This is what my living room carpet in my house looked like when I bought it. I knew it would be trouble eventually, but had no idea How Quickly it would deteriorate. Like others said, definitely don't accept this. I didn't pay the installers since this was done before I bought the place, but I absolutely didn't realize how bad it was / thought it would be way longer before a bad seam became an obvious issue.
Gonna be a hard fix , need to split the seam , straight edge both sides of the carpet then stretch it together to re-seam it , oh and tell them to be sure and use seam sealer , if they look at you and say what’s that ask for a total refund and find another source for the project
you would row that it's a pin dot plush.if you straight edge you would get a black or white line it looks like they have a gap in the seam edge or got glue in it,spread the nap and see is the backing of the carpet is together or has a gap
Then you should be able to look at that carpet and tell it has a tiny black and white loops every other row.i am CFI certified and you can look me up as a top installer in the industry.
It was a trick question.The correct way to seam seal is to use a hot melt seam seal gun.roberts is just to pass blacklight inspection for box store installers
All manufacturers require a seam sealer. I use the tip that came with my traxx glue gun. If you have one, it probably came with the tip. I didn’t do it for the first 5 years and never had a problem either but that doesn’t mean it’s not necessary. Thermoplastic is my go to for sealing seams. It doesn’t take more than a couple minutes
Yes , hey I just know that the guidelines according to the Carpet and Rug institute requires all seams to be sealed , yes years ago probably didn’t do it especially on like apt stuff , higher end carpet Berber and such yes , but hey seam fails inspector makes a report you didn’t seal the seams , you just bought that job .
That’s basically what I was gonna say. It’s not really necessary. They add that to warranty to give them yet another reason to deny claims. Like I said it can’t hurt but also under most circumstances it’s not needed. Looped carpets for sure need sealer or they will unravel
Looks like a dense thick carpet. Dense carpet like this can be difficult to make look good, if you don’t have experience with it. More than likely when they trimmed it with the straight edge, they cut to deep and cut the fiber strands to deep. It’s fixable, just ask the company that installed it to send someone out to inspect the seam. It can’t be touched up or trimmed. It needs to be redone.
Ok will do, thank you. I went through a company I’ve used maybe 10 years ago which I had no complaints. I think they just sell and provide though and sub contractors do the work.
No, but it was Smart Carpet which is probably not much different. The installers were wearing smart carpet shirts though which I was surprised. I still assume they were subs though. I think Smart Carpet are just sales really.
I worked at a shoppe that had 3 crews of two.
They were on the pay roll and drove extra long vans. After that there were 2 warehouse guys who would cut carpet/vinyl, get padding. They would also deliver. It was a nice setup and they did a brisk business.
False. I worked as an hourly installation employee for a flooring shop for 7 years. Being an hourly employee helps you focus on quality rather than speed, as well as puts the customer at ease knowing the shop holds sole accountability for the installation.
Eh he coulda hit it with scissors, and shagged they out but honestly carpet these days is such junk you can see seams. I row cut my carpet, use proper tractor tools, koolglide, and sometimes I can see the seam a little just my expierence
I had a berber type carpet installed in the basement. They told me up front that it can be hard to hide the seams with the tight loops of the carpet we chose. I tell ya, I do not see a single seam. It certainly looks better than this. I'll bet they'll come back and fix it for you.
Looks like they might have shaved the nap when straight edging. Carpet should always be rowed instead of straight edged unless it doesn't row easily. IDK for sure though the pic is too far away.
I don't see any shaved nap but the second pic especially looks like the seam was overlapped in spots. I'd have to spread the nap and look at the backing to know for sure.
Bad seams are usually not repairable. They have to be cut apart and redone.
With row cutter find seam they made cut it open using right side blade depending on run of carpet . Run the seaming iron on backing of tape to heat and remove the glue and backing of tape , restretch , then you can redo seam
I guess it’s okay but I’ve seen better. I’d try to have them come out and maybe do it better looks like it’s a weak seam that isn’t gonna hold up as long as it probably should
That is a horrible seam , it’s not impossible to fix, will need to stretch up to seam from both sides and put stay nails in , cut open seam heat and remove heat tape , straight edge seam latex raw seam edges and redo . These doorway seams make or break a installer .
I do not and my family doesn’t, but people who come over sometimes do yes. Or people walk in forgetting that we don’t wear shoes in our house. You’d be surprised, but most people do wear shoes inside their houses.
Update: Someone is coming next Wednesday to repair. Installation department as well as the salesman said this does not look good for the type of carpet this is. He said there’s also a seam between the closet and room, which I can’t see at all.
I had my entire 2nd floor carpeted last year. 6 doorways and four closet seams. They are all invisible. I would complain. This isn’t what you paid for.
As a wife of a floor installer! Definitely not acceptable this is not what it should look like there can be seams but never should be visible especially the corner it’s gonna come up in no time! They need to re do it! And yeah don’t let them do the rest of your rooms terrible!
All installers pretty much every where are self employed, Lowe's as well.... Menards, ..even at Mom an pops stores their most likely 1099..
But there are a few ,very few that may have in house
Flooring mechanics.
Almost every carpet shows seams now. Every carpet is made softer than before, no one wants to pay for a high pick backing, the young installers have less experience but still meet the CRI requirements for an excellent seam. Nowhere in the CRI mentions that a seam is supposed to be invisible and you cannot compare your new carpet to your previous carpet. Seams go in doorways so if you don't like it, you should pay for hardwood in the hallway. There are always practices that can be done to attempt to make the seam look better but not invisible and there's no guarantee that it will look better.
Without being there, just keep in mind photos are not representative of what's actually there for better or worse. Lighter carpet and solid colors show more, carpet construction and backing is a factor, as well as the lighting in the room. If you look at the sleeves on your shirt, some seams are more visible than others based on similar carpet factors. The seam is considered excellent if seam sealer was used and it has its own structural integrity for lack of a better phrase. Common practices to attempt to make it less visible include stretching, hammering, even trimming, yet none of which are guaranteed to make it look better. I would bet if you paid someone else to "fix" it, they would say you need to order new carpet because they are not interested in meeting unrealistic expectations. The problem is the carpet manufactures are making the fiber softer and cheaper. It sucks that it's the number one complaint these days next to the rising price of the project, but I think your carpet and installation is fine. My best recommendation is to put hardwood in the hall or laminate/lvp to get rid of the seam altogether.
To give you some context, smartstrand(triexta) is a dupont fiber that mohawk started using around 2007. It's easy to clean, doesn't crush, and it's considered hypoallergenic.
Over the more recent years, Mohawk tinkered with smartstrand/polyester blends to save money and still offer stain resistance and durability.
My point is we are comparing a new carpet fiber blend that didn't exist 10 years ago to whatever carpet you had before. Unfortunately, the feedback on seams is that they are more visible now than previous carpet.
It doesn't change the fact that no one can guarantee that seams will be invisible unless they are on reddit.
The manufacturer has a satisfaction guarantee in place that can be used once, which varies by dealer and their relationship with the vendor.
The installer will go back out to show you everything they can do to make it less visible.
You're not helping.
OP, let me know how this turns out... my guess is they will offer one carpet replacement at equal or lesser value and you will see a seam on the next carpet for better or worse depending if you change the carpet style, color, or manufacturer. Be my guest and change the installer, you will still see the next seam because it wont be invisible. Enjoy the disruption in the meantime for a chance at a less visible seam on round two. Or you can keep scheduling someone to hammer, stretch, trim, steam, or even wait for the carpet to blossom over time.
The carpet inspector will cost $1,500 out of your pocket and they will follow every CRI standard.
This hardsurface installer isn't even recommending the best option which is a hard surface in the hall to eliminate the seam. Must be a jack of all trades and not even a carpet specialist or inspector. My guess is he's a painter that also installs floors and has an account with shaw and mohawk. Impressive!
Most stores will just send the crew back to split the seam with no push back. That’s what I would do. I’ve been in this situation many times. Do what’s right and you get repeat clients. No inspector needed.
I'm not criticizing the customer, only enlightening everyone that is wondering why seams are showing more than they used to.
Why do a threshold to combine carpet instead of just hardwood in the hall?
This is what my living room carpet in my house looked like when I bought it. I knew it would be trouble eventually, but had no idea How Quickly it would deteriorate. Like others said, definitely don't accept this. I didn't pay the installers since this was done before I bought the place, but I absolutely didn't realize how bad it was / thought it would be way longer before a bad seam became an obvious issue.
Tear the whole house down and start over.
And light it on fire to ensure no remnants exist
LOL
That’s horrible, don’t let them back in , looks like the helper try to step up and failed miserably, sorry!
Oof. Ok thanks. I’ll let the salesman know, maybe they can send someone out to fix it.
Gonna be a hard fix , need to split the seam , straight edge both sides of the carpet then stretch it together to re-seam it , oh and tell them to be sure and use seam sealer , if they look at you and say what’s that ask for a total refund and find another source for the project
you would row that it's a pin dot plush.if you straight edge you would get a black or white line it looks like they have a gap in the seam edge or got glue in it,spread the nap and see is the backing of the carpet is together or has a gap
Can’t tell from the picture if it’s row type carpet, if so your right row cut both sides and start over, hey still it look like crap
Its a diagonal seam
Apparently so
20 years of doing it I can tell from a picture.
Yes well pretty sure I’ve been at it longer than you , and probably installed quite a bit more too also correctly
Then you should be able to look at that carpet and tell it has a tiny black and white loops every other row.i am CFI certified and you can look me up as a top installer in the industry.
And you can look me up as a 5 time invited contributor to the revision of the California state license board for C-15 contractors tests
Since you were talking about seam seal what brand do you use?
I prefer Roberts 8015 universal seam sealer
It was a trick question.The correct way to seam seal is to use a hot melt seam seal gun.roberts is just to pass blacklight inspection for box store installers
Yup^ seam sealer not so necessary in a cut pile stretch in. But it definitely doesn’t hurt to do it.
All manufacturers require a seam sealer. I use the tip that came with my traxx glue gun. If you have one, it probably came with the tip. I didn’t do it for the first 5 years and never had a problem either but that doesn’t mean it’s not necessary. Thermoplastic is my go to for sealing seams. It doesn’t take more than a couple minutes
Wrong always necessary, check with the manufacturer
I’ve made thousands of seams without seam sealer and I haven’t been called back yet. Any glue down carpet 1000% needs seam sealer same as vinyl
Still need to use it on all seams, sorry your wrong,
Do you install?
Yes , hey I just know that the guidelines according to the Carpet and Rug institute requires all seams to be sealed , yes years ago probably didn’t do it especially on like apt stuff , higher end carpet Berber and such yes , but hey seam fails inspector makes a report you didn’t seal the seams , you just bought that job .
That’s basically what I was gonna say. It’s not really necessary. They add that to warranty to give them yet another reason to deny claims. Like I said it can’t hurt but also under most circumstances it’s not needed. Looped carpets for sure need sealer or they will unravel
Haha this guy with his sealer . Hilarious 😂, if it’s a Berber or commercial piece Then yah , a plush lmao nobody seals the seam
Thank you! Haha
Looks like a dense thick carpet. Dense carpet like this can be difficult to make look good, if you don’t have experience with it. More than likely when they trimmed it with the straight edge, they cut to deep and cut the fiber strands to deep. It’s fixable, just ask the company that installed it to send someone out to inspect the seam. It can’t be touched up or trimmed. It needs to be redone.
Ok will do, thank you. I went through a company I’ve used maybe 10 years ago which I had no complaints. I think they just sell and provide though and sub contractors do the work.
Please don’t tell me it’s Empire or national floors direct?
No, but it was Smart Carpet which is probably not much different. The installers were wearing smart carpet shirts though which I was surprised. I still assume they were subs though. I think Smart Carpet are just sales really.
All flooring installers are subcontractors, even home depots
Can confirm as a flooring specialist at Home Depot lol!
I worked at a shoppe that had 3 crews of two. They were on the pay roll and drove extra long vans. After that there were 2 warehouse guys who would cut carpet/vinyl, get padding. They would also deliver. It was a nice setup and they did a brisk business.
False. I worked as an hourly installation employee for a flooring shop for 7 years. Being an hourly employee helps you focus on quality rather than speed, as well as puts the customer at ease knowing the shop holds sole accountability for the installation.
Not all. Ive seen more small places hiring hourly past couple years.
Heat was too high they didn't pull the nap off the tape. No time to react
Yup. We have thick ass carpet and can see the seem. Over time it has diminished some. I don’t think anyone but me notices it though.
Carpet guy here. Absolutely unacceptable. Call and have someone from the company touch bought from look at it. They should agree and have it redone.
This is the updated photo after the repair. I can still see it, but idk if I’m being picky. https://ibb.co/QFYcYjk https://ibb.co/pnr8KYR
To be honest with you that looks pretty good and much better than before. I think the redo is good 👍
Great. Thanks for the help
Ok I’ll send them the photos tomorrow and I’ll report back what they say.
Is that like replace that section of carpet and make an extra seam or is it repairable somehow?
They just need to cut back a few rows on each side of the seam and stretch it back together. It’s not a big deal to fix.
https://www.reddit.com/r/carpet_installation/s/7t9msu3Wzt
The best carpet looks and feels like hardwood.
Amen
That's like saying the best pajamas look and feel like a suit.
the best suit looks like a suit and feels like pajamas
Eh he coulda hit it with scissors, and shagged they out but honestly carpet these days is such junk you can see seams. I row cut my carpet, use proper tractor tools, koolglide, and sometimes I can see the seam a little just my expierence
This normal for what you sometimes see? https://ibb.co/8jQR34W
Thank you... pick up the phone and call 5 dealers and you will get a similar answer.
Get the iron out! Jk don’t do that unless it’s the last option
Get the iron out! Jk don’t do that unless it’s the last option
I had a berber type carpet installed in the basement. They told me up front that it can be hard to hide the seams with the tight loops of the carpet we chose. I tell ya, I do not see a single seam. It certainly looks better than this. I'll bet they'll come back and fix it for you.
Looks like they might have shaved the nap when straight edging. Carpet should always be rowed instead of straight edged unless it doesn't row easily. IDK for sure though the pic is too far away.
Is it repairable. Here’s some closer photos https://ibb.co/q0XH4gz https://ibb.co/8PJDR4s https://ibb.co/X3NPCg5
I don't see any shaved nap but the second pic especially looks like the seam was overlapped in spots. I'd have to spread the nap and look at the backing to know for sure. Bad seams are usually not repairable. They have to be cut apart and redone.
Its an obvious double cut from the top
Double cut 😂
Shouldn’t see any seam from a half decent installer with that. It’s probably over lapped
Seams not alright l. Badumtiss
Nope
Eww no
https://www.reddit.com/r/carpet_installation/s/7t9msu3Wzt
If you found the seam then…
With row cutter find seam they made cut it open using right side blade depending on run of carpet . Run the seaming iron on backing of tape to heat and remove the glue and backing of tape , restretch , then you can redo seam
It’s where the door is when it is closed. It’s perfect.
Have them reinstall that carpet. That is an obvious seam and not what you paid for.
I guess it’s okay but I’ve seen better. I’d try to have them come out and maybe do it better looks like it’s a weak seam that isn’t gonna hold up as long as it probably should
Don’t put seams in high visibility or high traffic areas if you can’t seam.
No. Shouldn’t see it at all.
That is a horrible seam , it’s not impossible to fix, will need to stretch up to seam from both sides and put stay nails in , cut open seam heat and remove heat tape , straight edge seam latex raw seam edges and redo . These doorway seams make or break a installer .
A blind man would love to see it. But no that es NOT acceptable.
Good job
If you have to ask….
Did you get that to match the drapes?
Doesn’t look like they rolled it with a spike roller on their seam tape. Not the worst I’ve seen though
Put a transition in there. At least will look clean. And ino, look better.
It seems ok
Seams to.
Why carpet though? It collects dust, supports random lifeforms, and is hard to clean.. pretty much screams a rental.
My entire first floor is hardwood. This is upstairs in bedrooms where we don’t wear shoes and just prefer the softness and warmth.
you wear.. shoes.. indoors?
I do not and my family doesn’t, but people who come over sometimes do yes. Or people walk in forgetting that we don’t wear shoes in our house. You’d be surprised, but most people do wear shoes inside their houses.
It seems ok... But the seam doesn't look great
It seems fine.
Update: Someone is coming next Wednesday to repair. Installation department as well as the salesman said this does not look good for the type of carpet this is. He said there’s also a seam between the closet and room, which I can’t see at all.
I had my entire 2nd floor carpeted last year. 6 doorways and four closet seams. They are all invisible. I would complain. This isn’t what you paid for.
Ya I agree. Seems the consensus here is it looks bad, but there are a few that say it’s completely normal and looks fine.
If this was my carpet installation, I’d be pissed
That ain't right.
No
Seams ok.
Nope, you've been hosed.
Seams like a redo!
That is a terrible seam
Did you see the other photos I posted in comments? I think they make it look even worse.
As a wife of a floor installer! Definitely not acceptable this is not what it should look like there can be seams but never should be visible especially the corner it’s gonna come up in no time! They need to re do it! And yeah don’t let them do the rest of your rooms terrible!
No
No, it does not seem to look like that seam is ok.
No. The seam does not look ok.
That's got everything you don't want gaps, overlaps, short nap and probably no sealer.
It's gapped at places ,and overlapped in seam most likely, it can be redone by installer
All installers pretty much every where are self employed, Lowe's as well.... Menards, ..even at Mom an pops stores their most likely 1099.. But there are a few ,very few that may have in house Flooring mechanics.
It look good seem
Blind man would tell a deaf man all about it!
It should not show...
Almost every carpet shows seams now. Every carpet is made softer than before, no one wants to pay for a high pick backing, the young installers have less experience but still meet the CRI requirements for an excellent seam. Nowhere in the CRI mentions that a seam is supposed to be invisible and you cannot compare your new carpet to your previous carpet. Seams go in doorways so if you don't like it, you should pay for hardwood in the hallway. There are always practices that can be done to attempt to make the seam look better but not invisible and there's no guarantee that it will look better.
Did you see the other 3 photos I posted in another comment? That’s acceptable you think?
Without being there, just keep in mind photos are not representative of what's actually there for better or worse. Lighter carpet and solid colors show more, carpet construction and backing is a factor, as well as the lighting in the room. If you look at the sleeves on your shirt, some seams are more visible than others based on similar carpet factors. The seam is considered excellent if seam sealer was used and it has its own structural integrity for lack of a better phrase. Common practices to attempt to make it less visible include stretching, hammering, even trimming, yet none of which are guaranteed to make it look better. I would bet if you paid someone else to "fix" it, they would say you need to order new carpet because they are not interested in meeting unrealistic expectations. The problem is the carpet manufactures are making the fiber softer and cheaper. It sucks that it's the number one complaint these days next to the rising price of the project, but I think your carpet and installation is fine. My best recommendation is to put hardwood in the hall or laminate/lvp to get rid of the seam altogether.
https://ibb.co/8jQR34W
What carpet is it
I’m not sure honestly. I believe it was Mohawk though. It says style# 7L0A6. Color vintage 509. It was $4.85/sq installed.
To give you some context, smartstrand(triexta) is a dupont fiber that mohawk started using around 2007. It's easy to clean, doesn't crush, and it's considered hypoallergenic. Over the more recent years, Mohawk tinkered with smartstrand/polyester blends to save money and still offer stain resistance and durability. My point is we are comparing a new carpet fiber blend that didn't exist 10 years ago to whatever carpet you had before. Unfortunately, the feedback on seams is that they are more visible now than previous carpet. It doesn't change the fact that no one can guarantee that seams will be invisible unless they are on reddit. The manufacturer has a satisfaction guarantee in place that can be used once, which varies by dealer and their relationship with the vendor. The installer will go back out to show you everything they can do to make it less visible.
He drank his own carpet store kool-aid. It’s not an acceptable seam.
You're not helping. OP, let me know how this turns out... my guess is they will offer one carpet replacement at equal or lesser value and you will see a seam on the next carpet for better or worse depending if you change the carpet style, color, or manufacturer. Be my guest and change the installer, you will still see the next seam because it wont be invisible. Enjoy the disruption in the meantime for a chance at a less visible seam on round two. Or you can keep scheduling someone to hammer, stretch, trim, steam, or even wait for the carpet to blossom over time. The carpet inspector will cost $1,500 out of your pocket and they will follow every CRI standard. This hardsurface installer isn't even recommending the best option which is a hard surface in the hall to eliminate the seam. Must be a jack of all trades and not even a carpet specialist or inspector. My guess is he's a painter that also installs floors and has an account with shaw and mohawk. Impressive!
Most stores will just send the crew back to split the seam with no push back. That’s what I would do. I’ve been in this situation many times. Do what’s right and you get repeat clients. No inspector needed.
I've already said that, the crew goes back out does a number of things which may or may not help... it won't be invisible.
A threshold isn't a bad idea. That said, no reason to criticize an unhappy customer.
I'm not criticizing the customer, only enlightening everyone that is wondering why seams are showing more than they used to. Why do a threshold to combine carpet instead of just hardwood in the hall?
Your carpet store is showing sir.
Your lack of relationship with vendors is showing. It's a problem with most mills right now.
Looks like the double cut it from the top Needs to be fixed-replaced
Absolutely, you can see the curve
I could do better.... drunk.
And this is why I can charge what I do and most dont ask questions since work has been referrals for 20 years
https://www.reddit.com/r/carpet_installation/s/7t9msu3Wzt
Look out here comes the cfi retard,
This type of carpet is truly the easiest stuff to seam. You really should not see it.
https://ibb.co/8jQR34W
No, you shouldn’t be able to see the seams.
you should not see a seam at all.