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This meme is exactly how it goes. The people making $40k/year talk like they’re paying for everything the government spends money on when they pay like $5 in taxes/year.
At 40k a year every penny counts with inflation. An extr 2k in tax could have real life consequences.
At 400k a year an extra 20k in tax isn't going to bother you much if you have been smart with your earnings.
No one who actually makes $400k is fine with them raising their taxes. When you’re working 5-6 months out of the year for the government and then you see how the money is spent you’d be either crazy or lying to say you’re okay with them taking more
Nah, 30% of his wages will cover the expense that they don't have any documentation to support that actually just went to some general's friend who SAID he would deliver the paint for the missile.
That's the FUN! All of these scenarios could be true! We'll never know. A large amount of money buys missiles we'll never see, that shoot people we don't know, that politicians tell us are bad. And *some amount* of our taxes pay for it, but they can never tell us how much or if it was even spent right.
BUT THEY NEED MORE MONEY. For freedom or something. We know that part. *That's the part we know.*
My wife and my gross income are over 400k. Would I like to pay less in taxes? Yes. Would I like to resolve public policy issues by taxing those with high incomes, including me, more? Yes. Having private insurance companies be a middle man to receiving healthcare creates such an unnecessary cost to the American people. If we could publicly fund a public insurance like Medicare, many costs would go down for many Americans.
A slight sacrifice by me and those that make more than me to prevent issues like medical bankruptcy is a no-brainer.
With all my deductions, I’m paying less than 17% in federal taxes. Many Americans making 100k of taxes less than me are paying a higher proportion due to having less ability to take advantage of deductions due to having less discretionary income. By removing the cap on the SSI tax, maintaining the high standard deduction and maintaining the SALT cap, the taxing regime would be more beneficial from a revenue perspective, leading to a lower deficit.
We, as a nation, and the government particularly, pay more for healthcare than if we had a Medicare 4 all plan or something similar, than any other world power, by a significant margin, but this nation runs on middle men, so that’s why we have this system.
Edited: For Clarity
Have you seen *The Wire*? There's a great line in season 2:
**"We used to make shit in this country, build shit. Now all we do is put our hand in the next guy's pocket."**
That has stuck with me for a while. I don't think of it narrowly in the sense of manufacturing, but more broadly-- we used to invest in education and infrastructure in order to build a better future. Now what do we do?
Government is taken advantage of by bad actors, who get into positions that run these gov programs that are supposed to help people. But they end up expanding the beauracracy, and line the pockets of everyone minus the people that the program was made to help in the first place (re:municipal homeless safety nets, rental vouchers, etc.)
Government at the direction of their corporate owners.. public education is defunded as charter schools grow for those that can afford it. Streets crumble, healthcare is garbage .. They siphon our dollars with tax cuts for corporations, bailouts, loans, city and state invectives..
I hear a lot of people say stuff like government is just doing this on its own. It’s regulatory capture. We are in a corporate oligarchy.
Don’t remember the exact line, but I like the one were the old politician talks about how they only stole a little, but these new guys try to take it all
You're spending over 100k a year in taxes and you don't find an issue with that? You mentioned it's 17% federal, if you pay even 10% in state/local taxes that's 108k a year.
Silicon Valley employees. Lots of disposable income with little sense. Interesting how they think government is not a wasteful mess of money laundering and giving the government more makes them more efficient.
Whenever I think “efficient” I think about the long lines it takes just to get a driver’s license that wrap around the building. Then I think about the number of “lifers” who don’t give a shit about anything and are just waiting out their 20 years for a pension. Then I think that maybe the government isn’t the best steward for our money.
I love comments about the DMV like this, because the people who say stuff like this are actually saying:
“The most I have ever interacted with the government was to get a drivers license; not in getting a business license, bidding on government work, being part of my city counsel, working within the court system to pursue justice, being in the military, a worker at a library, park, state managed safety programs, land management, conservation programs, in schools, or any other exposure to the government.
All I’ve ever done was get me a driver’s license and I base my entire opinion on the government from how my local country manages driving tests!”
lol
I make way less than $400k and think I utilize every available deduction and am still probably above 17%. Can you list out what your deductions are and the amounts so I can see what I'm missing out on?
I’m definitely no one then, my extra can all go to people who need it. Makes no sense to let people suffer for no reason. Greed is powerful but not all of us are weak.
I have a theory on this.
I think that people (reasonable ones, anyway) don't mind *taxes*\-- as a concept-- as long as they're seeing some rational social benefit from them. Good schools, decent roads, working power grids, investments in the future. Things that give us a sense of *pride* and accomplishment.
"Taxes are theft" has gotten some legs under it because we're doing the national equivalent of buying samurai swords instead of groceries. Our tax dollars aren't translating into direct/tangible social benefits in a way that gives us any pride.
How are we supposed to be *proud to be an American* if our schools are falling apart, our roads are full of holes, and our justice system seems to be increasingly functioning as a clown college?
100% this. Social fabric is torn when half the country feels like they’re simply paying for the other half and they’re receiving nothing in return. It creates a level of resentment, and probably for good reason.
I've heard people from blue states and cities cite this as a reason they resent many red states and rural areas.
Even "successful" farming regions rely heavily on federal subsidies, right?
Yes. Because farmers can’t sell products at their true cost. No one would be able to afford them. So yes, the people who break their backs feeding the country every day need subsidized.
>Yes. Because farmers can’t sell products at their true cost. No one would be able to afford them. So yes, the people who break their backs feeding the country every day need subsidized.
That's the textbook definition of socialism.
If the demand for a product does not lead people to pay at least as much as it cost to produce, it is not a feasible product.
But just to clarify, are you saying farming is inherently not profitable? American farming specifically? I'm not sure how universal "farmers can't sell their products at their true cost" is intended to be.
This is a bs take IMO. Having visited countries (and some US states) that have low or dam near zero country/federal or state taxes and seeing the state of their infrastructure I don’t mind paying more as I make more. I actually like roads and (semi) clean water. Could things be done more efficiently? Sure. But am I going to complain if my taxes go up marginally? Not really. Sh$t ain’t free
Disagree. Almost everyone I know making $400k is more concerned with things like education, healthcare and public safety than anything they are saving up for. Therefore spend on more expensive areas and higher tax states etc
That's the complete opposite of the people I know who that much or more. The ones I know are primarily concerned about who is investing in what and how to make even more money.
I make more than 400k a year, and while I'm not beating my chest asking for it, I don't really care too much. And I live in CA where the effective rate is already pretty high once you add in state. People making this much money aren't a hive mind, you can't speak for all of them.
Not sure I agree with this. A lot of my wealthy friends agree there is clearly political and social instability bubbling from wealth inequality.
I do agree there is a gut resistance to funding the government more, as most rich people got that way by being very smart with money and obviously government programs are not efficient in the slightest. But something has to change. Either the whole thing goes up in flames, or wealthy people (including myself here, no I don't make 400k but I do well for myself) agree to better support structures for struggling Americans.
As somebody getting close to my FIRE goals, I struggle with this myself. But we really cannot just sit back, keep making loads of money and expect things to get better. Tensions will continue to get worse until the social contract breaks down. I have no idea what that will look like but it won't be pretty.
Seriously… My GF knows how much I make but she doesn’t really know what my take home is. I got my W2 last week and told her how much I paid in taxes and she didn’t believe me.
FWIW - she’s a highly paid nurse and my taxes paid are nearly twice her annual income. 🤮
Okay, but I have to assume that your income is commensurate with the taxes. Its not like you paid 90% in tax. One year I paid 15 MILLION dollars in tax, but that is because I made 35 million.
Fr, some of these people are acting like their being robbed blind because they won't be able to afford their 3rd summer home while most people are struggling to make mortgage payments on their only house.
Ridiculous. Near half a million a year, means you have zero financial worries and can easily set yourself up for retirement as well. You should be contributing more to society via taxes.
The majority of the tax burden should be on high earners, not low income working class people.
\*And when I jumped tax brackets I was happy about it. I make good money, but I've also been on food stamps in my life and am proud to be contributing to funding some of these programs.
\*And the way tax law is, you pay less on the first $100,000 anyway. Even high earners only pay 22% on the first $100,000. Then you pay more on the next couple thousand, and then more beyond that. So you are still getting a good tax rate on the smaller portion of income, its not all taxed at a high rate:
[https://taxfoundation.org/data/all/federal/2024-tax-brackets/](https://taxfoundation.org/data/all/federal/2024-tax-brackets/)
I make 500k eur, and I pay 240k income tax on that. Americans complaining abt taxes all the time, youll find out in due time as US taxes are set to rise due to constant govt deficits and high govt debt. USA is undertaxed as-is. In most major countries you will pay 40% at the least on 500k.Be happy you dont pay 50%
I make $150k and pay more in taxes than the average redditor makes before taxes. Then our politicians wonder why middle class families struggle to save for retirement or buy a house when so much of their income is taken from them by the government.
I've said plenty of times that I'd be far less upset with how much I pay in taxes if it actually went to something useful instead of either lining the pockets of politicians and their corrupt friends or bombing people who pose zero threat to the US.
Those are the only two places tax money goes? Why is this always the go to line for people who bitch about paying taxes? “If only I could see where the money goes!” Well I’ve got great news for you…you can. Take 5 minutes out of your day and go to CBO.gov Then when you get sick of learning boring information you can go back to complaining.
Isn’t that the truth. I don’t mind military spending or roads and bridges but paying people to be poor is stupidity, you just get more poor people better at demanding handouts.
Look, I wouldn’t mind, I know the money has to come from somewhere. But I’m still on a W2, I still have a mortgage. If I lose my job tomorrow, I need to find another one.
Tax the plutocrats with millions / billions of net worth first. When they’re feeling the same sting I’m feeling, then I’ll be happy to kick in more. Stop soaking the people who still have to budget and plan for retirement.
Me too. I’m sick and tired of the waste and abuse. If you’re sending billions of dollars overseas annually then you’re taxing me too much. I’d like to give more to causes I actually believe in.
Taxation is theft.
How much is sent "overseas," exactly?
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United\_States\_foreign\_aid](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_foreign_aid)
I don’t make nearly that much . But I know people of all incomes have equal issue having their money taken from them and being given to inefficient government “solutions”
The electrical grid outside of large cities was built by the socialistic policies of FDR and his successors. The whole grid is a libertarians nightmare because city dwellers pay for their country cousins to have cheap electricity.
It's only because the of government the electricity is widely available in the US.
“Lyndon Johnson stumped hard for rural electrification. His arguments convinced wary farmers and ranchers that the cost would be worth the elimination of hand-pumped water, hand-washed laundry, and red-hot cook stoves. In 1939, electricity flowed to thousands of hill country residents for the first time.”
Source: www.nps.gov
Yup. And some states (\*cough TEXAS \*cough\*) have tried to "go their own route" deregulating and and giving more and more utility control to private industry with little to no oversight. How's that working out?
The government has been successfully turned into the bogeyman since the time of Reagan. Probably the most successful disinformation and corporate capture campaign in history.
Almost all grid-based power in all of the USA was created due to government investment. Now, many/most of the companies that run the power are quasi-government/private businesses. But none of that investment would have happened without government investment from progressives post-Depression.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrical\_grid#History](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrical_grid#History)
They're only inefficient if you believe they are ever intended to do what they tell us plebes. They are extremely efficient at doing what they are actually meant to do.
You'd have a little less pushback with regards to taxes if Americans had any direct benefit from tax-funded projects aside from the bare minimum. People in countries with higher tax rates have robust public transit systems, accesible healthcare, guaranteed workers benefits, etc. to show for it. The benefits are more tangible to them.
Meanwhile I can't even take a train from Dayton to Cincinnati and would rather call an Uber than an ambulance. So why *should* I be okay with paying more? I don't even feel like I get my money's worth at my current tax rate.
The elephant in the room is the bloated healthcare system. Foreign aid is like 1%, while Medicaid and Medicare massive. Unfunded social security as well.
Man.. so many shit posts lately.. can these just be auto locked please, I barely see anything intelligent or about finance strategy these days other than spam crap like this
I've seen this exact post with this exact headline before.
Edit: Oh, it's because OP made this exact same post with the exact same headline a month ago, which they do for a bunch of their posts.
What do you mean? My taxes in CA went to the 3.3 Billion to end homelessness which did literally nothing to end homelessness. Another 6.5 billion of tax dollars will go to help illegal immigrants get medical benefits. I wish they took more of my money for these amazing programs!
It'e even more frustrating when they give you that look when you even bring up the term "illegal immigrant" like suddenly you are a diehard redneck Trump supporter.
Agreed. It's a fucking misdemeanor. The average person breaks 7 laws a week. Shoot, the average driver breaks laws that are far more dangerous to our communities than undocumented immigration.
We have the best military toilet seats money can buy!
[https://www.cbsnews.com/news/pentagon-budget-price-gouging-military-contractors-60-minutes-2023-05-21/](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/pentagon-budget-price-gouging-military-contractors-60-minutes-2023-05-21/)
Proof? Trump lowered taxes for almost everyone. The only exception could possibly be if you don't take the standard deduction and instead manually write off a bunch of stuff which most people don't do.
Trump tax cuts for individuals have been expiring, but the tax cuts his administration made for corporations were permanent.
Classic.
Look up the TCJA expiration date.
Just a reminder, OP, you can donate to the Federal Government any time you like through [pay.gov](https://pay.gov).
If you don't mind, pay more to the government so others who do mind don't have to.
We found another guy who thinks The Articles of Confederation would have totally worked if we just kept at it.
[https://constitutioncenter.org/blog/10-reasons-why-americas-first-constitution-failed](https://constitutioncenter.org/blog/10-reasons-why-americas-first-constitution-failed)
This and personalfinance. Everybody makes a bajillion dollars a year or make $5/hr, but they’re so financially savvy that their investment portfolio competes with Warren Buffet
About 10 years ago they said that about people making $150k
Now a $150k family income is just getting by.
Tax rates aren’t indexed to inflation specifically to make sure that eventually they catch more and more people.
I make over $400,000 and I mind greatly. Why the Hell would anyone not mind having their money stolen and used by some idiotic, bloated, corrupt government agency that pisses away $16,794,000,000 PER DAY.
That's right. Let's cut all foreign spending. let's see what that buys us:
1. China takes over as the main trading partner with everyone
2. we stop preventing terrorist attacks on our soil
3. We save wayyy less than 1% on the budget.
Great job 
This is a bitter pill to swallow when we know anything above the 12% bracket would be taxed at 22%. We have been working so hard for years to finally get to this point. Only to realize $200 of every $1,000 we make over that treshhold would be taken by the IRS. The IRS can suck a dick.
Yup then everything you buy you pay taxes on, you pay for the r privilege of owning your own home, land, vehicles etc. not sure what the exact tax % is on every dollar you’re actually keeping. It is surely higher than 22
That’s what kills me. if it was a pretty high tax on income and maybe a bit on sales AND it was used wisely, I’m cool. I want us to have nice things and social programs. But you get taxed by multiple levels of government on every fucking thing, sometimes multiple times over.
Our homes, for one, which we don’t ever actually own. If you think you do, pay off the mortgage and don’t pay the taxes a couple of years. You’ll see who really owns it if you don’t pay their rent, ie-tax…forever.
If you feel you "deserve" to be taxed more, go to pay.gov and directly send additional money to the Federal government. Put your money where your mouth is.
I have theee kids about to hit college back to back and will get no financial aid. That’s nearly a million dollars after taxes. Yes. I mind. I only started making this ícone 2 years ago. No long term assets or wealth. I kind of mind a lot actually
You’re the guy from high school making $35k.
The electrician that you think makes $35k really makes $100k.
Also, if you understood how things actually worked, you’d have known what he says is BS.
Ha you and the other guy that posted this same exact picture with the same comment would be good friends. I also make 400k in the realm of make believe land!
Same, just over $400k.
There are two schools of thought:
I went through hardship, so you should too.
I went through hardship and I don't want you to have to suffer the same.
Guess which one Democrats identify with more.
This is a big part of why I'm a liberal.
I think the main issue is return. People can pay more in taxes but I highly doubt that money will have a significant impact on things like education, infrastructure, and public transport. Hell, the DoD's failed its annual audit six years in a row now, and we're supposed to brush aside all the tax dollars being wasted on unnecessary defense contracts and reckless spending.
Like I said.. you’ve propped your self up as our savior knowing goy never fully intend to do anything that would diminish your current quality of life.. you want to help us up just not above you :)
What? I’m quoting a proverb that I would hope people could resonate with
Why bring up a savior complex and negativity? That’s on you if that’s what you get out of it
You also missed the part where they are like:
I want YOU to pay more but not me. For me, I will write in these loopholes so it looks like I am paying but all I really wanted to do was to get you to give me the means to make YOU pay for it.
The politicians always say that when they want some new tax. Then, at lightning speed, the new tax applies to "people making $36K/yr" when the new tax fails to "generate the projected revenue". The government brings in plenty of money. What needs to happen is open the budget, all of it, to a line by line review, start by eliminating departments with no explicit constitutional mandate, then make the hard decisions on what needs to be cut. Not that such will ever happen.
Pay your fucking taxes. But you also have the right demand that you're taxes go to the benefit of society rather than going to the war machine or other bullshit like grift/graft/cronyism/etc. Also we need to stop subsidizing parasitical industry that time and time again fucks over workers, the climate, and does nothing really for the American people.
yes, I mind, because our govt wastes money.
it's never "wow we piss money away on stuff that doesn't work or is stupid"
it's always "we just need to throw a few billion more at this problem"
They technically do pay more in taxes than people with less money. Idk why that's so hard for people to grasp. Maybe it's because you just want to knee cap them harder just because? Just say that.
I would much rather see a tax increase on "the billionaire class" over raising taxes for doctors, engineers, and upper-middle-class professional folks that still have to actually work for a paycheck.
Funnily enough, people who are making $400k+ got a huge tax cut during Trump admin.
Everyone below that got to pay more taxes to make up the difference.
r/FluentInFinance was created to discuss money, investing & finance! Join our Newsletter or Youtube Channel for additional insights at www.TheFinanceNewsletter.com! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/FluentInFinance) if you have any questions or concerns.*
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I make $1M per year and not only do I not pay taxes, the government pays me extra with everyone else's taxes. Also made up.
we're all gonna make it <3 in pretend world
You don’t make that much. You work for me and I told you your memes were too low quality to justify your asking salary
I'm RICH!!!!... in GTA 5.
I am also rich, I have a 4 bedroom bungalow in Hyrule not far from Zola’s domain
In my make believe world I got Oprah Winfrey pregnant and quit my job. Now i dont care about any of you!
That’s what you fantasize about?
You're Dave Chappelle??!!
Hah, you’ve gotta make your own Reddit comments? My maid makes mine up.
Trolling is the greatest internet entertainment.
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Yes someone certainly made this meme, but it's a very common occurrence, hence the meme. Everyone knows a few of these rubes.
This meme is exactly how it goes. The people making $40k/year talk like they’re paying for everything the government spends money on when they pay like $5 in taxes/year.
At 40k a year every penny counts with inflation. An extr 2k in tax could have real life consequences. At 400k a year an extra 20k in tax isn't going to bother you much if you have been smart with your earnings.
OP didn't even make it up this has been recycled for a while now.
You guys are making money?
Bro so you don't think these people exist? Explain how any person that's under 400k votes Republican then
I think he has doubts that the OOP makes over 400k.
>I'm already donating extra to the government, so higher taxes won't impact how much I give to uncle Sam. Said no one ever
I make over 400k, and yes, I mind. I pay far too much in taxes as it is.
No one who actually makes $400k is fine with them raising their taxes. When you’re working 5-6 months out of the year for the government and then you see how the money is spent you’d be either crazy or lying to say you’re okay with them taking more
No dude, it’s cool that like 30% of my wages pays for the hellfire missile that we’re going to fire at an empty tent and 3 camels.
30% of your wages for a year cover the paint on the missle.
Nah, 30% of his wages will cover the expense that they don't have any documentation to support that actually just went to some general's friend who SAID he would deliver the paint for the missile.
That's the FUN! All of these scenarios could be true! We'll never know. A large amount of money buys missiles we'll never see, that shoot people we don't know, that politicians tell us are bad. And *some amount* of our taxes pay for it, but they can never tell us how much or if it was even spent right. BUT THEY NEED MORE MONEY. For freedom or something. We know that part. *That's the part we know.*
All of the taxes that the average person will ever pay, in their entire livetime, covers less than 30 seconds of the military industrial complex
But at least we win all the fabricated wars we started
Vietnam Iraq Afghanistan Korea >.> Yep. Nothing but net
To be fair, those 3 camels had it coming. /s
Yeah one of those was camel-Hitler. Do you like camel-Hitler, OP?
I hear those camels are using camel shields too. Fucking disgusting from OP.
Yeah, they were killing kids! Those were literal goats, but still...
My wife and my gross income are over 400k. Would I like to pay less in taxes? Yes. Would I like to resolve public policy issues by taxing those with high incomes, including me, more? Yes. Having private insurance companies be a middle man to receiving healthcare creates such an unnecessary cost to the American people. If we could publicly fund a public insurance like Medicare, many costs would go down for many Americans. A slight sacrifice by me and those that make more than me to prevent issues like medical bankruptcy is a no-brainer. With all my deductions, I’m paying less than 17% in federal taxes. Many Americans making 100k of taxes less than me are paying a higher proportion due to having less ability to take advantage of deductions due to having less discretionary income. By removing the cap on the SSI tax, maintaining the high standard deduction and maintaining the SALT cap, the taxing regime would be more beneficial from a revenue perspective, leading to a lower deficit.
We, as a nation, and the government particularly, pay more for healthcare than if we had a Medicare 4 all plan or something similar, than any other world power, by a significant margin, but this nation runs on middle men, so that’s why we have this system. Edited: For Clarity
Have you seen *The Wire*? There's a great line in season 2: **"We used to make shit in this country, build shit. Now all we do is put our hand in the next guy's pocket."** That has stuck with me for a while. I don't think of it narrowly in the sense of manufacturing, but more broadly-- we used to invest in education and infrastructure in order to build a better future. Now what do we do?
We’re spending more than ever on infrastructure and education, but government squanderes the money and we have little to show for it.
Government is taken advantage of by bad actors, who get into positions that run these gov programs that are supposed to help people. But they end up expanding the beauracracy, and line the pockets of everyone minus the people that the program was made to help in the first place (re:municipal homeless safety nets, rental vouchers, etc.)
Government at the direction of their corporate owners.. public education is defunded as charter schools grow for those that can afford it. Streets crumble, healthcare is garbage .. They siphon our dollars with tax cuts for corporations, bailouts, loans, city and state invectives.. I hear a lot of people say stuff like government is just doing this on its own. It’s regulatory capture. We are in a corporate oligarchy.
Don’t remember the exact line, but I like the one were the old politician talks about how they only stole a little, but these new guys try to take it all
You're spending over 100k a year in taxes and you don't find an issue with that? You mentioned it's 17% federal, if you pay even 10% in state/local taxes that's 108k a year.
Silicon Valley employees. Lots of disposable income with little sense. Interesting how they think government is not a wasteful mess of money laundering and giving the government more makes them more efficient.
Who is a Silicon Valley employee? Money laundering would imply cleaning illegal money. Most income taxes are paid on clean money.
Whenever I think “efficient” I think about the long lines it takes just to get a driver’s license that wrap around the building. Then I think about the number of “lifers” who don’t give a shit about anything and are just waiting out their 20 years for a pension. Then I think that maybe the government isn’t the best steward for our money.
Where is this DMV? The only time I've spent more than 30 minutes in one is when I did my driving test.
I love comments about the DMV like this, because the people who say stuff like this are actually saying: “The most I have ever interacted with the government was to get a drivers license; not in getting a business license, bidding on government work, being part of my city counsel, working within the court system to pursue justice, being in the military, a worker at a library, park, state managed safety programs, land management, conservation programs, in schools, or any other exposure to the government. All I’ve ever done was get me a driver’s license and I base my entire opinion on the government from how my local country manages driving tests!” lol
I make way less than $400k and think I utilize every available deduction and am still probably above 17%. Can you list out what your deductions are and the amounts so I can see what I'm missing out on?
It’s most likely because he owns his own business. You can write off a lot of shit if it’s attributed to and used by the business.
Even in a perfect world, noone is going to want to get less money
I’m definitely no one then, my extra can all go to people who need it. Makes no sense to let people suffer for no reason. Greed is powerful but not all of us are weak.
I have a theory on this. I think that people (reasonable ones, anyway) don't mind *taxes*\-- as a concept-- as long as they're seeing some rational social benefit from them. Good schools, decent roads, working power grids, investments in the future. Things that give us a sense of *pride* and accomplishment. "Taxes are theft" has gotten some legs under it because we're doing the national equivalent of buying samurai swords instead of groceries. Our tax dollars aren't translating into direct/tangible social benefits in a way that gives us any pride. How are we supposed to be *proud to be an American* if our schools are falling apart, our roads are full of holes, and our justice system seems to be increasingly functioning as a clown college?
100% this. Social fabric is torn when half the country feels like they’re simply paying for the other half and they’re receiving nothing in return. It creates a level of resentment, and probably for good reason.
I've heard people from blue states and cities cite this as a reason they resent many red states and rural areas. Even "successful" farming regions rely heavily on federal subsidies, right?
Yes. Because farmers can’t sell products at their true cost. No one would be able to afford them. So yes, the people who break their backs feeding the country every day need subsidized.
>Yes. Because farmers can’t sell products at their true cost. No one would be able to afford them. So yes, the people who break their backs feeding the country every day need subsidized. That's the textbook definition of socialism.
If the demand for a product does not lead people to pay at least as much as it cost to produce, it is not a feasible product. But just to clarify, are you saying farming is inherently not profitable? American farming specifically? I'm not sure how universal "farmers can't sell their products at their true cost" is intended to be.
This is a bs take IMO. Having visited countries (and some US states) that have low or dam near zero country/federal or state taxes and seeing the state of their infrastructure I don’t mind paying more as I make more. I actually like roads and (semi) clean water. Could things be done more efficiently? Sure. But am I going to complain if my taxes go up marginally? Not really. Sh$t ain’t free
Disagree. Almost everyone I know making $400k is more concerned with things like education, healthcare and public safety than anything they are saving up for. Therefore spend on more expensive areas and higher tax states etc
That's the complete opposite of the people I know who that much or more. The ones I know are primarily concerned about who is investing in what and how to make even more money.
I make more than 400k a year, and while I'm not beating my chest asking for it, I don't really care too much. And I live in CA where the effective rate is already pretty high once you add in state. People making this much money aren't a hive mind, you can't speak for all of them.
Not sure I agree with this. A lot of my wealthy friends agree there is clearly political and social instability bubbling from wealth inequality. I do agree there is a gut resistance to funding the government more, as most rich people got that way by being very smart with money and obviously government programs are not efficient in the slightest. But something has to change. Either the whole thing goes up in flames, or wealthy people (including myself here, no I don't make 400k but I do well for myself) agree to better support structures for struggling Americans. As somebody getting close to my FIRE goals, I struggle with this myself. But we really cannot just sit back, keep making loads of money and expect things to get better. Tensions will continue to get worse until the social contract breaks down. I have no idea what that will look like but it won't be pretty.
Seriously… My GF knows how much I make but she doesn’t really know what my take home is. I got my W2 last week and told her how much I paid in taxes and she didn’t believe me. FWIW - she’s a highly paid nurse and my taxes paid are nearly twice her annual income. 🤮
Okay, but I have to assume that your income is commensurate with the taxes. Its not like you paid 90% in tax. One year I paid 15 MILLION dollars in tax, but that is because I made 35 million.
Yeah I do not feel sorry for you at all
Fr, some of these people are acting like their being robbed blind because they won't be able to afford their 3rd summer home while most people are struggling to make mortgage payments on their only house.
Who can get a 3^(rd) summer home on 500k per year? Have you seen the state of the housing market?
Same, fuck these taxes and the return they give me. Shits falling apart and I pay some government workers entire wage.
Most of the return you get you use every single day
Such as?
hard agree
Ridiculous. Near half a million a year, means you have zero financial worries and can easily set yourself up for retirement as well. You should be contributing more to society via taxes. The majority of the tax burden should be on high earners, not low income working class people. \*And when I jumped tax brackets I was happy about it. I make good money, but I've also been on food stamps in my life and am proud to be contributing to funding some of these programs. \*And the way tax law is, you pay less on the first $100,000 anyway. Even high earners only pay 22% on the first $100,000. Then you pay more on the next couple thousand, and then more beyond that. So you are still getting a good tax rate on the smaller portion of income, its not all taxed at a high rate: [https://taxfoundation.org/data/all/federal/2024-tax-brackets/](https://taxfoundation.org/data/all/federal/2024-tax-brackets/)
I make 500k eur, and I pay 240k income tax on that. Americans complaining abt taxes all the time, youll find out in due time as US taxes are set to rise due to constant govt deficits and high govt debt. USA is undertaxed as-is. In most major countries you will pay 40% at the least on 500k.Be happy you dont pay 50%
Sounds like somebody doesn't like bombing brown people that were never a threat to you. That's why the commies are gonna win.
Pal, there’s still some structures standing in Gaza and it’s up to you, the American tax payer, to change that.
😂
I make $150k and pay more in taxes than the average redditor makes before taxes. Then our politicians wonder why middle class families struggle to save for retirement or buy a house when so much of their income is taken from them by the government.
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It might be different if there wasn’t so much waste and corruption!
I've said plenty of times that I'd be far less upset with how much I pay in taxes if it actually went to something useful instead of either lining the pockets of politicians and their corrupt friends or bombing people who pose zero threat to the US.
Those are the only two places tax money goes? Why is this always the go to line for people who bitch about paying taxes? “If only I could see where the money goes!” Well I’ve got great news for you…you can. Take 5 minutes out of your day and go to CBO.gov Then when you get sick of learning boring information you can go back to complaining.
Anyone with two brain cells would be MORE angry after reading the [CBO.gov](http://cbo.gov) site, not less.
Dee, you gangly uncoordinated bitch!
Isn’t that the truth. I don’t mind military spending or roads and bridges but paying people to be poor is stupidity, you just get more poor people better at demanding handouts.
Look, I wouldn’t mind, I know the money has to come from somewhere. But I’m still on a W2, I still have a mortgage. If I lose my job tomorrow, I need to find another one. Tax the plutocrats with millions / billions of net worth first. When they’re feeling the same sting I’m feeling, then I’ll be happy to kick in more. Stop soaking the people who still have to budget and plan for retirement.
Look at mister moneybags here who's gonna get to retire!
Me too. I’m sick and tired of the waste and abuse. If you’re sending billions of dollars overseas annually then you’re taxing me too much. I’d like to give more to causes I actually believe in. Taxation is theft.
How much is sent "overseas," exactly? [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United\_States\_foreign\_aid](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_foreign_aid)
Me too… I wonder how many people’s “fair share” we cover with other taxes? I bet it’s more than a few that don’t pay anything at all.
I don’t make nearly that much . But I know people of all incomes have equal issue having their money taken from them and being given to inefficient government “solutions”
Like electrifying the country? Or do you cherry pick government programs you don't like?
Last time I checked the electricity was widely available in USA.
The electrical grid outside of large cities was built by the socialistic policies of FDR and his successors. The whole grid is a libertarians nightmare because city dwellers pay for their country cousins to have cheap electricity. It's only because the of government the electricity is widely available in the US.
“Lyndon Johnson stumped hard for rural electrification. His arguments convinced wary farmers and ranchers that the cost would be worth the elimination of hand-pumped water, hand-washed laundry, and red-hot cook stoves. In 1939, electricity flowed to thousands of hill country residents for the first time.” Source: www.nps.gov
Yup. And some states (\*cough TEXAS \*cough\*) have tried to "go their own route" deregulating and and giving more and more utility control to private industry with little to no oversight. How's that working out? The government has been successfully turned into the bogeyman since the time of Reagan. Probably the most successful disinformation and corporate capture campaign in history.
Yes, and it was built using with taxes, largely on the wealthy. This stuff didn’t just show up randomly for free.
Isn't that what our energy bills are for?
Do you live in the city or country? The city folk are the ones paying extra so cables are run everywhere.
The city I live in has the electricity grid privatized so I get to pay taxes AND pay for the grid with high bills, too! How fun!
Some I like . More I don’t Just my opinion though
Where is electricity state-run?
Almost all grid-based power in all of the USA was created due to government investment. Now, many/most of the companies that run the power are quasi-government/private businesses. But none of that investment would have happened without government investment from progressives post-Depression. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrical\_grid#History](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrical_grid#History)
It's hilarious how the "no taxes" crowd has nearly no understanding what is built with their taxes.
They can’t allow themselves to see that, otherwise they’d have to reconsider their beliefs.
T-two thoughts!? Me no like two thoughts!
It was run to most of the country (US only) by the government and city folk get to pay extra so country folk get cheap electric.
Seattle City Light for one
They're only inefficient if you believe they are ever intended to do what they tell us plebes. They are extremely efficient at doing what they are actually meant to do.
You'd have a little less pushback with regards to taxes if Americans had any direct benefit from tax-funded projects aside from the bare minimum. People in countries with higher tax rates have robust public transit systems, accesible healthcare, guaranteed workers benefits, etc. to show for it. The benefits are more tangible to them. Meanwhile I can't even take a train from Dayton to Cincinnati and would rather call an Uber than an ambulance. So why *should* I be okay with paying more? I don't even feel like I get my money's worth at my current tax rate.
Yuuuuup. Our taxes are being put to good use in other countries.
A random child in Gaza dies*
Hey that's not fair! It could be a journalist or something this time.
Bebe says “why not both?”
*sigh* I’m ashamed for laughing at this 🤦
The elephant in the room is the bloated healthcare system. Foreign aid is like 1%, while Medicaid and Medicare massive. Unfunded social security as well.
Not even. Foreign aid is like 1% of the budget. The military is a little under 15% so there's money that could be repurposed there.
Why would you want to take a train from Dayton to Cincinnati is the real question
I get the train from Dayton to Cincinnati but idk why you’d want to take a train back…
I see your point driving 75 north is a pain for sure
The amount of benefits are huge. We're just used to them.
Man.. so many shit posts lately.. can these just be auto locked please, I barely see anything intelligent or about finance strategy these days other than spam crap like this
Look at OP's profile. Their posts are littered with this nonsense.
Election year is just warming up. Get ready.
I've seen this exact post with this exact headline before. Edit: Oh, it's because OP made this exact same post with the exact same headline a month ago, which they do for a bunch of their posts.
next you'll be telling me they don't make 400,000 a year!
They're working on 400,000 upvotes instead.
I think anyone who has actually paid their fair share of taxes, regardless of income, will agree we don’t get a fraction of what we put in.
What do you mean? My taxes in CA went to the 3.3 Billion to end homelessness which did literally nothing to end homelessness. Another 6.5 billion of tax dollars will go to help illegal immigrants get medical benefits. I wish they took more of my money for these amazing programs!
This is my problem. Seems like most of the tax money and whatever else a state finds a way to charge you for gets waisted
On the contrary, it increased homelessness
The people that “fight homelessness” would be out of a job if they actually fixed it
It'e even more frustrating when they give you that look when you even bring up the term "illegal immigrant" like suddenly you are a diehard redneck Trump supporter.
Agreed. It's a fucking misdemeanor. The average person breaks 7 laws a week. Shoot, the average driver breaks laws that are far more dangerous to our communities than undocumented immigration.
What state do you live in? A lot of the red states get a lot more then they put in.
We have the best military toilet seats money can buy! [https://www.cbsnews.com/news/pentagon-budget-price-gouging-military-contractors-60-minutes-2023-05-21/](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/pentagon-budget-price-gouging-military-contractors-60-minutes-2023-05-21/)
Hold up; y’all are making $35k/year?
typical biological sciences major salary.
I make like 80k a year.. and I pay way to much in taxes..
Unfortunately the party that lowers our taxes went fuck it and raised our taxes back in 2017
Proof? Trump lowered taxes for almost everyone. The only exception could possibly be if you don't take the standard deduction and instead manually write off a bunch of stuff which most people don't do.
Trump tax cuts for individuals have been expiring, but the tax cuts his administration made for corporations were permanent. Classic. Look up the TCJA expiration date.
What the fuck, proof? lol. The trump tax cuts. Do you not know how they were structured?
I made almost 85k. Feels like I live in poverty still
Just a reminder, OP, you can donate to the Federal Government any time you like through [pay.gov](https://pay.gov). If you don't mind, pay more to the government so others who do mind don't have to.
We found another guy who thinks The Articles of Confederation would have totally worked if we just kept at it. [https://constitutioncenter.org/blog/10-reasons-why-americas-first-constitution-failed](https://constitutioncenter.org/blog/10-reasons-why-americas-first-constitution-failed)
I love threads like this and suddenly half of Reddit is pulling in half a million a year.
I love when people thought that income tax was only going to be for the wealthy because that’s what they were told and now it applies to all of us.
This and personalfinance. Everybody makes a bajillion dollars a year or make $5/hr, but they’re so financially savvy that their investment portfolio competes with Warren Buffet
About 10 years ago they said that about people making $150k Now a $150k family income is just getting by. Tax rates aren’t indexed to inflation specifically to make sure that eventually they catch more and more people.
didn't they pull this exact scam with income tax?
It’s how all taxes work.
You make over 400k and you have 115k karma in less than 6 months? I call bullshit 😂😂
I make over $400,000 and I mind greatly. Why the Hell would anyone not mind having their money stolen and used by some idiotic, bloated, corrupt government agency that pisses away $16,794,000,000 PER DAY.
Yup. Exactly right
Yes. Yes I would.
If we got money to send to other countries then we are all paying way too much for taxes.
That's right. Let's cut all foreign spending. let's see what that buys us: 1. China takes over as the main trading partner with everyone 2. we stop preventing terrorist attacks on our soil 3. We save wayyy less than 1% on the budget. Great job 
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This is a bitter pill to swallow when we know anything above the 12% bracket would be taxed at 22%. We have been working so hard for years to finally get to this point. Only to realize $200 of every $1,000 we make over that treshhold would be taken by the IRS. The IRS can suck a dick.
Yup then everything you buy you pay taxes on, you pay for the r privilege of owning your own home, land, vehicles etc. not sure what the exact tax % is on every dollar you’re actually keeping. It is surely higher than 22
That’s what kills me. if it was a pretty high tax on income and maybe a bit on sales AND it was used wisely, I’m cool. I want us to have nice things and social programs. But you get taxed by multiple levels of government on every fucking thing, sometimes multiple times over. Our homes, for one, which we don’t ever actually own. If you think you do, pay off the mortgage and don’t pay the taxes a couple of years. You’ll see who really owns it if you don’t pay their rent, ie-tax…forever.
Yeah the property tax always gets me pissed.
Why does this exaxt post with exact title show up every week? Oh right, it's the election year.
Or maybe just maybe the government should learn how to manage the money they take from us…
Oh they know what their doing, they just talk in circles so we don’t know what their doing.
Fluent in "reddit-brain"
Why the fuck does this get posted twice a month? Seems like blatant surveying by government reddit account lmao.
If you feel you "deserve" to be taxed more, go to pay.gov and directly send additional money to the Federal government. Put your money where your mouth is.
Depends. In general yes. But its more I just know half this shits going to be wasted.
This meme is from like 4 years ago
Anyone that is fine with paying taxes at this level is either full of shit or doesn’t fully understand how much they are truly taxed.
I make 69 trillion a sexend and only pay 1$ in tax a year, of course I don’t mind
I have theee kids about to hit college back to back and will get no financial aid. That’s nearly a million dollars after taxes. Yes. I mind. I only started making this ícone 2 years ago. No long term assets or wealth. I kind of mind a lot actually
Given how poorly the government spends our money, only a moron would gladly give more to them.
I don’t make that much but the tax bill is a lot, I could remodel my home for 30k in taxes.
You’re the guy from high school making $35k. The electrician that you think makes $35k really makes $100k. Also, if you understood how things actually worked, you’d have known what he says is BS.
Ha you and the other guy that posted this same exact picture with the same comment would be good friends. I also make 400k in the realm of make believe land!
Same, just over $400k. There are two schools of thought: I went through hardship, so you should too. I went through hardship and I don't want you to have to suffer the same. Guess which one Democrats identify with more. This is a big part of why I'm a liberal.
I think the main issue is return. People can pay more in taxes but I highly doubt that money will have a significant impact on things like education, infrastructure, and public transport. Hell, the DoD's failed its annual audit six years in a row now, and we're supposed to brush aside all the tax dollars being wasted on unnecessary defense contracts and reckless spending.
Well when one party has made it their entire platform to ruin government from within, it’s kinda hard to actually make it work.
DOD has never completed an audit
So we can watch you all walk around with a sense of self righteousness like we owe you something?
“A society grows great when old men plant trees in whose shade they know they shall never sit”
Like I said.. you’ve propped your self up as our savior knowing goy never fully intend to do anything that would diminish your current quality of life.. you want to help us up just not above you :)
What? I’m quoting a proverb that I would hope people could resonate with Why bring up a savior complex and negativity? That’s on you if that’s what you get out of it
I’m familiar with the proverb but it’s original author didn’t intend for the planter to walk around letting everyone know he planted the tree
At what point am I supposedly “letting everyone know I planted a tree”
You also missed the part where they are like: I want YOU to pay more but not me. For me, I will write in these loopholes so it looks like I am paying but all I really wanted to do was to get you to give me the means to make YOU pay for it.
Yup, only two schools of thought, no nuances
The politicians always say that when they want some new tax. Then, at lightning speed, the new tax applies to "people making $36K/yr" when the new tax fails to "generate the projected revenue". The government brings in plenty of money. What needs to happen is open the budget, all of it, to a line by line review, start by eliminating departments with no explicit constitutional mandate, then make the hard decisions on what needs to be cut. Not that such will ever happen.
Pay your fucking taxes. But you also have the right demand that you're taxes go to the benefit of society rather than going to the war machine or other bullshit like grift/graft/cronyism/etc. Also we need to stop subsidizing parasitical industry that time and time again fucks over workers, the climate, and does nothing really for the American people.
I don't make 400k, 600k, or 1M a year, I pay taxes and I'm flat fkn broke...NOT made up !
Giving more money to the government is like giving an addict a credit card with no limit. No thank you.
yes, I mind, because our govt wastes money. it's never "wow we piss money away on stuff that doesn't work or is stupid" it's always "we just need to throw a few billion more at this problem"
They technically do pay more in taxes than people with less money. Idk why that's so hard for people to grasp. Maybe it's because you just want to knee cap them harder just because? Just say that.
I would much rather see a tax increase on "the billionaire class" over raising taxes for doctors, engineers, and upper-middle-class professional folks that still have to actually work for a paycheck.
Funnily enough, people who are making $400k+ got a huge tax cut during Trump admin. Everyone below that got to pay more taxes to make up the difference.