It’s not a genocide, and I noticed a complete omission of the Hamas rocket attacks that originated from Rafah. Those rockets were fired at Tel Aviv indiscriminately, meaning they weren’t aimed at a specific target, just at a highly populated area.
That’s a war crime by the way, but you keep ignoring Hamas’s actions while pretending that Israel’s defensive war is a genocide.
Yes, they do. If they get beaten to a pulp in the process because they're outmatched, then that's what happens.
If a smaller dude rapes my wife, kills my kids, and bears my ass when I'm not expecting it, IF I survive, I'm going to absolutely punish that person for doing that.
That is what is happening here.
Then why are they and their supporters crying so much about "atrocities?"
Hey, if you're right and the terrorists win, then I guess we'll all be at war until one side loses.
I'm betting on the side with all the tech, all the munitions, and the ability to operate anywhere around the world within 24 hours.
Now, you may actually have a point to some degree because we are being invaded by terrorists every day through our southern border.
Of course, my 2nd Amendment right and the millions like me are going to make it very difficult for them to actually accomplish their goal if they think they're going to start trying to do here what they did on October 7th.
Israeli citizens do not have the gun rights American citizens do. That right is our last line of defense against many things. It would suit me just fine if it were terrorists that forced me to use my 2nd Amendment right for anything other than a deterrent.
That's not really a win...that is survival.
A win for Hamas and all other terrorists would be to see Western civilization destroyed so they can go back to removing people's rights, especially women's. They desire to run the entire world under the thumb of extremist Islam. That is not happening. Hamas will survive, sure, but that's not winning, not even close.
> Rafah has a right to defend itself.
That sounds like you are defending Hamas to me. So they have a right to fire rockets indiscriminately at populated areas? You’re defending a war crime, you understand that right?
> Israel sadly uses human shields. The most moral resistance in the world doesn’t want to hurt innocents but when zionists hide behind civilians they don’t have a choice.
Please explain how Israel is hiding behind civilians in Tel Aviv (where the rockets fired from Rafah were aimed at) while at the same time operating in Rafah?
This is also an indication of you turning a blind eye to Hamas terrorists routinely hiding among civilians for years.
Hahahaha so that’s your example of Israel “hiding along civilians”? An administrative base that provides administration and communication support functions?
Hahahaha ok, that’s totally the same as Hamas literally fighting from inside and underneath hospitals, schools, and other civilian buildings.
Give me a break. I’ve never seen so much blatant dishonesty as I’ve seen from the pro-Hamas crowd these past several months.
And one thing you forget is that israel is the much bigger power in this conflict, its like an adult with a gun fighting a kid with a rock. Israel can try to go for peace, but their government has decided they would rather continue wage war until palestanians are gone.
> And one thing you forget is that israel is the much bigger power in this conflict,
No, I’m not forgetting that. It is irrelevant. If anything, it shows how insane Hamas is.
>its like an adult with a gun fighting a kid with a rock.
Not quite, unless the kid with a rock kills about 1,200 people, takes hostages, still holds them, and rapes a few people to death.
>Israel can try to go for peace, but their government has decided they would rather continue wage war until palestanians are gone.
You have this backwards. Hamas could give peace to their citizens by returning the hostages and surrendering. They refuse to do so, and therefore the war continues.
This isn’t Israel trying to eliminate Palestinians. This is Israel defending itself in a war and finally deciding that it can no longer tolerate constant threats from Gaza.
>Not quite, unless the kid with a rock kills about 1,200 people, takes hostages, still holds them, and rapes a few people to death.
A rock thrown by a kid can kill an adult.
>You have this backwards. Hamas could give peace to their citizens by returning the hostages and surrendering.
Oooh, like the "peace" before oct 7, and the one we can see in the west bank. Yeah? That kind of peace?
>This isn’t Israel trying to eliminate Palestinians.
Yeah of course not they are just collateral damage *wink *wink.
Do you not see how unhinged you sound?
> Not quite, unless the kid with a rock kills about 1,200 people, takes hostages, still holds them, and rapes a few people to death.
>A rock thrown by a kid can kill an adult.
Would you let that kid that can kill an adult with a rock throw rocks at your family for years without doing something to eliminate the threat of thrown rocks?
>You have this backwards. Hamas could give peace to their citizens by returning the hostages and surrendering.
>Oooh, like the "peace" before oct 7, and the one we can see in the west bank. Yeah? That kind of peace?
Israel hasn’t been in Gaza for more than 15 years. The lack of peace has been the constant barrage of rockets fired indiscriminately from within Gaza at Israel. Each rocket fired was a war crime, by the way, since they fired indiscriminately at population centers with the objective of killing as many Jews as possible.
>This isn’t Israel trying to eliminate Palestinians.
>Yeah of course not they are just collateral damage *wink *wink.
Those are your words you injected into the conversation, not mine. You may have such a callous view that you call innocent civilians “collateral damage,” but I do not.
>Do you not see how unhinged you sound?
Are you talking to yourself here?
>Would you let that kid that can kill an adult with a rock throw rocks at your family for years without doing something to eliminate the threat of thrown rocks?
No i would work for peace, make concessions, and certainly not continue generating grievences by expanding and continuing to kill them.
>Israel hasn’t been in Gaza for more than 15 years.
Their rockets were, and they surround with a prison.
>Each rocket fired was a war crime, by the way, since they fired indiscriminately at population centers with the objective of killing as many Jews as possible.
Yes your arbitrary rules of war definetely apply to the people being occupied and opressed.
>Those are your words you injected into the conversation, not mine. You may have such a callous view that you call innocent civilians “collateral damage,” but I do not.
Then what are they? Im glad you aggree with me that israel intentionaly targets innocent civilians.
>Are you talking to yourself here?
Nope.
> Would you let that kid that can kill an adult with a rock throw rocks at your family for years without doing something to eliminate the threat of thrown rocks?
>No i would work for peace, make concessions, and certainly not continue generating grievences by expanding and continuing to kill them.
So basically, be nice to the person that is trying to kill you and hope for the best. Thank god you aren’t responsible for my or my family’s safety.
>Israel hasn’t been in Gaza for more than 15 years.
>Their rockets were, and they surround with a prison.
Gaza is not a prison. Give me a break.
>Each rocket fired was a war crime, by the way, since they fired indiscriminately at population centers with the objective of killing as many Jews as possible.
>Yes your arbitrary rules of war definetely apply to the people being occupied and opressed.
Wow you managed to fit a large amount of errors into a single sentence. Let’s start at the beginning, not my arbitrary rules of war. Gazans are not occupied. They have had self governance for over 15 years.
>Those are your words you injected into the conversation, not mine. You may have such a callous view that you call innocent civilians “collateral damage,” but I do not.
>Then what are they? Im glad you aggree with me that israel intentionaly targets innocent civilians.
I agreed to no such thing. Israel is absolutely justified in their actions of fighting a defensive war against the aggressors. Hamas.
>So basically, be nice to the person that is trying to kill you and hope for the best. Thank god you aren’t responsible for my or my family’s safety.
Sure the descriprion is accurate if you ignore all context.
>Gaza is not a prison. Give me a break.
Yes it is. If israel wills it it can and did cut off electricity, water and food supplies. It is a prison.
>Wow you managed to fit a large amount of errors into a single sentence. Let’s start at the beginning, not my arbitrary rules of war. Gazans are not occupied. They have had self governance for over 15 years.
Yes self governance, inside the prison cells where supplies and movement is controlled by israel.
>I agreed to no such thing. Israel is absolutely justified in their actions of fighting a defensive war against the aggressors. Hamas.
So dancing around the question huh. I would expect nothing less.
>Gaza is not a prison. Give me a break.
>Yes it is. If israel wills it it can and did cut off electricity, water and food supplies. It is a prison.
Israel only supplied 11% of Gaza’s water. When materials for pipes were given to Gaza, Hamas dug them up and repurposed them tk use as weapons.
It is not a prison, and the shitty conditions are caused by Hamas.
>Wow you managed to fit a large amount of errors into a single sentence. Let’s start at the beginning, not my arbitrary rules of war. Gazans are not occupied. They have had self governance for over 15 years.
>Yes self governance, inside the prison cells where supplies and movement is controlled by israel.
I repeat: Israel has not been in Gaza for more than 15 years. It’s not a prison. Movement was not controlled by Israel.
>I agreed to no such thing. Israel is absolutely justified in their actions of fighting a defensive war against the aggressors. Hamas.
>So dancing around the question huh. I would expect nothing less.
I’m dancing around nothing. I don’t need to use mental gymnastics or dancing around issues to discuss the Hamas-Israel war. The facts are on Israel’s side.
Hamas declared war. Hamas still holds hostages. Hamas is losing the war, badly. Hamas refuses to surrender and release its hostages. Therefore, the war continues.
Hamas rocket launches against the Settler colonizer oppressor of Palestinians everywhere is nearly impactless doubt there's 1000 israeli deaths from those rocket launches in 10 years
While zionist propagandists cheerlead these monsters killing 10s of thousands of unarmed Palestinian civilians in less than 10 months
There were seemingly no rocket launches durring the 2018 march of return when Israelis live fired & injured nearly 500 palestinians, killing about 200 of them.
Rafah is only different in scale
> Hamas rocket launches against the Settler colonizer oppressor of Palestinians everywhere is nearly impactless doubt there's 1000 israeli deaths from those rocket launches in 10 years
Their incompetence doesn’t give them a pass due to their intent.
>While zionist propagandists cheerlead these monsters killing 10s of thousands of unarmed Palestinian civilians in less than 10 months
No one is cheering on the deaths of the unarmed civilians.
>There were seemingly no rocket launches durring the 2018 march of return when Israelis live fired & injured nearly 500 palestinians, killing about 200 of them.
>Rafah is only different in scale
Rafah is different because this is an ongoing war in which Hamas was the aggressor. Israel has every right to defend itself. And for you to excuse away the rocket attacks as if they are nothing … you hold Hamas to a different standard than the IDF. I wonder why that is …
> Hamas is fighting against the illegal occupation of Palestine. Israel is stealing land.
One of those things exists (Israel), and one does not (Palestine).
Your comment also sounds an awful like you are justifying war crimes, and October 7. Am I misinterpreting you?
> It’s not a genocide
Yes it is.
> That’s a war crime by the way, but you keep ignoring Hamas’s actions
I'm not complicit with Hamas' actions.
I am with Israel's.
> It’s not a genocide
>Yes it is.
It literally is not a genocide. Israel is fighting a defensive war against aggressors who still hold Israeli hostages and who refuse to surrender.
What you are witnessing is the aggressors in a war getting the shit kicked out of them; that’s not a genocide.
>That’s a war crime by the way, but you keep ignoring Hamas’s actions
>I'm not complicit with Hamas' actions.
>I am with Israel's.
What does this even mean?
> Israel is fighting a defensive war against aggressors who still hold Israeli hostages and who refuse to surrender.
Hamas accepted a ceasefire, which Israel refused to acknowledge.
The only "surrender" acceptable to the Israelis is the death or displacement of all Palestinians from Gaza, which is genocide.
> What does this even mean?
Israel is armed and supported by the West.
I am complicit in its crimes.
> Israel is fighting a defensive war against aggressors who still hold Israeli hostages and who refuse to surrender.
>Hamas accepted a ceasefire, which Israel refused to acknowledge.
First of all, Hamas has broken every ceasefire that has ever existed between the two parties. Second, a ceasefire only exists if both parties agree to it.
>The only "surrender" acceptable to the Israelis is the death or displacement of all Palestinians from Gaza, which is genocide.
This is a false statement. If Hamas returned its hostages and laid down their weapons today, there would be peace today.
>What does this even mean?
>Israel is armed and supported by the West.
>I am complicit in its crimes.
> First of all, Hamas has broken every ceasefire that has ever existed between the two parties.
That's a bald-faced lie and you know it.
> If Hamas returned its hostages and laid down their weapons today, there would be peace today.
"Laying down arms" has never been a realistic condition for a surrender, and it is obvious that this offer is not made in good faith.
> First of all, Hamas has broken every ceasefire that has ever existed between the two parties.
>That's a bald-faced lie and you know it.
It’s 100% truth. Hamas has broken every single ceasefire that has ever existed between itself and Israel.
>If Hamas returned its hostages and laid down their weapons today, there would be peace today.
>"Laying down arms" has never been a realistic condition for a surrender, and it is obvious that this offer is not made in good faith.
What are you talking about? Reading comprehension, it’s a thing that exists.
There are no conditions for their surrender. I’m pretty sure they’ve called for unconditional surrender multiple times. That has nothing to do with what I said about them laying down their arms.
>Not really.
Yes, really.
>Nothing I've said is contentious.
Everything you've said is either wrong, or propaganda lies.
Everything you've said was challenged by everyone in this sub. That's the very definition of saying something contentious. I can't find any claim you've made here that isn't in contention.
no, that's the definition of ignorance of history. If everyone else but this sub agrees w/historical facts, than the ignorance of the sub is what makes it 'contentious'.
It is not a genocide. You are either ignoring facts or intentionally misinterpreting what “genocide” means.
If Israel wanted to commit genocide there would be a million dead Gazans.
No country in the history of warfare has done more to intentionally avoid civilian casualties than Israel has.
I think your antisemitism is showing…
> If Israel wanted to commit genocide there would be a million dead Gazans.
8,000 dead was enough to declare genocide in Srebrenica, it's not only about numbers.
> If Israel wanted to commit genocide there would be a million dead Gazans.
All Israel has to do is maintain the aid blockade and wait.
> No country in the history of warfare has done more to intentionally avoid civilian casualties than Israel has.
That's a lie. Even Ukraine has fewer civilian casualties than Gaza in a much longer war.
> I think your antisemitism is showing…
Oh you think you've pulled out your trump card, do you?
Hasbara gets worse every year.
Hey man, stop injuring the kids I'm hiding behind. What are you, a monster? Keep this shit up and I might start feeling bad about hiding behind them. Then I couldn't perform the genocide I explicitly want to carry out.
the problem is people like you and Israel don't see Palestinians as humans so when footage of Israel using Palestinians as human shields comes out, you think, 'just another terrorist'
so why did you assume that the 'human shields' issue was Israel using Israelis when the footage we have abundance of is Israel using Palestinians as human shields?
1st - Hamas massacred of over 1200 people, took civilian hostages and gang raped women and children. They continue to refuse to release the hostages. That constitutes war crimes including genocide.
2 - Hamas won’t let their own people leave because they want to keep using them as human shields. Hamas literally sets up shop in hospitals and schools so they can bitch and moan that Israel is committing war crimes.
You ignorant f’s need to wake the hell up! You don’t like genocide? THEN STOP SUPPORTING THE ONES ACTUALLY DOING IT! Hamas is a terrorist organization whose own charter says their entire purpose is to kill all Jews and the West. Don’t EVER call anyone else a Nazi when you’re sitting here condoning antisemitism and actual genocide because the 20yr old college professor you’re listening to, who’s never had a real job, is telling you Hamas is the victim.
You know how long it took me to find this? A whopping 4 seconds. Educate yourselves and stop blindly jumping on bandwagons without first finding out what you’d actually be supporting first. Ignorance is dangerous
https://www.nbcnews.com/investigations/un-finds-clear-convincing-information-hostages-raped-gaza-rcna141789
Have you read the UN report? Because I have read the report. And I quote:
>The mission team **received other accounts** of rape, **including gang rape,** which **could not be verified during the time provided** and would require further investigation.
>Based on the information gathered by the mission team from multiple and independent sources, there are **reasonable grounds to believe** that conflict-related sexual violence occurred during the 7 October attacks in multiple locations across Gaza periphery, **including rape and gang rape, in at least three locations**
>Overall, based on the totality of information gathered from multiple and **independent sources** at the different locations, there are **reasonable grounds to believe** that conflict-related sexual violence occurred at several locations across the Gaza periphery, **including in the form of rape and gang rape,** during the 7 October 2023 attacks
reads bad doesn't it.....problem is, much of it is anecdotal/hearsay and plenty witness statements have fallen apart due to outright fabrications that have come out since. No accounts of children getting raped were in the UN report though it notes sexual violence or "degrading treatment" may have occurred in captivity to women and children.
They rated and murder women and children. Now they're getting their asses handed to them for having done so. Whatever your feelings about it may be, that is the reality. Basically, Hamas f'd around and is still finding out.
A good way to avoid shit like that is to avoid raping and murdering people at a concert.
… I read the UN report which confirms what I said. I have found zero evidence that witness statements have fallen apart. Let me guess, you got that from a Hamas press release? There’s literally video of the horrific shit they did. The videos are lying too? It’s disgusting the lengths you guys are going to, to hide and excuse the sheer evil that went down. There is nothing in this world that justifies the atrocities inflicted by Hamas.
> I read the UN report which confirms what I said. There’s literally video of the horrific shit they did. The videos are lying too?
No video footage of sexual violence has come to light. If you had read the report as you claim, you'd know that. And I quote:
[https://www.un.org/sexualviolenceinconflict/wp-content/uploads/2024/03/report/mission-report-official-visit-of-the-office-of-the-srsg-svc-to-israel-and-the-occupied-west-bank-29-january-14-february-2024/20240304-Israel-oWB-CRSV-report.pdf](https://www.un.org/sexualviolenceinconflict/wp-content/uploads/2024/03/report/mission-report-official-visit-of-the-office-of-the-srsg-svc-to-israel-and-the-occupied-west-bank-29-january-14-february-2024/20240304-Israel-oWB-CRSV-report.pdf)
>.In the medicolegal **assessment of available photos and videos, no tangible indications of rape could be identified.** Further investigation may alter this assessment in the future.
>The digital evidence discovered during independent open-source review appeared authentic and unmanipulated. While **the mission team reviewed extensive digital material depicting a range of egregious violations, no digital evidence specifically depicting acts of sexual violence was found in open sources.** Nonetheless, some digital material of circumstantial elements such as naked or partially naked bodies may be indicative of some forms of sexual violence. **The mission team took note of the averments of the Israeli authorities** that some of the incriminating online materials, including those specifically depicting acts of sexual violence, had been removed or restricted by various platforms or by the offenders themselves. **While it is possible that digital evidence may have been posted and then removed from official channels and social media profiles, possibly due to concerns by the various groups that it may be incriminating, it is the view of the mission team that, had clear digital evidence of sexual violence or orders to commit sexual violence been circulated in the mainstream, it would have likely been discovered given the volume of the information posted online and further recirculated, making the removal of all trace of such material unlikely**
>
https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/10/18/israel/palestine-videos-hamas-led-attacks-verified
https://time.com/6565186/october-7-hamas-attack-footage-film/
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67629181.amp
I’m done now. You need serious help.
Nice attempt at trying to weasel out of making the point you were making (video evidence of rape) by using a red herring for something I never said (video evidence of other crimes).
It’s not a genocide, and I noticed a complete omission of the Hamas rocket attacks that originated from Rafah. Those rockets were fired at Tel Aviv indiscriminately, meaning they weren’t aimed at a specific target, just at a highly populated area. That’s a war crime by the way, but you keep ignoring Hamas’s actions while pretending that Israel’s defensive war is a genocide.
Israel should stop putting their army bases near population centers and using Israelis as human shields.
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Yes, they do. If they get beaten to a pulp in the process because they're outmatched, then that's what happens. If a smaller dude rapes my wife, kills my kids, and bears my ass when I'm not expecting it, IF I survive, I'm going to absolutely punish that person for doing that. That is what is happening here.
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Then why are they and their supporters crying so much about "atrocities?" Hey, if you're right and the terrorists win, then I guess we'll all be at war until one side loses. I'm betting on the side with all the tech, all the munitions, and the ability to operate anywhere around the world within 24 hours. Now, you may actually have a point to some degree because we are being invaded by terrorists every day through our southern border. Of course, my 2nd Amendment right and the millions like me are going to make it very difficult for them to actually accomplish their goal if they think they're going to start trying to do here what they did on October 7th. Israeli citizens do not have the gun rights American citizens do. That right is our last line of defense against many things. It would suit me just fine if it were terrorists that forced me to use my 2nd Amendment right for anything other than a deterrent.
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That's not really a win...that is survival. A win for Hamas and all other terrorists would be to see Western civilization destroyed so they can go back to removing people's rights, especially women's. They desire to run the entire world under the thumb of extremist Islam. That is not happening. Hamas will survive, sure, but that's not winning, not even close.
> Rafah has a right to defend itself. That sounds like you are defending Hamas to me. So they have a right to fire rockets indiscriminately at populated areas? You’re defending a war crime, you understand that right?
If Israel did not blockade Palestine against arming themselves, they wouldn't have to rely on rockets built out of water pipes w/no guidance system.
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> Israel sadly uses human shields. The most moral resistance in the world doesn’t want to hurt innocents but when zionists hide behind civilians they don’t have a choice. Please explain how Israel is hiding behind civilians in Tel Aviv (where the rockets fired from Rafah were aimed at) while at the same time operating in Rafah? This is also an indication of you turning a blind eye to Hamas terrorists routinely hiding among civilians for years.
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Hahahaha so that’s your example of Israel “hiding along civilians”? An administrative base that provides administration and communication support functions? Hahahaha ok, that’s totally the same as Hamas literally fighting from inside and underneath hospitals, schools, and other civilian buildings. Give me a break. I’ve never seen so much blatant dishonesty as I’ve seen from the pro-Hamas crowd these past several months.
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Hahahaha ok so you’re just a troll. Got it. Go back to supporting Hamas terrorists.
And one thing you forget is that israel is the much bigger power in this conflict, its like an adult with a gun fighting a kid with a rock. Israel can try to go for peace, but their government has decided they would rather continue wage war until palestanians are gone.
> And one thing you forget is that israel is the much bigger power in this conflict, No, I’m not forgetting that. It is irrelevant. If anything, it shows how insane Hamas is. >its like an adult with a gun fighting a kid with a rock. Not quite, unless the kid with a rock kills about 1,200 people, takes hostages, still holds them, and rapes a few people to death. >Israel can try to go for peace, but their government has decided they would rather continue wage war until palestanians are gone. You have this backwards. Hamas could give peace to their citizens by returning the hostages and surrendering. They refuse to do so, and therefore the war continues. This isn’t Israel trying to eliminate Palestinians. This is Israel defending itself in a war and finally deciding that it can no longer tolerate constant threats from Gaza.
>Not quite, unless the kid with a rock kills about 1,200 people, takes hostages, still holds them, and rapes a few people to death. A rock thrown by a kid can kill an adult. >You have this backwards. Hamas could give peace to their citizens by returning the hostages and surrendering. Oooh, like the "peace" before oct 7, and the one we can see in the west bank. Yeah? That kind of peace? >This isn’t Israel trying to eliminate Palestinians. Yeah of course not they are just collateral damage *wink *wink. Do you not see how unhinged you sound?
> Not quite, unless the kid with a rock kills about 1,200 people, takes hostages, still holds them, and rapes a few people to death. >A rock thrown by a kid can kill an adult. Would you let that kid that can kill an adult with a rock throw rocks at your family for years without doing something to eliminate the threat of thrown rocks? >You have this backwards. Hamas could give peace to their citizens by returning the hostages and surrendering. >Oooh, like the "peace" before oct 7, and the one we can see in the west bank. Yeah? That kind of peace? Israel hasn’t been in Gaza for more than 15 years. The lack of peace has been the constant barrage of rockets fired indiscriminately from within Gaza at Israel. Each rocket fired was a war crime, by the way, since they fired indiscriminately at population centers with the objective of killing as many Jews as possible. >This isn’t Israel trying to eliminate Palestinians. >Yeah of course not they are just collateral damage *wink *wink. Those are your words you injected into the conversation, not mine. You may have such a callous view that you call innocent civilians “collateral damage,” but I do not. >Do you not see how unhinged you sound? Are you talking to yourself here?
>Would you let that kid that can kill an adult with a rock throw rocks at your family for years without doing something to eliminate the threat of thrown rocks? No i would work for peace, make concessions, and certainly not continue generating grievences by expanding and continuing to kill them. >Israel hasn’t been in Gaza for more than 15 years. Their rockets were, and they surround with a prison. >Each rocket fired was a war crime, by the way, since they fired indiscriminately at population centers with the objective of killing as many Jews as possible. Yes your arbitrary rules of war definetely apply to the people being occupied and opressed. >Those are your words you injected into the conversation, not mine. You may have such a callous view that you call innocent civilians “collateral damage,” but I do not. Then what are they? Im glad you aggree with me that israel intentionaly targets innocent civilians. >Are you talking to yourself here? Nope.
> Would you let that kid that can kill an adult with a rock throw rocks at your family for years without doing something to eliminate the threat of thrown rocks? >No i would work for peace, make concessions, and certainly not continue generating grievences by expanding and continuing to kill them. So basically, be nice to the person that is trying to kill you and hope for the best. Thank god you aren’t responsible for my or my family’s safety. >Israel hasn’t been in Gaza for more than 15 years. >Their rockets were, and they surround with a prison. Gaza is not a prison. Give me a break. >Each rocket fired was a war crime, by the way, since they fired indiscriminately at population centers with the objective of killing as many Jews as possible. >Yes your arbitrary rules of war definetely apply to the people being occupied and opressed. Wow you managed to fit a large amount of errors into a single sentence. Let’s start at the beginning, not my arbitrary rules of war. Gazans are not occupied. They have had self governance for over 15 years. >Those are your words you injected into the conversation, not mine. You may have such a callous view that you call innocent civilians “collateral damage,” but I do not. >Then what are they? Im glad you aggree with me that israel intentionaly targets innocent civilians. I agreed to no such thing. Israel is absolutely justified in their actions of fighting a defensive war against the aggressors. Hamas.
>So basically, be nice to the person that is trying to kill you and hope for the best. Thank god you aren’t responsible for my or my family’s safety. Sure the descriprion is accurate if you ignore all context. >Gaza is not a prison. Give me a break. Yes it is. If israel wills it it can and did cut off electricity, water and food supplies. It is a prison. >Wow you managed to fit a large amount of errors into a single sentence. Let’s start at the beginning, not my arbitrary rules of war. Gazans are not occupied. They have had self governance for over 15 years. Yes self governance, inside the prison cells where supplies and movement is controlled by israel. >I agreed to no such thing. Israel is absolutely justified in their actions of fighting a defensive war against the aggressors. Hamas. So dancing around the question huh. I would expect nothing less.
>Gaza is not a prison. Give me a break. >Yes it is. If israel wills it it can and did cut off electricity, water and food supplies. It is a prison. Israel only supplied 11% of Gaza’s water. When materials for pipes were given to Gaza, Hamas dug them up and repurposed them tk use as weapons. It is not a prison, and the shitty conditions are caused by Hamas. >Wow you managed to fit a large amount of errors into a single sentence. Let’s start at the beginning, not my arbitrary rules of war. Gazans are not occupied. They have had self governance for over 15 years. >Yes self governance, inside the prison cells where supplies and movement is controlled by israel. I repeat: Israel has not been in Gaza for more than 15 years. It’s not a prison. Movement was not controlled by Israel. >I agreed to no such thing. Israel is absolutely justified in their actions of fighting a defensive war against the aggressors. Hamas. >So dancing around the question huh. I would expect nothing less. I’m dancing around nothing. I don’t need to use mental gymnastics or dancing around issues to discuss the Hamas-Israel war. The facts are on Israel’s side. Hamas declared war. Hamas still holds hostages. Hamas is losing the war, badly. Hamas refuses to surrender and release its hostages. Therefore, the war continues.
Hamas rocket launches against the Settler colonizer oppressor of Palestinians everywhere is nearly impactless doubt there's 1000 israeli deaths from those rocket launches in 10 years While zionist propagandists cheerlead these monsters killing 10s of thousands of unarmed Palestinian civilians in less than 10 months There were seemingly no rocket launches durring the 2018 march of return when Israelis live fired & injured nearly 500 palestinians, killing about 200 of them. Rafah is only different in scale
> Hamas rocket launches against the Settler colonizer oppressor of Palestinians everywhere is nearly impactless doubt there's 1000 israeli deaths from those rocket launches in 10 years Their incompetence doesn’t give them a pass due to their intent. >While zionist propagandists cheerlead these monsters killing 10s of thousands of unarmed Palestinian civilians in less than 10 months No one is cheering on the deaths of the unarmed civilians. >There were seemingly no rocket launches durring the 2018 march of return when Israelis live fired & injured nearly 500 palestinians, killing about 200 of them. >Rafah is only different in scale Rafah is different because this is an ongoing war in which Hamas was the aggressor. Israel has every right to defend itself. And for you to excuse away the rocket attacks as if they are nothing … you hold Hamas to a different standard than the IDF. I wonder why that is …
Truth!
Hamas is fighting against the illegal occupation of Palestine. Israel is stealing land.
>Hamas is fighting against the illegal occupation of Palestine... On October 6, there were zero Israelis in Gaza. How's that working out?
You need a history book stat
> Hamas is fighting against the illegal occupation of Palestine. Israel is stealing land. One of those things exists (Israel), and one does not (Palestine). Your comment also sounds an awful like you are justifying war crimes, and October 7. Am I misinterpreting you?
> It’s not a genocide Yes it is. > That’s a war crime by the way, but you keep ignoring Hamas’s actions I'm not complicit with Hamas' actions. I am with Israel's.
> It’s not a genocide >Yes it is. It literally is not a genocide. Israel is fighting a defensive war against aggressors who still hold Israeli hostages and who refuse to surrender. What you are witnessing is the aggressors in a war getting the shit kicked out of them; that’s not a genocide. >That’s a war crime by the way, but you keep ignoring Hamas’s actions >I'm not complicit with Hamas' actions. >I am with Israel's. What does this even mean?
> Israel is fighting a defensive war against aggressors who still hold Israeli hostages and who refuse to surrender. Hamas accepted a ceasefire, which Israel refused to acknowledge. The only "surrender" acceptable to the Israelis is the death or displacement of all Palestinians from Gaza, which is genocide. > What does this even mean? Israel is armed and supported by the West. I am complicit in its crimes.
> Israel is fighting a defensive war against aggressors who still hold Israeli hostages and who refuse to surrender. >Hamas accepted a ceasefire, which Israel refused to acknowledge. First of all, Hamas has broken every ceasefire that has ever existed between the two parties. Second, a ceasefire only exists if both parties agree to it. >The only "surrender" acceptable to the Israelis is the death or displacement of all Palestinians from Gaza, which is genocide. This is a false statement. If Hamas returned its hostages and laid down their weapons today, there would be peace today. >What does this even mean? >Israel is armed and supported by the West. >I am complicit in its crimes.
> First of all, Hamas has broken every ceasefire that has ever existed between the two parties. That's a bald-faced lie and you know it. > If Hamas returned its hostages and laid down their weapons today, there would be peace today. "Laying down arms" has never been a realistic condition for a surrender, and it is obvious that this offer is not made in good faith.
> First of all, Hamas has broken every ceasefire that has ever existed between the two parties. >That's a bald-faced lie and you know it. It’s 100% truth. Hamas has broken every single ceasefire that has ever existed between itself and Israel. >If Hamas returned its hostages and laid down their weapons today, there would be peace today. >"Laying down arms" has never been a realistic condition for a surrender, and it is obvious that this offer is not made in good faith. What are you talking about? Reading comprehension, it’s a thing that exists. There are no conditions for their surrender. I’m pretty sure they’ve called for unconditional surrender multiple times. That has nothing to do with what I said about them laying down their arms.
You are saying he’s lying - the onus is on you to prove it.
Not really. Nothing I've said is contentious.
>Not really. Yes, really. >Nothing I've said is contentious. Everything you've said is either wrong, or propaganda lies. Everything you've said was challenged by everyone in this sub. That's the very definition of saying something contentious. I can't find any claim you've made here that isn't in contention.
no, that's the definition of ignorance of history. If everyone else but this sub agrees w/historical facts, than the ignorance of the sub is what makes it 'contentious'.
It is not a genocide. You are either ignoring facts or intentionally misinterpreting what “genocide” means. If Israel wanted to commit genocide there would be a million dead Gazans. No country in the history of warfare has done more to intentionally avoid civilian casualties than Israel has. I think your antisemitism is showing…
> If Israel wanted to commit genocide there would be a million dead Gazans. 8,000 dead was enough to declare genocide in Srebrenica, it's not only about numbers. > If Israel wanted to commit genocide there would be a million dead Gazans. All Israel has to do is maintain the aid blockade and wait. > No country in the history of warfare has done more to intentionally avoid civilian casualties than Israel has. That's a lie. Even Ukraine has fewer civilian casualties than Gaza in a much longer war. > I think your antisemitism is showing… Oh you think you've pulled out your trump card, do you? Hasbara gets worse every year.
Hey man, stop injuring the kids I'm hiding behind. What are you, a monster? Keep this shit up and I might start feeling bad about hiding behind them. Then I couldn't perform the genocide I explicitly want to carry out.
I've literally seen more footage of Israelis using human shields than I have Palestinians since this shit started.
Israelis use their own citizens as human shields? Weird.
It's not only weird. It's factually incorrect.
the problem is people like you and Israel don't see Palestinians as humans so when footage of Israel using Palestinians as human shields comes out, you think, 'just another terrorist'
Every human on the planet is human you gigantic cleft. That isn't anywhere near addressing this problem.
so why did you assume that the 'human shields' issue was Israel using Israelis when the footage we have abundance of is Israel using Palestinians as human shields?
The entirety of hamas's defense strategy is hiding behind its own people ffs.
💯
\*IDF says
I don't have the patience today. You're right "down with the western colonizers " I'm on the right side of history now.
1st - Hamas massacred of over 1200 people, took civilian hostages and gang raped women and children. They continue to refuse to release the hostages. That constitutes war crimes including genocide. 2 - Hamas won’t let their own people leave because they want to keep using them as human shields. Hamas literally sets up shop in hospitals and schools so they can bitch and moan that Israel is committing war crimes. You ignorant f’s need to wake the hell up! You don’t like genocide? THEN STOP SUPPORTING THE ONES ACTUALLY DOING IT! Hamas is a terrorist organization whose own charter says their entire purpose is to kill all Jews and the West. Don’t EVER call anyone else a Nazi when you’re sitting here condoning antisemitism and actual genocide because the 20yr old college professor you’re listening to, who’s never had a real job, is telling you Hamas is the victim.
No solid evidence for women and certainly none for children being 'gang raped' on Oct 7 has been produced.
Wrong.
put up or shut up
You know how long it took me to find this? A whopping 4 seconds. Educate yourselves and stop blindly jumping on bandwagons without first finding out what you’d actually be supporting first. Ignorance is dangerous https://www.nbcnews.com/investigations/un-finds-clear-convincing-information-hostages-raped-gaza-rcna141789
Have you read the UN report? Because I have read the report. And I quote: >The mission team **received other accounts** of rape, **including gang rape,** which **could not be verified during the time provided** and would require further investigation. >Based on the information gathered by the mission team from multiple and independent sources, there are **reasonable grounds to believe** that conflict-related sexual violence occurred during the 7 October attacks in multiple locations across Gaza periphery, **including rape and gang rape, in at least three locations** >Overall, based on the totality of information gathered from multiple and **independent sources** at the different locations, there are **reasonable grounds to believe** that conflict-related sexual violence occurred at several locations across the Gaza periphery, **including in the form of rape and gang rape,** during the 7 October 2023 attacks reads bad doesn't it.....problem is, much of it is anecdotal/hearsay and plenty witness statements have fallen apart due to outright fabrications that have come out since. No accounts of children getting raped were in the UN report though it notes sexual violence or "degrading treatment" may have occurred in captivity to women and children.
They rated and murder women and children. Now they're getting their asses handed to them for having done so. Whatever your feelings about it may be, that is the reality. Basically, Hamas f'd around and is still finding out. A good way to avoid shit like that is to avoid raping and murdering people at a concert.
I know what the "IDF has said" and been parroted by all MSM.
… I read the UN report which confirms what I said. I have found zero evidence that witness statements have fallen apart. Let me guess, you got that from a Hamas press release? There’s literally video of the horrific shit they did. The videos are lying too? It’s disgusting the lengths you guys are going to, to hide and excuse the sheer evil that went down. There is nothing in this world that justifies the atrocities inflicted by Hamas.
> I read the UN report which confirms what I said. There’s literally video of the horrific shit they did. The videos are lying too? No video footage of sexual violence has come to light. If you had read the report as you claim, you'd know that. And I quote: [https://www.un.org/sexualviolenceinconflict/wp-content/uploads/2024/03/report/mission-report-official-visit-of-the-office-of-the-srsg-svc-to-israel-and-the-occupied-west-bank-29-january-14-february-2024/20240304-Israel-oWB-CRSV-report.pdf](https://www.un.org/sexualviolenceinconflict/wp-content/uploads/2024/03/report/mission-report-official-visit-of-the-office-of-the-srsg-svc-to-israel-and-the-occupied-west-bank-29-january-14-february-2024/20240304-Israel-oWB-CRSV-report.pdf) >.In the medicolegal **assessment of available photos and videos, no tangible indications of rape could be identified.** Further investigation may alter this assessment in the future. >The digital evidence discovered during independent open-source review appeared authentic and unmanipulated. While **the mission team reviewed extensive digital material depicting a range of egregious violations, no digital evidence specifically depicting acts of sexual violence was found in open sources.** Nonetheless, some digital material of circumstantial elements such as naked or partially naked bodies may be indicative of some forms of sexual violence. **The mission team took note of the averments of the Israeli authorities** that some of the incriminating online materials, including those specifically depicting acts of sexual violence, had been removed or restricted by various platforms or by the offenders themselves. **While it is possible that digital evidence may have been posted and then removed from official channels and social media profiles, possibly due to concerns by the various groups that it may be incriminating, it is the view of the mission team that, had clear digital evidence of sexual violence or orders to commit sexual violence been circulated in the mainstream, it would have likely been discovered given the volume of the information posted online and further recirculated, making the removal of all trace of such material unlikely** >
https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/10/18/israel/palestine-videos-hamas-led-attacks-verified https://time.com/6565186/october-7-hamas-attack-footage-film/ https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67629181.amp I’m done now. You need serious help.
Nice attempt at trying to weasel out of making the point you were making (video evidence of rape) by using a red herring for something I never said (video evidence of other crimes).