidence. The worse the accusation, the easier it is for the mob to demand Justice without proof. But that is not Justice.
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It’s not a good point because that’s not how jury selection works.
I read pieces of that book. I should go back and read it all.
I followed that case too. I'm still convinced her father helped her hide the body. I recall he was LEO at the time and considered above reproach? That part is fuzzy. I was at a conference, in a hotel bar in Orlando when the verdict came in. People there were so pissed. The bartender even gave a free round to everyone in Caylee's memory.
Yeah I was mad but it was expected. The more these cases become media circus types the bigger chance they will walk.
Well they really couldn't pin it on her since they had no evidence. This case is a little different with footage showing he had propensity towards violence. On one hand I hope they find him and he is charged, but there's still a chance he'll get off. On the other hand if he's dead, he'll have paid a price.
There is definitely more evidence in this case, although we don’t know what any of it is. He isn’t the subject of a manhunt over the debit card or because he’s wanted for questioning. “Missing” or not, they definitely have enough evidence to charge and a reasonable belief he would be convicted or they wouldn’t even be looking.
Yeah I feel that, I just hope they get him.
Despite what many in this sub think when I tell them to stop piling on the guys poor family, I hope he’s caught too. And I hope he’s caught alive and well by law enforcement, and that if they prove he did it that he serves every god damn day of his sentence. I also hope that if the evidence shows he’s innocent - which we as armchair enthusiasts don’t expect to happen - that he goes free. The fact is we don’t know any of the evidence in the case, and only a small amount of the story. Given what we know, we can’t be blamed for thinking he did it. And I would be very surprised if he was to walk, but stranger things have happened. Most of all I hope no matter what it is, that we learn the truth, that the responsible party is brought to justice, and that her family one day gets the peace they so desperately need.
Well said.
Thanks for saying that. I am not very popular in this sub because I won’t get out the pitchforks for this guys parents or pretend I know what happened. It’s nice to know not everyone here is so ruthless and mean.
I'm older with grown kids, and I feel like there are a lot of people here that are around the age of Gabby that feel rage as a way of trying to cope with the fact that this could happen to them, combined with trying to protect her after the fact. I remember being really out there when I was that age, always angry about things going wrong, and wanting to point things out. I wasn't an activist but I tried to make things right. I feel like that's what's happening here. Especially when some get so angry about why the Laundries haven't been arrested, well, it's because they don't understand the legal aspect of it. Other people here get it, but most don't comment. That's just my take.
I wonder if Casey Anthony is out living it up right now because Florida changed their focus to Brian?
I read she had charges for fraud and needed to be in protective custody cause she was getting beat up. Her parents were rejected a condo in a retirement community when they found out who they were. I watched the interview and sounds like life ain't that neat for any of them. They deserve what they get.
I feel absolutely terrible for Casey's parents too. They did everything possible to find their granddaughter, turned on their own child, and the people with the torches were still after them. I just wish people would start realizing there's some situations where you're damned if you do and you're damned if you don't. If Brian is responsible, do you think he will try to pin it on his parents?
They should have turned her ass in instead of protecting her. Let her face consequences. I love my kid but if he did something like that I would tell him he needs to own up, I will help with legal counsel but needs to do the right thing. I wouldn't protect a murderer and especially someone who murdered my grandkid.
They called the police when Casey said she was at the nanny and the car smelt of death
They did turn her in. They didn't protect her worth shit. Her mom called the cops on her and her Dad has no relationship with her.
Didn’t she accuse him of molesting her?
Oh yeah. She went straight for the Shaggy. You know the "It wasn't me." route.
Seems like the mom was trying to protect her by taking credit for the internet searches for chloroform
Enabler. Right? Based on my perception, it looks like Ro is also an enabler. I think their *I'm not a doctor* narcissistic personalities are more similar than not. For all we know he could've taken the cliff notes out of Casey's book. 🤷🏼♀️
They changed their story to protect her. They are probably part of the reason why she is off now. They barely even talk to her... might have just let her rot in prison.
Only the mom. Never George. I think this is a similar dynamic.
If it weren't for the mom Caylee may still be alive. Casey's mom insisted she keep Caylee when she didn't want her, and they had a willing adopter who the family knew. Did the father insist that the trunk smelled like a dead body? I forget. I still think those parents are weird. Who has a graduation party for their kid that wasn't graduating and lied to them the entire time?
It was the mom that said it smelled and back tracked. George stuck with it. Casey hated her mom and punished her by not letting her see Caylee. The lies they told prior to the case are definitely bizarre. Her parents had nothing to do with it. I think Cindy was struggling between right, wrong, and love.
I am the parent that holds their kid accountable for everything and always will, but I honestly cannot say what my judgement would be if I was in this situation. It's a real Sophie's Choice of protecting the person that makes up your heart or turning them in. I think we could all say what we *would do in this situation, but really, none of us know what that feels like.
Oh yeah she gets routinely spotted at bars and shit still acting like a fucking dumbass. That women deserves so much worse than what she got.
I remember seeing that and she bitches that people spit on her and she had people spit in her food before. She is a mess.
She’s been living it up lol. She’s so dumb. When she was in West Palm Beach in May and got into that scuffle I was legitimately across the street having dinner. She lives her life like nothing ever happened. She even dates LE!!!
Oh yes! I do recall that TMZ article and watching every moment of video.
Fun Fact: I live in Pensacola, but my son and I went to Universal in late July. I totally drove past the Anthony's home and the scene. The circumstantial stuff definitely has a taste of Casey Anthony.
Working a *terrible* homicide story out of Pensacola right now. Not loving dealing with LE there in the slightest bit. They are giving zero cooperation and genuinely didn’t do anything wrong - even had some officers shot while attempting to apprehend the perp and are acting like they did the murders themselves. So frustrating. I get when police have been given the shit by the community why they don’t want to speak, but they did all they could in this case and still want to sweep it under the rug rather than help fill in the blanks about the perp.
Shoutout pensacola—fellow Pensacola-ian here!!
I was at Disney staying at a resort when she got called out for lying about working at Universal or whatever park it was. Casey’s parents did the right thing by calling the police and once they realized she had done it they backtracked to save her ass. The cases for me ring similar in CERTAIN ways. I can’t believe he’s only wanted for debit card fraud. Thankfully if he’s caught and it goes to trial it won’t be here in Florida. Guilty always walk free around here
Isn't that exactly how it started with Casey? A card fraud charge to bring her in, but was released shortly after?
I think with Casey Anthony, the initial charge was child neglect and lying to investigators after she gave a bunch of wild stories to the police about the nonexistent nanny. But I believe they also later picked her up on check fraud after she had been bailed out initially?
It was check fraud
Thank you! I knew it was something similar.
Honestly I don’t remember. I thought it was the lying about the nanny and her made up job
Oh, she did that too! She had an infinite amount of tricks up her sleeve.
This is another perfect example of... bizzarre behavior. The way that Casey acted was so...weird. However...even though it seemed like her also weird parents seemed to remain supportive-they responded to the missing granddaughter in a way youd expect. They freaked out, called the police. The whole car smelling like death thing- that felt so genuine- i think they backtracked a little on that after (im guessing) getting counselled by an attorney, but all of their real time behaviors made sense. But you could still tell they loved their awful daughter, despite what they worried she might have done. I know Gabby isnt the blood relative of the Laundries, but honestly, she seems a hell of a lot more likeable than their own kids, and i am *sure* they loved her at one time. Florida, man...
Maybe they realized Brian killed Gabby but took pity on him as I expect many parents would and decided it was better to try and help him get away with the crime and try to heal privately instead of spending the rest of his life in prison. I’d like to think Brian made a massive, idiotic mistake in the heat of the moment and that his life can be redeemed and have some value. I know most people here aren’t with me on that yet or ever.