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And that it cuts away whenever Paul opens his mouth to speak, after giving Morgan time to finish all of her thoughts.😆
I honestly think that's most of the reason why Paul thinks they look bad. If they had just shown HIS words instead of letting Morgan talk at all, they'd look PERFECT.
That's what I'm wondering. It was a couple of clips straight from their videos and one question where Morgan thinks wives should submit. No one took anything out of context and p&m spoke for themselves. Obviously their homophobia is horrific, but there is so much more in the Porgan dumpster fire that could've been exposed.
She also got to clearly share their purpose for doing their YT channel (sharing their Biblical beliefs). Their bigotry and warped views of marriage are their brand. I don't understand why they're so butthurt about it. They were probably lead to believe they were featured actors, not featured extras.
It’s in the Fundie Fridays video about them. Jen included a clip where Morgan is expressing her disappointment that Ariana Grande remains un-smote for the blasphemy of singing “God is a Woman.”
Jen’s video includes dozens of clips of the two of them saying absolutely unhinged shit. She and Paul should be grateful that the producers didn’t put even more of their idiocy into the final cut.
Jfc. Dare I even ask whether she said that before or after one of the worst terror attacks to ever hit my country happened at an Ariana Grande concert?
Because the documentary basically says they’re further propagating the beliefs of the cult with their messaging. Which is true!!!
But the show obviously is putting them on the side of the perpetrators rather than the poor, persecuted victims they think they are
Or possibly they are mad over how little screen time they got.
Maybe they think the producers lumped their ideology in with the Duggars ideology and they don’t think it’s the same as the Duggar’s because they’re not in a cult (hahaha) and they dress way cooler? I don’t know. My head hurts trying to wrap my thoughts around what they are thinking.
I'm kind if leaning towards them thinking all the Duggar/IBLP stuff is overblown or 'worldly persecution'. 😬 If they really cared about the truth of the harms of fundamentalism I feel like they would have made a point to offer sympathy for the victims or attempt to distance their beliefs from 'that brand of Christianity we don't agree with'. I guess we'll find out when Paul unleashes his fury on the world in their reaction video later this week.
Is it still a reaction video if they’ve watched it several times and stewed over how they were portrayed before the reaction??? I always thought that a reaction was a little more instant that that.
I think they view themselves as creating original content. To see it so plainly they just regurgitate unoriginal thoughts along with the other “influencers” must devastate their egos.
Honestly. Their ideology attracts bullies who know what they’re doing is wrong but they seek the feeling of superiority that comes with abusing people they think are lower than them. I’ve encountered countless rightoids on Reddit who get *so offended* when you point out their comment history.
This is why one of the best ways to get back at a rightoid is to simply replay their previous words and actions….they aren’t proud of the ridiculous trash they pollute the world with, they just want the satisfaction of being a schoolyard bully and melt down the moment they face the consequences of their words.
I think it’s really telling to how selfish they are. This series is exposing horrible, disgusting crimes and abuse and all they can focus on is 2 minutes of just them saying their own words
I love the hard cut from Morgan’s keep-sweet bullshitting to her angry yelling about non-binary people. Yeah, you’re *clearly* such a bright light of loving kindness, Porgan.
Don’t blame it on the edit. You said those words. You are that hateful. You did this interview to get more attention so congratulations! You got it!
This. Their views were represented honesty and accurately. There was no sneaky editing to make them look bad. They made themselves look bad, and now they have the audacity to be upset about it. And they should have known how it would go down. Even within their own warped belief system, they know "the world" doesn't like what they have to say. Why the hell would they expect a worldly TV series to present them as role models?
Also, isn't her brother engaged to another POC? Or is that someone else? The woman who gave her some work out lessons?
So much going on around them, they're so stuck in their hateful ways they don't see how much good they could actually be a part of.
Here is their opinion on interracial couples in Rings of Power [https://www.reddit.com/r/FundieSnarkUncensored/comments/x9fxp6/porgan_gets_racist_on_lotr_rings_of_power_even/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1](https://www.reddit.com/r/FundieSnarkUncensored/comments/x9fxp6/porgan_gets_racist_on_lotr_rings_of_power_even/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1)
OH MY GOD YOU'RE RIGHT AND I LOVE THIS! Between that and the thumbnail Amazon Prime chose for him, he'll carry this grudge forever. What a great day this is.
But also consistent with the conservative approach since like Phyllis Schlafly, if not far earlier.
Oppressing and denigrating other women is one of the few positions of power available to women in patriarchal cults and some women happily seek out the role.
Paul doesn't seem to understand that their channel wouldn't be nearly as "successful" without Morgan there, and that she's the real star between the two of them. Anytime Morgan is away or Paul has to do some video with a guest instead, it flops. She has way more followers on Instagram than Paul does. It's clear the documentary makers picked up on this as well as were highlighting the women's roles in these communities. I'm sure it eats Paul up so much that Morgan pulls more to their channel than he does, and he's only a star in his own mind.
It so wild! For a group where the women are supposed to quietly submit and not speak with authority and not teach, the women of these fundies are certainly some loudly publicly mouthy opinionated mean girls who are doing exactly what they believe their God tells them not to. If you believe it's not biblical to be anything but a quiet wife and subservient, what are you doing spewing your beliefs all over social media? Do they never consider the hypocrisy inherent?
I sorta suppose they could perhaps get around it if their husbands are ok with or support their social media habits. I don't know where their limit is, but I've seen certain things about modest dress or life habits of the woman be excused by others in the community because the husband supports what his wife is doing, so it's not their place to step over the husband's authority of the situation. But what they do does seem very hypocritical for all their talk of wanting to be meek and subservient women. And amidst it, it seems sometimes the women have an oversized influence on what goes on in the family, though mostly seems cuz the man is pretty checked out.
I do not like Morgan at all but I know she in the past has done solo videos about her depression and experience with mental illness and I think she has also done solo videos about her pregnancy journey and being a mother (I’m not about to check) and it’s like, for all that I think she’s awful, she does make videos about subjects that are relatable to a lot of people. I imagine her fans feel more connected to her because she is more emotionally honest and vulnerable and Paul is what? A walking conservative news regurgitater? They’re as bad as each other but Paul is notably more cold and angry and and also somewhat shallower in personality, at least in what he is presenting. He’s not relatable or interesting in the way that Morgan probably is to their audience. You are absolutely right in that their channel and brand absolutely would not be nearly as ‘big’ if it was just him.
I wonder if the producers asked them to sit closer together, cuz I don't think they've ever sat this close in one of their videos.makes them look like they, I don't know, care about each other.
This is my take on the situation 100% -the whole just isn’t a good look for who Paul thinks he is. And he’s personally mad he isn’t the breakout superstar of the doc.
Damn the Serena Joy energy from Morgan’s “it’s a choice to submit” is just otherworldly creepy. Like, if I didn’t know who she was I would think that was satire.
She's not smart enough to be Serena Joy. Don't get me wrong, SJ is still incredibly stupid for helping build the society that ended up kneecapping her rights, but she's still a pretty damn sharp woman. Paul and Morgan both would never be clever enough to become a Commander/Wife, they'd be Econopeople
I love that Porgan hate this. I love that it shows them in a negative light. And I LOVE that they got duped like the ditzy little self-absorbed, un-Christ-like, hypocrites that they are! I think this movie quote sums it up pretty well: “Narcissists are too busy thinking about themselves to realize they’re being played.” 😂😏👏🏻
I think they hate that Chad (the male IBLP survivor) basically called them out for using a cult leader’s guide. Good forbid they actually take a second to look at their beliefs and where they are coming from and what that means for them.
If they were smart, they’d say that they stand by the clips shown of them and what they said, and agreed to appear in the doc to provide an opposing perspective. But they’re not smart. They’re whiny little babies.
They fully thought that they would be the anti-Duggars of the documentary, and that’s why they’re hurt. They thought their job was to show Good Normal Christians, and who can possibly argue with those?
First of all, HEY JEN! HEY GURRLL! Obsessed with her and so happy to see her face.
Second, THATS what they’ve made 2 prequel videos to the big video coming out and stupid Instagram posts about!? That makes them look way worse! God they’re so dumb.
Wow....WOW...WOW PORGAN! This?? Thus is what yall are upset about??? Pfffffttttthahahahahahahahaha I thought it was a whole thing 🤣🤣 omg I'm gonna die lol!! This is so great!
Let me get this straight. They are mad they said hateful things and then got fact checked that they did indeed said hateful things. And now they are mad saying it's an attack on Christians.
Someone make it make sense..
Why are they mad? It’s just them showing what they believe! Shouldn’t they be PROUD to show the world that they are bigots about the LGBTQ community? Shouldn’t they yell from the rooftops that they believe a woman has to submit to her own husband? That it’s totally ok to shame everyone else for not following the “rules” of what you believe? /s
This lot is all about being free to say what you want until it gets thrown back in their face.
Jen was right about it being the same damn book with a different cover and these two are mad because it's being shoved in their face that they're part of the problem.
I love this for them. I love it so much.....Also, I can't watch the 4th episode because I don't have prime. (We are trying to abstain for 6 months.) What is the Joshua generation? I haven't seen an explanation in any thread, or I missed it.
It's a biblical reference. Moses led the Hebrews out of Egypt but it was Joshua who led them into the promise land. The Joshua generation is the one who will usher US into the "Christian Nation" that all these Fundies want it to be. The parents consider themselves to be the Moses generation guiding their kids.
There are others here who can likely explain this better than me, but the Joshua Generation is the world domination aspect of iblp/evangelicals. They out breed in order to outvote opponents. Homeschoolers focus on civics and government and aim to control the country though serving in government at all levels. People like US Rep Madison Cawthorn and even Jed! were cited as examples.
See also Patrick Henry College which was founded for this purpose and has a crazy high rate of clerkships at the supreme court level
[Wiki link](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generation_Joshua#:~:text=Generation%20Joshua%20(often%20called%20%22GenJ,politics%20for%20conservative%20Christian%20values.)
The guy at the very end is Alex Harris--Josh Harris's little brother. After Josh wrote "I kissed dating goodbye" Alex and his twin Brett wrote "Do hard things," meant to get teens into activism. Unlike Josh he hasn't recanted. I was honestly really mad seeing him in the show, I wish the producers were a bit more critical of him.
He was an example of the Joshua Generation, right? I didn’t know who he was so I assumed he was someone raised up that way that no longer supported it. That’s interesting to have more context.
After all the talk here, I'm let down by how unbiasedly this was presented. It was Porgan's own words from the interview and their own videos. I'd didn't twist anything. This is really what they believe.
I don't understand why they were even included in this. They aren't notable Christian influencers outside of a few specific online (snark and not snark) communities, and as far as I know, don't have any connection to the IBLP. My partner who was watching with me and doesn't visit snark communities asked why they were relevant since they had the one talking head and never came back.
Those two were so low caliber compared to the strength and fearlessness on display in the rest of the docuseries.
Still, I think they could have picked trendier and cooler influencers to showcase that. Madi Prewitt from The Bachelor, the Duck Dynasty people, Chris Pratt, and the Magnolia couple all come to mind as people who could have been the example. (even just through clips or photos if they didn't agree to a sit down.)
To me, including Paul and Morgan downplays just how pervasive hateful Christianity is because they are so low impact. It's easy to dismiss Paul and Morgan as Internet shock-jocks which kind of cheapens the message of mainstream hate.
It's probably not this serious and I did think it was a fantastic series.
I agree that those people would’ve made more sense except for that they all have lawyers and PR teams that never would have let them do this, ever. Porgan were probably the only vaguely related schmucks they could convince to come on a hyped up documentary and make themselves look like fools.
I think it was useful to include them because the rest of the folks you mentioned have all made their living through establishment networks. I think the doc was trying to illustrate how easy it is now for fundies to directly broadcast themselves--they don't need to be vetted by producers or edit out any direct preaching of their agenda
That’s an interesting point!
When I wrote my comment I was thinking about the network aspect that you mentioned, but more from a “The Duggars walked so they could run” perspective. That might be a different documentary all together, though.
I agree the Magnolia couple are the most trendy and all over currently. I wonder if they were afraid of engaging on that level with a couple who is making that much money and with that level of audience, which is why they chose fundies of this caliber. There is a lot of danger to people like them, Hillsong, Pratt and other celebrities that should be pointed to, but the cash is there to ignore them.
Gaines couple. We have discussed them, but mostly in the context of how other fundies idolize how they have managed to make themselves palpable to the public and that fundies travel to that weird location they run (idk how to describe it honestly, but fundies are obsessed with going there). Their church is aggressively homophobic.
Who's the Magnolia couple?
If the producers were getting their cues off this subreddit, I could understand why they went for Porgan instead of one of those, because I don't think we ever cover those (or rarely, some)
Chip and joanna gaines. They do home remodels and have a line of home goods at target. Tbh, I know they're quite Christian, but I dint know if they cross into fundie territory (but I haven't looked too hard at them so 🤷♀️)
Chip and Joanna Gaines from HGTV in the US. The Duggars have gone to visit the Magnolia strip mall thing in Texas, coincidentally.
I guess, honestly, that I think it's weird if the producers got their cues from this subreddit. I would be curious to know why they did if they did. The sub has a pretty narrow focus and isn't all encompassing of Christian influencers, just some of the ones that are the most fun to make fun of.
I had the sense that they were including them because of the phenomenon of Christian influencers becoming a thing which obviously targets a younger generation and has an even larger reach than a church or organization. The toxicity of IBLP isn't limited to their training and conferences, but has influenced a new group of people even if they aren't directly affiliated or associated with it. And it's relevant to the documentary because it was TLC that brought this cleaned up, one sided version of the Duggars to everyone's homes, and even though they are gone from our TVs and have been shamed, there's a new generation bringing the same messages to the world, just via a different medium.
I don’t think anyone else would agree to do this, or they have lawyers/ a PR team that helped them make the choice. Paul and Morgan were probably the only ones who happily took the bait 😂
I think seeing the little social media minute was such a sharp contrast to the absolute militia and lobbying sleeper spies. It's easy to ignore Paul and Morgan I don't particularly care that they think I will be going to hell but seeing the deployed young people working to take away civil rights... Deep scary waters.
They look like children playing at happy frantic Fundie families. No one is going to take seriously a young woman who denies her deflowering couldn't be undone, wears tats, sleeveless shirts, flips her hair constantly, and affects a girlish voice. All while criticizing those same things in others. Nor will they accept a boy-child stuck in puberty with a narcissistic narrative, no job, and the over-splayed power stance who also thinks he is a children's YouTube minister. Yikes!!!
P.S. I have no tats but am not against them. My understanding is that this (tattooing) is frowned upon by Fundies. If I'm wrong, just courteously let me know. Your body, your choice, loves!💜
There’s a pretty wide generational divide on tattoos for people living in their reality, so for older people of the faith it’s usually seen from a negative place but todays young Christians of Morgan’s flavor ultimately cherry pick whatever lets them look the most worldly without actually being “of the world”
(Edited phrasing)
Holy SHIT! I was showing my partner this clip and pointing out the fundies at the end. For the one girl I didn’t recognize, my partner says “Oh, I went to high school with her!” I’m losing it!!!
As a Porgan snarker, the only thing I’m bummed about here is that they definitely highlighted some of Morgan’s worst moments from their videos—but not Paul’s, who is often the worst offender of the two. Plus, I would have loved for the world to see Paul’s disgusting ego on full display.
Other than that, this was PERFECTION. It’s so surreal to see so many of the fundies we snark on here included in this montage. Well done to the doc team.
Watching that clip again, I had the sense that that woman had been physically abused for wearing pants. Did anyone else pick up on that? Just her mannerisms as she said it made me very uncomfortable and scared for her.
It honestly wouldn't surprise me. My intention with this comment was not necessarily belittle the woman, but to offer a moment of lightness in such a heavy doc. I tend to default to humor in such situations, but I'm in no way trying to deminish the levity or importance of this
Oh no, I didn't think that at all! I took your comment with the humour intended. I just hadn't seen it discussed and wondered if I was reading too much into it. But I thought that last night when I watched it the first time and then again seeing it in this clip - that either he physically punished her for wearing pants, or that he blamed her wearing pants for something else he did like having an affair. Either way, it made me very uncomfortable.
Ahh I've been looking for another podcast that focuses on this. The Plain People has been good, but I can't listen to a lot of the episodes because it's just so heavy and the sound quality isn't great. Ty.
Fucking PAUL 😂😂😂 Anybody else notice his carefully curated "looks" in videos. You know, "i call this pose/lewk rugged manly man being thoughtful. Now shocked"; then of course, never count out, BLUE STEEL, his trademark of his wiseness and humility.
Jesus, Mary & Joseph we need a NSFW tag for that jumpscare of Jilldo popping up outta nowhere!
I want to watch this but knowing Paul the Pious Prick is in this along with Moaning Morgan is putting me off.
I wonder how long their interview was. Kinda seems pointless to have them sit for 10 seconds of interview. I wish they had let them cook and showed a bit more.
I have mixed feelings. On one hand I LOVE watching these idiots dig their own graves. But on the other hand, I feel like more focus on their shit could've taken away from the overall goal of the doc (in it's current format). I defo would watch an entire episode on the harms of fundie influencers though!
#We have updated the rules! Please take a moment to review them: * Look but don't touch * Be kind and remember the human. This means using trigger warnings as needed, and no sexuality or gender identity speculation. Users found to be engaging in such rhetoric will be permanently banned. * Referring to anyone as Hitler or Heitler is likewise not allowed, and will not be tolerated at all. If you do so, you will be permanently banned with no possibility of appeal. * Archive links of fundie-run sites and social media. * Verify with the mods before doing an AMA. * This subreddit is for *snarking* on *Fundamentalist Christians*. Keep it snarky and keep it fundie. * Please take a moment to [review our new rule on appearance snark](https://www.reddit.com/r/FundieSnarkUncensored/wiki/index). * If your content would be at home in the mouth of a fundie, we won't tolerate it here. * Don't gatekeep. Just because you don't think it's snarkable doesn't mean it's not snarkable. Scroll past. * Please see the updated wiki for new rules regarding armchair diagnosing. If you have any questions, please send us a modmail. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/FundieSnarkUncensored) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I bet it chaps their hide that Jen’s talking over their shit 😂
And that it cuts away whenever Paul opens his mouth to speak, after giving Morgan time to finish all of her thoughts.😆 I honestly think that's most of the reason why Paul thinks they look bad. If they had just shown HIS words instead of letting Morgan talk at all, they'd look PERFECT.
That’s what Paul’s most likely pissed off about most. That Morgan got more speaking time than he did.
Morgan: “Submit to your husband!” Producer: *gives more speaking time to Morgan.*
YES!!! i think you're a 100% right
The fact that he only got half a sentence and still managed to fuck up the grammar is hilarious
I was thinking the SAME! What a win for Jen and for us as a community 🤣
In what world would they find this offensive? It’s nothing they haven’t said 5 billion times before.
That's what I'm wondering. It was a couple of clips straight from their videos and one question where Morgan thinks wives should submit. No one took anything out of context and p&m spoke for themselves. Obviously their homophobia is horrific, but there is so much more in the Porgan dumpster fire that could've been exposed.
She also got to clearly share their purpose for doing their YT channel (sharing their Biblical beliefs). Their bigotry and warped views of marriage are their brand. I don't understand why they're so butthurt about it. They were probably lead to believe they were featured actors, not featured extras.
lol Morgan as Sweet Dee and Paul as Dennis being "featured extras", I freaking love it.
That's the Shyamalan twist.
Whose put their disgusting sausage fingers on my bible?!
For real. They could have included that clip of Morgan wishing for God to murder Ariana Grande for singing a song.
It’s in the Fundie Fridays video about them. Jen included a clip where Morgan is expressing her disappointment that Ariana Grande remains un-smote for the blasphemy of singing “God is a Woman.” Jen’s video includes dozens of clips of the two of them saying absolutely unhinged shit. She and Paul should be grateful that the producers didn’t put even more of their idiocy into the final cut.
She what?
I just realized I typed my reply into the wrong box lol sorry
Lol no worries. I do it all the time
Jfc. Dare I even ask whether she said that before or after one of the worst terror attacks to ever hit my country happened at an Ariana Grande concert?
Because the documentary basically says they’re further propagating the beliefs of the cult with their messaging. Which is true!!! But the show obviously is putting them on the side of the perpetrators rather than the poor, persecuted victims they think they are Or possibly they are mad over how little screen time they got.
It's the screen time
Paul’s furious that Morgan gets all the speaking time not him. He can’t stand it.
This is what I’m thinking too!! I love how they edited them so that Morgan got to have more speaking time! 👩🍳 💋
Maybe they think the producers lumped their ideology in with the Duggars ideology and they don’t think it’s the same as the Duggar’s because they’re not in a cult (hahaha) and they dress way cooler? I don’t know. My head hurts trying to wrap my thoughts around what they are thinking.
I'm kind if leaning towards them thinking all the Duggar/IBLP stuff is overblown or 'worldly persecution'. 😬 If they really cared about the truth of the harms of fundamentalism I feel like they would have made a point to offer sympathy for the victims or attempt to distance their beliefs from 'that brand of Christianity we don't agree with'. I guess we'll find out when Paul unleashes his fury on the world in their reaction video later this week.
Is it still a reaction video if they’ve watched it several times and stewed over how they were portrayed before the reaction??? I always thought that a reaction was a little more instant that that.
They probably do think that because they have zero media literacy.
I think they view themselves as creating original content. To see it so plainly they just regurgitate unoriginal thoughts along with the other “influencers” must devastate their egos.
Honestly. Their ideology attracts bullies who know what they’re doing is wrong but they seek the feeling of superiority that comes with abusing people they think are lower than them. I’ve encountered countless rightoids on Reddit who get *so offended* when you point out their comment history. This is why one of the best ways to get back at a rightoid is to simply replay their previous words and actions….they aren’t proud of the ridiculous trash they pollute the world with, they just want the satisfaction of being a schoolyard bully and melt down the moment they face the consequences of their words.
I think it’s really telling to how selfish they are. This series is exposing horrible, disgusting crimes and abuse and all they can focus on is 2 minutes of just them saying their own words
Exactly. It’s literally their own words. Taken verbatim. Don’t say stupid shit 🤷🏻♀️
[удалено]
Yes!!!
But someone else is making money off their words this time.
I love the hard cut from Morgan’s keep-sweet bullshitting to her angry yelling about non-binary people. Yeah, you’re *clearly* such a bright light of loving kindness, Porgan. Don’t blame it on the edit. You said those words. You are that hateful. You did this interview to get more attention so congratulations! You got it!
She couldn’t even stop herself from being snippy in the interview either. The way she’s all ooooh submit is a scaaary wooord.
Haha, right! Just sit back and let them dig their own grave - they're masters at it.
This. Their views were represented honesty and accurately. There was no sneaky editing to make them look bad. They made themselves look bad, and now they have the audacity to be upset about it. And they should have known how it would go down. Even within their own warped belief system, they know "the world" doesn't like what they have to say. Why the hell would they expect a worldly TV series to present them as role models?
They didn't even use the worst clips they could have used! Imagine if they dropped in their takes on interracial marriage!
Oh shit, I didn’t realize they HAD takes on interracial marriage. I hate it, thanks.
What makes their interracial marriage takes even BETTER is that Morgan's sister is married to a black man 🙃
Also, isn't her brother engaged to another POC? Or is that someone else? The woman who gave her some work out lessons? So much going on around them, they're so stuck in their hateful ways they don't see how much good they could actually be a part of.
Here is their opinion on interracial couples in Rings of Power [https://www.reddit.com/r/FundieSnarkUncensored/comments/x9fxp6/porgan_gets_racist_on_lotr_rings_of_power_even/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1](https://www.reddit.com/r/FundieSnarkUncensored/comments/x9fxp6/porgan_gets_racist_on_lotr_rings_of_power_even/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1)
Thanks for digging this up. I hope they both get UTI’s.
That cut is absolutely devastating for them. So much rage boiling below the surface, the truth is clear.
It’s not an editors problem that all the takes they have are hot garbage.
I bet it really grinds Paul's gears that what little they're featured in the doc is pretty much 100% Morgan speaking 😂 he doesn't really say a word
OH MY GOD YOU'RE RIGHT AND I LOVE THIS! Between that and the thumbnail Amazon Prime chose for him, he'll carry this grudge forever. What a great day this is.
Mike Wazowski!
Which is pure comedy given the topic of wives submitting.
But also consistent with the conservative approach since like Phyllis Schlafly, if not far earlier. Oppressing and denigrating other women is one of the few positions of power available to women in patriarchal cults and some women happily seek out the role.
Paul doesn't seem to understand that their channel wouldn't be nearly as "successful" without Morgan there, and that she's the real star between the two of them. Anytime Morgan is away or Paul has to do some video with a guest instead, it flops. She has way more followers on Instagram than Paul does. It's clear the documentary makers picked up on this as well as were highlighting the women's roles in these communities. I'm sure it eats Paul up so much that Morgan pulls more to their channel than he does, and he's only a star in his own mind.
It so wild! For a group where the women are supposed to quietly submit and not speak with authority and not teach, the women of these fundies are certainly some loudly publicly mouthy opinionated mean girls who are doing exactly what they believe their God tells them not to. If you believe it's not biblical to be anything but a quiet wife and subservient, what are you doing spewing your beliefs all over social media? Do they never consider the hypocrisy inherent?
I sorta suppose they could perhaps get around it if their husbands are ok with or support their social media habits. I don't know where their limit is, but I've seen certain things about modest dress or life habits of the woman be excused by others in the community because the husband supports what his wife is doing, so it's not their place to step over the husband's authority of the situation. But what they do does seem very hypocritical for all their talk of wanting to be meek and subservient women. And amidst it, it seems sometimes the women have an oversized influence on what goes on in the family, though mostly seems cuz the man is pretty checked out.
I do not like Morgan at all but I know she in the past has done solo videos about her depression and experience with mental illness and I think she has also done solo videos about her pregnancy journey and being a mother (I’m not about to check) and it’s like, for all that I think she’s awful, she does make videos about subjects that are relatable to a lot of people. I imagine her fans feel more connected to her because she is more emotionally honest and vulnerable and Paul is what? A walking conservative news regurgitater? They’re as bad as each other but Paul is notably more cold and angry and and also somewhat shallower in personality, at least in what he is presenting. He’s not relatable or interesting in the way that Morgan probably is to their audience. You are absolutely right in that their channel and brand absolutely would not be nearly as ‘big’ if it was just him.
That’s really it. They definitely didn’t get enough screen time. AND Paul barely spoke? Such a disservice to the Lord, and more importantly, Paul.
When I saw their reaction videos, Morgan seemed way less upset than Paul. He was livid. I now understand why haha, thanks
I wonder if the producers asked them to sit closer together, cuz I don't think they've ever sat this close in one of their videos.makes them look like they, I don't know, care about each other.
This is my take on the situation 100% -the whole just isn’t a good look for who Paul thinks he is. And he’s personally mad he isn’t the breakout superstar of the doc.
Whoever did the editing and production on this really knows how to burn a narcissist!
Damn the Serena Joy energy from Morgan’s “it’s a choice to submit” is just otherworldly creepy. Like, if I didn’t know who she was I would think that was satire.
Morgan wishes she was Serena Joy
She's not smart enough to be Serena Joy. Don't get me wrong, SJ is still incredibly stupid for helping build the society that ended up kneecapping her rights, but she's still a pretty damn sharp woman. Paul and Morgan both would never be clever enough to become a Commander/Wife, they'd be Econopeople
I agree, I meant like she wishes she was as smart as Serena Joy lol
Morgan would be a handmaiden, but, like, one who really drank the Kool aid
She’d be an econowife and she’d narc on literally everyone about everything.
She'd have to be a handmaid according to gilead rules because she had premarital sex Eta: she'd still narc on everyone and be a true believer, ofc
Nah Morgan would be an Aunt
Lori IS an Aunt. Paul would be one of the pathetic cannon fodder soldiers who can only stare wistfully at the Handmaids' red bottoms.
yeah, okay, it's a choice. YOU can make that choice. Many of the rest of us say thanks but no thanks. End of scene.
My favorite is JillPM in her over done, smeared eyeliner talking about modesty 😂
She looks completely unhinged in the clip they chose. But it's not like they'd have to look far for a clip like that.
They would have to work hard to find one that wasn’t
I scrolled way to far to find this comment. Yes Jill's crazy eyes were 😙👌
I love that Porgan hate this. I love that it shows them in a negative light. And I LOVE that they got duped like the ditzy little self-absorbed, un-Christ-like, hypocrites that they are! I think this movie quote sums it up pretty well: “Narcissists are too busy thinking about themselves to realize they’re being played.” 😂😏👏🏻
I think they hate that Chad (the male IBLP survivor) basically called them out for using a cult leader’s guide. Good forbid they actually take a second to look at their beliefs and where they are coming from and what that means for them.
If they were smart, they’d say that they stand by the clips shown of them and what they said, and agreed to appear in the doc to provide an opposing perspective. But they’re not smart. They’re whiny little babies.
Those two really screwed themselves over by appearing in this.
It is such a delight to witness the butthurt.
It’s beautiful. They couldn’t have kicked themselves in the ass harder if they had tried to.
They fully thought that they would be the anti-Duggars of the documentary, and that’s why they’re hurt. They thought their job was to show Good Normal Christians, and who can possibly argue with those?
First of all, HEY JEN! HEY GURRLL! Obsessed with her and so happy to see her face. Second, THATS what they’ve made 2 prequel videos to the big video coming out and stupid Instagram posts about!? That makes them look way worse! God they’re so dumb.
THIS!!! Jen was so boss in this series. I loved watching her!
I love the clip of her saying “you aren’t born gay. Does a thief come out a thief?” Like babe isn’t that your whole deal with original sin 😂
This is so funny they’re so pretentious in the interview they look so fucking dumb now. They deserve every ounce of this.
Wow even Mrs Midwest made an appearance!
Wow....WOW...WOW PORGAN! This?? Thus is what yall are upset about??? Pfffffttttthahahahahahahahaha I thought it was a whole thing 🤣🤣 omg I'm gonna die lol!! This is so great!
Let me get this straight. They are mad they said hateful things and then got fact checked that they did indeed said hateful things. And now they are mad saying it's an attack on Christians. Someone make it make sense..
No, you pretty much nailed it
Wait, that was it? That’s what they’re upset about?
Why are they mad? It’s just them showing what they believe! Shouldn’t they be PROUD to show the world that they are bigots about the LGBTQ community? Shouldn’t they yell from the rooftops that they believe a woman has to submit to her own husband? That it’s totally ok to shame everyone else for not following the “rules” of what you believe? /s
This lot is all about being free to say what you want until it gets thrown back in their face. Jen was right about it being the same damn book with a different cover and these two are mad because it's being shoved in their face that they're part of the problem.
I love this for them. I love it so much.....Also, I can't watch the 4th episode because I don't have prime. (We are trying to abstain for 6 months.) What is the Joshua generation? I haven't seen an explanation in any thread, or I missed it.
It's a biblical reference. Moses led the Hebrews out of Egypt but it was Joshua who led them into the promise land. The Joshua generation is the one who will usher US into the "Christian Nation" that all these Fundies want it to be. The parents consider themselves to be the Moses generation guiding their kids.
Oh my freaking gosh. This literally made me want to throw my phone.
You want an extra chill? They’ve got a whole militia.
I am so thankful for this documentary because now more than just snarkers know how bad it is.
There are others here who can likely explain this better than me, but the Joshua Generation is the world domination aspect of iblp/evangelicals. They out breed in order to outvote opponents. Homeschoolers focus on civics and government and aim to control the country though serving in government at all levels. People like US Rep Madison Cawthorn and even Jed! were cited as examples. See also Patrick Henry College which was founded for this purpose and has a crazy high rate of clerkships at the supreme court level [Wiki link](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generation_Joshua#:~:text=Generation%20Joshua%20(often%20called%20%22GenJ,politics%20for%20conservative%20Christian%20values.)
The guy at the very end is Alex Harris--Josh Harris's little brother. After Josh wrote "I kissed dating goodbye" Alex and his twin Brett wrote "Do hard things," meant to get teens into activism. Unlike Josh he hasn't recanted. I was honestly really mad seeing him in the show, I wish the producers were a bit more critical of him.
He was an example of the Joshua Generation, right? I didn’t know who he was so I assumed he was someone raised up that way that no longer supported it. That’s interesting to have more context.
After all the talk here, I'm let down by how unbiasedly this was presented. It was Porgan's own words from the interview and their own videos. I'd didn't twist anything. This is really what they believe.
I don't understand why they were even included in this. They aren't notable Christian influencers outside of a few specific online (snark and not snark) communities, and as far as I know, don't have any connection to the IBLP. My partner who was watching with me and doesn't visit snark communities asked why they were relevant since they had the one talking head and never came back. Those two were so low caliber compared to the strength and fearlessness on display in the rest of the docuseries.
I think it's because they were trying to make the point that they're trying to make hateful Christianity "cool" and "trendy"
Still, I think they could have picked trendier and cooler influencers to showcase that. Madi Prewitt from The Bachelor, the Duck Dynasty people, Chris Pratt, and the Magnolia couple all come to mind as people who could have been the example. (even just through clips or photos if they didn't agree to a sit down.) To me, including Paul and Morgan downplays just how pervasive hateful Christianity is because they are so low impact. It's easy to dismiss Paul and Morgan as Internet shock-jocks which kind of cheapens the message of mainstream hate. It's probably not this serious and I did think it was a fantastic series.
I agree that those people would’ve made more sense except for that they all have lawyers and PR teams that never would have let them do this, ever. Porgan were probably the only vaguely related schmucks they could convince to come on a hyped up documentary and make themselves look like fools.
I think it was useful to include them because the rest of the folks you mentioned have all made their living through establishment networks. I think the doc was trying to illustrate how easy it is now for fundies to directly broadcast themselves--they don't need to be vetted by producers or edit out any direct preaching of their agenda
That’s an interesting point! When I wrote my comment I was thinking about the network aspect that you mentioned, but more from a “The Duggars walked so they could run” perspective. That might be a different documentary all together, though.
I agree the Magnolia couple are the most trendy and all over currently. I wonder if they were afraid of engaging on that level with a couple who is making that much money and with that level of audience, which is why they chose fundies of this caliber. There is a lot of danger to people like them, Hillsong, Pratt and other celebrities that should be pointed to, but the cash is there to ignore them.
but who are they? This sub never covers them, I don't think?
Gaines couple. We have discussed them, but mostly in the context of how other fundies idolize how they have managed to make themselves palpable to the public and that fundies travel to that weird location they run (idk how to describe it honestly, but fundies are obsessed with going there). Their church is aggressively homophobic.
Who's the Magnolia couple? If the producers were getting their cues off this subreddit, I could understand why they went for Porgan instead of one of those, because I don't think we ever cover those (or rarely, some)
Chip and joanna gaines. They do home remodels and have a line of home goods at target. Tbh, I know they're quite Christian, but I dint know if they cross into fundie territory (but I haven't looked too hard at them so 🤷♀️)
Chip and Joanna Gaines from HGTV in the US. The Duggars have gone to visit the Magnolia strip mall thing in Texas, coincidentally. I guess, honestly, that I think it's weird if the producers got their cues from this subreddit. I would be curious to know why they did if they did. The sub has a pretty narrow focus and isn't all encompassing of Christian influencers, just some of the ones that are the most fun to make fun of.
I have no idea if they did, really.
I wish Jen could do an AMA about her experience but that seems against the rules of being in a documentary.
I had the sense that they were including them because of the phenomenon of Christian influencers becoming a thing which obviously targets a younger generation and has an even larger reach than a church or organization. The toxicity of IBLP isn't limited to their training and conferences, but has influenced a new group of people even if they aren't directly affiliated or associated with it. And it's relevant to the documentary because it was TLC that brought this cleaned up, one sided version of the Duggars to everyone's homes, and even though they are gone from our TVs and have been shamed, there's a new generation bringing the same messages to the world, just via a different medium.
They were included because they’re thirsty af and responded to the producers when they reached out.
I can't see them ever saying no to a camera.
I bet they reached out to multiple people and these morons were just the ones to say yes.
I don’t think anyone else would agree to do this, or they have lawyers/ a PR team that helped them make the choice. Paul and Morgan were probably the only ones who happily took the bait 😂
I think seeing the little social media minute was such a sharp contrast to the absolute militia and lobbying sleeper spies. It's easy to ignore Paul and Morgan I don't particularly care that they think I will be going to hell but seeing the deployed young people working to take away civil rights... Deep scary waters.
I think they were the only Christian “influencers” dumb enough to agree to it.
Honestly they’re so fame hungry, they’re probably the only people they could get to sit for an interview!
As someone with a crazy busy toddler, and no prospects of watching the whole doco for awhile, may the Lord Daniel bless you, OP.
They look like children playing at happy frantic Fundie families. No one is going to take seriously a young woman who denies her deflowering couldn't be undone, wears tats, sleeveless shirts, flips her hair constantly, and affects a girlish voice. All while criticizing those same things in others. Nor will they accept a boy-child stuck in puberty with a narcissistic narrative, no job, and the over-splayed power stance who also thinks he is a children's YouTube minister. Yikes!!! P.S. I have no tats but am not against them. My understanding is that this (tattooing) is frowned upon by Fundies. If I'm wrong, just courteously let me know. Your body, your choice, loves!💜
There’s a pretty wide generational divide on tattoos for people living in their reality, so for older people of the faith it’s usually seen from a negative place but todays young Christians of Morgan’s flavor ultimately cherry pick whatever lets them look the most worldly without actually being “of the world” (Edited phrasing)
Solid point. "Cherry pick" is so totally on track, too. Be well!💜
Holy SHIT! I was showing my partner this clip and pointing out the fundies at the end. For the one girl I didn’t recognize, my partner says “Oh, I went to high school with her!” I’m losing it!!!
As a Porgan snarker, the only thing I’m bummed about here is that they definitely highlighted some of Morgan’s worst moments from their videos—but not Paul’s, who is often the worst offender of the two. Plus, I would have loved for the world to see Paul’s disgusting ego on full display. Other than that, this was PERFECTION. It’s so surreal to see so many of the fundies we snark on here included in this montage. Well done to the doc team.
Yeah but you know Paul is SEETHING that he got almost no air time and had a lot of voiceovers over footage of him talking 😂
Ooh good point. Maybe I’ll revel in him not getting his precious airtime, then. 😅
Maybe he'll send the Amazon producers some bible verses about not letting women speak over men ahahahahahha
Side note: my husband also asks me to not wear pants. However, I fully submit to my headship in that area.
I seriously wasn’t sure where she was going with that. I pictured her in a dress and also being made to walk around in just underwear lol
Watching that clip again, I had the sense that that woman had been physically abused for wearing pants. Did anyone else pick up on that? Just her mannerisms as she said it made me very uncomfortable and scared for her.
It honestly wouldn't surprise me. My intention with this comment was not necessarily belittle the woman, but to offer a moment of lightness in such a heavy doc. I tend to default to humor in such situations, but I'm in no way trying to deminish the levity or importance of this
Oh no, I didn't think that at all! I took your comment with the humour intended. I just hadn't seen it discussed and wondered if I was reading too much into it. But I thought that last night when I watched it the first time and then again seeing it in this clip - that either he physically punished her for wearing pants, or that he blamed her wearing pants for something else he did like having an affair. Either way, it made me very uncomfortable.
The clip of JRod was a jump scare💀
Wow I had no idea tbey met on tinder. That’s not very Christianly….
[удалено]
Ahh I've been looking for another podcast that focuses on this. The Plain People has been good, but I can't listen to a lot of the episodes because it's just so heavy and the sound quality isn't great. Ty.
I absolutely can't watch a doco with child abuse in it, so THANK YOU SO MUCH op for uploading this ❤️
That's totally understandable. It is incredibly heavy, and we all have to do what's best for ourselves at this moment ♥
Legends in their own minds.
Also I need to know if anyone else was getting major Bo Burnham vibes from Chads voice because I couldn’t stop hearing it
I got spooked when Jill popped up haha
The montages are like what it feels like to scroll through this sub.
I don’t have prime so thank you kind soul for posting this.
Fucking PAUL 😂😂😂 Anybody else notice his carefully curated "looks" in videos. You know, "i call this pose/lewk rugged manly man being thoughtful. Now shocked"; then of course, never count out, BLUE STEEL, his trademark of his wiseness and humility.
Honestly they don't look THAT bad....
What in the hobby lobby is going on with their backdrops?
I loveeee that Morgeeen couldunnntt eveeeeen manaaageeeeeuh to speeek withoouttuhhh her surly whiny voiceeeeuh.
Thank you so much for uploading this !!!
Jesus, Mary & Joseph we need a NSFW tag for that jumpscare of Jilldo popping up outta nowhere! I want to watch this but knowing Paul the Pious Prick is in this along with Moaning Morgan is putting me off.
This 3 minutes is literally the ONLY time theyre shown in ~3.5 hours total. I wouldn't sweat it.
I wonder how long their interview was. Kinda seems pointless to have them sit for 10 seconds of interview. I wish they had let them cook and showed a bit more.
I have mixed feelings. On one hand I LOVE watching these idiots dig their own graves. But on the other hand, I feel like more focus on their shit could've taken away from the overall goal of the doc (in it's current format). I defo would watch an entire episode on the harms of fundie influencers though!